- test-drb@ccmp.vtda.org - classiccmp.org

by kyrrin＠my-dejanews.com

CLASSICCMP folks... This is a list of DEC equipment that's either available now or soon will be. If any of you are interested, please contact the originator directly. His name is Craig Bence, and he can be reached as: craigb(a)frzr.com Thanks. Attachment follows. -- --------- Forwarded Message --------- DATE: Wed, 23 Sep 1998 09:05:44 From: "Craig Bence" <craigb(a)frzr.com> To: <kyrrin(a)jps.net> Here is a text file for you. -=-=-=- <snip> -=-=-=- Make Model Serial Num Description Location Availability DEC DV-31ATBAA 108755 "KA41-1(4MB,FPU) RZ23-EG" Omaha Now DEC LA120-AA NA3089 LA120-BA (W/out Numeric keypad) Omaha Now DEC TK50Z-FA 000021 "TK50 Contrl, Exp Box, 120V" Omaha Now DEC RZ23-E 000018 "104MB Winch.Disk 3.5"" Preconfig" Omaha Now DEC RZ23-E 000019 "104MB Winch.Disk 3.5"" Preconfig" Omaha Now DXTRA MV 3100 729654 MicroVax 3100 Software Support Omaha Now DEC RZ24-EF 000020 "209MB 3.5"" Disk Drv/Add on" Omaha Now Data Products B300 N47065 300 LPM Printer Omaha Now DEC DV-31DTAAA 0D3759 MV3100/10E VMS T/S Base USA Fremont 10/01/98 DEC LA120-AA F08543 LA120-BA (W/Out Numeric keypad) Fremont 10/01/98 DEC LA120-AA N91945 LA120-BA (W/Out Numeric keypad) Fremont 10/01/98 DEC VT320-C2 0Z2693 Mono Amber Text Terminal Fremont 10/01/98 DEC VT320-C2 353830 Mono AmberText Terminal Fremont 10/01/98 DEC VT320-C2 606499 Mono AmberText Terminal Fremont 10/01/98 DEC DSH32-BA 000025 Microvax 2000 Communications Fremont 10/01/98 DXTRA MV 3100 0D3759 Microvax 3100 Software Support Fremont 10/01/98 DXTRA MV 2000 000025 Microvax 2000 Software Support Fremont 10/01/98 DEC VT420-C2 018607 Mono Amber Term No KB/PWC Fremont 10/01/98 DEC VT420-C2 018608 Mono Amber Term No KB/PWC Fremont 10/01/98 DEC VT420-C2 4L9591 Mono Amber Term No KB/PWC Fremont 10/01/98 DEC VT420-C2 5S7624 Mono Amber Term No KB/PWC Fremont 10/01/98 DEC VT420-C2 685335 Mono Amber Term No KB/PWC Fremont 10/01/98 DEC RZ24-EF 000026 "209MB 3.5"" Disk Drive/ADD on" Fremont 10/01/98 DEC RZ24-EF 000027 "209MB 3.5"" Disk Drive/ADD on" Fremont 10/01/98 DEC SZ12X-HA 000023 TZ30 95MB Tape Drive-Dual CAB Fremont 10/01/98 Data Products B300 N21368 300 LPM Printer Fremont 10/01/98 DEC DSRVG-AA 05425A DECServer 90L Phoenix 11/01/98 DEC DV-31CT2AA 005425 Microvax 3100 (KA41-A) Phoenix 11/01/98 DEC LA424-CA 1P4C37 136 Column Printer Phoenix 11/01/98 DEC LA100-AA NN0195 "ENG Lang, Dot Mtrx Term, KSR, 240" Phoenix 11/01/98 DEC LA120-DA NN2925 LA120 ksr w Numeric Keypad Phoenix 11/01/98 DEC LA120-RB NN5002 Printer Phoenix 11/01/98 DEC VT510-AA 05425B Terminal White Phoenix 11/01/98 DEC VT510-AA 05425C Terminal White Phoenix 11/01/98 DEC TK50Z-BA 003QAY TK50-AA w/ Nema Cabinet Phoenix 11/01/98 DEC VT320-C2 146689 Mono Amber Text Terminal Phoenix 11/01/98 DEC VT320-C2 619887 Mono Amber Text Terminal Phoenix 11/01/98 DEC VT320-C2 744751 Mono Amber Text Terminal Phoenix 11/01/98 DEC VT320-C2 9CF214 Mono Amber Text Terminal Phoenix 11/01/98 DEC LG02-CA M94343 600 LPM Text/Graphic Printer Phoenix 11/01/98 DEC RZ23-EF 101QL4 104MB DRV/Upgrade VS/MV3100 Phoenix 11/01/98 DXTRA MV 3100 005425 Microvax 3100 Software Support Phoenix 11/01/98 DEC VT420-C2 05425D Mono Amber Terminal no KB/PWC Phoenix 11/01/98 DEC DV-31GTAB9 OPH341 MV3100-40 2 User Open-VMS SYST East Dubuque 02/01/99 DEC 450ZM-B9 3KP654 Microvax 3100 Model 40 SBB East Dubuque 02/01/99 DEC LA424-A2 346208 136 Column Impact Printer East Dubuque 02/01/99 DEC LA424-CA 346231 136 Column Printer East Dubuque 02/01/99 DEC TZ30-AA H341TZ 95MB Half Height Tape East Dubuque 02/01/99 DEC VT420-CA 8V1338 Mono Amber Terminal USA East Dubuque 02/01/99 DEC VT420-CA 8V1339 Mono Amber Terminal USA East Dubuque 02/01/99 DEC VT420-CA 8V1340 Mono Amber Terminal USA East Dubuque 02/01/99 DEC VT420-CA 8V1341 Mono Amber Terminal USA East Dubuque 02/01/99 N VT420-CA 8V1342 Mono Amber Terminal USA East Dubuque 02/01/99 DEC RZ25-E 00341A "426MB 3.5"" SCSI Disk Drive" East Dubuque 02/01/99 DEC RZ25-E 00341B "426MB 3.5"" SCSI Disk Drive" East Dubuque 02/01/99 DEC SZ12X-HA 9000S9 TZ30 95MB Tape Drive-Dual CAB East Dubuque 02/01/99 DEC SZ12X-HA 903786 TZ30 95MB Tape Drive-Dual CAB East Dubuque 02/01/99 FUJIT M3041C 030135 Fujitsu M3041C East Dubuque 02/01/99 DEC DV-31DTAAA 8D7452 MV3100/10E VMS Amarillo 03/01/99 DEC LA120-RA NE4903 Printer Amarillo 03/01/99 DEC LA120-BA N09850 LA120 120V/60HZ EIA Num Pad Amarillo 03/01/99 DEC VT320-C2 OCF915 Mono Amber Text Terminal Amarillo 03/01/99 DEC VT320-C2 OCH075 Mono Amber Text Terminal Amarillo 03/01/99 DEC VT320-C2 1R9867 Mono Amber Text Terminal Amarillo 03/01/99 DEC VT320-C2 2R3671 Mono Amber Text Terminal Amarillo 03/01/99 DEC VT320-C2 3BM687 Mono Amber Text Terminal Amarillo 03/01/99 DEC VT320-C2 742143 Mono Amber Text Terminal Amarillo 03/01/99 DEC VT320-C2 864430 Mono Amber Text Terminal Amarillo 03/01/99 DEC VT320-C2 943806 Mono Amber Text Terminal Amarillo 03/01/99 DEC RZ24-EG 000001 "209MB 3.5"" Disk Drive/Fact Ins" Amarillo 03/01/99 DEC RZ24-EG 000002 "209MB 3.5"" Disk Drive/Fact Ins" Amarillo 03/01/99 DXTRA MV 3100 8D7452 Microvax 3100 Software Support Amarillo 03/01/99 DEC SZ12X-HA 301GED TZ30 95MB Tape Drive-Dual CAB Amarillo 03/01/99 Data Products 8300 N21700 300 LPM Printer Amarillo 03/01/99 DEC DV-31DTAAA 0F6459 MV3100/10E VMS 1/S Base USA Garden City 04/01/99 DEC LA120-BA NF9304 Printer Garden City 04/01/99 DEC LA120-BB NN2813 Printer Garden City 04/01/99 DEC VT320-C2 0K9182 Mono Amber Text Terminal Garden City 04/01/99 DEC VT320-C2 0L8531 Mono Amber Text Terminal Garden City 04/01/99 DEC VT320-C2 1L1117 Mono Amber Text Terminal Garden City 04/01/99 DEC VT320-C2 457736 Mono Amber Text Terminal Garden City 04/01/99 DEC VT320-C2 537029 Mono Amber Text Terminal Garden City 04/01/99 DEC VT320-C2 590686 Mono Amber Text Terminal Garden City 04/01/99 DEC TZ30-AA 000010 95MB Half Height Tape Garden City 04/01/99 DEC DSH32-BA 4DE366 Microvax 2000 Communications Garden City 04/01/99 DXTRA MV 3100 0F6459 Microvax 3100 Software Support Garden City 04/01/99 DXTRA MV 2000 4DE366 Microvax 2000 Software Support Garden City 04/01/99 DEC VT420-AA 612268 Mono White Terminal USA Garden City 04/01/99 DEC SZ03B-BA 000008 209MB Disk Drive Garden City 04/01/99 DEC RZ24-EF 000009 "209MB 3.5"" Disk Drive/ADD on" Garden City 04/01/99 Data Products B300 N45046 300 LPM Printer Garden City 04/01/99 DEC DV-31DTAAA 0D3755 MV3100/10E VMS 1/S Base USA Sioux Falls 05/01/99 DEC LA120-DA NN6889 "LA120 KSR w/Numeric kypad, Univ" Sioux Falls 05/01/99 DEC LA120-RA N60640 Printer Sioux Falls 05/01/99 DEC VT510-AA 511891 Terminal White Sioux Falls 05/01/99 DEC VT320-C2 101183 Mono Amber Text Terminal Sioux Falls 05/01/99 DEC VT320-C2 204241 Mono Amber Text Terminal Sioux Falls 05/01/99 DEC DSH32-BA 000003 Microvax 2000 Communications Sioux Falls 05/01/99 DXTRA MV 3100 0D3755 Microvax 3100 Software Support Sioux Falls 05/01/99 DXTRA MV 2000 000003 Microvax 2000 Software Support Sioux Falls 05/01/99 DEC VT420-C2 000001 Mono Amber Terminal no KB/pwc Sioux Falls 05/01/99 DEC VT420-C2 203778 Mono Amber Terminal no KB/pwc Sioux Falls 05/01/99 DEC VT420-C2 714107 Mono Amber Terminal no KB/pwc Sioux Falls 05/01/99 DEC VT420-C2 714168 Mono Amber Terminal no KB/pwc Sioux Falls 05/01/99 DEC RZ26L-EK NF9304 1.05GB Disk Drive Sioux Falls 05/01/99 DEC RZ24-EF 000002 "209MB 3.5"" Disk Drive/Add on" Sioux Falls 05/01/99 DEC RZ24-EF 000006 "209MB 3.5"" Disk Drive/Add on" Sioux Falls 05/01/99 DEC SZ12X-HA 0043MF TZ30 95MB Tape Drive-Dual CAB Sioux Falls 05/01/99 Data Products B300 N45044 300 LPM Printer Sioux Falls 05/01/99 -----== Sent via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==----- http://www.dejanews.com/ Easy access to 50,000+ discussion forums

28 years

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EDSAC on your desk.

by allisonp＠world.std.com

< We just to joke that Z80EMU on a Pentium was faster than any Z80 process < you could actually buy, I wonder if it wouldn't be feasible these days t < create a 38 pin I/O port and build an "ICE" in software... < --Chuck thats a tall claim as the z80 is available up to 20mhz and z180s to 33mhz. Then you can also use he Z380 is z80 native mode (it uses fewer clocks per instruction than any other z80) at 20mhz (faster are supposed to exist.). I am in the process of bringing up a Z280 at 12.5mhz (with 16bit zbus) and I expect that with it's instruction cache and fast ram there will be a new level of CPM performance comming. since I have a z80 system that runs at 8mhz (no waits!) and MYZ80 on a 486dx2/66 and the 486 is faster on emulated disk IO (inherent caching) but about the about the same as the 8mhz system otherwise. The disk differences are due to the type of interface SCSI-1 vs SCSI-II and size of buffers. Emulators have their place. One is allowing cross platform code development and testing and the other is allowing access to archetectures that are scarce or unusual. Allison

28 years

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Motorola UDS modem

by allisonp＠world.std.com

< Apart from the "gee, that really was slow" potential for demonstration, < recreating the past, is there *any* use for old modems? I still use a 2400 Zoom pocket modem with my PX8. The PX8 isn't fast enough to keep up with anything over 9600 and 2400 is generally the slowest most services will go now (some will not go under 9600). Allison

28 years

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Stains caused by Cigarette smoke

by SUPRDAVE＠aol.com

DONT use purple stuff! its way too strong. i used it once on a pc case, and where it dripped and/or sat on the case, the paint was a lighter shade. its very strong, so if you take appropriate measures, it will clean most anything. the best thing i've found is armor all all-purpose cleaner. safe, and cleans good and wont draw the colour out of anything. it you use lots of it with hot water, it even removes the grease pen price marks from thrift stores. david In a message dated 98-09-22 18:11:28 EDT, you write: > If I recall, the FAQ recommends something called "Purple Stuff". I don't > know > what it is or how well it works or how hard you have to scrub, if at all -- > I've never used it.

28 years

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Quantum Q540 as a RD52

by CLASSICCMP＠timaxp.trailing-edge.com

>THANK YOU Tim You're welcome! > This is the kind of info I've been searching EVERYWHERE for! And the kind that languishes about in DEC-internal docs :-). Keep in mind that I strongly suspect that at least some of the RD51 numbers in that table are wrong. >The info on the Quantum page was virtually worthless, and I'd not been able >to find anything anywhere else. Unfortunately on the net these days, you're far more likely to find folks trying to act self-important rather than actually dealing with useful technical information. I certainly thought I'd see useful information on 'classiccmp', but it doesn't seem to be any better than the rest of the world. >If you haven't already, could you please >stick this on the PDP-11 FTP site, so the next person will have an easier >time finding it (if it was already there I'm going to feel really stupid). Indeed, it is now there: http://sunsite.unc.edu/pub/academic/computer-science/history/pdp-11/hardwar… -- Tim Shoppa Email: shoppa(a)trailing-edge.com Trailing Edge Technology Voice: 301-767-5917 7328 Bradley Blvd Fax: 301-767-5927 Bethesda, MD, USA 20817

28 years

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System 7

by g＠ehrich.com

>1800, used for process control (leading to the S/7). > I worked a lot with the System 7 back in the early 70's and wrote the code on it (TPMM) that controlled the first On-Line ATM in the US. It was at a small bank in central NJ. The ATM (2984 I think) was remote to a System 7. The files were transferred at night to a System 3 by carrying the disk pack across the room. The ATM was called "Tin Teller". The bank was Hunterton County Trust. Never forget the day when testing it the machine at the branch with my young kids along, the looks on their faces when they saw money come out of the slot on the wall. gene@ehrich http://www.voicenet.com/~generic Computer & Video Game Garage Sale

28 years

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PDP-10 (was Re: EDSAC on your desk.)

by allisonp＠world.std.com

< As far as the -10 is concerned, there would be several hundred (if not < thousands) of modules and the backplane (for want of a better word) was < machine wrapped nest of identical (yellow) wires. I doubt that you coul < reliably follow a signal within a rack, let alone across the whole machi < However, as I said before, I've never attacked a -10 with a scope so I < can't be sure that this isn't possible. Never touched a 10 myself but... I've worked with those who had. Despite it's complexity most of it is the same thing x36 or some sub multiple. So troubleshoorting it would be like attacking and older straight 8 or 8I/L series with it's large number of modules. You follow a problem along a bit path to the point of failure. Usually with a handfull of know good common modules and a scope. Backplane problems were extermely difficult if there were any kind if damage to the wiring or connectors. Allison

28 years

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Stains caused by Cigarette smoke

by allisonp＠world.std.com

< > While isopropanol is good wash a trip through the dish washer works ev < > time for me. Air dry or a cool oven to get out any trapped water. < < This is really good information I am going to try this on one computer < collection. This unit is so Gummed up by Cigarette smoke I can't even st < to be in the same room with it, It actually makes my sinuses get irritat < and makes me sneeze while this machine is on. I opened it up and there w < sticky film all over the components, almost like a fungus growing on it < cigarette tar.. I was going to get rid of it as it smelled so bad, so I < this works.. this takes me back some to a customer that was making TV converter boxes (legit). Seems the boards were assembled in Mexico and then tested in Texas. Then would fail after a few hours... seems fungus growing on the board from the bad water (recirculated and reused excessively) used would cause high resistance shorts that would affect the microprocessor crystal clock. The fix was a was a wash in good Texas water. Actually, a clean board has a lower fail rate as the cooling is better, no dust or grunge. Case parts can also be cleaned that way if they fit, me I take them out in the driveway and use the hose and a bucket of soapy water. With care you can clean most anything with soap and water... assuming the object itself isn't water soluble. ;) Allison

28 years

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Cleaning a rusty transformer

by sethm＠loomcom.com

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28 years

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Mail Mixup (off topic)

by jpl15＠netcom.com

Sorry for this, but it's short. I recently lost correspondence with a list-member... it turned out that my e-mail addr had mysteriously mutated, and mail sent there just vanished, no bounce, no return... zilch. It took a phone call to clear *that* up. [Correct is: jpl15(a)netcom.com] I have written two active list members, with no replies, though they used to do so. So: Seth M. and Paxton... if you are writing me privately... I'm not getting them. And if you've gotten my mail(s) and simply haven't/don't wish to write back.. my profuse apologies to you and the group, and I'll shut up now. Thanks for your indulgence, fellow List-friends. Cheers (digital garlic breath?? nahh....) John

28 years

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Stains caused by Cigarette smoke

by allisonp＠world.std.com

< Do you have to stop it before it goes through the dry cycle? On mine I can set it for a low energy dry so that varies. I'd suggest letting it start and after five minutes pull it out (warm board will dry faster). < I have a '64 I don't value especially that I'll try this on... anything < else I should know before this venerable machine gets opened up? Anything that can trap water like dip switches or adjustable coils will take a long time to dry. Baking in a 170-180F oven will accelerate drying with little risk. I've done this to PDP-11 and VAX boards, a TRS80 and many other boards that were real grungy. The process used at the factory is very similar to a dishwasher (sometimes is!). Allison

28 years

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EDSAC on your desk.

by SUPRDAVE＠aol.com

(wow, offline for 4 days, and well over 100 messages!) heh, i have that apple emulator program. i think someone gave it to me. it's pretty neat, but the apple // screen is rather small when you're running on a compact mac's screen! the program even included a comm program for a // so you could xfer files between the // and the mac. david In a message dated 98-09-22 16:34:01 EDT, you write: > Have you seen the Apple II emulator 'II in a Mac' for the 68000 Macs? It > placed the moitor, a keyboard, joystick, four floppy drives, printer, and > a clock on the screen. Then you could actually click on the keyboard's > keys or move the joystick on the screen with the mouse. A really neat > interface which, IMHO, did a half decent job at preserving the hardware's > feel. It's a shame more emulators don't do such a good job at portraying > the hardware. > > Tom Owad >

28 years

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Quantum Q540 as a RD52

by CLASSICCMP＠timaxp.trailing-edge.com

>>So what does it want for input? Don't know if this is a stupid question, >>but am asking since I've never actually used XXDP+ and I didn't get any >>documentation at all with the Packs, despite the fact that the rest had >>related Docs. >type 'STA'. It will prompt you for some information which will be >pretty intuitive... stuff like the hardware address to use, the unit >to format, whether you want bad blocks revectored, etc... If he couldn't figure out the answers to the VS2000 formatter, he's not going to have any easier time with ZRQC! Remember, he's formatting disks that have never been formatted on a VS2000 or RQDX3 before, so he needs all the numbers necessary to MSCP-qualify the disk. Here's the RD52 numbers, straight from the RQDX3 DEC-internal docs: Quantum Atasi ------- ----- Sector Interleave 1:1 1:1 Bytes/Sector 512 512 Sectors/LBN 1 1 LBNs/Track 17 17 Tracks/Group 8 7 Groups/Cylinder 1 1 Cylinders/Unit 512 645 Total LBN's/Unit 69632 76755 RBNs/Unit 168 168 RCT Size (Blocks) 4 4 RCT Copies 8 8 DBNs/Unit 8 8 XBNs/Unit 54 54 User LBNs/Unit 60480 60480 User Capacity (Bytes) 30965760 30965760 Step Pulsewidth (usec) 11.2 11.2 Step Rate (usec) 17.6 17.6 Write Precomp (nsec) 10 10 Precomp Cylinders 256-611 320-644 And, for completeness, the RD51 and RD53 numbers (though I suspect the DEC tables have typos for at least some of the RD51 quantities): RD51 RD53 ---- ---- Sector Interleave 1:1 1:1 Bytes/Sector 512 512 Sectors/LBN 1 1 LBNs/Track 18 17 Tracks/Group 1 8 Groups/Cylinder 4 1 Cylinders/Unit 306 1024 Total LBN's/Unit 22032 139264 RBNs/Unit 144 280 RCT Size (Blocks) 36 5 RCT Copies 4 8 DBNs/Unit 87 82 XBNs/Unit 57 54 User LBNs/Unit 21600 138672 User Capacity (Bytes) 11059200 71000064 Step Pulsewidth (usec) 11.2 11.2 Step Rate (usec) 17.6 17.6 Write Precomp (nsec) 10 (none) Precomp Cylinders 110-305 (none) -- Tim Shoppa Email: shoppa(a)trailing-edge.com Trailing Edge Technology Voice: 301-767-5917 7328 Bradley Blvd Fax: 301-767-5927 Bethesda, MD, USA 20817

28 years

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Quantum Q540 as a RD52

by mbg＠world.std.com

>If he couldn't figure out the answers to the VS2000 formatter, he's >not going to have any easier time with ZRQC! Remember, he's formatting >disks that have never been formatted on a VS2000 or RQDX3 before, so >he needs all the numbers necessary to MSCP-qualify the disk. The version of ZRQC I've used doesn't ask any of the stuff you supplied in the rest of your post... as I said, what it asks is pretty intuitively answered (at least it has been for me, and I've not had to enter any of the values). Megan Gentry Former RT-11 Developer +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+ | Megan Gentry, EMT/B, PP-ASEL | Internet (work): gentry!zk3.dec.com | | Unix Support Engineering Group | (home): mbg!world.std.com | | Compaq Computer Corporation | addresses need '@' in place of '!' | | 110 Spitbrook Rd. ZK03-2/T43 | URL: http://world.std.com/~mbg/ | | Nashua, NH 03062 | "pdp-11 programmer - some assembler | | (603) 884 1055 | required." - mbg | +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+

28 years

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Linux on S/370? Was: Re: printer socket (Off topic)

by cfandt＠servtech.com

At 11:13 21-09-98 -0400, William Donzelli wrote: >> Less S/370s out there? I would think, since they are more recent vintage, >> there would be more. Any reason why? I'll keep my eyes peeled for you though. > >I think is simply the prestige of the S/360s. After all, they are probably >the single most influential computer family of the 1960s. The S/370s just >do not have the same magic in their name. I can agree with that about their influence. IBM had the marketing horsepower and exposure to put them in many banks, insurance companies, factories, etc. more so than say, Buroughs, CDC and any of the other big names of the day. Computers back then were a BIG and Important Investment to a company. IBM made sure everyone got that feeling through their marketing. Ever hear much of an IBM 1130? Any info on the web, etc. on that machine? > >> Yeah, even my beige box 9370 is boring as heck to look at :-( (It's a CMOS >> version of the S/370 from 1987/88.) No interesting front panels, can't >> tinker with hardware much at all, etc. Pah! > >Even the last of the machines tagged "System/370" started to lose their >panels. By the time the 3033 and 4331 came out (mid to late 1970s), the >panels were gone. IBM used the same cabinets until recently switching over >to the black and red (very sharp looking) S/390s. > >S/370 panels are amazing. Unlike the S/360 panels, they are black with all >sorts of color coding, and liberal use of the hexadecimal knobs for >setting the registers. > >I would like to find a picture of any old S/370 on the Web, but I have not >come accross one yet. Interesting that there is no pics to be found so far. I recall seeing the S/370 console at the Deutsches Museum in Munich several years ago. It was amazing indeed at least for that model, to see such a neat operating panel. Wish I had taken some detailed photos of it then I could have someone scan and post them for everyone to see. Anyone have any sales/marketing brochures out there who could scan some good example photos of S/370's? > >> Christian Fandt, Electronic/Electrical Historian > >Lets give Chris a big hand for being an Auction helper at the Antique >Wireless Association meet in Rochester, NY just a few weeks ago. He did >not drop too many things. Thanks! I do worry about handling those $750-$1k DeForest Audions that come through. We've done the auction for many, many years as you may know (how long have you been an AWA member?). I've helped for at least 18 years I think. Usually it's myself, Lauren Peckham and his son, David, who are up there every year and several other old stand-bys in the "sold" area to the right. Thank God we usually have light weight equipment compared to classic computers!! However, a few Radiola 60's and the like come through occasionally and they can get real heavy _real_fast_! The three '30's and early 40's console radios and the early TV were auctioned while just setting in place as you saw. I was kinda sick for most of the day from total exhaustion or more likely burn-out while working at the conference. I wasn't my usual wise-cracking self with Lauren and Dave. I had to sit behind the platform for about 15 minutes around 2 PM as I was about to literally drop. That recharged my batteries, so to speak, and was able to perk me up enough to continue helping. We had, IIRC, 620 individual lots with a huge number of vacuum tube lots this year. Quite a few paper lots too. IIRC, $62,400 or so was sold during the 8 hour duration. New record amounts both in lot quantity and money. I got a few rather nice items for my collection including a Crosley 50A Two-step Amplifier with brass-base tipped '01A's for only $150 and a real early version of the Crosley ACE Type V (wooden book condensor, ceramic tube socket, cylindrical tickler coil) for $130. Somebody was sleeping on those rather rare items :-) I like Crosleys since they're quite interesting and SMALL doggone it! It was great to just relax on Saturday AM and listen to the technical talks. If any of us get involved with a computer collecting club or association like the AWA is to Electronic Communications and that club or assoc. begins to have an equipment auction, and I get involved with helping run the auction, please haul me away to get my head examined! I'm staying HOME!!! :-) Imagine lugging around Cromemco, CompuPro or other loaded S100 systems, or DEC RL02 drives, or IBM DASD units during an auction. Those are truly comparative boatanchors like an RAL-7 or R-390 (old military radios for the unwashed out there) but we sure love 'em, don't we! ;) I did not see you. Should have come up to me and introduced yourself. > >William Donzelli >william(a)ans.net > Christian Fandt, Electronic/Electrical Historian Jamestown, NY USA Member of Antique Wireless Association URL: http://www.ggw.org/freenet/a/awa/

28 years

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Transformer

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

In short, if the 128D uses 60W, I need a transformer with a VA of 60 or higher, your recommendation around 100? >> >> >> I visited Radio Shack yesterday, and look for a step-up transformer >> for my European C-128D. They had everything neatly labelled, but >> how do I find out how many watts it's rated for? It has a measurement >> called 'V/A Cap' which goes from about 70 to over a thousand. The >> prices goes up with it. > >OK... VA (not V/A...) is Volt-amps. It's called the 'apparent power' >rating of the load. > >Remember that in a DC circuit you calculate the power by multiplying the >voltage (in volts) by the current in amps. So the VA unit does have the >right dimensions to be power. > >In an AC circuit, things are not so simple. I'm going to stick to >sinusoidal waveforms here, BTW and let someone else handle the nasty >cases. It turns out that if the voltage and current are not in phase with >each other (and they won't be unless the load is perfectly resistive), >then the useful power you can get out of the load - the so-called true >power - is given by V*I*cos(phi) where phi is the phase angle between the >voltage (V) and current (I) waveforms. V and I are the rms values of the >voltage and current, as usual. > >cos(phi) is called the 'power factor' of the system. > >But, the size of the transformer you need is really determined by the rms >values of V and I, no matter what the phase shift is. So that, for >example, if you have a load giving out a true power of 50W, with a power >factor of 0.5, then you need to use a 100W transformer to supply it. > >What does this mean to you? > >I think it's fair to say that 0.5 is an excessively low power factor for >any micro. 0.66 would be pretty low as well. So if you (say) see that >your machine takes 100W, then a 150W or 200W transformer would be ample. >A 100W transformer _might_ be OK, but it might be marginal. Practically, >I'd probably pick smalllest transformer with a VA rating in excess of the >wattage of the computer, and if it doesn't get excessively hot in use, >it'll be fine. > >-tony > > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

28 years

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Here comes the Hurricane

by allisonp＠world.std.com

< Well, true, but I was more concerned with the more likely outcome of < flooding. It seems that homes normally stay intact in hurricanes unles < you get the full force, or unless a tornado gets whipped up. Maybe I'm Being from LI NY I'm used to hurricanes. I suggested CLEAN NEW garbage pails to store in as they can be taped closed and tied down. Also they are less likely to be sold out. We'd get one extra 10gal for water! Allison

28 years

1
0
0 0

Transformer

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

I visited Radio Shack yesterday, and look for a step-up transformer for my European C-128D. They had everything neatly labelled, but how do I find out how many watts it's rated for? It has a measurement called 'V/A Cap' which goes from about 70 to over a thousand. The prices goes up with it. ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

28 years

2
1
0 0

Trying to reach a list member

by museum＠techniche.com

Hi folks, I've been trying to reach Paxton Hoag (WHoaglll(a)aol.com). I've send several e-mail message but apparently I can't reach him. Maybe his ISP is blocking mine or something. I have seen recent posting from him our our list so I know that he's been out there. If anyone is in touch with him could you forward this to him? Perhaps he can contact me on an alternate address, techniche(a)mediaone.net Thanks, Jon

28 years

1
0
0 0

Cleaning a rusty transformer

by CLASSICCMP＠timaxp.trailing-edge.com

>Remember you are working with mains on exposed metalwork (including the >transformer core), so don't do this unless you have experience of such >things. Hasn't every IMSAI owner experienced 120VAC when they touched the traces running to the front panel power switch[*] and got a nasty jolt? :-). I've done it many times, and I'm sure I'll do it again! [*] Yes, I know it's not necessarily a power switch, but it is on all of mine (never had write-protectable RAM). -- Tim Shoppa Email: shoppa(a)trailing-edge.com Trailing Edge Technology Voice: 301-767-5917 7328 Bradley Blvd Fax: 301-767-5927 Bethesda, MD, USA 20817

28 years

1
0
0 0

TOPS Flashcard

by fauradon＠pclink.com

Hi, I am currently trying to set up TOPS between my MAC network and PC network. I have flashcard but apparently am having trouble making the two talk. Is there any way I can test the flashcard and connector adapter to make sure they work? Any pinout and hardware info will be greatly apreciated as well as any tips on that matter. Thak you. Francois ------------------------------------------------------------- Visit the desperately in need of update Sanctuary at: http://www.pclink.com/fauradon

28 years

1
0
0 0

EDSAC on your desk.

by mbg＠world.std.com

>[Too bad emulators don't emulate hardware interfaces...] > >Hmm... ANyone got a decent description of the lights/switches on the >KA-10 frontpanel? I could t Actually, there is a pdp-8/e emulator (from Doug Jones) which creates and X-window through which you can actually toggle things in, watch the lights, etc.... it looks great... Megan Gentry Former RT-11 Developer +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+ | Megan Gentry, EMT/B, PP-ASEL | Internet (work): gentry!zk3.dec.com | | Unix Support Engineering Group | (home): mbg!world.std.com | | Compaq Computer Corporation | addresses need '@' in place of '!' | | 110 Spitbrook Rd. ZK03-2/T43 | URL: http://world.std.com/~mbg/ | | Nashua, NH 03062 | "pdp-11 programmer - some assembler | | (603) 884 1055 | required." - mbg | +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+

28 years

1
0
0 0

Quantum Q540 as a RD52

by mbg＠world.std.com

>Here what happened when I ran ZRQCH0 > >.RUN ZRQCH0 >ZRQCH0.BIN > >DRSSM-G2 >ZRQC-H-0 >RQDX3 Disk Formatter Utility >UNIT IS Formattable Winchester (RDnn) or Floppy (RX33) Drives >RSTRT ADR 145702 > >DR> >So what does it want for input? Don't know if this is a stupid question, >but am asking since I've never actually used XXDP+ and I didn't get any >documentation at all with the Packs, despite the fact that the rest had >related Docs. type 'STA'. It will prompt you for some information which will be pretty intuitive... stuff like the hardware address to use, the unit to format, whether you want bad blocks revectored, etc... Megan Gentry Former RT-11 Developer +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+ | Megan Gentry, EMT/B, PP-ASEL | Internet (work): gentry!zk3.dec.com | | Unix Support Engineering Group | (home): mbg!world.std.com | | Compaq Computer Corporation | addresses need '@' in place of '!' | | 110 Spitbrook Rd. ZK03-2/T43 | URL: http://world.std.com/~mbg/ | | Nashua, NH 03062 | "pdp-11 programmer - some assembler | | (603) 884 1055 | required." - mbg | +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+

28 years

1
0
0 0

Removing mailing label gunk

by WHoagIII＠aol.com

Joe, what is Goo-Gone and where do you get it. Paxton

28 years

5
5
0 0

For Sale/Trade at the VCF - plus want list

by kaikal＠MICROSOFT.com

Here's a PARTIAL list of the stuff I'll have in my booth at the Vintage Computer Festival this weekend, followed by my want list. FOR SALE/TRADE AT VCF: - Apple II (original) systems (2), good cosmetics, neither working, one needs PS, the other TLC - Apple II/Bell & Howell "Black Apple" Disk II floppy drives, drives only (3) - Apple ///, tested working, plus optional ProFile hard disk and Apple /// ProFile controller card - Apple Lisa (Mac XL), nice shape, powers on, needs Sun SCSI card, keyboard has 3 wrong keys - Apple Macintosh 128, beautiful! Correct original mouse, keyboard and Apple-logo power cord - Atari 65XE, memory error on boot - Atari 130XE, tested working, plus floppy drive, cable, power supplies - Atari 800, the original Atari 8-bit, nice shape, tested working, with power supply and Atari BASIC book - Atari ST, untested - Coleco ADAM, tested working, with keyboard & printer - Colecovision classic game system, mint condition, with 2 controllers, power supply, 1 game - Commodore 128D, rare version with separate keyboard/built-in diskette drive, tested working - Commodore Amiga 500, technician's special - Commodore Amiga 1000, the first Amiga, tested working, with 1MB Insider and 256K cartridge - Epson PX-8 Geneva, CP/M notebook PC, tested working, with Multi-Unit 64 and Portable WordStar ROM - Epson PX-8 Geneva, CP/M notebook PC, tested working except some keys, needs cleaning? - IBM PC Convertible 5140, looks great, tested working, with battery - IBM Portable PC 5150, the original IBM PC in a portable case, flawless condition - Sharp PC1500 Pocket Computer with carrying case, printer, manuals, tested working - Sharp PC1500A Pocket Computer with carrying case, printer, manuals, tested working - SoftStrip Reader!!! Read those barcoded programs along the edge of magazine pages! In original box - Sony 15" universal color monitor, accepts Composite, S-Video, Analog RGB, Digital RGB - Timex-Sinclair ZX1000, tested working - TRS-80 Model 100, 32K, tested working, missing battery cover, with Model 100 book - TRS-80 Color Computer 1, tested working - Vectrex vector-graphic stand-alone home video game system, M6800 CPU WANT LIST: - Most anything S-100 bus related, especially but not limited to MITS, IMSAI - Documentation or Sales Literature for classic systems - Altair 6800 - Commodore PET Floppy System - Corvus Concept - Dynalogic Hyperion - Exidy Sorcerer - Heath H8, H11, drives - IBM AT - Ohio Scientific systems - Osborne Vixen - Processor Technology HELIOS - RCA 1802 machines (e.g. COSMAC ELF, VIP) - Rockwell AIM-65 - Sinclair ZX80 - Smoke Signal Broadcasting systems, drives - SWTPC systems, drives - Optical serial paper tape reader - Apple Lisa Office System Diskettes, Unserialized - HP150 DOS - Apricot F-Series DOS - Apple Macintosh Portable Battery And of course, can't fail to mention the Apple I, Apple Lisa I, Mark 8, Scelbi 8H, Sphere, & Xerox Star. See you at VCF!! Kai

28 years

3
2
0 0

Vectrex (RE: For Sale/Trade at the VCF - plus want list)

by kaikal＠MICROSOFT.com

Whoops, yeah, 6809, typo. I actually have another one that I'm keeping, equipped with Sean Kelly's terrific Multicart, a cartridge that has all of the Vectrex titles ever created with an on-screen menu select (http://www.xnet.com/~skelly/). A guy named John Dondzilla is programming NEW games for the Vectrex (http://www.monmouth.com/~pcjohn/) This is only slightly off-topic, since there was actually a plan to market a Vectrex keyboard add-on that would make it a full computer. Kai -----Original Message----- From: Eric Smith [mailto:eric@brouhaha.com] Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 1998 4:10 PM To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers Subject: Re: For Sale/Trade at the VCF - plus want list Kai Kaltenbach <kaikal(a)MICROSOFT.com> wrote: > FOR SALE/TRADE AT VCF: ... > - Vectrex vector-graphic stand-alone home video game system, M6800 CPU MC6809. Neat system. Service manual, schematics, ROM images, and some software source code are all available on the web.

28 years

2
1
0 0

printer socket (Off topic)

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

I'm having a little problem with Linux. I deleted the /dev/printer socket, and don't know how to get it back. I really don't feel like swapping floppies for three hours again, either. Anyone got ideas? ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

28 years

13
25
0 0

Shoe collectors?

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

Think of its as nostalgia. Sure, you couldn't hook up an oscilloscope to a sneaker and get meaningful results, but so what? People collect coins and stamps, too. Another possibility is that these people are using old sneakers to mask their odor :) >> I'm sorry, but sneakers I can not understand. Computers, yes. Beanie >> babies, maybe. Sneakers?? > >Well, it's sneakers and blue jeans, actually. Some rich cultures which >will remain anonymous are obsessed by American clothes. Whatever diddles >your bits, I say. > >-- Doug > > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

28 years

1
0
0 0

Quantum Q540 as a RD52

by mbg＠world.std.com

>However, I just realized, I am trying to make this overly difficult. I'm >wanting to use these drives on PDP-11's which means they need to be >formated on one. So the question I should really be asking is how to get >them formated on a RQDX3 that's in a PDP-11. The reason for trying to >format them on the VS2000 was just to make sure they worked (and for some >reason I was thinking it was a good idea, go figure). Then what you want is the XXDP+ kit, and the ZRQC formatter. >Ah, well at least I know that at least one seems to be good. Megan Gentry Former RT-11 Developer +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+ | Megan Gentry, EMT/B, PP-ASEL | Internet (work): gentry!zk3.dec.com | | Unix Support Engineering Group | (home): mbg!world.std.com | | Compaq Computer Corporation | addresses need '@' in place of '!' | | 110 Spitbrook Rd. ZK03-2/T43 | URL: http://world.std.com/~mbg/ | | Nashua, NH 03062 | "pdp-11 programmer - some assembler | | (603) 884 1055 | required." - mbg | +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+

28 years

3
2
0 0

q-bus finds ...

by emu＠ecubics.com

Hi all, I found some q-bus cards, i couldn't identify. Any help appreciated. excelan exos 203 quad size (network ?) eikonix 22 bit lsi-11 interface 821-141 , (two 50 pin connectors) (tape ?) mercury computer systems, 4 quad size boards. ap3216qb, bm3200qb, xm3200qb, cp3200qb (array processor ?) thanks in advance, emanuel

28 years

1
0
0 0

Sorry, just a router test

by blakeman＠creative-net.net

I normally don't do this but I have suspicions. Thanks for ignoring this message.

28 years

1
0
0 0

Removing mailing label gunk

by jon＠techniche.com

Hi Manney, I frequently buy books that are discounted or second hand. These always have annoying old labels on them that are a pain to remove. And my goal is to save the books cover at the same time (typically these are the glossy style covers that are popular for computer books these days). What I do is remove the majority of the "gunk" either with my fingernail or carefully with a pocket knife and then I use something with a sticky backing to remove the rest. The material with a sticky backing might be the label I just removed or scotch tape or a new label I've peeled off of some junk mail. You take that stickey material and repeatedly (like 50-60 times), stick it on the gunk and then peel it off again. This is incredibly tedious, but it works like a charm. You end up with a perfectly clean surface with no damage done during the cleaning. This may not work for you epson since you may not be able to reach all the places where there is gunk. But give it a try. Jon >An Epson gas eaten several mailing labels over the years (I think at least >_some_ of the labels must be 10 years old!). > >What's good stuff to remove the gunk without melting the plastic? > >Thanks, >manney > >

28 years

3
2
0 0

Stains caused by Cigarette smoke

by allisonp＠world.std.com

< >Reason: < > < >Components, IC's and especially those SMD's and quads are very hard < >to clean to assure reliablity. < > < >Cigerette smoke film are sticky and conductive to some degree! < > While isopropanol is good wash a trip through the dish washer works every time for me. Air dry or a cool oven to get out any trapped water. Did that on a trs80 that was megga nasty once and it came out better than factory. Keyboard and all. Water and detergent is safe for most everything. allison

28 years

4
3
0 0

[Fwd: free PDP-11 in Dallas area]

by jim_willing＠mail.intel.com

A possible rescue in the Dallas, TX area. Contact the original message author for details. -jim

28 years

1
0
0 0

Removing mailing label gunk

by rigdonj＠intellistar.net

At 10:06 PM 9/21/98 -0700, you wrote: >is better than that stuff you get from the hardware store called "Goo-off" >or what not. Also, enough rubbing alcohol will take just about anything >off. Be carefull using isopropyl or rubbing alcohol, I've found it discolors a lot of paints and plastics. I've found that denatured alcohol is safer. Joe

28 years

1
0
0 0

Quantum Q540 as a RD52

by CLASSICCMP＠timaxp.trailing-edge.com

Zane asked: >However, I just realized, I am trying to make this overly difficult. I'm >wanting to use these drives on PDP-11's which means they need to be >formated on one. So the question I should really be asking is how to get >them formated on a RQDX3 that's in a PDP-11. The reason for trying to >format them on the VS2000 was just to make sure they worked (and for some >reason I was thinking it was a good idea, go figure). The VS2000 low-level format will be compatible with the RQDX3. (The VS2000 format isn't compatible with the RQDX1/2, though.) Megan suggested: >Then what you want is the XXDP+ kit, and the ZRQC formatter. The ZRQC?? formatter will do the trick, too, but the VS2000 formatter is far more convenient and robust. I keep a VS2000 around for no other purpose than formatting MFM disks when I have to. Suggesting that someone use ZRQC?? when they have a VS2000 available is like suggesting that they learn how to fly an airplane rather than simply using an airline ticket :-). Zane asked about ZRQC??: >So what does it want for input? Don't know if this is a stupid question, >but am asking since I've never actually used XXDP+ and I didn't get any >documentation at all with the Packs, despite the fact that the rest had >related Docs. I'd go the VS2000 route myself, but if you insist on XXDP+ I can fax you a couple pages out of the MicroPDP technical manuals that will get you started. If you thought the VS2000 prompts were cryptic, you've never seen the ZRQC?? prompts :-). Also, since nobody else has mentioned it, *none* of this stuff is any great secret. A lot of this is very well explained in Terry Kennedy's collection of DECUSERVE conferences, THIRD-PARTY-DISKS.TXT, available by anonymous ftp from ftp.spc.edu. -- Tim Shoppa Email: shoppa(a)trailing-edge.com Trailing Edge Technology Voice: 301-767-5917 7328 Bradley Blvd Fax: 301-767-5927 Bethesda, MD, USA 20817

28 years

1
0
0 0

Strange Q-Bus Board, SCSI?

by healyzh＠ix.netcom.com

I got a bunch of Q-Bus and Unibus boards today, most of which are DEC, and most of which I was able to identify. One really caught my eye that I can't identify however. It's a Quad-Height board with a 50-pin connector on it There is one chip with a Model number on it "UTS25". The board looks to be manufactured by either MTI or MT, not sure which. The one EPROM says "MTI-U/B A3.4". It has a Z80B CPU from SGS, and a Zilog Z0853606PSC chip. However the chip that really caught my eye was a WD33C93-PL. Could this be a fabled SCSI controller? The WD chip is the same as an Amiga 3000's SCSI controller. Zane | Zane H. Healy | UNIX Systems Adminstrator | | healyzh(a)ix.netcom.com (primary) | Linux Enthusiast | | healyzh(a)holonet.net (alternate) | Classic Computer Collector | +----------------------------------+----------------------------+ | Empire of the Petal Throne and Traveller Role Playing, | | and Zane's Computer Museum. | | http://www.dragonfire.net/~healyzh/ |

28 years

5
4
0 0

off topic for nerdware

by allisonp＠world.std.com

< ----- Transcript of session follows ----- < ... while talking to po.laidbak.com.: < >>> MAIL From:<allisonp(a)world.std.com> < <<< 550 Access denied < 554 <nerdware(a)laidbak.com>... Service unavailable It's near impossible to discuss anything of your mailer is misconfigured or broken. Real address? Allison

28 years

1
0
0 0

Shoe collectors?

by WHoagIII＠aol.com

In a message dated 98-09-22 04:56:58 EDT, you write: << I'm appalled at what some collectors collect. >> I suspect that the Shoe collectors would be appalled at what you collect. It is this diversity of people that make the world interesting. I am attracted to the idea of collecting mainframes, my signifigant other is appalled at that attraction. I had a Litton 1251 in my living room when we met 19 years ago. I mention this so we would be on topic for the list. 400K of drum memory, a very interesting machine. Paxton

28 years

1
0
0 0

Shoe collectors?

by WHoagIII＠aol.com

There is a Shoe phone out there in the marketplace, I have seen one. The shoe phone is over 10 years old so It is not too far off topic. The population of collectors is growing by leaps and bounds. The internet revolution is making it much easier to get together and form community. I too am amazed at what collectors collect. Paxton

28 years

2
1
0 0

Warming up an IMSAI P/S

by jimw＠agora.rdrop.com

THrowing in my $0.02 here... At 09:07 PM 9/18/98 -0700, Sam wrote: > >Ok, so I have a 15W bulb in series with the P/S and it lit up. The fan >didn't start blowing until the second time I powered up, but its blowing, >albeit very slowly due to the limited power I assume. When its powered down, give the fan a spin with your finger. It should spin freely. If not, it should be replaced. The older bronze/oilite bearings dried out and would start to stiffen up after a souple of years of operation. >I didn't go the full Tony route because doing so would've required >desoldering the entire transformer which wasn't an attractive prospect. True 'nuff... Unless you got a very early IMSAI with the point-to-point wires PS. >I measured the voltages across a power connector and got 9.4V, +17.56 and >-17.86. A little high but I attribute that to a lack of a load. That is actually pretty much normal. Keeping in mind that the mains on the S-100 bus are unregulated and spec'd (such as it is) at +8 and +/-16VDC to allow for drop under load without falling out of the 'comfort' range for the regulators on the individual boards. >At this point I feel pretty comfortable that the P/S is working pretty >well, which surprised me. I expected a fight (but was hoping for the >results I got). These old machines just refuse to die. The big 'can' caps are a good deal harder to kill than the minis... >I'm going to let it warm up for about an hour before I start plugging in >boards. Never can be too safe. In the case of my PDP-8/i which had not been fired in a known 10+ years, once I had the supplied spun up I ran it in under (auto) lamp loads for a little over 6 hours (frequently checking for ripple with a 'scope) before I started reconnecting logic. But thats just me... B^} So... 'fess up. Is this the 'door prize' IMSAI? -jim --- jimw(a)agora.rdrop.com The Computer Garage - http://www.rdrop.com/~jimw Computer Garage Fax - (503) 646-0174

28 years

9
10
0 0

Quantum Q540 as a RD52

by CLASSICCMP＠timaxp.trailing-edge.com

>Not a silly question in the least. Sort of falls in the "now why didn't I >think of that" catagory! In all cases except 1 DS1 was jumpered, on the >one exception, nothing is jumpered. Set it to DS2, no luck, set it to DS3 >and it works. Thanks! This falls into the category of "my 11/73's line time clock quit working" :-). *Extremely* common problem, extremely simple answer! >Next question, does anyone happen to have the list of correct answers to >give the formating program written down anywhere? Yes, I'm lazy enough not >to want to have to figure that out. Roger Ivie posted the following many, many years ago. It's for the RD51, not the RD52, but it should get you started. One tiny note: Roger didn't figure out the Media ID scheme, but if you look at the source code to my DUSTAT utility (i.e. take a look at: http://sunsite.unc.edu/pub/academic/computer-science/history/pdp-11/rt/dust… ) and look at my comments there about how the media type code is represented. -- Tim Shoppa Email: shoppa(a)trailing-edge.com Trailing Edge Technology Voice: 301-767-5917 7328 Bradley Blvd Fax: 301-767-5927 Bethesda, MD, USA 20817 I've come across the notes I used to format an RD51 (that's a 10MB disk, folks) on a VS2000. When I was done, I was able to mount the disk under VMS. Here's what my notes say: An XBN is a block containing geometry info for the drive. DBNs are the blocks between the XBN and the end of the cylinder; essentially, the first cylinder of the drive is reserved to contain geometry info, but not all of the blocks in the cylinder may be used. DBNs fill out the first cylinder after all the XBNs are filled in. LBNs are blocks containing user data. RBNs are replacement blocks. RCTSIZ appears to be the size of the replacement block table in blocks, but I have a ? after my note on that one. RCTNBR appears to be the number of copies of the RCT on the disk, again I've makred that with a ?. Here were my answers to the questions for the RD51. The RD51 has 305 cylinders and 4 heads. I'm pretty certain the VS2000 and RQDX3 use 17 sectors/track (the RQDX2 used 18 sectors/track; reformatting a disk with an RQDX3 drops its capacity slightly): XBNSIZ: 54 I used 54 because all the info I've seen for other drives used 54. DBNSIZ: 14 A cylinder on the RD51 has 68 blocks. After the 54 XBN blocks are allocated, 14 blocks are left in the cylinder. LBNSIZ: 20000 I just winged this one. You should be able to twiddle this up or down by playing with the replacement blocks. RBNSIZ: 168 I think I picked this because that's what an RD52 uses, but I don't remember. SURPUN: 4 The RD51 has four heads. CYLPUN: 305 The RD51 has 305 cylinders. WRTPRC: 305 I don't remember where write precomp is supposed to be turned on for the RD51, so I turned it off for the whole drive. This should be the cylinder number where write precomp starts. RCTSIZ: 4 Again, taken from the RD52 RCTNBR: 8 Again, taken from the RD52 SECITL: 1 Sectors should be number 1 through 17 instead of 0 through 16. STSSKW: 2 Head-to-head skew in sectors. The RD52 also uses 2. CTCSKW: 14 Cylinder-to-cylinder skew in sectors. I don't remember why I picked 14; some experimentation should let you figure out what to use here. MEDIAI: 627327027 I'm pretty sure I looked in the source listings to see what the driver was expecting for an RD51. Short of doing that, I don't know what else to do here. I don't know if this number is really critical for antyhing; the driver should use the XBNs to get the geometry information instead of depending on the media ID to look it up.

28 years

2
1
0 0

DECmates up for grabs - contact original poster

by mbg＠world.std.com

>Xref: world comp.sys.dec.micro:8719 >Path: world!nntprelay.mathworks.com!news-peer.gip.net!news.gsl.net!gip.net!portc01.blue.aol.com!audrey01.news.aol.com!not-for-mail >From: whoagiii(a)aol.com (WHoagIII) >Newsgroups: comp.sys.dec.micro >Subject: Re: Looking for WPS-Plus DOS and DECmates >Lines: 9 >NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com >X-Admin: news(a)aol.com >Date: 21 Sep 1998 18:15:47 GMT >Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com >References: <6tbn9i$8gt8$1(a)newssvr04-int.news.prodigy.com> >Message-ID: <19980921141547.20548.00002820(a)ng119.aol.com> I have several decmate IIs and IIIs that are going to be scrapped. I would be happy to sell one or all. $20 each plus shipping. I have 4 or 5 IIIs and a couple of IIs I think. I am in Portland, Oregon Thnks, Paxton Hoag whoagiii(a)aol.com WhoagIII(a)aol.com

28 years

1
0
0 0

Shoe collectors?

by dastar＠ncal.verio.com

You people thought you were weird. Would you believe there's an article in the Wall Street Journal today about people who collect (and pay outrageous eBay sums for)--get this---old sneakers? A pair of some Nike something-or-others sold for $2,300 on ebay, and some fetch up to $5,000. And we thought all the money was in Altairs. I'm sorry, but sneakers I can not understand. Computers, yes. Beanie babies, maybe. Sneakers?? Sam Alternate e-mail: dastar(a)siconic.com ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Ever onward. September 26 & 27...Vintage Computer Festival 2.0 See http://www.vintage.org/vcf for details! [Last web site update: 09/21/98]

28 years

4
3
0 0

Shoe collectors?

by roblwill＠usaor.net

Hey, You never know when you'll be put up against the forces of CHAOS, Max. :-) -- -Jason (roblwill(a)usaor.net) ICQ#-1730318 ---------- > From: CLASSICCMP(a)timaxp.trailing-edge.com > To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> > Subject: RE: Shoe collectors? > Date: Monday, September 21, 1998 11:02 PM > > You know what I always wanted? A shoe phone. And with today's technology, > it'd be easy to do. (I'd have to learn some about shoe repair, but I > wouldn't mind.) Put that together with my cone of silence, and... > > -- > Tim Shoppa Email: shoppa(a)trailing-edge.com > Trailing Edge Technology Voice: 301-767-5917 > 7328 Bradley Blvd Fax: 301-767-5927 > Bethesda, MD, USA 20817

28 years

1
0
0 0

Shoe collectors?

by CLASSICCMP＠timaxp.trailing-edge.com

>You people thought you were weird. Would you believe there's an article >in the Wall Street Journal today about people who collect (and pay >outrageous eBay sums for)--get this---old sneakers? You know what I always wanted? A shoe phone. And with today's technology, it'd be easy to do. (I'd have to learn some about shoe repair, but I wouldn't mind.) Put that together with my cone of silence, and... -- Tim Shoppa Email: shoppa(a)trailing-edge.com Trailing Edge Technology Voice: 301-767-5917 7328 Bradley Blvd Fax: 301-767-5927 Bethesda, MD, USA 20817

28 years

2
1
0 0

Tandy 600 questions

by tomowad＠earthlink.net

I purchased a Tandy 600 at the York Hamfest on Sunday. The unit doesn't seem to work - the screen fills up with garbage (just alternating pixels, about 75% black). Anybody know what could cause this? I'm trying to take the unit apart so I can look at it, but its not opening up very easily. Are there screws under the four rubber feet on the bottom? They're in so good I'd have to tear them apart to get them out, which I hate to do unless I know there are actually screws under it. Thanks. Tom Owad -- Sysop of Caesarville Online Client software at: <http://home.earthlink.net/~tomowad/>

28 years

2
1
0 0

Tandy 600 questions

by roblwill＠usaor.net

Don't take apart. The only time you should have to do this is when you need to replace the battery pack. Here's what you should do: Perform a cold start. Before you perform a cold start, be sure the RAM Memory switch on the bottom of the computer is ON. Then, briefly press the [BKSP], [ALT], [LABEL], and [POWER] keys at the same time. Release the [POWER] key first, then the others. All data files stored in memory are erased, and the System Manager screen appears. If this doesn't work, turn off the RAM switch, and try everything again after a minute. Just remember to turn the RAM switch back on before you do. GooD LucK, -- -Jason (roblwill(a)usaor.net) ICQ#-1730318 ---------- > From: Tom Owad <tomowad(a)earthlink.net> > To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> > Subject: Tandy 600 questions > Date: Monday, September 21, 1998 9:06 PM > > I purchased a Tandy 600 at the York Hamfest on Sunday. The unit doesn't > seem to work - the screen fills up with garbage (just alternating pixels, > about 75% black). Anybody know what could cause this? > > I'm trying to take the unit apart so I can look at it, but its not > opening up very easily. Are there screws under the four rubber feet on > the bottom? They're in so good I'd have to tear them apart to get them > out, which I hate to do unless I know there are actually screws under it. > > Thanks. > > Tom Owad > > -- > Sysop of Caesarville Online > Client software at: <http://home.earthlink.net/~tomowad/> >

28 years

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Quantum Q540 as a RD52

by CLASSICCMP＠timaxp.trailing-edge.com

>VSfmt_RES_ERR #2 > 84 FAIL > >It does this for each of the drives. The drives "sound good" for what it's >worth. Is there some special trick to getting a Q540 to act like a RD52 Really silly question: what have you set the drive select jumper to on the Q540's? Generally on VAXen you have to set the DS to the third position (DS3 if it starts at one, DS2 if it starts at zero.) -- Tim Shoppa Email: shoppa(a)trailing-edge.com Trailing Edge Technology Voice: 301-767-5917 7328 Bradley Blvd Fax: 301-767-5927 Bethesda, MD, USA 20817

28 years

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Linux on S/370? Was: Re: printer socket (Off topic)

by Marty＠itgonline.com

How many DeForest double wing audions did Chris drop? Did they bounce or shatter? Marty ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: Re: Linux on S/370? Was: Re: printer socket (Off topic) Author: classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu at internet Date: 9/21/98 11:16 AM > Less S/370s out there? I would think, since they are more recent vintage, > there would be more. Any reason why? I'll keep my eyes peeled for you though. I think is simply the prestige of the S/360s. After all, they are probably the single most influential computer family of the 1960s. The S/370s just do not have the same magic in their name. > Yeah, even my beige box 9370 is boring as heck to look at :-( (It's a CMOS > version of the S/370 from 1987/88.) No interesting front panels, can't > tinker with hardware much at all, etc. Pah! Even the last of the machines tagged "System/370" started to lose their panels. By the time the 3033 and 4331 came out (mid to late 1970s), the panels were gone. IBM used the same cabinets until recently switching over to the black and red (very sharp looking) S/390s. S/370 panels are amazing. Unlike the S/360 panels, they are black with all sorts of color coding, and liberal use of the hexadecimal knobs for setting the registers. I would like to find a picture of any old S/370 on the Web, but I have not come accross one yet. > Christian Fandt, Electronic/Electrical Historian Lets give Chris a big hand for being an Auction helper at the Antique Wireless Association meet in Rochester, NY just a few weeks ago. He did not drop too many things. William Donzelli william(a)ans.net ------ Message Header Follows ------ Received: from lists2.u.washington.edu by smtp.itgonline.com (PostalUnion/SMTP(tm) v2.1.9i(b5) for Windows NT(tm)) id AA-1998Sep21.111603.1767.64703; Mon, 21 Sep 1998 11:16:04 -0400 Received: from host (lists.u.washington.edu [140.142.56.13]) by lists2.u.washington.edu (8.8.4+UW97.07/8.8.4+UW98.06) with SMTP id IAA21788; Mon, 21 Sep 1998 08:14:03 -0700 Received: from mxu1.u.washington.edu (mxu1.u.washington.edu [140.142.32.8]) by lists.u.washington.edu (8.8.4+UW97.07/8.8.4+UW98.06) with ESMTP id IAA20766 for <classiccmp(a)lists.u.washington.edu>; Mon, 21 Sep 1998 08:13:53 -0700 Received: from il1.nyp.ans.net (il1.nyp.ans.net [147.225.190.5]) by mxu1.u.washington.edu (8.8.4+UW97.07/8.8.4+UW98.06) with SMTP id IAA29679 for <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu>; Mon, 21 Sep 1998 08:13:52 -0700 Received: by il1.nyp.ans.net id LAA05654 (InterLock SMTP Gateway 3.0 for classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu); Mon, 21 Sep 1998 11:13:50 -0400 Received: by il1.nyp.ans.net (Internal Mail Agent-1); Mon, 21 Sep 1998 11:13:50 -0400 Message-Id: <Pine.GSO.3.96.980921110102.13855C-100000(a)titan.purch.ans.net> Date: Mon, 21 Sep 1998 11:13:50 -0400 (EDT) Reply-To: classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu Sender: CLASSICCMP-owner(a)u.washington.edu Precedence: bulk From: William Donzelli <william(a)ans.net> To: "Discussion re-collecting of classic computers" <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> Subject: Re: Linux on S/370? Was: Re: printer socket (Off topic) In-Reply-To: <199809211438.OAA21109(a)cyber2.servtech.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> X-Listprocessor-Version: 8.1 beta -- ListProcessor(tm) by CREN

28 years

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EDSAC on your desk.

by H.Davies＠latrobe.edu.au

At 07:21 PM 21-09-98 -0500, Doug Yowza wrote: >Excellent idea! That's part of the reason to choose Java :-) Sun's Java >compiler is written in Java, and generates code for the Java virtual >machine. Most of the Java runtime environment is also written in Java, >except for the machine-level glue which is written in a combo of C and >assembler. I guess the only difference is that BCPL is significantly smaller and simpler. I doubt that I could move Java to a new environment within a week, whereas I'd be confident that anyone with some simple programming skills could move BCPL, even with the limited documentation that exists. Huw Davies | e-mail: Huw.Davies(a)latrobe.edu.au Information Technology Services | Phone: +61 3 9479 1550 Fax: +61 3 9479 1999 La Trobe University | "If God had wanted soccer played in the Melbourne Australia 3083 | air, the sky would be painted green"

28 years

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x86 junk, AT/370 boards, etc. (was Re: printer socket (Off topic))

by allisonp＠world.std.com

<The AS/400 for example, is a non-micro. The problem, I guess, is that < when the computer market got a life of its own and was no longer < paid for by the government, PHBs didn't see the beauty of an 8-opcode ????? the government did make a few interesting machines but the bulk of them from Univac on were the result of private industry trying to make the better mouse trap. having played with a minuteman missle computer (you could get them surplus in the early '70s). I can say they are interesting for their day and hard as hell to program usefully as they were not innovative. < machine that had been developed for 10 years. And as long as computers < are commercial, we'll see much less of this 'interesting' stuff. < Maybe if Transmeta comes out with something, it will be interesting There are a lot of intresting machine of very current design that while not part of the converstation here as classics the cpus are none the less interesting even though they are neither PC or pc. Allison

28 years

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Quantum Q540 as a RD52

by allisonp＠world.std.com

<It does this for each of the drives. The drives "sound good" for what i < worth. Is there some special trick to getting a Q540 to act like a RD52 < does the VS2000 have a dislike for RD52's, or (my personal suspicion) i < the drive simply dead. ok, Quantum DQ540s are RD52... no difference, as I have RD52s and guess what they also say on the outside. Also the QD540 is about as reliable a drive as you can find. VS2000 likes the following: 20mb Seagate St225 40mb Seagate ST251 31mb Quantum QD540 71mb Micropolus 1325 159mb Maxtor 2190 series Now if the drive is incorrectly jumpered it will not work. If it's been formatted on say a PC the format mode of the VS2000 may not work as expected. Meaning you have to fill in the values manually. Allison

28 years

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x86 junk, AT/370 boards, etc. (was Re: printer socket (Off topic))

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

I'm sure that the problem is that earlier, you had a different concept of interesting machines. I don't think minis and workstations were ever very common at hamfests, compared to common micros. I don't think PCs are bringing an end to classic computing; sooner or later, all PDPs and VAXen and IMSAIs will be in the hands of collectors. In the meantime, some interesting machines are still being made. The AS/400 for example, is a non-micro. The problem, I guess, is that when the computer market got a life of its own and was no longer paid for by the government, PHBs didn't see the beauty of an 8-opcode machine that had been developed for 10 years. And as long as computers are commercial, we'll see much less of this 'interesting' stuff. Maybe if Transmeta comes out with something, it will be interesting 10 years from the release. Then again, it might be another WinChip... >upon pile of motherboards, I/O cards, VGA cards, etc on sale. And very >few 'interesting' machines. > Did Compaq document their machines well? > >Actually, I do tend to buy genuine IBM cards, especially if they're >described in the TechRefs. A lot of them did 'set the standard' for what >followed, and although poorly designed certainly have a place in the >history of computing. > >[AT/370] > >> Too bad no technical docs were ever available, it would be fun to port >> Linux to them. > >YEs, I've never managed to trace a TechRef for them, alas... > >> > >-tony > > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

28 years

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printer socket (Off topic)

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

Well, if someone doesn't want to run a microsoft OS, does that mean they don't want any version of DOS because they think DOS sucks? CP/M doesn't suck any more or any less, IMHO. Maybe a bit more >< various UNIXoids. I'd rather run DOS in that particular case. > >You neglect CP/M-86 and CCPM. Also MINIX (unix like) and a few other more >obscure OSs. > >Allison > > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

28 years

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Quantum Q540 as a RD52

by healyzh＠ix.netcom.com

I picked up 5 Quantum Q540's yesterday in the hope of being able to get some usable diskspace for one of my PDP-11's. These are the same as a RD52 >from what I've been able to find out. I stick one of the drives in my VS2000 and try to format it with the following results: >>> T 70 KA410-A RDRXfmt VSfmt_QUE_unitno (0-2) ? 0 VSfmt_STS_Siz .?? VSfmt_RES_ERR #2 84 FAIL It does this for each of the drives. The drives "sound good" for what it's worth. Is there some special trick to getting a Q540 to act like a RD52, does the VS2000 have a dislike for RD52's, or (my personal suspicion) is the drive simply dead. Zane | Zane H. Healy | UNIX Systems Adminstrator | | healyzh(a)ix.netcom.com (primary) | Linux Enthusiast | | healyzh(a)holonet.net (alternate) | Classic Computer Collector | +----------------------------------+----------------------------+ | Empire of the Petal Throne and Traveller Role Playing, | | and Zane's Computer Museum. | | http://www.dragonfire.net/~healyzh/ |

28 years

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EDSAC on your desk.

by CLASSICCMP＠timaxp.trailing-edge.com

Someone wrote: >> Java is the closest thing we've got today to an architecture-neutral >> executable environment. Except for the fact that it pretty much requires that IEEE floating point be used. Yes, Virginia, there are lots of machines out there that don't do IEEE math! And there are many good reasons to *not* use IEEE floating point. William Donzelli pointed out: > C is well established, Java is not. True, but C itself if far from portable. The endless maze of #ifdef's that are necessary to make a piece of source code portable among a limited set of machines and OS's are fine and dandy unless you have to support all those different permutations! > People keep worrying about what the > different companies will do to extend or change Java. When Java gets to be > a truely standard, then I might say OK. Part of the problem is that folks are already using Java in ways that are not portable. It's almost as bad as those web pages that come up and *insist* that you change your graphics mode to 640x480 or some other particular size - why do folks insist on starting with a nice general information-based document standard and then turn it into a nonportable one???!!! At least, in my experience, any page that insists on being viewed at some particular resolution inevitably has absolutely zero information content, so I don't want to view it anyway. -- Tim Shoppa Email: shoppa(a)trailing-edge.com Trailing Edge Technology Voice: 301-767-5917 7328 Bradley Blvd Fax: 301-767-5927 Bethesda, MD, USA 20817

28 years

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printer socket (Off topic)

by allisonp＠world.std.com

< Well, I don't know of any OS that runs on an XT besides DOS and < various UNIXoids. I'd rather run DOS in that particular case. You neglect CP/M-86 and CCPM. Also MINIX (unix like) and a few other more obscure OSs. Allison

28 years

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"bblish" Altair fails to sell on eBay AGAIN

by WHoagIII＠aol.com

If you read his text he has a reserve of $6000. Pax

28 years

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"bblish" Altair fails to sell on eBay AGAIN

by kaikal＠MICROSOFT.com

This is at LEAST the third time he's listed that Altair 8800 on eBay, and it failed to sell AGAIN, this time topping out at a "mere" $2225. Has anybody exchanged email with him? What the hell is this guy doing? Kai

28 years

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printer socket (Off topic)

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

Well, I don't know of any OS that runs on an XT besides DOS and various UNIXoids. I'd rather run DOS in that particular case. >were running MS-DOS when I worked there back in 90-91. Possibly >not the best way to run the gear (is MS-DOS _ever_ the best way to >run the gear?) but functional. Don't recall any '486 NGENs -- I >was working with the Unisys 6000 series mostly, didn't actually >_use_ any NGENs myself, but did use several old (left over from the >AT&T contract) Unix PCs as my consoles for the machines I was doing >software QA on. The '486 was fairly new at the time, I'd been given >to understand that NGEN was a dead series then -- pretty machines >that they were. >-- >Ward Griffiths <mailto:gram@cnct.com> <http://www.cnct.com/home/gram/> > >When I was crossing the border into Canada, they asked me if I had any >firearms with me. I said "Well, what do you need?" -- Steven Wright > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

28 years

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x86 junk, AT/370 boards, etc. (was Re: printer socket (Off topic))

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

Well, I feel the same way about Apples. I mean, I find Apple IIs as boring as any PC XT. And both are quite common. I sometimes find various PC clone models interesting, but not very. But about these 370 cards, am I to understand they're normal PCs that can also act like 370s? >You're right! I should have paid more attention to the NAQ list. >I guess there's simply no refuge from x86 PCs; they invade every newsgroup >and mailing list. Not to mention surplus stores; it's getting very hard >to find anything interesting because the places are completely overrun >with PC crap. As if anyone really wants huge piles of off-brand EGA cards >(or any EGA cards), ARCnet cards, etc. Sigh. > >The only halfway interesting PC-based hardware I've ever found surplus are >the XT/370 and AT/370 board sets, and I've never gotten the software for >them. If anyone wants them, though, I think Timeline is still advertising >them. Be forewarned, however, that they are mapped to the 512K-640K >memory address range, so they won't work unless you have a motherboard that >can be configured to NOT provide memory in that range. > >These boards contained three processors, a custom-microcoded 68000 variant >to implement the core 370 instruction set, a standard 68000 to implement >the instructions that wouldn't fit in the microcode of the first one, and >a custom version of the 8087 hacked to do IBM radix-16 floating point >instead of IEEE. > >Too bad no technical docs were ever available, it would be fun to port >Linux to them. > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

28 years

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printer socket (Off topic)

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

ELKS worked more or less last time I checked it. I think Minix is a lot better for the purpose, though. I've seen several attempts at UNIX for the Commodore, but never tried them. are they anything like UNIX, or just demo UNIX look-alikes? (The difference is that when you type ls on one, it executes assembly or C code, and when you do it on the other, it has a bit of code: 300 IF A$ = "ls" THEN LOAD "$",8,1 ) >On this list, "classic" means 10 years old or older, for the most part. >The 386 already qualifies. However, there is a project (stalled?) to get >Linux running on some older 8-bitters: > http://www.linux.org.uk/ELKS-Home/index.html > >-- Doug > > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

28 years

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Linux on S/370? Was: Re: printer socket (Off topic)

by cfandt＠servtech.com

At 01:16 21-09-98 -0400, you wrote: >> Anybody know where I can get an IBM 360/30? > >No. And I would _seriously_ drive across the country to get any S/360 or >370. Maybe even for an S/3 or S/7. Can't agree more with you on that William! > >> It would be fun to port Linux >> to that, although the lack of paging would be a bit of a problem. One of >> the cool things about the 360/30 is that you can alter the microcode using >> a standard keypuch machine. > >A real problem, I would say. The Model 30s were just about the runts of >the family, and could only have 8 to 64 K of storage. > >I would think that putting Linux on an S/370 would be just a bit easier, >but still cool enough to matter (circa 1974!). But I think there are less >S/370s out there than S/360s (I know of _one_ S/370, and it belongs to >IBM. S/360s, at least, number more than 10, probably). Less S/370s out there? I would think, since they are more recent vintage, there would be more. Any reason why? I'll keep my eyes peeled for you though. > >And by S/370, I mean _real_ S/370, with the cool panels. Not the beige >boxes IBM made in late 1970s, dropping the S/370 name. Yeah, even my beige box 9370 is boring as heck to look at :-( (It's a CMOS version of the S/370 from 1987/88.) No interesting front panels, can't tinker with hardware much at all, etc. Pah! Later this winter, William, I'll be trying to get the bugs worked out of that thing as to IPL failures. I still have to move it over from the old house to its new home in a nicely remodeled basement workarea. It'll set beside the PDP-11 racks I still need to haul outta the garage before winter. All this stuff is _heavy_. Oh, my sore back! Anyway, O Honorable Listmembers, stand by for a request from me for VSE OS documentation of any sort and perhaps some IPL troubleshooting. --Chris -- -- Christian Fandt, Electronic/Electrical Historian Jamestown, NY USA Member of Antique Wireless Association URL: http://www.ggw.org/freenet/a/awa/

28 years

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EDSAC on your desk.

by CLASSICCMP＠timaxp.trailing-edge.com

Dominique Cormann wrote: >William Donzelli <william(a)ans.net> wrote: >> > BASIC RULES! >> >> What are the BASIC rules? >Did they ever create a standard version of Basic like there is for C >(ansi c)? Yes, there are at least two ANSI standards, and one maybe-never-quite- adopted ANSI working committee standard: ANSI X3.60-1978, _American National Standard for the Programming Language Minimal Basic_. This is a *very* minimal basic, lacking things like strings and files. ANSI X3J2 working committee BASIC. AFAIK this was never officially adopted as an ANSI standard, despite the fact that the committee must've worked on it for over a decade. In _BYTE_ 1982:6 p182, you'll find Thomas Kurtz (yes, *the* Kurtz of Dartmouth) describing the draft standard as it then existed, and he actually sold a working version of this called "True BASIC". It does things in very different ways from just about every other BASIC (the string syntax is entirely different, looking more like Fortran-77 style character-addressable strings, and the math is actually *decimal* math!) ANSI X3.113-1987 "Full BASIC". I believe this to be the standard that the X3J2 committee eventually settled on. Penware's NKR BASIC claims to be an implementation of this standard, though I've never actually seen it in use. Bywater BASIC (by Ted Campbell, and often implemented on Unix-type machines by the executable "bwbasic") claims to be a superset of X3.60-1978 and a subset of X3.113-1987. It's available under the terms of the Gnu Public License. -- Tim Shoppa Email: shoppa(a)trailing-edge.com Trailing Edge Technology Voice: 301-767-5917 7328 Bradley Blvd Fax: 301-767-5927 Bethesda, MD, USA 20817

28 years

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Help with Lisa 2 vertical hold

by kaikal＠MICROSOFT.com

Does anybody know how to adjust the vertical hold on a Lisa 2? thanks Kai

28 years

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EDSAC on your desk.

by allisonp＠world.std.com

< As a software geek, C is quite portable, as long as you keep several < things in mind, like shorts are at least 16 bits, longs are at least 32 < bits, ints are at least 16 bits and can't be longer than a long, and don < use functions not defined in the Standard C library (or stuff you've < written). Those things are or should be a given for any language. The problem in all cases is when you talk to hardware, soon as you do that portability is likely broken. This has always been true and until hardware is reduced to one uniform platform (gag!). That is unlikely. < > It's almost as bad as those web pages that come up < > and *insist* that you change your graphics mode to 640x480 or < > some other particular size - why do folks insist on starting with a < > nice general information-based document standard and then turn it int < > a nonportable one???!!! See hardware and portability. Allison

28 years

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Kids these days

by jfoust＠threedee.com

At 09:32 PM 9/18/98 -0500, you wrote: > >I thought of doing two of those, put wheels on the steppers, use two to >push it around in various directions, mount a pair plastic replicas of >table-saw blades on the drive motors Sounds like my friends who build robots for the Bay area "robot wars" competitions. They do incorporate truly deadly weapons in their remote-control 'bots, including spinning saw blades. - John

28 years

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wierd stuff/spam

by jim＠calico.litterbox.com

Gang, some jerk is trying to use my site as a spam relay. If you get ANYTHING coming from litterbox.com that looks like a sex add please let me know and accept my humble apology. We've found where the attack is coming from and have sent e-mail to their hostmaster. -- Jim Strickland jim(a)calico.litterbox.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Vote Meadocrat! Bill and Opus in 2000 - Who ELSE is there? -----------------------------------------------------------------------

28 years

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removal help

by info＠annalee.com

Please sent me information about how to be removed for this list serve. Thank you.

28 years

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Chuck Peddle?

by jfoust＠threedee.com

At 05:01 PM 9/19/98 -0700, Sam wrote: > >Rumor has it that Chuck Peddle of 6502 and Commodore PET fame will be >found walking the halls of VCF 2.0. So you found him? Who won your contest for the VCF lifetime pass? - John

28 years

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CLASSICCMP digest 539

by mtapley＠swri.edu

All, Another announcement of possibly useful stuff on comp.sys.dec.micro. Contact him not me and I can't vouch for him. - Mark vvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvv Path: Supernews70!SupernewsNP!Supernews73!supernews.com!news.maxwell.syr.edu!cpk-news- hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!firehose.mindspring.com!not-for-mail From: fonzo(a)mindspring.com (Don Dalfonzo) Newsgroups: comp.sys.dec.micro Subject: manuals Date: Sat, 19 Sep 1998 03:17:33 GMT Organization: MindSpring Enterprises Lines: 7 Message-ID: <360321ef.696121(a)news.mindspring.com> Reply-To: fonzo(a)mindspring.com NNTP-Posting-Host: user-38lc6s9.dialup.mindspring.com X-Server-Date: 19 Sep 1998 03:13:42 GMT X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.1/32.230 Xref: Supernews70 comp.sys.dec.micro:9088 Anyone interested in unused(shrinkwrapped) ultrix manuals - 4.6 I believe.. let me know before I dump them... also some uniplex manuals. Complete set of both ..... Don or email fonzo(a)mindspring.com ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

28 years

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EDSAC on your desk.

by Bob.Withers＠MCI.com

True Basic is the name of the version of the language published by Professor's Kemeny and Kurtz, the inventors of the language. As far as I know the Basic language has not been standardized by ANSI, ISO, or any other standards organization. Can you provide more information? Bob > On 21 Sep 98, at 9:55, Dominique Cormann wrote: > > > Did they ever create a standard version of Basic like there is for C > > (ansi c)? > > Yes, there is an ANSI BASIC standard. There is a version out for > the PC (and the Mac I believe) called True BASIC which is ANSI > standard. I'm sure there were others too. > > > ----- > David Williams - Computer Packrat > dlw(a)trailingedge.com > http://www.trailingedge.com

28 years

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Help: IBM 5170

by Marty＠itgonline.com

I believe you can download the 80286 (AT) setup program from IBM's web site. Last year I downloaded the POS setup diskette for the PS/2 60. Marty ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: Re: Help: IBM 5170 Author: classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu at internet Date: 9/19/98 8:13 PM > > Recently I bought 2 IBM 5170's (PC/AT) for 6 bucks. I bought these > machines to add to my collection. Both of them say this when I boot up: > "162 - System Options Not Set - (Run SETUP)" That normally means that something has changed since the CMOS RAM was configured. > Both of them have a 512k System board. One only shows 256K of memory > during memory test and the other one shows 512K but has a parity error. Which version of the system board do you have? The older one has 36 RAM chips, each one being a 128K*1 device (actually made from 2 DIPs soldered together). The later one has 18 256K*1 bit devices on it. I have schematics, etc for both boards. The partiy error sounds like a RAM chip failing. Try reseating them, and if it's the later version, try replacing the RAMs one at a time with known-good ones. 256K*1 DRAMs are pretty easy to get, and the ones on the system board are socketed. > Is there any dip switches on the motherboard, and is SETUP a software There are 2 switch-things on the system board (unless you count the little 8-pin DIP postion behind the expansion slots that can be used to fiddle with the ROM addressing). One is a slide switch next to the power connector. In one position the board is set up for an MDA display. The other way for a CGA one. I can't remember which is which, but if you get it wrong, all that happens is that it fails the POST and beeps. Flip the switch and try again. The other is a jumper (J18) to the left of the speaker connector at the front). This selects between 256K and 512K for RAM on the system board. Check this is set the same way on both your boards. > program? Yes, SETUP is the program used to load the parameters into the CMOS RAM. Unlike most modern PCs, this is not in ROM, but has to be loaded from disk. There's a free clone (with source, I think) on Simtel somewhere. If the parameters have got scrambled, then about the only thing it can boot from is a 5.25" drive as A: -tony ------ Message Header Follows ------ Received: from lists2.u.washington.edu by smtp.itgonline.com (PostalUnion/SMTP(tm) v2.1.9i(b5) for Windows NT(tm)) id AA-1998Sep19.201355.1767.64448; Sat, 19 Sep 1998 20:13:56 -0400 Received: from host (lists.u.washington.edu [140.142.56.13]) by lists2.u.washington.edu (8.8.4+UW97.07/8.8.4+UW98.06) with SMTP id RAA09277; Sat, 19 Sep 1998 17:11:47 -0700 Received: from mxu3.u.washington.edu (mxu3.u.washington.edu [140.142.33.7]) by lists.u.washington.edu (8.8.4+UW97.07/8.8.4+UW98.06) with ESMTP id RAA38476 for <classiccmp(a)lists.u.washington.edu>; Sat, 19 Sep 1998 17:11:43 -0700 Received: from post.mail.demon.net (post-20.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.27]) by mxu3.u.washington.edu (8.8.4+UW97.07/8.8.4+UW98.06) with ESMTP id RAA19737 for <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu>; Sat, 19 Sep 1998 17:11:42 -0700 Received: from [158.152.97.199] (helo=p850ug1) by post.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.03 #1) id 0zKX6I-0004Rb-00 for classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu; Sun, 20 Sep 1998 00:11:39 +0000 Received: by p850ug1 id <m0zKWvk-000IyMC@p850ug1> (Debian /\oo/\ Smail3.1.29.1 #29.33); Sun, 20 Sep 98 01:00 BST Message-Id: <m0zKWvk-000IyMC@p850ug1> Date: Sun, 20 Sep 1998 01:00:40 +0100 (BST) Reply-To: classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu Sender: CLASSICCMP-owner(a)u.washington.edu Precedence: bulk From: ard(a)p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) To: "Discussion re-collecting of classic computers" <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> Subject: Re: Help: IBM 5170 In-Reply-To: <36043755.4B34(a)bright.net> from "oajones" at Sep 19, 98 06:59:33 pm Content-Type: text X-Listprocessor-Version: 8.1 beta -- ListProcessor(tm) by CREN

28 years

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printer socket (Off topic)

by allisonp＠world.std.com

> classic -- please give us examples of '86 boxen that _can't_ run an > MS OS. And tell us how those are more "classic" than an XT. Many of the 8088/8086 and x86 powered s100 crate were not native MSdos. Many of them were CPM or Turbodos. Allison

28 years

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Need docs for Dynabyte 16K Static RAM (S-100)

by dastar＠ncal.verio.com

Anyone have the docs for the Dynabyte 16K Static RAM handy? I need to know what each switch in the configuration blocks are for. I might be able to figure it out from the system I have set up but it'd be nice to know exactly what they all do. Sam Alternate e-mail: dastar(a)siconic.com ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Ever onward. September 26 & 27...Vintage Computer Festival 2.0 See http://www.vintage.org/vcf for details! [Last web site update: 09/12/98]

28 years

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uVAX II sleeping...

by jpl15＠netcom.com

sleeeping.....sleeeping... sleeping in a Jar (the Jar is under the bed) [sorry... had a Zappa flashback just then. Please disregard.] Ahem. Encouraged by the success of my more recent uVAX resurrection, I this evening powered up another one I have had for some time. It doesn't do much. So I have some questions re: uVAX autism. First off.. am I making a semantic error? The exact wording on the badgeplate of the 'good' machine reads 'VAXSTATION II/RC' and the dead one reads just 'VAXSTATION II'... all this time I have been refering to them as 'MicroVaxes'. Dumb? Irrelevant? Crucial? The VMS manual that I have (Thank you Bruce L. !!) seems to correspond with the sofware as extant on GoodMachine. DeadMachine is configured (externally) just the same as GM, ie. all the switches and controls are at the same settings. I am using a Decwriter III as the console, to have hardcopy. Upon power-up, the LED display on the back shows 'A'. The fixed disk, a Micropolis RD53-A, spins up and coasts down continuously. Cycling 'HALT' on the front panel causes the usual 'break' monitor printout and the pc state. The LED displays '8' and that's it... I have let it go for 10 minutes.... I have checked the power supply voltages.. all nominal. I have power-cycled the unit a few times.. same behavior. I have re-seated the CPU and MEM cards.. no change. In the absense of the System User Guides / Operating Manual / Processor Handbooks.. I am stuck here. I remember a thread on the disk drive's spin up/down routine, but I forgot the cause. I will gladly pay for some more docs for these machines.. any spare MicroVax Orange Notebooks out there?? Thanks in advance for any Info... Cheers John

28 years

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Kids these days

by roblwill＠usaor.net

> Can I recomend that you grab the parallel port FAQ off the web. Those > printer ports are really 12 output lines and 4 input lines each. You can > do all sorts of neat stuff with those. Like _directly_ control the > stepper motors (or use some simple stepper control ICs). Hook up > switches/sensors. You can do that from BASIC, but I think you have to be > running MS-DOS and not Windows (cetainly not 95 or NT), since that tends > to get in the way of direct port access. > That's not a problem. I'm using a Tandy 1000TX running DOS 3.2, and GW-BASIC 3.11 > Using the electronics from the printer, faking it so it thinks it's still > connected to a printer, and the using the motors seems a rather complex > way to do it, actually. Maybe. I'm just trying to get something to work, first, then I'll improve it and make it easier to use after it works. -- -Jason (roblwill(a)usaor.net) ICQ#-1730318

28 years

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OOOpps, sorry!

by jpl15＠netcom.com

Yup. Can't read my own scrawly handwriting. EDSAC Simulator: www.dcs.warwick.ac.uk/~edsac Possible Bart Simpson blackboard punishment writing: I will not post screwed-up URLs I will not post screwed-up URLs I will not post screwed-up URLs I will not....... Again... my apologies to those who got treated to error messages when all they wanted was some antique Fun. Sheeeshhhh!! John

28 years

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Windows 3.0 on 8088?

by mbg＠world.std.com

Oh, that is a problem... the system does not have a hard disk... so much for that idea... Megan

28 years

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Hewlett Packard 9835B

by apulo＠joyce.eng.yale.eduop

We picked one up at the MIT flea today. Anyone know much about it? It seems to be working. Tony

28 years

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Windows 3.0 on 8088?

by allisonp＠world.std.com

< That means I could run it on my IBM PC Convertible. Is this true? < < Megan Yes it would. You do need a hard disk as the install kit is some 5 disks. plus dos. Allison

28 years

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new interesting addition

by allisonp＠world.std.com

> since im known at work as a packrat of old computer junk, someone gave > something called a microsoft <!> mach 20. turns out it's a full length > card that has a 286-8 and 2 meg and high density floppy controller on I also have a card something like that. INBOARD386PC (I have it box and all!), it goes in a XT class machine and gives you a 386sx/16 with 1mb ram. I use it in a leading edge model D to make a nice fast sorta turbo-xt. I've run win3.1 on it but with 1mb of ram it's real pokey and some apps can't eb run. It's limitation is that the board only has 1mb of ram. I'm on the lookout for a matching memory card. There were two different piggyback memory cards 2mb and 4mb. also anyone have a slow (16mhz) 387math co processor (PGA package)? Allison

28 years

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To Tony Dellett

by rigdonj＠intellistar.net

Tony, Send me your REAL address and I'll send the info that I promised. Joe At 06:23 PM 9/20/98 -0400, you wrote: >This Message was undeliverable due to the following reason: > >Your message was not delivered because the DNS records for the >destination computer could not be found. Carefully check that >the address was spelled correctly, and try sending it again if >there were any mistakes. > >It is also possible that a network problem caused this situation, >so if you are sure the address is correct you might want to try to >send it again. If the problem continues, contact your friendly >system administrator. > > Host joyce.eng.yale.eduop not found > >The following recipients did not receive this message: > > <apulo(a)joyce.eng.yale.eduop> > >Please reply to Postmaster(a)star1.intellistar.net >if you feel this message to be in error. >Received: from lizard ([206.105.68.165]) by star1.intellistar.net > (Post.Office MTA v3.1 release PO203a ID# 0-41809U2500L250S0) > with SMTP id AAF29927 for <apulo(a)joyce.eng.yale.eduop>; > Sun, 20 Sep 1998 18:23:37 -0400 >Message-Id: <3.0.1.16.19980920182409.39d700ae(a)intellistar.net> >X-Sender: rigdonj(a)intellistar.net >X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.1 (16) >Date: Sun, 20 Sep 1998 18:24:09 >To: Tony Dellett <apulo(a)joyce.eng.yale.eduop> >From: Joe <rigdonj(a)intellistar.net> >Subject: Re: Hewlett Packard 9835B >In-Reply-To: <36053879.A58B1548(a)joyce.eng.yale.eduop> >Mime-Version: 1.0 >Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > >Tony, > >

28 years

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Kids these days

by allisonp＠world.std.com

< Tony Duell wrote: < > As somebody else pointed out, you're not going to be running < > Windows on an 8088 < < Are you certain? I thought I saw Windows 1.0 run on XTs? < < Not that anyone in their right mind would have wanted to run Windows 1.0 < but that's an entirely different issue. I have a copy of win3.0 that runs just fine (ok slow) on 8088s. Allison

28 years

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Micro jumper blocks

by rhblake＠bbtel.com

Wasn't it Manney that was looking for micro (not mini) jumper blocks for a HD a while back? He never got back with me on that or the IEE488 card and I haven't seen any posts from him of late. I have some if he wnats them, just drop me a note by reg. email. ___________________________________________________ Russ Blakeman, aka "Pooter Fixer" Email: rhblake(a)bbtel.com or rhblake(a)bigfoot.com Website: http://members.xoom.com/pooterfixer/ ___________________________________________________

28 years

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Does Bill Gates know how to program?

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

I believe his last program was in 1986 for a Tandy machine. He's been strictly buisness after that >I've got a question I've been meaning to ask for a long time. Does Bill >Gates know how to program? If my memory serves me correct he knew how to >progam in BASIC back in the late 70's, his buddy Paul Allen knew machine >language. >-- >Computing since 1982, VIC-20, CoCo, PC, CP/M >Amateur Radio since 1971, WN8JEF, KA6EXR, N8BGR, AA4ZI >http://www.bright.net/~oajones >Rev. O. Alan Jones > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

28 years

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New? Find

by franke＠sbs.de

>>> Woha. Dont open. At least that what's I would do >>> (especialy since my Apple /// was stolen 2 weeks ago :(). >>> Try to get a second one. > Who stole your Apple ///? Who ? I guess some bad guys. > And under what circumstances?? They opened the basement dor on the backside of the house, and worked their way up into the computer rooms. >> To late, already openned it. I never really had any intention of >> leaving it wrapped. I bought it that way because I knew everything >> would be there and I wanted to use it in my Apple ///. BTW, sorry >> to hear about your Apple ///. Hope they didn't get anything else. >> That has always worried me. Anyone breaking in wouldn't know >> what this stuff really was and would think they just found >> something that would get them thousands at the pawn shop. > Well, if your Altair was stolen and the pawn shop owner hung out on the > computer sections of eBay, then it might actually be worth thousands at > the pawn shop :) Its exacte wat I think hapened - the APPLE /// (no plus!) was the most prominent device on the big table. I think he was the only thing close to a PC in their eyes (An APPLE // 'tower' with two Profile Harddisks, Monitor /// and an external Disk /// drive). I think it will be sold on some kind of fleamarket. They also destroyed some stuff, opened two originaly packed Atari 400, trashed an Enterprise. They also took a prototype BTX telephone unit an various small stuff - including almost all of my C64 and VC20 cartridges. Also one of the PETs is gone (an ordinary 4016) and, thats the funiest thing, the CRT of a Sirus - only the CRT the computer and the stand is still available. I'm very happy that they didn't know what was laying in front of them - they took none of the KIMs or the other ols single boarders, non of the real devices like SWTP or Heatkit. My problem is that I should monitor now all major flea markts, but I'm leaving for the VCF this saturday :( Gruss H. -- Ich denke, also bin ich, also gut HRK

28 years

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Does Bill Gates know how to program?

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

Hmmm...a BROTHER running GEOS, by any chance? > >> Doug Yowza wrote: >> > >> > On Sat, 19 Sep 1998, Ward Donald Griffiths III wrote: >> > >> > > That is what has been reported. There used to be a link to an >> > > interview with Gates on the subject, but a fresh look through my >> > > various Model 100 bookmarks fails to turn it up, though I read it >> > > not much over a year ago. >> > >> > http://innovate.si.edu/history/gates/gates35.htm >> > >> > -- Doug > >This machine is one of my favorites (Model 100), in fact I use it quite >often..Very Cool the fact it runs on 4 AA batteries, and at that for many >hours.. >It has no need for storage, it holds it all in its own memory. I have >several applications >I use it for that I wrote in basic. >That was an interesting article, to know that Bill Gates had a major hand in > >writing the code for this machine.. The Radio Shack Model 100 is defiantly a >very cool >machine.. >BTW: I was at Service Merchandise the other day and they had a similar >machine running >a GUI based software (Not Windows SE) , but it had the same concept as the >Model 100, >but with a GUI, No floppy drive, just memory storage, and a serial plug to >Up load the data.. >It was not a pocket type, but a lap top size computer. Priced at $299.00 >(Very Cheap).. >Price was so inexpensive bacause of no Hard Drive or Floppy, >No Color either but very good VGA type monochrome graphs and text.. >A great machine for simple applications like WP and spreadsheets >--Phil > > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

28 years

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CP/M definition

by CLASSICCMP＠timaxp.trailing-edge.com

>I think trying to decide on a canonical definition of what >CP/M stands for is futile -- since DR were themeselves inconsistent over >time. Even the name of the company changed over time. Don't forget Digital Research Intergalactic! Tim.

28 years

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Books for DEC-heads

by allisonp＠world.std.com

< They won't last more than 20 years, sorry :) Depends. The older ones may not, the later one are on far better paper though still not low acid. That change started in the early 80s. My introduction to programming 1972 is still doing well considering the newsprint it's on. < Seriously, all the DEC processor and programming paperbacks I've come < accross are printed on highly acidic paper, almost newsprint quality. < They can be de-acidified, if it's not too late. Check by gently None the less if it's a thing your serious about preserving then proceed. Allison

28 years

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Transformer

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

I looked in Radio Shack, at some step-down transformers for 'traveling abroad'. There is a price range, with some 'for heating appliances only' (the cheapest) and the higher priced ones allow motors, and the $34 ones allow electronic devices. What is the difference among these units? Also, could a transformer such as in these theoretically be reversed and used for step-up purposes? ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

28 years

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Kids these days

by roblwill＠usaor.net

> I'm not talking about me. I'm talking about the fun the nerdy kids these > days could be having if they discovered classic computers. > Hey - I'm one of 'em. I've got an old drafting table in my basement covered (and full of) obsolete (286 and older) computer stuff. It's also scattered various places in my house. > Actually, there is one kid I've been talking to in e-mail (although he's > 19 now so "kid" may not be appropriate anymore). He built some sort of > digital logic contraption with relays out of an old elevator controller! > It sounds wild. He said it can do actual useful work, such as image > processing. I don't know the total details, but I'm trying to get him to > exhibit it at the Vintage Computer Festival. He said its very large and > would be a burden to move, but I'm trying to figure out a way to help him > get it to the venue. That sort of project should inspire many people > around his age to embark on similar projects of their own. > I'm only 15... I had a few plans for a few things, but the only problem is that I need to find an EPROM programmer and some old chips. Any idea where to get one - cheap?? ThAnX, -- -Jason (roblwill(a)usaor.net) ICQ#-1730318

28 years

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Re.: Does Bill Gates know how to program?

by rcini＠email.msn.com

On Sat, 19 Sep 1998 12:56:06 PDT, "Max Eskin" <maxeskin(a)hotmail.com> wrote: >>I believe his last program was in 1986 for a Tandy machine. He's been >>strictly buisness after that. Didn't Gates work on the BASIC on the Model 100? At the risk of a flame war...I think that Gates walks a razor-thin line between really aggressive and monopolistic. No question, he and Microsoft are successful, through a combination of luck, brass balls, and the paranoid fear of being technologically overtaken by another technology company. I also think that a portion of Microsoft's problems today can be attributed to sour grapes by some of the competition, fueled by books and articles in recent years which showcase Gates' incredible wealth and Microsoft's amazing success. Now, back to our regularly-scheduled program... The earliest programming example comes from "Gates" by Stephen Manes and Paul Andrews. Gates and Allen worked on an 8080 emulator on Aiken Lab's (Harvard) PDP10s during the winter '75 break. The Altair Basic command set was lifted from DEC's RSTS-11 Basic-Plus, which Gates considered elegant. The simulator code was dated 2/9/75. "Programmers at Work" by Susan Lammers quotes Gates as saying that there wasn't a program at Microsoft (at the time; the book is (c) 1986, 1989) in which he was not involved. Microsoft's Basic interpreter products are attributed to Gates, as is the work on the Model 100. At the time, Microsoft had 160 programmers, and Gates was intimately involved in the code review process, noting that there wasn't a piece of code which he didn't read. Rich Cini/WUGNET - ClubWin!/CW7 - MCP Windows 95/Windows Networking - Collector of "classic" computers <========= reply separator ==========>

28 years

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Re.: CP/M Definition

by rcini＠email.msn.com

Contrtol Program for Microcomputers according to Digital Research ads in early Byte magazines. >>This is from the CP/M FAQ: >>Q3: Does CP/M stand for anything? >>A: (Don Kirkpatrick) {snip} Rich Cini/WUGNET - ClubWin!/CW7 - MCP Windows 95/Windows Networking - Collector of "classic" computers <========= reply separator ==========>

28 years

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CP/M definition

by pete＠dunnington.u-net.com

On Sep 20, 6:19, Ward Donald Griffiths III wrote: Pete Turnbull wrote: > > The first line on page 1 of my CP/M 2.2 manual says "CP/M? is a > > monitor/control program ..." > > It is indeed a monitor/control program. That does not mean that that > is what the initials stand for. In the same way I can say that WG is > a weird geek. (Actually, it's other people who usually say that -- I > just don't actively [or actually] disagree with them). Sure, but the point I was making was simply that it's referred to differently in different places. For example, other CP/M documentation refers to it as "a control program for microprocessors" -- but the 2.2 docs don't (AFAICS). I think trying to decide on a canonical definition of what CP/M stands for is futile -- since DR were themeselves inconsistent over time. Much the same thing happens in lots of other places, and it's not unusual for someone to pick a name simply because it has multiple meanings or interpretations. I think it's significant that early DR docs don't explicitly say what the acronym stands for (or even that it's an acronym). -- Pete Peter Turnbull Dept. of Computer Science University of York

28 years

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CP/M definition

by pete＠dunnington.u-net.com

On Sep 19, 19:03, Ward Donald Griffiths III wrote: > Subject: Re: CP/M definition > Sam Ismail wrote: > > > > This is from the CP/M FAQ: > > > > Q3: Does CP/M stand for anything? > > > > A: (Don Kirkpatrick) > > > > There are at least three popular answers - Control Program for > > Microcomputers, Control Program for Microprocessors, and Control > > Program/Monitor. The issue is clouded by authors of popular CP/M > > books giving different answers. According to Gary Kildall (the > > author of CP/M), in response to a direct question on the PBS show > > "The Computer Chronicles" following Computer Bowl I, the answer is: > > Control Program for Microcomputers. This is also consistent with > > DRI documentation. See, for example, p. 4 of the DRI TEX manual. > > > > If this is true then someone is lying (perhaps even Kildall himself). > > "Control Program for Microcomputers" is what I recall from magazine > articles in the 70s and it's what's used in my CP/M 3.0 manuals. The first line on page 1 of my CP/M 2.2 manual says "CP/M? is a monitor/control program ..." -- Pete Peter Turnbull Dept. of Computer Science University of York

28 years

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NeXT tidbits (hijacking a NeXT Computer properly / other tidbits)

by thomas100＠home.com

Hi, You can blow away the netinfo database if you like... tho' it's somewhat crude. There's a simple way to hijack a NeXT computer from the console.

28 years

3
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NeXT tidbits [Printing]

by thomas100＠home.com

Hi, I've never figured out how to hook into a printer on another system [FROM NeXTStep/Rhapsody] which is annoying. It's easy if you're in the same location as netinfo handles everything for you... but I haven't been able to get one NeXT machine speaking remotely to another NeXT machine's laser printer without netinfo at long distances. I had better luck getting Windows networking and printing to work with my NeXT machine tho'. I expose my printer to my login account and can print from any Windows machine on the Internet to my NeXT machine once I login. Using Samba, you can have both Windows Networking and can configure your NeXT machine to look like a Postscript Laserprinter which is just _dandy_ for printing quick output from Win95 when you're away from home. Thomas

28 years

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CP/M-86 / MSDOS / DRDOS / GEM / Windows

by jeff.kaneko＠juno.com

On Sat, 19 Sep 1998 22:13:47 -0600 (CST) Scott Walde <scott(a)saskatoon.com> writes: >On Fri, 18 Sep 1998, Albert J. McCann, Jr. wrote: > >> > >client was a stand-alone GEOS app. I know there were stand-alone >Win >> > >apps, but I can't remember any names. >> >> > The only one I've ever seen was the game "Balance of Power". >> > It's Windows 1.x >> >> Micrografx Designer was another. It ran a stand alone 2.x Windows. > >When I started selling computers in 1990, we had Aldus Pagemaker (v?) >on >the shelf. It included run-time windows v2.x. As did Samna's Ami (before it became 'PRO'). I still think Ami 1.0 is the best windoze wordprocessor ever written: SImple, but powerful and easy to use. It won't run under 3.1 though (sigh). > >Did this practice stop with Windows v3.0? Everything anyone has >mentioned >here was v1 or v2. > >ttyl >srw > > > _____________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]

28 years

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