- test-drb@ccmp.vtda.org - classiccmp.org

by dittman＠dittman.net

> > I missed the 4000 due to the shadow and the BA215 as I didn't scroll all > > the way down. More nice toys. > Very nice toys. I have a MV4k200 in a BA215. A very handy QBus VAX and > it is nice to work on the BA215. No finger breaking and flor crawling > like on the flor stand BA23. Even worse is a rack-mount dual BA23. I used to have to pull all the cards out and reseat them on one system. The quad-width cards had locks, but the dual-width didn't, and I couldn't easily get to the dual-width cards to properly reseat them with the quad-width cards in place. I really like the BA213 and BA440. I have a 4000/500 in a BA440 at home. > > As someone that cares for an 8820 at work, > A 8820 still in production use?! > I know from ragge, the NetBSD/VAX port-master, that there is a 8800 in > north Sweden runing. AFAIK it is the machine behind ftp.luth.se, as the > folowing picture implies: > http://www.ludd.luth.se/gallery/ludd1-mII/ftp.luth.se_mark_IV-4.jpg Yes, indeed. All because of licensing costs. The 8820 is their slowest system and all it does is run that one piece of software. Never mind the environmental and service costs are more than a new system and license. > > I really think the 8700 is nuts, but fun. > Nuts are fun. ;-) Yeah, people think I'm a nut, and my computer collection is not nearly as large as it should be. -- Eric Dittman dittman(a)dittman.net Check out the DEC Ethusiasts Club at http://www.dittman.net/

25 years, 1 month

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Does anyone have RM03 prints?

by dseagrav＠sakura.lunar-tokyo.net

I'm rebuilding an RM03 head stack (I have two crashed drives, making one good one from the two), and I got a problem here... Drive one has all of the heads bad except for platter 2, head 1, and surface 3, head two. (That is, I have one good UP head, and one good DOWN head.) Drive two has all of the heads good, except for the heads for platter 1. That is, I have both the UP and DOWN heads for the topmost platter dead. The problem is, the good UP head from the first drive is the servo head, apparently - The pigtails for this head come out on the opposite side from the others, and it has a double-ended connection. Can this head be used as a normal data head anyway? The pinout looks the same, except that it has two endings, both of which look alike... Can someone look at the RM03 prints and find this out for me? This is my only good UP head, so if I roach it, I'm done for. PS: Ripping the drive apart and getting the head stack out to play with was somewhat easier than it looked like; All I had to do was get the big magnet out of the back, have someone hold the logic cage while I undid the drive head pigtails, undo the track 0 microswitch, disconnect the big coil at the end of the head assembly, and pull the whole mess out the back of the drive. Oh, and I'll have to take pictures of the crashed heads later; They're really impressive! The original top head for the second drive is COMPLETELY GONE. I have both the head and the platter it crashed onto stored upstairs to take pictures of as soon as the camera works again.

25 years, 1 month

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Interdata 7/32 C maintenance manual

by engdahl＠cle.ab.com

I was rummaging in the attic looking for my IBM 1130 listings, and came across this Interdata 7/32 C Maintenance Manual. It includes detailed schematics of the CPU, and the microcode listing. Is anyone interested in scanning or copying this? -- Jonathan Engdahl???????????????? Rockwell Automation Principal Research Engineer????? 24800 Tungsten Road Advanced Technology????????????? Euclid, OH 44117, USA Euclid Labs????????????????????? engdahl(a)cle.ab.com 216-266-6409

25 years, 1 month

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Philips P850 (Was: Classic Computers vs...)

by alan.pearson＠cramer.com

"Tony Duell" wrote: > It is worth seeing just how a processor can be built from > gates and flip-flops (and this will hopefully remove the myth that > there's something magical about the design of a CPU). A good book was written about this back in the late 80s by the bloke who taught us about digital design. I forget the title, but the author is Peter Thewlis and the book was published by the Oxford University Press. Takes you all the way from the basics of how to build various flip-flops to how to build registers and an ALU. Excellent fun :) --al

25 years, 1 month

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Small Vaxen (was Re: Mainframe stuff...

by cmcmanis＠netapp.com

Does anyone know how to take the rolling feet off a BA215? Its really straightforward on the BA213 (I assume the same for the BA440) but the BA215 has recessed hex head screws and I can't get to them. I was wondering if there was some "preliminary" step that exposed them. --Chuck >Very nice toys. I have a MV4k200 in a BA215. A very handy QBus VAX and >it is nice to work on the BA215. No finger breaking and flor crawling >like on the flor stand BA23.

25 years, 1 month

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Mainframe stuff...

by dittman＠dittman.net

I accidentally deleted the message before I read it completely, so I don't know what you said after commenting about the VUPs rating for the 7650, but the 7650 is about 155 VUPs, not 175, according the table I got from DEC. The 7610 is 35 VUPs, and each processor adds 30VUPs. You lose the rest due to overhead. -- Eric Dittman dittman(a)dittman.net Check out the DEC Ethusiasts Club at http://www.dittman.net/

25 years, 1 month

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Two DEC LN03 toner / maintenance kits available

by jfoust＠threedee.com

I picked up two each of the toner cart kit and the user maintenance kits, at $2 each. They're available at that cost plus shipping. New in box, unused. - John

25 years, 1 month

4
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MC68881 vs MC68882 (was Re: Mac Plus as a webserver...)

by Lee.Davison＠merlincommunications.com

> 68882 is right for 68030 & 68020. 68881 only foir 68020. > (talking about hardware, no software) My memory is that the parts were interchangable in hardware (presuming the speed was OK) but the performance was better at a given speed for the 68882 over the 68881. They are. Lee. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ---- This email is intended only for the above named addressee(s). The information contained in this email may contain information which is confidential. The views expressed in this email are personal to the sender and do not in any way reflect the views of the company. If you have received this email and you are not a named addressee please delete it from your system and contact Merlin Communications International IT Department on +44 20 7344 5888. _____________________________________________________________________ This message has been checked for all known viruses by Star Internet delivered through the MessageLabs Virus Scanning Service. For further information visit http://www.star.net.uk/stats.asp or alternatively call Star Internet for details on the Virus Scanning Service.

25 years, 1 month

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Tru64 V5.1

by dittman＠dittman.net

I know this is off-topic, but earlier there was some discussion that included comments about people buying the Tru64 hobbyist kit. If anyone has the Tru64 V5.1 CD set, I need to get an ISO image of the Associated Products CD 1 of 2. I damaged my CD. -- Eric Dittman dittman(a)dittman.net Check out the DEC Ethusiasts Club at http://www.dittman.net/

25 years, 1 month

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MC68881 vs MC68882 (was Re: Mac Plus as a webserver...)

by dittman＠dittman.net

> My memory is that the parts were interchangable in hardware (presuming > the speed was OK) but the performance was better at a given speed > for the 68882 over the 68881. I never did any rendering on my Amigas, > so my use of the floating point was rather limited. I skipped over > the '020 when I was heavily into Amigas, leaping from a massively > expanded A1000 (Rejuvinator, Spirit InBoard, Microbotics Starboard w/Star- > Drive, ROM switcher, etc.) to an A3000/25. I had a Mac II, which used a 68881. I remember the 68882 being sold by some people as a speed-up for the Mac II. I bought a 68851 MMU so I could run A/UX on my Mac II. The 68851 added functionality necessary for A/UX but did slow down memory access slightly. -- Eric Dittman dittman(a)dittman.net Check out the DEC Ethusiasts Club at http://www.dittman.net/

25 years, 1 month

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Wang 8" disks

by fire＠dataflo.net

good reputation, don't know how expensive... http://www.discinterchange.com/ they claim to be able to read media >from the following machines... Wang OIS Wang PC IWP Wang PC running WP Plus Wang VS (WPS Archive Disc) Wang VS Alliance Wang WITA Wang WP Plus High Density Wang WP Plus OIS, Wangwriter Wang WPS Wangwriter Bradley Slavik

25 years, 1 month

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who's got an M88k Aviion?

by jeff.kaneko＠juno.com

r-- I own an AV-400, and a 412. In addition, I have enough parts to turn my 400 into a AV-530. The 400 could be a single or dual processor machine, mine uses a 'stock' framebuffer. There used to be a page that had some of the NV-RAM info on it; I'll have to see if I have it stashed away somewhere. Do you have the DG/UX install CD/Tape? Jeff On Tue, 18 Sep 2001 01:47:02 -0400 (EDT) "r. 'bear' stricklin" <red(a)bears.org> writes: > > I'm looking for list members who own functioning M88k-series DG > Aviion > machines for a research base, so I can finish resurrecting my 310CD. > I > need some NVRAM information. > > Let me know if you have one; include the model and graphics type, or > at > least as much as you know about either. > > I'll follow up with more information in a week or so, depending on > what > kind of response I get. > > Thanks, I'd really appreciate it it! > > > ok > r. > ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj.

25 years, 1 month

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Hardware races

by pete＠dunnington.u-net.com

On Sep 17, 23:33, Mike Kenzie wrote: > On another list someone mentioned that a PDP11 ran at about the same > speed as a 486-66. > > I don't have a 486-66 but do have a PDP11/34 in the garage so I > suggested that if a 486-66 could be found we could have a race. I don't think an 11/34 or similar would come anywhere close to a 486DX2-66 in terms of processor speed. More like a slow 286. The real advantage of a mini was the architecture, which was designed to reap the benefit of multiple intelligent DMA subsystems and perhaps multiple busses. The same is true now, comparing expensive SGI kit with fast Pentiums -- you only see the advantage on specific tasks, like certain kinds of rendering. > Any suggestions for a fair race? Something that reflects the sort of use a mini would be put to; something with multiuple users or at least multiple processes, and a healthy mix of I/O. A Dhrystone test is definitely not what I'm thinking of :-) -- Pete Peter Turnbull Network Manager University of York

25 years, 1 month

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Interdata 7/32 C maintenance manual

by xds_sigma7＠hotmail.com

What's the rev of the manual? I might need it depending on the rev. _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp

25 years, 1 month

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Leicester (Donnington) show

by andyh＠netcomuk.co.uk

> Can you let us have some more info? It's one of the biggest Amateur Radio events of the year (and, as such, has quite a high computer-related content) Two days (Friday and Saturday*) at the Donnington International Exhibition Centre Donnington Park Castle Donnington (near junctions 23A/24/24A of M1) 0930-1730 (1700 Saturday) lots of trade stands/flea market/bring and buy admission ?3 parking free - free bus from airport (and cheap bus from railway station Loughborough or Derby to airport) see www.lars.org.uk * but I think there is a big Touring Car race on the Saturday at the adjacent racetrack so getting there/back on Saturday may be less than pleasant. Andy

25 years, 1 month

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Someone needs help for research paper

by vcf＠vintage.org

Can anyone help Dianne out with some computer wisdom? See message below, and please remember to CC your message to <dfmedic(a)msn.com>. ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Fri, 7 Sep 2001 06:32:53 -0700 From: dfmedic <dfmedic(a)msn.com> To: vcf(a)vintage.org Subject: Assistance Please Hi, I have been researching for information on comparing and contrasting mainframes and personal computers, but have not been able to locate any specific information. This information is required for a paper I have to present at the university I am attending. Could you send me some information on this or direct me to the appropriate resource? Thank you for your time and assistance. Sincerely, Dianne Fisher -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org

25 years, 1 month

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Mainframe stuff...

by mcguire＠neurotica.com

On September 18, Eric Dittman wrote: > Okay, you've got a 35 VUP system (VAX 7610), a 32 VUP system (VAX 6610), > and a 6 VUP system (VAX 8700). However, it looks like you are missing > the power controllers. The power controller for the 8700 is still down here in storage. It is stored at another location separate from the 8700 and we couldn't pick it up while Sridhar and Brian were here. -Dave -- Dave McGuire Laurel, MD

25 years, 1 month

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microcoding a PC into a PDP-11 (was: RE: Classic Computers vs.

by healyzh＠aracnet.com

> Does anyone on this thread even understand microprogramming? > > Apparently not. > > Pentium CPU's can't be microprogrammed, unless your Intel. Even microcode > updates cannot replace the basic instruction set. > > If you write a program in Pentium assembly code to run PDP-11 instructions, you > have just written an 'emulator', even if it does not run under windows. > > But an writing such an emulator is not 'microprogramming'. I was wondering about this! In all honesty I don't see any reason to go this low level, by doing this you're making it less portable. Ideally you want something like a stripped Linux or QNX system sitting on top of the hardware, with the system emulator sitting on top of that. If you want to avoid UNIX altogether, just take simh, and set it up so that it's started when the system boots, and you boot all the way up to the OS of your choice. Go one step further and hack simh so that if you shutdown the OS running on top of simh, that it shuts down the host OS. If you want to do hardware, go with FPGA's and reimplement the CPU and controllers like Neil Franklin is trying to do with the PDP-10. The tricky part here of course being the disk and tape controllers (unless you want to write your own device drivers). Zane

25 years, 1 month

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Embedded PDP-11 Processors

by dittman＠dittman.net

> Brian Hechinger and I just got a few HSC95s. They've got J11s in > them. Do they have the STI bus, UNIBUS, or QBUS? Can they run standard RT-11? -- Eric Dittman dittman(a)dittman.net Check out the DEC Ethusiasts Club at http://www.dittman.net/

25 years, 1 month

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Embedded PDP-11 Processors

by mcguire＠neurotica.com

On September 18, Eric Dittman wrote: > > Brian Hechinger and I just got a few HSC95s. They've got J11s in > > them. > > Do they have the STI bus, UNIBUS, or QBUS? Can they run standard RT-11? They look to contain HSC-specific cards. They sorta resemble VAX-11/750 cards in size and card-edge connectors. -Dave -- Dave McGuire Laurel, MD

25 years, 1 month

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Embedded PDP-11 Processors

by mcguire＠neurotica.com

On September 18, Bill Pechter wrote: > > DEC used embedded PDP-11 processors in many different places. There's > > the console for some of the VAX systems, and I've read some of the > > DECsystem-10 or DECSYSTEM-20 systems used a PDP-11 as a console system. > > Other uses of the PDP-11 that I know of are the HSCxx controllers and > > some of the printers. Where else did the PDP-11 get embedded? I know > > the HSZxx/HSDxx/HSJxx controllers used an Intel i960 processor, so > > there's no PDP-11 there. > > > > And speaking of the HSCxx controllers, are the PDP-11 controllers > > customized or is there a standard QBUS or UNIBUS system in there? > > My last DEC Field Service experience was with HSC-50's. > They had their own bus (no name known by field service). > I thought they went from F11 CPUs to J11 CPUs in the later ones (HSC70). > > I wondered if they ever used 78032 (uVaxII chips) in some of them. Brian Hechinger and I just got a few HSC95s. They've got J11s in them. -Dave -- Dave McGuire Laurel, MD

25 years, 1 month

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CIQBA

by mcguire＠neurotica.com

On September 18, Eric Dittman wrote: > Does anyone have a spare CIQBA for sale? Heh...me too! :-) -Dave -- Dave McGuire Laurel, MD

25 years, 1 month

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microcoding a PC into a PDP-11 (was: RE: Classic Computers vs. Classic Computing)

by pete＠dunnington.u-net.com

On Sep 17, 9:42, Jonathan Engdahl wrote: > Have you ever soldered down a flash ROM? Not fun. I used 36 gauge self-strip > magnet wire and tweezers under a 40X stereoscope. I'd rather buy one > prebuilt if available. If you build you own, it might be hard getting the > interfacing and timing compatible with DRAMs. The ones I've seen have been regular SMD (0.5" pitch) devices which are not too hard to do with hot air, or are ordinary DIL (0.1" pitch). The last one I soldered was a DIL chip. Timing might be a problem; I have almost no idea what access time DIMMs are supposed to be but I expect it's faster than SIMMs. SIMMs are usually in the 60ns-120ns range, and it's not too hard to get FLASH or EPROM in that range too. You'd just need to demultiplex the addresses (latch the addresses presented on the first part of the memory cycle). Of course, modern motherboards use DIMMs. > Of course it would be feasible to implement a PDP-11 emulator in the BIOS > ROM, it just would not be as fast as the one I'm thinking of. Back in the > days of QEMM/386, I remember allocating 64K for the BIOS ROM. I haven't > really looked that closely at a BIOS ROM since then. I was wondering if > modern mainboards had larger ROMs, or if they still are stuck with 64K. I don't know for sure, but I seem to recall seeing at least 128KB. Not megabytes, though! -- Pete Peter Turnbull Network Manager University of York

25 years, 1 month

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Classic Computers vs. Classic Computingt

by dittman＠dittman.net

> >> >The PIII will emulate the keyboard layout of a VT220 if you use an LK461 > >> >keyboard. > >> > >> What makes the LK461 special? > > > >The LK461 (and related keyboards, like the LK46W) have the same layout as the > >LK401, including all the keys. I use a couple on my Alphas and VT525. > > What about electrical or connector differences? > > I'm curious as a bunch came into a surplus place, and one of the other > junkies grabbed them all, but had no interest in the LK401. The LK461 has a PS/2 connector. The LK401 has a phone-jack connector. The LK401 can only be used with a VT2x0/VT3x0/VT4x0 terminal. -- Eric Dittman dittman(a)dittman.net Check out the DEC Ethusiasts Club at http://www.dittman.net/

25 years, 1 month

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CIQBA

by dittman＠dittman.net

Does anyone have a spare CIQBA for sale? -- Eric Dittman dittman(a)dittman.net Check out the DEC Ethusiasts Club at http://www.dittman.net/

25 years, 1 month

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Embedded PDP-11 Processors

by dittman＠dittman.net

> My last DEC Field Service experience was with HSC-50's. > They had their own bus (no name known by field service). > I thought they went from F11 CPUs to J11 CPUs in the later ones (HSC70). > > I wondered if they ever used 78032 (uVaxII chips) in some of them. We have HSC95 controllers. I haven't looked inside as they are 24x7, but in the next month I'll be taking two of them out of service (and leaving two just to serve some 3480 and 9-track tape drives). Is the OS RT-11? -- Eric Dittman dittman(a)dittman.net Check out the DEC Ethusiasts Club at http://www.dittman.net/

25 years, 1 month

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Embedded PDP-11 Processors

by IVIE＠cc.usu.edu

> Where else did the PDP-11 get embedded? There's a T-11 on the RQDX disk controllers. I've also been involved in a couple of projects which embedded complete MicroPDP-11s, but you're not likely to have heard of any of them. Roger Ivie ivie(a)cc.usu.edu

25 years, 1 month

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Worm/Virus alert

by Marion.Bates＠dartmouth.edu

Hey all, Sorry bout the spam (and sorry if you already know about this) but I figured you folks might want to know to watch out for a new Code Red-esque worm that's running rampant...below is from SlashDot. http://slashdot.org/articles/01/09/18/151203.shtml -- MB ************** New (More) Annoying Microsoft Worm Hits Net Posted by CmdrTaco on Tuesday September 18, @10:10AM >from the what-a-pain-in-the-arse dept. A new worm seems to be running rampant Unlike Code Red, it attempts to hit boxes with many different exploits (including what looks like an attempt to exploit boxes still rooted by Code Red). It looks like each IP tries 16 attempts on its neighbors. There is also a new mail worm mailing WAV files or something with bits of what appears to be the registry... it may or may not be related. Got any words on this? Shut down those windows boxes and stop opening attachments. And make that 21. Got another one while writing this story. All my hits are coming from 208.n.n.n (where I am) I'm sure it'll keep moving to nearby boxes. Here are examples of the requests it's sending: GET /scripts/..%%35%63../winnt/system32/cmd.exe?/c+dir GET /msadc/..%255c../..%255c../..%255c/..%c1%1c../..%c1%1c../ ..%c1%1c../winnt/system32/cmd.exe?/c+dir GET /_vti_bin/..%255c../..%255c../..%255c../winnt/system32/cmd.exe?/c+dir While writing this story I was hit a total of 4 times, 16 GET attempts per attack. In only 4 minutes. Also of interest, My desktop has now been hit about 500 times today, all from 208.x.x.x IPs. This might be really bad. I still haven't read anything about this anywhere else, so you heard it here first ;) Update: Web servers compromised by this worm apparently attach a "readme.eml" to all web pages served... and due to a bug in IE5, it will automatically execute the file! Yay Internet Explorer!

25 years, 1 month

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So I finally had time to pick up my MMJ crimper....

by fernande＠internet1.net

It came in last week, I ordered it from Kendall electric. It's an Ideal Industries Crimpmaster. I was a little disappointed to find that it was made in Taiwan. Oh well, at least they are allies. I bought the connectors to go along with it too. I got home, promptly cut off the filed down standard RJ11 connector off of one end of my cable. THEN, I tried putting a new connector into the crimper.... I couldn't figure out how the dumb thing was supposed to work! I was thinking GREAT, I just dumped 70 bucks into a specialized tool I can't seem to use. I checked part numbers several times. Turns out the MMJ die set was in wrong.... they misassembled it at the factory. It worked fine once I straightened it out :-) Now I have a proper cable :-) Maybe sometime soon I can start messing around with the Vax again.... still need to break into VMS. Chad Fernandez Michigan, USA

25 years, 1 month

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Embedded PDP-11 Processors

by dittman＠dittman.net

DEC used embedded PDP-11 processors in many different places. There's the console for some of the VAX systems, and I've read some of the DECsystem-10 or DECSYSTEM-20 systems used a PDP-11 as a console system. Other uses of the PDP-11 that I know of are the HSCxx controllers and some of the printers. Where else did the PDP-11 get embedded? I know the HSZxx/HSDxx/HSJxx controllers used an Intel i960 processor, so there's no PDP-11 there. And speaking of the HSCxx controllers, are the PDP-11 controllers customized or is there a standard QBUS or UNIBUS system in there? -- Eric Dittman dittman(a)dittman.net Check out the DEC Ethusiasts Club at http://www.dittman.net/

25 years, 1 month

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Worm/Virus alert

by dhquebbeman＠theestopinalgroup.com

> OK, I know this is not exactly on-topic, but I thought it was > ridiculous enough to share. > > Here's what I get from the logs on my IRIX web server running apache: > > > egrep "scripts/\.\..*" access_log | grep "18/Sep/2001" | wc -l > 7273 > > > egrep "msadc/\.\..*" access_log | grep "18/Sep/2001" | wc -l > 809 > > > egrep "_vti.*/\.\..*" access_log | grep "18/Sep/2001" | wc -l > 811 > > so, that's 8,893 bogus MS exploit requests. note too, that those numbers grew > by about 5% in about 5 minutes. Damn, I'm glad I don't run a windows machine > :) We do, and it isn't causing us any more trouble than *nix servers. 'Coz we patch. Surely the *nix sysadmins spend as much time writing Perl scripts as we do patching MS bugs... ;-) -dq

25 years, 1 month

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Social Studies, mature student.

by d.quigley＠ntlworld.com

Can anyone give me any information on the definition of the word ' family '.

25 years, 1 month

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IBM 1130

by jruschme＠Mac.com

> Date: Mon, 17 Sep 2001 15:00:34 -0700 > From: "Brian Knittel" <brian(a)quarterbyte.com> > Subject: Re: IBM 1130 > > Good to hear there some other 1130 fans out there! > > I should have added that we have ten disk cartridges with our 1130. > One is labeled "IBM Only" and we hope it's a CE disk. We didn't > find any punched card based software other than four IPL (boot) cards. > One is labeled "APLIPL" and we have an APL typeball, so we think > one of the cartridges has APL on it. However, we're a long way from > trying to spin it up to see if the disks are still readable after > what must be 20 years. APL/1130... Lord, that brings back a couple of memories. FWIW, the language is very similar to APL/360. The nasty part was the special symbols. The console keyboard (basically a 029 keyboard) was mapped into three shift states (3 symbols per keycap) with the shift state being indicated by banks of front panel lights. IIRC, make sure to make lots of copies of the APLIPL card as my experience was that the reader/punch would occasionally munch it. Also IIRC, the correct name for the IPL card is a "Cold Start" card. > We also have the maintenance manuals and schematics, but > no diagnostic software listings. We'd be interested in getting > copies of anything you get scanned or OCR'd, Hans. > Norm is setting up a boffo website for it all. A grand > opening announcement will be coming soon! Can't wait to see it... <<<john>>>

25 years, 1 month

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To garbage or ask for it: Commodore printer MPS801, TIs, Commodore 1525, DEC LA50, TRS80 Mod II exp box etc...

by claudew＠videotron.ca

Hi Garbage day tommorow and I will be scrapping more stuff I have accumulated too much of... This all going to charity (they probably wont want this) or garbage in about 24 hours or pick it up if you want it. I dont wanna start packing -- you have to have someone to pick this up. I know this is quite a long shot since I am in Montreal, Canada but who knows... A shame because most was cleaned and is working....most of this is stuff I have more than one of or just no space for... I anticipate more stuff getting junked so anybody with a large car or van that can pass by here can probably fill it up. MPS801 Commodore printer Commodore 1525 printer DEC LA50 printer TRS80 model II "8" floppy expansion box" with no drives Compaq portable II TI994a beige version TI994a black version Several MAC Plus and SE (no se-30s) Apple IIc Several C64 and Apple books some in french Some C64s and 1541 drives Untested 1084S monitor Stuff I cant see myself throwing in garbage but would like to see go to a good home : several Atari STs and Amiga 500s... Claude http://www.members.tripod.com/computer_collector

25 years, 1 month

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microcoding a PC into a PDP-11 (was: RE: Classic Computers

by dittman＠dittman.net

> >Very good point. I was thinking that it would be nice to have a machine that > >was a PDP-11 as soon as you flipped on the power, but probably not worth the > >cost and hassle of the flash. Didn't some of the VAXen boot their microcode > >from a floppy? > > Yes, the VAX 11/780 does. I remember an early brochure for the 11/750 talking about how it would be easy to load custom microcode to emulator other processors. This wasn't in later brochures or product descriptions for the 11/750 that I've seen. > Interestingly, the DEC DSSI drives are nearly already "there" when it comes > to this sort of scenario. There already is a communications protocol that > lets you "log in" to the drive and talk to a variety of programs that are > stored in the Disk drives flash. It may actually have a real PDP-11 on it, > I don't know who might know what all the parts are on a DSSI drive. I don't think the DSSI drives have a PDP-11, but they are pseudo-CI. -- Eric Dittman dittman(a)dittman.net Check out the DEC Ethusiasts Club at http://www.dittman.net/

25 years, 1 month

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HP Cassette Tapes

by fmc＠reanimators.org

Marvin Johnston <marvin(a)rain.org> wrote: > I just received about 80 HP Cassette tapes today, and have no idea what > these things might be used on or for. They appear to be about DC-100 > size and have names such as "64850-10005 Z8 asm/lnk", "64815-10002 68000 > Pascal Compiler", "64816-10005 Z8001/2 Pascal Compiler", "Z80 Emul/Asm", > etc. Anyone have any idea of what machine these things might be used on? HP 64000 cross-development system. Some used DC100 tapes as distribution media, others used 5.25" floppies. -Frank McConnell

25 years, 1 month

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microcoding a PC into a PDP-11 (was: RE: Classic Computers vs

by dittman＠dittman.net

> > My Mac IIfx used a ROM SIMM. The IIfx was the last Mac I ever > > bought, too, after the way Apple treated IIfx owners. > > One hell of a Mac, though. I only wish the thing was documented so > I could get from Apple OS 7.x and/or A/UX to something like NetBSD on > it. Apple's refusal to document the system was one problem. Another problem I had (that I started griping about during the A/UX 3.0 beta test) was Apple wouldn't let the engineers support the GPi pin on the serial ports under A/UX because not all Macs had the GPi pin. I continuously pointed out that all Macs that could run A/UX *DID* have the GPi pin, and they could allow this to be a configuration option. Without the GPi pin there was no way to have secure dial-in and hardware flow control, which means you really didn't want to have a dial-in connection on your A/UX system. There's a lot of other ways Apple mistreated IIfx owners. -- Eric Dittman dittman(a)dittman.net Check out the DEC Ethusiasts Club at http://www.dittman.net/

25 years, 1 month

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DEC DESPO-A Transceiver?

by lipo.ml＠gmx.at

Hi, does anybody know something about the DEC DESPO-A BNC Ethernet Transceiver? Its a small box (about 115*60*35 mm) with a BNC connector and a MMJ connector on the otherside. And ther is a cable wich on one side has the MMJ and on the other side a big black connector (don't know the name) which I have seen at token ring MUAs only. I haven't seen those token ring connectors for ethernet, and no BNC connectors on token rings. So I am a little bit confused about the purpose of these boxes. Looks like a ethernet/tokenring bridge but I don't believe this. Regards, Lipo -- Roland E. Lipovits Vienna, Austria

25 years, 1 month

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Final numbers on Apple IIgs computers for sale

by r_beaudry＠hotmail.com

Sorry to reply to myself.... PLEASE send all replies OFF-LIST for the IIgs systems posted previously .... Thanks! Rich B.

25 years, 1 month

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Final numbers on Apple IIgs computers for sale

by r_beaudry＠hotmail.com

Hello all, First let me say that I hope all of you are all right, and that your lives are as normal as possible given the recent events. I know it's hard to think about old computers at a time like this, but I did at least want to let you all know what was happening. Obviously, if there are any delays in our transactions, I certainly understand ... Take care of what's important first.... Bear in mind that these systems are school surplus. They WILL need cleaning, and many have stickers, sticker residue, magic marker writing, etc. They are all in good physical condition (no rust, no cracks in the cases, etc.), but they all need to be cleaned. Here are the final counts on the IIgs stuff... These are all tested and working: - Qty. 14 ROM 3 IIgs CPUs, with power cord, NO internal cards. - Qty. 8 ROM 01 IIgs CPUs, with power cord, and memory expansion card (only one bank full on each). - Qty. 22 5.25" Floppy Drives, Model # A9M0107, with cable - Qty. 23 3.5" Floppy Drives, Model # A9M0106, with cable - Qty. 12 AppleColor RGB Monitors, Model A2M6014, with power cable AND signal cable (see below ... more available) - Qty. 9 mice, with ADB connector, labelled as Model # A9M0331 - Qty. 7 mice, labelled "Apple Desktop Bus", "Family # G5431" - Qty. 3 Apple Desktop Bus keyboards with cable (see more below) - Qty. 2 Macintosh LC II CPUs, with power cable - Qty. 2 Macintosh Color RGB Monitors, with power AND signal cables - Qty. 2 Apple IIc computers, with power supplies The following are untested: - Qty. 5 Imagewriter II printers, with power AND data cables - Qty. 17 Apple Desktop Bus keyboards and cables I am willing to test the remaining keyboards, and the Imagewriters if people want them. I also can get more monitors, but again, I only want to lug them here and test them if people want them. Please, even if you have responded before, respond with a specific list of what you want. Don't tell me "a complete system", because I have no idea what that means (mouse? 1 floppy? 2 floppies? ROM version? Monitor?). BE SPECIFIC. The two types of mice listed work with the IIgs, but I don't know if either is "correct" in that I don't know which version shipped with the IIgs. Because some items are limited in supply, if I get more offers than items, I will throw names into a hat to decide who gets what. PLEASE INCLUDE A ZIP CODE OR COUNTRY WITH YOUR RESPONSE so I can determine shipping costs... Once you respond with a want list, I will determine if I can fulfill it, then weigh everything, and get a shipping quote. In terms of money and shipment ... Payment must be in US funds, and I accept PayPal, or Money Order (International Money Order for overseas). The cost of each order is a minimum of $5.00 + "shipping". What this means is that a single cable will cost at least $5.00. A complete system will cost at least $5.00. Anything over $5.00 is up to you, bearing in mind that ALL proceeds will be donated back to the school I got the computers from. There is no special priority given to people who donate more money. "Shipping" includes actual postage (USPS from Westminster, MA USA 01473), plus actual cost of boxes and packaging (no more than $5.00, even for a complete system). Monitors and printers will be shipped in SEPARATE boxes from CPUs. If you come to my house to pick them up, you can "cherry-pick" for the best cosmetic condition. Thanks! Rich B.

25 years, 1 month

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IBM 1130

by brian＠quarterbyte.com

Good to hear there some other 1130 fans out there! I should have added that we have ten disk cartridges with our 1130. One is labeled "IBM Only" and we hope it's a CE disk. We didn't find any punched card based software other than four IPL (boot) cards. One is labeled "APLIPL" and we have an APL typeball, so we think one of the cartridges has APL on it. However, we're a long way from trying to spin it up to see if the disks are still readable after what must be 20 years. We also have the maintenance manuals and schematics, but no diagnostic software listings. We'd be interested in getting copies of anything you get scanned or OCR'd, Hans. Norm is setting up a boffo website for it all. A grand opening announcement will be coming soon! And as for Jonathan's observation: > Oh my, an 1130! I don't think we've ever encountered such a severe case of > the classic computers disease. Brian, you need help. I don't think we can claim to have the worst case around here, no sirreee. On the other hand, Norm was suggesting that we port the 1130 emulator to the Palm platform and ... Brian =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- _| _| _| Brian Knittel / Quarterbyte Systems, Inc. _| _| _| Tel: 1-510-559-7930 Fax: 1-510-525-6889 _| _| _| Email: brian(a)quarterbyte.com _| _| _| http://www.quarterbyte.com

25 years, 1 month

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microcoding a PC into a PDP-11 (was: RE: Classic Computers vs

by dittman＠dittman.net

> > >Cool idea -- flash on a DIMM. Has anyone ever heard of such a beast? > > > > The Apple Set Top box uses flash SIMM/DIMMs for it's boot > > code. At least the one I have does. It's a 68pin SIMM with 8 Intel > > E28F020 flash memory chips (256k x 8). > > Additionlly, several models of Macs have had either SIMM or DIMM > sockets for ROMs; in the case of the Mac IIci, it's unpopulated, > and my guess was there either for upgrades or for some special- > order boxes used by an unnamed customer... ditto the Quadra 605 > (LCII format). My Mac IIfx used a ROM SIMM. The IIfx was the last Mac I ever bought, too, after the way Apple treated IIfx owners. -- Eric Dittman dittman(a)dittman.net Check out the DEC Ethusiasts Club at http://www.dittman.net/

25 years, 1 month

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who's got an M88k Aviion?

by red＠bears.org

I'm looking for list members who own functioning M88k-series DG Aviion machines for a research base, so I can finish resurrecting my 310CD. I need some NVRAM information. Let me know if you have one; include the model and graphics type, or at least as much as you know about either. I'll follow up with more information in a week or so, depending on what kind of response I get. Thanks, I'd really appreciate it it! ok r.

25 years, 1 month

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UK members - Leicester (Donnington) show

by andyh＠netcomuk.co.uk

Anyone else going to the Leicester show at Donnington on Friday? Not that the chances of finding anything really classic - as far as computers are concerned, anyhow - are that brilliant. But probably better than the last Ally Pally Rally. Andy

25 years, 1 month

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HP Cassette Tapes

by mcguire＠neurotica.com

On September 17, Marvin Johnston wrote: > I just received about 80 HP Cassette tapes today, and have no idea what > these things might be used on or for. They appear to be about DC-100 > size and have names such as "64850-10005 Z8 asm/lnk", "64815-10002 68000 > Pascal Compiler", "64816-10005 Z8001/2 Pascal Compiler", "Z80 Emul/Asm", > etc. Anyone have any idea of what machine these things might be used on? I'd guess they'd be for the HP64000 dev/emul system. -Dave -- Dave McGuire Laurel, MD

25 years, 1 month

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Alpha CPU

by workstations＠poczta.onet.pl

I'm still looking for a DEC Alpha 21066A 233MHz chip to upgrade my AXPpci 33 motherboard. I want to either buy that CPU, or swap for other DEC Alpha chips. I have two 21064A 166MHz CPUs and one 21164-AA (266MHz) CPU. Jacek Artymiak -- r e k l a m a Lista Plac [ http://listaplac.onet.pl ]

25 years, 1 month

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Philips P850 (Was: Classic Computers vs...)

by cmurillo＠manizales.autonoma.edu.co

"Tony Duell" wrote: > How long have you been on this list :-). You mean I've not waffled on > about it recently??? I've been on this list for about 2 years, but I have to say that sometimes I miss some of the posts because I can't cope with the traffic. > To answer the last part first, yes the P850 was perfectly operational > last time I used it (about a year ago), and I don't see any reason why it > should have failed since then. > > OK, to the programmer it looks like a 16 bit machine, but it's actually > got an 8 bit ALU and 8 bit data path to memory. Every word is processed > in 2 cycles, one of the low byte, one for the high byte. [very interesting description of the machine deleted] > -tony Thanks Tony! looks like a rather interesting machine to learn about processing units. I don't have any machine with a TTL-implemented processor. I'll keep my eyes open for one... carlos. -- Carlos E. Murillo-Sanchez email: carlos_murillo(a)ieee.org Universidad Autonoma de Manizales, Manizales, Colombia ---- "I've always thought that underpopulated countries in Africa are vastly underpolluted." -- Lawrence Summers, chief economist of the World Bank, explaining why we should export toxic wastes to Third World countries.

25 years, 1 month

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Apple Set Top Box

by mythtech＠Mac.com

>What was that machine? I remember seeing one a while ago and never figuring >out what it was. It was a custom designed interactive TV unit, used for some test program in Texas and I think the UK. I think it was tested in a few schools, but I really don't know how far it went (it was probably slammed out of existance either by cost, or more likely by Channel 1 if it was meant for the educational market). I don't personally know of anyone that has gotten theirs to do anything, although I have read posts of a few people that got theirs to at least boot to an Apple logo screen. Mine just sits (it gets a red "starting up" light, but never gets past that to the yellow "standby" or green "on", or even the red blinking "busted" light). I got mine from a garage sale just recently (paid $5 for it, no remote, no anything, just the unit)... the guy selling it said his son went off to college, and he was getting rid of some of his "junk" he had kicking around the house while his son wasn't there to complain... my guess is, when the son gets home for vacation, he will be mighty pissed off (I also got a vintage 2 foot Godzilla with working shoot out hands and flicking fire breath... paid $2 for that). I have seen them come and go on ebay, usually selling for between $10 and $20 if you want to pick one up. -chris <http://www.mythtech.net>

25 years, 1 month

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microcoding a PC into a PDP-11 (was: RE: Classic Computers vs. Classic Computing)

by mythtech＠Mac.com

>By Apple set top box, do you mean the Mac that was black, and had a TV? Or >do you mean that device that was never released, is Apple branded, and >plugged into a TV? Or another machine all together? Can you elaborate? I think he means the black decoder like unit that was never released... at least his flash DIMM description fits the one that I have. (I just need a remote for mine, anyone have one?) Now if I can just find a MacTV (the first thing you mentioned) or a Pippin (the Apple/Bandi "Playstation" like thing), I can be a happy camper. -chris <http://www.mythtech.net>

25 years, 1 month

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microcoding a PC into a PDP-11 (was: RE: Classic Computers vs . Classic Computing)

by dhquebbeman＠theestopinalgroup.com

> >Cool idea -- flash on a DIMM. Has anyone ever heard of such a beast? > > The Apple Set Top box uses flash SIMM/DIMMs for it's boot > code. At least the one I have does. It's a 68pin SIMM with 8 Intel > E28F020 flash memory chips (256k x 8). Additionlly, several models of Macs have had either SIMM or DIMM sockets for ROMs; in the case of the Mac IIci, it's unpopulated, and my guess was there either for upgrades or for some special- order boxes used by an unnamed customer... ditto the Quadra 605 (LCII format). Regards, -dq

25 years, 1 month

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Free printer supplies in Milpitas CA

by bob＠jfcl.com

We have several (about six or so) full boxes of fanfold, tractor feed, printer paper, both 8.5 x 11 and 11 x 14 sizes, that are free to anybody who wants to pick them up in Milpitas. We have lots (a couple dozen at least - I'm too lazy to count them) "data binders" for 11 x 14 printouts. These are the nice, heavy covers that fit printouts on tractor feed paper and keep them clean and pristine. Also free, in Milpitas. We have have a printer stand for a 11 x 14 tractor feed printer, complete with a sound proof enclosure and fan. No printer, I'm afraid, but still free. Contact me if you want any or all of them. Bob Armstrong bob(a)jfcl.com

25 years, 1 month

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Anyone want an 11/750 & 11/730 out of New Jersey?

by fmc＠reanimators.org

Bob Brown <bbrown(a)harper.cc.il.us> wrote: > The one I heard about was called a 'micro 3000' and was described as > desktop sized...(I thought this was diffeent from the model 48 that was > also being described).... Oops, sorry about that! I was thinking about the series 48 that had been mentioned in this thread. Yes, a Micro 3000 is more "desktop sized", or at least the processor is. Peripherals like disc and tape drives are in separate boxes so it's easy to end up with a system comprising several small boxes (e.g. a Micro 3000, a 9144 cartridge tape, and a couple of 79[45][1-9] disc drives), and once you've got all that they can be stacked inside a desk-side cabinet that HP used to sell for the purpose. If you look at the cover of the September 1985 HP Journal you will see a 3000 series 37 in this sort of cabinet. Note there are also "Micro GX", "Micro RX", and "Micro LX" models that are usually mounted in desk-side tower cabinets that have room for a 9144-like cartridge tape drive in the top and two disc drives in the base, and also keep the ATP/M mux panels (serial connectors) inside the cabinet. They weigh about 70 pounds and can be moved by a single person reasonably easily. -Frank McConnell

25 years, 1 month

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[1]classiccmp-digest V1 #714

by pete.rickard＠carlingtech.com

[1]classiccmp-digest V1 #714 9/11/01 I'm on vacation and will return on Monday, September 17th. Thanks! -Pete

25 years, 1 month

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scosug-talk: funny thread from other list

by dhquebbeman＠theestopinalgroup.com

> ! rm -rf /bin/laden = force the recursive removal of bin laden. > ! This would include himself, as well as all of his subordinates There is actually already in production a line of t-shirts, sweatshirts, and a coffee mug with this on it. > ! chmod a+x /bin/laden = allow anyone the permission to execute > ! bin laden heh... hadn't seen this one. -dq

25 years, 1 month

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Sync on Green Monitors and Others

by pete＠dunnington.u-net.com

On Sep 17, 10:05, Dan Wright wrote: > Info from LSI said: > > > > my multisync Sony's have worked with just about every type system > > I have ever tried them on except my SGI Indy's, and that might be > > because the SGI's 13W3 pin-out might not be compatible with the > > 13W3 to HD15 adapter I use with the Sun's? It's been very > > That's correct, the SGIs actually so SOG over the 13W3 connector. I don't > know what the pinout is, but I DO know that the 13W3 to HD15 adapters sold for > Suns don't work with the SGIs. Some SGIs do put out a separate sync signal; some Suns do as well. However, SGIs tend to provide separate hsync and vsync while Suns mostly do composite sync. Moreover, they use different pins for the sync and monitor type sense. I'm sure I posted the two pinouts to the list a while ago. But I've found almost all my multisync Sonys work with mu Indys and Indigos, providing I have the relevant 13W3-3xBNC or whatever cable. I think the only exception I've found was a Sun-badged Sony that wanted composite sync. -- Pete Peter Turnbull Network Manager University of York

25 years, 1 month

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Anyone want an 11/750 & 11/730 out of New Jersey?

by fmc＠reanimators.org

Bob Brown <bbrown(a)harper.cc.il.us> wrote: > What happened regarding the desktop hp3000 that was being discussed? "desk-sized", not "desktop". It looks sort of like one and takes up about that much floor space, which is handy to know when one is figuring out how to lay out one's computer room. Speaking from personal experience, you may have to un-bolt the top (the woodgrain bit) to get a /44, /48, or /58 to fit around corners and through doors. -Frank McConnell

25 years, 1 month

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FW: scosug-talk: funny thread from other list

by DAW＠yalepress3.unipress.yale.edu

! -----Original Message----- ! Subject: Re: unix ! From: "Brad Brown" <brad.brown(a)openwave.com> ! Date: Sun, 16 Sep 2001 10:48:55 -0700 ! X-Message-Number: 10 ! ! rm -rf /bin/laden = force the recursive removal of bin laden. ! This would include himself, as well as all of his subordinates ! ! chmod a+x /bin/laden = allow anyone the permission to execute ! bin laden --- David A Woyciesjes --- C & IS Support Specialist --- Yale University Press --- mailto:david.woyciesjes@yale.edu --- (203) 432-0953 --- ICQ # - 905818

25 years, 1 month

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Some new stuff. What is it?

by DAW＠yalepress3.unipress.yale.edu

! >Modified Modular Jack. It's DEC connector, a bit like a ! >telephone plug ! >with the locking clip offset from the middle... ! ! Can someone get me a pinout of that? I suppose it shouldn't be too ! hard to change out for a normal jack. Pins: 1 - DSR 2 - RX+ 3 - RX- 4 - TX- 5 - TX+ 6 - DTR As seen here... http://www.openvms.compaq.com/wizard/openvms_faq.html#WIRES1 --- David A Woyciesjes --- C & IS Support Specialist --- Yale University Press --- mailto:david.woyciesjes@yale.edu --- (203) 432-0953 --- ICQ # - 905818

25 years, 1 month

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IBM PowerStation 530

by mtapley＠swri.edu

Roger Merchberger replied to Blair Miller... >>now, so I've never seen the monitor hook-up either... it's mini-coax and >>looks like the diagram below: >> >>(o)(o)(o) >> >>I'm assuming that's RGB... > >Yep... As the ascii graphic (while pretty) is not completely informative, >if it's three mini-coax in IIRC a DB shell, it could be the same cable as >is used on some DEC machines, notably some of the older RISC boxen & the >DEC 3000/300 (which I have)... A cable meeting a similar description (dunno if it's identical?) to go from my VAX 4000 VLC to its VRC-16HA monitor carries the label: BC29G-09. When I google-searched for it, I found it available for prices ranging from around $15 to around $120 (!) on the net. This was several months ago. - Mark

25 years, 1 month

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Classic Computers vs. Classic Computing

by brian＠quarterbyte.com

Recall that Jonathan Engdahl recently announced his development of MSCP device drivers for 2.9 BSD. That work was made possible by the availability of a reliable simulation environment. For this reason alone, simulators are indispensible to the real-hardware camp, as tools for supporting the maintenance and development of operating systems. Furthermore, I think simulators can play a big role in encouraging the long-term collection, retention and dissemination of legacy software to run on either real or emulated hardware. Norm Aleks and I just acquired an IBM 1130, and as far as I can see, there is NO software archived out there anywhere. It's very discouraging. You can bet that we're going to post whatever we can get our hands on, along with the simh-based simulator I'm 75% done with, to hopefully reawaken interest in the 1130. That's my .4 bits worth. Brian =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- _| _| _| Brian Knittel / Quarterbyte Systems, Inc. _| _| _| Tel: 1-510-559-7930 Fax: 1-510-525-6889 _| _| _| Email: brian(a)quarterbyte.com _| _| _| http://www.quarterbyte.com

25 years, 1 month

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Sync on Green Monitors and Others

by dec.parts＠verizon.net

Hello Blair, It seems from your description of your video connector that it may in fact be the 3W3 video connector as used on some DEC systems. One list member indicated ... > to 3 BNCs to hook up to a decent monitor that does sync on green If you try to use a fixed frequency monitor, you must use one that is a sync on green model monitor and that syncs at the correct horizontal and vertical frequencies. If you can determine which model monitor originally went to that system, you might be able to research a DEC or HP model that syncs at the same frequencies at ... http://www.monitorworld.com/Monitors/dec/ http://www.monitorworld.com/Monitors/hp/ > Find yerself a DEChead or two, and they may have a cable to fit... While I don't have any spares myself, I recently bought a cable >from Barry's Supply. He has one currently available at ... http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1275561813 > some older multisync Mac monitors with the 3-BNC input might work ^^^^^^^^^....... NOT .......... ^^^^^ Sony made monitors for DEC, HP, IBM, SGI, Sun, RasterOps, Radius, and possibly others. If a monitor has only 3-BNC inputs, it is most probably a sync on green fixed frequency model. If it has 4-BNC inputs, it is most probably a composite sync model ( the only exception I know of to that is a NEC model which also has a HD15 connector in addition to the 4-BNC's ). Any other monitor I have ever seen, other than those NEC models, that is a multisync had 5-BNC inputs. Note however that some 5-BNC input models are fixed frequency ( GDM-1950 and GDM-1952 come to mind ). Generally I have found that the Sony models that have 5-BNC inputs and rotary controls are the fixed frequency type. The models that have 5-BNC inputs and have push button controls ( digital ) have been multisyncs ( GDM-1971 and 2075RO come to mind ). http://www.monitorworld.com/Monitors/sony/ http://www.monitorworld.com/Monitors/radius/ http://www.monitorworld.com/Monitors/radius/0322precisioncolor20.html http://www.monitorworld.com/Monitors/rasterops/ http://www.monitorworld.com/Monitors/rasterops/2075ro20colorgraphicsdisplay… Those monitors that are considered multisyncs should be able to sync up on a horizontal scan frequency as low as, or slightly lower than, DOS's 31.5 kHz. The really nice thing about the 5-BNC Sony models, both fixed frequency and multisyncs, is that they auto-sense, and auto-switch sync types. So even though the monitor has 5 BNC inputs, you can still hook up to just 3 of them if your graphics outputs a sync on green signal, or 4 of them if your graphics outputs a composite ( H and V on the same line, but a separate line than R, G, or B ) sync signal. And of course if your graphics outputs a separate sync signal ( H, V, R, G, and B all on separate lines ) you would connect to all 5-BNC inputs. I use my Sony multisyncs to hook up to and test my DEC Alpha's (SOG), VAXstation 4000/60's (SOG), HP PA-RISC (SOG), Sun's (CS), Macintosh's (CS), and of course, PC's (SS). In fact, my multisync Sony's have worked with just about every type system I have ever tried them on except my SGI Indy's, and that might be because the SGI's 13W3 pin-out might not be compatible with the 13W3 to HD15 adapter I use with the Sun's? It's been very convenient, space wise, to use one monitor to test all those type systems, rather than have to store a different monitor for each one. Bennett Subject: Re: IBM PowerStation 530 Date: Sun, 16 Sep 2001 11:40:00 -0400 From: "Blair J. Miller" <millerbj(a)umich.edu> Reply-To: classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org To: <classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org> References: 1 , 2 Emanual - Hrm... I guess if I'd have known from the beginning that the computer would be a '7013 model 530' I'd have been a lot better off. I didn't find the exact manual, but rather one for the '500' series, and though it was published in 1996 (this computer is from 1990 or so) most of the physical stuff still seems to apply. Thanks for the heads up... - Blair > Try www.ibm.com ;-) > Anyway, check the real product number of this machine. Should be > something like "7013 model 530" (?) Subject: Re: IBM PowerStation 530 Date: Sun, 16 Sep 2001 11:45:29 -0400 From: "Blair J. Miller" <millerbj(a)umich.edu> Reply-To: classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org To: <classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org> References: 1 , 2 > Yup, it's RGB, sync on green. You need to get a cable to break that out > to 3 BNCs to hook it up to a decent monitor that does sync on green... Unfortunately, the monitor that may have been hooked up to the machine was nowhere to be found... and this being my first classic computer, I don't have such a thing lying around either. :o( I read something about hooking a serial terminal up to the machine directly... Forgive me for dumb questions, but I'm assuming a serial terminal is one of those boxes that I keep seeing that has hookups for mice, keyboards, SVGA monitors, and the like? Also called a 'Terminal Station' I believe... Will this work? I don't even know if I'm asking the right question here, and I could be horribly, stupidly, wrong. :o) This thing comes from 'way back in the day' for me, before I was even interested in computers, so I don't know a whole heck of a lot right now. More research I guess... Thanks again. Blair Subject: Re: IBM PowerStation 530 Date: Sun, 16 Sep 2001 11:49:01 -0400 From: "Blair J. Miller" <millerbj(a)umich.edu> Reply-To: classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org To: <classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org> References: 1 > Without looking at your email address, it took me a moment to figure out > where you were... I'm up in Sault Ste. Marie, MI right on the Canadian I've been there once or twice... I believe I also have relatives living there, though that could just be my imagination. > Find yerself a DEChead or two, and they may have a cable to fit... and some > older multisync Mac monitors with the 3-BNC input might work with it as > well... Where would I find something like this... I've no problems driving around Michigan (I think of driving as a way to calm down, and I end up doing it a lot, especially when dealing with foreign territory in the world of computers) to get my hands on one, but I'm not sure where to look. I suppose another trip to property disposition is in order. :o) Thanks for the tips. Blair Subject: Re: IBM PowerStation 530 Date: Sun, 16 Sep 2001 11:50:36 -0400 From: "Blair J. Miller" <millerbj(a)umich.edu> Reply-To: classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org To: <classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org> References: 1 , 2 > If you decide not to keep the 530 let me know Will do. You close to Ann Arbor? Blair Subject: Re: IBM PowerStation 530 Date: Sun, 16 Sep 2001 11:53:16 -0400 From: "Blair J. Miller" <millerbj(a)umich.edu> Reply-To: classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org To: <classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org> References: 1 > You should be able to get it to use a serial console. Having the key to > get it into service mode is extra helpful. Fortunately, I've got the key. Unfortunately, I'm a newbie to ALL of this, and I'm not sure what a serial console is... can you elaborate? > Making sure the RAM hasn't been removed is important. The amount would > matter if you were going to try to move to recent versions of AIX. I doubt it has. It was just sitting there, and it doesn't appear that anyone has opened it in a LONG LONG time. As for AIX, I'll figure that out when I can actually use the system. I also read something very brief that this machine would run LinuxPPC or YellowDog (forget which). Any idea if that's true? Thanks for your help. Blair

25 years, 1 month

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Why is this so slow?

by DAW＠yalepress3.unipress.yale.edu

Well, I asked this, just in case there was a problem somewhere. Every other mailing list I'm on does not have a delay this bad. I'm not worried about a delay, but with it being 1.5 hours, it seems like there's a problem somewhere. We're using Exchange here at work, so that might be it. If anyone has any hints of stuff for me to check out here at this end, let me knwo, off-list... --- David A Woyciesjes --- C & IS Support Specialist --- Yale University Press --- mailto:david.woyciesjes@yale.edu --- (203) 432-0953 --- ICQ # - 905818 ! -----Original Message----- ! From: Roger Merchberger [mailto:zmerch@30below.com] ! Sent: Friday, September 14, 2001 4:22 PM ! To: classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org ! Subject: RE: Why is this so slow? ! ! ! Rumor has it that David Woyciesjes may have mentioned these words: ! >Rich --- ! > Actually, my time estimate was a little wrong. The messages take ! >about an hour and a half... ! ! [snip] ! ! I've not seen lags anywhere near that -- mebbe 5-10 minutes ! at most. My ! Eudora checks mail every 4 minutes, and it's usually 2 checks ! & it's there. ! ! Methinks it might be something on your end... Have you called ! your ISP? ! ! I'll time this one and see what I end up with... ! ! HTH, ! "Merch" ! -- ! Roger "Merch" Merchberger --- sysadmin, Iceberg Computers ! Recycling is good, right??? Ok, so I'll recycle an old .sig. ! ! If at first you don't succeed, nuclear warhead ! disarmament should *not* be your first career choice. !

25 years, 1 month

1
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IBM Keys was: IBM PowerStation 530

by mythtech＠Mac.com

>I'm missing a key for one of my AS400's Does anyone know about >getting keys made or picking the lock? I don't know what key is on the AS400, if it is a round key, just call a locksmith, if it is a regular straight key, it may be like the ones on the PS/2's I have, which are single tumblers, and can be picked with a paperclip in about 10 seconds (take a small paper clip, straighten it, and then bend into a U... insert points first into the lock, and jiggle while turning it, you should be able to hit the right spot in a few soconds). The more tumblers, the harder it is to pick, but generally, anything 3 and under can be done with a paper clip, over that, you might want to call a locksmith or get a lock pick kit. -chris <http://www.mythtech.net>

25 years, 1 month

4
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[1]classiccmp-digest V1 #712

by pete.rickard＠carlingtech.com

[1]classiccmp-digest V1 #712 9/11/01 I'm on vacation and will return on Monday, September 17th. Thanks! -Pete

25 years, 1 month

2
1
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Anyone want an 11/750 & 11/730 out of New Jersey?

by gunther＠aurora.regenstrief.org

Hi, I have a contact who needs to get rid of a VAX 11/750 and an 11/730 real soon and they are in Sommerset County, New Jersey. A picker-upper would be preferred. There is also an HP 3000/48. Let me know who wants them and can pick up. If there is contention, I think one should try sharing, so let me know which one you really really badly want if you have to choose. Thanks, -Gunther -- Gunther Schadow, M.D., Ph.D. gschadow(a)regenstrief.org Medical Information Scientist Regenstrief Institute for Health Care Adjunct Assistant Professor Indiana University School of Medicine tel:1(317)630-7960 http://aurora.regenstrief.org

25 years, 1 month

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[1]classiccmp-digest V1 #715

by pete.rickard＠carlingtech.com

[1]classiccmp-digest V1 #715 9/11/01 I'm on vacation and will return on Monday, September 17th. Thanks! -Pete

25 years, 1 month

1
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[1]classiccmp-digest V1 #713

by pete.rickard＠carlingtech.com

[1]classiccmp-digest V1 #713 9/11/01 I'm on vacation and will return on Monday, September 17th. Thanks! -Pete

25 years, 1 month

1
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Why is this so slow?

by DAW＠yalepress3.unipress.yale.edu

Does anyone have any idea why it takes upwards of 15-20 minutes (seems longer sometimes) for my postings to this list to get sent back out? --- David A Woyciesjes --- C & IS Support Specialist --- Yale University Press --- mailto:david.woyciesjes@yale.edu --- (203) 432-0953 --- ICQ # - 905818

25 years, 1 month

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recent acquisitions for the House of VAX

by cmcmanis＠mcmanis.com

I got a great bunch of artifacts recently from an ex-Digit (DEC Employee) who was finally not going to use his VAX for anything else any more. These included: A set a PAKs that rivals the Hobbyist offering and exceeds it in that it has a PL/I and APL PAK. Several RRD40 caddys and a couple of the SCSI version of the RRD40 (I'm on the look out for the non-SCSI version, will trade one for one!) A VAXServer 3100/M48 (yet another one I didn't have yet.) with all the option cards (multi-serial, DMF32, etc) A bunch of manuals, including the VT103 users guide and a bunch of VAX 11/730 manuals (including the CPU technical manual!) An Ultrix-32 Condist for VAX (v3.0) Three VMS Condists (5.2, 6.0, and 6.1) Cables for various things. Some RTL replacement parts for the PDP-5 !!!! Bits of ephemera from the DEC hey day (VAX brochures, DECUS disks, etc) Some more docs Available for trade: TU58 Technical Manual TU58 User's Guide RL02 User's Guide RL01/RL02 manual Some DECConnect stuff and a crimping tool with about 20 MMJ "heads" Lots of little detail parts that are so hard to come by when you need them. --Chuck

25 years, 1 month

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scanned DEC manuals

by lipo.ml＠gmx.at

Hi, recently somebody (Chuck?) posted an URL for scanned DEC manuals <http://208.190.133.201/decimages/moremanuals.htm>. Today I've seen that a lot of manuals are no more available. Does anybody know something about this or about other sites where the manuals are still available? Regards, Lipo -- Roland E. Lipovits Vienna, Austria

25 years, 1 month

2
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Practical Electronics and D. Bollen

by pete＠dunnington.u-net.com

On Sep 16, 13:07, Doug Coward wrote: > Does anyone have a near complete collection of > Everyday Practical Electronics (EPE) Magazine? Maybe > the magazine has an author's index. Can anyone think > of the name another similar magaazine that fits this > description? That used to be two separate magazines, "Practical Electronics" which was been around for, well, forever (mid '60s); and "Everyday Electronics" which was more recent (mid '70s, aimed at beginners). EPE is the result of a merger. I bet some of the current staff have been around long enough to know what you're looking for. Try http://www.epemag.wimborne.co.uk/ -- Pete Peter Turnbull Network Manager University of York

25 years, 1 month

1
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Need IBM PC Server 320 bay filler plates (6)

by rhblakeman＠kih.net

In search of 6 of the vented original 5.25" half height filler plates for my new Server 320 - just mainly for looks. I have all the bays full of hard drives so that's why I need to fill all 6 bays. I understand that Server 325 hot swap trays fit the 320 so maybe the 325 filler plates work as well. Will pay up to $1 each for them (plus mailing of course) and would love it if one person has all of t hem but can get one or two from each person until I get what I need. OR I have some excess SCSI controllers and memory cards (no ram) for microchannel 286 and 386 level machines I can trade if possible, as well as various ESDI hard drives from PS/2 55SX and 70 machines.Drop me a note direct if you have these plates to spare. I'm in the middle of the US (KY) so postage isn't much from any part of the US or Canada.

25 years, 1 month

1
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DEC SBB boxes, what drive?

by dittman＠dittman.net

> >The later SBBs used SCA drives, which makes things much easier. > > Wouldn't that be on the wide drives for BA356's though? Or did they use > them for Narrow SBB's? That would be the wide drives for BA356's. Do they still make the narrow SBBs? -- Eric Dittman dittman(a)dittman.net Check out the DEC Ethusiasts Club at http://www.dittman.net/ For the Afghanistan weather forecast, see http://www.dittman.net/weather.html

25 years, 1 month

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DEC SBB boxes, what drive?

by dittman＠dittman.net

> >The problem is, which drive, depends on which ribbon is in the SBB. > > Sigh, I was afraid of that. The one in at least one of them is 17-03503-01. The later SBBs used SCA drives, which makes things much easier. -- Eric Dittman dittman(a)dittman.net Check out the DEC Ethusiasts Club at http://www.dittman.net/ For the Afghanistan weather forecast, see http://www.dittman.net/weather.html

25 years, 1 month

2
1
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Next Megapixel display

by lgwalker＠mts.net

I'm gradually getting my collection esconced in my new home in the boonies of central Manitoba. In trying to set up my beloved Next Color slab I'm dismayed that the 17" Megapixel isn't functioning. Before, the monitor was a bit flakey and would go to sleep on me occasionally. I've tried to find specs but the only useful one I've found is in the Peanuts FAQ archive. Unfortunately it gives no descriptions of the external controls. On the lower left side of the display is a button with a screen and vertical line symbol which doesn't appear to be working. What is it's function ? I had imagined it was a screen blanker. Also since I get static discharge on the screen when I depress the on-off in either position what is the ON position of the switch. In to the cabinet or protruding from the face. I've forgotten. I've been avoiding opening up since there's so many other pressing things to be done and you can't see thru the air-vents to see any life. Thanks for any help. Lawrence appear to be working. Reply to: lgwalker(a)mts.net

25 years, 1 month

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DEC SBB boxes, what drive?

by cmcmanis＠mcmanis.com

Hello Everyone, I've got some DEC SBB (Storage Works disk cartridges) boxes that the previous owner "liberated" the SCSI drives from. I thought I might put some drives that I have in them however they are clearly set up so that one "backplane" was used for each particular drive. So to use these I'd need to replace their innards with 4.3GB drives. I would like to know which 4.3 gb SE SCSI drive DEC/Compaq/HP :-) used in these so that when I find one or two I can replace them. Conversely, if someone needs/wants an empty SBB box let me know. --Chuck

25 years, 1 month

2
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Nec Multisync II monitor

by technos＠nerdland.org

On Saturday, September 15, 2001 11:14 PM, Mike Ford [SMTP:mikeford@socal.rr.com] wrote: > >>I have a pretty rough looking Nec Multisync II monitor in my car, > >>hope it > >>works, but more so hope its one of the "good" monitors to have the > >>list has > >>talked about in the past, is it? > > > >It certainly is. It's a multisync which will sync down to 15KHz (same > >as TV > >modes and "RGB" monitors) analogue as well as digital. > >Watch out for its big brother, the 3D. > > Thats what one of my other friends said, NEC II good, 3D better. I > haven't > even tested this one for working yet, and it is ROUGH from poor > handling > (ie gash in the case side). Still if it works I'll keep it for bench > use, > or wait til I find a dead one in a nicer case. > I'm sorry to say I sent two dozen 3D to a scrap company six months ago.. Jim

25 years, 1 month

2
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Classic Computers vs. Classic Computingt

by dittman＠dittman.net

> It's not an Emulator is better or worse thing for me. I cant yet buy a > z80 > that runs faster than MyZ80 on a PIII/550. At the other extreme that > said > PIII still cant emulate the keyboard layout of a Vt100 or VT220 worth > poop. The PIII will emulate the keyboard layout of a VT220 if you use an LK461 keyboard. -- Eric Dittman dittman(a)dittman.net Check out the DEC Ethusiasts Club at http://www.dittman.net/

25 years, 1 month

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Some new stuff. What is it?

by DAW＠yalepress3.unipress.yale.edu

! ...and two RJ-style(6 pins, and an offset clip) COM ! ports.... Those would be DEC MMJ ports... --- David A Woyciesjes --- C & IS Support Specialist --- Yale University Press --- mailto:david.woyciesjes@yale.edu --- (203) 432-0953 --- ICQ # - 905818

25 years, 1 month

3
3
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Zap-a-pal

by zaft＠azstarnet.com

I have a zap-a-pal PAL programmer card, but just the bare card, no programming pods or docs, not sure if I found software or not. Does anyone know anything about this? If someone knows the pod pinouts I assume I could rig one up myself. Gordon Zaft zaft(a)azstarnet.com

25 years, 1 month

1
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Classic Computers vs. Classic Computing

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

From: Eric Dittman <dittman(a)dittman.net> > >My AmproLB doesn't have the SCSI daughterboard so I prefer an emulator. Mine is the later LB+ that has the SCSI chip {5380} on board. My box is one I got at DEC that is exactly the same size as a BA11-VA with same openings but from a proto so it's light grey {DEC 68} and aluminum and compact. It has: Fujitsu 45mb 3.5" SCSI Two 3.5" floppies (720/781kb) I use it with VT240 or 330. Allison

25 years, 1 month

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VAX 7800 CPU and Memory Modules

by dittman＠dittman.net

> That must be why I repeatedly get out bid by the same guys over and over > again. Sometimes I don' even bother because I know they'll outbid me. Yes, I know of at least three bidders that are businesses. I also know that they can always outbid me, and at least two of them use some kind of automated sniping tool. > While bidding on a DSSI drive, I actually won the auction, then the > seller "elobby" went awol.... he's no longer registered, and I had > already paid him. It's odd, he has nothing but glowing feedback. It's > not due to the WTC either, it was before that. I bought a DSSI drive from elobby, and it did arrive. I see their last feedback entry was on Sep. 7, and you are right, elobby is now unregistered. -- Eric Dittman dittman(a)dittman.net Check out the DEC Ethusiasts Club at http://www.dittman.net/

25 years, 1 month

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VAX 7800 CPU and Memory Modules

by dec.parts＠verizon.net

Hi Gang, With our contacts to 1200 companies, in 100 countries, on 6 continents, my company is going to try to source these parts. It's doubtful they would buy directly from private individuals in single quantities, but we will. If any of you have CPU and Memory modules for VAX 7800's that you would like to sell, email back the module numbers and your asking prices immediately. Sincerely, Bennett

25 years, 1 month

4
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Classic Computers vs. Classic Computing

by dittman＠dittman.net

> I like to and MyZ80 allows it to be more portable than my S100 crate or > the Kaypro. > Then again, my AmproLB system with 45mb disk is far smaller than most > PCs. My AmproLB doesn't have the SCSI daughterboard so I prefer an emulator. I used to have the LB stuck in a full-size tower with my Wintel system along with a couple of 5.25" floppies. The primary serial port went back to one of the Wintel system's serial ports and the light and reset button went on another 5.25" cover plate. Unfortunately an emulator was more convenient. -- Eric Dittman dittman(a)dittman.net Check out the DEC Ethusiasts Club at http://www.dittman.net/

25 years, 1 month

1
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L@@K and L@UGH!

by dittman＠dittman.net

> >Well if its a KA694 then that wouldn't be a horrible price. I don't > have my > >KA670 out of the machine so that I could check against that one. It > > >definitely doesn't look like the KA692. > > The REX520 screams Rigel to me: KA670. > I don't have one handy to visually > inspect though. > > Look at the AlphaServer 2100 memory auction too: same price! The specs (28ns) are definitely KA670, plus it looks like the KA670 I sold just this past week. -- Eric Dittman dittman(a)dittman.net Check out the DEC Ethusiasts Club at http://www.dittman.net/

25 years, 1 month

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Anyone want an 11/750 & 11/730 out of New Jersey?

by mcguire＠neurotica.com

You, sir, are a freak. ;) -Dave On September 15, Chad Fernandez wrote: > Well, Okay, which one of you is the Queen? :-) > > Chad Fernandez > Michigan, USA > > Brian Hechinger wrote: > > > in most cases i speak for dave and myself. we're a collective. :) -- Dave McGuire Laurel, MD

25 years, 1 month

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Solomon Splitting the list... (was: Classic Computers vs. Classic

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

>> > I've never seen SPDT dipswitches in computers. I have some. Also I have some S100 boards that used them for address selection. Allison

25 years, 1 month

3
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Classic Computers vs. Classic Computing

by dhquebbeman＠theestopinalgroup.com

Ok, We all need a topic to take our minds of the WTC attack. Here's one I've been meaning to bring up, surely it will generate a lot of discussion. In a recent thread, Tony Duell expressed a lack of interest in the emulators and simulators of old iron that are now circulating. His reasons centered around his love of hardware. From my perspective, it appears that for Tony, the experience of computing cannot be separated from the experiencing of the computer. My reading of this mailinglist's charter leads me to conclude that the group is here for the benefit of the Tonys (BTW, Tony, I'm *not* picking on you) in the world, those for whom the hardware *is* the end-all be-all of the Classic _Computer_ experience. I confess I don't like that- the Classic Computers for which I lust the most will forever remain inaccessible (and few examples will even continue to exist). However, as both an RJE operator and as a mainframe user, I found the experience to be more about the _computing_ and less about the _computer_. Exceptions included (back in the 70s) of building an IMSAI, a SOL, hacking a KIM-1, etc. But after we got the hardware running, the fun part was in creating the _computing environment_. So, I think the formal name and the charter of this group should change to reflect an interest in Class Computing. The only real change would be that discussions about the eumlators and simulators would no longer be OT unless they drift into details of programming the emu/simulators themselves. Additionally, more detailed discussions of the Classic Operating Systems would be similarly on-topic. I'm not sure how many of you have ever thought about this; but now that I've broached the subject, whaddy'all think? Regards, -doug quebbeman

25 years, 1 month

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Classic Computers vs. Classic Computing

by dhquebbeman＠theestopinalgroup.com

> > For a monitor, I followed Lancaster's instructions on how to take > > an old B&W TV set and pull the unneeded circuitry (except for the > > tubes; they stayed in, heaters wired in series). The mods all helped > > In the UK, most series-string valve TV sets had a hot chassis (directly > connected to one side of the mains). Actually, a number of transistorised > sets did as well. [..snip..] > Did US TVs have proper isolating mains transformers, even though they had > series-string heaters? No; I bought an isolation transformer, a stand-alone unit. > > And I think I even got to like the smell of solder.. especially > > the Ersin Multicore stuff made in the U.K... why, there's some > > Nice, isn't it :-) Yup! > > yes, I've used all kinds of techniques to repair such damage. > > As have I. It gets more fun when it's an SMD-built board, with tracks > very close together :-) Haven't ever had to *fix* a multilayer board, but did hack on one (early Mac). > > > > But you can't damage software... which is one of the things that > > Hmmm... If you don't have backups you can :-) Oh, I got the backup religion long, long ago... > Actually, one thing I tend to worry about it misconfiguring a piece of > software and not being able to go back to the original configuration that > worked at least partially. Doing the same with hardware never bothers me. On the tricky stuff, I try to save the configurations, either in files, or on paper. > I gurss it comes down to experience. I know enough about hardware to see > what I've done and put it right. The same is not true of software... I've also done some embedded systems hardware development. But it tended to be taking the evaluation design from the databooks and massaging it into a working design, so I can't take too much credit. > > resisters, capacitors, transistors, and 7400-series chips. It > > How good will that emulation be? If I accidentally connect a pin on the > TTL chip to the -15V rail, what happens? Does the chip fail in the same > way that a real one does? Are you going to be able to emulate every > possible circuit (hint : No CAD system's simulator has ever maanged to > 'pass' my tests (namely a dozen or so nasty circuits). Would you settle for a graphic rendering of the magic smoke escaping? ;-) > > could also have an emulated soldering iron & solder. Ever wish > > I suppose you're going to add a little heater element and some flux so as > to give the right smells (a bit like those smoke generators the model > railway crowd use). And a device that burns my fingers from time to time. That might have to wait for the development of tactile interfaces, but rest assured, that's well underway... > I suppose next you'll be suggesting the floor of the emulated machine > room does not magically transport small components dropped on it into > another room.... So, your shop has funky space-time problems, too? ;-) -dq

25 years, 1 month

2
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Classic Computers vs. Classic Computing

by dhquebbeman＠theestopinalgroup.com

> On the real machine you can solder up a few TTL chips, wire them to the > bus connector and add another peripheral. You can't easilly do that on an > emulator. Or you can solder wires onto the chips on the CPU board of a > mini, clip a logic analyser to them, and watch the data flow through the > ALU and registers. > > Yes, you can do _similar_ things with emulators, but not quite the same. > No flames intended, but I'll stick to the real machines ;-) BTW, if it wasn't implicit (it is to me), I wouldn't have much of a need for an emulator for a machine that's readily available, or if rare, easy on the pocketbook to keep running (parts, electricity, etc). We can't all be Megan Gentry, Eric Smith, or Daniel Seagraves (owners of DEC-10&20s who come immediately to mind)... Now, Jim Battle's doing a SOL emulator. Great idea, I might want to play with a SOL at work. But my SOL was the machine I did exactly the kinds of things you describe. Unlike many, I didn't buy even the complete SOL kit. I bought only the motherboard and a folder of schematics and instructions for component assembly. By December 1976, all it could do was display a test pattern consisting of essentially a dump of the character generator ROM. As time went by, I continued buying components. It was getting close to being finished, but I needed a keyboard. I bought one surplus, taken from a TI Silent 700. However, the strobe was inverted and either too long or too short (can't recall). So I fingered through Don Lancaster's TTL Cookbook until I came across the 74121, which I hadn't used yet. I used it to change the strobe width, and one gate in a NAND wired as an inverter to flip the logic direction. Next, I needed some kind of key-repeat. Like many early terminals, there was no auto-repeat, but instead, the keyboard included a REPEAT key. A couple of 555s and some more gates from the NAND, and I was almost done. I ended up adding a lightpen interface to the design, then built it up permanently using a Rat Shack proto board. Stuck that inside a generic keyboard enclosure along with the TI keyboard, and I could now talk to my SOL. For a monitor, I followed Lancaster's instructions on how to take an old B&W TV set and pull the unneeded circuitry (except for the tubes; they stayed in, heaters wired in series). The mods all helped boost the bandwidth of the monitor a bit. The image quality ended up being quite good, and I sold it to another guy who'd bought a complete SOL kit sans monitor (I'd bought an actual monitor by this time). I enjoyed every minute of the 18 months it took me to make that forty-dollar naked PC board into a usable computer. Or termninal, actually... its raison d'etre was to hook up to my beloved and much missed CDC 6600 & DEC-10! And I think I even got to like the smell of solder.. especially the Ersin Multicore stuff made in the U.K... why, there's some now, and no iron in sight... But as much as I enjoyed fooling with hardware, the software had an even stronger draw. Just as you can only erase a piece of paper so many times before it disintegrates, you can only re- solder a PC board so many times before you've fried it. And yes, I've used all kinds of techniques to repair such damage. But you can't damage software... which is one of the things that I find attractive about it. Emulators represent the ultimate convergence of hardware and software... Hey, I just had an idea... how about an emulator that goes all the way down to the component level? One which actually emulates resisters, capacitors, transistors, and 7400-series chips. It could also have an emulated soldering iron & solder. Ever wish you had three hands for a difficult assembly? No problem in this proposed emulator! We'll just add an emulated hand... or two... or... ;-) -dq

25 years, 1 month

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Q. Who remembers the "see" editor for the ibm pc?

by cmurillo＠emtelsa.multi.net.co

I just realized that every now and then I still use the first editor that I learned for the ibm pc, whenever I'm too lazy or don't need the power of vi (and the file that I want to edit is less than 64K in size). It is called see.exe and it is 32768 bytes long. The version string reads SEE: Screen Editor V2.0: (c) 1982,83,84 Michael Ouye The file date is 3-16-84. For its size, it is actually pretty useful and you can even record and replay macros. It is one of the first programs that I copy to any pc-compatible even if it (the pc) has been winblowsized. Is anybody acquainted with this program? carlos. -------------------------------------------------------------- Carlos E. Murillo-Sanchez carlos_murillo(a)nospammers.ieee.org

25 years, 1 month

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VAXEN

by donm＠cts.com

Looks as though there is a growing demand for them. - don -------- Path: nntp.cts.com!galanthis.cts.com!newspeer.cts.com!newshub.sdsu.edu!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!sunqbc.risq.qc.ca!nf3.bellglobal.com!border1.nntp.aus1.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!nntp3.aus1.giganews.com!bin1.nnrp.aus1.giganews.com.POSTED!not-for-mail Message-ID: <3BA123E5.CCB1F35C(a)iu.net> From: Bob C <bc(a)iu.net> X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.73 [en] (WinNT; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 Newsgroups: comp.os.vms Subject: VAX 7800 Systems or CPUs needed ASAP Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 8 NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 13 Sep 2001 16:28:22 CDT Organization: Giganews.Com - Premium News Outsourcing X-Trace: sv3-JMoUAGiispUQRU0wjhKYuMTuQMXLo3hljdoJWqTau+DeJJ1pFvbWSWDRk+pkOKwIVY/GNjelq2JqzY3!5//51v4yYd2SKBszu/VredTz1sjnRL367Ttr614cxdfTn0ewLiOGSGhQ9wM= X-Complaints-To: abuse(a)GigaNews.Com X-DMCA-Notifications: http://www.giganews.com/info/dmca.html X-Abuse-Info: Please be sure to forward a copy of ALL headers X-Abuse-Info: Otherwise we will be unable to process your complaint properly Date: Thu, 13 Sep 2001 21:28:22 GMT Xref: nntp.cts.com comp.os.vms:104521 One of our customers lost a lot of VAXes in the WTC attack. If you have any excess VAX 7800 let me know and I'll connect you with the right resources. Thanks Bob Comarow -- end of forwarded message --

25 years, 1 month

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L@@K and L@UGH!

by Antonio.Carlini＠riverstonenet.com

> Chuck McManis wrote: >Well if its a KA694 then that wouldn't be a horrible price. I don't have my >KA670 out of the machine so that I could check against that one. It >definitely doesn't look like the KA692. The REX520 screams Rigel to me: KA670. I don't have one handy to visually inspect though. Look at the AlphaServer 2100 memory auction too: same price! Antonio

25 years, 1 month

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Anyone want an 11/750 & 11/730 out of New Jersey?

by mcguire＠neurotica.com

On September 14, Gunther Schadow wrote: > Here are the "winners" according to my notes: > > VAX 11/730 - John Allain > VAX 11/750 - Sridhar, Vance, Master of all that Sucks, Absurdly Obtuse > HP 3000 - Lee or Bob Uhhhh...Crap, I thought those VAXen were ours, Brian...whaddup wit dat? -Dave -- Dave McGuire Laurel, MD

25 years, 1 month

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RT11 basic commands

by mirko.pikalo＠guest.arnes.si

Please, somebody helps me with RT11 basic commands. Where I can find them on the net? Mirko

25 years, 1 month

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ENOUGH ALREADY

by west＠tseinc.com

I sincerely agree as to the tragedy of recent US events. My heart goes out to all affected. HOWEVER, this is a classic computer mailing list. The discussion on the WTC stuff is very interesting, but it belongs on all the myraid of other lists present on the net for this purpose. What on EARTH posessed people to think we needed blow by blow updates on this list about current world events? Think - if you have to put "OT" in the subject of your message, it probably doesn't belong here. Regards, Jay West

25 years, 1 month

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L@@K and L@UGH!

by gunther＠aurora.regenstrief.org

Hi, see this http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1274886271 he's trying to sell a VAX 4000 CPU for $999.0 and no, it's not a typo, BuyItNow says $2000 something. cheers, -Gunther -- Gunther Schadow, M.D., Ph.D. gschadow(a)regenstrief.org Medical Information Scientist Regenstrief Institute for Health Care Adjunct Assistant Professor Indiana University School of Medicine tel:1(317)630-7960 http://aurora.regenstrief.org

25 years, 1 month

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Free: Sony CPD-1320 VGA monitor

by cmcmanis＠mcmanis.com

This is one monitor I can no longer justify owning. It is a nice trinitron VGA monitor with few hours on it, however it is a fixed frequency 31.25Khz/60Hz monitor. It makes an excellent "spare" monitor for a laptop with a damaged screen or a rack mounted system, etc, etc. At 13" it doesn't take up too much space and its easily lifted by one person. Its in Sunnyvale, CA. If you're willing to pay the packing and shipping (I do not have the original packing material so I would have to take it to be packed) I can mail it to you. Fortunately, it looks like tomorrow I'm going to finally get my mailings done for those of you who are patiently waiting. --Chuck

25 years, 1 month

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Qualstar 1260 9-track tape drive manual anyone?

by djenner＠earthlink.net

Perchance does anyone have an operations and/or maintenance manual for the Qualstar Model 1260 9-track tape drive? This was a popular drive in the late '80s and early '90s, especially for use with PCs. It's very compact, works in vertical or horizontal attitude, and is basically reel-to-reel without any tensioning mechanism. It was sold by Qualstar and in systems by other vendors such as Overland Data and Chi Corporation. Thanks. -- David C. Jenner djenner(a)earthlink.net

25 years, 1 month

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Classic Computers vs. Classic Computing

by dhquebbeman＠theestopinalgroup.com

> > In a recent thread, Tony Duell expressed a lack of interest in the > > emulators and simulators of old iron that are now circulating. His > > True. But let me say a couple of things here... Ok... > > reasons centered around his love of hardware. From my perspective, > > it appears that for Tony, the experience of computing cannot be > > separated from the experiencing of the computer. > > That much is also true. As I've said a few times before, I am an > electronics hacker primarily. My interest in computers is to consider > them as (fairly) complex electronic circuits to be investigated, hacked, > modified, repaired, etc. This is (I know) somewhat unconventional, but.... No so unconventional... I started with hardware (hacking the family TV, stereo, and phones)... > Since you can't (usefully) take a soldering iron to an emulator, it > explains why I am not interested in them. Isn't rosin (ersin) carcinogenic? Just kidding! > > I confess I don't like that- the Classic Computers for which I > > lust the most will forever remain inaccessible (and few examples > > You can probably gather from the above that I don't like it either! Sure, > _I_ am interested in the hardware, but this list would be very boring if > all memeber were like me. I feel that this list should cover other > aspects of classic _computing_. Yes, keep the hardware repair and > preservation (the bits I am interested in), but also include stuff on > emulators, programming techniques for the older machines, software > preservation, and everything else related to _computing_ 10 years or more > ago. Again, I didn't want you to feel picked-upon. However, for each of us who posts, I'd bet there are ten who don't. Of those of us who do post, each of us appears to represent yet a different facet of this interest area. You post a lot, and I believe, whether you realize it or not, that you represent a viewpoint held by many subscribers. In siezing upon your words, I was really trying to focus on one particular viewpoint, in order to place it in comparison and contrast with a different viewpoint. > > So, I think the formal name and the charter of this group should > > change to reflect an interest in Class Computing. The only real > > I am assumeing that's a typo for 'Classic Computing'. In which case you > have my vote... @*#$^@*#& Where's that damned DWIM keyboard when I need it??? ;-) > > change would be that discussions about the eumlators and simulators > > would no longer be OT unless they drift into details of programming > > the emu/simulators themselves. Additionally, more detailed discussions > > Why the last exclusion? I've never heard of a discussion on how to > diagnose hardware faults using modern test equipment being branded as > off-topic. Nor using modern parts to repair old machines. Nor using > modern machines as an aid to restoring/preserving old hardware. Why > should writing emulators be any different. It can quickly degenerate into "this version of GCC does <x> but doesn't do <yz>"... most of the sims are relying on GCC for portability. Or, do we build it as one huge monolithic source, or modularize the source? Separate execution modules running as native processes, or one big carefully-coded "superloop" that polls everything? For that level of discussion, it may prove beneficial to have a mailinglist dedicated to emulator/simulator theory. But if there is insufficient interest to mandate a separate list, ok, this is as fine a place as any for the discussions. > I don't particularly want to see complete listings for emulators (many > megabytes of C source) posted here, but certainly techniques for writing > them could be classed as on-topic, I think. Agreed... -dq

25 years, 1 month

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