- test-drb@ccmp.vtda.org - classiccmp.org

by rcini＠optonline.net

Hello, all: I'm posting working code and pre-built binary, along with a binary image of Altair BASIC 3.2. It works very well. I have no way yet to guage relative speed to a real Altair, but it seems pretty responsive. What I'd like to do is ask an Altair owner on this list to create some sort of benchmark program and run it on his real Altair. Then, I'll run it on the Altair32 and that'll give me a basis for improving the speed of the emulator. Thanks again and enjoy. Rich Rich Cini Collector of classic computers Build Master for the Altair32 Emulation Project Web site: http://highgate.comm.sfu.ca/~rcini/classiccmp/ /************************************************************/

25 years

1
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Identify this mystery Q-Bus board!

by zaft＠azstarnet.com

I have an unidentified Q-Bus board that I'm hoping someone will recognize. it's a quad-height (i.e. full-size) board. On the component side is says "RELIABILITY ASSOCIATES" and (c) 1987 and "TIME SLOT CONTROLLER". It has two 40-pin headers and a 20-pin header and two pushbutton switches. Chipwise, it's got a 68000RC10, a couple of 68450s, three MK68564s, and a 74S409N, all socketed, and a host of PALs and MSI/SSI chips. Anybody know what this is? Also does anyone have data sheets for 74S409? Gordon Gordon Zaft zaft(a)azstarnet.com

25 years

1
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6502 vs 68000

by paul＠orchard.wccnet.org

> Date: Sun, 19 Aug 2001 07:26:19 -0600 > From: "Richard Erlacher" <edick(a)idcomm.com> > Subject: Re: SemiOT: Mourning for Classic Computing > > There are lots of things one CPU could do more simply than another, > but, normally, there were others that went the other way. I remember, > back in '80 or so, demonstrating that the 4 MHz 6502 was considerably > faster and more code efficient than the 8 MHz 68000. This was, of > course, because the 8 MHz 68K had to fetch two words just to get its > opcode, though it didn't take long to execute it once the opcode and > operands were in place. In 1980, most 8-bit CPUs were more efficient that the 68000 in terms of code size as long as you limited yourself to 64K. When you got past 64K, the 68000 scaled smoothly while programming the 8-bitters became a Chinese fire drill. Paul R. Santa-Maria Monroe, Michigan USA

25 years

2
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Gateway Z80 ISA cards

by optimus＠canit.se

I've come across two full-length eight-bit ISA cards from Gateway Communications. The main chips on it is a family of Zilog chips: Z80 CPU, 2?SCC, Z80 CTC. The blanking plate fatures a micro-D50, the same kind found on SCSI cards. It's not uncommon to find Zilog chips on SCSI controllers, but that connector was AFAIk introduced with SCSI-2, and an 8-bit SCSI-2 card seems like an odd thing to do. The card is labelled WNIM Z80 and is copyrighted 1990. The farther end of the card features two 10-pin headers marked PORT 1,2 and PORt 3,4 respectively. What could this board be for? -- En ligne avec Thor 2.6a. Remember: - On the Amiga, you can make a way. - On Linux, there is a way, you just don't know it. - On Windows, there is no way and you know it. Aaron Digulla

25 years

3
3
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FS: VAXStation 3100/M76

by cmcmanis＠mcmanis.com

I bought a pallet with some VAXStations at auction and I'm going to sell several of them on Ebay to raise funds to cover the cost of storage for the rest of my collection. However, before I do that, and at the risk of ruining my market, there are three types of systems available: VS3100/M76 16MB Mono, w/ RZ23 VS3100/M76 16MB Color (8pln, not the SPX), w/RZ23 VS4000/M60 24MB Color, w/RZ24 If you want one, make me an offer by midnight pacific time thursday (I'm planning to start listing them Friday). Note I will expect you to cover the cost of packing and shipping it which shouldn't be all that much (say 30 lbs from Sunnyvale, CA 94087). Note that I'll balance the offer against the hard luck story that comes with it :-) So if you have a good story that will help your cause. I will include an MMJ cable with a male DB25 adapter (either DTE or DCE your choice). No, none of them came with the funky SCSI cable that you need for a VS3100. I've also got a VS3100 M30? (KA42) with an RX23 that is available for $10 + postage (it has 8MB and no internal hard drives) --Chuck

25 years

4
3
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Update SIMPLEX doc

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

From: Chuck McManis <cmcmanis(a)mcmanis.com> >I've updated the SIMPLEX document and would appreciate critical reviews for >accuracy completeness. The URL is here: ><http://www.mcmanis.com/chuck/computers/simplex.html> > >It also includes my idea for the front panel. I don't know if it will work >out that way but that is what I'm shooting for. If I'm lucky the whole >thing will fit in one Radio Shack project box, (assuming I make it out of >an FPGA) if I build it out of tubes it will probably take up a couple of >racks :-) An aside to this.... Why fpga other than as an exercise in FPGA and cpu design? Why not program a PIC or somesuch to emulate the processor??? I doesnt have to be fast as a teaching tool and the ram/rom required to do this would be reasonable. Allison

25 years

1
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SC/MP NIBL emultor by Henry Mason

by sipke＠wxs.nl

Hi Folk, Henry Mason coded an emulator for the SC/MP NIBL system This was a SC/MP based development system that National Semiconductor made. It includes the NIBL ROM so you can program it in very itsypitsy tiny BASIC. I'll be on the lookout for more info on this system. Its aviable for downloading I've included it in my SC/MP page http://xgistor.ath.cx Drill down to: ==> Vintage Computers ==> SC/MP Elektor Emulator Regards, Sipke de Wal

25 years

1
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Assembly vs. Everything Else (was: SemiOT: Mourning for ClassicComputing)

by pete＠dunnington.u-net.com

On Aug 18, 22:29, Derek Peschel wrote: > Acorn designed a 6502-based computer for the BBC, called (natch) the BBC > Microcomputer. Sophie Wilson wrote a fine BASIC for the machine. When > Acorn designed the ARM chip and a line of computers based on that, the BASIC > got ported, but I don't know who did that work. Sophie did. She wrote TWIN (Two WINdow Editor), ChangeFSI (image manipulation program), and some ray-traced demos as well, and several other things. -- Pete Peter Turnbull Network Manager University of York

25 years

1
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Update SIMPLEX doc

by cmcmanis＠mcmanis.com

I've updated the SIMPLEX document and would appreciate critical reviews for accuracy completeness. The URL is here: <http://www.mcmanis.com/chuck/computers/simplex.html> It also includes my idea for the front panel. I don't know if it will work out that way but that is what I'm shooting for. If I'm lucky the whole thing will fit in one Radio Shack project box, (assuming I make it out of an FPGA) if I build it out of tubes it will probably take up a couple of racks :-) --Chuck (And thanks to Jim Battle who pointed out a clearly better way to do accumulator loads.)

25 years

1
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SemiOT: Mourning for Classic Computing

by technos＠nerdland.org

HTML isn't flimsy as a language goes.. The problem is the wack intrepreters. Each does something different, especially in the case of a broken document.. (Not starting a browser flamewar.. No, I'm not. Really. No flames. Shaddup already!.) Jim > > HTML is no programming language, silly. You'd learn more by running a > Cardiac, > and besides, HTML is so flimsy that it can never be predicted in any > whatsoever. > > -- > En ligne avec Thor 2.6a. > > Die Zeit kommt aus der Zukunft, die nicht existiert, in die > Gegenwart, die keine Dauer hat, und geht in die Vergangenheit, > die aufgehort hat, zu bestehen. > --- Augustinus (Rom. Kirchenlehrer, 354-430 n. Chr.)

25 years

5
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This week's finds

by optimus＠canit.se

A summary of what I've stumbled over in the past week or so: One ABC80. This one's been equipped with a TKN80 80 column kit. It also came with two datasettes. One interesting tidbit is that the keyboard is actually made by Keytronic. And the Z80 is a really pretty model, all white with very visible traces and the core mounted on top of it all. One Spectravideo MSX datasette, as though I haven't got enough of those already. One Atari 1040STFM with Notator dongle. I had to skip the monitor. One extremely hacked-up Amiga 500. With all the solder, broken pins, added sockets and switches, it's one hideous "Rock lobster". One Commodore VC-1520 plotter/printer. One North Hills MAU. It's surprisingly small. But isn't it supposed to have any AC mains? One BayTech multiport controller 525. What is this? It's a smallish box with five DB25 ports in the back. Each port has still got a DB25/RJ45 adaptor, which makes it worthwhile regardless of what it actually might be. A lot of electronics out of a can recycling machine, TOMRA brand. Seems to be VME, with a lot of useful Motorola chips. An AC adaptor for a Luxor VEC (Also known as a Fairchild, SABA, etc). Various Mac parts, including a video capture card and a MIDI interface. -- En ligne avec Thor 2.6a. Was ist ein Erwachsener? Ein Kind, das vom Alter aufgepumpt ist. --- Simone de Beauvoir

25 years

2
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Danish

by optimus＠canit.se

My, what an interesting find today. I just hope the boys were able to find a taxi, or it will have ended up on a dirty road in the middle of nowhere. The beast I'm referring to is an RC855, made by Regnecentralen of Denmark. It's a brown and beige (which seems to have been the colours of choice for all Scandinavian computers, whether Luxor, Tandberg or Regnecentralen =) tiltable screen with a sturdy stand into which a microcomputer is fit. It also came with two eight-inch floppy drives, which someone with a sick sense of humour has named "Picollo". I also managed to find two floppies, one of which seems to contain CP/M. Urgh. Couldn't it have been something more interesting? Nevertheless, it's Danish, so I like it. The floppies are daisychained on a D36. There are also two serial ports, a detachable keyboard and some kind of network port, IIRC a three or four-pin DIN connector. Among other finds were a C64C, an Atari 520STFM (yawn) and two small Memorex Telex boxes with VGA out and twinax networking. Some kind of terminals apparently, these seem to have been used in a cinema booking system. There was also a DECwriter IV there, but I had to leave it since some people think VGA monitors are more fun than 300 bps hard copy terminals. =) -- En ligne avec Thor 2.6a. When cherry tree blooms, people go and walk there, eat dumpling, bring sake and talk each other such things as "A superb view!" and "Full of spring here", and they become very happily and cheerful. But this is a lie. People gather below cherry trees and get drunk, vomit, fight, which are happening since the old days of Edo period. From long time ago. THE FULL OF CHERRY BOOLMS, CHAPTER 1

25 years

1
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an odd question

by mmcfadden＠cmh.edu

I know that the control key on the DEC terminals stripped off the high order bit on the character that followed. The Control-G series would sound the bell on either the VT100 or LA34. the G character is an octal 107 Control-G sends out an octal 007 which is the bell All sorts of modem, printer, and terminal combinations used the entire ASCII character set. When we replaced our VT52's we found out you could send out series of cursor control codes on VT100's to move the cursor and then output a character. Early star trek games on video terminals used this instead of sending out spaces and characters. You could also plot line graphs and barcharts using control codes. Mike mmcfadden(a)cmh.edu

25 years

14
24
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classiccmp-digest V1 #690

by dittman＠dittman.net

> > PROGRAM SayHello(INPUT, OUTPUT) > > BEGIN > > WHILE (TRUE) > > BEGIN > > WRITELN('Hello World'); > > END; > > END. > > I think what you wanted to say was this: > PROGRAM SayHello(OUTPUT); > BEGIN > WRITELN('Hello World'); > END. The BASIC program printed "Hello World" over and over, so the WHILE loop is used do the same thing in the Pascal program. Your program just prints "Hello World" once. -- Eric Dittman dittman(a)dittman.net School Zones: Man's attempt to thwart natural selection.

25 years

12
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FS: Silent 700s and Trimm 19" rack mount box with slides

by cmcmanis＠mcmanis.com

Hi everyone, cleaning out more stuff this evening and have unearthed a few things. Everything is in Sunnyvale, California, zip 94087. First an EXTREMELY rare Texas Instruments Silent 700 with Bubble Memory storage (model 765). These are very unusual because there was only a short period of time between when bubble memory was practical and the whole Silent 700 was impractical :-) The Silent 700 series are thermal printing, hard copy terminals. Works fine. $75 + postage. (Strangely a bubble memory unit for this thing brought $76 on Ebay a while back, go figure) Second, is a less rare but very nice Silent-700 model 785. The thing that distinguishes this terminal from the others is that it has real lower case letters (versus the original Silent 700's "short" upper case standing in for lower case). Works fine, $25 + postage. Third a very nice Trimm Technologies 19" rack mount box. This box has a full rack slide mounting kit (both the rails and the slides for the rack) so you can put it into a 19" rack, it is 4U high and has an opening in the front for a 5.25" full height peripheral (disk or tape). It also has the mounting brackets for said peripheral which will hold either one or two devices (you could, for example, mount a CDROM drive and a DAT drive above each other. Inside is a standard switching power supply with at least 8 "standard" power plugs for SCSI devices (4 pin disk/tape power plug). There are also two SCSI-2 connectors on the back, each connected to a long ribbon cable inside (reaches to the front of the box) to allow you to run dual busses. This is extremely useful on VAXen where you have one SCSI controller talking to a tape drive and the other talking to a bunch of disks. The power switch comes to the front and has a 'Highland Digital' logo on it. There are many strategically placed holes on the bottom for mounting additional disk drives or brackets for more stuff. $20 plus postage takes it, if you want just the rack slides I'll understand can send just those. They are the 40 lb ones (1" wide) versus the 100 lb ones (3" wide) If no one wants this stuff I'll probably put it up on Ebay. --Chuck

25 years

2
1
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non HP RPN calculators (was: Re: SemiOT: Mourning for

by dittman＠dittman.net

> #As I said, I find any calculator other than an RPN one to be very > #difficult to use (and I make a lot of mistakes attempting to do so). > #There would have to be something _very_ special in a non-RPN machine > to > #convince me to use it... > # > #-tony > > I totally agree with this. I bought an HP 21 when I was in college > (the first calculator I owned, and which I stll have), and even today I > have a hard time figuring out when to hit the "=" sign on non-RPN > calculators. What's so hard about a non-RPN calculator? If you want to do the equivalent of 2+2, you enter 2, +, 2, and =. For a non-RPN calculator you basically enter the calculation the same way you write it. If you've got a non-simple calculation and you've not a calculator with ( and ) you can use them, too (most reasonable calculators have them). -- Eric Dittman dittman(a)dittman.net School Zones: Man's attempt to thwart natural selection.

25 years

2
1
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SemiOT: Mourning for Classic Computing

by dhquebbeman＠theestopinalgroup.com

> On Fri, 17 Aug 2001, Douglas Quebbeman wrote: > > > I do think it's less likely for someone to pick up bad programming > > habits if they start with Pascal, but that's not an absolute, just a > > probability thing. > > Bad programming habits are either LEARNED or NOT CORRECTED early enough! Semantics? Around here, "picked up" would include LEARNing, among other things... > My high school computer science teacher was a great TEACHER. I envy people who had the benefit of teachers whose skills were farther advanced than those of the students. No one could ever answer the questions I asked, so I realized I'd have to teach myself. > TEACHERS make all the difference! So it is imperative that you go out and > find STUDENTS to TEACH! I find myself in a bad situation everytime someone wants me to "show them"; I show them precisely as I learned, and they just give me deer-in-the-headlight look. As I said above, no one taught me, so I'm clueless as to how to teach others. Regards, -dq

25 years

3
2
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Assembly vs. Everything Else (was: SemiOT: Mourning for ClassicComputing)

by mcguire＠neurotica.com

On August 18, Jeffrey S. Sharp wrote: > > Now, why is it so important to have a PRINT statement? > > Iggy Drougge said: > > So that you may print "HELLO WORLD". It's essential for the newbie. > > Please bear with me. Does it have to be "HELLO WORLD" exactly, or could > something different suffice? This is an important point...It needs to be "HELLO WORLD" exactly, otherwise it won't work. -Dave -- Dave McGuire Laurel, MD

25 years

1
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SemiOT: Mourning for Classic Computing

by jeff.kaneko＠juno.com

On Fri, 17 Aug 2001 23:23:05 +0100 (BST) ard(a)p850ug1.demon.co.uk (Tony Duell) writes: >> The assembly languages I like are ones where the instructions and > addressing modes are 'orthogonal'. That is to say that any > instruction can use any addressing mode, and any registers. Like a PDP11 or a > P800, or to a lesser extent the VAX. That was the cool thing about the NS-32000's-- it was designed to be *very* orthogonal. I find it very sucky that good design is frequently hampered by crappy marketing. > The ones I dislike are the ones with all sorts of special cases (the > destination operand must be in this register unless it's this mode, > etc). Well, after having had to program one for a while, the Z-80 definitely fits into this category. I strongly suspect that parts from that era had these design aspects (e.g. orthogonality) limited by their die size. ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj.

25 years

1
0
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free for postage or or toss

by thompson＠mail.athenet.net

VITALINK Translan 350 bridge. LAN interface: ethernet II or 202.3 Data link: V.35, DS-1, RS232, RS499 Data Link speed: 9.6kbs to 2.048Mbps Dimensions: 5.5in x 17.5in x 23.5in Weight: 32lbs, 14.5Kg (Motorola 68000 processor, as I recall) Includes two manuals and a floppies that worked to boot the machine several years ago. Software Version 10.4 Ref. Manual Gettings started guide. >From about 1988-1990 timeframe. --

25 years

1
1
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Marketing (was RE: SemiOT: Mourning for Classic Computing)

by zaft＠azstarnet.com

At 07:15 AM 8/16/2001 -0400, you wrote: >I've always believed that consumers should research the products they >purchase, and that a good product will sell itself. Marketing merely >raises the ultimate costs of a product, so perhaps you'll understand >why I don't have a very high opinion of it. Or of a generation or >programmers who rose to serve marketing's needs. While marketing costs money that must be recovered in sales, if a product has a high volume in can be sold at a smaller margin and therefore cost less than it otherwise would. Therefore good (<-) marketing can lower the price of a product even though it adds to the cost. GZ

25 years

1
0
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DECMux 300?!?

by dittman＠dittman.net

> What the heck is a DECMUX 300? I thought it was a DECServer 200/MC when I > pulled it off the pallet but no, it wasn't. I think the DECmux 300 is a 8/16/32 port to single serial port multiplexor, usually used to multiplex several terminals over one high speed link, but my memory could be misfiring. -- Eric Dittman dittman(a)dittman.net School Zones: Man's attempt to thwart natural selection.

25 years

1
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Amiga magazines free/trade

by jimoaks＠hotmail.com

claude id love to get these, ive not much to trade but would be willing to pay you for them. Let me know Thanks Jim >From: "Claude.W" <claudew(a)videotron.ca> >Reply-To: classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org >To: <classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org> >Subject: Amiga magazines free/trade >Date: Fri, 17 Aug 2001 13:13:10 -0400 > >More Amiga mags to donate or trade. These are all clean: > >Amiga Transactor: 89: Jan, Oct, April, Sep, July, June, Feb, March, April >also Jun 88 > >Amigo Times : Issue' 1.2, 1.3, 1.4, 1.5, 1.6, 1.7, 1.8,.1.9 > >Always looking for 8/16 bit micros or semi-recent SGI or SUN >machines/hardware... > >Claude >http://www.members.tripod.com/computer_collector > > > _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp

25 years

1
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an odd question

by dhquebbeman＠theestopinalgroup.com

> Fred said: > > How about type balls > > I believe for the Selectric, being IBM, they would be blue. Postings are down, severe belly cramps again? ;-) -dq

25 years

1
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VAX stuff in OH, PA, NY, MA, CT, RI

by gunther＠aurora.regenstrief.org

Hi, I'm going to go on vacation with a car driving from Indy through OH, PA, NY to New Haven, CT, so I'll be close to everything on the east coast. Will visit NY city too. Now the question is anything VAX going on there? Do you know of any places where one could go browse and may be find stuff? Anyone who always wanted to get rid of something but was too afraid to ask? :-) I am especially interested in finding an RA90 or 92 somewhere just so to pick up so I finally can actually run my VAX 6460. I can store and ship larger items too. If I could find a star-coupler or a TU81+ that would be super cool. Of course I wouldn't mind tripping over a nice 11/785 :-) There's got to be something on the east coast, right? thanks for your suggestions, -Gunther -- Gunther Schadow, M.D., Ph.D. gschadow(a)regenstrief.org Medical Information Scientist Regenstrief Institute for Health Care Adjunct Assistant Professor Indiana University School of Medicine tel:1(317)630-7960 http://aurora.regenstrief.org

25 years

1
0
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SemiOT: Mourning for Classic Computing

by dhquebbeman＠theestopinalgroup.com

> >What I don't like is dog-and-pony shows, too much sturm und drang. > > It's all about sturm und drang. We had a kid in the neighborhood who was a great show-off... he used to ride his bicycle head-on at cars, doing a wheely, then veer off at the last second. I figured if he survived to adulthood, then there'd be a job in marketing for him. > Programming contests are another deal. They're just about academic > programming. Demos are more like MTV on a computer screen. Yeah, and I always considered MTV to be one big marketing outlet. At least I appear to have this in perspective now... I've always believed that consumers should research the products they purchase, and that a good product will sell itself. Marketing merely raises the ultimate costs of a product, so perhaps you'll understand why I don't have a very high opinion of it. Or of a generation or programmers who rose to serve marketing's needs. Regards, -dq

25 years

5
5
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DECMux 300?!?

by cmcmanis＠mcmanis.com

What the heck is a DECMUX 300? I thought it was a DECServer 200/MC when I pulled it off the pallet but no, it wasn't. --Chuck

25 years

1
0
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SemiOT: Mourning for Classic Computing

by dhquebbeman＠theestopinalgroup.com

> Douglas Quebbeman skrev: > > >> But then is Pascal that bad? > > >Bad? Bad at what? bad *for* what? > > We were discussing beginner's languages and alternative to BASIC. I do think it's less likely for someone to pick up bad programming habits if they start with Pascal, but that's not an absolute, just a probability thing. > I think the interpreter makes BASIC unequalled pedagogically. If you like the immediacy of the interpreter environment, you should try programming in Smalltalk-80. Typing an expression, selecting it, and choosing DO IT (or PRINT IT) >from the context menu is almost as fast as ?"This is a test" -dq

25 years

3
2
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Keyboard for VT320

by matt＠knm.yi.org

Hi, A friend of mine was recently given a vt320 - unfortunatly it's keyboardless - don't spose anyone's got one spare (preferably in the UK)? -- Matt --- E-mail: matt(a)pkl.net, matt(a)knm.yi.org, matt(a)printf.net matt(a)m-techdiagnostics.ltd.uk, matthew.london(a)stud.umist.ac.uk mattl(a)vcd.student.utwente.nl, mlondon(a)mail.talk-101.com Web Page: http://knm.yi.org/ http://pkl.net/~matt/ PGP Key fingerprint = 00BF 19FE D5F5 8EAD 2FD5 D102 260E 8BA7 EEE4 8D7F PGP Key http://knm.yi.org/matt-pgp.html

25 years

11
16
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classiccmp-digest V1 #690

by Alan.Pearson＠cramersystems.com

Various people wrote: > CESIL (Computer Education in Schools Instructional Language), Ha ha, I'd forgotten about that one... I remember typing in a CESIL interpreter into the Speccy from some magazine or other. It was even slower than ZX BASIC though so I gave up on it after a couple of weeks.. > If the eight-bitters had booted into Pascal, perhaps things would have > looked differently? For me the immediacy of an interpreted language was what made it fun, and therefore encouraged me to find out more about programming. We were taught PASCAL and 6809 assembly in my first year at college, both excellent learning languages (one for high-level structured programming and the other for the low-level 'how a computer computes' stuff) - both were nowhere near as much fun as BASIC because you had to compile/assemble them before you could "do anything". A lot of the time was spent learning the language syntax ("why does it need a semicolon here" or "why does the opcode need to go at least one space in") rather than learning programming concepts, which I found a bit distracting. OK nowadays it's not a big deal to pick up a new language, but when I was just starting out learning non-intuitive rules about semicolons was quite a headache. Compare the possible pitfalls in here (what are INPUT, OUTPUT? why no semicolon after BEGIN and WHILE (TRUE)? why a full stop after the last END? what does 'while true' really mean anyway? etc) PROGRAM SayHello(INPUT, OUTPUT) BEGIN WHILE (TRUE) BEGIN WRITELN('Hello World'); END; END. when compared to this: 10 PRINT "Hello World" 20 GOTO 10 BASIC's appeal was its simplicity and immediacy. I don't agree with Wirth that it pollutes the mind irrevocably either, I mostly use C++ or Java these days and never have to use the much-maligned 'goto'. The only time I use global data is for the occasional acceptable (even trendy!) "singleton" design pattern :-) --al PS I guess my mind has been polluted though, I'd rather hack 68K any day ;-)

25 years

4
3
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Amiga magazines free/trade

by claudew＠videotron.ca

More Amiga mags to donate or trade. These are all clean: Amiga Transactor: 89: Jan, Oct, April, Sep, July, June, Feb, March, April also Jun 88 Amigo Times : Issue' 1.2, 1.3, 1.4, 1.5, 1.6, 1.7, 1.8,.1.9 Always looking for 8/16 bit micros or semi-recent SGI or SUN machines/hardware... Claude http://www.members.tripod.com/computer_collector

25 years

1
0
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SPARCStations anyone?

by LFessen106＠aol.com

In a message dated 8/17/01 12:21:45 PM Eastern Daylight Time, pechter(a)bg-tc-ppp389.monmouth.com writes: > > I've got a nice one (SLC I think) here... I added 64mb (4 16mb) of 72 pin > parity simms and it works great if anyone's interested in a sparc in > a mono monitor. > > I've also got an IPX (64mb of memory) available if anyone's interested. > > Bill Heck yeah Bill! -Linc Fessenden In The Beginning there was nothing, which exploded - Yeah right... Calculating in binary code is as easy as 01,10,11.

25 years

1
0
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tape drive question

by ojw＠dircon.co.uk

Hi. Having recently been the happy recipient of an HP 7978 tape drive I have set about the task of finding new blank tapes for it. Not too difficult until faced with the embarrassing question of whether my tapes need to be Wright Line seal or Easy Load (Auto Load ?). My vintage magnetic media experience doesn't go much beyond 8 inch disks, so I wondered if anyone could please give me some hints on how to answer this. (Of course I haven't got any manuals). Thanks in advance.

25 years

2
1
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DECserver 90M fault codes

by mrbill＠mrbill.net

I've got the manual, but it doesent go into detail about the fault/failure codes. I dont have a console terminal or ethernet connection hooked up to this yet - but when power is applied, it goes through the self-test, lighting up 8 7 6 5 4 3, then those LEDs blink, 2 and 1 are dark, and only the POWER LED is lit otherwise. Anybody know what this means, exactly? Is this a paperweight? Bill -- Bill Bradford mrbill(a)mrbill.net Austin, TX

25 years

2
1
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SemiOT: Mourning for Classic Computing

by dhquebbeman＠theestopinalgroup.com

> You still don't get it. Demos have no marketing relevance whatsoever. They're > done just for the fun of it, and the prestige. They don't fulfill any needs > and don't claim to do it. I don't even see why I'm trying to explain to you, > you don't even seem to read what I write. No, I trying very hard to grok this. Is this in the United States? What part of the country? It doesn't happen around here (Louisville, KY metro area), I'd have heard of it. Given the Internet, I suppose my world shouldn't be limited to a 150-mile radius, but in a way, it is. -dq

25 years

2
1
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Romar TOY-11

by taylor＠crystal.nrl.navy.mil

I have this qbus board that is a date/time clock. It was made by Romar Peripherals and looks very simple, does anyone have any info on this board? I would like to use it in a RT11 system to set the date/time automatically. It is based on a National Semiconductor 58167 clock chip, I think the board is set to respond to an address176600.

25 years

1
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Altair32 News

by RCini＠congressfinancial.com

Hello, all: Just to relay some great news. Theo has killed the last of the nagging bugs in the processor core (mostly flag-setting stuff) and has successfully gotten Altair BASIC 3.2 (4k BASIC) to run!!! I have some code to cleanup tonight and I'll post new sources over the weekend. Woo, hoo! http://highgate.comm.sfu.ca/~rcini/classiccmp/Altair32.htm Rich ========================== Richard A. Cini, Jr. Congress Financial Corporation 1133 Avenue of the Americas 30th Floor New York, NY 10036 (212) 545-4402 (212) 840-6259 (facsimile)

25 years

1
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SPARCStations anyone?

by LFessen106＠aol.com

In a message dated 8/16/01 10:27:57 PM Eastern Daylight Time, cmcmanis(a)mcmanis.com writes: > Is anyone on the list interested in SPARCStation 1's ? > --Chuck Sure! -Linc Fessenden In The Beginning there was nothing, which exploded - Yeah right... Calculating in binary code is as easy as 01,10,11.

25 years

1
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SPARCStations anyone?

by marino13＠btinternet.com

I would be but I'm presuming you're in the States right? > Is anyone on the list interested in SPARCStation 1's ? > --Chuck >

25 years

1
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terminal inventiveness (was Re: an odd question

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

From: Stan Sieler <sieler(a)allegro.com> To: Chuck McManis <cmcmanis(a)mcmanis.com>; classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org > So here are some specific questions that might be interesting to answer: > 1) What was the first example of a TERMINAL (See above)? In the late 60s I did use the H1000 (hazeltine) wich was glass tty. > 2) When was a processor (micro, bit-slice, whatever) first > DEDICATED to operating a terminal? That came in the mid 70s, later than some of the terminals that could do #3. > 3) What is the first terminal that could manipulate its own > buffer memory in response to a "control" code? at least one example was the VT52, it had gotoxy and a few other controls but was not uP based. > 4) What is the first terminal that could display graphics and > text? (either alternately or simultaneously) I beleve the TEK401x and even the tube in the PDP1 (vector graphics) could do that. Likely predates standalone tubes. However the first serious graphics tube I encountered as a text/standalone was VT100 with line drawing or VT125 with regis/sixel and VT100 text. 5) what was the first terminal to have memory "above" the screen? (I.e., some number of lines could scroll off the top, but could still be scrolled back later) (Probably HP 2640A) This was implemented on the SWTP CT1024 many others did it. 6) what was first terminal with user-installable option cards? (Probably HP 2640A) H1500, Vt100, CT1024 and others. Allison

25 years

2
1
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Upcoming Garage Sale

by kyrrin＠bluefeathertech.com

Greetings, port-VAX'ers and CLASSICCMP'ers, I wanted to let you all know I'm going to be doing a one-day-only garage sale on Sep. 15th (Saturday) from 10:00 to 17:00 at 12641 SE 277th Pl., Kent, WA (southeast of Seattle). I'll be clearing out a bunch of VAXen and Qbus stuff, along with disk drives, cables, tape devices, test gear, etc. If you're local to the area, or going to be in the area, swing by. I never know when I'll be putting out something that someone may have been digging for. Thanks much for the small bit of advertising space. -- Bruce Lane, Owner & Head Hardware Heavy, Blue Feather Technologies -- http://www.bluefeathertech.com ARS KC7GR (formerly WD6EOS) since 12-77. "Plut? Ahh, Gribble Snort!"

25 years

1
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terminal inventiveness (was Re: an odd question

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

From: Lawrence LeMay <lemay(a)cs.umn.edu> >Fairly early examples are: > prior to this there was the H1000. >2/70 TEC inc. model 410/415, 420/425, 430/435 > >4/70 Applied Digital Data Systems (ADDS) Consul 920 > >5/70 Univac Uniscope 100 > >10/70 Hazeltine 2000 > >> >> 2) When was a processor (micro, bit-slice, whatever) first >> DEDICATED to operating a terminal? >> >> 3) What is the first terminal that could manipulate its own >> buffer memory in response to a "control" code? >> >> 4) What is the first terminal that could display graphics and >> text? (either alternately or simultaneously) >> >> I'm guessing that the Lear-Seigler machines were near the front... > >Nope. The ADM-1A didnt come out until 8/73. There were many out there befor the ADM1A, When that one hit VT05s were around. See 1973 small computer handbook. The ADM1 was notable for several reasons but being first was not it. the fact that it was lower in cost than many and by 1975 avaiable as a KIT for much less made it popular. For me I'd been using electronic terminals for a few years by 1973 with the H1000, VT05 being notables but there were others around. Allison

25 years

1
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Who reads their email the most Classically?

by fmc＠reanimators.org

"Curt Vendel" <curt(a)atari-history.com> wrote: > Is anyone running any internet connected lynx servers with dialup > capability??? I've wanted to do this myself as many older Atari 8-bit > groups would like access for email and newsgroup reading to stay connected > with the online Atari communities. They're called "shell accounts". Yes, they exist as commercial offerings. For example, Panix in NYC (http://www.panix.com/) and a2i communications in the San Francisco Bay Area (http://www.rahul.net/). -Frank McConnell

25 years

3
2
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Big Iron

by CAA007216＠mail.ono.es

Is there somebody out there with space to get this "microcomputer": http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1625704207 Greetings Sergio

25 years

2
1
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PDP-8/i Question

by djg＠drs-esg.com

>From: "Will Jennings" <xds_sigma7(a)hotmail.com> > >OK, >How the hell do you tell if the thing is negative or positive bus? I need to >know this before I go and buy some peripherals... > If the lower rows have M650/M651 then it is negative bus. I'm sure your's is positive bus so you won't be going after the stuff I want :-). David Gesswein http://www.pdp8.net/ -- Run an old computer with blinkenlights. Have any PDP-8 stuff you're willing to part with?

25 years

1
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WTB/T: hp-21 battery pack anyone?

by cmcmanis＠mcmanis.com

Well since it appears I'll be holding on to this calculator, and I've verified that it does indeed work if I kludge up a battery pack. Does anyone have a spare HP battery pack I could buy/trade for? It doesn't particularly matter if the pack is dead, we can rebuild it :-) --Chuck

25 years

7
8
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Fwd: Apple IIgs rescue in Florida

by jfoust＠threedee.com

>From: Compnavi(a)aol.com >Date: Tue, 14 Aug 2001 20:13:23 EDT >Subject: Computer Donation >To: jfoust(a)threedee.com > >Mr. Foust - > >Due to the fact that computers have so drastically revolutionized the world >and the way we live, and due to the fact that proper history of computers and >a collection demonstrating this history will be more valuable than a >collection of historical automobiles or planes, or any item collected >previously, it would be my pleasure to offer you a piece of computer history >for your collection. > >I would like to donate to your museum a perfectly working and complete Apple >IIgs setup. ? This setup includes the computer itself, the standard issue >Apple monitor, a 5.25" floppy drive, a 3.5" floppy drive, a dot-matrix >printer, and a full suite of software. The software diskettes still sit in >their original boxes. ? The equipment is in perfect condition ??? neither a >scratch nor a crack to be seen. All is Apple brand equipment purchased at >the same time. > >The IIgs became a staple in classrooms around the country, and in American >homes. ? Its role as one of the first computers to be mass-produced and >integrated into education deserves special recognition. ? As a member of the >teen generation ??? a generation that has grown up with Apple and the IIgs ??? >this computer is a part of our history, and part of our memory. Just as >exhibits regarding the fifties and sixties make the baby boomers blush and >remember fondly their childhood when regarding tinker toys, Lincoln Logs, and >tin lunch boxes ??? and then remember Armstrong stepping on the moon, Kennedy >being shot, and King???s great words, my generation will look back at our >computers, and other electronic amusements, and wander back to a time we long >to remember ??? and yet we might not have such great men and shining moments to >draw an association to. ? Our technological triumph may be the only great >endeavor of my generation's childhood, but its effect will be long lasting. > >Use the Apple IIgs I offer you in an exhibit now, or store it for display >later, but please don't let it end up where it is currently destined: the >county dump. > >Please feel free to contact me if you have any questions or assorted points >of inquiry. > >Sincerely, > >? - Josh Mendelsohn > >_________________________ >Joshua Marc Mendelsohn >3101 North 47th Avenue >Hollywood, FL 33021 >(954) 962-0505 >compnavi(a)aol.com

25 years

1
0
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Down-under articles on retrocomputing

by jfoust＠threedee.com

>Date: Tue, 14 Aug 2001 14:38:13 +1000 >From: Nathan Cochrane <ncochrane(a)theage.fairfax.com.au> >Reply-To: ncochrane(a)theage.fairfax.com.au >Organization: The Age newspaper >To: "Nathan Cochrane (E-mail)" <ncochrane(a)theage.fairfax.com.au> >Subject: Many thanks for your help on the emulation article > >Once again, my deep appreciation for your help in compiling the >article(s), which you will find online at: > >Bernie's lost in time >Bernie Meyer flips a CD-ROM into his PC and, in an instant, turns it >into a time machine. Within a few seconds an old friend ? a red and >white chequered ball ? bounces around the screen. Welcome to Amiga, >circa 1985. >http://www.it.mycareer.com.au/news/2001/08/14/FFX6PT25BQC.html > >When I grow up I'll be a Mac >Emulators fall into the category of virtual machines, a class that takes >in Sun Microsystems' Java. The emulator software makes a PC, Macintosh, >Linux or any other desktop think it's another computer or console game >system. >http://www.it.mycareer.com.au/news/2001/08/14/FFXAYW25BQC.html > >Going retro >It was a humble Sinclair Spectrum computer that, nearly two decades ago, >nudged the teenage Pierre Scotney on to a path of programming and logic >that he hopes will lead to a gene therapy for heart disease. >http://www.it.mycareer.com.au/news/2001/08/13/FFXGPU25BQC.html > >If you have problems getting a hard copy of today's paper, let me know >and I will organise to have one sent to you. > >This is the first of two packages on emulation and retrocomputing. The >second will appear in the Livewire supplement embedded in the Green >Guide liftout, probably in the next 13-20 days. > >All the best > >Nathan

25 years

1
0
0 0

Need ST506-based HD (20MByte or 55MByte)

by rmeenaks＠olf.com

Hi, Does anyone have a spare ST506-based HD laying around unused. I am specifically looking for a 20MByte or 55Mbyte in size. Here is the models I am specifically looking for: NEC D3126 Olivetti HD352 But any would do. I am planning on reviving a TMB05 transputer disk controller (M212-based transputer tram motherboard with a ST506 disk drive interface). This is just one of the many missing pieces. The board is basically unsocketed, so it is missing a lot of chips, etc including the M212. I found a source for the M212, but still need a HD. Thanks, Ram -- ,,,, /'^'\ ( o o ) -oOOO--(_)--OOOo------------------------------------- | Ram Meenakshisundaram | | Senior Software Engineer | | OpenLink Financial Inc | | .oooO Phone: (516) 227-6600 x267 | | ( ) Oooo. Email: rmeenaks(a)olf.com | ---\ (----( )-------------------------------------- \_) ) / (_/

25 years

3
4
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SemiOT: Mourning for Classic Computing

by jeff.kaneko＠juno.com

On Thu, 16 Aug 2001 07:15:53 -0400 Douglas Quebbeman <dhquebbeman(a)theestopinalgroup.com> writes: > We had a kid in the neighborhood who was a great show-off... > he used to ride his bicycle head-on at cars, doing a wheely, > then veer off at the last second. Hey! That could have been me! We put together a bike from misc parts, but didn't have a proper rear wheel (a 'front' wheel was substituted). The result? The Kamikaze Bike: No Brakes. No Pedals. No Fear. I piloted that sucker down the street in front of our house (it was a fairly steep hill). I crashed and burned into a hedge at the bottom, but oooooh what a rush. > I figured if he survived to adulthood, then there'd be a > job in marketing for him. Well, I survived into adulthood, and became a programmer-- go figure. > Marketing merely raises the ultimate costs of a product, so > perhaps you'll understand why I don't have a very high > opinion of it. Or of a generation or programmers who rose > to serve marketing's needs. Marketing has another *very* undesirable effect-- It allows lousy products to succeed, and good products to fail (for lack of). I would rant and rave about how these 'successful' products then frequently become 'standards', but I won't beat that rotting, stinking horse anymore. OB Classic: Yesterday I scored a VaxStation 4000/90 with 2 x 600mb drives, and 128Mb of RAM (or thereabouts-- it has 8 x 16Mb simms). Jeff ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj.

25 years

2
1
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Who reads their email the most Classically?

by dhquebbeman＠theestopinalgroup.com

> I am of the school of thought that figures the only reason for quoting > previous content is to provide context so the new message will make > sense. Following this reasoning, the context should be established > first. HOWEVER, it is very important to trim the quote so that it > only provides enough context and doesn't go overboard and turn into > spam. Ever seen the TV program "The West Wing"? They start most > programs with a short "previously on The West Wing..."-bit. It comes > first (so the following program will make sense) and it is shorter > than the new program (even though it covers more territory--the idea > is that it be the new stuff that is important). I hate to be such a ditto-head, but... what Kent said. -dq

25 years

1
0
0 0

Dead PC

by technos＠nerdland.org

Any fine metal cleaner should work, just apply with a Q-Tip and rinse well with water. IBM uses a dilute phosphoric acid solution, as does HP. I normally use 00 or finer steel wool, and just a little. I've also used commercial jewelery cleaner, and above mentioned Q-Tip.. Jim On Wednesday, August 15, 2001 1:30 AM, Chad Fernandez [SMTP:fernande@internet1.net] wrote: > pull > the socketed ram chips and clean them. I have heard of some Apple // > guys using some sort of cleaner on chips.... I think it was something > like TarnX, or something found at the grocery store. Maybe Tony > could > recommend something, too. > > Chad Fernandez > Michigan, USA > > > Matt Wilda wrote: > > > I sold the PC on Ebay after I was tired of it. > > > > Yeah, I'm the guy that bought it :-) This is your old PC. BTW, a > > friend of mine was able to get me another monitor for it. > > > > I'll try messing with it a little more this afternoon. Thanks to > > everyone for the suggestions.

25 years

6
5
0 0

IBM PS/2 Keyboard Cable

by matt＠knm.yi.org

Hi, I've got a PS/2 keyboard (IBM keyboards were the best thing to happen to PC keyboard IMHO, apart from the first one) but unfortunatly the cable is going on this one. I was wondering if anyone would have such a thing as a replacement cable (silly flat connector at one end to PS2 at the other) :&) -- Matt --- E-mail: matt(a)pkl.net, matt(a)knm.yi.org, matt(a)printf.net matt(a)m-techdiagnostics.ltd.uk, matthew.london(a)stud.umist.ac.uk mattl(a)vcd.student.utwente.nl, mlondon(a)mail.talk-101.com Web Page: http://knm.yi.org/ http://pkl.net/~matt/ PGP Key fingerprint = 00BF 19FE D5F5 8EAD 2FD5 D102 260E 8BA7 EEE4 8D7F PGP Key http://knm.yi.org/matt-pgp.html

25 years

9
18
0 0

ancient laserjets

by technos＠crosswinds.net

Heh.. I once personally passed 7,000 sheets per day through a III for four days straight. One jam, one swap of the cartridge, and a quick swipe with a cleaning cloth to kill the dust. Greatest, most bullet-proof printer I've ever used, with a slight exception for an old Pitney Bowes laser.. I still prefer them, to the point of refusing a HP4 in trade for it.. Jim On Wednesday, August 15, 2001 11:14 PM, Richard Erlacher [SMTP:edick@idcomm.com] wrote: > > passes self > test and also prints cleanly. It has 85k sheets through it, though. > My two > 10-year old (got 'em new) LJIII's have about 15k sheets through them, > combined.

25 years

4
3
0 0

SemiOT: Mourning for Classic Computing

by dhquebbeman＠theestopinalgroup.com

> > > Most assemblers haven't got a PRINT statement, so, no, I don't think so. > > > Depends upon the environment. Under AmigaOS you have RawDoFmt(), which is > > part of Exec and available to Assembly language programmers (and it works > > similar to C's printf()). Under MS-DOS you have INT 21h, funtion 9, which > > prints a text string (ended by a `$'). But all you really need is a way to > > print out characters, leaving printing of numeric values as a programming > > exercise. > > Besides, why not steal such stuff from BASIC ROM? On the C64, print a string > from memory by setting A/Y to the localtion and jsr $ab1e, and use the routine > at $bdcd that LIST uses to print line numbers for 16-bit unsigned int. This is the kind of thing on the PC that I was ranting about... C64, my dog ain't in that fight... Oh well... -dq

25 years

1
0
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ancient laserjets

by technos＠nerdland.org

One PC to fill the buffer, print bridge from a pair of AS/400. One secretary watching over it, then the night IS guy. Y2K BS, we were printing every line of in-house code on the machines. Really got off on telling the IS veep we had three million lines of legacy code tho.. Thought he was about to soil his Brooks Brothers.. Jim On Thursday, August 16, 2001 12:27 AM, Richard Erlacher [SMTP:edick@idcomm.com] wrote: > It's good to know that some LJ3's hold up that well. If you pass the > rated 8 > ppm through them you only have time time for 11520 sheets in 24 hours. > > 7000/11520 is pretty busy, representing over 14.5 hours of constantly > full > utilization. Somebody must have stood there to refill the tray while > 3-4 > computers kept the buffer full. I'd say you were geting your money's > worth > during that timespan. > > I don't like the later laser printers either, though they don't cost > as much as > they once did. I have an Okidata OL-1200 which emulates an HP4 pretty > well, and > prints a genuine 12 ppm at 600 DPI, and somewhat faster in text-only. > It has > the advantage that you can refill the toner reservoir yourself. > > Dick > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Jim Tuck" <technos(a)crosswinds.net> > To: <classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org> > Sent: Wednesday, August 15, 2001 9:55 PM > Subject: RE: ancient laserjets > > > > Heh.. I once personally passed 7,000 sheets per day through a > > III for four days straight. One jam, one swap of the cartridge, and > > a quick swipe with a cleaning cloth to kill the dust. > > > > Greatest, most bullet-proof printer I've ever used, with a slight > > exception for an old Pitney Bowes laser.. I still prefer them, to > > the > > point of refusing a HP4 in trade for it.. > > > > Jim

25 years

1
0
0 0

68020 ISA card

by mcguire＠neurotica.com

On August 15, Bob Stek wrote: > If it's a Calera board, it was designed by our own Jim Battle (come on > out and take a bow, Jim!). Kick ass! Great job, Jim! I was really impressed with that board. It did a wonderful job, and seemed very well-designed. > Semi-OT Small World Dept. - In 1987 I used a Palantir OCR unit (5 68000 > CPU's and 2MB ROM code) to convert all 60 Sherlock Holmes stories into > machine readable ASCII format (sold several hundred copies of 'An > Electronic Holmes Companion.') Soon after, Palantir was bought by > Calera, and Jim Battle designed the ASIC for their board. Nearly 10 > years later I hook up with Jim Battle when I send him a copy of the Sol > User's Manual, and he remembers having heard about this guy who used the > Palantir to scan the Holmes stories! Interesting...the Calera board and software that I used created ".pda" files...for "Palantir Document Architecture". -Dave -- Dave McGuire Laurel, MD

25 years

1
0
0 0

He's just checking-in . . .

by jeff.kaneko＠juno.com

Gee, I dunno-- From the archetecture, it looks like it was built in the early 20th century, but that's just a guess. OB Classic: WHen I lived in Baltimore (in 1980), I used to be a field service droid for a local business machine company (now defunct). We were totally floored when we unpacked the first 'Winchester' drive we ever sold to one of our CADO customers. A whopping 10Mb on an 18-inch platter. "Ten MILLION bytes!" by boss exclaimed, in sheer disbelief. Those *were* the days . . . . On Wed, 15 Aug 2001 15:19:35 -0400 Eric Chomko <chomko(a)greenbelt.com> writes: Yes, yes, you can see the Bromo Seltzer tower from Camden Yards as well. But what year was it built? Eric

25 years

1
0
0 0

Online version of 8080 manual

by rcini＠optonline.net

Hello, all: Does anyone have a pointer to an on-line version of the Intel 8080 datasheet? Before I begin to scan mine for posting, I thought that I'd check. Thanks. Rich Rich Cini Collector of classic computers Build Master for the Altair32 Emulation Project Web site: http://highgate.comm.sfu.ca/~rcini/classiccmp/ /************************************************************/

25 years

1
0
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68020 ISA card

by r.stek＠snet.net

If it's a Calera board, it was designed by our own Jim Battle (come on out and take a bow, Jim!). Semi-OT Small World Dept. - In 1987 I used a Palantir OCR unit (5 68000 CPU's and 2MB ROM code) to convert all 60 Sherlock Holmes stories into machine readable ASCII format (sold several hundred copies of 'An Electronic Holmes Companion.') Soon after, Palantir was bought by Calera, and Jim Battle designed the ASIC for their board. Nearly 10 years later I hook up with Jim Battle when I send him a copy of the Sol User's Manual, and he remembers having heard about this guy who used the Palantir to scan the Holmes stories! Bob Stek Saver of Lost Sols

25 years

1
0
0 0

SemiOT: Mourning for Classic Computing

by dhquebbeman＠theestopinalgroup.com

> Douglas Quebbeman skrev: > > >Seriously, what's a demo programmer? A programmer who writes > >only demo software? As in mock-ups? Prototypes? > > A demo is a demonstration, showing off your programming/gfx/music talent. > The demo crews arrange demo parties where they display their demos and win > prices. It's all about pushing the limits of what's possible on a computer. > Still, I doubt that Doug would like demo programmers. They're usually all > quick'n'dirty, not a trace of the kind of academic programming practices which > Doug seems to prefer. What I don't like is dog-and-pony shows, too much sturm und drang. I *have* developed prototypes, and told the boss to keep the client as far away from seeing it as humanly possible. Let the marketing people suck the money out of the vulture capitalists, no felching for me. Maybe you're talking about programming contests? If so, you're right, I never liked them; and like multiple-choice tests, which basically test your ability to take tests, programming contests basically demonstrate your ability to demonstrate and to participate in contests, neither of which interest me. Regards, -doug q

25 years

3
2
0 0

Wanted : 8" boot disk for TRS80 Model II

by geoffr＠zipcon.net

My First 'Nix box was a 16..... :) At 12:27 PM 8/15/01 -0400, you wrote: >On Tue, 14 Aug 2001, Claude.W wrote: > > > I have fanilly gotten around to checking this model II/expansion box that > > was saved from garbage truck. > > > > Very clean, no crt burn and a missing keyboard problem that was solved by > > Hans Franke sending one he had all the way from Germany! > > > > Id like to show this thing off a bit more then just turning it on and > seeing > > ask for a disk....I dont think Ill be able to boot this from 5.25" 1.2M > > drives connected to this... > > > > The unit came with a single 8" diskette that does not boot (written > > "accounts receivable"). I dont know if its the floppy drive that is bad or > > its not a bootable diskette or....internal 8" floppy drive looks "alive" > > anyways... > > > > So I am asking if anyone as a easy way of making an 8" boot disk in this > > situation or would be nice enough to provide me with one. > > > > Id like to get at least one. Better would be one of each OS this thing ran > > and a few softs. > > > > I have a fairly large "for trade/giveaway" list of witch you could pick > > something to thank you for the troubles... > > > > Thanks > > Claude > > http://www.members.tripod.com/computer_collector > >Well, I'm hurt. :-) > >You should have come to me first. I have a Model 16 (two actually, but >one is jsut for parts.) I have TRSDOS, TRSDOS-II, TRSDOS-16 (which you >can't run) and both the Z80 and 68K versions of UCSDPascal. Come to >think of it, I also have Pickles & Trout CPM around here somewhere. >Oh wait, I also have Xenix for the Model-16. What a collection. > >So, you want a couple of Model-16's with all the stuff that goes with them?? >One of these days the list will get big enough for you to make the trip >down here to pick this stuff up. :-) > >bill > >-- >Bill Gunshannon | de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n. Three wolves >bill(a)cs.scranton.edu | and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. >University of Scranton | >Scranton, Pennsylvania | #include <std.disclaimer.h>

25 years

1
0
0 0

Fujitsu drives (was Re: Service does still exist....)

by geoffr＠zipcon.net

They left the desktop market (IDE, some scsi) and are retaining the "Enterprise" market 'At 08:27 AM 8/15/01 -0500, you wrote: >Didn't Fujitsu just (within the last week) exit the hard disk market? Or >was it just desktop (IDE) drives?

25 years

1
0
0 0

SemiOT: Mourning for Classic Computing (Was: RE: PeeCee turns 20) [longish]

by dhquebbeman＠theestopinalgroup.com

> On Wed, 15 Aug 2001, Douglas Quebbeman wrote: > > > > Where on earth are LARTs illegal?!? And how did this come to pass?!? > > At the time of writing, I was thinking of a thermonuclear LART... Fussion tends to eradicate the memory of the pain, so I stick with bamboo LARTs... when not in LART mode, it's backscratcher, so no one realizes the potential.... -dq

25 years

3
2
0 0

SemiOT: Mourning for Classic Computing (Was: RE: PeeCee turns 20) [longish]

by dhquebbeman＠theestopinalgroup.com

> On Tue, 14 Aug 2001, Douglas Quebbeman wrote: > > > > And as to lusers with a little too much knowledge... yeah, they can be > > a problem, and a LART's not always at hand... > > ...or worth the resulting jail time! :-) Where on earth are LARTs illegal?!? And how did this come to pass?!? > > Well, you won't get much disagreement from me here... but I've seen > > COBOL code that was more spaghetti'd out than the worst BASIC I've > > seen... > > BASIC is an OK starting point for someone who's destined to be a good > programmer. Its problem is that it doesn't do enough to weed out the bad > ones, who will then progress furthur into the trade on the false > assumption that they have what it takes. I reference my previous post > about assembly language... ;-D Total agreement... -dq

25 years

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Desperately looking for an X11 server for Inmos G300-based boards

by rmeenaks＠olf.com

Hi, I am looking for X11R5 source code for the IMSB020 (aka "Bozo") graphics motherboard (contains a IMSG330) OR any other transputer-based X11 source code. Either that, or at least an implementation of an X11 server for the IMSG3xx chipset. I have the source code to the Helios OS for the transputer, but not the source to their X11R4 implementation. So, I want to port the X11R6.6 code over, but I also want an XServer as well. I believe John Honniball said he had it, but he never responds to me emails :-( Any help would help every transputer user. Thanks for your respond... Ram PS: I think the Amiga Visiona used the IMSG33x chipset, so that might help. But I couldnt find anything on the net.... -- ,,,, /'^'\ ( o o ) -oOOO--(_)--OOOo------------------------------------- | Ram Meenakshisundaram | | Senior Software Engineer | | OpenLink Financial Inc | | .oooO Phone: (516) 227-6600 x267 | | ( ) Oooo. Email: rmeenaks(a)olf.com | ---\ (----( )-------------------------------------- \_) ) / (_/

25 years

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He's just checking-in . . .

by jeff.kaneko＠juno.com

On Wed, 15 Aug 2001 09:16:13 -0700 (PDT) "Fred Cisin (XenoSoft)" <cisin(a)xenosoft.com> writes: > Historical? trivia: Coming into Baltimore from the south (on the > parkway, > long after passing GSFC and NSA), just as you reached Baltimore, > there was > a big clock tower. What did that clock have instead of numbers? O R M B O S R E E L Z T I love Baltimore. It's my favourite city.

25 years

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PDP-8/i Question

by xds_sigma7＠hotmail.com

OK, How the hell do you tell if the thing is negative or positive bus? I need to know this before I go and buy some peripherals... Thanks, Will J _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp

25 years

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SemiOT: Mourning for Classic Computing

by dhquebbeman＠theestopinalgroup.com

> I'd tend to agree, in general. However, I think something like MIPS > assembly (such as that taught in CS courses at UIUC) might work well as a > "learners" language, and doesn't require knowing TOO much of the hardware > (aside from the registers / memory distinction, which could be taught using > a "file cabinet / cubbyholes" analogy). Was the MIPS a true 3-address machine (or do I mean 3-operand?)? Or am I thinking of the NS32000 family? > But, yeah, I'd say BASIC is still a pretty good language to see if someone > can "get" programming -- provided that someone moves to a structured > language quickly if he or she wishes, instead of getting into bad > programming habits (as I did for a while). I grudgingly agree. Niklaus Wirth thought that BASIC hopelessly polluted a mind from every being a good programmer. I, too, think that's harsh, probably because I also started with (a superset of) BASIC, and wrote journal articles for two years for The Cobb Group's Inside Microsoft BASIC and Inside Quickbasic. And every time I think I've finally put it behind me, it creeps back into my life. Most recently, TOPS-10 BASIC running on a simulated DECSYSTEM-2020 (KS-10) (fixing MONPLY.BAS). -dq

25 years

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He's just checking-in . . .

by cfandt＠netsync.net

Just a brief report I'm passing on from Hans Franke who is wending his way Westward on his cross-country motorcycle journey to VCF 5.0. He reports he's been having a great time so far after he'd picked up the bike at the Baltimore seaport around a week or so ago. He came up through the York, PA area up to the North-Central PA area, thence Westward towards Jamestown. Stayed in our front yard in his rather interesting camper arrangement over Friday and Saturday night. He's got a small AutoCamp folding tent bolted to the top of the cargo box. The neighborhood up and down our dead end street was certainly curious about such an odd looking rig not to say the other motorcycle riders who had seen him riding through town. They seemed to drive off the side of the road while studying Hans' rig. Bev and I took him to his first live rodeo on Saturday night which is a fairly major Eastern rodeo on the PRCA professional circuit (http://gerryrodeo.org/). Always a good time there for all -especially the barbecue beef dinners the rodeo organizers put on. Personally, I like the pretty cowgirls in their Wrangler jeans ;-) Hans really had fun that day. We got him a Sprint PCS cellphone on my own SS and drivers license numbers (silly outfit couldn't take his German passport number for ID after he arrived in NYC). Seemingly the best coverage across the USA plus a rather reasonable deal for what he's going to use it. So now he's got communication when that Russian-made three-wheel cycle breaks down out at the head of nowhere ;-) We got the rear door hinge welded properly by one of my friends after it broke during the sea trip over. Hans figures the welder in the Ural factory had too much vodka that day. He should be down towards Columbus, OH at this time if he was able to get in contact with Ethan. Watch out Sellam and gang! The mad Bavarian is on his way West if that underpowered Ural engine can pull itself over the Rockys and if all the bolts don't rattle out of it! Regards, Chris -- -- Christian Fandt, Electronic/Electrical Historian Jamestown, NY USA cfandt(a)netsync.net Member of Antique Wireless Association URL: http://www.antiquewireless.org/

25 years

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Wanted : 8" boot disk for TRS80 Model II

by claudew＠videotron.ca

I have fanilly gotten around to checking this model II/expansion box that was saved from garbage truck. Very clean, no crt burn and a missing keyboard problem that was solved by Hans Franke sending one he had all the way from Germany! Id like to show this thing off a bit more then just turning it on and seeing ask for a disk....I dont think Ill be able to boot this from 5.25" 1.2M drives connected to this... The unit came with a single 8" diskette that does not boot (written "accounts receivable"). I dont know if its the floppy drive that is bad or its not a bootable diskette or....internal 8" floppy drive looks "alive" anyways... So I am asking if anyone as a easy way of making an 8" boot disk in this situation or would be nice enough to provide me with one. Id like to get at least one. Better would be one of each OS this thing ran and a few softs. I have a fairly large "for trade/giveaway" list of witch you could pick something to thank you for the troubles... Thanks Claude http://www.members.tripod.com/computer_collector

25 years

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Fujitsu drives (was Re: Service does still exist....)

by mjsnodgr＠rockwellcollins.com

"Messick, Gary" <Gary.Messick(a)itt.com>@classiccmp.org on 08/15/2001 08:27:07 AM Please respond to classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org Sent by: owner-classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org To: "'classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org'" <classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org> cc: Subject: RE: Fujitsu drives (was Re: Service does still exist....) Didn't Fujitsu just (within the last week) exit the hard disk market? Or was it just desktop (IDE) drives? > -----Original Message----- > From: Master of all that Sucks [mailto:vance@ikickass.org] > Sent: Tuesday, August 14, 2001 10:48 PM > To: Glenatacme(a)aol.com > Cc: classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org > Subject: Re: Fujitsu drives (was Re: Service does still exist....) > > > > Well, it usually the large-capacity (4.5+ GB) older > workstation drives. > One good way to find out is to ask Fujitsu. It's the path I normally > take. > > Peace... Sridhar > > On Tue, 14 Aug 2001 Glenatacme(a)aol.com wrote: > > > More information about this, please? If I find a Fujitsu > drive how can I > > tell if the lifetime warranty applies to that drive? > > > > Thanks, > > > > Glen > > 0/0 > > > =========================================================================== Yup - The Register (A British IT mag) just had an article on it: http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/7/20799.html "Fujitsu bows out of desktop hard drive fight By Robert Blincoe Posted: 02/08/2001 at 14:37 GMT Fujitsu is ditching the desktop hard disk market to concentrate on the notebook and server sectors where it believes it can make more money. The company will quit making desktop hard drives later this year. Mike Chenery, VP of Fujitsu Computer Products of America, acknowledged things had been difficult because of low margins, the markets' slow growth, and because Fujitsu hadn't been one of the first players competing in the sector. Fujitsu's competitors are IBM, Maxtor, Seagate, Western Digital, and Samsung in the desktop drive market. Interestingly, back in May, Paul Griffin, IBM's EMEA VP for its Technology Group, predicted it would be Samsung and Western Digital which would bow out of the sector first. He felt Fujitsu had deep enough pockets and technology ownership to last out the margin fight. Fujitsu had lost market share in the first half of 2001, and was in fifth place with to nine per cent. ? "

25 years

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SemiOT: Mourning for Classic Computing

by dhquebbeman＠theestopinalgroup.com

> > I've always thought that one of the more simple assembly languages would > > be a great 'first language' for someone wanting to learn how to program. > > Who's with me? > > I think S/360-S/370 assembler would work quite well. It starts out > exceedingly simple, then moves to variable length opcodes, variable word > length, four-level indirection, etc. Doesn't require it to do useful > stuff though. But I am a bit biased towards mainframes. Yeah, that was my first... in fact, at quitting time, I sometimes think "time to BALR *,HOME" or something like that... -dq

25 years

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Who reads their email the most Classically?

by jeff.kaneko＠juno.com

On Tue, 14 Aug 2001 23:56:50 -0500 (CDT) "Jeffrey S. Sharp" <jss(a)subatomix.com> writes: > Funny... I haven't seen very many people announcing their use of > Micro$oft Virus Transfer Utility Express > > I guess the magic eight-ball was right when it told me > "Outlook not so good" Hm, that's funny . . . mine says . . . LookOut!! ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj.

25 years

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What's your coolest ISA card?( was Re: IBM 5150 PC)

by dhquebbeman＠theestopinalgroup.com

> > I used to feel the same way when I was running a TRS-80 Model > > 2000 and I'd see caching SCSI controllers that used the same 80186 as > > a coprocessor on the board. There's something humbling about seeing > > your main CPU relegated to coprocessor status! > > Remember when the Apple Laserwriter was more powerful than any of the > computers that they sold to connect it to? Yes, I found that highly amusing at the time... -dq

25 years

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Who reads their email the most Classically?

by dhquebbeman＠theestopinalgroup.com

> Funny... I haven't seen very many people announcing their use of > Micro$oft Virus Transfer Utility Express > > I guess the magic eight-ball was right when it told me > "Outlook not so good" > > Sorry for the recycled jokes. Ok, Jeff... that one made me split my sides, and I *hurt*.. -dq

25 years

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SemiOT: Mourning for Classic Computing

by dhquebbeman＠theestopinalgroup.com

> On Tue, 14 Aug 2001, Douglas Quebbeman wrote: > > > > And I would not consider people writing in assembly language to be at > > the bottom rungs > > Right! I've always wondered why so many of the other programmers I have > met have held assembly language in such low esteem. Depending on the > particular make/model of processor you're dealing with, it can be > downright elegant. Was it for assembly language programmers that the phrase "high priests of a low cult" was coined? or was that for mainframe guys in general? > I've always thought that one of the more simple assembly languages would > be a great 'first language' for someone wanting to learn how to program. > Who's with me? Many schools (I.U. included) had courses that used assembly language for a hypothetical machine as the first language taught. Regards, -dq

25 years

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PDP 11/84's - any interest?

by hofmanwb＠worldonline.nl

Sergio Well, I had a BA23 box in which I put the CPU and the memory of the 11/84. And I had an RQDX3 disk interface and a Seagate ST-251 disk. The hard part is the cabinet kit. It should be possible to use parts of the 11/84 cabinet kit and make it fit with some soldering, but happily I could avoid that. The cabinet kit is for setting the serial line speed and to connect the serial line. Someone (Thanks again Wanderer!!) offered me an original 11/83 cabinet kit so that finished it. Wim ---------- > From: SP <SPEDRAJA(a)mail.ono.es> > To: classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org > Subject: RE: PDP 11/84's - any interest? > Date: Tuesday, August 14, 2001 12:38 AM > > Hello. Could you be more explicit ? It's possible > I could obtain one (with CPU and Memory of the 84, > of course) but I'd like to knoe the form to convert > one 84 in one 83, of course. > > Regards > > Sergio > > > > > Jerome, > > > > I converted an 11/84 to an 11/83 myself. The memory works fine on a Q-bus. > > It is connected to the CPU board via overhead flatcable. I converted an > > 11/84 to an 11/83 myself. > > > > Wim > > >

25 years

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Fw: SIMH VAX

by dhquebbeman＠theestopinalgroup.com

Can anyone help our good friend Bob Supnik out? "Bob Supnik" <bsupnik(a)us.inter.net> wrote in message news:<et3dnt44ib8ves29sklh73733afl5o6714(a)4ax.com>... > SIMH for VAX has been hung up for more than two years now due to lack > of documentation on I/O. (It ran the HCORE diagnostic in the spring > of '99.) I would like to emulate a CVAX based Qbus system (eg, a > MicroVAX 3000) so I need, in particular, > > - VMB code > - specs for the system support chip (CSSC) > - specs for the Qbus adapter chip (CQBIC) > - specs for the disk controller (RQDX3 or generic MSCP controller) > - specs for the Ethernet controller (DEQNA or first chip based > controllers) > > The rest of the peripherals will be standard - LP(V)11 for line > printer, DZ(V)11 for multiple terminals. > > Thanks, > > /Bob Supnik

25 years

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SemiOT: Mourning for Classic Computing (Was: RE: PeeCee turns 20) [longish]

by dhquebbeman＠theestopinalgroup.com

> I think all of us have our own personal view on "when computing had it's > golden age". For me, 1984 and the Sinclair QL was the peak of the > microcomputer (as opposed to the IBM PC & clones). For you, it must have > been around 197<mumble>. Hard to say... Actually, 1979-1983, my Pr1me Days... > >The beginning of the end. I knew it then, and I was > >proved right. > > I dispute that: Computers and computing go from strength to strength. > There's more than just PCs out there; the mighty mainframe still rules the > roost in many places, there's Apple Macs, VAX minis, Crays, and probably > many others I can't even think of. And, for the soldering-iron fans, > embedded computing is probably stronger than it ever was - *everything's* > got a computer or three in it... Computing today is nothing if not diverse. > >Again, it's nice to have fast, cheap > >computers, but I for one would have been just as > >happy for the next 20 years having fast, cheap TERMINALS > >to hook to the mainframes. And the continued high cost of > >entry would have kept from coming into existence an entire > >generation of self-taught (and poorly so) programmers who > >have and continue to crank out some of the worst software > >imaginable. In the halcyon days, most of the bad code was > >writtwn by the lusers themselves... > > That's a bit elitist, isn't it? Besides, most of the self-taught > programmers of whom you speak are not really programmers; they're merely > users with enough knowledge to be dangerous. Besides, if it wasn't for the > microprocessor and all that it begat, this list wouldn't even be here.. No; I have worked with these people. Most of them learned how to program before they had a chance to take a college course with rigor; I know this is anecdotal, but take one young man I worked with. He'd learned to program in high school, a combination of some fragmentary knowledge on the part of the math teacher and self-taught the rest of the way. Then got to college, where they tried to teach him structured programming. He dismissed structured programming completely because "it slows down both the program and the programmer". While this is potentially true, it ignores the truth (at the time, less so now) that more labor is spent on maintaining code than initially writing it. And as to lusers with a little too much knowledge... yeah, they can be a problem, and a LART's not always at hand... But as this list is dedicated to hardware that ranges from a Imlac-1 (I think that was the oldest reported here recently) to something like a Mac IIci (1991), it might have a smaller readership sans micros, but I'd bet there'd be sufficient interest to have the list. And if you meant we'd not have the Internet if the micro hadn't come about, I'd have to dispute that. It would simply be a slower, and less saturated Internet... > >Easy access to fast, cheap computers drove the genesis of > >an entire generation of self-taught programmers who didn't > >give a whit for structured programming or anything else that > >resembles a methodology, and who single-handedly changed the > >expectations that managers have about how quickly things > >get done. Sure RAD helped speed programming along, but not > >nearly as much just cutting corners... which the PC made > >easier... damn, I feel a song coming on again: > > It wasn't the PC that made cutting corners easy; it was the near-universal > use of BASIC - a fundamentally unstructured language - that is responsible > for the bulk of the "bad programmers"; and I say that as a professional > programmer who uses BASIC....! Well, you won't get much disagreement from me here... but I've seen COBOL code that was more spaghetti'd out than the worst BASIC I've seen... > Maybe if PASCAL had been the language de jour, today's self-taught > programmers would be better at it... Overall, yes, but to paraphrase my Data Structures, Pascal sucks when you limit yourself to the FORTRAN subset... > >No, not only will I not celebrate it, but I need to > >find a black armband to wear the rest of the month. > > IMHO, no. The PC had to happen; it was just a case of who got lucky (or had > the best marketing). At the end of the day, the PC offered unrivalled > expansion possibilities, a comparatively friendly OS (Gates did well to > poach DOS), and good flexibility thanks to the lack of built > in anything. Actually, at that moment I saw the Apple II, my thought was: "ten years too soon. we need ten years to figure out what we can really do with these damn things..." Ten years to develop real operating systems, job control languages, interfaces, etc. > Personally, I'd have liked to have seen a MC68000 based machine become > today's PC (mainly because I'd already learned assembler on the QL). No > doubt Commodore fans would have preferred the C128 or Amiga to "grow up" > into the PC. Might have been a marginal improvement... it's a nicely orthogonal processor... > Well, I'm off to dabble with my CBM PET, or maybe the MZ-80K. They're fun, > but I wouldn't like to have to use them every day, day in day out... Cool, don't let my rant effect your fun! -dq

25 years

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HS-1

by Glenatacme＠aol.com

On page 81 of the March/April 1981 issue of Sync Magazine there is a ad for a board which connects two ZX81, TS1000 or TS1500 computers, using one as the display processor and one for all other computations. The company name is Interface Design, in Rexford NY. Any info out there? Thanks, Glen 0/0

25 years

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Fujitsu drives (was Re: Service does still exist....)

by Glenatacme＠aol.com

In a message dated 8/13/01 5:03:03 PM Eastern Daylight Time, vance(a)ikickass.org writes: << Yeah. Two hard disk manufacturers I've never had trouble with are IBM and Fujitsu. The reason I mention Fujitsu is that their highest-end drives, and most of their oldest drives all come/came with a lifetime warranty. There has been many a time when I have found an old SCSI Fujitsu drive lying around broken somewhere, I rescue it, and they fix it up for me. I find that very impressive. >> More information about this, please? If I find a Fujitsu drive how can I tell if the lifetime warranty applies to that drive? Thanks, Glen 0/0

25 years

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68020 ISA card

by technos＠nerdland.org

A number of companies still make so-called scan accelerator cards.. Kofax, Xerox, Canon.. Pretty much all they do is take the scanned image over a SCSI connection and compress it into a tiff or jpeg in hardware.. I've seen everything from Phillips MIPS clones to AMD embedded processors for the job. Never seen one based on a M68K tho. Not too much demand for them these days. Well, considering a PII 350 can handle 60ppm at 400dpi in software at a sane level of system load. Jim On Tuesday, August 14, 2001 1:20 PM, Dave McGuire [SMTP:mcguire@neurotica.com] wrote: > On August 14, Richard Erlacher wrote: > > IIRC, it's possible it's associated with scanner/OCR processes. One > > of my > > colleagues had a set of three or four ISA cards, each of which had > > four 68030's > > on it, each with what I then saw as a significant amount of RAM for > > its task. > > He was using that together with a pretty fancy set of software for a > > MAJOR > > automatic transcription task, and, from what I gathered, it did a > > good job. > > > > I don't know about your board, but the ones I saw were fully packed > > on both > > sides. It was, for the time, VERY impressive to see. The results > > were pretty > > impressive, too, as he'd converted about 6000 pages of text into a > > searchable > > document on a set of CD's. > > This sounds like some boards made by Calera that I used back in '90 > or so. They were pretty impressive. > > -Dave > > -- > Dave McGuire > Laurel, MD

25 years

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Who reads their email the most Classically?

by mcguire＠neurotica.com

On August 14, LUCAS J CASHDOLLAR wrote: > My university used pine until about a year ago when they switched > to mulberry a graphical bloat-wear email program. It takes 20 times > longer to load, but its got grpahics and it likes to crash a hell of a > lot. All hail the bloat-wear nazis and their inefficiency at making our > lives easier. Is it possible to bring in your own software? If pine is what you prefer, why not use a local copy of it in your home directory? -Dave -- Dave McGuire Laurel, MD

25 years

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SemiOT: Mourning for Classic Computing (Was: RE: PeeCee turns

by dhquebbeman＠theestopinalgroup.com

> > > Simple solution, software people should unionize. > > And why should they be ionised in the first place? Severe belly cramps are probably keeping anyone from replying to this one, Tony... Some bosses *should* be ionized... that way, sh*t _would_ stick to them... -dq

25 years

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New stuff (HP9000)

by fmc＠reanimators.org

Pete Rickard <pete.rickard(a)carlingtech.com> wrote: > This is my first posting (I'm on SurvPC primarily).... I found the list > during a google search for *HP-UX*, trying to find other HP9000 > series users. There's a *very* quiet list for the 9000 series 500s at nvc.cc.ca.us. (Last message was in March.) I think the subscription instructions are to send an e-mail message as follows: To: hp9000-500-request(a)nvc.cc.ca.us Subject: subscribe hp9000-500 -Frank McConnell

25 years

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SemiOT: Mourning for Classic Computing (Was: RE: PeeCee turn s 20) [longish]

by dhquebbeman＠theestopinalgroup.com

> > I dispute that: Computers and computing go from strength to strength. > > There's more than just PCs out there; the mighty mainframe still rules the > > roost in many places, there's Apple Macs, VAX minis, Crays, and probably > > many others I can't even think of. And, for the soldering-iron fans, > > embedded computing is probably stronger than it ever was - *everything's* > > got a computer or three in it... > > In many places? The mainframe rules the roost period. What do you think > serves the databases that run the neato little things your PCs do on the > internet? IBM DB2/390. Hmmm... probably true for the commercial sites, of which I spend virtually zero of my personal time. Unless Google uses the OBM iron... > > That's a bit elitist, isn't it? Besides, most of the self-taught > > programmers of whom you speak are not really programmers; they're merely > > users with enough knowledge to be dangerous. Besides, if it wasn't for the > > microprocessor and all that it begat, this list wouldn't even be here... > > I don't know if I necessarily think this anymore, but whenever I used to > see droves of mindless PC zombies getting on the 'net, I used to think, > "Hmmm. Fresh meat." If Horace Greely was right about him, then P. T. Barnum would love living in this age... > > It wasn't the PC that made cutting corners easy; it was the near-universal > > use of BASIC - a fundamentally unstructured language - that is responsible > > for the bulk of the "bad programmers"; and I say that as a professional > > programmer who uses BASIC....! > > That and all the stupid ass "crackers" who learned assembler just to get > free shareware. I dunno; I haven't run into too many of these people in the orkplace... > > Maybe if PASCAL had been the language de jour, today's self-taught > > programmers would be better at it... > > How about something like LISP or SML? Maybe Prolog (!)... I know I'm > pushing it with that one. Fine languages. > > >No, not only will I not celebrate it, but I need to > > >find a black armband to wear the rest of the month. [..snip..] > I would've loved to have seen the Atari computers take over. I still have > a couple of Hades I use regularly. > > > Well, I'm off to dabble with my CBM PET, or maybe the MZ-80K. They're fun, > > but I wouldn't like to have to use them every day, day in day out... > > I'll be off tinkering with my big-iron VAX and my S/390 G5 (ot). Cool. -dq

25 years

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Who reads their email the most Classically?

by mcguire＠neurotica.com

On August 14, Mike Ford wrote: > Who reads their email the most Classically? > > I am not classic at all, running Eudora on a PowerMac, but somebody out > there must be farther back than pine in the email evolution chain, who is > it? Surely this is a matter of opinion, and I'm not a Pine user myself, but I haven't seen many mailers that I'd consider "further evolved" than Pine. Myself, I use VM under XEmacs. -Dave -- Dave McGuire Laurel, MD

25 years

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Who reads their email the most Classically?

by healyzh＠aracnet.com

> Who reads their email the most Classically? > > I am not classic at all, running Eudora on a PowerMac, but somebody out > there must be farther back than pine in the email evolution chain, who is > it? I use the following, Eudora on a G4/450 PowerMac, Elm on my ISP's Linux shell (sometimes telnet'd in from a PDP-11), and VMS Mail or Mailbox on VMS (I use Mailbox when sending as it's got a good address book, and VMS mail for reading and replying as it's got the better interface). Zane

25 years

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New stuff (HP9000)

by pete.rickard＠carlingtech.com

Hello, group- This is my first posting (I'm on SurvPC primarily).... I found the list during a google search for *HP-UX*, trying to find other HP9000 series users. Glad to have found this group, if for no other good reason than to be able to point to someone else when *normal* people come to my house and remark, "Gad! What a massive pile of old junk down here!" My own HP model 540 still has *OLD* HP-UX 5.-something on it. It also has compilers for Pascal, ForTran and 'c' (of course). It was the host to an '80s GrafTek GMS CAD system, 12+ users, from which I also saved a Meteor II workstation (including a Summagraphics Bit Pad 2 tablet and a huge Hitachi HM4119, EIA RS-343A compatible monitor). I've not much to offer except that I have quite a bit of mid-80's HP docs on this system... anyway, most hardware that I saved is as follows: HP 9050A - The basic unit, 8Mb RAM, 2x8 multiplexers, IOP (2) CPU's, etc.** HP 9144A - DC cartridge drive, works as emergency boot system (if lucky) HP 7914 - Hard disk drive, 128Mb, original in 1985 HP 7958 - Hard disk drive, 130+Mb "compact" (the root disk) HP 7974A - 9 track tape drive (the 'Man from U.N.C.L.E.' drive, as my big brother refers to it :-) HP 2934 - Dot-matrix printer (HP-IB) on top of its original cabinet HP 2392A - System console, green-on-black screen (saved 2 of these!) **includes 27125A LAN card CIO 802.3 (10mbps) BNC (there were two networked 9000's) and 28641A ThinLAN micro-MAU (RG58C/U), IEEE 802.3 spec...(throwing all the specs in there to anticipate queries...) -I could use an HP-IB floppy drive I suppose, if one happens along... Oh, BTW- here at work I use an iMac connected to our DEC Alpha using VersaTerm PRO terminal emulator. Login message includes this: "OpenVMS (TM) Alpha Operating System, Version V7.1-2" Regards, -Pete <jarkko.teppo(a)er-grp.com> wrote in part: > A reasonable weekend: > - - HP 9000/834 + 7959 disk with HP-UX 8.x. > Interestingly the 834 case is the same as the 9000/550 case. "640k ought to be enough for anybody." - Bill Gates, 1981 - - - - - Pete Rickard Product Engineer Carling Technologies Plainville CT USA

25 years

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What is a QBus Z-Board by Virtual Microsystems

by Innfogra＠aol.com

Going through my old Qbus and Unibus cards getting them ready to sell I found a very interesting card with four Z80 based computers on a Qbus card. It appears to me to be four complete 8 bit computers on a quad card, each with CPU and memory but no I/O. It is all socketed chips with the only other large chips being a pair of 2901 bit slicers. It is copyrighted 1983 by Virtual Microsystems and called the Z-Board. Made in the USA. Any idea what it was and what it was used for? Google turned up nothing other than VM was bought and sold several times. Three pictures at http://members.aol.com/innfogra/zboard.jpg A single one at http://members.aol.com/innfogra/zboard2.jpg If interested in purchase please contact me off list, here or at whoagiii(a)aol.com. Paxton Astoria

25 years

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SemiOT: Mourning for Classic Computing (Was: RE: PeeCee turns 20) [longish]

by dhquebbeman＠theestopinalgroup.com

> >> I know that the PC turns 20 this month, > >> but does anyone know the actual date of introduction? > >> > >> It's tough going through August without a holiday, so > >> I'm looking for something to celebrate :-) Sorry I waited so long on this one, but... For me, it should be a date to *mourn*, not to celebrate. Now in fairness, the PC has brought us high-speed commodity computers. However, it has also dumbed-down a signficant portion of the field of computing. Inasmuch as the PC was created as a reaction to the Apple II, I must tell this story. I cow orker and I had been fixing the various cold solder joints on an IMSAI 8080 construction attempt done by the head of the Physics Department (and soon to be D-I-T). We'd run it successfully for a few weeks, and had begun using it in a Psych experiment involving reaction times. Then the 8212 went to heaven. We took it to the recently-opened Computerland, wherein a guy I mistook for an electronics technician (he was an MBA) rolled up his sleeves, heated up the iron, clipped off the fried 8212, soldered in a socket, plugged in a new chip... But I digress. While he was doing this, I was looking around the store, and saw the Doom of Computing in the form of a computer that didn't require a soldering iron to build and use- namely, an Apple II. The beginning of the end. I knew it then, and I was proved right. Again, it's nice to have fast, cheap computers, but I for one would have been just as happy for the next 20 years having fast, cheap TERMINALS to hook to the mainframes. And the continued high cost of entry would have kept from coming into existence an entire generation of self-taught (and poorly so) programmers who have and continue to crank out some of the worst software imaginable. In the halcyon days, most of the bad code was writtwn by the lusers themselves... Easy access to fast, cheap computers drove the genesis of an entire generation of self-taught programmers who didn't give a whit for structured programming or anything else that resembles a methodology, and who single-handedly changed the expectations that managers have about how quickly things get done. Sure RAD helped speed programming along, but not nearly as much just cutting corners... which the PC made easier... damn, I feel a song coming on again: -- obSimpsonSongLyric: Shary: If there's a task that must be done, Don't turn your tail and run, Don't pout, don't sob, Just do a half-assed job! If... you... cut every corner It is really not so bad, Everybody does it, Even mom and dad. If nobody sees it, Then nobody gets mad, Bart: It's the American way! Shary: The policeman on the beat Needs some time to rest his feet. Chief Wiggum: Fighting crime is not my cup of tea! Shary: And the clerk who runs the store Can charge a little more For meat! Apu: For meat! Shary: And milk! Apu: And milk! Both: From 1984! Shary: If... you... cut every corner, You'll have more time for play, Shary & OFF: It's the American waaaaay! -- No, not only will I not celebrate it, but I need to find a black armband to wear the rest of the month.

25 years

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SemiOT: Mourning for Classic Computing (Was: RE: PeeCee turn s 20) [longish]

by dhquebbeman＠theestopinalgroup.com

> And I'll bet you they could do it cheaper with a single IBM mainframe than > thousands of PCs. The power savings alone would be tremendous. A 9672 G7 > xSeries can run hundreds of thousands, if not millions, of Linux images in > LPARs or under VM, all at speeds comparable to quick PCs. Sadly, and many years after I left the local public school corp that brought me together with my first Prime, they replaced a power-hungry Prime 9950 with a *much* (read: no more dedicated transformer outside) less hungry model 4450. Which, I understand, they kept for two years before succumbing to the PeeCee disease.... oh sh*t, new lyrics for Dire Straights' Industrial Disease are coming to mind ***ClassicCmp SONG LYRIC FILTER INVOKED***

25 years

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Commodore Stuff For Sale

by mcguire＠neurotica.com

"I took the shot, there was no danger..." -Dave On August 14, mjsnodgr(a)rockwellcollins.com wrote: > > Have one of our distinguished assembly programmers write you a program to > randomly pick names. <grin> > > - M.S. > > > > > > > "Rich Beaudry" <r_beaudry(a)hotmail.com>@classiccmp.org on 08/14/2001 > 08:24:38 AM > > Please respond to classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org > > Sent by: owner-classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org > > > To: <classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org> > cc: > > Subject: Commodore Stuff For Sale > > > Hello all, > > I posted some Commodore stuff to my website, for sale. 99% of the items > are > $2.00 or $5.00, so no outrageous pricing (you also pay shipping, of > course). > > http://members.tripod.com/glhturbo/commo.html (Apologies for the annoying > Tripod banner). > > All the details are there... > > One important note is that this is NOT a "first come, first served" sale. > In order to have some fairness to the international and digest members of > the list, if I get more people interested in an item than I have on hand, I > will throw names into a hat and pick randomly. > > Thanks! > > Rich B. > > > -- Dave McGuire Laurel, MD

25 years

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68020 ISA card

by mcguire＠neurotica.com

On August 14, Richard Erlacher wrote: > IIRC, it's possible it's associated with scanner/OCR processes. One of my > colleagues had a set of three or four ISA cards, each of which had four 68030's > on it, each with what I then saw as a significant amount of RAM for its task. > He was using that together with a pretty fancy set of software for a MAJOR > automatic transcription task, and, from what I gathered, it did a good job. > > I don't know about your board, but the ones I saw were fully packed on both > sides. It was, for the time, VERY impressive to see. The results were pretty > impressive, too, as he'd converted about 6000 pages of text into a searchable > document on a set of CD's. This sounds like some boards made by Calera that I used back in '90 or so. They were pretty impressive. -Dave -- Dave McGuire Laurel, MD

25 years

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68020 ISA card

by optimus＠canit.se

Found an interesting card in the trays of a small computer shop. It's an 8-bit card with a 68020 on it. The card is full-length, with a piece sandwiched onto it at one end. It's by a Xerox company with a German name; Kurzweil? Any leads as to what this might be? -- En ligne avec Thor 2.6a. [E]xcept in the works of Gunnar Asplund, architect of the Stockholm Exhibition of 1930 and the Stockholm crematorium, Sweden has never contributed much to the revolutionary developments through which modern architecture made its initial impact on the world. J.M. Richards, Modern Architecture

25 years

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68020 ISA card

by jfoust＠threedee.com

At 10:40 AM 8/14/01 -0500, Messick, Gary wrote: >I think Xerox bought Kurzweil's speech recognition unit. So it might be >some sort of speech recognition board (probably coupled with other software >of course!) See http://www.kurzweiltech.com/aboutray.html . They made a number of other unique products, hardware and software. - John

25 years

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Data I/O programmers (was Re: EPROM sideline)

by mlps＠together.net

Support and information for the older Data I/O programmers is available from Memory & Logic Programming Services. Data I/O sold the rights to this equipment to so they could direct all there support to there newer products. You can contact them via email at mlps(a)together.net. Promlink & Device lists are available for free but copies of the manuals are available for sale. Service, calibration and updates are also available. Al Marin.

25 years

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68020 ISA card

by Gary.Messick＠itt.com

I think Xerox bought Kurzweil's speech recognition unit. So it might be some sort of speech recognition board (probably coupled with other software of course!) Gary > -----Original Message----- > From: Iggy Drougge [mailto:optimus@canit.se] > Sent: Monday, August 13, 2001 7:45 PM > To: Classic computing > Subject: 68020 ISA card > > > Found an interesting card in the trays of a small computer > shop. It's an 8-bit > card with a 68020 on it. The card is full-length, with a > piece sandwiched onto > it at one end. It's by a Xerox company with a German name; Kurzweil? > Any leads as to what this might be? > > -- > En ligne avec Thor 2.6a. > > [E]xcept in the works of Gunnar Asplund, architect of the > Stockholm Exhibition > of 1930 and the Stockholm crematorium, Sweden has never > contributed much to > the revolutionary developments through which modern > architecture made its > initial impact on the world. > J.M. Richards, Modern Architecture >

25 years

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Commodore Stuff For Sale

by mjsnodgr＠rockwellcollins.com

Have one of our distinguished assembly programmers write you a program to randomly pick names. <grin> - M.S. "Rich Beaudry" <r_beaudry(a)hotmail.com>@classiccmp.org on 08/14/2001 08:24:38 AM Please respond to classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org Sent by: owner-classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org To: <classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org> cc: Subject: Commodore Stuff For Sale Hello all, I posted some Commodore stuff to my website, for sale. 99% of the items are $2.00 or $5.00, so no outrageous pricing (you also pay shipping, of course). http://members.tripod.com/glhturbo/commo.html (Apologies for the annoying Tripod banner). All the details are there... One important note is that this is NOT a "first come, first served" sale. In order to have some fairness to the international and digest members of the list, if I get more people interested in an item than I have on hand, I will throw names into a hat and pick randomly. Thanks! Rich B.

25 years

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