I've collected a number of Q-bus boards for PDP-11s and/or VAXen that I'm trying to
identify and locate documentation for. Poking around the web, checking bitsavers.
org
and Manx, and looking at the Q-bus field guide have so far turned up nothing for
me. I'd like to ask all of you Q-bus experts for some input. I've cobbled together a
webpage with some images here:
http://www.rogerwilco.org/mystery_boards
At this moment, I'm most interested in information and documentation on the
Clearpoint Q-BUS 11B. I'd like to use this in a PDP-11/23+ or 11/73, hoping to get
Ultrix-11 or BSD2.9 running.
All comments are welcome on- or off-list.
Thanks!
J
let me know :)
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Back in the early 70s, I did a computer science degree and was
taught that a simulator was a program and an emulator was a
microprogram, both to execute the instruction set of another
computer, but at a different level.
There is another class of simulation I have been considering
lately. For machines like my ICT 1301, which I would guess
has about ten thousand gates, it would be possible to write a
program which does a gate level simulation on a fast machine
like my 2GHz Mac. You could even simulate the signals in
the machine, hook up a simulated oscilloscope and look at
the waveforms. The slow rise times and overshooting might
not be possible to show of course, but maybe even this could
be added. You could even simulate logic faults for educational
purposes and show how they used to be tracked down via the
console, the logic diagrams and an oscilloscope. Now that
really would be a historical/educational tool. Or am I just dreaming?
Could I OCR the old line printer listings of the interconnection lists
and use them to build the simulator?
Simulating the audio output (which is pulsed on most conditional
branch instructions) is another issue I am thinking about. Modern
computers can obviously make the sounds, but how do I convert
>from a live stream of speaker reversals into what a modern
machine needs?
Roger.
--- Jules Richardson <julesrichardsonuk at yahoo.co.uk
> wrote:
> aliensrcooluk at yahoo.co.uk wrote:
> > I got all the A600 related questions right,
> > which is good as I own two :)
>
> Out of interest, why was the answer to the "Only
> Amiga makes it possible"
> advertising slogan question "because it can
> multi-task and run a second OS"
I have no idea. I knew it was either that one
or the "it can have 4096 colours on a screen".
I guess it depends how you define "multi-tasking".
As an Amiga owner with a A600 (with 2MB) it
can run say up to 10 applications at once
(depending how much memory they eat up)
theoretically. Whether it can or not I don't
know, since I generally only have 2 or 3 things
running at once (eg. Workbench, a music
program and AMOS Pro).
> (or words to that effect) - surely plenty of syste
ms
> had existed before the
> Amiga which could do just that. They might have be
en
> big and expensive, but
> I'm sure it wasn't a new concept.
>
> Gawd, extra-halfbrite mode. That takes me back...
>
>
> I got 11 out of 30. I suck. :-)
>
>
> What's the state of play with Amiga emulators thes
e
> days - are they any good
> (and complete)? What's archived, on-line software
> availability like? I think
Firstly I apologise if the next bit seems like
free advertising, but it's all relevant :)
Amiga Hardware
----------------
Various "new projects" in the pipeline,
including a PPC based machine and Amy '05.
New "Amiga's" since Commodore went under
include The Pegasos and the AmigaOne.
There are 2 sites I can point you to for a
pretty near complete (if not complete)
archive of info about Amiga hardware.
The first is Commodore Amiga Retro
( http://www.commodore-amiga-retro.com )
and includes loads of decent sized pictures
of all the various Amiga's, and other retro
computers.
The other one is known as the Big Book Of
Hardware. Sorry, I don't have an URL for it
as I have never visited it. But from what I
have heard about it, it has a complete
archive of all Amiga hardware, including
pripherals.
Amiga emulators
-----------------
Don't really know much about them. There are
a few out there. UAE is one of them, but I
forget what it stands for.
Amiga software
----------------
http://www.lemonamiga.com has a huge archive
of info about loads of Amiga games, some
movie clips and some interviews with famous
Amiga people.
http://www.aminet.net is a huuuuge online
database of games, utilities, tools, libraries
and other Amiga stuff developed by bedroom
(aka homebrew) coders. There are atleast
6 mirror sites based all over Europe and in
the US.
Ownership of Aminet recently changed hands
(either this year, or last year) and so should
be around for quite a while yet.
I recently bought a modem for my A600 so I
could upload my stuff onto there, but before
I could do so I ran into problems (my original
Amiga 600 died).
Amiga magazines
-----------------
There are only 2 magazines that I know of:
Amiga Forever is a Germany-based magazine
which AFAIK is in English. There are special
issues available that come with CD's/DVD's
full of software, video's and other stuff.
Total Amiga is a UK-based magazine which
comes out quarterly, and is the one I buy.
Due to high demand in Europe and the US it
is professionally printed in the UK and in
Canada. It includes a round-up of the latest
Amiga news, the latest info about OS4,
interviews with people such as Eric Schwartz
and Dave Haynie.
Acquiring Hardware/Software
----------------------------
There are also various online shops to buy
Amiga software and hardware including:
http://www.amikit.comhttp://www.amigadeals.co.uk
and an online advertising board for buying /
selling Amiga kit:
http://www.amibench.org (or .net , both work)
Regards,
Andrew B
aliensrcooluk at yahoo.co.uk
PS. Sorry if that was too long, or if anyone
fell asleep!
>Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2006 14:43:57 -0800
>From: "Chuck Guzis" <cclist at sydex.com>
>On 22 Nov 2006 at 15:31, Jeff Walther wrote:
>
>> There was (and may still be) a fellow on Ebay selling a pair for $6
>> shipped. Ah, here it is
>Wasn't the Micro 16s a PeeCee-type machine that could use different
>CPU boards? (Z80, 8088, 68K maybe?). I've got a couple of diskettes
>from one in my collection, but I can't say that I've seen one up
>close and in person.
If that's the case, then *Whoops!*. Sorry. I just immediately
though 16 bit microcontroller.
I guess I've been reading too much of the FPGA thread. Gets me
thinking on the chip level.
Jeff Walther
Ethan wrote
>In the realm of 68K
>Macs, though, I'm not sure if they can or do use an MMU if present.
Apart from A/UX and the other *IXes using one, System 7 and above would
"kind of" use the '851 to manage a pagefile. That was all.
The '020 was used in many workstations: the entire Sun-3 series excluding the
3/80, 3/380 and 3/480 (030 based), a number of Apollo stations, the
IRIS 3000 and Turbo 2000 series from SGI. Might have still been used except that
the 030 was a disappointment and the 040 was late.
>Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2006 23:03:45 -0500
>From: David Barnes <davebarnes at adelphia.net>
>Hello all;
>
>I have a Radius mac clone , model 81/110 which needs a new power
>supply.... it gave up the ghost this morning... anyone have one
>available? or an entire system they want to part with?
>
>Yes I need to keep this old machine alive.... nubus video capture
>cards, etc...
It's the same as the Apple 8100 power supply. You'll have better
luck finding a power supply for the 8100.
Here's one:
<http://cgi.ebay.com/Power-Supply-for-an-Apple-PowerMac-8100-Quadra-800-840_…>
but that seller (KPS101) plagiarized my Item Description for Beige G3
ROMs so I would love it if folks would refuse to buy from him/her/it.
Actually, he continues to plagiarize it to this day when he has them
available to sell.
Ah, here we go and cheaper too
<http://cgi.ebay.com/Powermac-8100-Quadra-800-840av-Power-Supply-614-0012_W0…>
And finally from Olde Mac Milt
<http://cgi.ebay.com/Quadra-800-840av-PowerMac-8100-Power-Supply_W0QQitemZ87…>
This one is in the middle price-wise, but I've dealt with Milt before
and he's an upstanding guy.
Oh, and he has a 225 watt version as well, the others are 200 watts:
<http://cgi.ebay.com/Apple-PowerMac-8100-225-Watt-Power-Supply_W0QQitemZ8793…>
What kind of video capture are you using in there? Is it a Video
Vision Studio? I have one I haven't hooked up yet. One thing
that's keeping it down on the list of things to do next is all the
(old) talk about fiddling to get decent frame rates. Is it really
that hard? Or with a modern hard drive connected to a JackHammer,
should one be able to do just fine? Is it difficult or tricky to
record the sound along with the video and have them synchronized?
And finally, any tools to convert the MJPEG to modern video formats?
Jeff Walther
yes indeed I was referring to a desktop machine. Not
sure if had optional uPs - what youre describing
sounds alot like the Dimension 68000.
--- cctalk-bounces at classiccmp.org <cclist at sydex.com>
wrote:
> On 22 Nov 2006 at 15:31, Jeff Walther wrote:
>
> > There was (and may still be) a fellow on Ebay
selling a pair for $6
> > shipped. Ah, here it is
> >
<http://cgi.ebay.com/NEW-MB90552APF-Fujitsu-MCUs-100-Pin-QFP-FREE-SHIP_W0QQi…>
>
> Wasn't the Micro 16s a PeeCee-type machine that
could use different
> CPU boards? (Z80, 8088, 68K maybe?). I've got a
couple of diskettes
> from one in my collection, but I can't say that I've
seen one up
> close and in person.
>
> Cheers,
> Chuck
____________________________________________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Everyone is raving about the all-new Yahoo! Mail beta.
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Not vintage, but closely related.
Rather than write some emulation software, I'd like to see if I can
implement some simpler CPU designs in FPGA.
I see various development kits out there with various capabilities
(I/O memory, displays, etc.).
Is there any particular kit that stands heads and shoulders above the
others? Is there a preference between Xilinx and Altera?
I'm just looking for some pointers here.
Thanks,
Chuck
I'm looking at a reference to the brand "TX Peripherals". A link to
their website just brings up the Tapes4u, so I suspect they're out of
business.
The Wayback machine shows a few pages. It looks as if their 9-track
setup used a rebadged Cipher drive, but that's about all I can tell
about them.
Did they use Pertec-interfaced 9 track drives?
Thanks,
Chuck
Hi Tony
Yes, there is activity in the address lines at least.
I would beleive is gets hung on something. I can see
some activity for a breif period in different parts
of the board. like it was in self test. Then it looks
like it gets hung. Not sure what type of a Processor
it uses, but watching the address lines on the roms
it starts out Ok. With all of the Error codes in the
manual and none being displayed, It would have to be
a very low level problem.
As Dave pointed out, it's not a true DEC item.
So with out much to go off of it would be a long up
hill battle.
- Jerry
-------------- Original message ----------------------
From: ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell)
> > It turns on and when you push "logic on" it goes
> > into self test and just stays there with out any
> > codes displayed. Display just stays at "00"
> > voltages look close. DEC manual says system main
> > board or voltages off. I guess they just had a
> > stack of spare boards to test with.
>
> Again, I've never worked on one of these, so this is very generic
> information.
>
> If there's a recognisable microprocessor on the controller board, I'd
> check it was getting a clock signal, that the reset line wasn't being
> held asserted, and then check that there was activity on the bus lines
> from said microprocessor.
>
> This might give you an idea of where to start looking for the fault.
>
> -tony
> For the TC08 and similar devices, the issue really comes down to
> the Posibus interface and the Blinkenlights. Both are key features
> of the TC08, and both are very pin-hungry.
Lights can be serially multiplexed to an external holding register / light
driver on the panel.
A TC08 on an omnibus card would be useful too.
--- Chris M <chrism3667 at yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> --- aliensrcooluk at yahoo.co.uk wrote:
>
> > That's easy. The Amiga CD32 (I own one).
> > I got all the A600 related questions right,
> > which is good as I own two :)
>
> Hmm a rather late use of the chip - 1993 (the
> original Mac II had it in 1987). I think I'm
> intrigued. There's a few new ones on ePay for arou
nd
> $100, not a colossal sum, but I just don't feel li
ke
> getting Shanghaied ;).
> A striking resemblance to the Sega Genesis, and
> according to Wiki it can use it's controllers.
> I think I'll save my cash for a 1000 though when
it
> comes along.
>
It can, however the wiring needs to be
swapped (didn't we talk about this a few
months ago?) otherwise using the Megadrive
controllers can blow a chip (CIA, IC or
whatever it was).
Regards,
Andrew B
aliensrcooluk at yahoo.co.uk
Ethan wrote:
> I don't have any docs on the CompuServe board, but I can give you a
> historical tidbit or two... (snip)...
>
Ah, thanks for the education. Very interesting. Are there any good
online sources of historical infomation about CompuServe and their data
center? I should google.....
> Try here... http://www.rdrop.com/~jimw/j-boards.shtml ... for a
> picture of what looks to be a CompuServe Node serial card.
>
>
Hmmm...yes, too bad Jim doesn't have the picture behind the thumbnail
online anymore. Would be interesting to see up close. Thanks for the link.
J
> PS. Al, if you read this, it would be great if you get an ftp server up
> and running again...
I no longer have direct control of this, since Jay has generously offered
the space/bandwidth for the main site.
I assume you mean ftp access to the archive?
>Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2006 17:10:06 -0800 (PST)
>From: Chris M <chrism3667 at yahoo.com>
>Subject: wtd: Fujitsu Micro16s
>To: talk <cctalk at classiccmp.org>
>Message-ID: <69858.93343.qm at web61012.mail.yahoo.com>
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
>
>seems to have been more prevalent in Europe then here.
>There was a review in BYTE though.
There was (and may still be) a fellow on Ebay selling a pair for $6
shipped. Ah, here it is
<http://cgi.ebay.com/NEW-MB90552APF-Fujitsu-MCUs-100-Pin-QFP-FREE-SHIP_W0QQi…>
I bought a couple from him but have not done anything with them.
They came wrapped in antistatic wrap that was bundled up in tape. I
don't know if they were already bent, or if I bent the pins undoing
the tape, but either way I was not impressed with his packaging job.
It's been a while, so my memory is hazy, but somehow I was able to
request a CD or DVD of development software from Fujitsu. The
European Fujitsu sites seem to have better information on them.
Plus I don't think I saw any development boards advertised anywhere
except on the European site.
However, when I started thinking at the fine detail level, i.e. how
do I develop software and run it on this board, as opposed to the
coarse detail level, i.e. this board has enough IO pins and memory to
do what I want, I realized that having a decent development kit would
be very important.
The tiny bits of obscure information that the sellers publish about
their development kit totally put me off compared to some of the
great information that's out there for kits for the Freescale 9S12
for example.
So ultimately, I decided that the Fujitsu MCUs will probably stay in
a drawer because it's just to big a pain and risk to get a decent
development board for them.
Of course, my research may have been incomplete or inaccurate and I'd
be happy to be shown that it was.
Jeff Walther
> In general, I think its a bad idea to have everything in any community
> funnel through a single person. What happens if Al (knock on wood)
> should get injured and can't do scans anymore? If we adopted the
> "well, just let Al scan everything because he knows how to do it" and
> it never gets documented on what is the best way to scan documents,
> then we lose everything connected to document scanning when we lose
> Al.
The only thing that currently has me as the bottleneck is actually putting
things onto the web site. I have loaned several people now scanners and as
you say, it isn't a good thing to rely on a single person to do all of the
work. One area that would be useful would be having others help in the
cleanup/post-processing of the raw scans. There is only about 25% of what
I've scanned currently on line.
The things I try to concentrate on are materials that are rare and out of
the mainstream. There are others, for example, that are taking care of
microcomputer docs. I also like to collect material on digital magnetic
storage devices, for their use in data recovery.
I really don't claim to have any 'special knowledge'. There is a particular
document processing flow that I prefer to use to have the documents have a
consistant 'look' to them. It does change over time, though. I have started
adding color cover pages recently as well as more grayscale pictures.
FYI:
I scored 14 out of 30
Regards,
Andrew B
aliensrcooluk at yahoo.co.uk
--- In Commodore_Amiga_Retro at yahoogroups.com, "Paul
Hill" <paulroberthill at ...> wrote:
>
> Hi Amigos,
>
> Just stumbled across this Amiga quiz while looking
logic simulator software:
>
> http://www.tetzl.de/quiz/quizbegin.cgi
>
> I scored 20 points out of 30. How about you?
>
> --
> Paul
>
>> A TC08 on an omnibus card would be useful too.
> Nah, you just need yet more Posibus and Data Break cards for your
> Omnibus machines :-).
8E cabling is horrible. I helped maintain a large TSS/8 configuration
(RK8E,TC08,RF08,PC08, lots of 8655's in an expander box) and a similar OS/8
system w/o the expander box, and those heavy shielded BC08s made working on
the CPU a nightmare. As you are aware, there is neither cable strain relief
nor card guides in those machines. It wasn't uncommon to see an Omnibus card
bent 1/4" back because of the cable strain.
Hey Jim,
I just noticed this was sent to cctalk@, apologies if this is off-topic.
> Are you using MS Outlook?
No, Thunderbird.
> Are you using filters to move it to a special folder?
Yes. I'm also subscribed to other mailing lists, but I don't have that
problem there. They have the same sort of filters though.
> Do you have two rules?
Yes, one for cctalk and one for cctech.
> That can cause the symptoms you describe.
>
> Laurens Vets wrote:
>> Hi,
>> Is it normal that I'm receiving _every_ message on the Classic
>> Computer mailing list twice?
>> I'm subscribed to several mailing lists and only the Classic Computer
>> one has this...
Laurens
--
Laurens Vets
http://www.cilinder.behttp://www.cilinder.be/syllable
> On the other hand, anyone who actually owns the relevant
> equipment would probably like to have original documentation.
As I mentioned the the post to you, if someone has the gear, they are
welcome to the paper copy after it has been scanned.
My concern is with getting the material digitized.
