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101090 discussions

by allisonp＠world.std.com

<Compare this to modern OSs - windows, macos, etc where the development pack <costs hundreds or thousands of dollars extra. VMS, all of the Unix clones, RT-11 to name a few still provide full development environment. I'm sure some(I would) here would add CPM OS9 and even PC based DOS(MS, DRdos, CCPM...). the amount of freeware or lowcost shareware for DOS/winders is quite impressive and plentyful. Of all the software out there CPM-80, APPLE and PCdos has the largest archives, but the PDP-8, -11, VAX archives are getting big. Allison

26 years, 6 months

Top 150 Collectible Microcomputers

by kaikal＠MICROSOFT.com

Polymorphic originally called it the "Micro Altair" until MITS threatened to sue them, and they renamed it the POLY-88. Kai -----Original Message----- From: Dwight Elvey [mailto:elvey@hal.com] Sent: Friday, June 18, 1999 2:52 PM To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers Subject: Re[2]: Top 150 Collectible Microcomputers Marvin <marvin(a)rain.org> wrote: > > > > Polymorphic Systems POLY-88 > > I have asked a few people but so far no response. Since this was originally > named the Micro-Altair, did any of those machines actually get shipped with > that name? If so, I would consider them to be rather rare and worthy of a > separate listing. Say Huh? The Poly-88 was not an Altair. It was made by a group in Santa Barbara. I have one, they were manufactured and sold as a product called Poly-88. Dwight

26 years, 6 months

HP7900A drive

by jlwest＠tseinc.com

I talked to a guy that does 7900A repair today. He said from what I described that the heads are probably just in need of strong cleaning with a toothbrush, then touchup with 100% alcohol. As long as the gimbal isn't bent, all should be well. That takes care of the heads. Then you wrote... >I fixed a Plessey RK05-a-like drive years ago using a platter taken from >a standard RK05 cartridge. If you're lucky (and I was), the fixed platter >seats on a machined area of the hub/spindle and doesn't need to be >centred up. Otherwise you have to centre it with a dial gauge before >clamping up the screws. He also said the platter scapes make the platter almost, but not quite, useless; and that I definitely need a new platter. The lower platter on the 7900A does in fact seat on a machined area of the spindle and doesn't need special centering - "just bolt it on? - just bolt it on". He said I could use any 14" disk media that was the right thickness. Can't remember if it was 50 mils or 75 mils. I think it's the same as the RK05. I'll find out the mils number tonight when I compare my 7900 cartridge with my 7905/6 one. All I need to do is clamp a metal micrometer on the platter <just kidding folks!>. So - does anyone have a broken RK05 type cartridge that they'd part with so I can steal the platter out of it? >It's worth trying. Clean the platter as well. It can't do _more_ damage, >after all... True, but if there is so much scraped oxide that the badtrack list is 10% of the platter, why even bother. I've been quoted anywhere from $50.00 to $250.00 for a media only surface (no hub, which is all I need). Hopefully someone here can help out? Thanks in advance!!! Jay West

26 years, 6 months

Have I been unsubscribed?

by bill＠chipware.com

I have not received a single classiccmp message today (6/18/1999). Am I unsubscribed? Is the list down? Bill Sudbrink

26 years, 6 months

Commodore 64GS

by BobMcPhail＠aol.com

Does anyone know where I can find a working Commodore 64GS system? I've been looking for the last two years with no luck. Please e-mail me if you know where I can purchase one. Thanks, Bob

26 years, 6 months

it's just typical (was: First Apple I up for auction)

by edick＠idcomm.com

I don't know where this "reporter" got his information, but MITS did not build the IMSAI. It's sacrilege, that's what it is! It's like saying the Silver Cloud was built by YUGO. Dick -----Original Message----- From: Sellam Ismail <dastar(a)ncal.verio.com> To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> Date: Thursday, June 17, 1999 12:19 PM Subject: Re: First Apple I up for auction >On Thu, 17 Jun 1999, Zane H. Healy wrote: > >> Now's some lucky persons chance to own a piece of computing history. >> >> http://www.wired.com/news/news/technology/story/20271.html >> >> Sam is in the article, and the place selling the computer is hoping to get >> $40,000 for it. > ><BIG ANNOYED SIGH> > >I love being misquoted. I also love it when the journalist takes the >information I give him and jumbles it all up into a miserable pile of >gibberish. > >Oh well, the price I pay for free publicity. > >Sellam Alternate e-mail: dastar(a)siconic.com >--------------------------------------------------------------------------- --- >Don't rub the lamp if you don't want the genie to come out. > > Coming this October 2-3: Vintage Computer Festival 3.0! > See http://www.vintage.org/vcf for details! > [Last web site update: 05/25/99] >

26 years, 6 months

OT -mostly -

by robert.edis＠creatcomp.com

OpenVMS still comes with development tools. You can write primitive interpretive code using DCL and more sophisticated stuff with TPU. The file management system RMS also comes free with VMS. Besides the above, there are many shareware or freeware development tools that can be used with VMS. For the private user, VMS can be free and comes with free C/C++, BASIC, Fortran, Perl and other compilers. How does BeOS compare with that? Blue PowerHouse consultant Rhode Island, USA Disclaimer: The opinions and ideas expressed in this message are my own and have no relationship to my current employer, Initial Technical Staffing, its client CCI, or any of CCI's clients. -----Original Message----- From: Jim Strickland [mailto:jim@calico.litterbox.com] Sent: Friday, June 18, 1999 3:58 PM To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers Subject: OT -mostly - After playing with BeOS a while something occurred to me. Does anyone remember at what point operating systems stopped coming with development tools? I'm remembering the commodore 64 that came with Basic, and if you typed in the assembler from the manual, you could (at least in theory) write proffessional quality assembly language programs worthy of being sold to others. Compare this to modern OSs - windows, macos, etc where the development package costs hundreds or thousands of dollars extra. (small plug - BeOS comes with (theoretically) all the tools you need to do development on it.) -- Jim Strickland jim(a)DIESPAMMERSCUMcalico.litterbox.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- BeOS Powered! -----------------------------------------------------------------------

26 years, 6 months

Sol-20 Keyboard

by kaikal＠MICROSOFT.com

True, but I found that nearly all the keys were usable except for Enter, Space, Escape and Shift. Kai -----Original Message----- From: Don Maslin [mailto:donm@cts.com] Sent: Friday, June 18, 1999 12:06 PM To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers Subject: RE: Sol-20 Keyboard On Fri, 18 Jun 1999, Kai Kaltenbach wrote: > Pull off one of the SOL keys. Note the spring and the key mounting > mechanism. Go to your local surplus joint and go through their pile 'o' old > keyboards, pulling a key off of each until you find one that uses springs -- > Keytronic made essentially the same foam-pad mechanism for years and years, > on PC keyboards. > > I found a suitable one quite easily, and replaced all of the foam in my SOL. The only problem with that, Kai, is that some of the PC keyboards are getting old enough to be a bit edgy also. But at least you won't have much invested except time! - don

26 years, 6 months

Sol-20 Keyboard

by kaikal＠MICROSOFT.com

Pull off one of the SOL keys. Note the spring and the key mounting mechanism. Go to your local surplus joint and go through their pile 'o' old keyboards, pulling a key off of each until you find one that uses springs -- Keytronic made essentially the same foam-pad mechanism for years and years, on PC keyboards. I found a suitable one quite easily, and replaced all of the foam in my SOL. Kai -----Original Message----- From: Marvin [mailto:marvin@rain.org] Sent: Friday, June 18, 1999 9:51 AM To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers Subject: Sol-20 Keyboard Well, the saga continues. This unit does have the 85 key keyboard and the Sol-20 power supply so I don't know what to say about the model 10 on the nameplate. I took the keyboard apart last night and found both the sponge disintegrating and the metalized plastic that contacts the keyboard also has the metalization disappearing. Since I believe this is a capacitive type of keyboard, I can see why it didn't work. What have others on the list done to replace the plastic/sponge sandwich on this type of keyboard?

26 years, 6 months

Who says familiy activities are extinct? ^_^

by DSEAGRAV＠toad.xkl.com

Yesterday, I spent all day at a customer's site, arguing with Windows NT. God, I hate NT. Anyway, I return to the office to clock out, call home, my mother answers. I says, "Is my supper still there?" She says, "Yes, and hurry home, me and your (little) sister went dumpster diving." "Uh, WHAT?" So, I go home. They scored 2 dead monitors, some miscellaneous System/36 disks, and 2 leased-line modems. So, I head out with them, to visit the dumpster again. Turns out it was a grade school not too far away. Anyway, I took some goodies, here's the highlights: An Apple 2/E, in (seemingly) working order, but no floppy controller. But it has the drives... A Laser 128. No power supply. What's this? IBM System/36 SSP and Microcode disks. Ohhh, yes. The 2 leased-line modems - a small Gandalf model, and something else. Miscellaneous 2e manuals. I have DOS disks and such elsewhere... Anyway, what's the Laser, and can I do much with the Apple, even though it has no floppy card? I suppose I have to RTFM... -------

26 years, 6 months

it's just typical (was: First Apple I up for auction)

by edick＠idcomm.com

That was my point, Hans. I can't comment on the Morris Minor, but the Yugo did work, just as the Altair did. It's just that you always had to nurse the Altair along. Now the IMSAI was a different thing. It was laid out by a professional who designed the PCB assemblies like a "real" product, even back when people thought of microcomputers as fancy "toys" for the intellectual elite. The Altairs of the mid '70's were laid out the way 2nd year engineering students did it. If they had hired a professional, it would have cost more. Likewise, the Yugo was designed and built with many economies in the form of omissions. Dick -----Original Message----- From: Hans Franke <Hans.Franke(a)mch20.sbs.de> To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> Date: Friday, June 18, 1999 12:20 PM Subject: Re: it's just typical (was: First Apple I up for auction) >> > I don't know where this "reporter" got his information, but MITS did not >> > build the IMSAI. It's sacrilege, that's what it is! It's like saying the >> > Silver Cloud was built by YUGO. > >> More like saying a Moris Minor was built by Yugo. > >Just help me: >Why you're always jumpin' on the Yugo ? >They had fine cars (when considering the price). >And in fact, I'd prefer a Yugo over a Moris Minor >(guess I won't be allowed to set a foot on the >isle in the future :). > >Gruss >H. > >-- >Der Kopf ist auch nur ein Auswuchs wie der kleine Zeh. >H.Achternbusch

26 years, 6 months

TRS-80 parts/software needed

by roblwill＠usaor.net

Hi! I need the following stuff to fix my old TRS-80. I had it working again after I dropped paper clips into it, but the person who was junking the parts that I used to repair it were obviously throwing them out for a reason... I think all that I need are a model 3 or 4 motherboard, and a matching RS-232 interface. I could also probably use a model 4 keyboard, if I get the model 4 motherboard, but the model 3 one will still work, won't it? I also need a disk copy of VideoText software, Scripsit, and TRS-DOS (I have L-DOS, but it's for the Model 4). ThAnX, ///--->>> -Jason Willgruber (roblwill(a)usaor.net) ICQ#: 1730318 <http://members.tripod.com/general_1> PS>> I think there was someone on this list that was parting out an old Model 4. I think I emailed you about it, but I lost your address. Do you still have it??

26 years, 6 months

HP7900A drive

by jlwest＠tseinc.com

Ugggg.... In my rush to spin up the drive, I had neglected to inspect the bottom heads for the fixed platter. They are, after all, almost hidden in the bottom. :[ This time I removed the bottom of the drive and looked underneath. There are the obvious telltale streaks on the bottom surface of the bottom (fixed) platter; it doesn't look gouged, but streaked nontheless. The bottom heads (which can only really be inspected from the bottom of the drive with the bottom cover off) don't look to be very happy. Definite oxide residue, but the heads at least LOOK structurally sound. Since the bottom fixed platter doesn't have servo data on it, I'm hoping a new bottom platter won't cost much more than a removable platter. Then I'm hoping that since the noise was never that pronounced that perhaps the heads will be OK after thorough cleaning. Don't know much about this - is that possible? I know, I'm probably hoping unrealistically. This pretty well trashes my hopes for TSB, at least until I can fix it or find another 7900A. On the bright side, it's pretty obvious that this damage was done before I got the drive. Small consolation ;) Jay West

26 years, 6 months

Serial option for PCs

by jfoust＠threedee.com

An article on Slashdot <http://slashdot.org/askslashdot/99/06/17/1731248.shtml> asked about methods for making headless Linux boxes, and one of the reader answers was sufficiently retro and weird that I thought it might interest this list. <http://www.realweasel.com/> describes the PC Weasel 2000, an ISA card that emulates a mono video card, but that transmits the characters on the virtual screen out the serial port, and converts serial input to PC keyboard keystrokes. Thus no video monitor is needed, and no BIOS changes needed, in order to "see" even the lowest-level cold-boot options on a PC. - John

26 years, 6 months

Motorola UDS modem....

by roblwill＠usaor.net

Hi! I just found an old Motorola Universal Data Systems model 201B/C modem in my basement while I was cleaning. I have the original box and manual, but can't figure out how to get it to work. It's odd- looking (in the fact that it's blue). It runs on 120 volts, has a 1/2 amp fuse, a toggle (power) switch, 25-pin DTE data connector, and the telephone input/output connectors on the back. The front is black and has 9 LED's on it, along with a rotary switch. The LED's are (left to right) MR/RI, TR,RS,CS,CD,RD,TD,TM,and POWER. The rotary switch (which is between the "TM" and "POWER" LED's has 9 positions for RDLST, RDL, LDL, AL, DATA, TALK, TTP, RTP, and ST. According to the manual, these are different test settings. Anyone ever worked with one of these? ThAnX, ///--->>> -Jason Willgruber (roblwill(a)usaor.net) ICQ#: 1730318 <http://members.tripod.com/general_1>

26 years, 6 months

Sanyo MBC 555

by PATTON2R＠aol.com

Hello all, Anybody else out there have a Sanyo MBC 555 computer? Anybody out there have MS-DOS version 1.25??? Robert Patton II PATTON2R(a)aol.com

26 years, 6 months

Who says familiy activities are extinct? ^_^

by SUPRDAVE＠aol.com

In a message dated 6/17/99 9:45:36 PM US Eastern Standard Time, tomowad(a)earthlink.net writes: > >A Laser 128. No power supply. What's this? > > It's an Apple IIe/IIc compatible. Unlike most "clones", VTech created > their own Apple II compatible ROMs and the machine is 100% legal. I've > never had any compatibility issues with mine, either. An ordinairy Apple > IIc power supply will work with the unit. > > Tom Owad > the only compatibility issue i had with the laser was that it wouldnt work with aol when they supported it. i had to borrow a //c to logon. i think laser claimed 99% just for these type issues. It's my understanding that the laser128 had the universal disk controller builtin so it handled pretty much any apple drive that could be plugged into the disk drive port.

26 years, 6 months

Who says familiy activities are extinct? ^_^

by allisonp＠world.std.com

<Actually, you can link 2 together - Tx terminals on one to Rx terminals <on the other and vice versa. Works with twin twisted pair cable up to a <few hundred metres (? Maybe a little more). If it's a short haul modem the limit is some 4000ft at something like 9600 or maybe even as fast as 38.4k. Used to used them in the DEC Mill for links off the eithernet using synchronous DUV-11s. Allison

26 years, 6 months

Sol-10

by allisonp＠world.std.com

<Complex. This has two ROM sockets on it along with a switch to select one o <the other. The one at C000 is labeled "N* C000" and the one at F000 is <labeled "*80.2 F000". No idea what they are for as the NS* controller has it's own boot roms nominally at E800h. The C000h address is nothing special for NS* dos. Allison

26 years, 6 months

Who says familiy activities are extinct? ^_^

by tomowad＠earthlink.net

>A Laser 128. No power supply. What's this? It's an Apple IIe/IIc compatible. Unlike most "clones", VTech created their own Apple II compatible ROMs and the machine is 100% legal. I've never had any compatibility issues with mine, either. An ordinairy Apple IIc power supply will work with the unit. Tom Owad

26 years, 6 months

Off Topic about GRiD and 1958 Oscilloscope- Help requested.

by fluke＠mcs.net

I've gotten my hands on a touchscreen GRiDpad. I don't recall the model number, but its just an LCD panel with some buttons along the side, and a stylus. I found a keyboard port pinout for it and build a power adapter, and can get it to ask me to abort, retry, or fail, but I cannot get it to do anything remotely useful. The appeal of this system is that I am a religious GEOS user for MSDOS pc's, and the idea of having touchscreen-GEOS is pretty cool (GEOS has built in support for the GRiD's goofy video resolution, I believe, as well as support for its touchscreen-mouse driver). My question is this: What do I put on a hard drive to get it to boot? It seems reluctant to boot off of a conventional micro-IDE drive that has MS-DOS on it, and if I don't have a drive plugged in it says GRiD Bios v. something.something. When I first got it it had no HD in it at all, just two PCMCIA looking slots, which I would assume to be PCMCIA sockets. One of these sockets is on a daughter board adjacent to a micro-IDE connector. I am stuck. I've had this in my basement for quite some time, but I can't figure out how to get it to boot anything. On a side note, I've also picked up a 1958 Tektronix O-scope (the school I go to was tossing it). It works fine, aside from the fact that the CRT on it scans so far to the left as to be almost off the screen. Does anyone out there have experience with this vintage of oscilloscope? Thanks! Greg

26 years, 6 months

Help needed on HP 7900A disk drive (mechanical)

by jlwest＠tseinc.com

I'm in need of sage advice from others on the list, due to my lack of troubleshooting/repair experience with large (14") hard drives. I'm a sophomore with electronics, but these beasties are largely mechanical and out of my meager knowledge set. Background: I finally got a brand new (yes, really brand new) blank disk cartridge for my HP 7900A disk drive. The drive has never been powered up since I got it. The spindle motor won't even start on these drives unless the cartridge is in place (there is also a fixed platter underneath). Since the drive is obviously not checked out, I wanted to get blank media to test so I didn't ruin valuable data on a cartridge I am getting later. First I very thoroughly cleaned the drive inside and out, cleaned all contacts, heads, positioner reticule, etc. etc. etc. I then checked the power supply out carefully. Then I powered up the drive (without the cartridge) and tested a number of the basic mechanical functions, interlocks, and test points on some of the cards called out by the operating manual. Then I wanted to try loading the cartridge to see if the heads would crash nicely :) Keep in mind that once the cartridge is in, there is a load switch that powers up the spindle and 30 seconds later the heads do a seek. At any time during the spin up or seek, the unload switch will immediately and very quickly retract the heads and then the drive spins down. "Problem": I put the cartridge in the drive and hit load. You can hear the spindle come up to speed. Exactly 30 seconds later as stated in the operators guide, you can hear the heads move and then the drive ready light comes on. From what I understand if there are any problems at all up to this point, the drive fault lite would come on (including a seek fail, etc.). I kept my finger on the unload switch. The second the heads came out I could hear a disconcerting noise. I immediately hit unload. I removed the cartridge, and inspected both the cartridge and heads carefully. No obvious signs of problems. I reloaded the cartridge. This time, when drive ready lit up, the drive was nice and quiet for about 25 seconds. Then I started hearing the noise again. On and off, more and more, so I hit unload. Rechecked the heads and cartridge again - no obvious signs of damage. Tried loading the cartridge again. This time it ran for a few minutes before I heard the noise. I unloaded and rechecked everything, still no signs of problems. Gee - can you tell I'm paranoid about possibly ruining the new cartridge and/or the heads? :) The sound is not quite metallic, but very close. It sounds like something rubbing at high speed but at a pretty high pitch. The best way I can describe it is that it is almost identical to the sound an 8" floppy disk makes when you put it into an RX02 drive and close the door (the media turning inside the sleeve), but much louder. I'm pretty uncomfortable proceding with diagnostics, etc. unless someone here can calm my fears as to what the sound might be. Is it just due to the fact that it's a brand new cartridge, or is it indicative of a potential head crash, just a belt issue, dust, etc? I'm pretty familiar with the whine a drive makes when the bearings are going out, and it does not sound like that sound. Any help, ideas, thoughts, etc. are MOST appreciated! Jay West

26 years, 6 months

Sanyo DOS was: Re: GRiD and misc

by rigdonj＠intellistar.net

At 09:29 AM 6/17/99 -0700, Grumpy old Fred wrote: >On Thu, 17 Jun 1999, Marvin wrote: >> I didn't realize a DOS 1.25 was issued; I only have DOS 1.1 (1.01?) > >There was an MS-DOS 1.25, but not a PC-DOS. The second released version of >PC-DOS was 1.10 Note that the part after the PERIOD was stored >internally as ten, and the part after the period was then ALWAYS displayed >as a 2 digit decimal number. MS-DOS was released to other OEMs, who could >even change the NAME! (Z-DOS, etc.) Most of them (Compaq, etc.) called >that version 1.25 Note that the part after the PERIOD was stored >internally as twenty five. The (original) Sanyo disks that I have say "MS(tm)-DOS V. 1.25 #1.0". Even though they called it MS-DOS it was VERY modified for the Sanyo. FWIW, Joe

26 years, 6 months

it's just typical (was: First Apple I up for auction)

by edick＠idcomm.com

Well . . . O.K. . . . you made your point. Nevertheless, the average MITS board looks like a screwed up piced of junk. . . . even the bare boards! The IMSAI products were all made up very nicely, clean circuit layout, good silkscreen, nice solder mask . . . AND most of them actually worked! Dick -----Original Message----- From: Dwight Elvey <elvey(a)hal.com> To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> Date: Thursday, June 17, 1999 1:42 PM Subject: Re: it's just typical (was: First Apple I up for auction) >"Richard Erlacher" <edick(a)idcomm.com> wrote: >> I don't know where this "reporter" got his information, but MITS did not >> build the IMSAI. It's sacrilege, that's what it is! It's like saying the >> Silver Cloud was built by YUGO. > >More like saying a Moris Minor was built by Yugo. >IMHO >Dwight >

26 years, 6 months

Sol-10

by kaikal＠MICROSOFT.com

Sol-PC: $475 kit (Sol single board computer only) Sol-10: $795 kit (Includes case, power supply and 70-key keyboard) Sol-20: $995 kit (Including case, power supply, 5-slot S-100 backplane, fan, large power supply, and 85-key keyboard) Kai -----Original Message----- From: Sellam Ismail [mailto:dastar@ncal.verio.com] Sent: Thursday, June 17, 1999 9:18 AM To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers Subject: Re: Sol-10 On Thu, 17 Jun 1999, Marvin wrote: > As I recall, Bob Marsh at VCF 1.0 indicated that the SOL-20 had only been > advertised and not produced. I am confused now. Last night, I pulled out the > SOL to fire it up and see if it worked or not. In looking at the nameplate, > it says "SOL Terminal Computer Model No. 10". No, there was never really a Sol-10. The Sol-10 was just a Sol-20 without the disk controller or something like that. If yours says Model 10 then that's interesting, and Bob Marsh lied :) Maybe it was the one that didn't originally come with a disk controller? Sellam Alternate e-mail: dastar(a)siconic.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- Don't rub the lamp if you don't want the genie to come out. Coming this October 2-3: Vintage Computer Festival 3.0! See http://www.vintage.org/vcf for details! [Last web site update: 05/25/99]

26 years, 6 months

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test-drb