- test-drb@ccmp.vtda.org - classiccmp.org

WTB: GRiDPad 1912 parts

by higginbo＠netpath.net

Looking for the keyboard adapter, internal 2400 MNP modem w/jacks, the optional stand, just about anything that was available for it. - - john higginbotham ____________________________ - webmaster www.pntprinting.com - - limbo limbo.netpath.net -

28 years

1
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IBM service rig?

by sinasohn＠ricochet.net

At 11:13 PM 6/11/98 -0500, you wrote: >I just picked up an IBM type 9075 laptop. The label on the inside (where the >keyboard is) says it's an Aptek Personal Service Communicator II. It's got a The PC Radio. Take a look at <http://www.sinasohn.com/clascomp/pcradio.htm>; is yours the same? If so, do you have a power supply? I think I've got the info I have on the web page... It was designed for service people to communicate with the home office. --------------------------------------------------------------------- O- Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad roger(a)sinasohn.com that none but madmen know." Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates San Francisco, California http://www.sinasohn.com/

28 years

2
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FW: Fellow wants a VAX, willing to pay...

by kyrrin＠jps.net

Except for MV3100's (he explicitly says no to them), this fellow's willing to pay real money for a cheap VAXen. If you can help, reply to him directly. Thanks. Attachment follows. -=-=- <snip> -=-=- From: Mark Tarka <tarka(a)earth.oscs.montana.edu> Newsgroups: comp.os.vms Subject: WTB small VAX system -- WA State Message-ID: <009C797D.53C8C87D.1(a)earth.oscs.montana.edu> Date: Fri, 12 Jun 1998 11:25:55 MDT Organization: Info-Vax<==>Comp.Os.Vms Gateway X-Gateway-Source-Info: Mailing List Lines: 9 Path: blushng.jps.net!news.eli.net!uunet!in2.uu.net!nntp.ntr.net!news.maxwell.syr.edu!news.idt.net!nntp2.cerf.net!nntp3.cerf.net!mvb.saic.com!info-vax I will be in Western Washington State next week (6/16 to 6/22) on business (American Chemical Society regional meeting in the Tri-Cities). Is there anyone in the Spokane-Walla Walla-Yakima triangle with a small VAX to donate or sell ($200 or less)? No MV3100's, please. Mark -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Bruce Lane, Sysop, The Dragon's Cave (Fido 1:343/272) http://table.jps.net/~kyrrin -- also kyrrin [A-t] Jps {D=o=t} Net Spam is bad. Spam is theft of service. Spam wastes resources. Don't spam, period. I am a WASHINGTON STATE resident. Spam charged $500.00 per incident per Chapter 19 RCW.

28 years

1
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IIRC

by photze＠batelco.com.bh

28 years

2
1
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Mini-Monitors?

by allisonp＠world.std.com

<><Does anyone know of a *cheap* source of a VGA-compatible display? What <><looking for, especially, is low power usage, followed by compactness an <><portability. Thanks! At 5$ it's interesting to have as a spare assuming the shipping isn't over 20$. <>I'm also interested in same and know someone that might like info. <>There is a truck load of applications for a cheap/compact/lowpower <>VGA display. I should elaborate. I'm looking for a mono (or color) display that is very low power and size is not that important other than I need to be able to see 80charx24line text on it. Graphics are not required. While some CRTs can be under 10watts power my desire is an order of magnitude lower if possible. An LCD would be ideal but alas none are available (low cost) that have more than the basic LCD drivers. The DELL laptop LCD I have is typical of the MONO 640x480 displays and the "video" input is not like a crt in timing or signals. For example the display is really two 640x240 running in parallel with seperate video for each. Hand built logic to do that costs enough in power and design time to make it unappealing or no better than a good mono crt unless I resort to Gals/FPGAs (design effort and cost prohibitive for a one up). Allison

28 years

3
2
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CP/M

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

I have started bringing home the expanded Apple II+. It has an external "Executive Peripheral Systems, Inc." keyboard, with program macro modules for Wordstar and Visicalc (great keyboard,if only it clicked), and the regular DuoDisk. I also brought home the DR CP/M card manual. The Apple II and floppies will be brought home next week. I was firstly thinking of putting this into a PC case, since the keyboard is external anyway. But I was reading the CP/M manual (pretty shallow), and it mentions a 16-user capability and password protection. How does this work and how secure is it? Also, would you say that the Z-80 was better than the 8088? It was certainly used much more... ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

28 years

2
1
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GRiD/PenExec questions

by sinasohn＠ricochet.net

Someone had e-mailed me the pinouts for the AST PenExec (aka GRiD Convertable), but I lost them when my e-mail crashed. Whoever it was, could you be so kind as to resend them? Thanks! Also, the GRiD version was available with a 386 (2260) and 486 (2270). Does anyone know if there were also two AST versions? Thanks! --------------------------------------------------------------------- O- Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad roger(a)sinasohn.com that none but madmen know." Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates San Francisco, California http://www.sinasohn.com/

28 years

4
3
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CP/M

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

Because if I use a baby AT case, it will take less space than the apple case. I will also be able to stick the floppy drive inside. >Why? > ><keyboard is external anyway. But I was reading the CP/M manual ><(pretty shallow), and it mentions a 16-user capability and password ><protection. > >Well the 16 user thing is not multiuser it's a way of diving up the >directory into 16 distinct areas as CP/M didn't have subdirectories. > >Password protection? There wasn't any as part of CP/M. The CP/M 3+ manual says the syntax is drive:12345678.123;password. Maybe it's a weird DR thing. They tended to add weird stuff... ><say that the Z-80 was better than the 8088? It was certainly used ><much more... > >Better... that's a relative term. It was cheaper to use, more software >available as it was fully upward compatable with the 8080 (and 8085) >that preceeded it and it was there before the 8088. Also as the 8088 >got faster the z80 also got faster and added a MMU. I can still build >a system using z80 for less than the 8088 and the z80 one will be easier >to program. If the program gets larger than fits in the 64k space then >the competition becomes a bit more fair. Still segmented space is pretty >ugly and a paged MMU on z80 is very easy to do. Or better yet a z180 >(64180) which is a z180 with MMU, 2 serial ports and a DMA all on one >chip (and still cheaper and faster than a bare 8088 in 1985). The z180 >also offered something the 8088 line never had which was a compatable >highly integrated version as the 8088 needed several parts around it to >use effectively and the '188 was an odd duck compared to the 8088. So >for the 8088 comparison the z80 was hard to dislodge. It really took the >386(32bits) to make a real impact. > >Z80 space was characterized as developing, it was inexpensive to develop >around, there were lots of similar and competing systems (both >a blessing and curse), tons of cheap to free software, offered sufficient >compute power and friendy to program in assembler. The only other chip >to be as persistant, easy to use and popular was the 6502. > >I might add that both were quite popular in the instrumentation and >control sytems field. > >Tidbit... the z80/z180 is still in production and the cmos z80s182 runs >at a screaming 20mhz internal clock (roughly 2-4mips processing speed) >and can come to a complete stop, using only microwatts of power in that >mode. I have a z180 at 9.8mhz and it's quite fast for text apps and is >usually waiting on the SCSI hard disk system (xybec/st251). > > >Allison > > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

28 years

1
0
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Cyber 2000?

by william＠ans.net

OK, so it seems to be the last CDC machine, after the Cyber 180s. Does anyone have any information on these things? Any still in use? William Donzelli william(a)ans.net

28 years

1
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CP/M

by allisonp＠world.std.com

<I was firstly thinking of putting this into a PC case, since the Why? <keyboard is external anyway. But I was reading the CP/M manual <(pretty shallow), and it mentions a 16-user capability and password <protection. Well the 16 user thing is not multiuser it's a way of diving up the directory into 16 distinct areas as CP/M didn't have subdirectories. Password protection? There wasn't any as part of CP/M. How does this work and how secure is it? Also, would you <say that the Z-80 was better than the 8088? It was certainly used <much more... Better... that's a relative term. It was cheaper to use, more software available as it was fully upward compatable with the 8080 (and 8085) that preceeded it and it was there before the 8088. Also as the 8088 got faster the z80 also got faster and added a MMU. I can still build a system using z80 for less than the 8088 and the z80 one will be easier to program. If the program gets larger than fits in the 64k space then the competition becomes a bit more fair. Still segmented space is pretty ugly and a paged MMU on z80 is very easy to do. Or better yet a z180 (64180) which is a z180 with MMU, 2 serial ports and a DMA all on one chip (and still cheaper and faster than a bare 8088 in 1985). The z180 also offered something the 8088 line never had which was a compatable highly integrated version as the 8088 needed several parts around it to use effectively and the '188 was an odd duck compared to the 8088. So for the 8088 comparison the z80 was hard to dislodge. It really took the 386(32bits) to make a real impact. Z80 space was characterized as developing, it was inexpensive to develop around, there were lots of similar and competing systems (both a blessing and curse), tons of cheap to free software, offered sufficient compute power and friendy to program in assembler. The only other chip to be as persistant, easy to use and popular was the 6502. I might add that both were quite popular in the instrumentation and control sytems field. Tidbit... the z80/z180 is still in production and the cmos z80s182 runs at a screaming 20mhz internal clock (roughly 2-4mips processing speed) and can come to a complete stop, using only microwatts of power in that mode. I have a z180 at 9.8mhz and it's quite fast for text apps and is usually waiting on the SCSI hard disk system (xybec/st251). Allison

28 years

1
0
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CP/M

by peacock＠simconv.com

> But I was reading the CP/M manual (pretty shallow), and it mentions a 16-user capability and password protection. How does this work and how secure is it? Also, would you say that the Z-80 was better than the 8088? It was certainly used much more... > The "16 user" isn't really a multi-user capability. Unlike MS-DOS, Unix, VMS, etc., CP/M did not have subdirectories. The main directory was it, everything fit there. This was not so convenient, so "user areas" came into being with CP/M v2. The 16 users are actually numbered subdirectories. The "C> USER 5" command would switch you to subdirectory 5, equivalent to a "C> CD \DIR5" in DOS. The idea was if multiple people used the machine, each would have their own area. On V3 the user 0 area was a common directory, I think there were some commands to control this (very rusty on CP/M V3). I don't think CP/M V3 was ever implemented on the Apple card, since V3 was designed to use banked memory over 64K. As for 8088 vs. Z80, I would rate the 8088 as one step above the Z80. It was slower, but had a larger instruction set and a crude MMU built in, out to the 1MB limit so familiar today. The Z80 was a bit faster at the same clock rate, and the 8088 never got to a very high speed, IIRC it got to about 8 or 10Mhz in the Intel version, NEC sold variants out to 12Mhz. The Z80H was an 8Mhz part, it kept up with the 4.77Mhz original IBM quite well, except for the memory limitation. BTW, on S-100 systems the 8086 was far more common than the 8088, since the S-100 could support a real 16-bit bus. Zilog and Hitachi eventually extended the Z80 out to 512K and then 1MB with an MMU too, but it was never as flexible as the segment registers in the 8088. As far as design difficulty, using an 8088 or Z80 was about equal. The 8088 had a minimal mode for small designs, or support chipset for expanded systems. The Z80 took some random logic for the clock signal and needed some type of MMU if you needed more than 64K. Jack Peacock

28 years

1
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I have a AC Adapter for Apple Portable

by webmaster＠pntprinting.com

Someone was looking for a Mac Portable PS? Too late for me. >X-Persona: <webmaster> >Return-Path: <rdeleon(a)newmax.dataflux.com.mx> >Date: Fri, 12 Jun 1998 18:33:03 +0000 >From: Rolando de Le?n <rdeleon(a)newmax.dataflux.com.mx> >Reply-To: rdeleon(a)newmax.dataflux.com.mx >Organization: MAC S.A. >To: webmaster(a)pntprinting.com >Subject: I have a AC Adapter for Apple Portable > >I have an AC Adapter *NEW* Apple Brand. have also a base for recharging >the battery outside of the computer. > >I Want $15 US Dlls. for it > >Please let me know. > > >Rolando de Leon >

28 years

1
0
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Pre-Color Computer Terminal??

by archive＠navix.net

Woops... sorry, I didn't include my e-mail address, name, etc., on the header of my first e-mail here. Again, problems with my mail software and just some tempory settings. I'm really not anonomous, just appear to be on my last e-mail. Thanks, CORD COSLOR archive(a)navix.net -- ____________________________________________________________ | Cord G. Coslor : archive(a)navix.net |\ | Deanna S. Wynn : deannasue(a)navix.net | | | on AOL Instant Messenger: DeannaCord | | | http://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/Vista/4395 | | |------------------------------------------------------------| | | PO Box 308 - Peru, NE - 68421 - (402) 872- 3272 | | |------------------------------------------------------------| | | If you don't have AOL (like us) but want a great instant | | | chat feature, just go to http://www.aol.com/aim | | |____________________________________________________________| | \_____________________________________________________________\|

28 years

2
2
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Mini-Monitors?

by allisonp＠world.std.com

<Which reminds me of a hardware question: I can get lots of nice LCD <displays very cheap. How hard is it to convert one to a VGA display (or <even to convert an old laptop with built-in VGA controller to something <that will accept VGA input)? Reduce the number of variables and we may have a shot... I have one >from a dell laptop. It's rather interesting to drive and it ain't VGA or even mono! Allison

28 years

1
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IIRC

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

What IS up with them? I don't get "their" reference to themselves in plural. Was it really a group? >On Thu, 11 Jun 1998, Francois wrote: > >> Well, "If I Recall Corectly" that's what it means. > >BTW, whatever happened to lisard/communa? The consistency with which >"they" used pronouns was impressive: IIRC -> iwrc. > >-- Doug > > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

28 years

1
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Unix filenames and drum memory (was: Files as files)

by allisonp＠world.std.com

<BTW, as a bit of trivia, a friend of mine who worked for the CIA in <Vietnam had the job of actually grinding off all the oxide on retired <disks and drums, so there would be no possibility of recovering data Along the same lines the A6 aircraft in the Vietnam era used a drum based computer for the bomb targetting computer... a 10g turn could really mess up the computer. Allison

28 years

1
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Early Mac Clones

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

How does this soft-microcode thing work? Doesn't it imply that there is some kind of "sub-microcode" needed to load and process the soft one? Or was there a completely separate storage subsystem that booted first (which would essentially make it two computers)? Also, where was the microcode stored? Could you upgrade special "microcode cache" to store more complex microcode? Sounds pretty unusual! >and with a somewhat interesting design. > >The PERQ 1 was first sold in 1979 for (I think) $30000. For that you got >a personal computer (!) with about 1MIPS of computing power. You also got >a megabyte of memory, a bitmapped display (768*1024 points, portrait), >a blitter, a 20 bit CPU, a Z-80 based I/O processor, a hard disk, a >pointing device (normally a Sumagraphics bit pad 1), etc. Options >included networking (ethernet came out pretty soon after the first >machine) and a laser printer. > >All 'classic PERQs' (everything apart from the PERQ 3a) have a >soft-microcoded CPU that loads the microcode (and hence the instruction >set) from disk when the machine boots. Writing your own microcode is fun. >The PERQ 1a introduced the 16K CPU board with 4 times the control store >and other improvements (multiply/divide support, indexed addressing of >the _registers_) over the original 4K board. > >The PERQ 2's all had a revised I/O board with an extra serial port, >battery-backed real time clock and ethernet as standard. The multitasking >I/O software was only present on these boards AFAIK. You could add the >same I/O option boards to the PERQ 2's, so in theory you can have a PERQ >2 with 2 ethernet ports. > >Older PERQs were 20 bit. The rare PERQ 2T4 was 24 bit. > >If you're interested in finding out more, look at Bob Davis's PERQ web >page (a web search should find it). There's a number of text files there >which explain a few things. There's also a somewhat dead Usenet group, >alt.sys.perq, which would love some on-topic messages again :-). > >> here on the rebellious side of the Atlantic? (I know _nothing_ of > >They were a USA machine (3 Rivers Computer Corporation). But some bits >of the design were done by ICL in the UK, and they were sold by ICL. >They were also one of the standard machines supplied to UK universities, >which may explain why they're more common over here. > >> these machines beyond your messages, if I saw them advertised the >> references went into brain cells that have been foully murdered). > >> Ward Griffiths > >-tony > > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

28 years

2
1
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FA: Various systems

by rcini＠email.msn.com

Auction services have their place, but I think that we on the list should be given the "right of first refusal". If one of the list members has something to sell, give the others a first crack, with some time limit (like a week), before listing it on eBay or Haggle. Just my $0.02. Rich Cini/WUGNET <nospam_rcini(a)msn.com> (remove nospam_ to use) ClubWin! Charter Member (6) MCP Windows 95/Windows Networking Preserver of classic computers ============================================

28 years

1
0
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Unix filenames and drum memory (was: Files as files)

by yakowenk＠cs.unc.edu

On Thu, 11 Jun 1998, Doug Yowza <yowza(a)yowza.com> wrote: ] That used to be one of my interview questions for Unix programmers: your ] buggy program just created a filename with {control characters, leading ] dash (-), leading slash (/), '*', etc} in it. How do you delete it? Oh shoot. And I thought I was Unix-competent. I thought the only way to put a slash in a filename was with a low-level filesystem hack. I mean, the OS calls themselves will take "a/b" to mean file "b" in directory "a", right? It isn't up to your program to parse the filename that way. That isn't something you can get get around, even with any ordinary sort of bug. Is it? Of course, given root permission, you could run the appropriate disk utility, open /dev/root as a file, find the directory block, and put anything you like in a filename. But then you would have to do the same thing to access that file or get rid of it, wouldn't you? How could 'rm' get around that? ObCC: I just noticed /dev/drum on a Dec here. Now I *know* there is not a drum on this thing, so this must be a holdover from some earlier implementation of some Unix. True? Were filesystems on drums managed the same as those on disks? I don't see any reason why they wouldn't be, offhand. But I thought drums died out before Unix appeared. Does anyone still have a functional magnetic drum memory? That would be one _awesome_ peripheral. :-) Bill.

28 years

2
1
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Unix filenames and drum memory (was: Files as files)

by franke＠sbs.de

> ObCC: I just noticed /dev/drum on a Dec here. Now I *know* there > is not a drum on this thing, so this must be a holdover from some > earlier implementation of some Unix. True? Were filesystems on > drums managed the same as those on disks? I don't see any reason > why they wouldn't be, offhand. But I thought drums died out before > Unix appeared. Does anyone still have a functional magnetic drum > memory? That would be one _awesome_ peripheral. :-) No, no functional drum, but I own _parts_ of a drum from an SIEMENS 2002 - this wasn't a storage drum like later on, this computer stored the (working) REGISTERS on the drum (Background: the 2002 was the first fully transistorized computer). Thats prior to core memory tek. Gruss H. -- Ich denke, also bin ich, also gut HRK

28 years

1
0
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Heathkit replacement manuals

by dcoward＠pressstart.com

I just received the H-11a manuals that I ordered last week from the Heathkit's manual replacement service and I just wanted to let any one who is looking for old Heathkit manual know how I made out. I'm very happy with the manuals I received! First I ordered just the Assembly and the Operations manuals. One was $35 (I think) and the other was $45. After I hung up I realized that I had not asked about any schematics or illustration booket that usually comes with these manuals. (By the way, I asked about any EC-1 manuals and she said I was the fifth person to ask about those in the last week, no they don't any manuals for the EC-1) I received the Assembly manual and the Illustration Booket xeroxed DOUBLE sided on 11"x17" paper (also folded but not stapled). The Assembly manual did not have the traditional brown jacket, but I could take one off an old color TV assembly manual. I also received one schematic of the chassis power supply, front panel, and backplane on what seen to be about 20"x25" paper. (It does not look like it's been reduced in size). The Operation manual is about 3/4" thick and most likely came originally in a loose leaf binder. It is xeroxed again double sided and on 8 1/2" x 11" paper. (You can see were the 3 holes were punched) In their letter with the manuals they state that the manuals are nonreturnable but they will "attempt to correct any problem with the quality of the copy". I found they friendly, helpful, and fast. Their number is 616-925-5899 The only problem I've seen so far is with thw xray views of the circuit boards, the RED circuit traces on the foil side of the board do not xerox at all. ========================================= Doug Coward dcoward(a)pressstart.com Senior Software Engineer Press Start Inc. Sunnyvale,CA Curator Museum of Personal Computing Machinery http://www.best.com/~dcoward/museum =========================================

28 years

1
0
0 0

Files as files

by pete＠dunnington.u-net.com

On Jun 11, 23:25, Doug Yowza wrote: > On Fri, 12 Jun 1998, Pete Turnbull wrote: > > > And "rm -i *" prompts even with "-f". > > Not on Linux, at least. > > > AFAIK, all rm's have -r. > > I know -r is a fairly recent addition to "cp", but you may be right about > "rm". Anybody have a V1 system they can test on? :-) I wish :-) "-r" certainly was an option to "rm" in 7th Edition, and IIRC (see other thread :-)) "-i" overrides "-f" there too. -- Pete Peter Turnbull Dept. of Computer Science University of York

28 years

2
1
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IBM service rig?

by rigdonj＠intellistar.net

Here's what IBM says about the 9075:

28 years

1
0
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Unix filenames and drum memory (was: Files as files)

by allisonp＠world.std.com

<> ObCC: I just noticed /dev/drum on a Dec here. Now I *know* there <> is not a drum on this thing, so this must be a holdover from some <> earlier implementation of some Unix. True? Were filesystems on <> drums managed the same as those on disks? I don't see any reason Drum is serial storage just like disks. What distinguished some drom is that ther stored words using multiple parallel heads making them very fast. On PDP-10 I used in 70/71 had a 128kw swapping drum used to hold the swap file. It's my understanding (and memory) it rotated at 1200 or 1800 rpm and stored 18 bit parallel words. I've also used a PDP-8 that had RS/RF08 disk that was structured like a drum with 12bit parallel access (32kw per platter). It was also quite fast. In all aspects durms and disks are the same thing. <> why they wouldn't be, offhand. But I thought drums died out before <> Unix appeared. Does anyone still have a functional magnetic drum <> memory? That would be one _awesome_ peripheral. :-) It didn't! <No, no functional drum, but I own _parts_ of a drum from <an SIEMENS 2002 - this wasn't a storage drum like later <on, this computer stored the (working) REGISTERS on the <drum (Background: the 2002 was the first fully transistorized <computer). Thats prior to core memory tek. Core predates transistors. The TX1 and TX2 were the mostly transistor machines that also had core. They had some tubes(valves) as the high current pulse drivers for the core drivers. I think Mark1 or Whirlwind (all tube) had core. Another use for drums was bit serial machines where register and main memory were serial in nature and stored on multiple tracks of the drum (or disk). Allison

28 years

1
0
0 0

Unix filenames and drum memory (was: Files as files)

by peacock＠simconv.com

True? Were filesystems on drums managed the same as those on disks? I don't see any reasonwhy they wouldn't be, offhand. But I thought drums died out before Unix appeared. I last used a drum on a Univac 1106 (FASTRAND II), the file system was the same as a disk drive. A drum is just a 2 dimensional disk, track and sector but no head select. Univac had fixed head drums and moving head drums, don't recall the capacity (it wasn't all that big). The drums on the 1106 were retired in 1971 when it was upgraded to a dual processor 1108 with a room full of short stack disk drives (20MB packs). Good thing too, the reliability on the drum wasn't so great, heads would often get out of alignment, you would suddenly have half of your file and half of someone else's. BTW, as a bit of trivia, a friend of mine who worked for the CIA in Vietnam had the job of actually grinding off all the oxide on retired disks and drums, so there would be no possibility of recovering data >from them. Might be one reason they are so scarce now. Jack Peacock

28 years

1
0
0 0

Mini-Monitors?

by sinasohn＠ricochet.net

Does anyone know of a *cheap* source of a VGA-compatible display? What I'm looking for, especially, is low power usage, followed by compactness and portability. Thanks! --------------------------------------------------------------------- O- Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad roger(a)sinasohn.com that none but madmen know." Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates San Francisco, California http://www.sinasohn.com/

28 years

3
2
0 0

Pre-Color Computer Terminal??

by a＠aol.com

Greets! I was wondering if anyone might have any information on an old machine produced by Tandy/Radio Shack. It came out _prior_ to the Color Computer, but it looked like a CoCo. However, it was a modified with a phone jack in the back for a TV/monitor and ran off of a 6809E (???). It basically was a videotext terminal of some sort. If anyone might have some information on this little unit, your help in learning more about it, and it's purposes, and maybe some history on it, would be much appreciated. Oh, yeh... an off-topic question? Is this text formatted correctly. I had some problems with my mail software and had it completely messed up trying to fix the original problem. Anyway, let me know if the text is going off the right of your screen or whatever, and if my signature box at the bottom of the page is formatted ok, ok? If it is, great! If something's wrong, feel free to send a private e-mail back to me to let me know ok? Thanks, CORD COSLOR -- ____________________________________________________________ | Cord G. Coslor : archive(a)navix.net |\ | Deanna S. Wynn : deannasue(a)navix.net | | | on AOL Instant Messenger: DeannaCord | | | http://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/Vista/4395 | | |------------------------------------------------------------| | | PO Box 308 - Peru, NE - 68421 - (402) 872- 3272 | | |------------------------------------------------------------| | | If you don't have AOL (like us) but want a great instant | | | chat feature, just go to http://www.aol.com/aim | | |____________________________________________________________| | \_____________________________________________________________\|

28 years

1
0
0 0

online support (was: old laptop BIOS???)

by sinasohn＠ricochet.net

At 08:27 AM 6/10/98 +0000, you wrote: >> I've found Toshiba's on-line support for their older machines to be >> excellent; I wouldn't be surprised at all to find that the setup pgm was >> available on their web site. Definitely worth checking out. > >True, I know but that is very flimsy. Toshiba can decide to pull >those files off, never know. Yes, Toshiba could yank the files from their site, but unless they went out of business (not likely) why would they? Doesn't cost them anything (coupla meg of hd space) to keep them there. Probably more expensive (people time) to get rid of them. An incredibly valuable marketing tool for very little (or no) cost. Because of what I found there, I would definitely consider a Toshiba laptop. >else. IBM, Gateway what you have that have long term service I wouldn't touch a Gateway computer to save my life. I've got a Gateway 2000 Colorbook that my sister uses. I sent them an e-mail to simply ask what models hard drive they used (I got some empty sleds, and my hard drives didn't fit) and if they still sell sleds/hard drives for it. Was told they didn't know, didn't care, not interested. Suggested a couple of places that sell used GW2K stuff. I have a long-standing loathing of IBM, though I must admit some of their more recent laptops look pretty nice. (Can't stand the damn erasers, though.) They do seem to be pretty good about offering support and info on older machines. Basically, if a company isn't interested in helping out with their older (sometimes much older) machines, I'm not interested in their new machines, simply because whatever I buy today I'll still be using when it qualifies for this list. --------------------------------------------------------------------- O- Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad roger(a)sinasohn.com that none but madmen know." Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates San Francisco, California http://www.sinasohn.com/

28 years

6
5
0 0

Files as files

by peacock＠simconv.com

> But the VAX-philopsophy was extreme CISC, and that extended to the VAX/VMS filesystem as well: record-based, with a zillion different file attributes, built-in file versioning, etc. It was hierarchial, but mixed with a clunky "volume" concept (something like DOS "C:", but with longer names). I wouldn't call it "clunky". In fact with VMS you can combine drives into a volume set if you want the filesystem spread across multiple drives, or you can treat each drive as an isolated filesystem. As a system admin, I prefer the separate volumes, makes it easier to manage overnight backups. In our VMScluster individual disks are backed up in parallel across several tape drives (as many as four tapes in operation at the same time, depending on day of week), a trivial task in VMS but a bit more elaborate on a Unix system. As for the RMS file attributes and versioning, they are a dream for programmers, compared to PC or Unix systems. We have NT or W95 workstations at every desk, but we still keep a VMScluster running, partly for financial apps, and partly for coding. When you start dealing with larger apps (i.e 3K-5K users per week, 300-500 at any one time in a 24 hour day, all accessing the same files) you start to appreciate what VMS can do. BTW, one nice advantage of filesystem per disk is drive shadowing in VMS. You can mirror two drives during the day, then break the set, remount the mirrored drive as a separate disk, back it up, then reconnect it back to the shadow set. Instant snapshot backup without shutting down applications, all the database files are intact as of the moment you broke the shadow set, no updates during the backup. Jack Peacock

28 years

3
2
0 0

IIRC

by SUPRDAVE＠aol.com

I've seen him/her/them/it post on alt.folklore.computers about several topics recently, IIRC. david In a message dated 98-06-12 00:56:28 EDT, you write: << BTW, whatever happened to lisard/communa? The consistency with which "they" used pronouns was impressive: IIRC -> iwrc. -- Doug >>

28 years

1
0
0 0

Bit slices?

by allisonp＠world.std.com

<On Thu, 11 Jun 1998, R. Stricklin (kjaeros) wrote: < <> I suppose a better way of asking that is how is a 'bit sliced' processo <> or ALU differentiated from a 'normal' one? The concept was to take a vertical slice of the core of most cpus and make it so they can be cascaded to the needed width. Some of the common parts were the 3101 (intel 2 bit slice) and the 6701/2901 4 bit slices. Their advantages were speed, they were bipolar and in the 70 to early 80s you could make a z80 equivelent using them that was 10mhz and piplined. Or a custom 20 bit machine. <BTW, I mentioned a while back that I wrote a simulation of a PDP-8 built <from 2901's. I finally found the source code for everything but the <assembler (but I did find a grammar spec). It's not in good enough shap <to "publish", and I don't plan to spend the time to get it there, but if <anybody wants a copy, let me know and I'll send you source. (It's <curses-based, and should run fine on any Unix or DOS box). I'd love to see that... I have a big bunch of 2901s doing nothing. Allison

28 years

2
1
0 0

FW: VAX Manuals available

by kyrrin＠jps.net

Found the following on Usenet. Please contact this guy directly if interested. -=-=- <snip> -=-=- From: "Joe Huber" <jhuber(a)anet-dfw.com> Newsgroups: comp.sys.dec Subject: need to get rid of Vax manuals Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 17:07:50 -0500 Organization: ANET Internet Services Lines: 16 Message-ID: <6ln059$8o0$1(a)news1.anet.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: dal-vd1-112.anet-dfw.com X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Path: blushng.jps.net!news.eli.net!news-out.internetmci.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!4.1.16.34!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!news.mathworks.com!uunet!in1.uu.net!news1.anet.com!not-for-mail I have a nearly complete set of VAX/VMS 5.5-2 manuals in 3-ring binder format. There are also bound manuals for DecForms (still in the plastic wrapper), DecPrinting services, several other things. I sold my VAX but the buyer did not want the manuals. I hate to throw them out. I'll "sell" them for the cost of shipping. Please respond via email if interested. Thanks! -- Joe Huber jhuber(a)anet-dfw.com -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Bruce Lane, Sysop, The Dragon's Cave (Fido 1:343/272) http://table.jps.net/~kyrrin -- also kyrrin [A-t] Jps {D=o=t} Net Spam is bad. Spam is theft of service. Spam wastes resources. Don't spam, period. I am a WASHINGTON STATE resident. Spam charged $500.00 per incident per Chapter 19 RCW.

28 years

1
0
0 0

FW: FREE IBM System/38 needs rescue!

by kyrrin＠jps.net

A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text/enriched Size: 1652 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/19980611/6999ffc5/at…

28 years

1
0
0 0

IIRC

by fauradon＠pclink.com

Well, "If I Recall Corectly" that's what it means. Francois ------------------------------------------------------------- Visit the Sanctuary at: http://www.pclink.com/fauradon -----Original Message----- From: Marvin <marvin(a)rain.org> To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> Date: Thursday, June 11, 1998 11:29 PM Subject: IIRC >Somehow, I should probably already know what IIRC stands for, but can >someone enlighten me please. I should have asked years ago :). >

28 years

2
1
0 0

Spotted: PDP 11-23 stuff for sale

by bill_r＠inetnebr.com

The usual disclaimers apply... >In enclosed 19" rack with metal door. 50" x 26" x 30" > >PDP 11-23+ Comm interface PCB's and 2 RL02 drives. > >Was running prod line when de-installed. > >Equipment is located in the metro Atlanta Ga area. > >Email offers.... > > Dick Perron >http://www.randomc.com/~dperr/pc_hdwe.htm >dperr(a)randomc.com > >"Whether you think you can, or you think you can't.....will happen." -Bill Richman bill_r(a)inetnebr.com http://incolor.inetnebr.com/bill_r (Home of the COSMAC Elf Simulator!)

28 years

1
0
0 0

Files as files

by pete＠dunnington.u-net.com

On Jun 11, 13:43, Doug Yowza wrote: > On Thu, 11 Jun 1998, Pete Turnbull wrote: > > Quickest general method is "rm -i *", though you may sometimes need > > "rm -i .*" instead/as well. It doesn't matter for "rm" since it won't delete directories unless you add "-r" but for some other commands , "xx .?*" may be preferable to "xx .*". > If you had a file named "-f" in your directory, then "rm -i *" would > happily delete all of the files in the directory without prompting you. > > "rm -i ./*" would be better, but would not work for files with control > characters or spaces. It does on SystemV-based systems, and others I've tried. And "rm -i *" prompts even with "-f". > If you wanted to stick with the "-i" approach, then "cd .. ; rm -r -i dir" > would be the best bet (assuming your rm had a -r option to recurse). AFAIK, all rm's have -r. -- Pete Peter Turnbull Dept. of Computer Science University of York

28 years

2
1
0 0

IBM service rig?

by nerdware＠laidbak.com

Hi guys. I just picked up an IBM type 9075 laptop. The label on the inside (where the keyboard is) says it's an Aptek Personal Service Communicator II. It's got a 9.5" monochrome screen, a built-in thermal printer, what appears to be a modem jack, a screw-on (not BNC) rf-type jack, a socket for a pcmcia-type RAM card, and what appears to be a breakout box connector on the back. No floppy. Is this a field service terminal? If not, just what the heck is it? Thanks. Paul Braun NerdWare -- The History of the PC and the Nerds who brought it to you. nerdware(a)laidbak.com www.laidbak.com/nerdware

28 years

1
0
0 0

Files as files

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

OK, I never got this "object" stuff, it's kinda confusing because it tends to make much ado about nothing (in poor implementations, yes, but I've only seen poor ones, the Newton being very hard to understand in terms of how to use). As for VMS file attribs does anyone know how many there actually were? I counted the attribs Norton DiskEdit lets me change on the Mac (bundle, locked, bozo, init, etc.), and there are at least 30. >> DOS in terms of having an array of blocks and stuff. Except Apple's >> is quite a bit more elegant. Since some people here are fond of >> praising the VAX, how does its file system work (typically)? > >The Newton "soup" is an object store rather than a directory hierarchy, >and you'll probably see that paradigm more often in the future. I think >Microsoft's "Cairo" road-map included turning the filesystem into an >object store. > >"VAX" is a hardware architecture. Lots of people run Unix on VAXen. >But the VAX-philopsophy was extreme CISC, and that extended to the VAX/VMS >filesystem as well: record-based, with a zillion different file >attributes, built-in file versioning, etc. It was hierarchial, but mixed >with a clunky "volume" concept (something like DOS "C:", but with longer >names). > >-- Doug > > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

28 years

2
1
0 0

WeirdStuff PCjr

by dcoward＠pressstart.com

>Hardly. There were plenty of those made too. I've got at least 5 now, >and I just added one today from the WeirdStuff sealed bid auction (I >couldn't resist, it came with some cool carthridges including Imagic's >Demon Attack [who knew Imagic made carts for the PCjr!?] and an >internal PCjr modem). >Sam Alternate e-mail: dastar(a)siconic.com I'm glad you mentioned that. One of the pallets I got had a PCjr power supply on it. Did yours come with one? [who knew Imagic made carts for the PCjr!?] That's still not as cool as my two cartridge set of Lotus 123 for the PCjr. ========================================= Doug Coward dcoward(a)pressstart.com Senior Software Engineer Press Start Inc. Sunnyvale,CA Curator Museum of Personal Computing Machinery http://www.best.com/~dcoward/museum =========================================

28 years

1
0
0 0

Final Xerox Star demo

by yowza＠yowza.com

>Xerox PARC is giving one final demonstration of the original Xerox Star >workstation built in 1981. This may be the last time it gets >demoed, as the hardware has begun failing due to its age. Don't miss >this opportunity to witness one of the most important steps ever taken in the >history of computing and user interface design. > > Final Demo of the Xerox Star Workstation > 5:30 to 7:00pm > Wednesday June 17th > Auditorium Xerox PARC > > > Unquestionably, one of the major design innovations of this century >has been the Graphical User Interface, with its desktop, icons, pop-up >and pull-down menus and ubiquitous windows. The explosion of computer usage >in the last decade has in large part been made possible through this simpler >and more direct method of user interaction. > > Though millions of people around the world are now using GUIs, few >outside of the Human/Computer Interaction field or the Silicon Valley >are aware of the history of the its design prior to the introduction >of the Macintosh in 1984. > > The first GUI ever developed was the work of Dr. Douglas Englebart, >a researcher at SRI (the Stanford Research Institute in Menlo Park, CA) in the >mid-1960s. His visionary and pioneering design and prototypes succeeded in >producing the world's first screen-based windows, cursor-selectable pop-up >menus, as well as the mouse with which to interact with them. > > Though these innovations were truly revolutionary, it was not until >a decade later when researchers at the Xerox Palo Alto Research Center (PARC) >began systematically studying this system in a commericial development effort. >The Xerox Alto personal computer workstation was developed in the late 70's >and included a mouse pointing system. This system influenced later systems >such as Bravo, which was developed at Xerox PARC by Bruce Lampson and included >an integrated editor formatter. Later systems included Markup, Draw, and Star. > > Xerox Palo Alto Research Center (PARC) has been a cradle of Silicon >Valley innovation for 25 years. Its research spans domains from atoms >to anthropology, from its solid-state physics lab, which develops new >laser diodes for use in printers and copiers, to the group that studies >work practices and their possible impact on current and future products. > > Located in the Stanford University Industrial Park in the heart of >Silicon Valley, PARC was charged upon its founding in 1970 to the >"architect of the information age". Since then it has delivered into >use such significant pieces of the current information infrastructure >as laser printers, graphical user interfaces, object-oriented >programming languages, and Ethernet local area networks. PARC has >contributed to user interfaces, electronic components, embedded >software and architectures for each new line of Xerox copiers, >printers, and systems reprographics products. > > > > Directions to Xerox PARC > >>From Highway 101, take the Oregon Expressway exit west 2 miles to >El Camino Real. Oregon Expressway becomes Page Mill Road at El Camino. Follow >Page Mill Road 1.7 miles to Coyote Hill Road (no light) and turn left. Coyote >Hill Road is just past the intersection with >Foothill Expressway. Go one-half mile and PARC will be on your left. >Follow the signs to the auditorium. > >>From Interstate 280, take the Page Mill Road exit. Go east one mile >to Coyote Hill Road (no light) and turn right. Go one-half mile and >PARC will be on your left. Follow the signs to the auditorium.

28 years

5
6
0 0

Files as files

by allisonp＠world.std.com

<is quite a bit more elegant. Since some people here are fond of <praising the VAX, how does its file system work (typically)? Vax is hardware. VMS is an OS. Unix also run on vax. VMS is a fairly conventional albeit complex file system that can do sequential, indexed or random accesses. It deals with files, directories and volumes. <>contiguity). This made file access *fast* when you needed it. I still <>find fragmentation a nightmare even on Linux. Some file systems do more poorly than others with fragmentation. For the best fragmentation is a mild performance hit, in that it will take more disk seeks to find all the peices. For others (RT-11, NS*DOS) you can have an almost empty disk that is effectively full as the OS cannot allocate space peicemeal. VMS, DOS and CP/M perform well with fragmented files. Allison

28 years

1
0
0 0

Mac Portable Power Supply

by higginbo＠netpath.net

On the bottom of the Mac Portable I have sitting right here, it says 7.5v 2.0a. The injection molded plastic never lies... or does it? This is a model 5120, non-backlit. Maybe the backlit version took 1.5a? At 05:45 PM 6/11/98 PDT, Max Eskin wrote: >Again, the original was 1.5a, which was not enough to power the >machine w/a dead battery. 2.0a came w/ the first powerbook, and works >fine. >(didn't I find this out on this list over a year ago?) - - john higginbotham ____________________________ - webmaster www.pntprinting.com - - limbo limbo.netpath.net -

28 years

1
0
0 0

Early Mac Clones

by tomowad＠earthlink.net

>Powder Blue Computers >Akkord Technologies each used Mac 128k ROMs >Colby: >WalkMac SE -- $3999 >WalkMac SE 30 -- $6699 > >Dynamic: (around for a few years) >Dynamac Plus $4995 >Dynamac SE 30 - $7954 > >Outbound Anybody have any of these? Any experience with them. I would love some further information. >The bit on Outbound shocked me, it seems they were actually working with >Apple. To quote the 2nd edition: "While Outbound continues to floursh-thanks to a wisely-forged legal agreement and clever positioning of their Macintosh portable versus the Apple PowerBooks-I question their long-term staying power." Tom Owad

28 years

4
3
0 0

Clueless Museums (was: Final Xerox Star demo)

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

>Having creative thoughts is not something (IMHO) that can be taught. Some >people just suddenly think 'Wouldn't it be neat if...' or 'We can do it >like this...'. Of course having a good understanding of the subject, and >know what's been done before help a lot here. And that's were classic >computers come in (to bring this back on topic!) I thought this was on topic anyway... >> <faultfinding/repair can be done by almost anybody. Well, having done >> <both, I personally find them equally difficult. Perhaps that means I'm >> <no good at it, but... >> >> Troubleshooting is a very complex process that I've never been able to >> teach to anyone but those that naturally could. For me troubleshooting > >The point is, in the UK at least, designers tend to get much better pay, >and are more highly regarded than repairmen. This I think is wrong, but this >list is not the place for that rant. In general, I've found that things like TVs are almost never repaired, at least in the US. Back in the USSR, we repaired everything, including alarm clocks destroyed by trashy batteries that leaked. >I'm not good at troubleshooting, and I could never (for example) repair >TV sets for money. But I've never yet let a fault beat me. It may take me >weeks to solve it, but I'll spend those weeks to sort out a machine. Do you mean you've never left a problem unsolved or never left a machine broken? >> But working with field circus underscored that thinking is not something >> you can mandate. Isn't there some kind of qualification these guys have to pass? Still, I can imagine a 20-year old pizza-eating moron who takes a job like this just to tell his girlfriend, "Hey! I'm a COMPUTER SERVICE TECHNICIAN!"... > >-tony > > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

28 years

8
8
0 0

Mac Portable Power Supply

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

Again, the original was 1.5a, which was not enough to power the machine w/a dead battery. 2.0a came w/ the first powerbook, and works fine. (didn't I find this out on this list over a year ago?) > >At 04:25 PM 6/11/98 -0700, Uncle Roger wrote: >>At 12:42 PM 6/11/98 PDT, you wrote: >>>I was wondering if anyone had a Mac Portable power supply, and wanted to >>>sell it cheap. >> >>Just get a (iirc) 7.5v PS with appropriate connector/polarity. > >- >- john higginbotham ____________________________ >- webmaster www.pntprinting.com - >- limbo limbo.netpath.net - > > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

28 years

1
0
0 0

Mac Portable Power Supply

by higginbo＠netpath.net

Gotta be 2.0a though, at least that's what it says on the bottom of the unit. At 04:25 PM 6/11/98 -0700, Uncle Roger wrote: >At 12:42 PM 6/11/98 PDT, you wrote: >>I was wondering if anyone had a Mac Portable power supply, and wanted to >>sell it cheap. > >Just get a (iirc) 7.5v PS with appropriate connector/polarity. - - john higginbotham ____________________________ - webmaster www.pntprinting.com - - limbo limbo.netpath.net -

28 years

1
0
0 0

New Finds this week

by jrkeys＠concentric.net

>Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 19:10:55 -0500 >To: clasic >From: "John R. Keys Jr." <jrkeys(a)concentric.net> >Subject: New Finds this week > >Well it's been slow since I got back from vacation but I found a couple good items: >1) Freeze Frame cartridge for the C64, has four dip switches 1&2 work the freeze frame and 3&4 are printer configuration for 4 different printers. Neat never seen or heard of this unit before. cost 10 cent at thrift. >2) Manual set for the LA50 printer all of them for 50 cent. >3) ICmemories manual from 1980 covering HITACHI #HLN100 25 cent >4) Freedom ONE terminal manual 25 cent >5) ACER710 user's guide 1987 25 cent >6) DisplayStation 88kp6 for $35 >7) Socrates program manual 11 cent >8) Commodore model 1541-II/1571-II/1581 power supply free >9) TRS80 Deluxe RS-232 program pak cat. 26-2226 with cable free >10) HP 2382A kb 1.00 >11) Tecmar tape unit for early Mac's only has two 9pin serial ports in back 1.00 not tested yet still had a cartridge in it. >12) and best for last a 'Starlet' Nec Portable computer model PC-8401A-LS that works off of 4 c batteries. No power came with it, cost $10. It has CP/M 2.2 in ROM from DRI 1982; Bios date is ver 1.0 1984; has a built in modem 300/1200; software in rom is WS, CALC, TELCOM, and FILER. This baby powers up very fast and seems work very well. I even put in some PIP commands. >Well that's it for now hope to have busy weekend lots of auction going on. Keep Computing John

28 years

1
0
0 0

CP/M software (was: Former Disk Costs)

by allisonp＠world.std.com

<> It should be different as Knuth's was written in C and tex is asm or pl < ^^^^^^^^^^^^ <Since when? The source code for TeX that I have here, and the version <that's printed in Volume B of 'Computers and Typesetting' is written in <Web Working versions (or pascal). I've never seen a web compiler. <> code. No credit given and. It's a simpler version circa 1978 and the <> putput formats are oriented toward character printers. < <Can it handle the standard TeX tests (even old versions of them)? If not, <it's not TeX, by definition. Likely not, never tried it's stripped some. It was also used to push the idea of device independent page descritpions that were capable of text and graphics. One product that came from that was RETOS (ReGIS to Sixel) translator. I later modified fancyfont as part of runoff to give font capable runoff with bitmap output. It could really give a disk a workout. Allison

28 years

4
5
0 0

Final Xerox Star demo

by sinasohn＠ricochet.net

At 01:04 PM 6/11/98 -0700, you wrote: >> >> Final Demo of the Xerox Star Workstation >> >> 5:30 to 7:00pm I'm really hoping to be there, but I still have to figure out how to get >from Walnut Creek at 5pm to Palto Alo at 5:30... >Francisco Bay Area or some subset thereof) get together on the second >Wednesday of each month for dinner, yakking, bragging about our latest >k00l f1nd5, waving our appendages at each other and so forth. Sounds Ooh, I *love* waving my appendages, especially my phelanges! Only, Wednesdays, esp. the second wed are not good... Make it the second Thursday and you've got a deal. 8^) --------------------------------------------------------------------- O- Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad roger(a)sinasohn.com that none but madmen know." Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates San Francisco, California http://www.sinasohn.com/

28 years

1
0
0 0

Mac Portable Power Supply

by sinasohn＠ricochet.net

At 12:42 PM 6/11/98 PDT, you wrote: >I was wondering if anyone had a Mac Portable power supply, and wanted to >sell it cheap. Just get a (iirc) 7.5v PS with appropriate connector/polarity. --------------------------------------------------------------------- O- Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad roger(a)sinasohn.com that none but madmen know." Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates San Francisco, California http://www.sinasohn.com/

28 years

1
0
0 0

IBM 700 Laptop Significance?

by sinasohn＠ricochet.net

At 08:13 PM 6/10/98 -0500, you wrote: >It's not even classic yet: > >GRID INTROS FIRST MS-DOS LAPTOP WITH BUILT-IN POINTER >BOSTON, MASSACHUSETTS, U.S.A., 1990 >AUG 16 (NB) > -- Grid Systems Corporation has introduced the GridCase 1550sx, the first >PC-compatible lapto... Well, that just means it won't be priced outragiouslt on ebay. 8^) Definitely significant, though. >a mouse. I hate mice, and hate track-balls and other stationary pointers >only slightly less, but I *love* IBM's eraser head. Some people see this I agree in theory, but disagree with your conclusion. (Can't stand the eraser.) >A mouse requires you to remove your hands from the keyboard and switch [...] >if I have to move a stupid pointer across the screen, the eraser head >let's me keep most of my fingers on keys where they belong. Yes, but so does a trackball or trackpad centered below the keyboard (which is one of the main reasons I bought my current laptop.) Best of all, IMO is the tootsie-roll from the Outbound. Mostly, however, I stick to keyboard commands (my one complaint about the MacOS -- you can't pull down menus and such from the keyboard). I strongly feel that anything you want to do should be doable from the keyboard -- if you're willing to remember how. (Example: in MS Word, there is a keyboard command to set bold/underline/etc. If I used Word a lot, and used bold/underline/etc a lot, I would remember it. Instead, for the few times I do that, I don't mind using the mouse. On the other hand, I can do just about anything in Eudora without using a mouse-thingie.) I do use a trackball -- a Logitech Trackman Marble. It's comfortable, accurate, and simply works great. The advantage of a trackball/other over a mouse is that on a mouse, when you click, you are also moving (however slight) the moving part. With a trackball, you can take your thumb completely off the ball before clicking. And I'll shut up now lest I get flames for mumbling off-topic too much. --------------------------------------------------------------------- O- Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad roger(a)sinasohn.com that none but madmen know." Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates San Francisco, California http://www.sinasohn.com/

28 years

1
0
0 0

Dash 030 (was: Early Mac Clones)

by sinasohn＠ricochet.net

At 12:57 AM 6/11/98 +0000, you wrote: >> nice servers for their time, with great cases. > >As for the rest.. smile when you say it, some of us still run IIx's and >IIfx's. :-) Sorry, what I meant was, at the time they came out, they were top-of-the-line. Today, with the advances since, they are simply great servers. (And, when I get the time to set it up, I fully intend to put one to use as a server for the Macs in Rachel's classroom.) >Seriously, though, there is an article on one of the MacTimes sites >which argues for using an older system as a server. Basically, it Also, if all you're doing is internet stuff, an older IIci or basic '486 is just fine. But that sort of thing that got a lot of us on this list in the first place. --------------------------------------------------------------------- O- Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad roger(a)sinasohn.com that none but madmen know." Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates San Francisco, California http://www.sinasohn.com/

28 years

1
0
0 0

Bit slices?

by red＠bears.org

Hej allesammen; What's a 'bit slice'? Are they served with a twist of lemon? I suppose a better way of asking that is how is a 'bit sliced' processor or ALU differentiated from a 'normal' one? ok r.

28 years

3
2
0 0

Clueless Museums (was: Final Xerox Star demo)

by higginbo＠netpath.net

At 10:26 PM 6/10/98 -0400, William Donzelli wrote: >> Packard Bell: Today's headache, tomorrow's obscure collectible. Hey, you >> never know: People might start collecting only the badly designed systems. >> It could happen. > >OK, enough Packard-Bell bashing. Send me every PB model 250 you can get >your hands on - I will even pay shipping (and for the crate). Heh heh. I thought that comment would flush out a PB person or two. :) They have actually gotten alot better, but I don't think you'll ever see any in the Smithsonian like some classic systems. - - john higginbotham ____________________________ - webmaster www.pntprinting.com - - limbo limbo.netpath.net -

28 years

4
3
0 0

Early Mac Clones

by desieh＠southcom.com.au

Mac XTs where the first as far as I know Mac clones............. bascailly a Mac in a IBM 5150 case......... Desie -----Original Message----- From: nerdware(a)laidbak.com <nerdware(a)laidbak.com> To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> Date: Monday, June 08, 1998 1:47 Subject: Re: Early Mac Clones Date sent: Sun, 07 Jun 1998 13:46:25 -0400 Send reply to: classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu From: Ward Donald Griffiths III <gram(a)cnct.com> To: "Discussion re-collecting of classic computers" <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> Subject: Re: Early Mac Clones > Zane H. Healy wrote: > > > I think that's the same book I've got a copy of around here. Interesting > > reading, but I've basically never seen any of that stuff anywhere. Though > > I found it really interesting, has anyone ever seen a Mac Plus or simular > > system recased into a PC case? It would be a fun project, but I've got to > > many other projects :^) > > > > The closest I've got to a Mac clone (I'm writting this on a PowerMac > > 8500/180) is a Amiga 3000 with emulation software. The Amiga is actually > > about as fast as the real thing. > > I had a coworker in the late 80s who had his Mac and his Amiga 2000 > recased and rack-mounted, sharing a rack with a lot of _serious_ > video editing gear. > -- IIRC, NewTek (makers of the Video Toaster) decided that since they were having some trouble getting the Toaster accepted in the mainstream because most people thought the Amiga was only a toy, they created an interface card for a Mac that would allow the Mac user to run the Toaster-equipped A2000 (private-labeled for NewTek) from his Mac, thereby making it 'legit'. I had to laugh at the thought of paying a grand or more just to see the Amiga Workbench come up on a Mac screen instead of the "toy" Amiga screen. Of course, this 'toy' made multimedia possible before Uncle Bill said it was ok to use it.....too many people forget that. Not you guys, though. (I hope.) One of my other favorite Amiga stories was something I swear I read in AmigaWorld or Byte -- right after the A1000 came out, Gates had a press conference to talk about Windows. Some reporter asked him about multitasking, and Gates replied that multitasking really wasn't possible in anything under 8 megs of ram. To which the same reporter replied, "But doesn't your own Amiga Basic multitask nicely on a 512k Amiga?" A question which Gates promptly ignored and moved on......... Paul Braun NerdWare -- The History of the PC and the Nerds who brought it to you. nerdware(a)laidbak.com www.laidbak.com/nerdware

28 years

3
4
0 0

Files as files

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

In general, file systems seem to fit into several simple categories. Let's say UNIX-like, DOS-like, simple (just data), and that's about it I've looked at Apple manuals, and the Apple ][ format is kinda like DOS in terms of having an array of blocks and stuff. Except Apple's is quite a bit more elegant. Since some people here are fond of praising the VAX, how does its file system work (typically)? > >That used to be one of my interview questions for Unix programmers: your >buggy program just created a filename with {control characters, leading >dash (-), leading slash (/), '*', etc} in it. How do you delete it? > >Does anybody collect file systems? That would be semi-useful for somebody >doing data recovery. I have no idea what the Newton "soup", for example, >looks like. One of my favorites was the Regulus (unix-like) filesystem. >It maintained a bitmap of free blocks and could easily allocate a best-fit >contiguous region for your file (I think they had an option to creat() for >contiguity). This made file access *fast* when you needed it. I still >find fragmentation a nightmare even on Linux. > >-- Doug > > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

28 years

3
2
0 0

Mac Portable Power Supply

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

IF you mean the AC adaptor, you can use later ones (powerbook). This is actually beneficial because later ones are strong enough to power the machine alone, while the Mac Portable one needed the battery to be inside and working. I powered my mac portable for a few months w/two adaptors. The I put the battery in. Happily, it recharged fully from that high current (it was dead otherwise; I got the portable because it wouldn't start up because of the battery. I got it to run by hooking the battery up to mains AC long enough to "recharge" it). >I was wondering if anyone had a Mac Portable power supply, and wanted to >sell it cheap. > Thanks :), > Mike Sheflin > >______________________________________________________ >Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

28 years

1
0
0 0

Files as files

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

How do UNIX files work? Is there a header of some sort? BTW, I think it's an incredible pain that the Mac has no built in way to change file types. If they get lost, I have to used DiskEdit or some such thing to restore them. > >Even the Mac or its apps seemed to be confused about the nature of >what should be in the resource fork - some apps stored all their >data there, using it as a sort of mini-database of tagged chunks >of data. If there's anything classic about today's computers, >it's the nearly universal recognition that a file's a file. >Departures from this are interesting but rare. > >The other non-file info such as the filename itself, the date stamp, >attributes, etc. are treated in an incidental fashion. The Amiga >file system, for example, had a "file comment" of about 80 characters >of extra text to describe the file that wasn't always preserved. >This may have been inherited from Tripos. > >And then there's the way something like the effects of Radix-50 >(packing three chars into two bytes) has percolated through the >years as three-character filename extensions from RT-11 (or >earlier?) to CP/M to DOS and Windows, which are overused and >abused in many ways. > >One of my latest three-great-ideas-before-breakfast ideas is >to write a program for Windows that sniffs and identifies files >in the manner of Unix's "file". That's the problem with files as >files: you can easily lose track of what's in them, especially >if you lose that three-char extension, or it gets wrapped in >an archive format or attachment, etc. > >- John >Jefferson Computer Museum <http://www.threedee.com/jcm> > > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

28 years

7
7
0 0

Clueless Museums (was: Final Xerox Star demo)

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

Before we go any further, which Packard Bells are we talking about? I don't know the old ones (I rescued a 286 PB still in the box from a compactor about a year ago and hid it where I thought it would be safe; I doubt they will ever get that ceramic off the dumpster's ram), but the new ones are ugly and had that stupid navigator thing that looked like screenshots from Myst (do they still?). But, how bad can a design get (am I asking for it?)? >You mean there's a difference? :) > >Packard Bell: Today's headache, tomorrow's obscure collectible. Hey, you >never know: People might start collecting only the badly designed systems. >It could happen. > > >- >- john higginbotham ____________________________ >- webmaster www.pntprinting.com - >- limbo limbo.netpath.net - > > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

28 years

1
0
0 0

Mac Portable Power Supply

by icyblackhand＠hotmail.com

I was wondering if anyone had a Mac Portable power supply, and wanted to sell it cheap. Thanks :), Mike Sheflin ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

28 years

1
0
0 0

Bit slices?

by mcquiggi＠sfu.ca

Bit slice processors are designed so that they can be ganged together with suitable interconnection, making an 8 bit ALU out of 2 - 4 bit units, etc. Generally good for accumulators etc with more complex instruction decoding outboard. My 2 cents... Kevin At 02:39 PM 11/06/98 -0400, you wrote: > >Hej allesammen; > >What's a 'bit slice'? Are they served with a twist of lemon? > >I suppose a better way of asking that is how is a 'bit sliced' processor >or ALU differentiated from a 'normal' one? > >ok >r. > > >

28 years

1
0
0 0

Files as files

by pete＠dunnington.u-net.com

On Jun 11, 3:36, Doug Yowza wrote: > That used to be one of my interview questions for Unix programmers: your > buggy program just created a filename with {control characters, leading > dash (-), leading slash (/), '*', etc} in it. How do you delete it? Quickest general method is "rm -i *", though you may sometimes need "rm -i .*" instead/as well. -- Pete Peter Turnbull Dept. of Computer Science University of York

28 years

2
1
0 0

Attn: Ward Griffiths

by jeff.kaneko＠ifrsys.com

Guys: I would address this to Ward directly, rather than to the list, but our jerked-around mail system now removes the original senders address. My apologies. Ward: Please e-mail me at: jeff.kaneko(a)ifrsys.com There's something I'd like to discuss with you. Thanks! Jeff We now return you to our regularly scheduled programme . . . .

28 years

1
0
0 0

Microsoft's Computer Museum

by sinasohn＠ricochet.net

At 12:47 AM 6/11/98 +0100, you wrote: >That makes me wonder if they're going to attempt to rewrite history >_again_... After all the Altair (it was the Altair, wasn't it) was hardly Well, possibly, but the optimist in me says that maybe, just maybe, they'll do it right, what with all that money they have laying around.... (Pardon me, while I go kill said optimist. Feel free to continue laughing...) --------------------------------------------------------------------- O- Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad roger(a)sinasohn.com that none but madmen know." Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates San Francisco, California http://www.sinasohn.com/

28 years

1
0
0 0

Early Mac Clones

by sinasohn＠ricochet.net

At 11:18 PM 6/10/98 +0000, you wrote: >> >Dash '030 from (iirc) 68000 systems. It's an actual Mac II-type > >Apparently very popular (at one time, at least) with prepress houses. Yes; one of mine came from a company called Landor Associates that was responsible for recent Olympic Logos, Radio Shack's latest logo, Most (if not all) of McDonald's packaging and branding, and a lot of Microsoft's packaging/branding. Great company, and good at what they do. (In addition to the Dash, they had an outbound running around, but I don't know what happened to it.) --------------------------------------------------------------------- O- Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad roger(a)sinasohn.com that none but madmen know." Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates San Francisco, California http://www.sinasohn.com/

28 years

1
0
0 0

Early Mac Clones

by sinasohn＠ricochet.net

At 02:48 PM 6/10/98 PDT, you wrote: >Is this device better than a mouse, in your opinion? Is it an ADB >device? Is it better than a mouse? Is Ben & Jerry's Phish Food better than a rotten banana? Is a Jaguar XK8 better than totalled Ford Aspire? Yes, it's better. Unfortunately, it's an integral part of the Outbound case, and therefore not applicable to any other computer. The outbound, if you're unfamiliar with it, is a Mac Clone laptop. There are two models; mine sports a 68030, and uses a standard 2.5" IDE laptop hard drive. Great machine. (If my screen wasn't ferschimmled I'd be using it all the time.) --------------------------------------------------------------------- O- Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad roger(a)sinasohn.com that none but madmen know." Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates San Francisco, California http://www.sinasohn.com/

28 years

1
0
0 0

FA: Various systems

by sinasohn＠ricochet.net

At 02:48 PM 6/10/98 -0500, you wrote: >Actually, the ad was for auctions at Haggle Online, http://www.haggle.com. (nudge, nudge, wink, wink, say no more, say no more...) 8^) For them not familiar with it, Haggle is kinda like ebay, though less crowded. More importantly, it is also building an online museum of classic computers. This is probably due to our own Doug Salot somehow being involved in the whole mess... --------------------------------------------------------------------- O- Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad roger(a)sinasohn.com that none but madmen know." Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates San Francisco, California http://www.sinasohn.com/

28 years

1
0
0 0

FA: Various systems

by sinasohn＠ricochet.net

At 01:37 PM 6/10/98 EDT, you wrote: >This is NOT a flame, but i'm just wondering the point of posting items that >have been put up for sale on ebay, et al. all that means is every item will The point is that you thereby inform a whole passel of people that the items are for sale, including many who might not otherwise know. Gets the seller potentially higher prices. And, someone here might find out about something they really want. On the other hand, it may annoy some folks here. btw, it seems to me that prices on Haggle are not quite as wild as on ebay. (Though I do check ebay regularly too.) >is announced as being for sale, the subscribers to this group should get >first crack. Well, tyhat would be nice, but the collective "we" can't force anyone to do anything. This has come up before, and the consensus seems to be that it's a tough decision whether to offer things here (and be a hero) or on ebay (and get rich.) --------------------------------------------------------------------- O- Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad roger(a)sinasohn.com that none but madmen know." Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates San Francisco, California http://www.sinasohn.com/

28 years

1
0
0 0

Cross listing Ebay items

by jfoust＠threedee.com

At 08:26 PM 6/10/98 -0500, you wrote: > >Or the $1500 Lisa 2? That one went from $300 to $1500 in one bid, but it >only takes one sucker, err, collector. The auction sites are just like any other web site: you don't know what's really happening, such as if the transaction actually takes place at that price. Certainly the auction sites do not list their failure and debt-collection rates. I think the auction offers and supposed final bids are interesting to hear - they're at least as interesting as the brag-of-the-week >from those lucky Silicon Valley and Redmond thrift-store cruisers who appear to be filling a U-Haul for $50 every weekend. On Wed, 10 Jun 1998, Ward Donald Griffiths III wrote: > Hell, I'd rather fix rams with my teeth the way the old Basque herders > used to than a Packard-Bell computer. At least us sheep ranchers understand your jokes. - John

28 years

1
0
0 0

Early Mac Clones

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

But there's a difference between a Z-80 running a text-mode interface, and an 8088 running a GUI. Also, remember that Bill Gates didn't know very much about operating systems, as opposed to languages. MS Windows is the only OS MS programmed ground up, something they only started after the A1000. And, I've never seen Windows multitask under 8MB in the way the Amiga or a UNIXoid computer can. >> and Gates replied that multitasking really wasn't possible in >> anything under 8 megs of ram. To which the same reporter replied, >>"But >> doesn't >> your own Amiga Basic multitask nicely on a 512k Amiga?" >> >> A question which Gates promptly ignored and moved on......... > >Especially since the TRS-80 Model 16, with the Xenix OS partly done >by Microsoft, multitasked (and multiusered) quite nicely even with >only 256K of RAM. Not to mention the Color Computer running OS-9 in >64K. >-- >Ward Griffiths >They say that politics makes strange bedfellows. >Of course, the main reason they cuddle up is to screw somebody else. > Michael Flynn, _Rogue Star_ > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

28 years

3
2
0 0

Clueless Museums (was: Final Xerox Star demo)

by higginbo＠netpath.net

At 10:13 PM 6/10/98 -0400, Ward Donald Griffiths III wrote: >Hell, I'd rather fix rams with my teeth the way the old Basque herders >used to than a Packard-Bell computer. You mean there's a difference? :) Packard Bell: Today's headache, tomorrow's obscure collectible. Hey, you never know: People might start collecting only the badly designed systems. It could happen. - - john higginbotham ____________________________ - webmaster www.pntprinting.com - - limbo limbo.netpath.net -

28 years

6
6
0 0

Files as files

by pete＠dunnington.u-net.com

On Jun 11, 4:20, Ward Donald Griffiths III wrote: > Unix started with a 14-char filename limit (and allowed [still does] > characters in filenames tricky to get at from the shell). I still have two disks with filenames which include DEL and NUL characters. > I always figured if you couldn't describe > what a file was for in 14 characters, you should be in a different > profession. The current fashion for doing things like including > things like extended version numbers in filenames does not change my > opinion. Nor mine :-) -- Pete Peter Turnbull Dept. of Computer Science University of York

28 years

1
0
0 0

Digital DF02 modem

by dastar＠wco.com

Ok you DEC-heads. What baud rate does the Digital DF02 modem jog along at? Sam Alternate e-mail: dastar(a)siconic.com ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Ever onward. September 26 & 27...Vintage Computer Festival 2 See http://www.siconic.com/vcf for details! [Last web page update: 06/07/98]

28 years

3
2
0 0

IBM PC DOS 5.02 (OT)

by photze＠batelco.com.bh

Hi. I just got a shwrink wrapped copy of this, and wanted to know if anyone wanted it before I used it... I'll either sell it or trade it for PC/Apple ][ stuff. Ciao, Tim D. Hotze

28 years

1
0
0 0

Dash 030 (was: Early Mac Clones)

by sinasohn＠ricochet.net

At 07:14 AM 6/10/98 -0700, you wrote: >Does "Mac II-type motherboard" mean its a genuine Apple motherboard, or >do you just mean its similiar to the Mac II motherboards? Sorry... By "Mac II-type" I meant that size mb. Both that I have use real Apple motherboards. One is (iirc) a Mac IIx, the other is a IIfx. Very nice servers for their time, with great cases. --------------------------------------------------------------------- O- Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad roger(a)sinasohn.com that none but madmen know." Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates San Francisco, California http://www.sinasohn.com/

28 years

3
2
0 0

Files as files

by pete＠dunnington.u-net.com

On Jun 10, 11:10, Allison J Parent wrote: > <word. I do not know if ODS-1 (RSX FILES-11) or the RSTS filesystems > <precede RT-11, but if I had to guess, I would say yes. IIRC, both use > <9.3. > > Did you mean 8.3? RT-11, RSTS and RSX-11 were 8.3 as was early VMS and > unice. RT-11 has always been 6.3, RSX-11 is 9.3 IIRC, and UNIX doesn't have any fixed format - though early versions had a fairly small limit on name length (12 chars?). All versions of UNIX allow as many dots as you can fit in the length. -- Pete Peter Turnbull Dept. of Computer Science University of York

28 years

4
3
0 0

FS: Apple Lisa Vintage Computer! Very rare! (fwd)

by dastar＠wco.com

@Get this for humor. The funny thing is, he'll probably get this price for it! Sam Alternate e-mail: dastar(a)siconic.com ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Ever onward. September 26 & 27...Vintage Computer Festival 2 See http://www.siconic.com/vcf for details! [Last web page update: 06/07/98] ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Shadow303(a)my-dejanews.com Newsgroups: comp.sys.apple2.marketplace Subject: FS: Apple Lisa Vintage Computer! Very rare! Date: Mon, 08 Jun 1998 14:39:20 GMT Apple Lisa computer for sale! Looks a bit used but in excellent condition! Has tons of extra software! I want 2,000 dollars or best offer. E mail me. Cliff -- Sam Alternate e-mail: dastar(a)siconic.com ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Ever onward. September 26 & 27...Vintage Computer Festival 2 See http://www.siconic.com/vcf for details! [Last web page update: 06/07/98]

28 years

1
0
0 0

Microsoft Re-Liscencing?

by photze＠batelco.com.bh

Hi. Just heard about this, so I dunno really what I'm talking about... Appearantly, this company is (was) selling liscences for DOS 3.3. I'm guessing that this is from a deal with MS. Has anyone ever seen this? Is it available with another product, such as early Windows releases? Ciao, Tim D. Hotze

28 years

3
2
0 0

Basic PDP-11ish questions

by healyzh＠ix.netcom.com

OK, to aviod confusion the first system in question is a SMS-1000, with a PDP-11/73 board, 2MW RAM, RL02 Controller (DL), TK50 Controller (MU), Dilog DQ606 Floppy Controller (DY). The SMS-1000 has an internal Floppy and HD, which it thinks are a RD51 (DU) and RX50 (DU). The boot ROMs support DU (DSA, the HD and Floppy), MU (TK50), and MS (TS). I'm able to boot off of RL02 by entering in the bootstrap from ODT. I've got RSX-11M and XXDP RL02 packs, and can boot from either. I've managed to make a bootable XXDP floppy diskette. I can boot the machine directly off of the XXDP floppy on power up. I can boot the XXDP floppy >from the XXDP RL02 pack, and then boot the XXDP RL02 pack from floppy. However, if I power up and boot from floppy, I can not boot the XXDP RL02 pack. Is this because the Boot ROMs don't support RL02's? Does anyone have any instructions for a Dilog DQ606 controller? I gather that it can be configured to act as several different floppy drives. The drives that came with it are labeled as being a RX-50 and a RX-33, yet RSX-11M sees both as RX-02's. I'd like to get these changed back to RX-50 and RX-33. What does the device name 'MS', device type 'TS' stand for? My guess is a 9-Track tape drive. I've also got a PDP-11/44 that I'm slowly working on restoring. It's in two racks, one has a pair of RL02's which have been cleaned up. The other has the CPU, 2 RX-02's, 2 TU-58's, and a battery backup. In looking at the CPU, it looks as if it has a LED for the battery backup. Does that battery need to be in the system? I would just as soon remove them and not have anything to do with them since they are old lead-acid batteries, and I'm not very fond of such things (spent 3 1/2 years of my time in the Navy working on UPS's). Is there any reason that I can't just plug the whole thing into a power source outside of the rack. I'm asking since for all I know the battery and powersuppy in the bottom of the rack are some kind of power conditioning circuit. Also does anyone have any recommendations on how to go about testing out the power supplies on the 11/44? I'd just as soon not blow anything up. I have powered up the RL02's, but that is all so far. I'm waiting to test the power supplies before I get the remaining boards that I need for the system. Thanks, Zane | Zane H. Healy | UNIX Systems Adminstrator | | healyzh(a)ix.netcom.com (primary) | Linux Enthusiast | | healyzh(a)holonet.net (alternate) | Classic Computer Collector | +----------------------------------+----------------------------+ | For Empire of the Petal Throne and Traveller Role Playing, | | see http://www.dragonfire.net/~healyzh/ | | For the collecting of Classic Computers with info on them. | | see http://www.dragonfire.net/~healyzh/museum.html |

28 years

3
5
0 0

Early Mac Clones

by jeff.kaneko＠ifrsys.com

Hey, not to mention those guys that unpackage their CoCo III's and put them into PeeCee cabinets to add SCSI, more disk drives, extra memory, etc. etc. etc. Jeff At 05:45 PM 6/8/98 -0500, you wrote: >>bit hard getting a mac into a pc case though, remember that macs have all >>the connectors on board, >> >>desie > > >Can't be any worse than the people that put Atari's or Amiga's in a PC >case. I've seen a Atari TT030 in a PC Tower, and it's quite popular among >Amiga people to tower their A1200's. All it takes is some creative cabling. > > Zane >| Zane H. Healy | UNIX Systems Adminstrator | >| healyzh(a)ix.netcom.com (primary) | Linux Enthusiast | >| healyzh(a)holonet.net (alternate) | Classic Computer Collector | >+----------------------------------+----------------------------+ >| For Empire of the Petal Throne and Traveller Role Playing, | >| see http://www.dragonfire.net/~healyzh/ | >| For the collecting of Classic Computers with info on them. | >| see http://www.dragonfire.net/~healyzh/museum.html | > > >

28 years

2
1
0 0

Cross listing auction items

by higginbo＠netpath.net

I'm trying my darndest not to get too involved in this thread, even though I started it, but I need to set the record straight: The URLs I sent weren't from ebay, they were from Haggle Online. An online auction that is totally free to buyers and sellers, unlike ebay, that charges a fee to sellers. Not that it really matters, since online auctions seem to be the new "great satan" on this list. I would like to point out though that if you don't know the true value of an item, why not let the public decide? What's wrong with making a little bit of money off a hobby? I know this probably isn't over, but I'll try to stay out of it, regardless. At 07:15 PM 6/10/98 -0700, Sam Ismail wrote: >I and others have said in the past that there's no wrong reason for >wanting to collect computers, but this craze I see going on at eBay is in >the very least stupid. - - john higginbotham ____________________________ - webmaster www.pntprinting.com - - limbo limbo.netpath.net -

28 years

2
1
0 0

Early Mac Clones

by allisonp＠world.std.com

<One of the smallest multitasking systems I've seen was the I/O processor <on the PERQ 2's. It was a Z80 with 4K ROM and 16K RAM, but said ROM <contained essentially a cooperatively multitasking kernel. Some tasks <were in ROM, others were loaded into RAM. OK, so the user never realised <what was going on, but that doesn't alter the fact that it was there :-) The smallest I've seen run on 8080 and fits in some 100 or so bytes. It was published in Kilobaud April 1978 page 102 and yes it was real. To multitask on most anything all you need is an interrupt and save the context of the current task and start some new task... the order, where the tasks are and memory allocation can be somewhat tricky but, for small tasks its pretty trivial. I've done it in 8048 MCUs where the resources were 64byts of ram and 1k of rom and the tasks were keyscan, display, serial IO and code conversion. The timer provided the interrupt. Allison

28 years

3
2
0 0

Early Mac Clones

by desieh＠southcom.com.au

bit hard getting a mac into a pc case though, remember that macs have all the connectors on board, desie -----Original Message----- From: Sam Ismail <dastar(a)wco.com> To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> Date: Monday, June 08, 1998 5:41 Subject: Re: Early Mac Clones >On Sun, 7 Jun 1998, Tom Owad wrote: > >> What edition do you have? My 2nd edition book says a listing of clones >> is given in edition 1, as oppose to just saying they exist. I'd love to >> get a list of old Mac clones. > >I made a timely find today of the first edition of _Build Your Own >Macintosh and Save a Bundle_. In Chapter 2 it has a price comparison >between the clone "Cat" Mac and the real Mac. The computers it lists are: > >Cat Mac SE >Cat Mac SE 30 >Cat Mac II >Cat Mac IIfx >Cat Mac IIcx >Cat Mac IIci > >It will indeed be interesting if I ever find one of these homebrew clones >(For the curious, the book basically tells you to buy Mac motherboards and >parts from third-party suppliers and stick them in a PC case. That's it.) >They would be hard to spot since I don't even give a first look to PC >clone boxes. There's not really anything special about them anyway, other >than the fact that it is novel. > >Sam Alternate e-mail: dastar(a)siconic.com >--------------------------------------------------------------------------- ---- >Ever onward. > > September 26 & 27...Vintage Computer Festival 2 > See http://www.siconic.com/vcf for details! > [Last web page update: 05/30/98] >

28 years

4
3
0 0

Stupid lusers...

by JRichardson＠softwright.co.uk

>> The MC68010 is the heart of my favorite computer ever, the AT&T Unix PC >> (built by Convergent Technologies). I've got three, two work fine, one >> is for parts. _Still_ the prettiest machines in my collection. Do you mean the NCR Tower series? Or was this some other offering by AT&T? I seem to remember that the old Tower 400's had 68010's - I've still got a few boards somewhere for one (system board was about 1 metre long and half a metre high!). I've got a complete Tower 700 with a 68030 as main CPU, and performance still rates really highly even these days...) Jules

28 years

3
2
0 0

Files as files

by pete＠dunnington.u-net.com

On Jun 10, 14:56, Max Eskin wrote: > How do UNIX files work? Is there a header of some sort? Not really. Certainly not consistently across all file types. Often command scripts have a comment at the top, and some versions of unix (eg, Irix) embed a "tag" number into executables so they can distinguish individual programs/versions quickly, but other than that, filetype determination is done by looking at various parts of a file and comparing what's found ("magic numbers") to a database (the "magic" file). So, for example, my system "knows" a certain file is a command script because the first 256 characters are all ASCII (which means it's probably a text file of some sort) and the file permissions are set such that it's executable (not merely readable). It also knows that a certain file is an ELF-format executable for a 32-bit little-endian MIPS processor with a version 1 architecture (ie it will run on *old* MIPS cpus as well as newer ones) because the bytes at offset 1 are "ELF", at offset 4 there's a binary "1" (which in this context means 32-bit not 64-bit), at offset 5 there's another "1" (little-endian), at offset 16 "2" means "executable", and at offset 18 "0" means "MIPS" (not Sparc, 80x86, 68000, etc). Some magic numbers are much simpler to decode, of course: a file that begins with "GIF89a" is a GIF file, surprise, surprise. And the more you dig, the more detail you can work out. -- Pete Peter Turnbull Dept. of Computer Science University of York

28 years

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Clueless Museums (was: Final Xerox Star demo)

by allisonp＠world.std.com

<And another point. There are a lot of ways to make (say) an oscillator. <If you're designing something you probably only need to know a couple of <them. But if you're repairing it, you'd better understand the one that <was used. True! I have the advantage that I see designs and immediatly see the core of the design with all the fluff removed. But it's years of experience and a good basic grounding in circuit theory that allows me to look st stuff I've never seen and synthsize the elements of the design in my head and troubleshoot it, right down to seeing it's weak points of likely failure. Allison

28 years

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Clueless Museums (was: Final Xerox Star demo)

by allisonp＠world.std.com

<Related to this, there's a myth that design is difficult, but design is easy, it's a process. The initial creative thought is hard. <faultfinding/repair can be done by almost anybody. Well, having done <both, I personally find them equally difficult. Perhaps that means I'm <no good at it, but... Troubleshooting is a very complex process that I've never been able to teach to anyone but those that naturally could. For me troubleshooting is something that I find natural and easy. I carry that to design as just a different problem to solve (cheaper, faster, better; pick any two). But working with field circus underscored that thinking is not something you can mandate. Allison

28 years

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Cross listing auction items

by higginbo＠netpath.net

At 07:58 PM 6/10/98 -0500, Doug Yowza wrote: >auctions. I'd suggest that the exact opposite is true. Whenever somebody >asks this list "how much is this thing worth", the answer is invariably >"whatever somebody is willing to pay". Basically, valuation of >collectibles is a democratic process not an analytical one belonging to >some exclusive domain of experts. Exactly, hence the value of an auction environment. That is what "whatever someone is willing to pay" means, isn't it? - - john higginbotham ____________________________ - webmaster www.pntprinting.com - - limbo limbo.netpath.net -

28 years

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Help on Grid Laptop

by manney＠lrbcg.com

There's an interesting GRiD support page at http://limbo.netpath.net/hw/GRiD/new.html >Is it a 1550SX? Try ftp://ftp.ast.com/GRID/conf1550.exe

28 years

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GRiD Latop, another problem

by manney＠lrbcg.com

Thanks for the advice -- it worked just fine!. Now...Windows (3.1) setup hangs when loading...when it's still in the DOS screens (before starting the Windows part.) Any ideas? manney(a)lrbcg.com "Un sot trouve toujours un plus sot qui l'admire." >Most (all?) GRiDs allow the boot device to be selected by holding down a >key at boot time: >'F': floppy >'H': hard disk >'B': bubble disk >'R': ROM disk >etc. I'm also hav manney(a)lrbcg.com "Un sot trouve toujours un plus sot qui l'admire."

28 years

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FA: Various systems

by SUPRDAVE＠aol.com

This is NOT a flame, but i'm just wondering the point of posting items that have been put up for sale on ebay, et al. all that means is every item will already be overbid on for an insane price. it is my opinion that if anything is announced as being for sale, the subscribers to this group should get first crack. david In a message dated 98-06-10 13:21:21 EDT, you write: << Some items on auction: Apple Portable, currently at $53.00 http://www.haggle.com/cgi/getitem.cgi?id=201635376 TI-99/4A, complete with about 15 games http://www.haggle.com/cgi/getitem.cgi?id=201639758 Also, looking for cheap Type I PCMCIA/JEIDA RAM cards. 1mb-4mb range. >>

28 years

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MS Museum (RE: Ack, not again (RE: Cross listing auction items))

by kaikal＠MICROSOFT.com

Well, apparently we need to demolish the existing one-story building where the current museum is located, and it's always been a bit cramped for big school tours, so a new larger location was pretty much de rigeur. I don't know if anything will be added, and no, I'm not on the museum staff. Kai -----Original Message----- From: Doug Yowza [mailto:yowza@yowza.com] Sent: Wednesday, June 10, 1998 6:17 PM To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers Subject: Re: Ack, not again (RE: Cross listing auction items) On Wed, 10 Jun 1998, Kai Kaltenbach wrote: > Please stop this, we've been over it a million times. We've been over the "is it OK to sell stuff here" question a million times. The auction thing adds a nice twist because they address the all-important valuation issue. Anyway, did you have anything to do with the Microsoft Museum announcement, and do you know what Bill is looking for and how much he'll pay? -- Doug

28 years

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Ack, not again (RE: Cross listing auction items)

by kaikal＠MICROSOFT.com

Please stop this, we've been over it a million times. It ALWAYS generates MORE traffic on the list to argue about it than it does to simply ignore the auction posts if you don't like 'em. Kai

28 years

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IBM 700 Laptop Significance?

by sinasohn＠ricochet.net

At 12:58 AM 6/10/98 -0500, you wrote: >The first DOS laptop with a pointing device was the GRiD 1550SX, and it >had an isopoint (tootsie-roll) similar to the Outbound Mac-clone. What year did the 1550sx come out? I'll have to watch for it... 8^) --------------------------------------------------------------------- O- Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad roger(a)sinasohn.com that none but madmen know." Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates San Francisco, California http://www.sinasohn.com/

28 years

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IBM 700 Laptop Significance?

by lwalker＠mail.interlog.com

> On Tue, 9 Jun 1998, Zane H. Healy wrote: > > > Was this one of the ones from about '92? If it's the one I'm thinking of, > > it would be the first with the 'pencil' pointer in the keyboard. For all I > > know, the first built in pointer (I'd not seen any prior to this). Of > > course I really remember it running AIX and OS/2 at the same time (I hate > > AIX, but sure wish they had released that product). > > That must be it. The TP700 was the first with the TrackPoint (eraser > head). Interestingly enough there was a thread recently on comp.sys.ibm.ps2 re the collectiveity of PS2 s. Most mentioned the 700. Some quotes : "The Thinkpad 710T (IBMs first Trackpad). I have one - without the 5MB TP-File. There were two different model-lines out: one has a 2.5" IDE HD, the other has a 5,10 or 20MB PCMCIA Solid State disk. The SSD-models have a different planar and cannot be converted into IDE-models. I have a SSD-model (2523-AY9) but no TP-Filecard. Too bad." " 9552 Thinkpad 700 C, one of the last microchannel Thinkpads" ciao larry > > The first DOS laptop with a pointing device was the GRiD 1550SX, and it > had an isopoint (tootsie-roll) similar to the Outbound Mac-clone. > > -- Doug > > > lwalker(a)interlog.com

28 years

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IBM 700 Laptop Significance?

by sinasohn＠ricochet.net

At 10:28 PM 6/9/98 -0700, you wrote: >Was this one of the ones from about '92? If it's the one I'm thinking of, >it would be the first with the 'pencil' pointer in the keyboard. For all I >know, the first built in pointer (I'd not seen any prior to this). Of That's probably it. Though not the first with a built-in pointer. As Doug mentioned, GRiD had one, as did the Mac Portable (1989) and the Atari STacy (year?). Not sure what year the Outbound came out but I'm pretty sure it was pre-thinkpad (maybe '89ish?). --------------------------------------------------------------------- O- Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad roger(a)sinasohn.com that none but madmen know." Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates San Francisco, California http://www.sinasohn.com/

28 years

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FA: Various systems

by higginbo＠netpath.net

Looks like I made a real splash with my first post since resubscribing! In my defense, all I have to say is this: If don't really know the current street value for an item and I want to get rid of it, the best thing to do IS put it on auction and post to similar lists and newsgroups. I'm sorry if I offended anyone. During my hiatus, I was spending alot of time on usenet, a place where this is done all the time. Guess I got a little brainwashed. If it's gonna cause a problem, I won't let it happen again. At 01:37 PM 6/10/98 EDT, SUPRDAVE(a)aol.com wrote: >This is NOT a flame, but i'm just wondering the point of posting items that >have been put up for sale on ebay, et al. all that means is every item will >already be overbid on for an insane price. it is my opinion that if anything >is announced as being for sale, the subscribers to this group should get first >crack. - - john higginbotham ____________________________ - webmaster www.pntprinting.com - - limbo limbo.netpath.net -

28 years

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Early Mac Clones

by tomowad＠earthlink.net

>A (very!) non-portable Mac "Clone" that I haven't seen mentioned yet is the >Dash '030 from (iirc) 68000 systems. It's an actual Mac II-type >motherboard in a huge server case. Ports were accessable on the top, and >has about 6 or 7 drive bays up front. The front covers the drives and can >be locked closed. Huge P/S, with filter on the back. Very serious >systems. I've got two, actually. Does "Mac II-type motherboard" mean its a genuine Apple motherboard, or do you just mean its similiar to the Mac II motherboards? Tom Owad

28 years

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Early Mac Clones

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

Is this device better than a mouse, in your opinion? Is it an ADB device? >At 12:25 PM 6/8/98 -0700, you wrote: >>>Outbound >> >>Anybody have any of these? Any experience with them. I would love some >>further information. > >I have an Outbound. Fantastic machine. The pointing device alone is worth >getting the computer for. (Imagine a pencil tucked up against the bottom >edge of your keyboard. Roll it towards the screen and away to move the >cursor up and down. Slide it left and right to move the cursor left and >right. Wonderful!) Unfortunately, mine has a problem with the screen; if >anyone has any spare parts, or knows anything about them, I'd love to hear >from you! (I'd really like to put this machine to use!) > > >--------------------------------------------------------------------- O- > >Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad >roger(a)sinasohn.com that none but madmen know." >Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates >San Francisco, California http://www.sinasohn.com/ > > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

28 years

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Wang PC-002 ??

by rigdonj＠intellistar.net

After reading Doug's message, I checked at my favorite trift store and found a pile of manuals for a Wang PC. NOT Personal Computer but Professional computer! The manuals seem to be sort of generic to all Wang PCs. None of the manuals mentioned a model number of the computers themselves but they did list the model numbers of the various options and accessories. I also found three Wang computers. They were under a pile of stuff so I didn't get a good luck at them and I don't know if they were Wang PCs or a different model but they looked like the PCs. Two looked like 8 slot electronics units (that's what Wang calls them) and the other looked like a 5 slot unit. Joe At 02:18 PM 6/9/98 -0400, you wrote: > >Greetings, > >I saw a very large Wang box at a thrift store yesterday, I *think* the >little sticker on it said "PC-002". I didn't see the keyboard, but I >didn't look. > >The machine was really big, I think about twice the height of an old >IBM-PC and about the same width. It was longer than it was wide. > >It had two full-height 5.25" floppy drives. > >>From the back it looked like it had several large horizontally-mounted >cards inside, including one with two coaxial cable connectors and another >with two female DIN connectors. > >I would have paid close attention to it had my arms not already been full. > >I didn't see the keyboard, but it was probably stacked up in the pile with >all the normal PC crap keyboards. > >If I am to go back for it, I'll have to take the car as I doubt I'd be >able to survive the walk to the bus while trying to carry that thing. > >Does anyone know what this thing is? > > >Doug Spence >ds_spenc(a)alcor.concordia.ca >http://alcor.concordia.ca/~ds_spenc/ > >

28 years

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