- test-drb@ccmp.vtda.org - classiccmp.org

by Philip.Belben＠pgen.com

>> Runs AIX, based on the Power2 Processor (a PPC varient, or maybe it came >> out before the PPC). > > Very similar, but the PowerPC has much of the good floating point > hardware stripped out. Power2 has very good floating point performance - > probably the best of any microprocessor ever made until very recently. I'll second that. Not too long ago we were looking for a replacement for our RS/6000 models 320 and 375. The only RS/6000 of a sesible size and price with comparable floating point performance was the model 397. Why? It still used a Power2SC processor. All the more modern ones use PPC and it slows, er, shows! (we bought Sun in the end. With luck I'll get the 375 or both 320s. I don't think I'll get all 3 machines :-( ) Philip

25 years, 10 months

1
0
0 0

Sun 3/60

by ethan_dicks＠yahoo.com

--- LordTyran <a2k(a)one.net> wrote: > You burned your own ROMs? What for? > According to one of the Sun 3/60 pages, different ROMs were installed in various units, depending on what the bootstrap needs were (boot from tape, CD, with framebuffer, without, etc.). I don't have that information handy, but since I was assembling a 3/60 from several parts (CPU, external shoebox with 150Mb SCSI tape, 200Mb SCSI disk, no CD), I wanted to make sure that the ROMs I had would work with my configuration. Starting an intact 3/60 is not that complicated. I'm essentially building one from scratch. -ethan _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com

25 years, 10 months

1
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chips

by edick＠idcomm.com

There have, in recent years come to be other manufacturers offering the PALCE version of the popular LATTICE GAL's. Cypress is, indeed, among them. As for the feedback, if you use pins 1 or 11 as something other than CLOCK or /OE, as they were used in the 16-series PALs, then the input path from them preempted the feedback from these end macrocells. I wouldn't remember that, except that PALASM slapped my wrist for it a couple of times early in my experience with them, so, like the dog who once pee'd on the electric fence, I remember that. There are other little "gotchas" with the various versions of these parts. Dick -----Original Message----- From: Pete Turnbull <pete(a)dunnington.u-net.com> To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> Date: Tuesday, June 29, 1999 12:52 AM Subject: Re: chips >On Jun 28, 17:41, Richard Erlacher wrote: >> Subject: Re: chips >> SInce these are electrically eraseable it's of no consequence what the >> previous program was. These parts can be viewed as a relplacement for >the >> entire 16xN series where x=L or R and N ranges from 4 to 8. They can >> effectively emulate/replace 16L8, 16R4, 16R6 and 16R8 with a few >exceptions. >> The macrocells associated with pins 19 and 12 have no feedback path of >their >> own, i.e. it must be via the adjacent macrocell. The data book (these >are >> AMD/Vantis parts) for the Lattice GAL parts will explain it adequately if >> you can't lay hands on an AMD databook. > >They're not necessarily AMD; they could be Cypress parts, or one of a few >other manufacturers. Unfortunately, not all use the same erase or >programming algorithms (Lattice, National Semiconductor, and SGS Thomson > use one algorithm; AMD, Texas, Cypress, Altera and ICT use others). > >Why do you say that pins 12 and 19 have no feedback path of their own? > They do in my data sheets... > >-- > >Pete Peter Turnbull > Dept. of Computer Science > University of York

25 years, 10 months

1
0
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VAX-BI (was Re: Local bus schedule)

by ethan_dicks＠yahoo.com

--- blstuart(a)bellsouth.net wrote: > In message <199906271535.AA28999(a)world.std.com>, Allison J Parent writes: > >BI is open but, was designed for high speed and multiple processesors. > >The bus requires a chipset to communucate over it and while it was supposed > >ot be widely available it was never widely adopted. > > It was open? I could swear I remember a really big stink in > the DEC press when the BI was introduced. Of course, this > wouldn't be the first time bit-rot affected my historical > claims. It was licensed. I worked for a "third-party vendor" back in those days. We were denied a license in 1984 when we first applied (when it would have done some good) and were granted one in 1989, long after the VAX-BI was relevant. We sold a handful of boards, only part of our prototype batch (compared with hundreds of Q-bus boards and a couple thousand UNIBUS boards). Because DEC never really opened up the licensing program until later (unless you made a board that they didn't care about, then it was easy), the market never really took off for them. Once the VAX-4000 line came out, it was easier and cheaper to buy a couple of 4000's to replace aging 11/7xx and other mid-range VAXen than it was to jump up to a 6xxx or 8700/88xx. We had more UNIBUS->Q-bus upgrade sales than anything->VAXBI. I still have most of that first run of board. If I ever have far too much time on my hands, I'll write some new code for it - 68010 @ 10Mhz, Z8530 SIO, 2Mb RAM, 64kb ROM, DMA interface, timer. I suppose I could turn it into an intellegent PPP interface or make it do Localtalk (with a change in line drivers) -ethan _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com

25 years, 10 months

1
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IBM 5100 sought

by Anthony.Eros＠COMPAQ.com

<< Apologies if this was posted twice... >> Gang - I know they're highly sought-after, but I'd really love to snag an APL-capable IBM 5100 and thought I'd throw the question open... There's something about those systems I always liked (even though I didn't use one more than a couple of times in high school.) Is there any chance that I might be able to tempt one of you elusive 5100 owners with some combination of the following? > DEC PDP-8/L > Teletype ASR-33 Apple Macintosh Portable (with case) > NeXTstation Turbo Color (minus monitor and sound box) > HP 85 with a variety of ROM drawers > HP 9825A with 8" floppy drive > There'd be some shipping issues, but I'd even be open to parting with an IBM 1130 (missing keyboard, power supply and drum disk.) Any interest? > -- Tony Eros Mid-Atlantic Computer History Museum

25 years, 10 months

1
0
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Local bus schedule

by allisonp＠world.std.com

<KIM bus - used on the KIM believe it or not also the SYM-1! <The book also includes a few x to S-100 translator designs. KIM to s100 would be useful. <VAX BI - hmm, that nomenclature doesn't look right, but you may < remember this move by DEC to use a non-open bus design BI is open but, was designed for high speed and multiple processesors. The bus requires a chipset to communucate over it and while it was supposed ot be widely available it was never widely adopted. There was also CI (cluster interconnect) for multiple vaxen and storage. Allison

25 years, 10 months

3
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Seeking a ZX80

by Mark.Ambrose＠RebusGroup.Com

I am looking for a Sinclair ZX80, any condition, even spares or repair... Mark

25 years, 10 months

1
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FW: Vintage computers

by jrkeys＠concentric.net

anyone on the list interested in this equipment ? contact the seller direct. -----Original Message----- From: Eric Stechmann [mailto:estechmann@abivest.com] Sent: Monday, June 28, 1999 7:29 AM To: John R. Keys Jr. Cc: estechmann(a)abivest.com Subject: Re: Vintage computers John, Well, here's a list put together last night. Some of these are in a storage unit and I didn't get over there to take inventory. As a result, the list might be incomplete, but should give you an idea: 1 - Amiga 500: w/ 'Insider' (1 MB) add-on. Hard disk & color monitor. Books and software. 2 - Atari 512(?): 1 w/ Hard disk, ext. floppy, 2 or 3 monitors (1 color, as I recall). Books and software. 3 - Zenith(/Heathkit?) Z-89: These machines can run CP/M or MSDOS. Each has both an Intel 8085 and an 8088, I believe. Two are "lowboys" with dual floppies and detached monitors. The other is an "all-in-one" with a hard disk and a floppy. The monitors are monochrome. They came from a business, and have appropriate software (I don't remember just what and it's packed away) Books and software. 1 - Zenith(/Heathkit) Z-19(?): This is an "all-in-one" Z-80 CP/M machine. It has an external dual floppy drive and an external 8-inch floppy. Books and software. 1 - Zenith laptop: This needs a battery. I think this is an 8088 system. It has a hard drive and 3.5" floppy. A couple of Epson printers. Assorted spare and salvaged parts for the various machines. Is there anything of interest to you or others? Eric -- Eric Stechmann Direct: +1 (651) 234-1217 Software Critter Fax: +1 (651) 490-1484 American Biosystems, Inc. E-mail: estechmann(a)abivest.com 20 Yorkton Court URL: www.abivest.com St.Paul MN 55117 The program said "Requires Windows 9* or better" so I bought a Macintosh.

25 years, 10 months

1
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Other list???

by Glenatacme＠aol.com

In a message dated 6/28/99 11:57:18 AM Eastern Daylight Time, Philip.Belben(a)powertech.co.uk writes: > Greetings everyone on both lists: Will some kind denizen of this listserv please enlighten me concerning the other list? Am I missing half the fun??? TIA Glen Goodwin 0/0

25 years, 10 months

2
1
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chips

by pete＠dunnington.u-net.com

On Jun 28, 17:41, Richard Erlacher wrote: > Subject: Re: chips > SInce these are electrically eraseable it's of no consequence what the > previous program was. These parts can be viewed as a relplacement for the > entire 16xN series where x=L or R and N ranges from 4 to 8. They can > effectively emulate/replace 16L8, 16R4, 16R6 and 16R8 with a few exceptions. > The macrocells associated with pins 19 and 12 have no feedback path of their > own, i.e. it must be via the adjacent macrocell. The data book (these are > AMD/Vantis parts) for the Lattice GAL parts will explain it adequately if > you can't lay hands on an AMD databook. They're not necessarily AMD; they could be Cypress parts, or one of a few other manufacturers. Unfortunately, not all use the same erase or programming algorithms (Lattice, National Semiconductor, and SGS Thomson use one algorithm; AMD, Texas, Cypress, Altera and ICT use others). Why do you say that pins 12 and 19 have no feedback path of their own? They do in my data sheets... -- Pete Peter Turnbull Dept. of Computer Science University of York

25 years, 10 months

1
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VCF Announcement

by dastar＠ncal.verio.com

Note: some of the links referenced are broken at present...under construction and all that. Parallax Inc. and Dr. Dobb's Journal proudly present... The Vintage Computer Festival 3.0 October 2nd & 3rd Santa Clara Convention Center Santa Clara, California www.vintage.org For the third year in a row, the Vintage Computer Festival is back to thrill and amaze you with the history of one of the greatest inventions in all of mankind, the computer! This year: * More great speakers! * More great exhibits! * More great vendors with Cool Stuff to sell! * More fun games and contests, including the Nerd Trivia Challenge! * Tour The Computer Museum History Center! * And of course, FREE STUFF!! In short, plenty of stuff to indulge all your SENSES: HEAR the speakers! SEE vintage computers! TOUCH them too! SMELL their electronics! But please don't TASTE them! "The mission of the Vintage Computer Festival is to promote the preservation of 'obsolete' computers by allowing attendees to experience the people, stories and technologies that embody the remarkable tale of the computer revolution." Register Early and $AVE! Register by June 30 and pay only $15 per person (or $20 per person by September 15). That includes access to the entire event all weekend, including the speakers, the exhibit and the flea market. Kids 17 and under are admitted free, and as always, parking is free too! To pre-register, send a check or money order to: Vintage Computer Festival 4275 Rosewood Drive #29-161 Pleasanton, California 94588 Or visit the VCF website for more information and a handy registration form ready to print (http://www.vintage.org/vcf/register.htm). The Speakers Horst Zuse Horst, the eldest son of early digital computer pioneer Konrad Zuse, will be giving a lecture on his late father's machines and will focus on the computer businesses that Konrad later founded to market his ideas. Jon Titus Who can forget one of the earliest of kit microcomputers, the Mark-8? Jon designed the Mark-8 around Intel's 8008 microprocessor and wrote a construction article which appeared in the July 1974 issue of Radio Electronics. Todd Fischer Todd bought the assets of IMSAI after their bankruptcy and continued to manufacture and sell IMSAI products under the Fischer-Frietas Corporation. Todd consulted with MGM for the movie _War Games_ and, as a treat, will be bringing along for show and tell the actual IMSAI 8080 computer that co-starred in the film. Stan Veit Stan is an early chronicler of the microcomputer revolution, and also a participant. Stan started one of America's first computer stores in New York, and in the process forged relationships with some of today's revered pioneers, including Steve Jobs and Steve Wozniak, whom he shared a booth with at the first West Coast Computer Faire where the Apple ][ was debuted to the world. Jim Willing Our admired and beloved VCF Celebrity, Jim will wax philosophic on various themes of stupendous relevance. Eugene Kim Eugene is a writer for Dr. Dobb's Journal (a VCF sponsor!) and will be giving a lecture on the history of free software, a very relevant topic considering the free-software movement is in full force in today's computing arena as evidenced by the escalating adoption of GNU/Linux. Curt Vendel Curt is the founder of the Atari Historical Society (check out his great website at http://www.atari-history.com) and has amassed an amazing collection of Atari artifacts and company history, including some one-of-a-kind Atari prototypes. Curt will be bringing along some of these prototypes for show and tell. Roger Sinasohn Roger is an avid collector of early portable computers and will be giving a talk on the history of the Kyocera 85, a.k.a. the Tandy Model 100, a.k.a. the Olivetti M10, a.k.a. the NEC PC-8201A. Doug Salot Doug's research has uncovered what he believes to be the first "personal computer". Forget the Apple ][, the Altair or even the Alto. Doug's pick as first PC goes all the way back to the 1950's. Designed by Edmund Berkeley, an unsung hero of computer history, Doug intends to win Berkeley the prominance and praise that he feels is much deserved by this virtually unknown computer visionary. Plus! Workshops by Parallax on their amazing little BASIC Stamp. Get a preview of this cool little device by visiting their website at http://www.parallaxinc.com. More speakers to be announced soon! Check the VCF website for updates. The Vintage Computer Faire and Exhibition This year, the Vintage Computer Festival exhibit will feature the exhibits of individual collectors, all vying to win first, second or third place in eleven categories, plus the coveted "Best of Show" award. The winner of the "Best of Show" ribbon will also win fabulous prizes. This year, we want YOU to exhibit the pride of your collection. What better way to demonstrate your enthusiasm for your hobby than to be an exhibitor at the Vintage Computer Festival. Exhibitor information can be found on the Vintage Computer Festival website (http://www.vintage.org/vcf/exhibit.htm). The Vintage Computer Flea Market Every year the best deals on vintage computer items can be found at the Vintage Computer Flea Market. Here are only a few of the amazing items sold at last year's flea market: * Apple 1 (no, we're NOT kidding!) * SWTPc 6800 * A rare computer by "the digital group" * Morrow Decision 1 (S-100) * California Computer Systems (S-100) * Apple Lisa 2 * And much, much more!! If you've got old computer stuff that you'd like to sell, there's no better place than the Vintage Computer Flea Market at the Vintage Computer Festival. Please visit our website for rates and regulations (http://www.vintage.org/vcf/vendor.htm). The Nerd Trivia Challenge! Hey trivia fans! Think you got what it takes to survive the Nerd Trivia Challenge? If you qualify, you'll be pitted against two other players in a battle to determine who is the undisputed master of computer history trivia. Answer the most questions correctly and you could walk away with $50 in cash plus some other nifty prizes. Lightweights need not apply, this contest is geared towards the serious computer history enthusiast. For contest rules please visit http://www.vintage.org/vcf/ntc.htm. Tour The Computer Museum History Center! The Computer Museum History Center boasts the largest collection of historic computer artifacts in the world. Their collection includes rare, one-of-a-kind computers and artifacts that date back to the early part of the century and beyond. A tour of the History Center's "Visible Storage" warehouse will be organized on Sunday, October 3. Tickets are limited and so advanced registration is recommended. FYI: The History Center is on the move, and is thrilled to announce plans to build a permanent museum to be dedicated by 2007. You can help the History Center achieve its goal by becoming a member. Information about becoming a member of the History Center can be found at http://www.computer-history.org. Meet Fellow Computer Collectors! The VCF is the premier gathering for collectors of vintage computers. What better way to enjoy your hobby than by meeting other like-minded individuals to share stories and information about your computer collection. Register now! http://www.vintage.org/vcf/register.htm Visit our Sponsors! Without our sponsors, the Vintage Computer Festival could not be a reality. It is our wonderful sponsors that enabled us to bring you the Vintage Computer Festival year after year. Demonstrate your appreciation by visiting them on the web: Parallax, Inc. http://www.parallaxinc.com Parallax manufactures the BASIC Stamp, a versatile microcontroller with a built-in BASIC language that is suitable for most any electronics and computer hobbyist project. Dr. Dobb's Journal http://www.ddj.com Dr. Dobb's Journal is the oldest continually running microcomputer journal, in existence since 1975. It features monthly articles and columns geared towards the computer programming professional. EOF Sellam Alternate e-mail: dastar(a)siconic.com ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Don't rub the lamp if you don't want the genie to come out. Coming this October 2-3: Vintage Computer Festival 3.0! See http://www.vintage.org/vcf for details! [Last web site update: 05/25/99]

25 years, 10 months

2
2
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PC's Limited (1986 on topic)

by bill＠chipware.com

I grabbed, out of a pile of various PC clones being trashed, a PC's Limited Turbo PC whose serial number sticker says it was manufactured in Sept. 1986. Could this be one of the machines actually assembled in Mr. Dells college dorm room? Bill

25 years, 10 months

4
5
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Bliss, $5

by therunk17＠earthlink.net

I'm definately interested in these manuals. The shipping would be to ma zip code 01581 Ron ---------- >From: Mike Ford <mikeford(a)netwiz.net> >To: "Discussion re-collecting of classic computers" <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> >Subject: Bliss, $5 >Date: Mon, Jun 28, 1999, 8:21 AM > > My wife is clearing out some old manuals, first up is a four volume set of > Bliss stuff from DEC. Bliss primer vol 1, 2, and 3, plus some kind of > Digital Bliss reference or something. The whole jolly group, $5 and postage. > > please email me directly, not the whole list. > > > >

25 years, 10 months

2
1
0 0

Bliss, history

by CLASSICCMP＠trailing-edge.com

>The Bliss books lasted less than 3 minutes. Sorry to those who now lack >Bliss, but you missed it. ;) I'd like to point out that the Bliss compilers, and the documentation, are now in the "freely distributable" category. See ftp://ftp.wku.edu/vms/fileserv/ for "bliss-article-ps.zip" and "bliss-intro.zip" for the documentation. Tim.

25 years, 10 months

1
0
0 0

New toy..

by a2k＠one.net

Today a friend of mine gave me a TRS-80 Daisywheel printer.. this sucker is HUGE, really heavy, loud, and fairly fast. I got 5 daisy wheels and 23 ribbons (!!). Some seem to be dried up but begin to print darker and darker the longer they're run.. anybody know how I can rejuvinate (sp??) the cartridges? Thanks, Kevin ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- "It's you isn't it? THE BASTARD OPERATOR FROM HELL!" "In the flesh, on the phone and in your account..." -- BOFH #3

25 years, 10 months

7
11
0 0

chips

by edick＠idcomm.com

SInce these are electrically eraseable it's of no consequence what the previous program was. These parts can be viewed as a relplacement for the entire 16xN series where x=L or R and N ranges from 4 to 8. They can effectively emulate/replace 16L8, 16R4, 16R6 and 16R8 with a few exceptions. The macrocells associated with pins 19 and 12 have no feedback path of their own, i.e. it must be via the adjacent macrocell. The data book (these are AMD/Vantis parts) for the Lattice GAL parts will explain it adequately if you can't lay hands on an AMD databook. Dick -----Original Message----- From: Tony Duell <ard(a)p850ug1.demon.co.uk> To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> Date: Monday, June 28, 1999 5:40 PM Subject: Re: chips >> >> I found some 20 pin DIP chips, 8 chips in a plastic chip tube. I have no >> idea what they are, so i though i'd mention it here. maybe someone can >> use these. >> >> PALCE16V8H-15 >> PC/4 9545ABA L > >They're PALs. The number can be decoded as follows : > >16 - 16 inputs to the 'AND' matrix >V - 'Versatile'. Each output comes from a configurable block that allows >it to be either a normal output or a flip-flop >8 - 8 outputs > >What they are, and if they're useful, depends on whether they've been >programmed, and if so, with what. > >-tony >

25 years, 10 months

1
0
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chips

by lemay＠cs.umn.edu

I found some 20 pin DIP chips, 8 chips in a plastic chip tube. I have no idea what they are, so i though i'd mention it here. maybe someone can use these. PALCE16V8H-15 PC/4 9545ABA L -Lawrence LeMay

25 years, 10 months

2
1
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chips

by edick＠idcomm.com

These parts aren't PAL chips FOR a specific application. They're about 10-year-old electrically eraseable and reprogrammable GAL (generic arraly logic) parts, intended to become lower-cost replacements for the bipolar PALs. In the latter purpose they have been quite successful, in that I seldom even see a bipolar part in boards less than 15 years old. The advantage, of course, is that these have a more flexible architecture and variable macrocell design than the original PALs, say, from MMI, had. Of course there are only a few of them that are asynchronous, and those, typically, are just copies of the 20RA10 in more current technology. Dick -----Original Message----- From: Jay West <jlwest(a)tseinc.com> To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> Date: Monday, June 28, 1999 3:31 PM Subject: Re: chips >I haven't looked up the numbers, but these almost sound like PAL chips for >the Digiboard PC/x boards. There is a 4 port model (PC/4) that is actually a >lobotomized 8 port card. > >Jay West >-----Original Message----- >From: Lawrence LeMay <lemay(a)cs.umn.edu> >To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers ><classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> >Date: Monday, June 28, 1999 4:06 PM >Subject: chips > > >>I found some 20 pin DIP chips, 8 chips in a plastic chip tube. I have no >>idea what they are, so i though i'd mention it here. maybe someone can >>use these. >> >> PALCE16V8H-15 >> PC/4 9545ABA L >> >>-Lawrence LeMay >> >

25 years, 10 months

1
0
0 0

IBM 5100 sought

by Anthony.Eros＠COMPAQ.com

Gang - I know they're highly sought-after, but I'd really love to snag an APL-capable IBM 5100 and thought I'd throw the question open... There's something about those systems I always liked (even though I didn't use one more than a couple of times in high school.) Is there any chance that I might be able to tempt one of you elusive 5100 owners with some combination of the following? > DEC PDP-8/L > Teletype ASR-33 Apple Macintosh Portable (with case) > NeXTstation Turbo Color (minus monitor and sound box) > HP 85 with a variety of ROM drawers > HP 9825A with 8" floppy drive > There'd be some shipping issues, but I'd even be open to parting with an IBM 1130 (missing keyboard, power supply and drum disk.) Any interest? > -- Tony Eros Mid-Atlantic Computer History Museum

25 years, 10 months

1
0
0 0

chips

by jlwest＠tseinc.com

I haven't looked up the numbers, but these almost sound like PAL chips for the Digiboard PC/x boards. There is a 4 port model (PC/4) that is actually a lobotomized 8 port card. Jay West -----Original Message----- From: Lawrence LeMay <lemay(a)cs.umn.edu> To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> Date: Monday, June 28, 1999 4:06 PM Subject: chips >I found some 20 pin DIP chips, 8 chips in a plastic chip tube. I have no >idea what they are, so i though i'd mention it here. maybe someone can >use these. > > PALCE16V8H-15 > PC/4 9545ABA L > >-Lawrence LeMay >

25 years, 10 months

1
0
0 0

Goo on my Teletype print head

by PB14＠leicester.ac.uk

On 24 Jun 99 at 18:52, Tony Duell wrote: > Yes, it is/was. Not sure if it was really rubber, but it was some > flexible material, and it does go sticking after a number of years. The > problem (beyond clogging the type cylinder) is that if the stud on 180540 > that 180502 goes on to is exposed, it will damage the surface of the type > cylinder. > > I wonder if you could cast one using that stuff that classic car > restorers use to make rubber parts [an aside : Anyone know where to get > that in the UK?]. Making the mould would be fairly easy, I think. A well known brand name is Flexane. Try http://www.frost.co.uk/016frost.html (this is an orphaned frame...) or have a look at the classifieds in Practical Classics. Woolies in East Anglia are always very helpful. I also found a spec sheet at http://www.netherlandrubber.com/adhesive/mainrepr/flexspec.html. Phil ************************************************************** Phil Beesley -- Computer Officer -- Distributed Systems Suppport University of Leicester Tel (0)116 252-2231 E-Mail pb14(a)le.ac.uk

25 years, 10 months

2
1
0 0

British Science Museum needs a lesson in history

by dastar＠ncal.verio.com

Here's an interesting announcement from the British Science Museum that might interest some of the folks in the UK (Tony, now you can get a job!) OPERATE THE BABY COMPUTER Would you like to work on the rebuilt 'Baby' computer? This rebuild of the original which ran for the first time on 21 June 1948 is on display in the Futures gallery at the Museum of Science and Industry in Manchester. The Museum needs help to keep the computer in working order and to demonstrate it to visitors. You should have some experience in and knowledge of electronics. An interest in the history of computing would be desirable. You should also be available once during the week for training and, if possible, at the weekends for demonstrations. You will join the Museum's volunteer programme and will receive training on the computer's operation and maintenance, on its background history and on talking about the computer to Museum visitors. The Museum is the only place where you can have this opportunity to work with the first computer. You will be able to learn from the people who rebuilt the computer and benefit from the experience of explaining it to visitors. If you are interested in helping, please contact Jenny Wetton at the Museum, telephone 0161-832-2244, or email: j.wetton(a)msim.org.uk --- What's funny is the state in the second to last paragraph: "The Museum is the only place where you can have this opportunity to work with the first computer." Konrad Zuse might have a problem with this. Sellam Alternate e-mail: dastar(a)siconic.com ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Don't rub the lamp if you don't want the genie to come out. Coming this October 2-3: Vintage Computer Festival 3.0! See http://www.vintage.org/vcf for details! [Last web site update: 04/22/99]

25 years, 10 months

4
5
0 0

BI Bus

by IVIE＠cc.usu.edu

Ack! How could I miss a discussion of the BI bus? I'd better pay a bit more attention when I'm glancing through the subject lines... > It was open for a minimal definition of the word open. > DEC owned the chip set and protocol and would sell you the chip set > if your board was not a competitor to a DEC board. I can vouch for this. The company I used to work for did a couple of VAXBI interface boards: a quad IEEE-488 board and an interface to a custom shared memory. DEC had to be convinced where product was complementary before it gave you the right to buy chips. > A number of outfits purchased the older lowest priced DEC board > available to pull the chips for the BI bus to make disk controllers > and such since DEC wasn't going to let anyone reverse engineer the set > without a major patent fight. There was a memory company that reverse engineered the BI bus, at least enough to build memory cards. Clearpoint, perhaps? I don't recall which. IIRC, they were bought by an I/O company (Emulex, maybe?) primarily to gain access to their reverse-engineered BI chip. > DEC cut it's own throat on this one and the BI bus never took hold. There's also the fact that for the average bus transaction it really wasn't any faster than the UNIBUS. You had to _always_ do octaword transactions to outperform the UNIBUS (at least, the theoretical max of the UNIBUS; and by the time the VAXBI appeared, it was starting to be possible to get the theoretical max out of the UNIBUS. I once did a processor module that did the UNIBUS mapping during the settle(?) (the one that was after the deskew time) time; once that 75ns was up, the processor module knew that the adders had had enough time to map the address and didn't need to add any extra delay for the mapping. The processor module could support a J-11 running full bore while simultaneously outperforming the PDP-11/84 on DMA throughput. And it looked enough like a PDP-11/84 to run RSX-11 out of the box). > who left DEC around the time of the BI bus release... and has NO > proprietary data on 'em. I've still got a couple of copies of the VAXBI manual. Roger Ivie ivie(a)cc.usu.edu

25 years, 10 months

1
0
0 0

PC's Limited (1986 on topic)

by jeff.kaneko＠juno.com

Actually, my understanding was that at least one of the 1st PC's limited machines were unique: 386PC's design using multiple megabytes of *static* memory to keep up with the *blazing* 386-16 then in use.

25 years, 10 months

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Local bus schedule

by ethan_dicks＠yahoo.com

--- James Willing <jimw(a)agora.rdrop.com> wrote: > At 09:25 PM 6/26/99 -0400, Max Eskin wrote: > >Hi, > >I'd like to know about the various famous, complete local bus standards. > >I've heard of: > >ISA > > Posibus and Negibus from the pre-Omnibus PDP-8 series machines... I thought about adding those, but I wasn't sure they qualified as local busses, especially if you have a DW08 bus converter on your machine. -ethan _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com

25 years, 10 months

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Sun 3/60

by ethan_dicks＠yahoo.com

--- Aaron Christopher Finney <af-list(a)lafleur.wfi-inc.com> wrote: > Kevin, > > Do you have an extra type 4/5 keyboard? I have an adapter I could give > you. Ooh! Where can I get one of these? I have this 3/60 that I burned new ROMs for, I have the older SunOS tape images, the 150Mb drive, a spare monitor, an external shoebox (with several older SCSI and ESDI disks), but no keyboard. I started to make an adapter, but got distracted. I've used this machine with a VT220 hung off the console, so I know it mostly works. I've never booted an OS on it, though. -ethan _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com

25 years, 10 months

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Heads up: Vax 3400 for disposal

by Philip.Belben＠powertech.co.uk

Greetings everyone on both lists: I have a lead on a microvax near Birmingham, UK. All items in good, working condition unless marked "not checked". I am interested in people's comments, but the person to make offers, answer queries, etc. is Martin Poole, martin.poole(a)pgen.com Closing date for tenders Noon (British Summer Time) 12 July 1999. System: Microvax 3300/3400 Computer System 32Mb MOS memory, 3*381Mb DSSI ISE, Std Kbd., Mono Term. Expansion Cab, ?" Cartridge Tape Drive Spare Microvax 3400 Computer System (backup m/c.) (Not checked) Printers and peripherals:- LA324 -AE 24 pin Dot Matrix Printer (Three off) LA210 -A3 Letterprinter (Three off) Oki Microline 393C 24 pin Dot Matrix Printer (Three off, of which two not checked) Assorted tapes and ribbons for above The machines are now decommissioned but were in continuous use from new in 1989 till April 1999. They have always been supported by a maintenance contract, originally with Digital but in recent years a company called ICM Team had the contract. There are three cabinets, all desk-side size (28" tall x 14" wide x 20" deep) being (I think) the main CPU, the backup CPU and the expansion box. Since I (still!) haven't signed the lease on a storage unit of my own (local council not replying to letters), I shall probably not be bidding, but what do people know about these machines? How fast / reliable / compatible / easy to set up are they? Good luck, one and all. Philip. PS Enquiries and offers to Martin, just in case you'd forgotten. ********************************************************************** This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify the system manager. This footnote also confirms that this email message has been swept for the presence of computer viruses. Power Technology Centre, Ratcliffe-on-Soar, Nottingham, NG11 0EE, UK Tel: +44 (0)115 936 2000 http://www.powertech.co.uk **********************************************************************

25 years, 10 months

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ZX81

by peter＠joules.enterprise-plc.com

I think I may hve missed out on a bargain yesterday. I was walking around Surbiton, yesterday and in one of the charity shops they had a ZX81 complete with original manuals and a black and white TV for 15UKP. I left it there becuse I could not have carried the TV all the way to the car about a mile away. Perhaps I should have told them that I would give them 15 quid for the computer and they could have the TV. If any of our UK members are nera Surbiton and would like to see if it still there then the shop is and educationaal charity, I can't remember the name. It is about opposite Sainsbury's and is the second charity on the left hand side of the road if walking up from the traffic lights towards Surbiton railway stastion. Regards Pete

25 years, 10 months

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Available: IMSAI Chassis

by jimw＠agora.rdrop.com

For Sale/Trade/Whatever... IMSAI 8080 chassis and CPU board. Why 'chassis' rather than 'computer'? It's missing the front panel. I had been considering rebuilding it into a replica of an IMSAI dual-floppy sub-system, but it looks like I may have finally tracked one of those down, so now this piece is (somewhat) surplus. It does have the power supply and full card cage, so there is potential. Mayhaps someone has one of the third party 'smart' front panel boards that they want to play with? Any which way... I'm entertaining offers, lest I decide that I really need the room (and $$) and offer it up to the vultures on ePay... B^} -jim --- jimw(a)computergarage.org The Computer Garage - http://www.computergarage.org Computer Garage Fax - (503) 646-0174 >>> Coming soon to www.computergarage.org - the CBBS/NW on-line archives >>> Coming to VCF III (2-3 October 1999) - CBBS/NW live!

25 years, 10 months

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Local bus schedule

by edick＠idcomm.com

At the time BI came out we (I then was working for a military/aerospace contractor) were developing a portable military workstation based on a microvax-II. We briefly considered building our own version on the VME bus as opposed to Q-bus, when we learned that the BI-bus interface chipset was the microVax processor set. This would have saved lots of dough and let us use current generation hardware in place of the obsolete rubbish for which DEC charged so much dough. Politics doomed that notion, however. The KIM didn't have a way to float the processor's address bus, nor did it support prioritized interrupts, both of which were a little-used "big-deal" on the S-100. The fact that it also didn't support I/O instructions was a real limitation, though. Dick -----Original Message----- From: allisonp(a)world.std.com <allisonp(a)world.std.com> To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> Date: Monday, June 28, 1999 6:25 AM Subject: Re: Local bus schedule >On Sun, 27 Jun 1999 blstuart(a)bellsouth.net wrote: > >> In message <199906271535.AA28999(a)world.std.com>, Allison J Parent writes: >> ><The book also includes a few x to S-100 translator designs. >> > >> >KIM to S100 would be useful. > That would not be terribly difficult, depending on which direction you wanted to go. Unfortunately, the KIM didn't produce the appropriate signals for about half the functions on the S-100. (Neither did many of the CPU's offered for the S-100) This stood in the way of a successful commercial product along these lines. Nevertheless, it would have been nice to buy rather than build a memory card or controller for the KIM. > >> The book includes the schematics and a brief technical description >> of the KIMSI, a commercial KIM to S-100 product. It's covered in >> Chapter 15, "6502/6800 to S-100 Conversion." > >Would it be possible to get a copy of the schematic and minimal text? > >> It was open? I could swear I remember a really big stink in >> the DEC press when the BI was introduced. Of course, this >> wouldn't be the first time bit-rot affected my historical >> claims. > >It was open but DEC was the sole source for the interface/protocal >chipset. Hence the stink. It' was never actully locked as a few years >later there was both a second source and a "open" spec available. The >fact of the matter is most vendor specific buses tend to be somewat >closed if by virtue of lack of adoption by third parties. > >Allison >

25 years, 10 months

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Why does my Apple IIe run so _fast_ ?

by guerney＠uq.net.au

I have just played with an Apple IIe (Model A2S2128X) I was given. It is obviously "souped up" as everything runs so _fast_. Most games are impossible to play on it. I just tried a pinball simulation and the ball just bounces around at 100mph! I ran a BASIC graphics extension demo and the bits which were supposed to show "slow" drawing to the screen were real fast, and the "fast" draw was instantaneous. It is not hard to guess that a chip called the "ZIP CHIP Model 8000" plugged into the lower left of the motherboard has something to do with it! I came into microcomputers through the Commodore line, and have never known much about Apples, and I have not accumulated enough reference material to find something about this add-on. Another thing with this unit is that it happily runs DOS 3.3 but any ProDos disks are greeted with a "UNABLE TO LOAD PRODOS" banner. So it will not run Apple Works etc. There is also a PlusRAM II 1MB RAMCARD which is fully populated with 1MB RAM. I suspect that card must have cost $$$ in its day. What do I need to access this memory?Another slot holds a tiny card called a Berkely Softworks IRQ Manager. The centre slot contains a AIIE 80col/64K Memory Expansion card. The remaining slots are the more common Disk II Interface, Mouse Interface and "AII Parallel Interface" cards. Anything anyone can tell me about what makes this IIe run like it does? Phil in Brisbane, Australia.

25 years, 10 months

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What is an IBM PowerServer 370?

by steverob＠hotoffice.com

> > HP's offering FREE HP-UX 10.something for the 9.x customers > to get past the y2k problem. > Don't know if it applies to all the HPUX 9.X platforms but, I did receive the upgrade for my 9000/840. I just filled out the online form (sorry I forgot the URL) and they sent me a complete package. It included all the CDs (16 of em), installation instructions, and licenses. Very Cool! Steve Robertson - <steverob(a)hotoffice.com>

25 years, 10 months

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Laser-50 "educational computer"

by mranalog＠home.com

Sellam Ismail <dastar(a)ncal.verio.com> said: > Yes, I added one to my collection in 1997. Basically a simple little > computer with maybe 4K of memory and built-in BASIC. Made by Vtech > (Video Technology), the same guys that make all those educational toy > computers for kids, as well as the oft discussed Laser 128 (Apple //c > clone). And the Laser Compact XT (IBM XT clone). This is the specs from the manual: Model Laser 50 Educational Computer OS Basic - built-in Ram 2192 bytes expandable to 18K Rom 8K x 12bits Display 5x7 Dot matrix LCD, 16 chars/line 1 line/screen Interface Built-in cassette port,buzzer,parallel printer port Features Auto power off (2 1/2 minutes) without losing program. Auto LCD contrast adjustment. Program capacity - 10 programs (P0 - P9) Scientific calculator mode Power UM3x4 (4 "AA") or 6VDC adapter 15mA 22mW --Doug ==================================================== Doug Coward dcoward(a)pressstart.com (work) Sr. Software Eng. mranalog(a)home.com (home) Press Start Inc. http://www.pressstart.com Sunnyvale,CA Curator Analog Computer Museum and History Center http://www.best.com/~dcoward/analog ====================================================

25 years, 10 months

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3 computers looking for homes

by peterutz＠worldnet.att.net

For your list, Radio Shack TRS80 Model 1 with monitor, dual disk drives, 48K memory, manuals, documents, software. MacIntosh Classic MO-420 (made 1990) with HD, cables, manuals,software, and Imagewriter 2 if you want it. Swan 286 with dual floppies and hard drive, manuals, software, monitor. Make an offer plus shipping and contact peterutz(a)worldnet.att.net directly. Pete

25 years, 10 months

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Local bus schedule

by ethan_dicks＠yahoo.com

--- Max Eskin <max82(a)surfree.com> wrote: > Hi, > I'd like to know about the various famous, complete local bus standards. > I've heard of: > ISA > S-100 > PCI > VLB > EISA > NuBus > Unibus (don't know anything about this besides that it's by DEC) If this is on the list, then you should also have BI bus (32-bit bus used as the processor bus in 8200/8300 "Scorpio" class VAXen), Q-bus (16-bit bus going back to the early 1970's), Nautilus bus (32-bit system bus for VAX 85xx and 87/88xx machines) and XMI (eXtended Memory Interconnect) bus, the primary path on 6xxx/7xxx VAXen. > PDS > Apple ][ bus > > Does anyone know about any others? The Netronics Elf-II bus COSMAC VIP (1802) expansion slot? VME (68K and old, large SPARC servers used this) Multibus (favored of Intel, found in older Cisco products and the NCR Tower) Microchannel Zorro II/III (16/32-bit Bus used in Amigas) OMNIBUS (PDP-8/e/f/m/a - lots of batches of 12-bit signals) C-64 expansion bus \ VIC-20 expansion bus - 6502 signals and memory decode stuff, like the Apple ][ PET expansion bus / I guess it just depends on how you are using the term "local bus". If you mean direct access to processor signals, these should all count. Some of these appear as a local bus in some machines (BI bus in the 8200, etc.), and a peripheral bus in others (BI bus in 85xx/87xx/88xx/6xxx...) Same goes for the UNIBUS (main bus in older PDP-11's (11/20, 11/05...) but one of several busses in later models (11/70, 11/84, etc.) -ethan _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com

25 years, 10 months

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Fw: Museummy Computer

by jfoust＠threedee.com

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25 years, 10 months

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Laser-50 "educational computer"

by ckaiser＠oa.ptloma.edu

A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 653 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/19990627/562eb270/at…

25 years, 10 months

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VAXstation I questions

by allisonp＠world.std.com

<So if you're excluding the FP stuff, the MicroVAX I has more instructions <than the MicroVAX II. And its still the slowest of the lot... ;) Allison

25 years, 10 months

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Free HP 9000 340s in the UK

by rigdonj＠intellistar.net

Contact the owner. Joe In comp.sys.hp.misc, Richard Atkinson <96rga(a)eng.cam.ac.uk> wrote: >That's right, free to anyone who can collect or pay the postage. > >HP 9000/340 workstations >HPIL keyboards > >Email for more details. > > >Richard >

25 years, 10 months

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Local bus schedule

by max82＠surfree.com

Hi, I'd like to know about the various famous, complete local bus standards. I've heard of: ISA S-100 PCI VLB EISA NuBus Unibus (don't know anything about this besides that it's by DEC) PDS Apple ][ bus Does anyone know about any others? --Max Eskin (max82(a)surfree.com) http://scivault.hypermart.net: Ignorance is Impotence - Knowledge is Power

25 years, 10 months

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Grid and other pen PDAs FS

by rigdonj＠intellistar.net

FYI. Joe In comp.sys.handhelds, tcbordp(a)vbbusnw1.tc.cc.va.us (Peter W. Borders) wrote: > Pen / PDA Garage Sale > >I have the following pen related systems and software for sale. All >systems work correctly, pens function and all accessories work. These >systems have mostly been in storage so batteries are in unknown >condition and no guarentees are made with regards to ability to hold a >charge. All I can say is the last time I used them they worked but that >could be a couple of years for a few of these. All systems are in very >good to excellent condition, all doors and covers are in tact and the >only dislay scratch is listed in the descriptions. I will not sell parts >seperately and if something is not listed I don't have it. Resonable >counter offers on prices welcomed, lowball offers ignored. Not really >interested in trades unless you have somehting unusual, I am trying to >clear out some space. Prices include insured shipping via UPS ground >within the lower 48 states, for prepayed orders, anything else is at the >expense of the buyer. Buyer prepays with a money order or I can do UPS >COD but then the shipping, insurance and COD charges are the >responsibility of the buyer. For references check any amatuer radio >callbook (information available on the web) I have been at the same >address for over 10 years and the previous address (6 block away) for >over 20, I am not going to steal from someone and move after all this >time. > >Pete Borders - WB4TKA > >tcbordp(a)vbbusnw1.tc.cc.va.us > > >Pen Systems: > >Toshiba T200 $200.00 > 486dx, 8M memory, 80M HD > Windows for Pen 3.1 > 640x480 grayscale VGA backlit > Pen, Battery, AC adaptor > Built in IO ports (serial, parallel, floppy, vga, ps/2 keyboard) > 1 type II and 1 type III pcmcia slot > >Gridpad 2050sl $150.00 > 1/4 inch scratch on display, left of center near top > 386sl, 4M memory, 60M HD > Windows for Pen 3.1 > 640x480 grayscale VGA backlit > Pen, Battery, AC adaptor > Built in IO ports (serial, parallel, floppy, vga, ps/2 keyboard) > Built in modem (probably 2400 baud) > External 1.44M low profile floppy drive > >Grid Palmpad 2350 $150.00 > NEC V20, 1M memory, 10M pcmcia flash card > MS-DOS 5.0 with pen extensions > 640x400 dualscan grayscale CGA backlit > Pen, Battery, AC adaptor > Serial/power adaptor cable > Battery recharge cable > Custom case > >Pen PDA Systems: > >Motorola Envoy $125.00 > Magic Cap > Grayscale display > 2 Stylii, 2 batteries, AC adaptor > 2 PCMCIA slots > Wireless modem (Ardis) > External battery charger > Some manuals > >Peter W. Borders > >Network Support Technician >Tidewater Communty College >tcbordp(a)vbbusnw1.tc.cc.va.us

25 years, 10 months

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VCF Announcement: Nerd Trivia Challenge

by dastar＠ncal.verio.com

Nerd Trivia Challenge Official Rules and Regulations http://www.vintage.org/vcf/ntc.htm 0. The Nerd Trivia Challenge is a game-show like event geared towards the computer history enthusiast. Questions concering computers, their inventors, their technologies, and their software are relevant. The questions are carefully selected by a panel of amateur computer historians and are researched as thoroughly as possible to ensure the correct answer is associated with each question. Only questions with unambiguous, undisputed answers are used in the game. 1. To be considered as a player you must first pass a pre-qualifying quiz given when you arrive and register at the VCF. This is a series of 10 free-form answer questions, with each question being worth a point. The pre-qualifying quiz will be given on days one and two of the VCF (Saturday, October 2 and Sunday, October 3). The top ten scores will then qualify to move on to the final qualification quiz. 2. If you qualify then you must be available on day two of the event (Sunday, October 3) at 2:00pm to take the qualifying quiz. This quiz consists of a series of ten questions, each worth a point. The top three scorers on the qualifying quiz will be chosen to play the Nerd Trivia Challenge. In the case of a tie, a tie-breaking question will be asked in a "sudden death" format. The first person to respond with the correct answer to the tie-breaking question will be chosen as the final player. 3. The contest consists of two rounds with 25 questions each round in five different categories (five questions per category), plus a final round consisting of one question. Each question in each category is progressively more challenging than the last. 4. Scoring is in "bits". In round 1, the questions at the top of each category are worth 5 bits and increment by 5 bits so that the last question is worth 25 bits. In round 2, the questions start at 10 bits each and increment by 10 bits so that the last question is worth 50 bits. Scores will be displayed in the Octal numbering system. 5. Before the game begins, a player will be selected at random by a computer to be the first to choose a question from the game board. 6. The game is played thusly: each player's score starts at 0 bits (or NULL). The game is controlled by the Master Nerd. Each player has a hand signalling switch. The player who was chosen to go first will pick a question from the game board. The question will then be read by the Master Nerd. Once the question has been read, the player who signals quickest will be called upon to answer the question. 7. The player who is in control of the board may pick any question of any category they desire. There is no requirement to pick the questions in order, and there is no requirement to stay with a category until all its questions are exhausted. In other words, the questions may be picked in any order the contesant who is in control of the board desires. 8. A question may not be answered until the Master Nerd has read the question in its entirety. Once the question has been read, a player must signal within 3 seconds to answer the question. If no player signals before the 3 seconds have elapsed then the question is withdrawn, and the correct answer will be read. 9. The player signalling has 5 seconds to produce the correct answer. If the time elapses before the player successfully answers the question then the question is considered answered incorrectly by that player and the question is then re-opened to the remaining players. 10. If the question is answered correctly the bit value of the question will be added to the player's score. An incorrect answer will result in the bit value of the question being deducted from the player's score. The question is then re-opened to the remaining players, with the same time constraints as outlined in 8 and 9. 11. Round one includes a special Nerd question, and round two includes two special Super Nerd questions, which are found only upon a player selecting the question where these special questions are hidden. When a player selects a Nerd or Super Nerd question, they will be allowed to wager any amount (greater than 0) that they will produce the correct answer to the question. In other words, the player will be able to determine the point value of the question. The amount wagered may be up to the player's score, or the value of the question, whichever is greater. If the question is answered correctly, the bits wagered will be added to the player's score. If the question is not answered correctly, the bits wagered will be deducted from the player's score. In such a case, the question will not be opened up to the other players. 12. There is no time limit on rounds one and two. The rounds will continue until all questions on the board have been selected. 13. The final round consists of one question which all three players will have the opportunity to answer. The players will first be told the category of the question. The players must then secretly record a wager that they will produce the correct answer. The wager can be any amount from 0 bits to their current total score. Once the players have recorded their wagers, the final question will be read. The players then have 30 seconds to secretly record their answer. Once the 30 seconds have elapsed, each player will be asked to reveal the answer they recorded. The players producing the correct answer will have the amount they wagered added to their score, while those producing an incorrect answer will have the amount they wagered deducted from their score. 14. The player that has the highest number of bits at the end of the game is declared the First Place Winner. The players with the second and third highest scores are considered the Second and Third Place Winners respectively. In the case of a tie between any players, a tie breaking question will be asked. The first contestant to successfully answer the tie-breaking question will be awarded the place they are competing for (i.e. First or Second). The process will be repeated in the event of a three-way tie. 15. Any questions or comments concerning these rules or the Nerd Trivia Challenge in general may be directed to ntc(a)vintage.org. EOF Sellam Alternate e-mail: dastar(a)siconic.com ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Don't rub the lamp if you don't want the genie to come out. Coming this October 2-3: Vintage Computer Festival 3.0! See http://www.vintage.org/vcf for details! [Last web site update: 05/25/99]

25 years, 10 months

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Data General

by jonas＠coyote.org

Hi, I just got a Data General machine. It's marked with product ID MV/1000 DC. Could someone identify the year of this machine? It's not marked with the production year, but I get the impression that it's one of the newer Data General machines. I'd love to learn more about it. Jonas

25 years, 10 months

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Need photographs of vintage computers for magazine article.

by kstumpf＠unusual.on.ca

Ladies and gentleman if you have your own photographs of a Poqet or a Portfolio, a Hyperion, IMSAI, or of early word processing software like Electric Pencil, Wordstar, Samna, Multimate, or scenes from a Hamfest and Goodwill-type store that show vintage computer gear please contact me privately. I have written an article on collecting computers for Antique Trader and we need these photographs to go with the article. You will receive the photograph credit, be mentioned in the caption, and receive a copy of the issue the article appears in. Please contact me privately. Thank you. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------- Kevin Stumpf * Unusual systems * www.unusual.on.ca +1.519.744.2900 * EST/EDT GMT - 5 Collector - Commercial Mainframes & Minicomputers from the 50s, 60s, & 70s and control panels and consoles. Author & Publisher - A Guide to Collecting Computers & Computer Collectibles * ISBN 0-9684244-0-6 .

25 years, 10 months

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New Finds Today

by museum＠techniche.com

Stopped at the local surplus store today and found a double wide 7' tall HP rack full of old equipment. Out of it I pulled an HP 21mx, HP 9-track tape drive, HP pizza oven disk drive with a removeable pack installed and finally an HP Paper Tape reader. These were all still hooked up so I also picked up the connecting cables and the equipment slides. I left the rack since I have an empty one empty and waiting and it's alot cleaner then the one I took these out of. Cost -- $50. and a couple of hours time to disassemble and move it all (the disk drive is incredibly heavy). I had to put this all into storage immediately because I'm leaving on business so I didn't have time to note peripheral model numbers or inventory the cards in the CPU (however every I/O slot on the back was populated. On another topic, can anyone tell me exactly what the Morrow ADM-20 was? I have a lead on one, I understand that it is a CP/M machine. Is this one of the S-100 boxes?

25 years, 10 months

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Forwarded request for help: uts40

by jimw＠agora.rdrop.com

If anyone can help this guy, please contact him directly. I have no clue what a 'uts40' is... -jim ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- --- >Date: Thu, 24 Jun 1999 10:12:34 +0000 >From: Dominique Carlier <dominique(a)best.be> >Subject: uts40 > >Hello, > >i have a little question about a Sperry Univac computer, you know the >UTS 40 (universal terminal) and his subsystem (2x 8' drives) ? >This big neolithic computer, an old fellow for me, make a long beep when >i turn terminal on, the POC test do not initiate, black screen... >if you have an information about this, that was great, Help ! :) >(sorry for my bad english but i'm a frensh guy) ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- --- --- jimw(a)computergarage.org The Computer Garage - http://www.computergarage.org Computer Garage Fax - (503) 646-0174

25 years, 10 months

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Founder of Sphere surfaces

by dastar＠ncal.verio.com

Michael Wise, the founder of Sphere, has surfaced. His website is at http://www.users.uswest.net/~mwise/index.html. He's another one claiming title to inventor of the "Personal Computer", plus claims of other "firsts" that you can find on his website. I'm sure there will be plenty of debate. I'm trying to get him to speak at the VCF so you can heckle him in person. See also http://ibnd.net/old_days/sphere/ Sellam Alternate e-mail: dastar(a)siconic.com ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Don't rub the lamp if you don't want the genie to come out. Coming this October 2-3: Vintage Computer Festival 3.0! See http://www.vintage.org/vcf for details! [Last web site update: 05/25/99]

25 years, 10 months

1
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Local bus schedule

by allisonp＠world.std.com

<>ISA <>S-100 <>PCI <>VLB <>EISA <>NuBus <>Unibus (don't know anything about this besides that it's by DEC) It is the bus used for PDP11 and early VAX based (7xx and some 8xxx) systems. The related bus is Qbus used on smaller PDP-11s and MicroVAXen. <>PDS <>Apple ][ bus < <Duh! I left out MCA. Boy, am I in for it now... Multibus, mostly intel based/biased sytems. STDbus, Zilog z80 based systems SCSI and the earler version called SASI GPIB/HPIB general purpose instrumentation bus IEEE485 lowspeed networking for instrumentation and controllers. Omnibus DEC PDP-8E/F/M/A series computers. Eithernet, serial bus. Token ring, serial bus MassBus, used on large dec system for interconnecting disk farms. IDE, a 16bit wide bus for storage devices on PCs Hexbus, used on some TI consumer Machines. USB and firewire, serialbuses for interconnect (PC and?). And Parallel port... who says a bus has to talk both ways! Allison

25 years, 10 months

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Local bus schedule

by edick＠idcomm.com

Well, There Multibus-I, Multibus-II, STD bus, VME bus, Omnibus, Q-bus, B-I Bus, KIM bus, Exorcisor bus, FastBus, and that doesn't even scratch the surface. If I could focus I could probably come up with another dozen or so, not that they matter that much. Dick -----Original Message----- From: Max Eskin <max82(a)surfree.com> To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> Date: Saturday, June 26, 1999 8:31 PM Subject: Local bus schedule >Hi, >I'd like to know about the various famous, complete local bus standards. >I've heard of: >ISA >S-100 >PCI >VLB >EISA >NuBus >Unibus (don't know anything about this besides that it's by DEC) >PDS >Apple ][ bus > >Does anyone know about any others? > >--Max Eskin (max82(a)surfree.com) > http://scivault.hypermart.net: Ignorance is Impotence - Knowledge is Power >

25 years, 10 months

1
0
0 0

Apple //e OS

by pete＠dunnington.u-net.com

On Jun 26, 16:20, Sellam Ismail wrote: > On Fri, 25 Jun 1999, Pete Turnbull wrote: > > > > Actually, it can run any version of DOS (3.2 or 3.3) but for 3.2 you need > > > the 3.2 controller. > > > > Um, Sellam, are you sure you've not got 3.2/3.3 compatibility round the > > wrong way? > Oh yes, you are quite correct. I forgot about that. I remember now that > to boot 13-sector disks on a 16-sector controller required the 13-sector > pre-boot disk that Apple supplied with DOS 3.3. Yes, the BASICS disk, or the BOOT13 utility on the System Master. I figured what you wrote was just a typo, and you meant it the other way round, which would make sense. -- Pete Peter Turnbull Dept. of Computer Science University of York

25 years, 10 months

2
1
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Apple //e OS

by pete＠dunnington.u-net.com

On Jun 25, 11:45, Sellam Ismail wrote: > :: On Jun 25, 10:37, Arfon Gryffydd wrote: > > ::Can anyone tell me what DOS (name and version) works with an Apple //e > Actually, it can run any version of DOS (3.2 or 3.3) but for 3.2 you need > the 3.2 controller. Um, Sellam, are you sure you've not got 3.2/3.3 compatibility round the wrong way? The P5A and P6A PROMs that came on Disk ][ cards sold with DOS 3.3 (16-sector) can also handle the encoding used for DOS 3.2 (13-sector), but P5 and P6 PROMs supplied with Disk ][ cards can't handle the encoding used by DOS 3.3. There are a very few exceptions related to copy protected disks, of course, which is why some of us had switchable cards. -- Pete Peter Turnbull Dept. of Computer Science University of York

25 years, 10 months

2
1
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Sun 3/60

by a2k＠one.net

Hello, I'm trying to netboot my Sun 3/60 (from my Linux box). None of the HOWTOs I can find are very clear on how to do this. I've recompiled my kernel for rarp and nfs. My ethernet card works (00:00:C0:73:50:52) and my Sun is 8:0:20:6:10:35. When I try to run a command like /sbin/rarp -s 192.168.1.10 8:0:20:6:10:35 I get the error: SIOCSRARP: Network is unreachable . Any ideas? I think I have the correct kernel for the Sun, but that shouldn't matter -- it should at least try to talk to my Linux box, right? When I do >b le() on my Sun, it says Boot: le(0,0,0) Reqesting Internet address for 8:0:20:6:10:35 Any ideas? Thanks, Kevin ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- "It's you isn't it? THE BASTARD OPERATOR FROM HELL!" "In the flesh, on the phone and in your account..." -- BOFH #3

25 years, 10 months

3
4
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Russian computers in hand :)))

by adavie＠mad.scientist.com

I wrote a while ago about Russian microcomputers. A couple of days ago I received my first two, and throught I'd write a brief description to the list. "Microsha" Appears to be a (souped-up) Spectrum clone in functionality, but looks totally different. Quite cool, actually... Keyboard unit in dirty yellow (Atari 800-style colour and basic appearance) but much flatter (about 1.5" thick). Red and blue keys in a really weird cyrillic layout. Each key has two labels, shown in pairs here. Many of the Cyrillic letters are unreproducible in ASCII, so I'll enclose a best guess in [...] The first of the pair is the TOP marking on a key, the second is the lower marking. Top row: (;+) (1!) (2") (3#) (4[circle with 4 prongs]) (5%) (6&) (7[triangle]) (8[left bracket]) (9[right bracket]) (0) (-=) (red: cyrillic [GT]) (red: cyrillic [AR2]) row 2 ([backward n with accent][right square bracket]) ([CH]C) (yU) (KK) (EE) (HN) ([G]G) ([sch][left square bracket??]) ([sc??][right square bracket??]) ([zh]Z) (XH) (:*) (red: [PS]) (red: [VK]) row 3 (red: yC) ([ph]F) ([bI]Y) ([B]W) (AA) ([P]P) ([R]R) (OO) ([L]L) ([D]D) ([??V]V) ([3]\) (.>) (red: PyC LAT) row 4 (red: [HP]) ([backward R]Q) ([sort of y]^) ([C]S) (MM) ([bacward N]I) (TT) ([b]X) ([b with bar]B) ([circle with half plus]@) (,<) (/?) ([b with bar overhang left]_) row 5 two small space keys for left/right thumb. Keyboard has a "keypad" section at right, with contents left diagonal up arrow, F1, F2 left arrow, up arrow, right arrow F3, f4, f5 down arrow, CTP What a bizarre organization!!! Keys are i correct positions - size differences confirm this. anyway, the gist of it is that the keyboard isn't QWERTY, but more like CUKENG It looks so very alien. Weight: abot 2lbs at a guess. Unit has an expansion interface at back (RAM?) which plugs in at right angles (ie: a bit like a cart slot on an Atari 800, again). Several other interface ports on back, the most interesting is a square unit simply marked (interface 2) with a 3 x 10 female connector. I have the manuals and power supply for this machine. I'll do a picture if there's any interest. I also have about ten cassette tapes of original software for this one. The other machine is a PDP-11 processor-clone machine called BK-0010 It's in original box, with all documentation. More about that later, if there's any interest. Cheers A

25 years, 10 months

4
4
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8" floppy media with 32 hard sectors

by edick＠idcomm.com

Well good! I was wondering what to do with these, so, knowing that I don't have to feel I should gouge someone for them, I can give them away. Dick -----Original Message----- From: CLASSICCMP(a)trailing-edge.com <CLASSICCMP(a)trailing-edge.com> To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> Date: Saturday, June 26, 1999 5:34 AM Subject: RE: 8" floppy media with 32 hard sectors >>I see there are floppy diskettes being auctioned off on eBay. I = >>remember too that there was some discussion about where one might get = >>some hard-sectored diskettes. Well,folks, I have a box of new ones! = >>Though the box was ruined, the plastic bag inside protected the media, = >>so they were undamaged by the moisture which got in due to a damaged = >>shrink-wrap on the box. =20 > >You know, it isn't that hard to find these (despite what everyone seems >to claim.) Take a look at http://www.athana.com/, specifically at part >number 47-0801 on the "diskettes" page :-). > >Tim.

25 years, 10 months

1
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computers in the media

by CLASSICCMP＠trailing-edge.com

>has anyone seen the movie 'Three Days of the Condor'? there are many >computers shown. the only one i think i can identify is an Imsai with a >tape drive (?). Heh heh - talk about misidentification. That's a PDP-8 with DECTape drives! Since when did Imsai's have orange and burnt amber front panels with light bulbs? :-) -- Tim Shoppa Email: shoppa(a)trailing-edge.com Trailing Edge Technology WWW: http://www.trailing-edge.com/ 7328 Bradley Blvd Voice: 301-767-5917 Bethesda, MD, USA 20817 Fax: 301-767-5927

25 years, 10 months

2
1
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8" floppy media with 32 hard sectors

by CLASSICCMP＠trailing-edge.com

>>I see there are floppy diskettes being auctioned off on eBay. I = >>remember too that there was some discussion about where one might get = >>some hard-sectored diskettes. Well,folks, I have a box of new ones! = >>Though the box was ruined, the plastic bag inside protected the media, = >>so they were undamaged by the moisture which got in due to a damaged = >>shrink-wrap on the box. =20 >You know, it isn't that hard to find these (despite what everyone seems >to claim.) Take a look at http://www.athana.com/, specifically at part >number 47-0801 on the "diskettes" page :-). And if you don't mind paying a lot more than Athana charges, you can go to http://store.imation.com/ and select 8" SS-DD-32-W/WP, 8" DS-DD-32-W/WP, or the 8" SS-SD-32-W/WP. Tim.

25 years, 10 months

1
0
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8" floppy media with 32 hard sectors

by CLASSICCMP＠trailing-edge.com

>I see there are floppy diskettes being auctioned off on eBay. I = >remember too that there was some discussion about where one might get = >some hard-sectored diskettes. Well,folks, I have a box of new ones! = >Though the box was ruined, the plastic bag inside protected the media, = >so they were undamaged by the moisture which got in due to a damaged = >shrink-wrap on the box. =20 You know, it isn't that hard to find these (despite what everyone seems to claim.) Take a look at http://www.athana.com/, specifically at part number 47-0801 on the "diskettes" page :-). Tim.

25 years, 10 months

1
0
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computers in the media

by bluoval＠mindspring.com

has anyone seen the movie 'Three Days of the Condor'? there are many computers shown. the only one i think i can identify is an Imsai with a tape drive (?). there are a few others that i can't identify. one (cast iron?)big blue punch card machine; one black face, white case terminal with white keys; a teletype and another disassembled computer Redford was looking into. there are glimpses of others, but those are the ones i noticed.

25 years, 10 months

1
0
0 0

8" floppy media with 32 hard sectors

by edick＠idcomm.com

I see there are floppy diskettes being auctioned off on eBay. I remember too that there was some discussion about where one might get some hard-sectored diskettes. Well,folks, I have a box of new ones! Though the box was ruined, the plastic bag inside protected the media, so they were undamaged by the moisture which got in due to a damaged shrink-wrap on the box. Anyone interested? Dick

25 years, 10 months

1
0
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Apple //e OS

by SUPRDAVE＠aol.com

In a message dated 6/25/99 5:48:01 PM US Eastern Standard Time, pete(a)dunnington.u-net.com writes: > On Jun 25, 11:45, Sellam Ismail wrote: > > :: On Jun 25, 10:37, Arfon Gryffydd wrote: > > > ::Can anyone tell me what DOS (name and version) works with an Apple > //e > > > Actually, it can run any version of DOS (3.2 or 3.3) but for 3.2 you need > > the 3.2 controller. > > Um, Sellam, are you sure you've not got 3.2/3.3 compatibility round the > wrong way? The P5A and P6A PROMs that came on Disk ][ cards sold with DOS > 3.3 (16-sector) can also handle the encoding used for DOS 3.2 (13-sector), > but P5 and P6 PROMs supplied with Disk ][ cards can't handle the encoding > used by DOS 3.3. There are a very few exceptions related to copy protected > disks, of course, which is why some of us had switchable cards. > I've got several disks from apple called BASICS that will allow a dos3.3 system to boot up and manipulate dos 3.2 disks. The only dos3.2 disk I've ever seen was/is a diagnostic disk from call-APPLE that i got in a box of materials i got from someone. Prodos can be used with any apple ][ with 64k and an autostart rom. There is a bug in version 1.1.1 that can trash track 0 but I've never had it happen. Later versions do not have this problem. I think it's prodos version 1.8 (or is it 2.0) that won't run on a ][+ anymore.

25 years, 10 months

1
0
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AT&T 3B1 stuff available

by rigdonj＠intellistar.net

Forwarded from comp.sys.3b1. Contact the owner directly. Joe In comp.sys.3b1, John Isenhour <isenhour(a)uiuc.edu> wrote: >Hi, > >Been off the list for a long time. My free space has just shrunk >(girlfriend induced:) and I need to retire my trusty 3b1/7300 >collection. There is almost too much >stuff to mention, I got a lot of it from George who worked at ATT and >had a warehouse fulla new stuff (if anyone here was on the list that far >back) > >I have a 3b1 (4 MB) with the p5 upgrade and larger disk, my main >machine, >this is loaded to the gills with about all the hardware and software >the old gang could help me stuff into it over the years. >Downside - the battery is dead > >otherwize... >several new in box 7300's (opened, tested, reboxed) >several shrink wrapped system doc/software sets >several new keyboards, also some 3b1 and 7300 mildly used ones >memory cards >ethernet cards >hard disks, several, from 70 mb to 10mb >ethernet mau's 2, (converts 15 pin ethernet to BnC connector) >two tape drives and some tapes >external expansion box (good for everything but memory) >telebit t-1600 and a trailblazer modem >serial cards >some other cards I have forgotten what they do (voice card maybe?) >extra power supplies >an extra fan or so >extra motherboards >a few of the wd2010 controller chips >Probably more stuff in storage I have forgotten about. > >I will probably move this stuff at a yard sale in two weeks, to people >at >the university here (UIUC). If there are any diehard unixpc types that >are >interested in maintaining their equipment or getting backup stuff (is >why >I collected so much) no reasonable offer will be refused. I would like >to >see this stuff get a nice home. > >cheers, >john >isenhour(a)uiuc.edu > >

25 years, 10 months

2
1
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Formatting disk on rt11

by edick＠idcomm.com

I have a two-board Q-bus Controller for 8" hard disks. Having no use for same, and not wishing to "go there" I'm hoping someone in this group is curious enough to send me $6.20 for postage via USPS Priority mail, as I don't think they'll make the 2-lb limit, being fully loaded enough to have no identifying silkscreen markings to indicate who made them. Any takers? Dick -----Original Message----- From: CLASSICCMP(a)trailing-edge.com <CLASSICCMP(a)trailing-edge.com> To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> Date: Friday, June 04, 1999 7:46 PM Subject: Re: Formatting disk on rt11 >>>Alternatively, if you have a VS2000, it has a RQDX3-compabitle >>> formatter built into it. > >>I just formatted the disk in a MVII with the diagnostic tape. > >Or - maybe you didn't :-(. The MVII diagnostics are worse than useless. > >>>What error message do you get when you try DIR DU0: ? If it's a >>>"?DIR-F-Error reading directory", > >>I still get this one ... > >Then you didn't format the RD54 successfully. The best you can hope >for with the MVII diagnostics is to turn an already formatted RD54 >into a formatted RD54. The worst that can happen is that you >lose an already existing format. > >Let me know what media it'd be useful to you on, and I'll get you a >bootable XXDP disk/pack/cart/tape with ZRQC?? on it. > >>.INIT Du0: >>DU0: Initialize are you sure ?Y >>?DUP-F-Size function failed > >Yep - you need to really reformat the disk, as opposed to what the MVII >diagnosics do. And congratulations on actually posting the command >you used and the error message that resulted!! If only everyone else >on the list could do the same, it'd be a much nicer world!! > >-- > Tim Shoppa Email: shoppa(a)trailing-edge.com > Trailing Edge Technology WWW: http://www.trailing-edge.com/ > 7328 Bradley Blvd Voice: 301-767-5917 > Bethesda, MD, USA 20817 Fax: 301-767-5927

25 years, 10 months

2
1
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Wanted: Alpha-Syntauri

by jimw＠agora.rdrop.com

Header says it all... If you have to ask, you probably can't help... B^} If you have one that needs a new home, drop me a note with what you're looking for... ($, trade, favours, etc...) [please, no "I just put one up on ePay..." notes] -jim --- jimw(a)computergarage.org The Computer Garage - http://www.computergarage.org Computer Garage Fax - (503) 646-0174

25 years, 10 months

2
2
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FSOT: two Lear Siegler ADM-3A terminals

by bill_r＠inetnebr.com

You wouldn't happen to have any spare keycaps for those, would you? I've got an ADM-3A that's missing a couple. Not where the terminal is right now, so I can't say which for sure... > >I have a couple of Lear Siegler ADM-3A CRT terminals available >for sale or trade. These are early models, with a board > Bill Richman incolor.inetnebr.com/bill_r (Home of the COSMAC Elf microcomputer simulator!)

25 years, 10 months

1
0
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ASR-33 Local Mode "OK"

by cmcmanis＠mcmanis.com

Yipee. So after only two steps in the "clutch trip area" adjustment pages I've restored "normal" operation to the reader. Per the manual I loosened the armature extender, rotated the typing unit to the "stop position" and adjusted the extender for the correct distance (page 7, adjustment RRA-2) and once complete the reader returned to normal function. The bulk of the problem was, as Tony surmised, that the arm was now too far forward which did not allow the linkage to "catch" when the reader was turned off. Once adjusted the reader starts and stops under switch control. Now to hook this puppy up to the 8/E and see what I can make it do! (acutally eventually I'll get to the point where I read in FOCAL-8 but for now the TTY test loop would be just peachy thankyou very much. --Chuck

25 years, 10 months

5
5
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Apple //e OS

by arfonrg＠texas.net

Can anyone tell me what DOS (name and version) works with an Apple //e and where I can get a copy? Thanks, A ---------------------------------------- Tired of Micro$oft??? Move up to a REAL OS... ######__ __ ____ __ __ _ __ # #####/ / / / / __ | / / / / | |/ /## ####/ / / / / / / / / / / / | /### ###/ /__ / / / / / / / /_/ / / |#### ##/____/ /_/ /_/ /_/ /_____/ /_/|_|#### # ###### ("LINUX" for those of you without fixed-width fonts) ---------------------------------------- Be a Slacker! http://www.slackware.com Slackware Mailing List: http://www.digitalslackers.net/linux/list.html

25 years, 10 months

6
10
0 0

Odd glitch in a PDP-8/i

by jimw＠agora.rdrop.com

Ok, here is one for the true wireheads among us. I finally got some time to start working on the PDP-8/i in my collection, and started keying in some test programs with the intent of getting the timing on the TTY interface tweaked in so I could load some serious software, and found that the old beast seems to have an odd problem. See if anyone has hit on this one and has a suggestion... I can't seem to write into location 0 on any memory field?!? Regardless of what I write into the location, it always reads back as 0000. I can write into any other location, and all of the primary logic functions seem to be ok... (I can load/run programs as long as they don't need location 0) The 'write all zeros' test program (that org's at location 4) runs as expected... Thots, suggestions, comments, eek!?! -jim --- jimw(a)computergarage.org The Computer Garage - http://www.computergarage.org Computer Garage Fax - (503) 646-0174 >>> Coming soon to www.computergarage.org - the CBBS/NW on-line archives >>> Coming to VCF III (2-3 October 1999) - CBBS/NW live!

25 years, 10 months

2
1
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What is an IBM PowerServer 370?

by rigdonj＠intellistar.net

Another oddity that I spotted in a surplus place. Can anyone tell me about it?

25 years, 10 months

4
4
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For sale -- IBM 4869 drive for PS/2 Model 80

by Glenatacme＠aol.com

Hello all: Does anyone have use for the above 5.25" drive? We recently obtained a pile of junk, er, highly collectible computer crap, and this drive was in it -- still attached to its Boat Anchor (PS/2 80). If you are interested, reply by private e-mail with an offer, and we'll try to fire it -- and the Boat Anchor -- up to determine its condition. Cosmetically, it's perfect. Regards, Glen Goodwin ACME Enterprises 0/0

25 years, 10 months

1
0
0 0

Hamfests (South American computers)

by Glenatacme＠aol.com

In a message dated 6/24/99 1:48:54 PM Eastern Daylight Time, ware(a)xtal.pharm.nwu.edu writes: > Could the Brazilian Sinclair clone phenomenon be related to Timex Computer > Corportation's presence in Portugal? Many of the Timex/Sinclair computers > sold in the USA were manufactured by Timex of Portugal, and the systems > apparently remained popular in Portugal after Timex pulled out of the US > market. If this was the case, then there may have been a ready supply of > Portugese-language software and documentation for Sinclair clones, making > them a reasonable choice for cloning in other Portugese-speaking > countries. Very interesting theory! I'll have to check with my firends in Portugal & Brazil. > > Speaking of rubber-keyed ZX81 clones, Timex made such a beast for the US > market - the Timex/Sinclair 1500. It's essentially a ZX81 with 16K of RAM > in a Spectrum case. I have a picture of one at > > http://www.corestack.com/classic/machines/ts1500.html Please -- the TS1500 case is nothing like the Spectrum case, except for the rubber keys. 0/0 Glen Goodwin

25 years, 10 months

1
0
0 0

What is a NextStation Color?

by rigdonj＠intellistar.net

I found one in a surplus place today. Can anyone tell me more about it? Joe

25 years, 10 months

2
1
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Russian computers in hand :)))

by mallison＠konnections.com

Are the manuals in Russian or english? -Mike -----Original Message----- From: Andrew Davie <adavie(a)mad.scientist.com> To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> Date: Thursday, June 24, 1999 1:52 PM Subject: Russian computers in hand :))) I wrote a while ago about Russian microcomputers. A couple of days ago I received my first two, and throught I'd write a brief description to the list. "Microsha" Appears to be a (souped-up) Spectrum clone in functionality, but looks totally different. Quite cool, actually... Keyboard unit in dirty yellow (Atari 800-style colour and basic appearance) but much flatter (about 1.5" thick). Red and blue keys in a really weird cyrillic layout. Each key has two labels, shown in pairs here. Many of the Cyrillic letters are unreproducible in ASCII, so I'll enclose a best guess in [...] The first of the pair is the TOP marking on a key, the second is the lower marking. Top row: (;+) (1!) (2") (3#) (4[circle with 4 prongs]) (5%) (6&) (7[triangle]) (8[left bracket]) (9[right bracket]) (0) (-=) (red: cyrillic [GT]) (red: cyrillic [AR2]) row 2 ([backward n with accent][right square bracket]) ([CH]C) (yU) (KK) (EE) (HN) ([G]G) ([sch][left square bracket??]) ([sc??][right square bracket??]) ([zh]Z) (XH) (:*) (red: [PS]) (red: [VK]) row 3 (red: yC) ([ph]F) ([bI]Y) ([B]W) (AA) ([P]P) ([R]R) (OO) ([L]L) ([D]D) ([??V]V) ([3]\) (.>) (red: PyC LAT) row 4 (red: [HP]) ([backward R]Q) ([sort of y]^) ([C]S) (MM) ([bacward N]I) (TT) ([b]X) ([b with bar]B) ([circle with half plus]@) (,<) (/?) ([b with bar overhang left]_) row 5 two small space keys for left/right thumb. Keyboard has a "keypad" section at right, with contents left diagonal up arrow, F1, F2 left arrow, up arrow, right arrow F3, f4, f5 down arrow, CTP What a bizarre organization!!! Keys are i correct positions - size differences confirm this. anyway, the gist of it is that the keyboard isn't QWERTY, but more like CUKENG It looks so very alien. Weight: abot 2lbs at a guess. Unit has an expansion interface at back (RAM?) which plugs in at right angles (ie: a bit like a cart slot on an Atari 800, again). Several other interface ports on back, the most interesting is a square unit simply marked (interface 2) with a 3 x 10 female connector. I have the manuals and power supply for this machine. I'll do a picture if there's any interest. I also have about ten cassette tapes of original software for this one. The other machine is a PDP-11 processor-clone machine called BK-0010 It's in original box, with all documentation. More about that later, if there's any interest. Cheers A

25 years, 10 months

1
0
0 0

Woz speaks on "Pirates..."

by cmcmanis＠mcmanis.com

Presumably this was a hoax as the site has been disabled, and the NIC record for WOZ.ORG indicates that it was simply a host record (rather than a domain) and not related to Wozniak at all. --Chuck At 08:10 AM 6/24/99 -0700, you wrote: >With all of the avid Slashdot readers here, how did this not get posted? >Or is my mail server dropping messages? > >Anyway, if there's anyone who hasn't seen it yet, this page has a bunch of >Woz's replies to email questions about the show: > >http://www.woz.org/woz/commets.html > >I just tried it again and the site seems to be Slashdotted at the >moment (funny, it worked fine around 3am!). Along with reasserting that he >was the only real engineer of the bunch, he says that though the show may >have taken liberties with hard facts, that the personalities were captured >perfectly. > >Aaron >

25 years, 10 months

3
2
0 0

Hamfests

by chemif＠mbox.queen.it

At 21:05 20/06/99 -0400, you wrote: >Sorry, but I'm not in Europe... wish I was in England, but that's another >story.. No need to excuse ;) I thought you were talking about Milford near London (he,he :) It can easyly happen, considering the number of city that are present on the two continents.. Anyway, again I would like to receive news from all the subscriber concerning the "BEST HAMFEST/FLEAMARKET" or VINTAGE COMPUTER FESTIVALS referring to the presence of vintage computing of theyr country, (possibly with the date) with no "continental" restrictions. This will allow us to have a list of places around the world to be visited. I think that many times happen that one of these HAmfest are happening in the country I'm visiting, and I don't take the chance to visit this just beacuse I ignore it (that for a vintage collector is something bad). So, please report wich are the most important dates: If the idea is interesting also someone else, we could post the results on the web, similarly we have done with the CCC list. Comments are welcome! Ciao Riccardo Riccardo Romagnoli <chemif(a)mbox.queen.it> I-47100 Forl?

25 years, 10 months

6
8
0 0

70's sheet metal cases

by kaikal＠MICROSOFT.com

Thre is no "original" Apple 1 case. -----Original Message----- From: Michael Maginnis [mailto:celt@chisp.net] Sent: Thursday, June 24, 1999 11:47 AM To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers Subject: Re: 70's sheet metal cases Well, I think I'm going to have to disagree with you on that one - the motherboard itself was mounted on a square of sheet metal which was screwed into a real wood casing. Extra pieces of sheet metal were added to the inside of later versions of the Apple 1 to improve durability and lifespan, but the case itself was wood, not metal. If the Apple 1 featured in those pics has a metal case with contact paper stuck over it, then it's a replica, not an original. Mike Bill Sudbrink wrote: > > > The case is actually wood, not sheet metal. > > The main body of the case (where the keyboard > is mounted) is _SHEET_METAL_ covered with wood > grain contact paper. _NOT_WOOD_. It looks very > much like a SOL case and somewhat like a C4P case.

25 years, 10 months

2
1
0 0

More on the Compupro

by allisonp＠world.std.com

<>On a more serious note, I looked inside and there was: <> A Z-80 cpu card. <> 2 cards with 512K on them and were labled Disk something. < <Well, then, these are your disk controller(s). The "something" that <comes after Disk is very important in identifying them! Likely 512k Mdrive (ramdisk) really nice and quite a speed up for cpm. <> A wire wrapped (home-brew looking) card that looks like the 8" drive <>interface. <What makes you think that it's the 8" drive interface? Look for the 50-pi <cable coming from the drive box and figure out where it's going. Could be anything... < <> Another card covered with 6116 Ram chips. < <32 6116's gives you 64Kbytes, a comfortable amount for running CP/M-80. <Your description matches that of the Compupro RAM17, though lots of <of other manufacturers made similar boards that might be in your system. Ram16, ram17 there were other vendows with comparable cards. Allison

25 years, 10 months

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Preview of VCF 3.0 speakers

by dastar＠ncal.verio.com

Bring your copy of "A History of the Personal Computer" to VCF 3.0 so you can get it signed by Stan Veit. Also, Jon Titus, Horst Zuse (son of Konrad Zuse), and more. Stay tuned for details. Sellam Alternate e-mail: dastar(a)siconic.com ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Don't rub the lamp if you don't want the genie to come out. Coming this October 2-3: Vintage Computer Festival 3.0! See http://www.vintage.org/vcf for details! [Last web site update: 05/25/99]

25 years, 10 months

1
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Pirates...

by dcoward＠pressstart.com

Sam said: >Its a "story" (fictional) about the early days of Apple vs. Microsoft. I >don't even want to talk about it really. Just know it was horrible in >every way possible. >If anyone dares to pipe up and say they actually liked it I swear to you I >will unleash such a torrent of rage upon thee so please don't. Keep it to >yourself for your own good. Ligh-en up Sam! It's not the Learning Channel and it's not the History Channel. It's Turner, and they just colorized history a little. Partly to keep the audience interested and partly to squeeze it all into 2 hours. I enjoyed all of the scenes that take place in Albuquerque. (MITS, the hookers, Bill getting arrested). :) You just have to remember that not everyone on this list lives here in California. In other places it not considered polite to tell people what they can't think, what they can't say. :) --Doug ========================================= Doug Coward Press Start Inc. Sunnyvale,CA =========================================

25 years, 10 months

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Just scored an IMSAI

by allisonp＠world.std.com

<>There are only three voltages on the bus, +8VDC, +12VDC, and -12VDC, whic <>in reality are usually closer to +10~12VDC, +16~18VDC, and -14~18VDC. A good way to soft start a old powersupply that is also short safe is a 100-200W 110v (or equivalent for other countries) in SERIES with the 110v power. If the supply is shorted you will get a bright light, if it's ok it will Dim gradually or quickly to a dull glow or less. Works well for forming caps that arent totally gone. It's cheap and easy to make. Whille the lamp is in series with the source you can check the unloaded powersupply voltages, if the look good you can use an auto 12V bulb for a 1A load or a headlight for a 5-8a load. Allison

25 years, 10 months

2
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Goo on my Teletype print head

by CLASSICCMP＠trailing-edge.com

>I wonder if you could cast one using that stuff that classic car >restorers use to make rubber parts [an aside : Anyone know where to get >that in the UK?]. Making the mould would be fairly easy, I think. I always carved new ones out of pink rubber erasers, and they seemed to work fine for me. Tim.

25 years, 10 months

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70's sheet metal cases

by allisonp＠world.std.com

<Well, I think I'm going to have to disagree with you on that one - the <motherboard itself was mounted on a square of sheet metal which was <screwed into a real wood casing. Extra pieces of sheet metal were added <to the inside of later versions of the Apple 1 to improve durability and <lifespan, but the case itself was wood, not metal. If the Apple 1 <featured in those pics has a metal case with contact paper stuck over <it, then it's a replica, not an original. Many that were bought as boards and cased elsewhere. The Apple 1 was the first of the fairly complete machines (one or multiple board). The apple II ( or ][) was significant in the construction including the molded case. Allison

25 years, 10 months

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Just scored an IMSAI

by bill＠chipware.com

Well, much to my amazement, at lunch today, I got an IMSAI 8080. In beautiful condition, a few small scratches, almost no dust. Hasn't been up in years. I know we've done this before on this list, but... Where should I start? I figure: 1) pull all cards. 2) attach dummy load and check PS voltage and amperage. (What is an appropriate dummy load?) 3) check front panel mechanically. Use an OHMmeter to be sure that all switches are opening and closing correctly? I seem to remember that some people said that front panel disassembly/assembly is tricky. 4) install CPU and see if it "lights up"? Thanks, Bill Sudbrink

25 years, 10 months

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70's sheet metal cases

by fpp＠concentric.net

>Thre is no "original" Apple 1 case Right! We had 5 of them, no cases and the thing was a kit! Oh God, why did we get rid of them? We mounted them behind a wall with cut-outs for monitors and a shelf for keyboards and charged kids, mostly adults, to play breakout etc. Sold a lot of computers that way. "Hey kid, do you know that is a computer, and you can buy one for your own?"

25 years, 10 months

1
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Goo on my Teletype print head

by cmcmanis＠mcmanis.com

Symptom: Print quality degrading on the ASR-33. Analysis: Black tar like substance coating the print head apparently originating on the print hammer. I didn't look closely but was part #180502 the print head formerly made of black rubber? Seems like it. --Chuck

25 years, 10 months

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Just scored an IMSAI

by edick＠idcomm.com

I once found a handy gadget for seeking adjacent line shorts on the S-100. It's essentially a board with the edge connector and little else, except that the pins on one side are connected. Since the lines tend to be laid out alternating from one side to the other, your audible squeaker will allow you to test one side at a time with the "other" probe tide to the opposite side. Finding shorts is really quick and easy with this. It's easy make, though several vendors sold them at one time. Fortunately, it's built without the part of the board which would prevent you from reversing it, so you can do just that. An unaltered board with the connections on one side shorted wouldn't quite work due to the mechanical offset which prevents you >from reversing a board. Dick -----Original Message----- From: James Willing <jimw(a)agora.rdrop.com> To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> Date: Thursday, June 24, 1999 2:20 PM Subject: Re: Just scored an IMSAI >On Thu, 24 Jun 1999, Bill Sudbrink wrote: > >> Well, much to my amazement, at lunch today, I got >> an IMSAI 8080... > >Congradulations! > >> Where should I start? >> >> I figure: >> >> 1) pull all cards. > >Yep... Then I frequently do a quick 'shorts' check on the S-100 backplane >before proceeding. Take a ohmmeter on a low resistance setting and step >across the opposing pins with the leads. Start on pin 3, pin 53, then pin >4, pin 53, then pin 4, pin 54, and onward across the backplane. This will >quickly catch any adjacent line shorts. You may also reverse the stepping >sequence in case the backplane is an oddball and the lines are interleaved >differently. > >Skip pins 1,2,51,52,50, and 100, since these are the power supply pins and >will give readings back thru the power supply components. > >(note: pins 1/51 = +8VDC, pin 2 = +12VDC, pin 52 = -12VDC pins 50/100 = >GND) > >> 2) attach dummy load and check PS voltage >> and amperage. >> (What is an appropriate dummy load?) > >Well... (and I'll probably catch some heat for this) since the IMSAI >supply is an unregulated linear supply (regulation is done on each >individual S-100 card), a 'dummy load' is not really necessary for a basic >check. (switching supplies need a load or they get unhappy) > >There are only three voltages on the bus, +8VDC, +12VDC, and -12VDC, which >in reality are usually closer to +10~12VDC, +16~18VDC, and -14~18VDC. > >With the cards out, you can check these with a voltmeter. Now, where you >may want to load things up a bit is for a 'ripple' test. (looking for >bad/leaky capacitors &/or bad rectifier stacks. Although a bad recifier >will often cause the line fuse to blow) > >Depending on the amperage rating of the supply, (the IMSAI is a honker!) I >have a bank of automobile lamps (headlights for high amp, taillights for >lower). I gang these together for the appropriate voltage/amperage >ratings and 'light it up'! (pun intended) Then you can look for odd sags >in the voltage, and if you have a 'scope look for ripple on the suppliy >lines. > >> 3) check front panel mechanically. Use an >> OHMmeter to be sure that all switches are >> opening and closing correctly? I seem to >> remember that some people said that front >> panel disassembly/assembly is tricky. > >Not THAT complicated, but there are LOTS of screws, spacers, etc... > >Usually I just do a 'click' check on the switches, (toggle them and >listen. Bad ones will often make either a muffled sound or no sound at >all), and then do a function test once the panel and CPU boards are >plugged in. > >> 4) install CPU and see if it "lights up"? > >After a final 'visual' check for bad/damaged/improperly installed >components, etc... > >Ever onward! YMMV!! > >Regards; >-jim >--- >jimw(a)computergarage.org >The Computer Garage - http://www.computergarage.org >Computer Garage Fax - (503) 646-0174 > >>>> Coming soon to www.computergarage.org - the CBBS/NW on-line archives > >>>> Coming to VCF III (2-3 October 1999) - CBBS/NW live! >

25 years, 10 months

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More on the Compupro

by edick＠idcomm.com

-----Original Message----- From: allisonp(a)world.std.com <allisonp(a)world.std.com> To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> Date: Thursday, June 24, 1999 6:28 AM Subject: Re: More on the Compupro > >On Thu, 24 Jun 1999, Richard Erlacher wrote: > >> I've been watching this thread with some interest, as I'm curious how large >> a board with 512Kbytes in 4116's would be. I've got some boards downstairs >> which have sites for 288 4116's on each. That's 576KB, though it's >> organized as 64-bit words with off-board SECDED which makes it 512 KBytes > >The board in question obviously has 4164s on it or it's only 1/4 the size >indicated. > That's what I concluded as well, though the originator of this thread has said at least once they were 4116's. I'e got an 8MB "ramdisk" board I built back in about '85 when the 256k's were new. This board is populated with a few LSI samples I got, together with a 4MBx18 section literally hacked (with a bandsaw) from a client's application circuit and tacked to the S-100 board. The packages were the "zip" package, which allowed for pretty dense layout. If I ever find this circuit again, I intend to rework the logic, since the memory is actually organized 1MBx72 bits, and I have a now-obsolete LSI from TI, the 74AS6364A, which is a gigantic LSI used to perform SECDED. Since it corrects and propagates in only 10 ns, I want to build in a hardware error scrubbing circuit and maybe a battery backup scheme. The board's still more than half empty, since the memory is on two mezzanine boards. - Dick > >Compupro made a M-drive, a 512k ram disk using 4164 devices. I have one >of these and it works quite well. > >Allison > >

25 years, 10 months

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Compro, S100 & 8" drives

by arfonrg＠texas.net

I can grab a big Compro (model:?) computer that the junk guys says is a S100 computer. it includes two 8" drives. Anyone know anything about this box? ---------------------------------------- Tired of Micro$oft??? Move up to a REAL OS... ######__ __ ____ __ __ _ __ # #####/ / / / / __ | / / / / | |/ /## ####/ / / / / / / / / / / / | /### ###/ /__ / / / / / / / /_/ / / |#### ##/____/ /_/ /_/ /_/ /_____/ /_/|_|#### # ###### ("LINUX" for those of you without fixed-width fonts) ---------------------------------------- Be a Slacker! http://www.slackware.com Slackware Mailing List: http://www.digitalslackers.net/linux/list.html

25 years, 10 months

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Woz speaks on "Pirates..."

by CLASSICCMP＠trailing-edge.com

>>http://www.woz.org/woz/commets.html >Presumably this was a hoax as the site has been disabled, and the NIC >record for WOZ.ORG indicates that it was simply a host record (rather than >a domain) and not related to Wozniak at all. It's a real site, and really is Woz's, but it appears to be "down" (possibly from overloading): $ whois woz.org [No name] (WOZ-HST) WOZ.ORG 209.76.144.2 UNUSON (WOZ-DOM) WOZ.ORG $ whois woz-hst [No name] (WOZ-HST) Hostname: WOZ.ORG Address: 209.76.144.2 System: ? running ? Coordinator: Wozniak, Steve (SW70) steve(a)WOZ.ORG (408) 354-5000 (FAX) (408) 354-8999 $ whois woz-dom Registrant: UNUSON (WOZ-DOM) 16400 Blackberry Hill Road Los Gatos, CA 95030 US Domain Name: WOZ.ORG Administrative Contact, Technical Contact, Zone Contact: Wozniak, Steve (SW70) steve(a)WOZ.ORG (408) 354-5000 (FAX) (408) 354-8999 Billing Contact: Harvey, Carlos (CH1750) carlos(a)WOZ.ORG (408) 354-5000 (FAX) (408) 354-5000 Record last updated on 07-Apr-99. Record created on 27-May-94. Database last updated on 23-Jun-99 08:35:41 EDT. Domain servers in listed order: WOZ.ORG 209.76.144.2 NS1.PBI.NET 206.13.28.11 Tim.

25 years, 10 months

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More on the Compupro

by CLASSICCMP＠trailing-edge.com

>Thanks, how about a generic answer more like this: > "It is probably an S-100." > "Open it and look for:" > "XXXX Processor.. this is a CP/M machine." > "XXXX Processor.. This is a Super-whammodyne-OS machine." > "A Blah blah card." Life with S-100 boxes is a bit more complicated. Machines rarely kept their original factory configuration... and it was not uncommon to find every board in the machine made by a different company. With Compupro stuff, there are 5 main lines: 1. "Disk n" disk controllers, n=1, 1A, 1B, 2, 3, or 4. 2. "CPU nn" CPU cards, nn=85/88, Z, etc. 3. "Interfacer n" I/O boards, n=1 to 4 4. "System Support" boards, with real time clock, console port, etc. 5. "RAM nn" boards, nn usually greater than 16. There are many other less common Compupro boards, like their video controllers, etc. Of course, there were literally *thousands* of S-100 manufacturers, and the above list only helps if you know you're dealing with Compupro stuff. >On a more serious note, I looked inside and there was: > A Z-80 cpu card. > 2 cards with 512K on them and were labled Disk something. Well, then, these are your disk controller(s). The "something" that comes after Disk is very important in identifying them! The "512K" sounds like a Compupro board etch identifier, but I just looked over my Compupro Disk 1's, 1A's, Disk 2's, and Disk 3's, and none of them say 512K. Maybe it's a Disk 1B? Disk 4? > A wire wrapped (home-brew looking) card that looks like the 8" drive >interface. What makes you think that it's the 8" drive interface? Look for the 50-pin cable coming from the drive box and figure out where it's going. > Another card covered with 6116 Ram chips. 32 6116's gives you 64Kbytes, a comfortable amount for running CP/M-80. Your description matches that of the Compupro RAM17, though lots of of other manufacturers made similar boards that might be in your system. -- Tim Shoppa Email: shoppa(a)trailing-edge.com Trailing Edge Technology WWW: http://www.trailing-edge.com/ 7328 Bradley Blvd Voice: 301-767-5917 Bethesda, MD, USA 20817 Fax: 301-767-5927

25 years, 10 months

5
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Cromemco System 1 in Ghostbusters

by kaikal＠MICROSOFT.com

I was just channel surfing and ran across Ghostbusters on STARZ... in their lab, they have a clearly visible Cromemco System One with a C-10 acting as a terminal! Totally cool. I wonder if anybody's ever put together an "old micros spotted in movies" list. Kai

25 years, 10 months

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Alto Mouse in "Pirates"

by kaikal＠MICROSOFT.com

Bravo manual, page 33, "Bravo is controlled partly from the keyboard and partly from the mouse, the small white object with three black buttons which sits to the right of the keyboard". Also: "The three buttons on the mouse are called RED (the top or left-most one, depending on what kind of mouse you have), YELLOW (the middle one) and BLUE (the bottom or right-most one)." This implies that there were at least two mouse designs, one with three buttons from left to right, and one with three buttons from top to bottom. They both used a ball (not wheels). Kai -----Original Message----- From: Innfogra(a)aol.com [mailto:Innfogra@aol.com] Sent: Thursday, June 24, 1999 2:50 AM To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers Subject: Alto Mouse in "Pirates" In "Pirates" a mouse was handed about, supposedly from the Alto. Was it an Alto mouse? Was the Alto mouse a three button? Who made it? I know the star 8010 Dandelion and 6085 Daybreak mice were two button mice as I have had several. Anyway I have a mouse that looks like the one in the movie and it is possible it came from an Alto. I would like to identify it for sure. Paxton

25 years, 10 months

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70's sheet metal cases

by bill＠chipware.com

Did anyone else follow the link in the WIRED Apple 1 article? It goes here: http://www.grin.net/~cturley/gsezine/GS.WorldView/*APPLE.HISTORY/ Does anyone know the origin of this case? The color and general style of the sheet metal look about right for some OSI boxes. It also has a SOL-ish quality. Were there one or two sheet metal shops doing the cases for most computers in the mid-to-late 70's? I've sent this question off to the ex-OSI engineer I know, but he will probably take a couple of weeks to respond. Bill Sudbrink

25 years, 10 months

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Woz speaks on "Pirates..."

by af-list＠lafleur.wfi-inc.com

With all of the avid Slashdot readers here, how did this not get posted? Or is my mail server dropping messages? Anyway, if there's anyone who hasn't seen it yet, this page has a bunch of Woz's replies to email questions about the show: http://www.woz.org/woz/commets.html I just tried it again and the site seems to be Slashdotted at the moment (funny, it worked fine around 3am!). Along with reasserting that he was the only real engineer of the bunch, he says that though the show may have taken liberties with hard facts, that the personalities were captured perfectly. Aaron

25 years, 10 months

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Hamfests

by chemif＠mbox.queen.it

Hi, Larry, at 17:44 23/06/99 +0000, Larry wrote: > You might try the International Amateur Radio Union listings at > >http://www.iaru.org/iaru-soc.html > >ciao larry >lwalker(a)interlog.com > >Let us know of your upcoming computer events for our Events Page. At the moment I'm going to attend the HAMFEST'99 (HAMRADIO+HAMTRONICS+BEER?) that will be held fm 25 to 27/06 in Friedrichshafen (a place very close to Switzerland and Austria borders). Seems that this is nerly the bigger HAM-FLEAMARKET convention in EU.. Maybe Hans can tell something more about that and the VINTAGE COMPUTERS density inside... Ciao! Rick Riccardo Romagnoli <chemif(a)mbox.queen.it> I-47100 Forl?

25 years, 10 months

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More on the Compupro

by CLASSICCMP＠trailing-edge.com

>I've been watching this thread with some interest, as I'm curious how large >a board with 512Kbytes in 4116's would be. I've got some boards downstairs >which have sites for 288 4116's on each. That's 576KB, though it's >organized as 64-bit words with off-board SECDED which makes it 512 KBytes >with correction. These boards are about 15"x22" which is quite a bit large >for any of my S-100 boxes. The compupro boys often were fairly ambitious >with their "features" and may have planned a different >jumpering/multiplexing scheme for the power, addresses, etc, which were >different once the 64K parts became available. However, considering what it >took to make a memory board, even 64K parts would have left it a difficult >task to fit all those DRAMs on the board, considering 1982 or so technology. The M-Drive/H 512K's that I have are populated with 64 4164's (1982/1983 date codes) and the M-Drive/H 2MEG's that I have are populated with 64 41256's (1984 date codes). The DRAM's take up about 70% of the board, with the remainder going to the Intel DRAM controller (8203), bus drivers, PAL's, and regulators. These boards were available partially populated, too. These boards were not cheap when introduced; from old price lists, they sold in the $5000-$8000 range fully populated. > The Godbout boys were really >not inclined to use the most costly technology available. Hence, I doubt >the CompuPro board in question held 512K of 4116's. I agree, it wouldn't be physically possible to put 512K of 4116's on a single S100 board. But the Compupro folks had customers who were more than willing to buy a S-100 board the price of a new car, and bought the technology to do it with the denser DRAM's just becoming widely available at the time. -- Tim Shoppa Email: shoppa(a)trailing-edge.com Trailing Edge Technology WWW: http://www.trailing-edge.com/ 7328 Bradley Blvd Voice: 301-767-5917 Bethesda, MD, USA 20817 Fax: 301-767-5927

25 years, 10 months

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More on the Compupro

by edick＠idcomm.com

I've been watching this thread with some interest, as I'm curious how large a board with 512Kbytes in 4116's would be. I've got some boards downstairs which have sites for 288 4116's on each. That's 576KB, though it's organized as 64-bit words with off-board SECDED which makes it 512 KBytes with correction. These boards are about 15"x22" which is quite a bit large for any of my S-100 boxes. The compupro boys often were fairly ambitious with their "features" and may have planned a different jumpering/multiplexing scheme for the power, addresses, etc, which were different once the 64K parts became available. However, considering what it took to make a memory board, even 64K parts would have left it a difficult task to fit all those DRAMs on the board, considering 1982 or so technology. I worked on a board from "little machines, inc" in '80 or so, which had on it about 250 IC's including some of the first sipps I ever saw on one side of the board (Multibus-1) and about 1000 passives and discretes on the other side. I think the combined RAM on the board came up to 512K, though the parts with which you could do that were not available. That board used every modern LSI and space-preservation strategy available at the time, yet was truly 10 pounds of SH*T in a 5-pound bag. The Godbout boys were really not inclined to use the most costly technology available. Hence, I doubt the CompuPro board in question held 512K of 4116's. The question remains, "What is it?" Dick -----Original Message----- From: Don Maslin <donm(a)cts.com> To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> Date: Thursday, June 24, 1999 12:01 AM Subject: RE: More on the Compupro >On Wed, 23 Jun 1999, Arfon Gryffydd wrote: > >> >1. "Disk n" disk controllers, n=1, 1A, 1B, 2, 3, or 4. >> >2. "CPU nn" CPU cards, nn=85/88, Z, etc. >> >3. "Interfacer n" I/O boards, n=1 to 4 >> >4. "System Support" boards, with real time clock, console port, etc. >> >5. "RAM nn" boards, nn usually greater than 16. >> >> >>On a more serious note, I looked inside and there was: >> >> A Z-80 cpu card. >> >> 2 cards with 512K on them and were labled Disk something. >> > >> >Well, then, these are your disk controller(s). The "something" that >> >comes after Disk is very important in identifying them! >> > >> >The "512K" sounds like a Compupro board etch identifier, but I just >> >looked over my Compupro Disk 1's, 1A's, Disk 2's, and Disk 3's, and >> >none of them say 512K. Maybe it's a Disk 1B? Disk 4? >> >> Nope... I suspected RAM disc cards because 512K is the AMOUNT of RAM I >> counted (a board covered w/ 4116s). And there were no connectors to the >> boards other than the card edge. >> There are two of these mystery boards. > >SemiDisk, perhaps? > - don > >> >> >> A wire wrapped (home-brew looking) card that looks like the 8" drive >> >>interface. >> > >> >What makes you think that it's the 8" drive interface? Look for the 50-pin >> >cable coming from the drive box and figure out where it's going. >> >> Uh,I thought it was the drive interface because it had a 50pin cable >> comming off it that matched the 50pin connection to the 8" drives box. >> >> >> >> Another card covered with 6116 Ram chips. >> > >> >32 6116's gives you 64Kbytes, a comfortable amount for running CP/M-80. >> >Your description matches that of the Compupro RAM17, though lots of >> >of other manufacturers made similar boards that might be in your system. >> >> Yep, that sounds right. >> >> ---------------------------------------- >> Tired of Micro$oft??? >> >> Move up to a REAL OS... >> ######__ __ ____ __ __ _ __ # >> #####/ / / / / __ | / / / / | |/ /## >> ####/ / / / / / / / / / / / | /### >> ###/ /__ / / / / / / / /_/ / / |#### >> ##/____/ /_/ /_/ /_/ /_____/ /_/|_|#### >> # ###### >> ("LINUX" for those of you >> without fixed-width fonts) >> ---------------------------------------- >> Be a Slacker! http://www.slackware.com >> >> Slackware Mailing List: >> http://www.digitalslackers.net/linux/list.html >> >

25 years, 10 months

2
1
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More on the Compupro

by CLASSICCMP＠trailing-edge.com

>> >> 2 cards with 512K on them and were labled Disk something. >> > >> >Well, then, these are your disk controller(s). The "something" that >> >comes after Disk is very important in identifying them! >> > >> >The "512K" sounds like a Compupro board etch identifier, but I just >> >looked over my Compupro Disk 1's, 1A's, Disk 2's, and Disk 3's, and >> >none of them say 512K. Maybe it's a Disk 1B? Disk 4? >> >> Nope... I suspected RAM disc cards because 512K is the AMOUNT of RAM I >> counted (a board covered w/ 4116s). And there were no connectors to the >> boards other than the card edge. >> There are two of these mystery boards. > >SemiDisk, perhaps? That certainly seems to be the idea, though I'm puzzled as to why the board would say "Disk something" on it. All my Compupro ramdisk-type boards say "M-Drive" on them. -- Tim Shoppa Email: shoppa(a)trailing-edge.com Trailing Edge Technology WWW: http://www.trailing-edge.com/ 7328 Bradley Blvd Voice: 301-767-5917 Bethesda, MD, USA 20817 Fax: 301-767-5927

25 years, 10 months

1
0
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RSX-11M emulator for VMS?

by CLASSICCMP＠trailing-edge.com

>I was recently told that DEC sold an RSX-11M emulator that run as a process >on VMS for people who had old RSX code they wanted to run. Is this true? Yes, it is. This is the start of the SPD (see http://www.mentec.com/SPDS/vaxrsx.html for the whole thing): SPD 26.73.08 VAX-11 RSX, Version 2.5 is a member of a family of operating system and other software products produced by Mentec Inc. for the PDP-11 family of computers. It is available from Mentec Inc. or Digital Equipment Corporation subject to a software license issued according to standard terms and conditions. Description: Overview VAX-11 RSX is an emulator of the RSX Operating System family which executes on all VAX systems. VAX-11 RSX runs in compatibility mode on processors that support a PDP-11 instruction set subset in hardware or microcode, and also runs on processors without this support by providing its own software emulation of the same PDP-11 instruction set subset. VAX-11 RSX provides special capabilities which enable PDP-11 users to develop programs for execution in the following environments: VMS compatibility mode (hardware-supported or software-emulated) RSX-11M-PLUS RSX-11M RSX-11S Micro/RSX VAX-11 RSX also allows for the migration of many existing RSX applications to VMS. >And if so is it part of the hobbiest license? No, it isn't, though last time I checked it was part of the CSLG. -- Tim Shoppa Email: shoppa(a)trailing-edge.com Trailing Edge Technology WWW: http://www.trailing-edge.com/ 7328 Bradley Blvd Voice: 301-767-5917 Bethesda, MD, USA 20817 Fax: 301-767-5927

25 years, 10 months

2
1
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Alto Mouse in "Pirates"

by Innfogra＠aol.com

In "Pirates" a mouse was handed about, supposedly from the Alto. Was it an Alto mouse? Was the Alto mouse a three button? Who made it? I know the star 8010 Dandelion and 6085 Daybreak mice were two button mice as I have had several. Anyway I have a mouse that looks like the one in the movie and it is possible it came from an Alto. I would like to identify it for sure. Paxton

25 years, 10 months

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by hhacker＠home.com

GE Fanuc is a Japan based company which manufactures devices known in the CNC field as a "control." It is essentially a computer which is used to control the operation of machine tools, such as mills and lathes. William R. Buckley -----Original Message----- From: Merle K. Peirce <at258(a)osfn.org> To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> Date: Wednesday, June 23, 1999 5:10 PM Subject: Re:... > >We were just given a GE Fanuc case. Apparently it held some sort of hard >drive, which has evaporated. Does anyone know what these things are?

25 years, 10 months

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