test-drb

test-drb@ccmp.vtda.org

101090 discussions

by gtoal＠gtoal.com

On Thu, 15 Mar 2007 at 22:54:55 Gordon JC Pearce <gordon at gjcp.net> wrote: > On Thu, 2007-03-15 at 16:09 -0500, Graham Toal wrote: > > I've run out of address to try for Fred van Kempen... > > > > does anyone have an idea where he is nowadays? I know he dropped > > off the net once before, and I'm afraid he may have done so > > again. Unfortunately he has an old PDP11 disk of ours and I > > need to talk to him to decide what to do about it. Email me > > his current address please, or pass on to him that I'm trying > > to contact him please, if you're in touch with him. > > We were discussing this in the IRC channel recently. I don't know what > became of the attempts to contact him. > > > Thanks > > > > Graham Toal (Edinburgh Computer History Project) > If you're stuck for PDP11ish bits, I'm just a short drive along the M8 from you ;-) > Gordon I wouldn't bet on that :-) I'm actually based in Edinburg, Texas; and the drive is wherever Fred is in the Netherlands. But it sounds like Henk is liable to bump into him tomorrow at the Hamfest, so we could be in luck. What I may be looking for, however, is someone to read a very old RK05 that hasn't been spun up in 30 years. And someone to bring it back from .NL. (My old Dad took it over the first time on his bicycle! But he's had a small stroke since then and although he still cycles I wouldn't like to send him off on a long trip like that on his own again...) Graham

19 years, 3 months

Outbound Laptop

by northerndancer2000＠mac.com

Hi: I got your name when I googled Outbound laptop and for sale. Did you ever sell your Outbound? If you did, could you please tell me who you sold it to? Thanks. Jennifer

19 years, 3 months

Austin, Texas Computerworks Goodwill

by trag＠io.com

>Date: Thu, 15 Mar 2007 15:33:46 -0400 >From: "Teo Zenios" <teoz at neo.rr.com> >I don't understand why people donate complete and working vintage machines >to places that just recycle them, why not offer them in the forums of >websites where people collect them or on freecycle or ebay? In many cases the older equipment which is donated comes from institutions or businesses which either have too many machines to handle on a one at a time basis, or just have no mechanism for giving to entities other than Goodwill or similar. Jeff Walther

19 years, 3 months

Austin, Texas Computerworks Goodwill

by trag＠io.com

>Date: Thu, 15 Mar 2007 12:18:05 -0700 (PDT) >From: Chris M <chrism3667 at yahoo.com> > My advice is to make known to the folk in your >area (the area being as big as you're willing to >travel) that you salvage these items for donations and whatnot. That might work at stores other than Goodwill ComputerWorks. There have been times when I could *see* older machines in the back sorting area. I asked the clerks if they ever get any of 'X' and they say no. I have done this multiple times including with the manager at the store. They have no interest in fulfilling requests. For some reason they are bound and determined to only sell newer stuff even when they have a customer standing in the store and the items in the sorting area. Jeff Walther

19 years, 3 months

old terminals...

by jwest＠ezwind.net

Ya know... this recent talk of terminals got me thinking..... It would be a good idea IMHO to preserve the functionality of all these classic old terminals. After all, sooner or later the real ones will disappear or at least stop working. After all, some systems are picky about only working with certain terminals (or some only work WELL with certain terminals)... Then I started thinking... most modernish "good" terminal emulation packages don't support all the old venerable classics. Sure, many do VT100 (sort of). But when was the last time you saw a terminal emulation package that faithfully reproduced a beehive minibee? Or a Heath H19? I think it might be helpful for the future if there was a "collectors" terminal emulation program that really did strive to get emulations for all the old terminals, and get it dead right. I know it'd be nice to have one emulator for my systems that "did the right thing(tm)" on my HP mini's, my DECs, DGs, and my Heathkits, GA Zebras, TI990's, etc. etc. all with one program. Instead I have to have many different terminal emulation programs (because one that does HP2624 emulation wont do my TI terminal emulation...)... or the real thing (which of course I'd prefer). So then my unix-centric brain said... Oh, well, there's always termcap/terminfo. Surely that will document old terminals for posterity and future emulation. So I just popped in to my local copy of terminfo and sure enough, there's even an entry for the beehive minibee and superbee. BUT... I then noted the comments that say "hey, this termcap entry is pretty wrong and doesn't work right". So relying on terminfo for preservation is probably not a great idea. But it's a start. Just thinking out loud... would be nice to have a terminal emulation program that was easily extensible for any terminal, already had all the ones defined that we here are familiar with... and ran on everything from MS/DOS to Vista to *nix. A classiccmp'ers terminal emulator :) Maybe a good start would be those of us that have particular terminals at least going in and correcting the terminfo entries that are incorrect. Perhaps this is a silly idea and I just need my morning coffee! Jay West

19 years, 3 months

cctech Digest, Vol 43, Issue 43

by marvin＠rain.org

> Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2007 12:19:29 +0000 (UTC) > box with the proper length loop. They worked, but were so dried out > from age/storage that the print wasn't any darker!! I even tried > drilling a small hole above the inkpad roller and squirting in some X- > stamper (handheld stamp) ink, but that didn't help much. > > So I've about given up on my 43, unless someone can tell me where to > get a ribbon that actually works! A re-inker works pretty well. Basically it is a device that applies new ink to the ribbon.

19 years, 3 months

Austin, Texas Computerworks Goodwill

by trag＠io.com

>Date: Thu, 15 Mar 2007 13:57:40 -0500 >From: Jim Battle <frustum at pacbell.net> >I've had it with the Computerworks in Austin. Please let me rant; >nobody else will appreciate it. > > http://www.austingoodwill.org/crs/store%20locater%20pages/ComputerWorks.html > >When I moved to Austin a couple years ago, I had high hopes. > In >Austin (and San Antonio, and probably some other cities) Goodwill sends >all of their computer donations to a specialized goodwill, marketed as >"ComputerWorks"; the theory is that most goodwill's don't have skilled >employees to know what is interesting or not and how to price it; I >agree that is the case. > >The Austin Computerworks even has a vintage computer museum, so that led >me to believe the appreciated vintage computers. >Bzzt. Not so. >What makes this even more insidious is that when I go to the local run >of the mill goodwills and inquire about what they do with old computer >donations, they say they ship them to computer works to deal with them. > >So essentially it is a vintage computer magnet attached to a wood chipper. My main interest is in old Macintosh and clone machines. I mostly lost interest in the Computer Works store when it became obvious that they would no longer put anything older than a Beige G3 on the shelves. But just to rub it in, they keep a Macintosh 128K up on a top shelf in the sales area which is not for sale. Why display such a collectable, when they will never offer anything remotely similar for sale ever again? Before they changed locations they had a nice little collection of SE/30s on one of the top shelves. Before they changed policies, I picked up a PM9150, a bunch of old unobtainium NuBus cards, and similar bits and pieces. Now, phsssst. I flap my tongue and direct spittle in their general direction. Jeff Walther

19 years, 3 months

teletype model 43 value (Richard)

by charlesmorris＠hughes.net

>From: Richard <legalize at xmission.com> >In article <m1HRzUm-000J1EC at p850ug1>, > ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) writes: > >> It uses an odd ribbon that is probably unobtanium now > > What's so odd about the ribbon? The ribbons aren't impossible to obtain but not everyone carries them. Usual quantity is at least a box of five. I think I already posted this (check the archives), but I'll recap briefly for those interested: Last year I bought a nice 43 in a transit case. Print was very light. So I ordered a box of five ribbons ($40+ with shipping) and promptly discovered that they had been made incorrectly (ribbon loop too long, so the ribbon was too slack and would not move across the re-ink roller during carriage return). After taking one apart, having a dialogue with the design engineer at Dataprint(?) and sending them for his inspection, he agreed that they were incorrectly made and sent me a new box with the proper length loop. They worked, but were so dried out >from age/storage that the print wasn't any darker!! I even tried drilling a small hole above the inkpad roller and squirting in some X- stamper (handheld stamp) ink, but that didn't help much. So I've about given up on my 43, unless someone can tell me where to get a ribbon that actually works! -Charles

19 years, 3 months

cctech Digest, Vol 43, Issue 43

by charlesmorris＠hughes.net

19 years, 3 months

sparc powerlite

by silvercreekvalley＠yahoo.com

Hi, I'm using a sparc powerlite which is a sparc laptop and it works great in stand alone mode. However, when I use an external monitor (plugged into the back) the screen shakes significantly whenever there is disk activity. Its pretty major interference - any ideas as to what that might be - or if there is an easy cure (maybe replacing the HD?) Thanks Ian. ____________________________________________________________________________________ Need Mail bonding? Go to the Yahoo! Mail Q&A for great tips from Yahoo! Answers users. http://answers.yahoo.com/dir/?link=list&sid=396546091

19 years, 3 months

Data General DG/500 - Help

by g-wright＠att.net

-------------- Original message ---------------------- From: Robert Borsuk <rborsuk at colourfull.com> > > Hi All, > I just got in a Data General DG/500 (this is the PC style computer > based on the microEclipse chip set). > Unforturnately, no docs or software can with the unit. Does anyone > have any info on this unit, or can > point me in the right direction. Even the connectors on the back are > non-standard. > > Thanks > Rob > > > Robert Borsuk > rborsuk at colourfull.com > -- > (\__/) > (='.'=) This is Bunny. Copy and paste bunny into your > (")_(") signature to help him gain world domination. > > I have the same problems here but did get some of the manuals >from bruce @ "Nova's are Forever" He does read this list and sends links if he has time. I can E-mial what I have if needed. I did figure out the pin-outs for the connections on the back. Have not been able to locate the cables or the OS tapes. - Jerry Jerry Wright

19 years, 3 months

ftp archives disappearing?

by dm561＠torfree.net

Date: Wed, 14 Mar 2007 17:35:19 -0400 From: Dave McGuire <mcguire at neurotica.com> Subject: Re: ftp archives disappearing? <snippage> ... >The massive influx of clueless morons has changed the >Internet considerably, to be sure, but the core of what it was is >still there and still works just fine, IF you choose to make use of it. -------- Well, I think that the biggest change, at least in a negative sense, is the malware and security problems so prevalent today, and in my opinion many of the people ultimately responsible for the trojans and virii and keeping the spam ahead of the filters are not clueless morons at all. In fact, they're probably a lot like you, computer literate, elitist and contemptuous of anyone who chooses to invest his or her time and intelligence in areas other than the arcane intricacies of computers and just uses them as tools (and runs Microsoft software of course ;-). ===================== On Mar 14, 2007, at 12:44 PM, Jules Richardson wrote: >> (I had exactly the same issues with VCRs the other day - they're >> still useful *to me*, but planet-wide they're dead as a dodo, >> superseded by DVD and PVR technology, so I had to bite my tongue >> when someone declared them obsolete :-) Dave: > Indeed, I know how you feel...the same thing happens to me with a >few things that I use that just happen to be "not new" (which, to the >99% of our society that doesn't think, now means "old"). Jules: >> [and there's a real danger with people confusing obsolescence with >> "no longer any good" - to my mind they're often totally different >> things] Dave: > Yes, that is infuriating. I emailed a question to the >manufacturer of a piece of test equipment that I have here, and the >response was "that product is obsolete". Well that's interesting...I >use it every day, it works great, and the company hasn't released >anything better since then. > Despite what corporations seem to think, true obsolescence is >determined by the USERS and the CUSTOMERS, not the vendors. There's >a big, big difference between "this is obsolete" and "we'd like to >sell you something different now". > Now, of course there's the matter of unreasonably expecting a >company to spend the resources to support a product long after it has >been discontinued. But again, that's not "that product is obsolete", >that's "we don't make that product anymore and we can't spend the >resources to support it". BIG difference. > Infuriating. > -Dave ----------------------------------- Sorry to hear that the word "obsolete" troubles you both so. As one of the 99% that (in Dave's opinion) doesn't think, I'd certainly consider something that's no longer manufactured or supported "obsolete" and, in comparison with something new, even "old." Whether it's still useful or, like Tony, you or I accept or even prefer its limitations in the current context and continue to use an AT to browse the 'Web is not really relevant. Sorry to say, it's the rest of us who prefer the convenience and extra features of DVDs & PVRs and enjoy full colour and motion video and audio on the 'Web (and of course the manufacturers who give us what we want) who decide what's obsolete. And you should be grateful: if DECs, HPs etc. weren't considered obsolete you probably wouldn't be able to afford 'em. And Jules, the next time someone you know buys a DVD player to replace that "obsolete" VCR, instead of biting your tongue just take the VCR off their hands and smile because you just got a free spare. m

19 years, 3 months

ftp archives disappearing?

by Billy.Pettit＠wdc.com

Dave McGuire wrote: Yes, that is infuriating. I emailed a question to the manufacturer of a piece of test equipment that I have here, and the response was "that product is obsolete". Well that's interesting...I use it every day, it works great, and the company hasn't released anything better since then. Despite what corporations seem to think, true obsolescence is determined by the USERS and the CUSTOMERS, not the vendors. There's a big, big difference between "this is obsolete" and "we'd like to sell you something different now". Now, of course there's the matter of unreasonably expecting a company to spend the resources to support a product long after it has been discontinued. But again, that's not "that product is obsolete", that's "we don't make that product anymore and we can't spend the resources to support it". BIG difference. Infuriating. -Dave -- Dave McGuire Port Charlotte, FL Billy: I agree that "obsolete" has different meanings for different people. For you, if it still functions, then it is not obsolete. So a model A is not obsolete because it still works. But for a manufacturer, more than just supporting a product - does it still generate revenue? That is what "works" means to a business. The product may be great, it may last for 50 years. But if it doesn't generate revenue, it is obsolete. You look for functionality - OEMs look for revenue. Obsolete then has multiple meanings depending on your viewpoint. I consider the Apple II obsolete - yet my machine still works great. I think you are saying that to you, the Apple II is not obsolete. By your criteria, is there ANY machine, computer or otherwise, that is obsolete? Can you give us an example or two of an obsolete machine? This is of great interest to me, because I'm in the middle of a new market (TVs with hard drives). All hard drives made today are regarded by the manufacturers as obsolete after 5 years max. (The parts are no longer made, the interface is different, the tooling is gone, etc.) There is no PRACTICAL way to extend the obsolescent point and still stay in business. But TVs are expected to have a normal life of 15 years before becoming obsolete (in the eyes of the industry, not the user). It's a big dilemma for us. Billy

19 years, 3 months

ftp archives disappearing

by Billy.Pettit＠wdc.com

? Ethan Dicks wrote: On 3/14/07, Billy Pettit <Billy.Pettit at wdc.com <http://www.classiccmp.org/mailman/listinfo/cctalk> > wrote: > But TVs are expected to have a normal life of 15 years before becoming > obsolete (in the eyes of the industry, not the user). It's a big dilemma > for us. Try buying an analog (non-HD) TV and trying to get 15 years out of it in the US. It'll make a fine monitor for a cable box or a DVD player or a VCR, but it won't work as a TV after 2009. Would that not be "obsolete" well before 15 years? -ethan To me, certainly. But then I regard any analog TV as obsolete already, even if it is still in production. And I don't know anybody trying to put a hard drive in an analog TV. It really serves no useful purpose. Billy

19 years, 3 months

Philips Micom 2001 in Rochester NY - pick-up only

by tosteve＠yahoo.com

Do not respond to me, please contact townmike at yahoo.com if interested. ------------------------------------------------ > Dear Sir or Madam: > > I have a Philips Micom 2001 that I no longer need > and I am wondering if you know someone who could use > it. I don't want to simply throw it away. I have > the operating software and the manuals, as well as > the printer that came with it. Everything worked > the last time that I used it. I don't have the two > countertops, but I may be able to get them. > > The computer is in Rochester, NY, USA. > > Please contact me if you know of someone who would > like this computer system. > > Thank you - townmike at yahoo.com > ____________________________________________________________________________________ Finding fabulous fares is fun. Let Yahoo! FareChase search your favorite travel sites to find flight and hotel bargains. http://farechase.yahoo.com/promo-generic-14795097

19 years, 3 months

Darkhorse Systems SIMM tester

by doc＠mdrconsult.com

Does anyone have a manual for the Darkhorse Systems, Inc. SIGMA LC SIMM tester? Specifically, I'm most interested in the "COMM" port. What's the pinout, what's the protocol, and what are the speed/stop-bit/parity settings? Is it for attaching to a printer only, or can I connect it to a computer? Thanks! Doc

19 years, 3 months

Introduction And Questions About Media Preservation? "MostlyDecStuff"

by fsmith＠ladylinux.com

On Thursday 15 March 2007 03:01:05 am cctalk-request at classiccmp.org wrote: Dwight Wrote .. > There is at least one SA851 on eBay right now. One also > just sold for about $30. Yep I have my eyes on a couple. I am loathe to pay 30.00 for a untested drive though. -- Kindest Regards, Francesca Smith "No Problems Only Solutions" Lady Linux Internet Services Baltimore, Maryland 21217

19 years, 3 months

SWTPC craze

by Billy.Pettit＠wdc.com

Richard wrote: Dude. 10 years ago I don't know if this "hobby" was on anyone's radar. Did ebay even exist 10 years ago? At any rate, 10 years seems like such a long time for this hobby that I don't know how you could compare 10 years ago to now. Billy writes: Oh come on! SWTPC kits were all the rage 30 years ago. Ever see one of their calculators? Ever use a KIM or SYM? 10 years is for the newbies to the hobby. Long before eBay, we had Ham Fests, fleas markets, government auctions, bankruptcy sales, etc. Some very serious scrounging and repairing took place. Maybe there were no terminals in mile high piles. But we sought out Teletypes, Flexowriters, Dura Machines, etc. I guess it hinges on what you mean by "hobby". Before the 1975 Mark 8 article, there were clubs around the US and England for homebrew computers. Most used TTL. Many had home made ROMS made from diode arrays. Quite a few copied instruction sets from DEC, DG so they could use the software. But these were true computers and true computer hobbyists. If you were extremely lucky, you found an entire computer. My first PDP-8 was dropped off a truck and sold by the pound by the insurance company. This was well before microprocessors were available. My first home built used DTL logic and serial shift registers for memory, circa 1965. And I had several friends who also were active computer hobbyists and built their own designs. Okay, so we're old farts and now that the dinosaurs went extent, we don't count as part of the hobby any more. But dammit, 10 years is nothing. I know a few other survivors who have been playing with home computers for 50 years! Billy

19 years, 3 months

11/45 progress

by jwest＠ezwind.net

A darlington (Q1) and a zener (D3) later... and my +15v (as well as -15v) has returned to the requisite spots on the backplane. Thanks a TON for the schematics Christian & Al, extra thanks to Al for the entire 11/45 printset!! Oh, and Tony, the description of the power supply circuit and test points was most helpfull. Thank you! I understand the supply itself, but I'm not sure I understand the control circuits just after the darlington that will shut it down. The machine now springs to life and passes all the front panel tests I would normally do. I did manual store/recall of various patterns in core. "clr pc" in loc 0 loops as does "br ." in any location. The box also passes a trap catcher program. Lastly, it passes a memory address test (puts the address of each memory location in each memory location and then verifies). Next I would like a way to test interrupts in this minimal configuration (that was where the problem was before, no matter what device interrupted it would always trap to the same address). I would assume I have to put something like an M7856 in next in order to test this. Sound like a reasonable next step? Remember, in the config I have right now I've just got 3 quad SPC slots... hex cards are not an option (yet). On another note... the power control board (5409730) was well... really poorly soldered. I'm not an expert solderer, but those joints looked awfull. Not to mention I had a difficult time getting any of the old solder to be absorbed by my solderwick. Is this a characteristic of old solder? My iron was at 750f, I'd think that'd be plenty (it is for my own new solder). Thanks for the input folks! Jay West

19 years, 3 months

SWTPC craze

by legalize＠xmission.com

Clearly SWTPC is a brand that is just as desirable as CompuColor. ebay Item # 190088674069 CT-64 terminal with minor case damage and no matching monitor. 12 bids, closed at $625.25 Another item out of my price range... I had to fight really hard to get my Cromemco Beehive -- I imagine the Cromemco OEM label is the only thing that kept it out of the scrappers hands. -- "The Direct3D Graphics Pipeline" -- DirectX 9 draft available for download <http://www.xmission.com/~legalize/book/download/index.html> Legalize Adulthood! <http://blogs.xmission.com/legalize/>

19 years, 3 months

the Tandy 2000 and GIFs

by chrism3667＠yahoo.com

according to this: http://www.preterhuman.net/texts/computing/general/format.txt there is a program by which the T2K can display gif images. The only graphics package (besides Autocad) that was graphics oriented was Lumena, and that was so old I sincerely doubt gifs were around then. If anyone happens to know if this is true, please inform. That site seems to have a number of text files archived, some possibly vintage oriented. ____________________________________________________________________________________ Bored stiff? Loosen up... Download and play hundreds of games for free on Yahoo! Games. http://games.yahoo.com/games/front

19 years, 3 months

ftp archives disappearing

by blstuart＠bellsouth.net

> From: Dave McGuire <mcguire at neurotica.com> > Yeah, and I just ran a Nessus scan against a web server at work, > and it recommended that I close port 80 because it's a potential > security risk. The only way the data on a machine is 100% secure is > if the machine is disconnected from the network, powered off, and > sitting in a closet. If one requires more usefulness than that > configuration provides, there is going to be some element of risk. > There's just no way around it. "It is easy to run a secure computer system. You merely have to disconnect all dial-up [network] connections and permit only direct-wired terminals, put the machine and its terminals in a shielded room, and post a guard at the door. - F.T. Gramp and R.H. Morris BLS

19 years, 3 months

OSI networking (was Re: FTP)

by tshoppa＠wmata.com

Andrew Back wrote: > I vote we dispense with both, set up an FTAM responder, build an OSI > network, and bury this pesky Internet. This is sort-of like taking the most virulent strain of smallpox there is, bottling it up, and then deciding what to do with it. Some things were cool and are worth saving and continuing to use. Certainly talk, finger, etc., all the wonderfully simple TCP/IP services fall into this category. Other things (OSI networking and its implementation in DECNET Phase V) should be preserved in the computer industry's equivalent of the Holocaust Museum, or the CDC's smallpox samples, lest we ever forget. They literally sucked and wasted billions of dollars of otherwise useful effort from projects that could've used creativity and simplicity rather than seven layers of crappy beauracracy on crappy beauracracy. Tim.

19 years, 3 months

ftp archives disappearing?

by legalize＠xmission.com

Has anyone else noticed that ftp search services like archie seem to have disappeared, that the content on ftp sites isn't indexed by google very well and that large software archives seem to be disappearing? Try searching for old copies of fractint and they are hard to find, even though they were everywhere as recently as 10 years ago. What's happened to FTP? Should we be working to archive large FTP software repositories? -- "The Direct3D Graphics Pipeline" -- DirectX 9 draft available for download <http://www.xmission.com/~legalize/book/download/index.html> Legalize Adulthood! <http://blogs.xmission.com/legalize/>

19 years, 3 months

UNIX 'file' command (was Re: PDP-11/40 videos)

by ethan.dicks＠gmail.com

On 3/15/07, Dave McGuire <mcguire at neurotica.com> wrote: > Try this experiment on pretty much any UNIX-likesystem: > > apophis$ cat > foo.txt > GIF89a is a half-decent file format. > apophis$ file foo.txt > foo.txt: GIF file, v89 Nice demo. I already knew about how file works, how the "database" is structured, and I've even tweaked it once or twice to handle new files (Infocom game files, FWIW ;-), but I'd never tried a simple little thing like that. I can see how it would work, but it just never occurred to me to try that. -ethan (who uses 'file' several times a week)

19 years, 3 months

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