- test-drb@ccmp.vtda.org - classiccmp.org

by zmerch＠30below.com

Rumor has it that David Woyciesjes may have mentioned these words: >Rich --- > Actually, my time estimate was a little wrong. The messages take >about an hour and a half... [snip] I've not seen lags anywhere near that -- mebbe 5-10 minutes at most. My Eudora checks mail every 4 minutes, and it's usually 2 checks & it's there. Methinks it might be something on your end... Have you called your ISP? I'll time this one and see what I end up with... HTH, "Merch" -- Roger "Merch" Merchberger --- sysadmin, Iceberg Computers Recycling is good, right??? Ok, so I'll recycle an old .sig. If at first you don't succeed, nuclear warhead disarmament should *not* be your first career choice.

23 years, 7 months

3
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Classic Computers vs. Classic Computing

by dhquebbeman＠theestopinalgroup.com

> What really puts me off emulators is that they're so awfully lame. How can an > emulator be lame? Well, it's not as much the emulators as the crowd > surrounding them. They're usually Win#? kids who know nothing about old > computers, really don't care, and just want games, games, games, all for free. Apples and oranges, Iggy. That's a totally different emulator world than the one I'm talking about. In the world I'm talking about, I don't think anyone creating emulators is under 40 years of age (well, Daniel Seagraves is under 40, I think). However, MAME32 which I assume is one of the game emulators to which you're referring, is well-constructed. And since the mainframe that I'm working to emulate had a vector graphics display as its system console, rather than reinvent the wheel, I intend on using the MAME32 codebase to build the CDC 6602/6612 display console emulator. This is a serious project that will be able to run all the operating systems and product set software that the real iron was running in 1976. Eventually, it will even have emulated card readers and punches; a web page will provide the user the ability to create what appear to be perfect IBM unit-records (punch cards), in the form of an image, then the punched card will go into a visually-represented deck. Then, you'll be able to grab the deck with the mouse, with the pointer changing into a hand, as you drop the deck into the image of a card reader. The job will then be read by the emulated mainframe, and processed until completion. Simulated lineprinters will be constructed using captured images of the actual "fonts" used by the printer (chain, band, etc). I may even include an option for greenbar paper. But ultimately, my underlying motivation is the same as the "game-kiddi3s" to which you refer: they can't afford the real thing, and neither can I. If I owned the mainframe of my choice, running it for a single week could consume my entire year's salary. Now, I don't want to dissuade you from your opinion. But I think perhaps you hadn't thought about emulators in the broader context to which I'm referring... Regards, -dq

23 years, 7 months

5
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Classic Computers vs. Classic Computingt

by dittman＠dittman.net

> >> PIII still cant emulate the keyboard layout of a Vt100 or VT220 worth > >> poop. > > > >The PIII will emulate the keyboard layout of a VT220 if you use an LK461 > >keyboard. > > > Thats one solution. The other is a real VT{100|125|330|340} or H19 since > I do have them and prefer the feel of the keyboards and their respective > layouts. The LK461 has the same feel and layout as the LK201 used on the VT-330 and VT-340. -- Eric Dittman dittman(a)dittman.net Check out the DEC Ethusiasts Club at http://www.dittman.net/

23 years, 7 months

3
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Mac Plus as a webserver...

by DAW＠yalepress3.unipress.yale.edu

! >Properly known as the 'Macintosh SE FDHD'. Yep, I got one of ! >these, running ! >OS 6.0.7, 50MB HDD, and 4MB RAM... ! ! I've got both kinds, one of which which is equipped with a ! 3Com Ethernet card. ! Unfortunately, 3Com seem to have forgotten all about making ! such a beast, and ! have even managed to reuse its model number on some PCMCIA card. =/ 3Com? I didn't know that they believed in Macintosh! ! >Yeah, the SE/30 is a 68030, 16MHz; with 68882 FPU and 0.5K ! >of L1 cache! Have ! >two of these, OS 7.1 and 7.0.1... ! ! Me too, but shouldn't that be a 68881? My info is taken from the Apple Spec Database, and that's what they wrote... --- David A Woyciesjes --- C & IS Support Specialist --- Yale University Press --- mailto:david.woyciesjes@yale.edu --- (203) 432-0953 --- ICQ # - 905818

23 years, 7 months

2
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Anyone want an 11/750 & 11/730 out of New Jersey?

by fmc＠reanimators.org

Bob Shannon <bshannon(a)tiac.net> wrote: > Can you tell me anything about the HP3000/48? Physically, it's the size and almost the shape of a desk, meaning there's a woodgrain top and it can double as the console table. However, what's under the desk is the processor, memory, I/O interface cards, and power supply, which makes the whole lot kind of heavy. Oh yes, and if you use it as the console table, look down by your right knee for a power switch. Think about "right knee" and "power switch" a bit, and then go find something to keep them safe from each other. This will be faithful to contemporary practice; I've seen cardboard taped over the switch, and also seen those magnetic covers used by telco guys to cover mated 50-pin jacks (and stick them to a nearby steel desk, cabinet, or radiator) in office settings. -Frank McConnell

23 years, 7 months

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DEC Keyboards (was: Re: Classic Computers vs. Classic)

by healyzh＠aracnet.com

> I wonder if the mushiness of the LK201 was a response to complaints that > the VT100 keyboard was a little too heavy at times. As a VT100 keyboard > aged the keys seem to develop little "catches" that made some keys more > difficult to depress. I'm guessing it's more the type keyswitches they bought, or did they outsource the entire keyboard? > A VT2x0/VT3x0/VT4x0/VT5xx can emulate a VT100, so use an emulated VT100 > with an emulated PDP-10. :-) I'm already doing that with a VT420 :^) Zane

23 years, 7 months

1
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Classic Computers vs. Classic Computing

by pete＠dunnington.u-net.com

On Sep 14, 8:18, Jonathan Engdahl wrote: > An idea that I've been thinking about is the re-implementation of a classic > architecture (for me, probably a PDP-11) using entirely modern hardware. [...] > Another approach would be to view a Wintel > PC as a microcoded platform, and reimplement the PDP-11 on that hardware. > The microcode would be written in tightly crafted Pentium code. The machine > would bootstrap itself by loading the microcode from a special partition on > the hard drive. Why not burn it into (EP)ROM? 64K for the opcode jump table fits in a 27512, you maybe want about the same again for the code, and that would fit in some devices used for BIOS ROMs these days. Or put it on a SIMM or DIMM. -- Pete Peter Turnbull Network Manager University of York

23 years, 7 months

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Cromemco 16FDC and IMSAI front panel

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

I'd have to see the schematics but I'd bet a timing difference or a conflict on a bus line usage. Allison -----Original Message----- From: Bill Sudbrink <bills(a)adrenaline.com> To: classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org <classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org> Date: Friday, September 14, 2001 3:31 PM Subject: Cromemco 16FDC and IMSAI front panel >I brought this up some time ago, but never >got a satisfactory answer... > >When I use the above combination (regardless >of CPU board), while the system in general >works fine, the deposit/examine functionality >of the front panel stops working. Somebody >said they knew of a fix, but then never posted >anything else. I've looked at the schematics >(I have them for both items) and can't for the >life of me see anything that would conflict. > >Any help greatly appreciated. >

23 years, 7 months

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Why is this so slow?

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

>From: "David Woyciesjes" <DAW(a)yalepress3.unipress.yale.edu> >To: <classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org> >Sent: Friday, September 14, 2001 9:06 AM >Subject: Why is this so slow? > > >> Does anyone have any idea why it takes upwards of 15-20 minutes >> (seems longer sometimes) for my postings to this list to get sent back out? Fire your ISP or find out why they use a string for a link. Allison

23 years, 7 months

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Classic Computers vs. Classic Computing

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

From: Eric J. Korpela <korpela(a)ssl.berkeley.edu> >In the case of CP/M machines, running an emulator on a modern machine with >a decent OS greatly improves the development environment. I find myself >developing software on my PIII in a native editor, compiling/assembling with >MyZ80, and transfering it to the CP/M machines for use there. (Not that I do >a lot of CP/M development.) I like to and MyZ80 allows it to be more portable than my S100 crate or the Kaypro. Then again, my AmproLB system with 45mb disk is far smaller than most PCs. Allison

23 years, 7 months

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[Donna.Deleon@COMPAQ.com: Urgent Vax 7800]

by cmcmanis＠netapp.com

Maybe the Pentagon is going to use VAX 7800's in their retaliatory strike for the WTC attacks. They are certainly as heavy as DU rounds :) Seriously though, a couple of things have come to light in the aftermath of this event: 1) VAXen are so reliable that several people keep them in production envirionments even today. 2) When you destroy a facility at large as the WTC and Pentagon off site backups don't help if they only system of capable of running your backups gets destroyed as well. Only the very serious disaster recovery plans consider the case that the entire datacenter is destroyed. At 01:50 PM 1/6/80, you wrote: >Area code 719? THAT'S NEWFOUNDLAND! SOMETHING IS UP!

23 years, 7 months

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Classic Computers vs. Classic Computing

by DAW＠yalepress3.unipress.yale.edu

! ...In a recent thread, Tony Duell expressed a lack of interest in the ! emulators and simulators of old iron that are now circulating. His ! reasons centered around his love of hardware. From my perspective, ! it appears that for Tony, the experience of computing cannot be ! separated from the experiencing of the computer.... ! ! ...I'm not sure how many of you have ever thought about this; but ! now that I've broached the subject, whaddy'all think? I dunno about splitting the list. Even my interest is in the hardware side, like Tony, I'm sure there are many here that go both ways. And there will be new guys, that are unsure about thier preference, and seeing discussions about both sides in one place here, will definitely be helpful to them... --- David A Woyciesjes --- C & IS Support Specialist --- Yale University Press --- mailto:david.woyciesjes@yale.edu --- (203) 432-0953 --- ICQ # - 905818

23 years, 7 months

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Wanted: QBus ESDI controller

by matt＠knm.yi.org

Hi, Before I get swamped with "Hey, why not get a SCSI controller instead" replies - I have a few unused fullheight ESDI drives, and I figure the best box I have to put them in is my MV3300. Sooo... poor little me sat here in Manchester, UK has a MV3300 just waiting for an ESDI controller, and I figured someone out there in vaxenland might have one going spare for the cost of postage, and maybe a contribution of some sort (but not too much cause I am but a poor student). So - anyone out there think they can help? :&) -- Matt --- Web Page: http://knm.yi.org/ http://pkl.net/~matt/ PGP Key fingerprint = 00BF 19FE D5F5 8EAD 2FD5 D102 260E 8BA7 EEE4 8D7F PGP Key http://knm.yi.org/matt-pgp.html

23 years, 7 months

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Paging Bill Bradford

by pete＠dunnington.u-net.com

On Sep 13, 13:05, Bill Bradford wrote: > bash-2.03$ nslookup subatomix.com > Server: localhost > Address: 127.0.0.1 > > Name: subatomix.com > Address: 24.94.226.65 > > bash-2.03$ nslookup 24.94.226.95 > Server: localhost > Address: 127.0.0.1 > > Name: okc-94-226-95.mmcable.com > Address: 24.94.226.95 > > DNS be brokie. I guess I"ll have to turn off the reject-mailhosts-with-bad-dns > requirement.. Um, not necessarily. You mis-typed the IP address on the second lookup. subatomix.com is indeed a valid domain name, registered by Tierranet whose nameserver (ns1.domaindiscover.com) will give you the A record and MX record for subatomix (both point to 24.94.226.65). However, there's no necessary correspondence between the domain name registrar, DNS provider for forward lookups, and ISP who provides the actual connection and address (usually also the DNS provider for reverse lookups). The reverse lookup for 24.94.226.65 comes out as okc-94-226-65.mmcable.com which isn't surprising. The reverse lookup is done by the mmcable servers, since they own the address space. If you look at Jeffrey's home page, it's URL is http://home.mmcable.com/xoraxax/, so that fits. Whether your mailserver will accept mail directly from Jeffrey's machine probably depends on what his machine is calling itself in the HELO and whether your mailserver does a reverse and forward lookup to check (as you've implied). If so, possible solutions are (1) turn off the double check, (2) have Jeffrey's machine give its mmcable.com name when sending mail, (3) have Jeffrey's machine relay mail through mmcable's server (assuming mmcable really is his ISP), or (4) persuade mmcable (again, assuming they're his ISP) to include his properly registered domain name in their DNS. -- Pete Peter Turnbull Network Manager University of York

23 years, 7 months

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Why is this so slow?

by DAW＠yalepress3.unipress.yale.edu

! From: Richard Erlacher [mailto:edick@idcomm.com] ! ! I suspect that this delay is provided so that one can figure ! out how to word an ! apology for having made an inane comment in the midst of an ! OT thread. It's ! seldom used, though. Rich --- Was that a poke at me? :-) --- David A Woyciesjes --- C & IS Support Specialist --- Yale University Press --- mailto:david.woyciesjes@yale.edu --- (203) 432-0953 --- ICQ # - 905818

23 years, 7 months

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DEC Keyboards (was: Re: Classic Computers vs. Classic)

by dittman＠dittman.net

> >Okay, this lead me to pull an LK201 out of the closet. You're right, the > >LK401 > >is not as mushy as the LK201. > > That's only part of it, the angle of the keys are slightly different, and > (and this is the part that is really hard to explain) somehow the LK201 > seems to have sharper corners to me, with the LK401 seeming to be a more > polished feel to it. A big difference is the LK201 uses those easily-lost black plastic posts to raise the back of the keyboard to a decent height. The LK401 does have a more polished look and feel. The LK201 keyboard always looked to me like the case was a temporary prototype. The old flip-top version of the LK201 struck me as too much for what it does. The simpler slot for the strip in the later version was simpler and less trouble. > BTW, I just checked and it's a pair of LK450's I got recently, though I > think I've got a LK461 up in storage. The LK450 is almost identical to > LK401, except it's got the PS/2 interface, and the keyboard is about as > mushy as the LK201. I wonder if the mushiness of the LK201 was a response to complaints that the VT100 keyboard was a little too heavy at times. As a VT100 keyboard aged the keys seem to develop little "catches" that made some keys more difficult to depress. > Of course for the people that prefer a VT100, none of these keyboards are a > substitute, but for those that want a proper keyboard for VMS, they're > great. I personally don't really care for the VT100 keyboard, though I am > trying to figure out where in here I can set one up as I want to use it to > access the PDP-10 emulators. A VT2x0/VT3x0/VT4x0/VT5xx can emulate a VT100, so use an emulated VT100 with an emulated PDP-10. :-) -- Eric Dittman dittman(a)dittman.net Check out the DEC Ethusiasts Club at http://www.dittman.net/

23 years, 7 months

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Why is this so slow?

by DAW＠yalepress3.unipress.yale.edu

Rich --- Actually, my time estimate was a little wrong. The messages take about an hour and a half... And the speed some discussions go at sometimes, it is almost like a chatroom. --- David A Woyciesjes --- C & IS Support Specialist --- Yale University Press --- mailto:david.woyciesjes@yale.edu --- (203) 432-0953 --- ICQ # - 905818 ! -----Original Message----- ! From: Richard Erlacher [mailto:edick@idcomm.com] ! Sent: Friday, September 14, 2001 2:18 PM ! To: classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org ! Subject: Re: Why is this so slow? ! ! ! I'm curious why it's important that it be quick? This is a ! mailing list, not a ! chat room. ! ! Dick ! ! ----- Original Message ----- ! From: "David Woyciesjes" <DAW(a)yalepress3.unipress.yale.edu> ! To: <classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org> ! Sent: Friday, September 14, 2001 9:06 AM ! Subject: Why is this so slow? ! ! ! > Does anyone have any idea why it takes upwards of 15-20 minutes ! > (seems longer sometimes) for my postings to this list to ! get sent back out? ! > ! > --- David A Woyciesjes ! > --- C & IS Support Specialist ! > --- Yale University Press ! > --- mailto:david.woyciesjes@yale.edu ! > --- (203) 432-0953 ! > --- ICQ # - 905818 ! > ! > !

23 years, 7 months

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Classic Computers vs. Classic Computingt

by dittman＠dittman.net

> >The PIII will emulate the keyboard layout of a VT220 if you use an LK461 > >keyboard. > > What makes the LK461 special? The LK461 (and related keyboards, like the LK46W) have the same layout as the LK401, including all the keys. I use a couple on my Alphas and VT525. -- Eric Dittman dittman(a)dittman.net Check out the DEC Ethusiasts Club at http://www.dittman.net/

23 years, 7 months

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Why is this so slow?

by DAW＠yalepress3.unipress.yale.edu

Jay --- Actually, the messages I sent in this thread, I've been checking the time, and they're taking 1.5 hours to come around... Is that normal? --- David A Woyciesjes --- C & IS Support Specialist --- Yale University Press --- mailto:david.woyciesjes@yale.edu --- (203) 432-0953 --- ICQ # - 905818 ! -----Original Message----- ! From: Jay West [mailto:west@tseinc.com] ! Sent: Friday, September 14, 2001 1:31 PM ! To: classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org ! Subject: Re: Why is this so slow? ! ! ! Yes, I know exactly why it takes 15-20 minutes for postings ! to be echoed to ! the list. ! ! How is this a problem? There's several reasons why it is set ! this way, but ! if it's a problem for folks that classiccmp reflections take ! 30 mins to go ! out, just let me know. ! ! Jay West ! ! ! ----- Original Message ----- ! From: "David Woyciesjes" <DAW(a)yalepress3.unipress.yale.edu> ! To: <classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org> ! Sent: Friday, September 14, 2001 10:06 AM ! Subject: Why is this so slow? ! ! ! > Does anyone have any idea why it takes upwards of 15-20 minutes ! > (seems longer sometimes) for my postings to this list to ! get sent back ! out? ! > ! > --- David A Woyciesjes ! > --- C & IS Support Specialist ! > --- Yale University Press ! > --- mailto:david.woyciesjes@yale.edu ! > --- (203) 432-0953 ! > --- ICQ # - 905818 ! > !

23 years, 7 months

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Classic Computers vs. Classic Computingt

by dittman＠dittman.net

> >The LK461 has the same feel and layout as the LK201 used on the VT-330 and > >VT-340. > > Oh, I'm going to have to disagree there! The LK201 has the same layout, > but the LK401 has a better look and feel! The only advantage the LK201 has > is the place to stick something that tells what the function keys are > mapped to. In fact the LK401 feels about as good as my Apple Extended II > Keyboard! Okay, this lead me to pull an LK201 out of the closet. You're right, the LK401 is not as mushy as the LK201. -- Eric Dittman dittman(a)dittman.net Check out the DEC Ethusiasts Club at http://www.dittman.net/

23 years, 7 months

2
1
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Cromemco 16FDC and IMSAI front panel

by bills＠adrenaline.com

I brought this up some time ago, but never got a satisfactory answer... When I use the above combination (regardless of CPU board), while the system in general works fine, the deposit/examine functionality of the front panel stops working. Somebody said they knew of a fix, but then never posted anything else. I've looked at the schematics (I have them for both items) and can't for the life of me see anything that would conflict. Any help greatly appreciated.

23 years, 7 months

1
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Solomon Splitting the list... (was: Classic Computers vs. Cl assic Computing

by DAW＠yalepress3.unipress.yale.edu

! > Now, if anyone's ever *heard* of a SPDT DIPswitch bank, let ! >alone where I ! > could find some... otherwise I'll be stuck with jumpers ! >(which is O.K., but ! > dip switches would look nicer & be harder to lose from the finished ! > project...) So far, Jameco, JDR Microdevices & B.G. Micro ! >don't list them... ! > ! > == I'm sure I haven't said this enough, so: "Thanks, Tony!" == ! > ! > "Merch" ! > -- ! > Roger "Merch" Merchberger --- sysadmin, Iceberg Computers ! > Recycling is good, right??? Ok, so I'll recycle an old .sig. ! ! I've never seen SPDT dipswitches in computers. ! ! The closest thing I've seen, I believe, are the dip switches ! in Sears Garage Door Openers and the handheld clicker for them. ! ! They've got two positions + and - but a central neutral ! position IIRC which makes them kind of SPDT with a neutral position. ! ! Hope this is some help. ! ! Bill Well, you could always take a DPDT switch, and wire up only one half of it.... Try Radio Shack? --- David A Woyciesjes --- C & IS Support Specialist --- Yale University Press --- mailto:david.woyciesjes@yale.edu --- (203) 432-0953 --- ICQ # - 905818

23 years, 7 months

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essential CP/M files

by Robert_Feldman＠jdedwards.com

It would be great if you could do WordMaster, the precursor to WordStar. It was a very useful editor for programming and its pattern of control-keys for cursor movement and editing was used by many other programs. -----Original Message----- From: Jim Battle [mailto:frustum@pacbell.net] Sent: Friday, September 14, 2001 1:34 AM To: classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org Subject: Re: essential CP/M files Allison wrote: <snip> >How about a decent editor? I used CP/M just a bit back in the day, and I'm only now learning a bit more about it. Do you have any recommendations? I've seen TED in one of the CP/M archives, but I haven't gotten far enough along to see if I can get it to run on a Sol. <snip>

23 years, 7 months

2
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Incompatible Timesharing System (ITS) Starter Kit Available

by dhquebbeman＠theestopinalgroup.com

> > Of course, you'll need Bob's simulator; you can check out > > Zane Healy's emulators page, or pick up a copy at: > > For those that don't know my page is at: > http://www.aracnet.com/~healyzh/pdp10emu.html > and Bob's pages are at: > http://www.tiac.net/users/mps/retro/ > > I've got links to all the ITS related materials on the net that I'm aware > of. If anyone knows of any documenation of any sort on the net besides what > is at Mirian's site, or the ITS reference manual, version 1.5 from MIT, I'd > appreciate knowing about it. The same goes for any other documenation for > TOPS-10 and TOPS-20 that isn't already listed on my site. On your ITS page, the last link: http://bony.umtec.com/pdp10.html appears to be stale... might just be down at the moment, but the sources for ITS can also be found on John Wilson's FTP site. He requests that downloads take place after hours or on weekends. -dq

23 years, 7 months

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essential CP/M files

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

>If you were stuck on an island with a solar-powered CP/M machine and only one floppy disk in CP/M 2.2 format, which programs and utilities would you want on that disk? I'd have two floppies. Any opinions of what I should distribute with the emulator? Here is what I am planning on so far: STAT PIP ASM MAC DDT ED DUMP LOAD SUBMIT XSUB How about a decent editor? >Unfortunately, I don't have FORMAT, MOVCPM, PUTSYS, GETSYS, or SYSGEN since None of those are very meaningful for an emulator. >Although there are lots of replacement programs for those listed above that are undoubtedly better than the stock CP/M 2.2 programs, I am going to use the originals from D.R. and leave it up to any user who cares enough to customize it as they see fit. Why? will the emulator provide a way to create a new disk drive? Allison

23 years, 7 months

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Solomon Splitting the list... (was: Classic Computers vs. Classic Computing

by pete＠dunnington.u-net.com

On Sep 14, 11:02, Roger Merchberger wrote: > Now, if anyone's ever *heard* of a SPDT DIPswitch bank, let alone where I > could find some... otherwise I'll be stuck with jumpers (which is O.K., but > dip switches would look nicer & be harder to lose from the finished > project...) So far, Jameco, JDR Microdevices & B.G. Micro don't list them... You certainly can get them. I have some in my junk box and they're listed in the Farnell catalogue over here (http://www.farnell.co.uk/). Farnell, incidentally, have outlets in the US. Depending on exactly what you want to do there are various options. Tyco make a "subminature washable PCB mounting" SPDT switch with pins on a 0.1" pitch which are side-stackable (part number SE1DGPCFN). EAO make one that's explicitly listed as stackable, 0.1" pitch, SPDT is part no 09-03290-01. ERG make SPDT (and others) as part of their 014 DIL switch series (the ones with colour-coded sliders), SDC1014, SDC2014 and SDC4014 are 1, 2, and 4-section respectively. They also do a recessed SPDT (SCD1 023 to SCD5 023 for 2/4/6/8 pole), slide switches in similar style which are 1-pole/8-way, 2-pole/4-way, and 4-pole/2-way (DS16C18, DS16C24, DS16C42). Enough? -- Pete Peter Turnbull Network Manager University of York

23 years, 7 months

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Olivetti ETX II

by sstratford＠mbbc.edu

Can anyone point me in the right direction to someone who might have information about an old CP/M machine and/or parts (specifically, keyboard): Olivetti ETX II. Thanks. --Steve

23 years, 7 months

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Why is this so slow?

by dhquebbeman＠theestopinalgroup.com

> Does anyone have any idea why it takes upwards of 15-20 minutes > (seems longer sometimes) for my postings to this list to get > sent back out? Echelon? -dq

23 years, 7 months

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Emulators (was: Classic Computers vs. Classic Computing

by dhquebbeman＠theestopinalgroup.com

> > > Unfortunately, last year, one of our administrators hauled off all of our > > > file cabinets of punched cards, and I don't know where else to find a > > > copy. > > > > Is he a preservationist? Or was he just cleaning shop? > > He filled several dumpsters with irreplaceable classic computer stuff, > without asking whether we wanted to part with any of it, and on a weekend, > so that we didn't know about it until it was gone. Molten iron would be > too gentle. Epithelial vaporization by carbon-dioxide laser over a 10-year period? -dq

23 years, 7 months

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[Donna.Deleon@COMPAQ.com: Urgent Vax 7800]

by mrbill＠mrbill.net

Some people in the Pentagon have a need for CPU and RAM for a VAX 7800.. Please contact Donna if you can help. Bill ----- Forwarded message from "Deleon, Donna" <Donna.Deleon(a)COMPAQ.com> ----- From: "Deleon, Donna" <Donna.Deleon(a)COMPAQ.com> To: "'mrbill(a)decdocs.org'" <mrbill(a)decdocs.org> Subject: Urgent Vax 7800 Date: Thu, 13 Sep 2001 14:42:28 -0500 Good afternoon Bill, I am a Compaq employee and participated on a North America conference call. During the call many things were mentioned re: the devastation that we all faced here in America. During the call it was asked that if there were any contacts that could be provided in search of as many as 70, 7800 Vax system that are needed at the Pentagon with deep urgency. Do you have any that you are willing to loan/donate etc.....or know of anybody that would be able to provide the same? Please feel free to contact me @ 719 592-6767 with any additional questions or leads that I can follow up on. Your help is greatly appreciated! Sincerely, Donna L. DeLeon ----- End forwarded message ----- -- Bill Bradford mrbill(a)mrbill.net Austin, TX

23 years, 7 months

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Need Electronic Soldering help....

by DAW＠yalepress3.unipress.yale.edu

***This is sent to the whole ClaasicCmp list, since others may/will have 166Alpha Multias too...*** Pat --- Well, the Multia Heat Death Syndrome (MHDS) is mentioned here... http://www.netbsd.org/Ports/alpha/multiafaq.html#heat-death ...it seems to affect only Multias with the 166MHz Alpha processor. It is on the underside of the board, at the edge closest to the power supply, label E215. One of my Multias just froze, and won't boot up since. Probably MHDS... Common recommendations for Multias is to replace that chip right away. Forgot to do that myself :-/ Doh! Second is to remove the red thermal resistor from the cooling fan (2 yellow wires), which then allows the fan to run at full speed all the time. Or just replace the fan with something that has more cfm output. Once you've got that covered, you should be all set. ---If you put a 2.5" IDE laptop HDD in it, remember that SRM console cannot see it, and therefore cannot boot a kernel off it. You have to either boot from a SCSI HDD, or load the kernel off the floppy, which then can see the IDE HDD and use it. ARC console can boot from either SCSI or IDE. --- David A Woyciesjes --- C & IS Support Specialist --- Yale University Press --- mailto:david.woyciesjes@yale.edu --- (203) 432-0953 --- ICQ # - 905818 ! -----Original Message----- ! From: Pat Barron [mailto:pat@transarc.ibm.com] ! Sent: Friday, September 14, 2001 1:06 PM ! To: David Woyciesjes ! Subject: Re: Need Electronic Soldering help.... ! ! ! David, ! ! I wish I could help you (if I was closer, I'd be happy to). But, your ! message caught my attention - could you explain what you mean ! by the "heat ! death chip"? I am guessing you are referring to a chip that ! has a history ! of failure due to overheat, but which one is it? I have a ! Multia that I ! have not done much with just yet; wondering what sorts of ! problems I can ! expect .... ! ! Thanks, ! --Pat. ! !

23 years, 7 months

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Has anyone heard from Bennet (dec.parts@verizon.net)?

by DAW＠yalepress3.unipress.yale.edu

Bennet's okay. He was just busy with other stuff, because of Tuesday. He sent this message to me... "...A lot of things went on hold due to the WTC attack... ...My brother-in-law was our only person in NYC, and while close enough to see the WTC, he was far enough away to have been in no immediate danger, though he had a time getting out of the city and home that day. I checked into taking my 10,000 lb. GVWR Ford Dually and 12,000 lb. GVWR 16' Beavertail Flatbed up to NYC for vehicle and debris removal, but alas, we don't have the funding to support that operation, and would have required corporate sponsorship. So it probably can't happen. Sincerely, Bennett --- David A Woyciesjes --- C & IS Support Specialist --- Yale University Press --- mailto:david.woyciesjes@yale.edu --- (203) 432-0953 --- ICQ # - 905818 ! -----Original Message----- ! From: Eric Dittman [mailto:dittman@dittman.net] ! Sent: Thursday, September 13, 2001 10:18 PM ! To: classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org ! Subject: Re: Has anyone heard from Bennet (dec.parts(a)verizon.net)? ! ! ! > Has anyone heard from Bennet (dec.parts(a)verizon.net)? ! ! The last email I had from him was just before 8:00AM on Tuesday. ! -- ! Eric Dittman ! dittman(a)dittman.net ! Check out the DEC Ethusiasts Club at http://www.dittman.net/ !

23 years, 7 months

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Need Electronic Soldering help....

by DAW＠yalepress3.unipress.yale.edu

Is there anyone in the CT area (I'm in New Haven) who is good at replacing the soldered chips? I have 3 (or is it 4?) DEC Multias, with the infamous Heat Death chip. I can pay/barter for the parts and labor... Replies should pobably be direct to me, off list... --- David A Woyciesjes --- C & IS Support Specialist --- Yale University Press --- mailto:david.woyciesjes@yale.edu --- (203) 432-0953 --- ICQ # - 905818

23 years, 7 months

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Why is this so slow?

by DAW＠yalepress3.unipress.yale.edu

Well, the message below took over an hour. I sent it at 11:00, and now it's 12:26 when I got it back... --- David A Woyciesjes --- C & IS Support Specialist --- Yale University Press --- mailto:david.woyciesjes@yale.edu --- (203) 432-0953 --- ICQ # - 905818 ! -----Original Message----- ! From: David Woyciesjes [mailto:DAW@yalepress3.unipress.yale.edu] ! Sent: Friday, September 14, 2001 11:06 AM ! To: classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org (E-mail) ! Subject: Why is this so slow? ! ! ! Does anyone have any idea why it takes upwards of 15-20 minutes ! (seems longer sometimes) for my postings to this list to get ! sent back out? ! ! --- David A Woyciesjes ! --- C & IS Support Specialist ! --- Yale University Press ! --- mailto:david.woyciesjes@yale.edu ! --- (203) 432-0953 ! --- ICQ # - 905818 !

23 years, 7 months

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Emulators (was: Classic Computers vs. Classic Computing

by dhquebbeman＠theestopinalgroup.com

> On Thu, 13 Sep 2001, Douglas Quebbeman wrote: > > For example, the IBM 1620 emulator, written in Java, is > > very nice graphically; the 1620 had a great front panel. > > About 35 years ago, I was using a 1620. The two main programs we were > using were a PDQ FORTRAN compiler, and ... > > a 1401 EMULATOR! > > I wonder if the 1401 emulator that ran on the 1620 would run on the 1620 > emulator? > > Unfortunately, last year, one of our administrators hauled off all of our > file cabinets of punched cards, and I don't know where else to find a > copy. Is he a preservationist? Or was he just cleaning shop? -dq

23 years, 7 months

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Classic Computers vs. Classic Computing

by dhquebbeman＠theestopinalgroup.com

> > Apples and oranges, Iggy. That's a totally different emulator world > > than the one I'm talking about. In the world I'm talking about, I > > don't think anyone creating emulators is under 40 years of age > > (well, Daniel Seagraves is under 40, I think). > > Why did you put this limit on 40 ? > ;-) > Most people I know working on emulations are just few years around the > 40 ... Precisely what I said. -dq

23 years, 8 months

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VCF 5.0 Postponed

by vcf＠vintage.org

An Important Message About VCF 5.0: Due to the recent events that have affected all Americans this week, it has been decided to postpone the fifth annual Vintage Computer Festival until further notice. We regret this decision, but in light of the problems being faced by out of town travelers, not to mention the trauma that we have all experienced as a result of the terrible events in New York and Washington, D.C., we felt that this was the right decision to make. We regret any inconvenience this may cause to those who had made arrangements to attend the event this weekend. The VCF wishes to express its sorrow to everyone who has been touched by this tragedy. We encourage everyone to do what they can in the coming days to help those who are in need, including donating blood at your local Red Cross. Please be aware that the California Extreme event will still be taking place this Saturday and Sunday, September 15-16, at Parkside Hall in San Jose, California. Please continue to check the VCF website at http://www.vintage.org/ for updates on when VCF 5.0 will be re-scheduled. We hope and pray for peace to prevail in the comings weeks and months, and we hope you will do the same. Best regards, Sellam Ismail Producer Vintage Computer Festival Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org

23 years, 8 months

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recent acquisitions for the House of VAX

by Antonio.Carlini＠riverstonenet.com

Jerome Fine wrote: > I could probably use the TU58 manuals, however, I would > rather see them > sent to someone who will scan them and make them available to > everyone. I've already scanned the TU58 user manual and if it's not already on its way to DFWCUG it soon will be (for some suitable value of "soon"). > Since I have only RT-11/PDP-11 hardware stuff, what might help? What > about a set of out of print RT-11 DOCs? As far as I know, these are > allowed to be reproduced since they are no longer available? I know someone was trying to get Mentec to give permission for certain manuals to be made available. If this has already been done, then point me to something >from Mentec that says it's OK and your wish may be granted. > Can these be > scanned as well? They can certainly be scanned. Can they legally be made available? > Also, I hope to soon receive an 11/73 manual? Could this > also be scanned? Easily! In fact, as long as it's not available from COMPAQ, years ago DEC gave (almost) blanket permission for anything pre-1985(?) to be made available. > I realize that it is great to have our own copies of these > manuals, but I am > now hoping that they can all be scanned and thereby preserved > before that > is no longer possible. You do know about the DFWCUG scanning project? Pointers to them (and a bunch of other individuals doing the same sort of thing) can be found at http://www.decdocs.org . Antonio

23 years, 8 months

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Classic Computers vs. Classic Computing

by dhquebbeman＠theestopinalgroup.com

> > > But it has no facilities to load/save programs to/from disk. > > It will have when it's done. It's still a work-in-progress. Our plan is > to have console typewriter, paper tape reader/punch and card reader/punch > done graphically like the front panel. Dave- The one I've been laying with is from Richard Jowsey... are you working with him, or is yours a separate project? -dq

23 years, 8 months

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Classic Computers vs. Classic Computing

by dhquebbeman＠theestopinalgroup.com

> I diagree. > > We need both the emulation-simulation fans, AND the hardware fans. I keep reading my original post to see where it is that I suggest a split; I don't. But you're not alone in having mis-read my post. I've felt that discussions about emulators and simulators weren't quite welcome here. I want to see them included. [..snip..] > As for the computing experiuance being computing, I also disagree. Again, a misunderstanding... I consider the term "Classic Computing" to be more inclusive than "Classic Computers". The latter implies (to me) a hardware focus; the former is more inclusive, describing both hardware and software. > Building devices and interfacing them to the hardware has always been > a major attraction to computing, and this is nearly all the original > personal computers were able to do. Hell, I know a guy that did this with mainframes as well. I'm glad to have stimulated conversation; sorry so many are misreading my intentions. Regards, -dq

23 years, 8 months

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OT: World Trade crash...

by marino13＠btopenworld.com

I have to say that I agree with the original part of this - I have been discussing this with my colleagues and I know for a FACT (and yeah its a lot easier to say this when you're not involved) that I would definately take the risk... the chances are you're gonna die anyway. If the plane was on the ground or part of a "hostage scenario" thats different but I am surprised not one person would have tried anything. But who knows... perhaps they did. Just my thoughts. > Unfortunately, I think you're mistaken here, Bill. The typical American of > today hasn't the courage to risk his life as an individual, even if it means > being slaughtered as part of a group. That same American hasn't the courage to > call the cops if he sees someone breaking into his neighbor's house or car, > because he fears being singled out as an honest individual, rather than part of > the corrupt masses. > > Dick > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Bill Sudbrink" <wh.sudbrink(a)verizon.net> > To: <classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org> > Sent: Wednesday, September 12, 2001 7:10 AM > Subject: Re: OT: World Trade crash... > > > > > > Mike Ford [mikeford(a)socal.rr.com] wrote: > > > > > Very sadly I suspect this type of attack to be > > > repeated soon. It was simply too easy and too > > > effective, for other organizations not to try > > > it again. > > > > I doubt that. As a matter of fact, I think that > > most airline hijacking will cease to be effective. > > I think that, after this, any able bodied person > > on a hijacked plane will resist with their life. > > I know that I would, rather than die as part of > > an instrument used to kill many more. > > > > >

23 years, 8 months

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OT: World Trade crash...

by wh.sudbrink＠verizon.net

Mike Ford [mikeford(a)socal.rr.com] wrote: > Very sadly I suspect this type of attack to be > repeated soon. It was simply too easy and too > effective, for other organizations not to try > it again. I doubt that. As a matter of fact, I think that most airline hijacking will cease to be effective. I think that, after this, any able bodied person on a hijacked plane will resist with their life. I know that I would, rather than die as part of an instrument used to kill many more.

23 years, 8 months

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Has anyone heard from Bennet (dec.parts@verizon.net)?

by DAW＠yalepress3.unipress.yale.edu

Has anyone heard from Bennet (dec.parts(a)verizon.net)? --- David A Woyciesjes --- C & IS Support Specialist --- Yale University Press --- mailto:david.woyciesjes@yale.edu --- (203) 432-0953 --- ICQ # - 905818

23 years, 8 months

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OT: World Trade crash...

by DAW＠yalepress3.unipress.yale.edu

I take it you all heard about the two 737s (?) hitting the world trade buildings... one was possibly a hijacked airliner... each hit a seperate tower, I believe... --- David A Woyciesjes --- C & IS Support Specialist --- Yale University Press --- mailto:david.woyciesjes@yale.edu --- (203) 432-0953 --- ICQ # - 905818

23 years, 8 months

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Mac Plus as a webserver...

by mythtech＠Mac.com

>Isn't the SE an 030 Mac? The Plus is only a 68000. No, the SE was an 8mhz 68000 just like the plus. The SE was basically a newer plus (it had a built in HD or 2 800k floppies, ADB, an expansion slot, and a newer ROM). Later the SE was upgraded to having the SuperDrive (not the NEW superdrive that apple has recycled the name for, but rather the original 1.4mb drive that could read MFS, HFS, DOS, and ProDOS) There WAS an SE/30 that was a 16mhz (33mhz?) 68030... it was basically an SE, but with the faster processor and 8 simm slots rather than 4... I think THAT is the Mac you are thinking of. -chris <http://www.mythtech.net>

23 years, 8 months

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Classic Computers vs. Classic Computingt

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

From: Eric Dittman <dittman(a)dittman.net> >> PIII still cant emulate the keyboard layout of a Vt100 or VT220 worth >> poop. > >The PIII will emulate the keyboard layout of a VT220 if you use an LK461 >keyboard. Thats one solution. The other is a real VT{100|125|330|340} or H19 since I do have them and prefer the feel of the keyboards and their respective layouts. Allison

23 years, 8 months

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Classic Computers vs. Classic Computingt

by healyzh＠aracnet.com

> > PIII still cant emulate the keyboard layout of a Vt100 or VT220 worth > > poop. > > The PIII will emulate the keyboard layout of a VT220 if you use an LK461 > keyboard. Also there is a shell script available that will turn an xterm vt100, I've got a copy on my ftp site if anyone wants to try it ftp://zane.brouhaha.com/pub just look for vt100.sh (I think it's in the VMS section). I use it all the time for telneting into my VMS systems. I've got to admit I like the LK461 idea, and just might have to give that a try. Zane

23 years, 8 months

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symphony for dot matrix printers

by acme_ent＠bellsouth.net

> > Being a musician, this conjures up all sorts of ideas for using computer > > sounds to make music. I have a recording studio hung off my main > > non-classic box, so I can add this to my List of Unfinished Projects. Some > > useable sounds might be: > > > > (printers, of course) > > hard drive spinup & chatter > > Head crashes :-) I considered that but don't know of any way to consistently get heads to crash in such a controlled manner as to be useable musically (i.e., makes pretty much the same sound every time). Do you? (Is this subject OT if I'm using > 10 year old gear? And if I'm deliberately causing classic hard drive heads to destroy themselves, hmm . . . is it okay if I only use ST-225s??? ;>) Glen 0/0

23 years, 8 months

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Has anyone heard from Bennet (dec.parts@verizon.net)?

by dittman＠dittman.net

> Has anyone heard from Bennet (dec.parts(a)verizon.net)? The last email I had from him was just before 8:00AM on Tuesday. -- Eric Dittman dittman(a)dittman.net Check out the DEC Ethusiasts Club at http://www.dittman.net/

23 years, 8 months

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Classic Computers vs. Classic Computing

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

Well then ther are those like me... I use MyZ80 as a platform to test z80 and cp/m software at the application level and a real (pat pending ;)) Z80 system with real VT100/125/340 to run it in reality. It's not an Emulator is better or worse thing for me. I cant yet buy a z80 that runs faster than MyZ80 on a PIII/550. At the other extreme that said PIII still cant emulate the keyboard layout of a Vt100 or VT220 worth poop. Allison

23 years, 8 months

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Classic Computers vs. Classic Computing

by daveb＠cup.hp.com

> > -----Original Message----- > > From: owner-classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org > > [mailto:owner-classiccmp@classiccmp.org]On Behalf Of Douglas Quebbeman > > Sent: Thursday, September 13, 2001 3:01 PM > > To: 'classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org' > > Subject: RE: Classic Computers vs. Classic Computing > > > > > > > Doesn't it seem a little odd to be debating whether emulators and > > > simulators are on-topic when the bulk of the list traffic is about > > > politics, and even the list owner can't get full cooperation in > > an attempt > > > to end threads that have absolutely NO connection with computers nor > > > computing? > > > > Ah, you've seen right through me... > > > > We need to get our minds off it for a while, now, I think... > > > > However, I'd actually hoped the discussion would quickly > > leave the real vs. virtual iron and stimulate some interest > > in the simulators and their range of capabilities. > > > > For example, the IBM 1620 emulator, written in Java, is > > very nice graphically; the 1620 had a great front panel. > > You can toggle in a program and run it; additionally, > > it comes with a memory test (or somesuch) already "loaded". > > > > But it has no facilities to load/save programs to/from disk. It will have when it's done. It's still a work-in-progress. Our plan is to have console typewriter, paper tape reader/punch and card reader/punch done graphically like the front panel. The IBM 1620 History project (of which the emulator is one part) has been on hold for almost a year but is being restarted. > > OTOH, Doug Jones' PDP/8E emulator provides those capabillites, > > and if you haven't seen Bernhard Baehr's PDP8/E emulator for > > the Mac, you should, assuming you have a Mac on which to run it. > > > > Hands down, though, the DEC-10 emulators are most excellent! > > They are able to provide me with a nearly exact duplicate of > > one of the computing environments I grew up with and miss. > > The few differences are: I'm the only user (something we used > > to live for), and the machine name doesn't say I U P U I in > > it. But I can change *that*... > > > > I can also get other users online, but that's another story... > > > > Regards, > > -dq Thanks, DaveB

23 years, 8 months

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Classic Computers vs. Classic Computing

by dhquebbeman＠theestopinalgroup.com

> Doesn't it seem a little odd to be debating whether emulators and > simulators are on-topic when the bulk of the list traffic is about > politics, and even the list owner can't get full cooperation in an attempt > to end threads that have absolutely NO connection with computers nor > computing? Ah, you've seen right through me... We need to get our minds off it for a while, now, I think... However, I'd actually hoped the discussion would quickly leave the real vs. virtual iron and stimulate some interest in the simulators and their range of capabilities. For example, the IBM 1620 emulator, written in Java, is very nice graphically; the 1620 had a great front panel. You can toggle in a program and run it; additionally, it comes with a memory test (or somesuch) already "loaded". But it has no facilities to load/save programs to/from disk. OTOH, Doug Jones' PDP/8E emulator provides those capabillites, and if you haven't seen Bernhard Baehr's PDP8/E emulator for the Mac, you should, assuming you have a Mac on which to run it. Hands down, though, the DEC-10 emulators are most excellent! They are able to provide me with a nearly exact duplicate of one of the computing environments I grew up with and miss. The few differences are: I'm the only user (something we used to live for), and the machine name doesn't say I U P U I in it. But I can change *that*... I can also get other users online, but that's another story... Regards, -dq

23 years, 8 months

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Classic Computers vs. Classic Computing

by healyzh＠aracnet.com

> and if you haven't seen Bernhard Baehr's PDP8/E emulator for > the Mac, you should, assuming you have a Mac on which to run it. If you haven't seen it you should find a Mac and borrow it long enough to try it. I know of one list member that bought a Mac to run it (OK, granted it was a very old cheap one). When I got my PDP-8/m and was trying to get it running I used the emulator as a diagnostic aid, so I could see what I should be seeing on the real hardware and better understand what I was doing. Zane

23 years, 8 months

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Introductory Electronics Book?

by cmcmanis＠netapp.com

The Art of Electronics by Horowitz and Hill He will have to read it a couple of times but damn if it isn't the best one. --Chuck At 06:44 AM 9/10/01, you wrote: >I'd like to get some recommendations from the list for a good introductory >electronics book for my 14 year-old son. He's interested in building an >intercom system (and other circuits) that he got off the Web, and I would >like something for him to read that will give him a good understanding of >how the circuit works. (For example, it uses the primary windings of a >120V:12V transformer as a coil.) TIA.

23 years, 8 months

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Classic Computers vs. Classic Computing

by dhquebbeman＠theestopinalgroup.com

> On Thu, 13 Sep 2001, Douglas Quebbeman wrote: > > I'm not favoring splitting the list... just hoping to avoid barbs > > for discussing stuff that isn't 10 years old (the sims themselves). > > I hadn't noticed those barbs. Were they because there wasn't an > obligatory mention of WTC? I've been as guilty as others about maintaining OT threads, the recent one about carburetors comes to mind... no one's ever flamed me for it (which is great), but given that many listers want to avoid too much OT stuff, it seemed worth bringing up. Actually, it never really gets very heated here... you should check out alt.sysadmin.recovery, they drummed me right out of there recently for not having a proper sigdash in my posts. For the record, I *do* have a proper sigdash in my posts (but not here); Outlook Express strips the trailing space, and, well, I'm spinning off-topic again... ;-) -dq

23 years, 8 months

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Incompatible Timesharing System (ITS) Starter Kit Available

by healyzh＠aracnet.com

> Of course, you'll need Bob's simulator; you can check out > Zane Healy's emulators page, or pick up a copy at: For those that don't know my page is at: http://www.aracnet.com/~healyzh/pdp10emu.html and Bob's pages are at: http://www.tiac.net/users/mps/retro/ I've got links to all the ITS related materials on the net that I'm aware of. If anyone knows of any documenation of any sort on the net besides what is at Mirian's site, or the ITS reference manual, version 1.5 from MIT, I'd appreciate knowing about it. The same goes for any other documenation for TOPS-10 and TOPS-20 that isn't already listed on my site. Zane

23 years, 8 months

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Classic Computers vs. Classic Computing

by dhquebbeman＠theestopinalgroup.com

> Perhaps I've been a little strong with my comments (about emulators, say) in > the past. If so, I apologise. I wasn't intending to flame anybody... Nope... didn't take it that way, anyway.... I don't recall when the list was founded ('97?), though I'm a latecomer ('00)... but I still consider a certain portion of the discussions here amount to each of us "feeling each other's callouses"... to abuse banker- talk... Regards, -dq

23 years, 8 months

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Mac Plus as a webserver...

by DAW＠yalepress3.unipress.yale.edu

! They refused to swap my machine... and you can't tell me that ! they didn't ! already have the new ones on order if they were there 2 days ! later... the ! bastard was just trying to clear out inventory and take ! advantage of a ! young teenager. Ouch... That hurts! --- David A Woyciesjes --- C & IS Support Specialist --- Yale University Press --- mailto:david.woyciesjes@yale.edu --- (203) 432-0953 --- ICQ # - 905818

23 years, 8 months

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Classic Computers vs. Classic Computing

by dhquebbeman＠theestopinalgroup.com

> ! ...I'm not sure how many of you have ever thought about this; but > ! now that I've broached the subject, whaddy'all think? > > I dunno about splitting the list. Even my interest is in the > hardware side, like Tony, I'm sure there are many here that go both ways. > And there will be new guys, that are unsure about thier preference, and > seeing discussions about both sides in one place here, will definitely be > helpful to them... I'm not favoring splitting the list... just hoping to avoid barbs for discussing stuff that isn't 10 years old (the sims themselves). -dq

23 years, 8 months

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Classic Computers vs. Classic Computing

by cisin＠xenosoft.com

Doesn't it seem a little odd to be debating whether emulators and simulators are on-topic when the bulk of the list traffic is about politics, and even the list owner can't get full cooperation in an attempt to end threads that have absolutely NO connection with computers nor computing? -- Grumpy Ol' Fred

23 years, 8 months

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Incompatible Timesharing System (ITS) Starter Kit Available

by dhquebbeman＠theestopinalgroup.com

Calling all ten-heads... Thanks to the efforts of many people for preserving the ITS operating system, and to the more recent efforts by Mirian Crzig Lennox in creating an ITS starter kit, interested parties can now run ITS on Bob Supnik's SIMH PDP-10 sim. You'll find Mirian's ITS starter kit at: http://www.cosmic.com/u/mirian/its Of course, you'll need Bob's simulator; you can check out Zane Healy's emulators page, or pick up a copy at: http://www.cosmic.com/u/mirian/its/files/simh26b.zip Additionally, Mirian has also created a mailing list: "To subscribe, send an empty e-mail with "subscribe" in the subject to <its-hackers-request(a)cosmic.com>. The list address itself is <its-hackers(a)cosmic.com>. You must be subscribed to the list in order to post, to prevent spam (but the list is not archived on the web, so you don't need to worry about spam-bots. If I ever do archive the list on-line, I will munge all e-mail addresses to thwart the spam-bots.)" Mirian is providing only the OS for now, but expects to have MIDAS (the ITS assembler), TECO, and of course, EMACS up soon. Everyone is asking about MACLISP; anyone have a copy? Regards, -doug quebbeman

23 years, 8 months

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Mac Plus as a webserver...

by mythtech＠Mac.com

>Properly known as the 'Macintosh SE FDHD'. Yep, I got one of these, running >OS 6.0.7, 50MB HDD, and 4MB RAM... Yeah, I got screwed out of mine... I bought my SE and had heard rumor about them going to FDHDs, and I SPECIFICALLY asked the Computer Factory salesman if they were going to switch. He told me no, that the rumor was false, so I shelled out my $2500 for the SE. Two days later, I was in the Computer Factory, and what did they have... big signs talking about the just arrived SE FDHDs!!! Same price, newer drives! They refused to swap my machine... and you can't tell me that they didn't already have the new ones on order if they were there 2 days later... the bastard was just trying to clear out inventory and take advantage of a young teenager. -chris <http://www.mythtech.net>

23 years, 8 months

1
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IBM System 23

by mythtech＠Mac.com

Does anyone know what current options there are for using IBM System 23 software? This can include emulators, compatible machines or OSes, pretty much anything that is more current than a true 23 and will run the 23 software. I have ONE program that I can't convince the boss to upgrade, and it currently runs on the System 23... the problem is, I am down to my last working machine, and I fear it too will die soon. So I am looking for a way to move the software to a more current computer. I was thinking of a System 23 emulator running on a current Mac or PC, but I have not been successful in finding such (nor do I have any idea how I would transfer the software, but one step at a time) Anyone have any advice? (other than, stop using the software, or upgrade it to a new application... as both ideas have fallen on deaf ears for the last 4 years) Thanks -chris <http://www.mythtech.net>

23 years, 8 months

1
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classiccmp-digest V1 #716

by alan.pearson＠cramer.com

> What kind of security is going to protect against that kind of attack? I > have a knife like object I use to open my mail, its called a CIA Letter > opener, made of glass reinforced nylon it has no xray image, yet is strong > enough to be pounded thru 5/8" plywood without breaking. Three things leap to mind: 1. ban all hand luggage 2. perform security checks right before boarding the plane as well as at the gate and departures entrance 3. have at least three armed counter-terrorist specialists on every flight to cover front, middle & rear sections of the plane. Maybe even six. One thing's for sure - until airlines/governments implement these kind of measures there's *no way* I'm getting on another plane. No way. -al

23 years, 8 months

2
1
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Paging Bill Bradford

by jss＠subatomix.com

My e-mail is not getting through to Bill Bradford: jss@lepton$ mailq /var/spool/mqueue (1 request) ----Q-ID---- --Size-- -----Q-Time----- ------------Sender/Recipient------------ f88GZoL28038 999 Sat Sep 8 11:35 <jss(a)subatomix.com> (Deferred: 450 <lepton.subatomix.com>: Helo command rejected:) <mrbill(a)mrbill.net> Bill, if you're listening, could you check this out? Thanks! -- Jeffrey S. Sharp jss(a)subatomix.com

23 years, 8 months

2
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Spliting a DEC BA350

by dittman＠dittman.net

> A BA350 is a StorageWorks shelf. It has a total of 8 slots, one of which > MUST be used for a power SBB (System Building Block), and a second that can > be used for one. The second power slot and the remaining 6 slots can be > used for drive SBB's, which are typically one slot Hard Drives, but can > also be CD-ROM's and DLT drives (both 3 slot I believe, and I don't think > there is a 8mm tape option), or a 1 slot 4mm tape drive. Unfortunatly all > I've got are disks. The BA350 shelf is Narrow SCSI, there is also a BA356 > which is wide SCSI and has an additional model where the cables plug in > that takes a 'personality model', this dictates if the shelf is Narrow or > Wide. The BA356 is a wide shelf even if the 8-bit personality module is installed. The 8-bit personality module just lets you use wide shelves/drives with narrow controllers. A wide drive will not work in a narrow shelf. > That's just the single shelf config's. There are also shelves that take > things such as a HSZ50 which plugs into a SCSI DIFF card and can do RAID > and stuff, or another HSsomething that plugs into a DSSI bus. The HSZxx are differential SCSI, the HSDxx are DSSI, the HSJxx are CI, and the HSGxx are fibre channel. -- Eric Dittman dittman(a)dittman.net Check out the DEC Ethusiasts Club at http://www.dittman.net/

23 years, 8 months

1
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Mac Plus as a webserver...

by Robert_Feldman＠jdedwards.com

Mike Kopplin had an HP 200LX palmtop (i80186, 2MB Ram, MS-DOS 5.0, powered by AC wall wart or 2 AA batteries; not entirely OT, since the 200LX model didn't come out until 1994, but the LX line started in 1991) running as a web server for 16 months between April 16, 1999 and September 4, 2000. For more information see: http://www.technoir.nu/hplx/welcome.html

23 years, 8 months

1
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Spliting a DEC BA350

by healyzh＠aracnet.com

I'm finding myself trying to bring another system online, needing more space on an existing system and running short of space in my server rack. I seem to recall that it is possible to split a BA350 in half by pulling something out. Am I correct in assuming that this lets you plug the shelf into two seperate systems (in this case one Alpha/UNIX, and the other VAX/VMS). Anyone have any experience with this? Zane

23 years, 8 months

4
5
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*sigh*

by DAW＠yalepress3.unipress.yale.edu

Jay --- Thanks for the smack, honestly, really. I do owe you a big apology for my rash message. I forgot to count to 5 (and think) before hitting the Send button. I know this is no excuse, but I replied rashly, in the heat of the moment, and out of anger. I also didn't realize exactly who you were either, in relation to this list. Again, big apologies to you, Jay. My bad. ! ... And before ! you go and accuse me of insensitivity, you might consider that the WTC ! tragedy has affected me very personally and directly in a ! manner that I will ! not discuss here. I'm not gonna ask, don't want to know, but my prayers go to you and yours, along with everyone else affected by this... --- David A Woyciesjes --- C & IS Support Specialist --- Yale University Press --- mailto:david.woyciesjes@yale.edu --- (203) 432-0953 --- ICQ # - 905818

23 years, 8 months

1
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errata

by west＠tseinc.com

oops... it was a typo, I meant 100, not 101 *GRIN* Is *THAT* what none of the programs I enter from the front panel work :) Jay

23 years, 8 months

1
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*sigh*

by west＠tseinc.com

David and Jeffrey: (The few places where I'm being sarcastic are explicitly noted in a manner I hope Jeffrey will find amusing) David said.... ----------------- They were then able to take care of necessary business in due time. If I upset someone by posting an OT message to one of my mailing lists, and helping someone in the process, I say too bad. Suck it up. There are a few times when an OT post is accepted. Yesterday was one of them. But, yes, now is the time to kill this thread from the list, now that everything has calmed down some... ----------------- "They were then able..." I agree. You're (and others) first few OT posts were no problem. I think it was intended as a service, and I (as well as others I'm sure) appreciated it. "suck it up"? <sarcasm>Your sentiment is duly noted. Thanks. I appreciate it.</sarcasm> "There are a few times when an OT post..." Yup, you're absolutely correct. I agree. That is why I didn't say a single word for the first 100 or so posts. Matter of fact, it wasn't the fact there were 100 posts about the subject that set me off, it was two things: 1) when the last few in the thread started to become extremely inflamatory political rhetoric, and 2) when the discussion branched into a discussion of the skillset necessary to fly a 767 (and I'm a pilot, so I'm not unappreciative of the content of the discussion). Case closed - I'm not going to revisit that, it was hashed over excessively a month ago. "But yes, now is the time to kill this thread..." <sarcasm>Why thank you for your decision.</sarcasm> Jeffrey said... -------------------- However, I think some sensitiviy and leverage may be appropriate given the circumstances. The US has faced inarguably, the worst tragedy whithin it's history and thousands of lives we're lost yesterday. -------------------- "...sensitivity and leverage..." I couldn't agree more. As a point of reference, you might want to be aware that the majority of private messages I got about the last political discussion asked for the "reasonable limit of posts in an OT thread" to be FOUR. Or did they really mean 101 (geek humor, do the math). I have no intentions whatsoever to be a censor (or even a moderator as Sellam suggests). I had no problem with the sensitivity and leverage of allowing the thread to go on as long as it was. I ONLY stepped in when the thread starting branching out to other OT threads, AND the political rhetoric started becoming exceptionally inflamatory. And before you go and accuse me of insensitivity, you might consider that the WTC tragedy has affected me very personally and directly in a manner that I will not discuss here. Regards Jay West

23 years, 8 months

1
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Tim Olmstead passed away

by IVIE＠cc.usu.edu

I saw a note over on comp.os.cpm this morning saying that Tim Olmstead has succumbed to his cancer and passed away. Since the Caldera license to distribute CP/M was in his name, this will affect the free distribution of CP/M until someone can pry a new license out of Caldera. Roger Ivie ivie(a)cc.usu.edu

23 years, 8 months

3
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A great loss, on topic...

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

Today Tim Olmstead passed away from a battle with cancer. A great loss. For those less familiar with his efforts for the classic computer community the _Unofficial CP/M Web_ site is his effort. For me I lost a friend and someone that shared the love of a system he could totally understand to the very hardware and bits that made it run. Allison

23 years, 8 months

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World Trade crash...

by LFessen106＠aol.com

In a message dated 9/11/01 10:19:47 AM Eastern Daylight Time, edick(a)idcomm.com writes: > Yes ... Dubya must have REALLY pissed someone off! Reports are that these > were > specific attacks, and that there was also an apparently intentional crash on > a > helipad near the Pentagon ... <sigh> You'd think they'd get closer than > that > ... > > Dick For those of you with friends and loved ones in these areas my heart and prayers are with you. At 10:40am here on the east coast there have been 4 attacks so far. The world trade center twice, the pentagon, and the state dept bldg in washington. -Linc Fessenden In The Beginning there was nothing, which exploded - Yeah right... Calculating in binary code is as easy as 01,10,11.

23 years, 8 months

10
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ENOUGH ALREADY

by DAW＠yalepress3.unipress.yale.edu

-----Original Message----- From: Jay West [mailto:west@tseinc.com] I sincerely agree as to the tragedy of recent US events. My heart goes out to all affected. HOWEVER, this is a classic computer mailing list. The discussion on the WTC stuff is very interesting, but it belongs on all the myraid of other lists present on the net for this purpose. What on EARTH posessed people to think we needed blow by blow updates on this list about current world events? Think - if you have to put "OT" in the subject of your message, it probably doesn't belong here. Regards, Jay West Jay --- Thank you for your sympathy... What possesed us to post updates here? Since I was the first to mention it (IIRC, I might be wrong), I'll answer... Simple. Many people here were stuck at work, without any source of news, to find out what was happening. Major news websites were useless, since they were all swamped yesterday. I know of a couple people, who didn't know a thing about it, until I sent a message. They were then able to take care of necessary business in due time. If I upset someone by posting an OT message to one of my mailing lists, and helping someone in the process, I say too bad. Suck it up. There are a few times when an OT post is accepted. Yesterday was one of them. But, yes, now is the time to kill this thread from the list, now that everything has calmed down some... It's time to help your neighbors. Call your local Red Cross, and make an app't to donate blood. --- David A Woyciesjes --- C & IS Support Specialist --- Yale University Press --- mailto:david.woyciesjes@yale.edu <mailto:david.woyciesjes@yale.edu> --- (203) 432-0953 --- ICQ # - 905818

23 years, 8 months

2
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Where are the Anti-OT measures?

by celigne＠tinyworld.co.uk

I'm not disputing the importance of this issue, but this isn't the place.

23 years, 8 months

4
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essential CP/M files

by frustum＠pacbell.net

Since somebody brought up the issue of CP/M, I have a question for the old CP/M hands out there in classiccmp-land. Short version: If you were stuck on an island with a solar-powered CP/M machine and only one floppy disk in CP/M 2.2 format, which programs and utilities would you want on that disk? Longer version: I've been (slowly) adding support for emulating a double-density (dual density, actually) northstar disk controller in my Sol emulator, Solace. When I release this version of the emulator, I was wondering what disk images to present with it. I know full well that I might be the only person who will really use this, and a few dozen people may fire it up, mess with it a bit, and that's all. Still, having spent so much time developing it, I'd like to present a polished package. There is, fortunately, a wealth of CP/M files still out there on the net, but my goal isn't to collect them all and put them on my site. What I want is to have some essential/useful general CP/M programs, then collect just those that are specific to the Sol version of CP/M (or another S-100 machine using a VDM). Any opinions of what I should distribute with the emulator? Here is what I am planning on so far: STAT PIP ASM MAC DDT ED DUMP LOAD SUBMIT XSUB This list was chosen simply because these are the standard programs/utilities that D.R. shipped with CP/M 2.2 and are described in their user's manual. Unfortunately, I don't have FORMAT, MOVCPM, PUTSYS, GETSYS, or SYSGEN since all this has been bootstrapped up off of the single floppy that was in my machine when I got it, and that disk didn't include much of anything other than the boot tracks. I could recreate them, but it would take some time and it is time I'd rather spend in other ways. It probably doesn't matter anyway since there is no good reason to SYSGEN as the emulator has only one memory size. Although there are lots of replacement programs for those listed above that are undoubtedly better than the stock CP/M 2.2 programs, I am going to use the originals from D.R. and leave it up to any user who cares enough to customize it as they see fit. I plan on adding one disk utility to allow making a sector-by-sector copy of virtual disks so that new boot disks can be created. NSCOPY is the one I use on my real Sol, so it is probably the one I will distribute with Solace. As a reminder, the Sol uses an 8080, so I can't use a lot of the fancy Z80-ified programs that are out there. Thanks for any opinions you can share. ----- Jim Battle == frustum(a)pacbell.net

23 years, 8 months

1
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OT: Some new WTC pics...

by DAW＠yalepress3.unipress.yale.edu

I got a couple more pictures of the World Trade Towers... http://pages.cthome.net/squeege/wtrade/updates.html --- David A Woyciesjes --- C & IS Support Specialist --- Yale University Press --- mailto:david.woyciesjes@yale.edu --- (203) 432-0953 --- ICQ # - 905818

23 years, 8 months

4
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Please, more computers...

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

From: Zane H. Healy <healyzh(a)aracnet.com> To: classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org <classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org> Date: Wednesday, September 12, 2001 10:10 PM Subject: Re: ENOUGH ALREADY >volume lists than this one! I for one would like to read something about >classic computers, as I'm feeling the need for a refuge from the madness! Please, radio, TV and whatnot is saturated with the news. I need a break >from it. Right now I need something else even if off topic just not that one. Allison

23 years, 8 months

1
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New scores!

by west＠tseinc.com

Just unpacked a truely rare and valuable item.... A CE alignment disc cartridge for an HP 7900A disc drive! woohoo! (also about five 7900A disc cartridges) Also just obtained three 7906D disc drives, three 13037 disc controller subsystems, three 13037 disc interface cards, about ten 7906 disc cartridges, and all associated cables! Of course, I am truely not worthy to own such gear, since I seem to think FOUR is 101 *GRIN* Jay West

23 years, 8 months

2
1
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ENOUGH ALREADY

by healyzh＠aracnet.com

I couldn't agree more! I'm down to three mailing lists anymore, and this list is the only one I activelly read. I'm also noticing that it has more posts about this than the other two put together, and they're BOTH higher volume lists than this one! I for one would like to read something about classic computers, as I'm feeling the need for a refuge from the madness! Zane > Well, I'll second Jay's opinion. I hope others who feel likewise will > do the same. > > I understand your need to discuss these events. I suggest you do so > with your family, friends, and co-workers. > > Respectfully, > > John > > Jeffrey Ingber wrote: > > > > Thanks for the HTML. > > > > Right now, it would seem that you are in the minority - as most people > > seem to have more pressing issues than Classic Computers. > > > > Jeffrey H. Ingber (jhingber _at_ ix.netcom.com) > > > > On Wed, 2001-09-12 at 16:21, Jay West wrote: > > > I sincerely agree as to the tragedy of recent US events. My heart goes out to all affected. > > > > > > HOWEVER, this is a classic computer mailing list. The discussion on the WTC stuff is very interesting, but it belongs on all the myraid of other lists present on the net for this purpose. > > > > > > What on EARTH posessed people to think we needed blow by blow updates on this list about current world events? Think - if you have to put "OT" in the subject of your message, it probably doesn't belong here. > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > Jay West > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > Part 1.2Type: application/pgp-signature >

23 years, 8 months

1
0
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Fwd: gulovsen@law.uiuc.edu: Wang disk conversion referral

by dtwright＠uiuc.edu

Hey all, If anyone can help this guy out, it'd be greatly appreciated... if you can help, please contact him directly. It sounds like they're willing to pay for the help too. Thanks... ----- Forwarded message from "Gulovsen, Grant" <gulovsen(a)law.uiuc.edu> ----- Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2001 13:20:04 -0500 Reply-To: "Gulovsen, Grant" <gulovsen(a)law.uiuc.edu> From: "Gulovsen, Grant" <gulovsen(a)law.uiuc.edu> Subject: Wang disk conversion referral To: CCSP(a)LISTSERV.UIUC.EDU X-Loop: dtwright(a)uiuc.edu Despite asking all College of Law faculty members to convert their WANG-based documents to WordPerfect/Word many (many, many) years ago, we have a faculty member who now needs to pull an old article off of two 8" WANG disks (ugh). Does anyone out there know anyone who is capable of performing this onerous task? Obviously we would prefer to find something reasonably priced on campus, but he is willing to pay for a commercial service. Thanks (and he promises to convert all of his old WANG disks as part of this process). Sincerely, Grant Robert Gulovsen Director of Information Services University of Illinois College of Law 203A Law Building, MC-594 504 East Pennsylvania Avenue Champaign, IL 61820 phone: 217.244.0157 fax: 217.244.1478 email: gulovsen(a)law.uiuc.edu url: http://www.law.uiuc.edu ----- End forwarded message ----- - Dan Wright (dtwright(a)uiuc.edu) (http://www.uiuc.edu/~dtwright) -] ------------------------------ [-] -------------------------------- [- ``Weave a circle round him thrice, / And close your eyes with holy dread, For he on honeydew hath fed, / and drunk the milk of Paradise.'' Samuel Taylor Coleridge, Kubla Khan

23 years, 8 months

1
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Tim Olmstead passed away

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

From: Sellam Ismail <foo(a)siconic.com> > >Why can't someone simply inherit Tim's license and pass it on to someone >else who is willing to take over? Is it non-transferrable? There is no license, it was a handshake between people in Caldara and Tim. Allison

23 years, 8 months

1
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We're saved!

by foo＠siconic.com

I just heard on the news: no steak knives in First Class anymore. That'll thwart those pesky terrorists!! Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org

23 years, 8 months

2
1
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still more OT

by cmcmanis＠mcmanis.com

Now CNN is reporting some people arrested on the George Washington Bridge driving a van full of explosives. It isn't "over" yet, --Chuck

23 years, 8 months

2
1
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ebay: Intel SnapIn 386 upgrade for IBM 5160 AT or IBM PS/2 models 50 or 60

by rhblakeman＠kih.net

Just posted it - 286 to 386 upgrade in box. Item 1273362665 for non-html readers. http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1273362665

23 years, 8 months

5
7
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August was the month for the Hayes Chronograph

by erd_6502＠yahoo.com

Apparently, I shouldn't have left town. Someone here mentioned the Chronograph that went for $39 on eBay during the third week of August. Shortly thereafter, from St. Louis, another one went, with box, for $10.50 after two bids. :-( Foo! -ethan __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get email alerts & NEW webcam video instant messaging with Yahoo! Messenger http://im.yahoo.com

23 years, 8 months

1
0
0 0

Hayes Chronograph on eBay

by rcini＠optonline.net

No bids as of 9pm EST. Item 1266277281. $9.00 I'm not connected to the auction in any way. I was just browsing and throught I'd let everyone know. Rich Rich Cini Collector of classic computers Build Master for the Altair32 Emulation Project Web site: http://highgate.comm.sfu.ca/~rcini/classiccmp/ /************************************************************/

23 years, 8 months

3
2
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Anyone want an 11/750 & 11/730 out of New Jersey?

by mythtech＠Mac.com

>Since you don't know what to do with either, here is a little warning, >they're big. I'm going to guess the 11/730 is a 19" rack, and the 11/750 >will be bigger. YIKES... humm... then maybe I don't want them (although, still, if they are going to the dumpster, I would probably play with them for a while before returning them to the dumpster, or passing them on to someone else) -chris <http://www.mythtech.net>

23 years, 8 months

2
1
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OT: World Trade crash...

by SUPRDAVE＠aol.com

In a message dated 9/11/2001 10:15:10 AM Central Daylight Time, fernande(a)internet1.net writes: > How big is a 737? I didn't think an airplane would do that much > damage. The Empire State building has been hit before, by accident, > although, it prpbably wasn't a direct hit. > > I see it on TV, However. I'm stunned, really. > > looks like it hit sideways on edge, taking out that side of the building. a B24 hit the ESB, not that much damage.

23 years, 8 months

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anyone have a wire disc cartridge rack?

by west＠tseinc.com

Since I've finally gotten my 2000Access system up AND obtained a fair number of 7900/7906 cartridges for it, I was looking for a cartridge rack. The style I'm thinking of is simply thick metal wire/rods, formed into a long tripod affair. This type was typically put on top of the computer rack or on a table, and 7900/7906 media (think RK05 or IBM 2313 cartridges) just got set in each slot on their side. This rack just held the media until use, very much like the wire tabletop mag tape racks. I'm looking for one that holds about 7-10 cartridges or so. If anyone has one of these to part with (or is willing to cut a long one in half and give up half) let me know. Thanks! Jay West

23 years, 8 months

1
0
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Introductory Electronics Book?

by alan.pearson＠cramer.com

> Chuck McManis wrote: > > > The Art of Electronics by Horowitz and Hill > > > > Great book, but definitely NOT as an introductory book. I'm not sure that it falls into either category... I bought it recently - it does start off assuming no prior knowledge, so from that point of view it's suitable for beginners. It does however get very "involved" quite early on... to me though this is a good thing, and I wouldn't hesistate in recommending the book to other beginners like myself as long as you're genuinely motiviated enough to want to learn - I had to re-read some sections several times before the mental light clicked on :-) The "eureka" moment in the bath when I finally understood how the NAND transistor circuit worked was too cool for words ;-) The writing style is very clear, they give "real world" examples, sample circuits (both good and bad, to illustrate common gotchas), and cover a huge range of topics. It's a MUST HAVE in my opinion. --al

23 years, 8 months

2
1
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OT: World Trade crash...

by dhquebbeman＠theestopinalgroup.com

> > Like I said, this is a reckoning. > > > It is only a reckoning in the eyes of a select few -- such > as those firing guns in the air in celebration of the many > dead. There is no way that the taking of thousands of > "innocent" lives balances out anything. Just as nothing > will be resolved when we inevitably do the same in > retaliation. I think the point he was trying to make regarding reckoning is that America's foreign policy doesn't take into account (or does a poor job of doing so) the reactions of various peoples who think of themselves as disaffected. So, our nation throws it weight around long enough, and eventually, push comes to shove. I had expected something like this for a long time; the recent economic good-times had lulled me into a false sense of security (things are great all over, no?)... It's not about whether they are justfied (in reality) or not, but how they feel about their situation. They feel put-upon, and they hold us partly (w/r/t Palestinians) or totally (Iraq) to blame. Should we therefore have a foreign policy that is doomed to forever "walk on eggshells"? No; but status quo clearly isn't working. -dq

23 years, 8 months

2
1
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OT- Re: World Trade Crash and a bit about computers

by dhquebbeman＠theestopinalgroup.com

> Keep in mind, Arthur, that you can't have it both ways. You've got to choose > between security and freedom. I think what Sellam is driving at is that every > externally imposed effort to ensure your security impairs someone's freedoms. > Perhaps we don't all see it that way, but it could be argued. Nonetheless, I > don't feel that letting someone look in my carry-on luggage to make sure I don't > have guns, knives, bombs, etc. is a reasonable infringement, partiticularly > since I've effectively agreed to allow this invasion of my privacy as part of > the contract associated with air travel. This will certainly lead to fewer men packing women's underwear in their suitcases, not to mention various flesh-tone plastic toys... Should anyone else care to enumerate the "legal things I'd hate to get caught with in my suitcase", please reply privately... -dq

23 years, 8 months

1
0
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OT: World Trade crash updates...

by DAW＠yalepress3.unipress.yale.edu

All my prayers go out to all the victims... Some updates & summary from various sources... Two planes have flown into both towers of the World Trade Center, one plane (an American Airlines 767) is known to have been hijacked from an airport in Boston. The towers have been evacuated. Uh oh, some are still in the towers, two people just jumped. Part of the World Trade tower has collapsed All traffic in and out of NY has been stopped, no one in, no one out. All airports in US have been shut down. No flights in, no flights out. 1-800 phone calls apparently not working... A commercial airplane has flown into the Pentagon, Pentagon has been evacuated too. UNCONFIRMED reports of several more (possibly hi-jacked) planes still in the air. All other planes have been ordered to land. A fire has started in front of the White House (they are calling it the Mall of the White House) and the White House has been evacuated too. Capitol, treasury, White House, and State Department have been evacuated. Boston and many other major cities are evacuating all potential taget sites/buildings also... As the White House was being evacuated, a threat came in, a credible threat, and the evacuation process went even fast, at first they were evacuating in an orderly fashion. Supposedly the president was supposed to be heading back from Florida. I'm sure that's going to be detoured somewhere else. --- David A Woyciesjes --- C & IS Support Specialist --- Yale University Press --- mailto:david.woyciesjes@yale.edu --- (203) 432-0953 --- ICQ # - 905818

23 years, 8 months

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Asunto: Re: World Trade crash...

by David.Neal＠ubsw.com

$20 worth of flight sim should be enough for the job. -----Original Message----- From: jss Sent: 12 September 2001 14:58 To: classiccmp Cc: jss Subject: Re: Asunto: Re: World Trade crash... On Tue, 11 Sep 2001, Chuck McManis wrote: > Don, you forget [...] training I bet this was the biggest cost; you just don't learn how to fly a big commercial jet overnight. -- Jeffrey S. Sharp jss(a)subatomix.com Visit our website at http://www.ubswarburg.com This message contains confidential information and is intended only for the individual named. If you are not the named addressee you should not disseminate, distribute or copy this e-mail. Please notify the sender immediately by e-mail if you have received this e-mail by mistake and delete this e-mail from your system. E-mail transmission cannot be guaranteed to be secure or error-free as information could be intercepted, corrupted, lost, destroyed, arrive late or incomplete, or contain viruses. The sender therefore does not accept liability for any errors or omissions in the contents of this message which arise as a result of e-mail transmission. If verification is required please request a hard-copy version. This message is provided for informational purposes and should not be construed as a solicitation or offer to buy or sell any securities or related financial instruments.

23 years, 8 months

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World Trade crash...

by SUPRDAVE＠aol.com

In a message dated 9/11/2001 11:37:26 AM Central Daylight Time, fernande(a)internet1.net writes: > Richard Erlacher wrote: > > The networks are issuing conflicting reports about that, but it's clear it > > wasn't a helipad on a nearby building. The Pentagon is apparently > severely > > damaged and there's been considerable loss of life. Of course that's > nothing as > > compared with the WTC disaster, now that both towers have collapsed. > > Doesn't the pentagon hold many many people as well? > > > The heart of Washington D.C. OTOH is apparently being (relatively) quitely > > evacuated. I don't know how the key government agencies can function if > they're > > not going to work, however. They've shut down the CIA, the NSA, and other > > security-related agencies. You (Jeff) can probably provide more detail, > since > > you're there. > > I'm sure the core parts of the agencies are working very hard right > now. They'll be in the field and in other lesser known offices. If > another plane hit the main offices of our security agencies, with our > people inside, then we would be in a lot more trouble. It's better to > have them in other places. > > > > > I note that Dubya is on the tube. I wonder where they set him down. He > was in > > the air when this happened. Likewise, Colin Powell apparently turned > around > > from his trip to Columbia, or wherever he was going. > > I haven't seen him yet. I did just see Arafat. He looked shocked, > althoughm he might be a good actor too? Don't know, just speculating. > > Chad Fernandez > Michigan, USA > my brother says AF1 came in andrews AFB with fighter escort and it's locked up there better than alcratraz. Im sure there's plenty going on in DC as theres lots of information that doesnt get fed to the general populace.

23 years, 8 months

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World Trade crash...

by RCini＠congressfinancial.com

I work in midtown Manhattan...both buildings have collapsed. There is nothing but blue sky where the Twin Towers once stood. ========================== Richard A. Cini, Jr. Congress Financial Corporation 1133 Avenue of the Americas 30th Floor New York, NY 10036 (212) 545-4402 (212) 840-6259 (facsimile) -----Original Message----- From: David Woyciesjes [mailto:DAW@yalepress3.unipress.yale.edu] Sent: Tuesday, September 11, 2001 9:23 AM To: classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org (E-mail) Subject: OT: World Trade crash... Importance: High I take it you all heard about the two 737s (?) hitting the world trade buildings... one was possibly a hijacked airliner... each hit a seperate tower, I believe... --- David A Woyciesjes --- C & IS Support Specialist --- Yale University Press --- mailto:david.woyciesjes@yale.edu --- (203) 432-0953 --- ICQ # - 905818

23 years, 8 months

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Tandy 1400 LT

by pjschilling＠gcstech.net

Mike, There were a few before the 1400. The 100/102/200 for sure. There are many 100's and 102's still in use. I know a few journalists locally using them. Phil -----Original Message----- From: owner-classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org [mailto:owner-classiccmp@classiccmp.org]On Behalf Of Mike Ford Sent: Wednesday, September 12, 2001 12:13 AM To: classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org Subject: Tandy 1400 LT I bought a Tandy 1400 portable today. Not bad shape, a bit of plastic damage in a couple places on the case, but it lights up and asks for a floppy and the battery doesn't even appear totally totally dead (only mostly dead). Is this the first Tandy laptop? Anybody interested before eBay? NEC 8088 4.77/7.00 MHz CPU (V-20) LCD Backlit CGA Display Panel Dual 3.5" 720k Disk Drives 640k RAM Serial/Parallel/CGA/TV Connectors

23 years, 8 months

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A great loss, on topic...

by pete＠dunnington.u-net.com

On Sep 11, 21:42, ajp166 wrote: > Today Tim Olmstead passed away from a battle with cancer. > A great loss. I'm very sorry to hear that. He was a nice guy and made a significant contribution to our hobby. -- Pete Peter Turnbull Network Manager University of York

23 years, 8 months

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