- test-drb@ccmp.vtda.org - classiccmp.org

by meltie＠myrealbox.com

Hello all, if you've got a VAX 11/750 in running order, please could you contact me directly (I want piccies of specific bits of your VAX to help me getting mine running.) I've been through all the docs and bits I received with the VAX, and i've got a big box of TU58 tapes, ranging from VMS install 3.1 to 5.2, VAX Fortran, and a few tapes marked TU58 Demo, or some weird filesystem names (i'll remember them later), or "Property of DEC". I've also found a board marked "Property of DEC, Do not Remove", and discovered how hard it is to fit two- and four-finger cards into a six-finger backplane.

24 years, 4 months

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expansion differences (was Re: Micro$oft Biz'droid Lusers)

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

From: Fred Cisin (XenoSoft) <cisin(a)xenosoft.com> > >> What software >> was there, that you could install and use? > >A "TOY" computer comes with software. With a REAL computer, you have to >program. No, A TOY is somthing for playing with. An APPLIANCE is a computer that comes with software that might be useful. An example of such an APPLIANCE is a sad affair as it could be a useful computer if you could program it. Allison .

24 years, 4 months

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Micro$oft Biz'droid Lusers (was: OT email response format)

by csmith＠amdocs.com

> -----Original Message----- > From: Fred Cisin (XenoSoft) [mailto:cisin@xenosoft.com] > Did he also think that the 68000 was a copy of the 8086? I didn't ask, but probably. I imagine every chip is a copy of the Pentium, in fact. How would MS-DOS run otherwise? We all know that even the Great Bill Gates wasn't able to make his Wonderful Windows Operating System function without MS-DOS, so it must certainly be impossible for anyone else. ;) Those ENIAC guys are just lucky that Bill Gates was around to give them a copy of MS-DOS when they needed it! No, I'm not exaggerating; yes, I did say he was a "programmer." Chris Christopher Smith, Perl Developer Amdocs - Champaign, IL /usr/bin/perl -e ' print((~"\x95\xc4\xe3"^"Just Another Perl Hacker.")."\x08!\n"); '

24 years, 4 months

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Sun help needed... [was: RE: open "dumpster" event in New Hav en, CT]

by DAW＠yalepress3.unipress.yale.edu

> From: Christopher Smith > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: David Woyciesjes [mailto:DAW@yalepress3.unipress.yale.edu] > > > Any tips, tricks, or other hints? Maybe something I missed? How > > about other options for getting this puppy running? > > I used an RRD42 to install SunOS <something> on a SPARC IPX. It > had a strange problem where the install program would see some problem > with the drive and abort. If you re-ran the install program a second > time, it would complete fine. You might watch out for that. > > Also, some versions of Solaris *hate* non-sun drives, and won't > boot from them. I don't know which ones, right off. > > Chris > Okay, I'll keep that in mind. I'll be installing the Solaris 8 Binary-Only deal... -- --- David A Woyciesjes --- C & IS Support Specialist --- Yale University Press --- mailto:david.woyciesjes@yale.edu --- (203) 432-0953 --- ICQ # - 905818 Mac OS X 10.1.2 - Darwin Kernel Version 5.2: Fri Dec 7 21:39:35 PST 2001 Running since 01/22/2002 without a crash

24 years, 4 months

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new server status and RFC on problem tracking database for all classic OS's

by jwest＠classiccmp.org

Thanks a MILLION to all who have donated parts and/or money so far to get a separate dedicated classiccmp server. Many of the components are in (still missing a few critical things), but I'm still waffeling on whether to put in IDE hardware mirroring (and if so, whether to do it with a motherboard that supports this or an addin ide raid card). Decisions decisions.... if anyone still wants to donate to the cause, my paypal id is jwest(a)classiccmp.org On a different note - something I have been considering and wonder if people would like it or use it. I would like to put up a problem tracking system for all classic OS's. This would be off the classiccmp.org website, where anyone could put in a problem they have run into with a particular classic OS - be it a suspected bug, compatability issues, etc. An administrative type (volunteers who want to watch the section for a particular OS) can come in and post an answer, resolution, workaround, etc., or mark the problem report as "user error", "known defect", etc. This database easily supports someone searching for a list of problems, issues, etc. For example - "show me any entries for getting a cdrom to work on RT11", or "show me any problems with crashed BBL on HP21xx", or "what are all the known defects in {your favorite operating system here}". All accessible to the public via a simple web interface. You can think of this as a totally free hobbyist support mechanism open to the public. However, keep in mind that it is NOT meant to be used as a "discussion" forum. The very nature of the software used for the system prevents this from happening (ie. it's not meant to replace the classiccmp mailing list in any way). Just another way to find out if the problem you're beating your head against is a known bug. I have been looking at BugTrak, but am starting to lean towards the gnats system with the www.gnats frontend. Any thoughts? Jay West

24 years, 4 months

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Vintage Comp Ads and Prices

by jpl15＠panix.com

Just found this: www.adflip.com a huge archive of print advertising covering many decades. Entering 'compter' into the search box returned hundreds of ads, starting with a full page National Geographic spread for the IBM 604 from 1951... many many other vintage systems from the 70s are there too, many with prices. Cheers John

24 years, 4 months

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Sun help needed... [was: RE: open "dumpster" event in New Hav en, CT]

by csmith＠amdocs.com

> -----Original Message----- > From: David Woyciesjes [mailto:DAW@yalepress3.unipress.yale.edu] > Any tips, tricks, or other hints? Maybe something I missed? How > about other options for getting this puppy running? I used an RRD42 to install SunOS <something> on a SPARC IPX. It had a strange problem where the install program would see some problem with the drive and abort. If you re-ran the install program a second time, it would complete fine. You might watch out for that. Also, some versions of Solaris *hate* non-sun drives, and won't boot from them. I don't know which ones, right off. Chris Christopher Smith, Perl Developer Amdocs - Champaign, IL /usr/bin/perl -e ' print((~"\x95\xc4\xe3"^"Just Another Perl Hacker.")."\x08!\n"); '

24 years, 4 months

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Ebay alert, Pacific NW, DEC gear

by fernande＠internet1.net

It's not my auction, and I wish I was close enough to investigate further. The auction says he has 3 pages of components that he'll fax to a potential bidder. http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2019918462 Chad Fernandez Michigan, USA

24 years, 4 months

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suggestions on BBC Micro, voltage converter, PAL monitor (in US)?

by Lee.Davison＠merlincommunications.com

Tony, Second processors _are_ hard to find. The 6502 and Z80 ones are just about possible to find. The 32016 and ARM1 ones are very rare. I've got a few of the Torch Z80 and Torch 68000 type along with an 80C286 board that fits internally to the BBC. I have no documents or software for any of these and both the 68000 and 80C286 boards have had nearly all the socketed chips pulled. Any ideas where I can get info and/or software for these. Lee. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ---- This email is intended only for the above named addressee(s). The information contained in this email may contain information which is confidential. The views expressed in this email are personal to the sender and do not in any way reflect the views of the company. If you have received this email and you are not a named addressee please delete it from your system and contact Merlin Communications International IT Department on +44 20 7344 5888. ________________________________________________________________________ This e-mail has been scanned for all viruses by Star Internet. The service is powered by MessageLabs. For more information on a proactive anti-virus service working around the clock, around the globe, visit: http://www.star.net.uk ________________________________________________________________________

24 years, 4 months

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Sun help needed... [was: RE: open "dumpster" event in New Hav en, CT]

by DAW＠yalepress3.unipress.yale.edu

> From: Bill Pechter > > > Anyway, to my point... This is off-topic, so taking it off-list is > > appropriate I believe... I have a Sun Ultra1 Creator. (170E, Open Boot > 3.1, > > 128 MB RAM, 4 GB Quantum, 1 GB Conner, floppy disk... old 19" Sun color > > monitor, type 5c keyb, optical mouse w/proper silver pad!) Well, now > that I > > finally got the Creator framebuffer replaced, it's time to load Solaris. > > Except that all the CD-ROMS I have aren't even seen by the console... > And I > > tried the sector size jumper both ways. > > > > -- > > try to describe the scsi bus and termination. > do a probe-scsi and a probe-scsi-all... > > let me know what that does. > - Termination was tried both ways on the CD drive. The 2 HDDs are SCA-80, and it looks like those are in the middle of the chain. probe-scsi shows _only_ the 2 HDDs, never the CD. probe-scsi-all will have to wait until I get home from work... > Great machine... I've got some Sun Parts if you need them including an > external disk and cd. > - Hopefully the DEC RRD42 will work, like people say it should. Could that external CD be mounted in the Ultra1? I'd hate to clutter up my desk _more_... :) > Plextor and Toshiba CD's and CD-R's have worked for me on them. > The old 2x toshibas are $3.50 at www.compgeeks.com. > > My Teac's also have the 512 byte jumper as do IBM's. > - None of which I have... -- --- David A Woyciesjes --- C & IS Support Specialist --- Yale University Press --- mailto:david.woyciesjes@yale.edu --- (203) 432-0953 --- ICQ # - 905818 Mac OS X 10.1.2 - Darwin Kernel Version 5.2: Fri Dec 7 21:39:35 PST 2001 Running since 01/22/2002 without a crash

24 years, 4 months

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Sun help needed... [was: RE: open "dumpster" event in New Haven, CT]

by DAW＠yalepress3.unipress.yale.edu

This may be an off-topic post, but Chris is nuts for old HP laser printers and old Macs! A 2 hour drive, out of the blue, during the week, just for two printers... Well I guess that fits just about everybody on this list though... Anyway, to my point... This is off-topic, so taking it off-list is appropriate I believe... I have a Sun Ultra1 Creator. (170E, Open Boot 3.1, 128 MB RAM, 4 GB Quantum, 1 GB Conner, floppy disk... old 19" Sun color monitor, type 5c keyb, optical mouse w/proper silver pad!) Well, now that I finally got the Creator framebuffer replaced, it's time to load Solaris. Except that all the CD-ROMS I have aren't even seen by the console... And I tried the sector size jumper both ways. - Matsushita CR-503-B Compaq spare... - Smart 7 Friendly CD-R 4012 - Apple CD300 plus (found the Sun CD list that said these didn't work afterwards) I have a DEC RRD42 external CD drive here at work that I'm gonna "borrow" this weekend. Any tips, tricks, or other hints? Maybe something I missed? How about other options for getting this puppy running? Thanks to Sridhar and DaveM for trying to help last might... -- --- David A Woyciesjes --- C & IS Support Specialist --- Yale University Press --- mailto:david.woyciesjes@yale.edu --- (203) 432-0953 --- ICQ # - 905818 Mac OS X 10.1.2 - Darwin Kernel Version 5.2: Fri Dec 7 21:39:35 PST 2001 Running since 01/22/2002 without a crash > ---------- > From: Chris > > >> 1 HP LaserJet IIID, w/ duplex > >Covet covet. > > > >*sigh* I'm in Qu?bec. > > That is sitting in the back of the van sitting in my driveway :-) > > In the morning I will see what it's status is (Dave believes it works, > but doesn't know 100%... worst case, I will probably canabalize my LJ 2 > to get the IIID running) > > Sorry, had to rub it in (isn't often I have toys others want) > > -chris

24 years, 4 months

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Unix versions

by pete＠dunnington.u-net.com

On Apr 25, 18:20, Bill Pechter wrote: > > On Apr 24, 21:05, Bill Pechter wrote: > > > > > Isn't it a bit much to call XXDP+ an OS. > > > DECX-11 is closer... XXDP's pretty dumb. > > > > I've always thought of XXDP as the OS that DECX-11 runs under. > More like the program loader for the OS... 8-). > > At least CP/M had better editors available than XXDP... Yeah, you mean EDLIN :-) TECO in XXDP is not my favourite editor! I'm slightly puzzled by what you say about DEC X-11, though. My exposure to it and XXDP is only in the form of the diagnostics available to end users and third-party service organisations, and I suspect there's more to it than that. The reason I think of XXDP as the OS and X-11 as the, well, application in a way, is that all I see are the X-11 modules to run build and series of tests, whereas XXDP includes the monitor, system handlers etc (as well as the diagnostic programs and utilites, of course). To me, that's the OS. -- Pete Peter Turnbull Network Manager University of York

24 years, 4 months

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Micro$oft Biz'droid Lusers (was: OT email response format)

by carlos_murillo＠epm.net.co

At 02:08 PM 4/25/02 -0500, you wrote: >I had a cop-rogrammer at one point who insisted that MacOS was based on >MS-DOS. :) >Needless to say, he didn't rogramm very well, and was fired eventually. >Chris Copro-grammer fits. carlos. -------------------------------------------------------------- Carlos E. Murillo-Sanchez carlos_murillo(a)nospammers.ieee.org

24 years, 4 months

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Mains voltage & frequency

by PeksaDO＠Cardiff.ac.uk

>From 1981-1992 our Honeywell Multics (120V 60Hz) was attached to the grid (240V 50Hz) via an motor/alternator set which was about 6' (long) x 3' (high) x 2' (wide). Doug.

24 years, 4 months

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Micro$oft Biz'droid Lusers (was: OT email response format)

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

6bits was the "byte" size for the PDP-8 (swap acc halves). 9bits was the byte size for the PDP-10, I believe IBM360 and CDC6600 12 bits was link-8, PDP-8 and PDP-12 (likely others). 9/18 the pdp7 (first home of unix). -----Original Message----- From: Sean 'Captain Napalm' Conner <spc(a)conman.org> To: classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org <classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org> Date: Monday, April 22, 2002 12:34 AM Subject: Re: Micro$oft Biz'droid Lusers (was: OT email response format) >It was thus said that the Great Ben Franchuk once stated: >> >> Sean 'Captain Napalm' Conner wrote: >> >> > As for using non-8 bit byte based CPUs? Not really; I don't think I've >> > ever even come across any 9, 12, 18, 24, 36, 60 or 66 bit systems >> > *anywhere* and I'm one of the few programmers I know that's even *heard* of >> > such CPUs. Most programmers I suspect are only aware of the x86. >> What computer systems did you have in mind? >> 9 bit ???? >> 12 bit ???? > > I might have gotten a bit confused there. I know of systems that have had >9 bit characters, and some that have 12 bit address spaces but I'm sure that >if there were indeed, such things as a nine bit or twelve bit computer, >they'll be mentioned soon enough 8-/ > > -spc (But I do want to say the PDP-8 was a 12 bit system for some reason ... ) > > >

24 years, 4 months

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ScanPlus Gray 300 scanner - what type of interface?

by Arno_1983＠gmx.de

Thanks for this first info. The scanner does not bear the Plustek name or logo, but their web site lists a "Scan Plus Color 3000" (possibly color variant of mine), for which they still have a driver. The bottom of my scanner has a label on it with two checkboxen, "ScanPlus Gray 300" next to the checked and "ScanPlus Color 3000" next to the unchecked one, so obviously the used at least the same housing. Unfortunately, they only describe setup procedures for parallel port scanners (which have a second connector for the printer cable) and USB scanners, so I'm still lost as to which kind of interface I need to connect mine. I had already found and downloaded the files from the Italian site. Sincerely yours Arno Kletzander Arno_1983(a)gmx.de -- GMX - Die Kommunikationsplattform im Internet. http://www.gmx.net

24 years, 4 months

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Micro$oft Biz'droid Lusers (was: OT email response format)

by mcguire＠neurotica.com

On April 21, Richard Erlacher wrote: > You can get the same software for UNIX, if you don't mind the $250K pricetag. > You won't get the source code there, either, of course, but I doubt you'd > expend 200 man-years developing a piece of software at your expense and then > give away the source code. If you did, your shareholders would tar and > feather you. Most of the software in use in the UNIX world is free. Of course there ARE commercial packages, but...with very few exceptions, for every commercial package there's at least one free one that does the job as well or better. It's possible that I'm preaching to the choir here, but one of the common misconceptions that really bugs me is the notion that "unix == expensive", when in reality it's just the opposite. (The same goes for "pc vs. real computers" in the "I use a PC because I can't afford a Sun or an Alpha" case...) > People like the software for FPGA's and CPLD's because it's either free or > under $100 US. There are so many high-quality 805x compilers that are FPGA and CPLD stuff are some of the exceptions that I mentioned in my paragraph above. For that stuff we're pretty much stuck with Windows due to the shortsightedness of the vendors. There's nothing we can do about that at this point, as far as I can tell. :-( I curb that problem by using Windows (under an emulator of course) ONLY for the stuff that I can't run under a real OS. > "freeware" or "shareware" that I can't see any reason one would want one of > the $2000 types, unless he was convinced he could make his work easier by > spending that money. If people would keep after the producers of the > purportedly faulty software, it would get fixed. Vendors of shoddy software > rely on the fact that people buy their products under the mistaken notion that > it will do their work for them, knowing that, when the end-user finds out it's > not so, he'll be too embarassed to complain that the product doesn't work any > better than the comparable freeware product. I agree 100%. Needless to say, we're trashing this compiler after this project. :-) The fancy GUI is nice, but frankly I can be more productive with xemacs and make. > There is a demo version of nearly every high-cost ($2000 isn't that high, btw, > though the Windows environment has made it so.) Get a comparable product for > UNIX, and you'll get no improvement, nor will you get source. All you'll get > is a bigger bill. Not necessarily...I've used at least four FREE 8051 C compilers under UNIX, nearly ten years ago! $2000 *is* high, when most of the 8051 compilers I've used cost $0. -Dave -- Dave McGuire "Mmmm. Big." St. Petersburg, FL -Den

24 years, 4 months

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Micro$oft Biz'droid Lusers (was: OT email response format)

by blacklord＠telstra.com

Hi Richard, > were not great, but at least they were adequate. Frankly, if one > considers the competition, the Commodore people picked the video > toy market to > play in rather than the home computer market, because they > couldn't compete > with Apple and Radio Shack, though they attempted to compete with > RS' low-end. So just what is it that classifies the C64 as a "toy" computer ? When it was released, it was far more capable than the existant Apples, Ataris & Radio Shacks (& a damn sight cheaper too). Indeed, out of all the machines then in production, which one still in use now is still capable of (more or less) doing what modern machines can ? cheers, Lance ---------------- Powered by telstra.com

24 years, 4 months

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Call for Chapters for Microscopy book

by micro＠formatex.org

Dear colleague This letter is to remind you that if you are interested in submitting a chapter for our forthcoming edition "Science, Technology and Education of Microscopy: an Overview" the deadline for submitting them is JUNE 30, 2002. Please note that a first list of accepted proposals/chapters has been also posted on the Call for Papers' website: http://www.formatex.org/micro2002/callforpaper.htm For any enquiry or suggestion, please contact us. Best wishes from Spain. J.A.Mesa Gonzalez Formatex Secretariat A.Mendez Vilas Physics Department University of Extremadura Avda. de Elvas s/n 06071 Badajoz SPAIN E-mail: amvilas(a)unex.es Editor

24 years, 4 months

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Micro$oft Biz'droid Lusers (was: OT email response format)

by csmith＠amdocs.com

> -----Original Message----- > From: R. D. Davis [mailto:rdd@rddavis.org] > reliable and less troublesome. One of them told me that there was no > difference between BSD and Linux, and he firmly believed that BSD was > based on Linux! Another one insisted that I switch to M$-Word from I had a cop-rogrammer at one point who insisted that MacOS was based on MS-DOS. :) Needless to say, he didn't rogramm very well, and was fired eventually. Chris Christopher Smith, Perl Developer Amdocs - Champaign, IL /usr/bin/perl -e ' print((~"\x95\xc4\xe3"^"Just Another Perl Hacker.")."\x08!\n"); '

24 years, 4 months

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Vax 3100/80 among other things.

by cvisors＠carnagevisors.net

Hi All again. I have to say the Vax I got last week has been heaps of fun, picked up a couple of bits for it today, like about 20 backup tapes (unfortunatly not TK50 tapes) And a Nice VT420 Terminal. Anyway decided to let VMS wait for a little before I try and learn this odd but interesting system, (I am going to be joind decus so I can get new VMS media as the machine didn't come with any) so I have had a look at the other avalible OSes that are avalible for the VAX. A quick question was ULTRIX ever avalible for the uVAX 3100/80? The two "free" operating systems that seem to be avalible for the 3100/80 are NetBSD and OpenBSD (there seems to be a version of linux but it seems to be quite imature.) I now have had a play with both (and If anyone ever needs a hand setting up either of these just give me a yell.) The NetBSD install was realy easy, I booted the vax via the network, and then did a [ctrl] + [z] and then using ftp pulled the .tgz files to the vax and installed the os from the local hard drive. The only issue was that the NetBSD install was sparse to say the least, and after compiling a couple of things (which was quite slow, but no where as slow as my first linux pc ;) I decided to give OpenBSD a go. OpenBSD is great, still it doesn't have all that I want, but has a lot more than NetBSD. The install is a little hairy in places, and it took me a while to configure the FreeBSD i386 box I am using for a boot server (the OpenBSD net boot process is a little differnt that NetBSD) but the install went painlessly. To sum up, and sorry if this is a little off topic. If anyone is looking for something other than VMS to run on their Vaxes, I would reccomend OpenBSD over NetBSD. I Hope I havent bored you too much.... Benjamin

24 years, 4 months

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Micro$oft Biz'droid Lusers (was: OT email response format)

by csmith＠amdocs.com

> -----Original Message----- > From: Fred Cisin (XenoSoft) [mailto:cisin@xenosoft.com] > Have you noticed some of the really odd structures in the > DIRectory of the > early Mac formats? > (linked list table (MICROS~1 calls theirs a F.A.T.) made up of 12 bit > entries!) Could that be coincidence? No. just a severe shortage of > competent systems programmers resulting in a number of programmers and > ideas in common. Atari's TOS wasn't based on MS-DOS either, and it used the exact same filesystem. To answer your rhetorical question, actually, I hadn't noticed. I did notice that it was significantly different from ODS-2. :) Perhaps I need to be more clear here -- this guy really thought that somewhere underneath the Mac GUI, there was a copy of MS-DOS on every Macintosh. He had nothing to offer as proof, except that no computer could possibly function without it. (I'm really serious here...) Chris Christopher Smith, Perl Developer Amdocs - Champaign, IL /usr/bin/perl -e ' print((~"\x95\xc4\xe3"^"Just Another Perl Hacker.")."\x08!\n"); '

24 years, 4 months

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Mark-8 Starter Set for sale

by MTPro＠aol.com

This set includes the circuit boards reproduced (actually produced-retro) >from the original plans, and the front panel with lettering, and the red lens. I purchased these directly from the man who produces them and he has assembled a number of Mark-8's in the past and is very knowledgeable on their assembly. He includes an excellent CD with reprints of the original Radio Electronics articles and his own very helpful notes. Here are a couple of pictures: http://www.classiccomputing.com/mark8.html Here is more info: The First Hobbyist Computer! The remarkable Mark-8 computer was described in the July 1974 issue of Radio Electronics. A landmark in computer history, it was the first hobbyist computer. At this point in time, most engineers didn't, or couldn't believe that a real computer could be constructed with the new fangle Intel chips. But Jon Titus proved them wrong with the affordable Mark-8 computer. The Mark-8 is a .5 Mhz 8008 based computer that preceded the Altair 8800 by about 6 months. The 8008 was Intel's first 8 bit processor and was developed along with the world's first processor, the 4004. Only plans and pcb boards were available from the creator, Jon Titus, everything else had to be provided by the builder. More on the CD from the creator: Also included is a CD that I put together containing a copy of the original Radio Electronics article and supplemental 47 page construction article; a 50 page manual I created detailing my experience and hints debugging this computer (with many photos and full scans of completed boards); aboueers informed before Byte came out, its a treasure chest of historical information about the Mark-8 and other early computers, the January 1975 issue is especially interesting, this is when the Altair was introduced) I paid $180 for this set and I have come to realize that I do not have the talent needed to do the precise soldering, testing, etc. and there is the task of locating the remaining parts for the computer. This is over my head I believe, so I want to pass these on to someone else. $150 plus shipping, an excellent deal. Don't miss your chance to build this classic kit. Best, David Greelish Classic Computing www.classiccomputing.com "classiccomputing" on eBay

24 years, 4 months

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open "dumpster" event in New Haven, CT

by mythtech＠mac.com

>> 1 HP LaserJet IIID, w/ duplex >Covet covet. > >*sigh* I'm in Qu?bec. That is sitting in the back of the van sitting in my driveway :-) In the morning I will see what it's status is (Dave believes it works, but doesn't know 100%... worst case, I will probably canabalize my LJ 2 to get the IIID running) Sorry, had to rub it in (isn't often I have toys others want) -chris <http://www.mythtech.net>

24 years, 4 months

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Open source -- non computer topics (Debian)

by nemesis-lists＠icequake.net

Doug: > Never had a problem with Debian, other than its name... > Is it an acronym for something? It's rather lame, but: "Since many people have asked, Debian is pronounced 'deb ee n'. It comes from the names of the creator of Debian, Ian Murdock, and his wife, Debra." <shrug> :) However, you can get Linux-based Debian distributions such as "Corel", "Storm", "Progeny", and such. The Debian package system and architecture is not tied explicitly to the official Debian project (and debatable policies) alone. Chris: > the Debian people have better things to do with their time than debate, > argue about, and perhaps eventually fix it. This is possible, but if you offered a reasonable and serious rebuttal to their policy (or portions thereof), I would doubt that anybody would think twice before taking it into consideration. In other words, if you have something to say, it would help to tell it to the people who can do something about it! :) -- Ryan Underwood, <nemesis at icequake.net>, icq=10317253

24 years, 4 months

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AEHD 3.5" External disk drive for Apple

by DAW＠yalepress3.unipress.yale.edu

This has been spoken for.. -- --- David A Woyciesjes --- C & IS Support Specialist --- Yale University Press --- mailto:david.woyciesjes@yale.edu --- (203) 432-0953 --- ICQ # - 905818 Mac OS X 10.1.2 - Darwin Kernel Version 5.2: Fri Dec 7 21:39:35 PST 2001 Running since 01/22/2002 without a crash > ---------- > From: David Woyciesjes > > This reminds me... I have here an Applied Engineering AEHD 3.5" > External disk drive for Apple Computers. But the machine it's from is long > gone. > Who wants it? Say, $20 for me to pack it and ship it out. > > -- > --- David A Woyciesjes

24 years, 4 months

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"Toy" computers (was Re: Micro$oft Biz'droid Lusers)

by csmith＠amdocs.com

> -----Original Message----- > From: Richard Erlacher [mailto:edick@idcomm.com] > They are toys, since they didn't have a disk interface in > them. They, in > fact, if your description is correct, needed a toy interface > to talk to > another toy interface that talked to what was probably a > smarter computer that > had a disk interface in it. That pretty much describes commodore disk drives, yep. The point, though, is that they plug directly into an interface that's already on the machine, so we would get into the sticky discussion of how "directly" a drive must be handled. Require too much of the logic to be in the computer, and suddenly an external IDE disk wouldn't count. As an aside, I've heard of interesting things being done with the disk drive "computers," though I can't think of any off hand. They spoke a pretty simple serial protocol, too, such that you can basically plug them into other systems (Intel Linux machines, at least) and build simple applications to talk to them, and they handled all of the complexities of disk I/O, so that the CPU didn't need to -- so there are good points to them. That being said, if I understand your other post properly, once the drive is there, you would possibly not consider it a toy any more, whether the drive is external or not, and regardless of how it's driven. Or am I way off? Would you also have considered 9-track tape "mass storage" for the time? Chris Christopher Smith, Perl Developer Amdocs - Champaign, IL /usr/bin/perl -e ' print((~"\x95\xc4\xe3"^"Just Another Perl Hacker.")."\x08!\n"); '

24 years, 4 months

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open "dumpster" event in New Haven, CT

by DAW＠yalepress3.unipress.yale.edu

We're cleaning here, and got some stuff being tossed. Free, Come pick it up... 12 old modems - Gandalf LDS125 (?) about 12 (?) dozen tape reels. 12" diameter. They're in 4 15" monitor boxes... 2 HP LaserJet IID, with duplex 1 HP LaserJet IIID, w/ duplex some long comms(?) cables old Epson line printers old DeskJet printers CSU/DSU more to come... I can hold some of the smaller things, but there is limited space in my garage. E-mail me directly... -- --- David A Woyciesjes --- C & IS Support Specialist --- Yale University Press --- mailto:david.woyciesjes@yale.edu --- (203) 432-0953 --- ICQ # - 905818 Mac OS X 10.1.2 - Darwin Kernel Version 5.2: Fri Dec 7 21:39:35 PST 2001 Running since 01/22/2002 without a crash

24 years, 4 months

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R.I.P. for D.I.Y.

by uban＠ubanproductions.com

Peter, I've had this concern myself and have even made processor choices based on my fear of the hand prototyping of BGA parts. Would you please give us a synopsis of your experience and tips hand assembling BGA parts, including tools, temperatures, etc. ? --tnx --tom At 12:46 PM 4/25/02 -0700, you wrote: >On Thu, 25 Apr 2002, Jos Dreesen wrote: > >> Allison wrote: >> > >> >almost impossible for the home builder ... and only the odd few (Tony? :-) >> > >> > Impossible? How? >> > >> Open any GSM phone and look at the components.... >> There is NO WAY a hobbyist (not even Tony ( sorry chap !)) will be able to >> handle 200-300 pin BGA packages, with 0.8 or even 0.5mm pitch. > >Nonsense! I do 388 pin BGAs for protos all the time with nothing but a hot air >gun... > >BGAs are easier than fine pitch QFP to solder (though difficult to salvage if >done wrong...) > >Peter Wallace > > > >

24 years, 4 months

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Micro$oft Biz'droid Lusers (was: OT email response format)

by mcguire＠neurotica.com

On April 22, Richard Erlacher wrote: > Most of the people I've met who use UNIX/LINUX in their home-computing > pursuits do it because they've nothing better to do. You may not fit that > model, but these guys figure out ways to make their computers more secure, > more complicated to use, and often have to type for several minutes to find > out whether a copy of a file on their local hard drive is available on that > other box down the wire. When my machines are all turned on, I can do that in > less than 15 seconds, and that long only because I can't remember the file > name. This is the one of your trolls that I think I'll ignore. > I just want (1) for my computers to act in concert to present me with a > convenient interface and (2) for them to work as expected. They seem to do > that most of the time. In recent years my cars have been more reliable than > my computers, but that wasn't the case some years back when I used Detroit > iron. When my computers become as reliable as my telephone, which may happen > not because the computers get better but ... then I'll be happy enough, I I suppose I'm more demanding than to accept my computers working as expected "most of the time". My computers are much MORE reliable than my telephone. But then, I don't use PeeCees, and I don't run Windows. I suppose it's just an issue of personal/professional standards and expectations. If I had a hammer that randomly jumped off of my workbench and flew through a window, I'd throw it in the trash and get a better hammer. I did exactly that with my computer a very long time ago. -Dave -- Dave McGuire "Mmmm. Big." St. Petersburg, FL -Den

24 years, 4 months

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Unix versions

by pete＠dunnington.u-net.com

On Apr 24, 21:05, Bill Pechter wrote: > Isn't it a bit much to call XXDP+ an OS. > DECX-11 is closer... XXDP's pretty dumb. I've always thought of XXDP as the OS that DECX-11 runs under. -- Pete Peter Turnbull Network Manager University of York

24 years, 4 months

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R.I.P. for D.I.Y.

by dquebbeman＠acm.org

> From: Andy Holt <andyh(a)andyh-rayleigh.freeserve.co.uk> > > Nowadays You typically have to deal with distributors - little > > problem for the experienced, but an obstacle to newcomers > > what about JDR, JAMECO, BG and a long list of suppliers that take > small orders and credit cards? Great for processors, logic gates, linear chips, etc... DigiKey I do lots of business with (well, in the past). But try finding: cross-bar switch telco line interface bond-out version of a processor caller-id decoder and any other number of specialized chips... -dq

24 years, 4 months

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.I.P. for D.I.Y.

by Gary.Messick＠itt.com

> -----Original Message----- > From: Dwight K. Elvey [mailto:dwightk.elvey@amd.com] > Sent: Thursday, April 25, 2002 12:39 PM > To: classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org > Subject: Re: .I.P. for D.I.Y. > > > I get a kick out of the fact that he made the electrodes > in the shape of the old atom symbol they used to use in > the advertisements. Does anyone remember the name of the > little cartoon character that the GE advertisements had > for the atom? > Dwight > > Reddy Kilowatt! ************************************ If this email is not intended for you, or you are not responsible for the delivery of this message to the addressee, please note that this message may contain ITT Privileged/Proprietary Information. In such a case, you may not copy or deliver this message to anyone. You should destroy this message and kindly notify the sender by reply email. Information contained in this message that does not relate to the business of ITT is neither endorsed by nor attributable to ITT. ************************************

24 years, 4 months

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Micro$oft Biz'droid Lusers (was: OT email response format)

by alan.pearson＠cramer.com

> From: Doc <doc(a)mdrconsult.com> > : > You're calling the entire DECstation 5000/2xx line "products intended > for the toy market as opposed to one intended to be seen as a computer", > since they have no internal mass storage. I guess he thinks Sun 3/50's are toys too. Sigh. Al.

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"Toy" computers (was Re: Micro$oft Biz'droid Lusers)

by dquebbeman＠acm.org

> The floppy port one was called the Hard Disk 20 (Hard Drive 20?? damn, I > always screw that up). You are right on the SCSI one (20SC). And there is > a 2nd product that I am aware of Apple made for the floppy port. An > external 400k floppy drive. They may have made other external floppies > for the Mac that use the floppy port as well (800k maybe, but I don't > think they made a 1.44 external) > > There were of course other floppy drives made for floppy ports on the > IIgs, but I don't know if that is the same functionality, so I don't know > if those could have been used on the Mac. I used to own an external 400k drive, sold it about 10 years ago along with the old 400k internal drive they let me keep when I had my Fat mac upgraded to a 512Ke. Yes, Apple did make an external drive, ISTR is was called UniDrive but that was also what they called the single plastic 5.25inch drives for the Apple //e, according to Sellam... So I think Apple may have goofed and used the name twice. However, these were not Superdrives, IIRC, they didn't support 1.44MB, only 800MB. When I first saw it, the sounds it made were like a little hard drive, or so it seemd at the time. Third-parties also made external drives; I have one such beast, can't recall the maker, but I think it has both autoeject in addition to the quite visible and accessible front-panel eject button. -dq

24 years, 4 months

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.I.P. for D.I.Y.

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

From: Bryan Pope <bpope(a)wordstock.com> > >O. :( What about this other store I just found on the net called "Active >Electronics"? They have a stores located in Woburn and Cambridge? Yep another resource. >I am looking to get a soldering iron plus double-sided copper clab boards, >chemicals and dry-erase (I can't remember the exact name) to draw the >circuit. U-blew-it is good for that. The marker pen for hand drawing etch directly is the ever popular Sharpie (sanford) permanent marker. They are avalable in many widths and work just fine for resist. For the Iron look for a low cost temperature controlled iron, it's worth the price and usually they have fine tips or can have an assortment of tips. Allison

24 years, 4 months

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.I.P. for D.I.Y.

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

From: Andy Holt <andyh(a)andyh-rayleigh.freeserve.co.uk> >Nowadays > You typically have to deal with distributors - little problem for the >experienced, but an obstacle to newcomers what about JDR, JAMECO, BG and a long list of suppliers that take small orders and credit cards? > The edge speed of modern logic is so high that WW is unlikely to work WW works just fine. I've done it and actually WW if done right sometimes exceeds PCB! > In fact even PCBs now need designing using UHF techniques for the same >reason If your going that fast. Then again I did a UHF transverter using dead bug (NO PCB) just recently and it works very well. > SMT devices - and almost everything nowadays is only available as such - Yes, all the really neat new stuff is. However PICs, Amtel cpus, and good old 74xxxs stuff is widely abailable in dips. >are best handled with an expensive soldering station (and BGA devices need >even more expensive equiment). BGA is the extreme and likely more than a trivial project use. > Documentation - though nowadays typically easier to obtain - is often >oversimplified. Maybe, maybe not. For the stuff I do, and have done, it's pretty decent. I've been doing it for over 30 years so I do know the world has changed. Buying fast logic in 1970 to make a 50mhz freq counter was difficult, now it's a gimme. > Programming devices often needs (one or both of) expensive hardware or >extremely expensive software. If your programming GAL, FPGA, and the like, yes. Eproms no problem. Then again I've met some that wanted a high end FPGA to do what I can do in a handful of diodes and a few transistors or less. >I stand by the "almost impossible" statement above. You go in expecting defeat and you will be defeated. I just finished building a PLL system with 100hz resolution at 42mhz in a 1.5inch cube. No exotica, most parts bought from JDR catalog at reasonable prices. >The one main exception to this black picture is the single-chip flash >micro - such as the PIC family or the 8051 derivatives. But working with >these is more like computer programming than hardware design. Maybe but with the right mindset these are increadable resources. They allow one to use programmed micro where you needed a dozen chips or more before. Allison

24 years, 4 months

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Open source -- non computer topics (Debian)

by csmith＠amdocs.com

> -----Original Message----- > From: Ryan Underwood [mailto:nemesis-lists@icequake.net] > That's fine, and it's your choice, but please remember that > since you are > "staying away from the Debian community", you are using a > system that is the > product of others' hard work, and not contributing. If you Well, eventually I'll write my own OS, but until then... ;) > don't wish to > assist the project, IMO you shouldn't be shooting flames and > labels around > when you're dissatisfied with the outcome. Not trying to shoot flames anywhere. I'm just voicing my objection to the naming convention. If I thought it was a serious problem, I would, as you suggest, bring it up with the Debian group. > be better brought up to the Debian project itself. That way, > we can be > aware of views that diverge from the popular "Debian user"'s > view, in order > to attempt to provide a better system for all. I mean, yeah, Since it's a cosmetic thing, and has no impact on usability, I've largely tried to ignore it so far. The system is technically not harmed by it. > it's great > hearing praise and honors from people who love Debian, but we > can't improve > upon our system when all we hear is what we've done right, > and when the grumpy > ones :D post their opinions elsewhere so the larger Debian > developer base never > sees them. Rest assured that if I ever see Debian make a big technical mistake, I'll be the first to let them know. ;) The "name thing," while it annoys me, isn't really worth bothering Debian about. > Dig? This isn't a flame or a reprimand, it's simply a > suggestion. If you > disagree, that is fine. I'm just looking out for my operating system. I don't disagree, but I believe that, being a purely syntactic problem, the Debian people have better things to do with their time than debate, argue about, and perhaps eventually fix it. I'm sure they wasted enough time (several seconds at least ;) changing the name the first time, since, IIRC, the old Debian distributions were "just Linux." Chris Christopher Smith, Perl Developer Amdocs - Champaign, IL /usr/bin/perl -e ' print((~"\x95\xc4\xe3"^"Just Another Perl Hacker.")."\x08!\n"); '

24 years, 4 months

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Open source -- non computer topics (Debian)

by dquebbeman＠acm.org

> That's the pragma behind it, it's not giving into Stallman's demands and > such, it's just a choice behind the user and developer community that "This > is how we want to present our system as installed by default." They're not > twisting anyone's arm. Never had a problem with Debian, other than its name... it always either parses as "of or having to do with Debbie", or I hear "Denebian" as in "Denebian slime devil". Is it an acronym for something? -dq

24 years, 4 months

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"Toy" computers (was Re: Micro$oft Biz'droid Lusers)

by csmith＠amdocs.com

> -----Original Message----- > From: Douglas H. Quebbeman [mailto:dquebbeman@acm.org] > Yes, Apple did make an external drive, ISTR is was called UniDrive > but that was also what they called the single plastic 5.25inch drives > for the Apple //e, according to Sellam... So I think Apple may have > goofed and used the name twice. However, these were not Superdrives, > IIRC, they didn't support 1.44MB, only 800MB. Wow, and on a 3.5" disk too... :) Chris Christopher Smith, Perl Developer Amdocs - Champaign, IL /usr/bin/perl -e ' print((~"\x95\xc4\xe3"^"Just Another Perl Hacker.")."\x08!\n"); '

24 years, 4 months

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"Toy" computers (was Re: Micro$oft Biz'droid Lusers)

by csmith＠amdocs.com

> -----Original Message----- > From: Ethan Dicks [mailto:erd_6502@yahoo.com] > These days, my personal criteria is "no ethernet == toy" (for > stuff made > after 1990) The iOpener or Audrey as shipped is a toy; add > USB Ethernet > and it graduates to "potentially useful tool". So dual FDDI just isn't good enough for you? :) Chris Christopher Smith, Perl Developer Amdocs - Champaign, IL /usr/bin/perl -e ' print((~"\x95\xc4\xe3"^"Just Another Perl Hacker.")."\x08!\n"); '

24 years, 4 months

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R.I.P. for D.I.Y."

by dquebbeman＠acm.org

> Nowadays You typically have to deal with distributors - little > problem for the experienced, but an obstacle to newcomers Usually, I could just call up the chipmaker/partmaker and ask for a few enegineering samples. When a 10MB Irwin QIC drive stopped working, I probed the adress line on the thing's Z-8 (yes, Z8) processor; there was no change, so I figured it was toast. Called up Zilog (this was 1987), asked for one, got two. Pull bad chip, insert new chip, got working Irwin drive. More recently, though, you have to develop a relationship with a rep from the local distributer (Hamilton-Avnet, Meunier, Graham, etc). WORST CASE was Mitel; I needed parts for a mini-PBX I designed and then never built. I had to buy this guy *two* martini lunches before i got my parts. Still it was a bargain... -dq

24 years, 4 months

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R.I.P. for D.I.Y.

by dquebbeman＠acm.org

> I get a kick out of the fact that he made the electrodes > in the shape of the old atom symbol they used to use in > the advertisements. Does anyone remember the name of the > little cartoon character that the GE advertisements had > for the atom? Hmmm... nope, though I do recall the REMC mascot, "Reddy Kilowatt", with a lightening bolt for a body... -dq

24 years, 4 months

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Open source -- non computer topics (Debian)

by nemesis-lists＠icequake.net

> The entire world has voted. The name is "Linux", not "GNU/Linux". I'm not preaching Stallman. What I said is that the better part of the Debian community has chosen to give GNU credit in the system. You can disagree with it, and that is fine! The world+dog does not have to think Stallman is the icon of open source. Go ahead and edit your /etc/issue if it's that big a deal. At the risk of being a pedant, Debian is not a Linux operating system; it is designed to be a universal operating system, that can use any Unix-like kernel at its core. Debian is being bootstrapped on BSD and Hurd currently. The core of Debian is GNU system utilities and the Debian policy and package system, which is why the kernel name is prefixed by Debian and GNU. Redhat, Mandrake, etc don't bother, because they are Linux systems, and ONLY Linux systems. They will never be anything else, thus "Redhat Linux" and "Mandrake Linux" are fine titles; they indicate what the system aspires to be. That's the pragma behind it, it's not giving into Stallman's demands and such, it's just a choice behind the user and developer community that "This is how we want to present our system as installed by default." They're not twisting anyone's arm. -- Ryan Underwood, <nemesis at icequake.net>, icq=10317253

24 years, 4 months

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Micro$oft Biz'droid Lusers (was: OT email response format)

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

From: Christopher Smith <csmith(a)amdocs.com> >People buy peesees for one of four reasons: > >They favor them -- usually because they've never seen anything else. > >Their friend-who-knows-everything-about-computers likes them (yeah...) > >Everybody else is doing it > >They don't know that anything else exists Reason #5: It's a large market and compatability is handy for many reasons. You don't have to like it but if you have a PC even a slow one it can be very handy. It doesn't mean you must pitch over to microsoftism either as there are enough non- M$ tools that seem to work ok on the base winders. As to buying a PC... why? People are giving away P166s and thats enough to do most anything if a decent disk is installed. I figure if I spend more than the price of a new modest sized disk I've overpaid for my PCs. Of course I don't do the games or heavy graphics that want cpu up the wazzoo or other resources. Allison

24 years, 4 months

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Open source -- non computer topics (Debian)

by nemesis-lists＠icequake.net

> > What you label "garbage" are the very attributes that many > > Debian members > > hold dear. > Probably exactly why I stay away from "the Debian community," > so to speak. That's fine, and it's your choice, but please remember that since you are "staying away from the Debian community", you are using a system that is the product of others' hard work, and not contributing. If you don't wish to assist the project, IMO you shouldn't be shooting flames and labels around when you're dissatisfied with the outcome. That is just my weak and unfounded opinion; but I just feel that instead of venting your disgust on other unrelated mailing lists, these issues would be better brought up to the Debian project itself. That way, we can be aware of views that diverge from the popular "Debian user"'s view, in order to attempt to provide a better system for all. I mean, yeah, it's great hearing praise and honors from people who love Debian, but we can't improve upon our system when all we hear is what we've done right, and when the grumpy ones :D post their opinions elsewhere so the larger Debian developer base never sees them. Dig? This isn't a flame or a reprimand, it's simply a suggestion. If you disagree, that is fine. I'm just looking out for my operating system. -- Ryan Underwood, <nemesis at icequake.net>, icq=10317253

24 years, 4 months

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Micro$oft Biz'droid Lusers (was: OT email response format)

by bob＠copenhagen.cuug.ab.ca

I didn't catch the posting that seems to have started all this, but ignorance never seems to stop anyone *else* from stating an opinion, so here's mine :-) A few years back I spent a little time working for a small company whose primary focus was Unix system software. They did some Windows work, and this was their eventual downfall because they were bought out by McAfee who didn't have a clue what to do with the Unix stuff and weren't interested in finding out. I was the last remaining employee of the original company. For most of the last year of its operation I did pretty much all the system administration, lightweight hardware maintenance, bug fixing, and many of the enhancements to the two Unix products that had been the mainstay of the company. I forget exactly how many machines we had and exactly what they ran, but it was something like: Hardware OS Notes ======== == ===== HP/Apollo 700 HP/UX 9.x HP/Apollo 700 HP/UX 10.01 + 10.10? dual boot DEC Alpha 2000 (?) OSF 1 Motorola Mxxx Motorola Unix v.X forgotten machine Motorola Myyy Motorola Unix v.Y & OS version names SUN Sparc 5 Solaris 2.5.1 SUN SLC Solaris 2.5.1 SUN 3/60 SunOS 4.1.1 IBM RS6000 AIX v.X & v.Y forgotten versions, dual boot Intel SCO Unix Intel Dynix Intel ?nix more memory loss I am missing a couple of machines and maybe one more OS. Before I started with the company I had never even heard of some of these variants. The point of all this is that the same code base built on ALL these things. Sure, we had a "portability" library of our own to make it easier, there was a fair amount of #ifdef stuff, and we had to tinker with GNU autoconf to get the builds smooth, but I could manage ALL of it. We used Emacs and gcc/gdb on all the machines, and a freeware distributed backup package (Amanda) to run complete backups of everything automatically (well, OK, I had to change the tapes manually). Of course, with the network applications that typically come with Unix (telnet, ftp, NFS, X Windows, etc.) I could sit at my own desk and get at every machine conveniently and run a parallel build on all the machines. That would have been completely impossible with the Microsoft (bundled) products available at that time. Now, I've watched people trying to do software development on Windows systems over the years, and I've done a little myself here and there. Every time there is a new service pack or OS release there are wailings and rendings of clothes on all sides. New licenses have to be bought for compilers, new versions of the network backup client have to be purchased, very often a whole new machine has to be bought, the sys admins have to do all sorts of black magic to get the new machines to "play nice" with the old ones on the network, and a whole new set of OS idiosyncracies has to be mastered. I have never observed anything similar in Unix development shops (well, OK, the more organised ones, anyway). Oh, and even *less* upheaval takes place in VMS shops BTW, but VMS has other problems. So: 1. it is perfectly possible to write highly portable software, and once the initial portability setup is done the rest is not particularly hard. 2. there is a great deal of very useful "free" software for Unix out there in net land, much of which you would have to pay big $ for on Windows 3. there is NOT very much "business" software (word processors, spreadsheets, contact management etc.) for Unix because the kind of people who write free software aren't generally very interested in "business" stuff, and the kind of people who write commercial software don't think there is much of a Unix market for it (since they priced themselves out of it a while back). 4. if I were developing software for "back end" applications (servers, networking, etc.) I would certainly do it on Unix in preference to Windows, and in this respect the market mostly agrees with me. By all means use Windows for your office work. That's about all it's good for, and on the whole it does it fairly well. Bob Bramwell Snail: 60 Baker Cr. NW | If I die in war you remember me; ProntoLogical Calgary, AB | If I live in peace you don't. +1 403/861-8827 T2L 1R4, Canada | - Spike Milligan (1919 - 2002)

24 years, 4 months

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.I.P. for D.I.Y.

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

From: Bryan Pope <bpope(a)wordstock.com> >And thusly Allison spake: >> >> From: Andy Holt <andyh(a)andyh-rayleigh.freeserve.co.uk> >> >I'll agree - but perhaps the main reason is that modern components are >> >almost impossible for the home builder ... and only the odd few (Tony? :-) >> >> Impossible? How? >> > >Well, we are kind of spoiled here with the "You-Do-It" Electronics store in >Needham. :) Feh! U-blew-it, home of the high priced spread. However they exist and are handy at times. The ham/electornics fleas are handy as mail/email order outfits. Allison

24 years, 4 months

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ScanPlus Gray 300 scanner - what type of interface?

by Arno_1983＠gmx.de

Hi all, a former teacher of mine dug this feed-through scanner out of his storage for me. It has a slider pot for brightness and a button labeled "Eject", a power light (green) and an error light (yellow), builtin power supply with on/off switch and IEC inlet. Then there's a female Sub-D-25 connector...unlabeled. How does that connect to the computer? Did it need one of those proprietary interface cards? (We found one in another box, but we're not sure whether it is for this one.) Did already about an hour of googling, but no definitive results...Any hints appreciated. Greetings from Germany Arno Kletzander Arno_1983(a)gmx.de -- GMX - Die Kommunikationsplattform im Internet. http://www.gmx.net

24 years, 4 months

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Micro$oft Biz'droid Lusers (was: OT email response format)

by mhstein＠canada.com

>From: Doc <doc(a)mdrconsult.com> > An easy way to spot a Microsoft/Intel patsy is his tendency to present > his own [generally incredibly narrow] viewpoint as immutable fact. > Doc -------- Well, the evidence of this latest waste of time & bandwidth seems to contradict that, since with one possible exception, all the people presenting those truly incredibly narrow viewpoints have been non-MS/Intel users. Despite being called morons, brain-damaged, biz'droid lusers, etc., with intelligence in the gutter, apparently those of us who do manage quite well to do our jobs & accomplish what we need/want using MS OSs & apps on PCs value our time more and respect diversity & other peoples' choices more than to get dragged into this childish & ridiculous name-calling 'discussion'. I for one am quite content to let other people use whatever hardware or software they like, are supplied with, can afford, are comfortable with, whatever, and when there are problems as there inevitably are with any hardware and software, I enjoy the challenge and satisfaction of getting past those problems, not to mention the income it provides. But it's reassuring that there are people out there who'd rather insult their clients/bosses or quit than work with MS/PC stuff; less competition and more opportunities for those of us who actually respect our clients and enjoy helping them and the organizations we work for accomplish their goals. And unlike some people on this list, <snip> Jeez, Dick. I can't believe you dragged me back into this. <snip> we don't all salivate whenever Richard rings his little bell. Hard to remember sometimes that the intelligent majority is silent at times like this (except for me, of course :-) mike

24 years, 4 months

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.I.P. for D.I.Y.

by dwightk.elvey＠amd.com

>From: "Ben Franchuk" <bfranchuk(a)jetnet.ab.ca> ---ship--- >>BTW Nuclear fusion on the small scale in a interesting hobby for the >man who has done everything. >http://www.mathematik.uni-marburg.de/~kronjaeg/hv/fusor/construction/index.… I get a kick out of the fact that he made the electrodes in the shape of the old atom symbol they used to use in the advertisements. Does anyone remember the name of the little cartoon character that the GE advertisements had for the atom? Dwight

24 years, 4 months

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"Toy" computers (was Re: Micro$oft Biz'droid Lusers)

by SUPRDAVE＠aol.com

In a message dated 4/25/2002 12:21:52 PM Central Daylight Time, dquebbeman(a)acm.org writes: > > The floppy port one was called the Hard Disk 20 (Hard Drive 20?? damn, I > > always screw that up). You are right on the SCSI one (20SC). And there is > > a 2nd product that I am aware of Apple made for the floppy port. An > > external 400k floppy drive. They may have made other external floppies > > for the Mac that use the floppy port as well (800k maybe, but I don't > > think they made a 1.44 external) > > > > There were of course other floppy drives made for floppy ports on the > > IIgs, but I don't know if that is the same functionality, so I don't know > > if those could have been used on the Mac. > > I used to own an external 400k drive, sold it about 10 years ago > along with the old 400k internal drive they let me keep when I > had my Fat mac upgraded to a 512Ke. > > Yes, Apple did make an external drive, ISTR is was called UniDrive > but that was also what they called the single plastic 5.25inch drives > for the Apple //e, according to Sellam... So I think Apple may have > goofed and used the name twice. However, these were not Superdrives, > IIRC, they didn't support 1.44MB, only 800MB. > > When I first saw it, the sounds it made were like a little hard > drive, or so it seemd at the time. > > Third-parties also made external drives; I have one such beast, > can't recall the maker, but I think it has both autoeject in > addition to the quite visible and accessible front-panel eject > button. > Apple called their drives Unidisks, at least for the // family. There was also an apple 3.5 drive, but was only for the mac I think. There was some compatibility notes on what drives went with what. I once had an external Laser 800k drive that worked with either the Laser128 or mac.

24 years, 4 months

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"Toy" computers (was Re: Micro$oft Biz'droid Lusers)

by mythtech＠mac.com

>I think there was exactly one product from Apple that plugged into >the floppy port - a 20MB disk that required strange drivers. I >don't recall the part number, but when Apple came out with a 20MB >SCSI disk, they called it the "20SC" or something similar (IIRC) >to distinguish it from the older product. The floppy port one was called the Hard Disk 20 (Hard Drive 20?? damn, I always screw that up). You are right on the SCSI one (20SC). And there is a 2nd product that I am aware of Apple made for the floppy port. An external 400k floppy drive. They may have made other external floppies for the Mac that use the floppy port as well (800k maybe, but I don't think they made a 1.44 external) There were of course other floppy drives made for floppy ports on the IIgs, but I don't know if that is the same functionality, so I don't know if those could have been used on the Mac. -chris <http://www.mythtech.net>

24 years, 4 months

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"Toy" computers (was Re: Micro$oft Biz'droid Lusers)

by mythtech＠mac.com

>You couldnt chain a floppy drive off the HD20 though. You sure? I seem to recall that at one point I had two HD20's chained with a 400k floppy at the end (for 3 devices hanging off the floppy port). This was probably on my Mac Plus, as that is the machine that saw the most use of my HD20's. But I could be remembering wrong (I am at least almost 100% positive that I had two HD20's chained at one point) -chris <http://www.mythtech.net>

24 years, 4 months

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Unix versions

by dquebbeman＠acm.org

> > I guess talking to my self and jerking violently and twitching is ok > > then after 20 years in the biz... > > No IRIX in the mix? IRIX in morning, sysadmins take warning... IRIX at night, hacker's delight. <Shudder> -dq

24 years, 4 months

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open "dumpster" event in New Haven, CT

by DAW＠yalepress3.unipress.yale.edu

For those of you just catching up to this, the stuff has all been either tossed or claimed. -- --- David A Woyciesjes --- C & IS Support Specialist --- Yale University Press --- mailto:david.woyciesjes@yale.edu --- (203) 432-0953 --- ICQ # - 905818 Mac OS X 10.1.2 - Darwin Kernel Version 5.2: Fri Dec 7 21:39:35 PST 2001 Running since 01/22/2002 without a crash > ---------- > From: David Woyciesjes > > This is the whole list. The room has to be emptied _today_, so I can > bring stuff home with me, if you want to get it later in the day. I'll try > to take home any of the smaller unclaimed stuff to store. > Again, everything is in unknown, untested condition; as-is. > Let me know by around 5:00 pm eastern time... > > > ---------- > > From: David Woyciesjes > > > > We're cleaning here, and got some stuff being tossed. > > > > Free, Come pick it up... > > > > 12 old modems - Gandalf LDS125 (?) > > about 12 (?) dozen tape reels. 12" diameter. They're in 4 15" monitor > > boxes... > -1 box is probably taken... > > 2 HP LaserJet IID, with duplex - Taken? > > 1 HP LaserJet IIID, w/ duplex - taken? > > some long comms(?) cables > > Epson line printers > > CSU/DSU > > -- > > > And here's more stuff... > > 2 Topaz Powermaker UPSs > 1, maybe 2 Datability Vista terminal servers > 1, maybe 2 Delnis > Digital DECRepeater 350 > DeskJet 500 > DeskJet Plus > VT220 > VT420 > Radius 21" (?) monchrome monitor > > -- > --- David A Woyciesjes > --- C & IS Support Specialist > --- Yale University Press > --- mailto:david.woyciesjes@yale.edu > --- (203) 432-0953 > --- ICQ # - 905818 > Mac OS X 10.1.2 - Darwin Kernel Version 5.2: Fri Dec 7 21:39:35 PST 2001 > Running since 01/22/2002 without a crash > >

24 years, 4 months

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"Toy" computers (was Re: Micro$oft Biz'droid Lusers)

by DAW＠yalepress3.unipress.yale.edu

> From: Chris > > >I think there was exactly one product from Apple that plugged into > >the floppy port - a 20MB disk that required strange drivers. I > >don't recall the part number, but when Apple came out with a 20MB > >SCSI disk, they called it the "20SC" or something similar (IIRC) > >to distinguish it from the older product. > > The floppy port one was called the Hard Disk 20 (Hard Drive 20?? damn, I > always screw that up). You are right on the SCSI one (20SC). And there is > a 2nd product that I am aware of Apple made for the floppy port. An > external 400k floppy drive. They may have made other external floppies > for the Mac that use the floppy port as well (800k maybe, but I don't > think they made a 1.44 external) > > There were of course other floppy drives made for floppy ports on the > IIgs, but I don't know if that is the same functionality, so I don't know > if those could have been used on the Mac. > > -chris > > <http://www.mythtech.net> > This reminds me... I have here an Applied Engineering AEHD 3.5" External disk drive for Apple Computers. But the machine it's from is long gone. Who wants it? Say, $20 for me to pack it and ship it out. -- --- David A Woyciesjes --- C & IS Support Specialist --- Yale University Press --- mailto:david.woyciesjes@yale.edu --- (203) 432-0953 --- ICQ # - 905818 Mac OS X 10.1.2 - Darwin Kernel Version 5.2: Fri Dec 7 21:39:35 PST 2001 Running since 01/22/2002 without a crash

24 years, 4 months

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"Toy" computers (was Re: Micro$oft Biz'droid Lusers)

by SUPRDAVE＠aol.com

In a message dated 4/25/2002 10:46:00 AM Central Daylight Time, mythtech(a)mac.com writes: > >I think there was exactly one product from Apple that plugged into > >the floppy port - a 20MB disk that required strange drivers. I > >don't recall the part number, but when Apple came out with a 20MB > >SCSI disk, they called it the "20SC" or something similar (IIRC) > >to distinguish it from the older product. > > The floppy port one was called the Hard Disk 20 (Hard Drive 20?? damn, I > always screw that up). You are right on the SCSI one (20SC). And there is > a 2nd product that I am aware of Apple made for the floppy port. An > external 400k floppy drive. They may have made other external floppies > for the Mac that use the floppy port as well (800k maybe, but I don't > think they made a 1.44 external) > > There were of course other floppy drives made for floppy ports on the > IIgs, but I don't know if that is the same functionality, so I don't know > if those could have been used on the Mac. > > The hard drive was called an HD20. I have a mac 512k that uses it. About a fast as a floppy drive, but at least it held 20megs worth. You couldnt chain a floppy drive off the HD20 though.

24 years, 4 months

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UNIX versions

by root＠diablonet.net

Douglas H. Quebbeman said: > > IRIX in morning, sysadmins take warning... > IRIX at night, hacker's delight. Hey, I actually like IRIX quite a bit! :) Granted, if I wanted to run an Internet server, I would probably reach for one of my Sun slabs running NetBSD, but my desktop UNIX workstation sitting next to me here is an Indigo2! I love SGI hardware -- I have a ton of Indy, Indigo, and Indigo2 systems that I run as UNIX workstations around the house, and I have not yet found a window manager that I prefer over 4Dwm. All my SGI machines are superbly reliable, although security can get to be a concern sometimes. 16 CDs? That seems really strange -- I tend to throw almost the entire system on my machines (drive space willing) and it takes maybe six or seven for 6.5.0... Kind regards, Sean Caron -- Sean Caron http://www.diablonet.net scaron(a)engin.umich.edu root(a)diablonet.net

24 years, 4 months

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Anyone Care About RT-11

by jhfinepw4z＠compsys.to

I will shortly be making some copies of the CD images from: ftp://ftp.trailing-edge.com/pub/cd-images/ that I have downloaded and wish to offload from my hard disk drive. I have verified each of the 2 RSX-11 and the 1 RT-11 images against the MD5 values in the file MD5SUMS and they are the same. In addition, after I copy the image on my hard drive to the CD, I will verify them against their respective images in their hard drive files. To do so, I will be using RT-11 and BINCOM (with some of my own modifications which allows me to also verify block 65535 at the end of each RT-11 partition). Since there are a maximum of 20 RT-11 partitions on each CD and each BINCOM run takes me less than 30 seconds, the whole comparison can be done in less than 10 minutes - which will probably be about the length of time it takes to make the CD copy in the first place. Since there might be a number of individuals who can't download at a reasonable speed (even with DSL it takes about 12 hours each at about 30 KBytes per second as compared with about 3 KBytes per second on a dial up line), I am prepared to make additional copies (Tim Shoppa no longer seems to have the time to do so) and make them available at my cost of about $ US 1.50 (for media, label, envelope and shipping carton - the media portion is less than half of that total) plus postage. By the way, for myself, I would VERY much appreciate being in touch with all individuals who have a copy of the RT-11 Freeware CD V2.0 so that we might exchange information about RT-11. Tim Shoppa felt that he might be violating privacy concerns if he made the names, of those who ordered the CD, available. I don't see it that way, so if you want your name to be known along with the other individuals (or not as the case may be - i.e. restrict that you have a copy of the RT-11 CD to ONLY specified individuals such as possibly just myself) so that you can receive interesting information about new developments in RT-11 and the status of the operating system, then PLEASE contact me so that we can share information. Also state if you want to be known to the entire group of just to specified individuals. PLUS, as for TSX-PLUS, I am going to try again to knock at the door of S&H to see what they may consider for hobby users. Sincerely yours, Jerome Fine -- If you attempted to send a reply and the original e-mail address has been discontinued due a high volume of junk e-mail, then the semi-permanent e-mail address can be obtained by replacing the four characters preceding the 'at' with the four digits of the current year.

24 years, 4 months

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"Toy" computers (was Re: Micro$oft Biz'droid Lusers)

by csmith＠amdocs.com

> -----Original Message----- > From: Ethan Dicks [mailto:erd_6502@yahoo.com] > I think there was exactly one product from Apple that plugged into > the floppy port - a 20MB disk that required strange drivers. I > don't recall the part number, but when Apple came out with a 20MB > SCSI disk, they called it the "20SC" or something similar (IIRC) > to distinguish it from the older product. I used to have an Apple disk that plugged into the floppy port. 20M as you say, but it booted directly, so it must not have been too "strange." > That having been said, I would question how much Apple "discouraged" > people from using the SCSI port on the Mac Plus. There may have > been an alternative and Apple may have pushed it over third-party > disks, but once the stock of strange disks ran out, presuming > the Mac Plus was still being made, I doubt Apple would continue > to urge people to ignore the SCSI port. So you're saying they probably wanted people to use their disk over what SCSI disks were available? It wouldn't surprise me. Chris Christopher Smith, Perl Developer Amdocs - Champaign, IL /usr/bin/perl -e ' print((~"\x95\xc4\xe3"^"Just Another Perl Hacker.")."\x08!\n"); '

24 years, 4 months

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Micro$oft Biz'droid Lusers (was: OT email response format)

by csmith＠amdocs.com

> -----Original Message----- > From: Chris [mailto:mythtech@mac.com] > I know I never increased my drinking, smoking, cursing and profuse > consumption of potato chips, coffee, or cola because of > playing games on > an Apple II. Nor did I, though, I already consumed more than enough potato chips and cola. Chris Christopher Smith, Perl Developer Amdocs - Champaign, IL /usr/bin/perl -e ' print((~"\x95\xc4\xe3"^"Just Another Perl Hacker.")."\x08!\n"); '

24 years, 4 months

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"Toy" computers (was Re: Micro$oft Biz'droid Lusers)

by csmith＠amdocs.com

> -----Original Message----- > From: Fred Cisin (XenoSoft) [mailto:cisin@xenosoft.com] > > > constitutes a "toy", even in the most general of terms. > > I'd say anything that runs windows primarily. *duck* > To be defined as a "TOY", doesn't it have to be FUN? You have a point, but just because it isn't _my_ idea of fun to watch an hourglass cursor spin, set through a boring install procedure every couple of weeks to coax the machine into performing better, all the while spending more money on hardware and software "necessities" that fix bugs in the system the should have never appeared, and worrying about my email client transferring "viri" around... Well, that doesn't mean that it's not somebody else's idea of fun. It obviously must be; just look at the healthy user base they've got. Chris Christopher Smith, Perl Developer Amdocs - Champaign, IL /usr/bin/perl -e ' print((~"\x95\xc4\xe3"^"Just Another Perl Hacker.")."\x08!\n"); '

24 years, 4 months

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DEC3000 Model 500

by csmith＠amdocs.com

> -----Original Message----- > From: Truthan,Larry [mailto:truthanl@oclc.org] > What is a Dec 3000 model 500? Has a cd rom. and a SCSI port > out the back. > Looks Like an Alpha Processor system. What OS? Peanut 2.2? on > handwritten CD. Well, VMS, of course. :) It will also run those other OS's ;) (The OS Formerly Known As OSF/1, NetBSD, that kind of thing...) Chris Christopher Smith, Perl Developer Amdocs - Champaign, IL /usr/bin/perl -e ' print((~"\x95\xc4\xe3"^"Just Another Perl Hacker.")."\x08!\n"); '

24 years, 4 months

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R.I.P. for D.I.Y."

by dquebbeman＠acm.org

> At 09:50 PM 4/24/02 -0400, Doug asked: > > > > > > >Where will I buy water wetter? > > E-bay. > > >Where will I buy Nitonol wire? > > E-bay. > > >Where will I buy flock paper? > > E-bay. > > >Where will I buy cheap assortment of lab glassware? > > E-bay. > > >Where will I buy an ultrasonic cleaner? > > E-bay. > > >Where will I buy a good Chinese microscope? > > > E-bay. > > > >and so on... > > Take a guess! Joe- I am not rich enough to be able to take E-Bay into the bathroom with me... Having an Edmund catalog kept me >from having to resort to National Geographic... ;) -Douglas Hurst Quebbeman (DougQ at ixnayamspayIgLou.com) [Call me "Doug"] Surgically excise the pig-latin from my e-mail address in order to reply "The large print giveth, and the small print taketh away." -Tom Waits

24 years, 4 months

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new server status and RFC on problem tracking database for al l classic OS's

by alan.pearson＠cramer.com

GNATS is a pretty good bug tracking system (we use it here), easy to search etc too. What would be really useful IMHO is a means to sort the classiccmp archives, since a great many "FAQs" are answered there somewhere... finding the answer isn't that easy though :-) Googling for whatever I'm looking for and including "classiccmp" in the search list is the best I've come up with so far, anyone found a better way? BTW if nobody's working on a searchable archive I'd be happy to take the work on? Cheers Al.

24 years, 4 months

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FREE STUFF! (Well almost)

by rigdonj＠cfl.rr.com

I spotted this in the CPM news-group. It looks like a good deal for somebody. From: Gerald Pine <gdpine(a)pacbell.net> X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.77 [en] (Win95; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 Newsgroups: comp.os.cpm Subject: Liquidating collection of CPM (and some other) machines Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 59 NNTP-Posting-Host: 32.101.253.40 X-Complaints-To: abuse(a)prodigy.net X-Trace: newssvr13.news.prodigy.com 1019533029 ST000 32.101.253.40 (Mon, 22 Apr 2002 23:37:09 EDT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 23:37:09 EDT Organization: Prodigy Internet http://www.prodigy.com X-UserInfo1: [[PAPDCAOXW[B^LX@JJDM^P@VZ\LPCXLLBWLOOAFQATJUZ]CDVW[AKK[J\]^HVKHG^EWZHBLO^[\NH_AZFWGN^\DHNVMX_DHHX[FSQKBOTS@@BP^]C@RHS_AGDDC[AJM_T[GZNRNZAY]GNCPBDYKOLK^_CZFWPGHZIXW@C[AFKBBQS@E@DAZ]VDFUNTQQ]FN Date: Tue, 23 Apr 2002 03:37:09 GMT Xref: cyclone.tampabay.rr.com comp.os.cpm:20184 Hello, I have sold cpm machines from my collection to several of you in the past. I am finally running out of time to disperse my collection of machines before my house is officially sold to its new owners. The machines are in La Grange, Illinois, a southwest suburb of Chicago. My wife is going to include whatever is not left in a garage sale that she is holding next Saturday (the 27th or whatever date is a Saturday about then--no calendar in front of me). If someone can pick up the machines before then, or have a friend pick them up, they can be had for a VERY attractive price. In fact, we'll let you name what you think is reasonable. The more you take, the cheaper the better we'll like it. I don't want to dumpster these if I can avoid it, and I doubt that the local thrift store will be interested in them. Among what I have are: Multiple Osborne I's --at least one I know is working. Some have developed glitches sitting around for the last few years, and I think that they could easily be made to work, but no guarantees. I do have at least boot disks for most, but you might have to sort through some diskettes to pick them out. Take them all and your job is easier. Multiple Xerox 820-II's: 1 dual 8-inch floppy, 8-inch hard drive; 1 dual 8-inch floppy. 1 dual 5 1/4 inch floppy; some home made 8-inch drive cabinets. Have software (much) for these, and even have one pretty complete set of manuals and original diskettes, including a technical manual, CPM and operating manuals of various types, and MS-DOS manual, a CPM-86 manual, a graphics manual, wordstar, and probably some that I'm not remembering. I'd like to get a few bucks for the manuals especially. A Sanyo MBC-1000(?) not sure of the number, but it is a single floppy drive Z80 machine with boot disks and some software that I've transferred. Almost new condition. An Altos 580 and an Altos 8000: The 580 is in fine working condition with CPM and MPM system disks and some software for CPM that I've transferred from other formats. The 8000 needs a new power supply. A Mac LC-II. Machine was working, but keyboard stopped responding except for click noise. Haven't had time to diagnose it. A Data General 1 portable MS-DOS machine (8086 or 8088, not sure which). Works and comes with expansion docking station and external 5 1/4 inch drive. No software for docking station, unfortunately. A Vic 20 with lots of goodies. A TI-99. Not sure what;s with it. A Columbia PC, PC compatible luggable, similar to Compaq original portables. A IBM XT with hard drive and CGA monitor. 4 Televideo terminals, 3 925's and a 950. Also one copy each of service manuals and several operating manuals. A Sperry terminal. An Apple IIc with color and monochrome monitors and lots of software. Wordstar 4 for CPM and for MS-DOS in original boxes. SuperCalcII for Osborne. Lots more software, getting too tired to list. Send me your email address and I'll give you details about where it is and how to arrange to see it. Please help me to keep from dumpstering this. Unfortunately, I don't have the time to pack and ship it, so local pickups only. Gerald Pine

24 years, 4 months

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Micro$oft Biz'droid Lusers (was: OT email response format)

by alan.pearson＠cramer.com

> Date: Tue, 23 Apr 2002 18:35:26 -0400 > From: Roger Merchberger <zmerch(a)30below.com> > : > [no room on the puny 6G HD for Linux, tho... it's fully Linux certified as > well...] LOL, you're kidding, right? :-) If not, contact me off list and I'll be more than happy to forward instructions for installing a very useful Linux setup onto an even punier 420Mb hard disk! Cheers, Al.

24 years, 4 months

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new server status and RFC on problem tracking database for al l classic OS's

by GOOI＠oce.nl

> Thanks a MILLION to all who have donated parts and/or money > so far to get a separate dedicated classiccmp server. > ... > Decisions decisions.... if anyone still wants to donate to > the cause, my paypal id is jwest(a)classiccmp.org Ok, I will truncate the last digits in my account for you. - Henk.

24 years, 4 months

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Anyone Care About RT-11

by GOOI＠oce.nl

> >Ethan Dicks wrote: > > > > By the way, for myself, I would VERY much appreciate > > > being in touch with all individuals who have a copy of the > > > RT-11 Freeware CD V2.0 so that we might exchange > > > information about RT-11. Tim Shoppa felt that he might > > > be violating privacy concerns if he made the names, of those > > > who ordered the CD, available. > > I can appreciate Tim's discretion, but I don't mind it being known > > that I ordered a copy from him. > > Jerome Fine replies: > > Is that OK just for myself or among others who are like minded? > If the latter, then RT-11 announcements will be sent to all 4 or 5 > of you at the same time - makes it easier. I think Tim said he sold > about 40 of the RT-11 Freeware CD, so many more names to go. I did also buy a copy of RT-11 (1 CD) and RSX11-M (2 CD's) from Tim. - Henk.

24 years, 4 months

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Micro$oft Biz'droid Lusers (was: OT email response format)

by mtapley＠swri.edu

On April 21, Richard Erlacher wrote: >BTW, when the NEXT boxes first came out, we had a few of them sitting around >for people to look at and play with. I personally was not impressed. They >were EXTREMELY low on gigaflops per picobuck and, aside from the OS, I don't >remember any applications that didn't have the same look and feel as a small >mono-MAC costing ~1/10 as much. Finally gored my ox - but it's on-topic! Yee-hah. Nice things created on NeXT systems: * the WWW (or rather the html protocol underlying it) by Tim Berners Lee (sic?). * Mathematica - though probably is not useful to the work you do, it's indispensable to some of mine. * Zilla, the fore-runner of most of the distributed-computing, grid-computing, commodity CPU projects buzzwording around today. Distributed as an example application on NeXT 3.3 and used to crack several outstanding mathematical compute-intensive problems. * Attached sound and graphics files in email. Hmm, maybe this is not good. Basically, a lot of the computing technologies you now rely on first appeared on NeXT systems. They may not have impressed you then, but they should now. You are right about the Flops rating - that was only a bit higher than Macs/PC's and well behind Sparc's, Alphas, etc. But Flops/dollar is not the best metric of a general-purpose computer. If you think it is, buy yourself a used (Sony) PS/2 and we'll all be happier. For many kinds of work, developer time to a working solution is the dominant metric, and NeXT was very near the good end of that scale. >The problem with these machines, as borne out by the market, is that they >weren't what the home user wanted. Quite right - the home user wanted applications, rather than the ability to develop applications, and the corporate user wanted Flops - which meant Suns and Alphas. There were not enough developers to float the market for the hardware. But note, the NeXT company did *not* fail - it successfully moved its software to Sun, PA-Risc, and x86 platforms, where it maintained a serious business niche until it eventually was bought out by a higher volume hardware player - Apple. The same software is now the second-best-selling (? am I right in claiming this?) OS on the planet. There's a NeXT on my desk at work right now, running Mathematica and perl tasks, websurfing, backing up my portable .... its utility (to me) exceeds that of any Windows machine I've seen. Count me in with James Rice - if you see a working NeXT of any sort under $20 or so, and *particularly* if you see a cube hooked up to a color display, I'd take it most kindly if you'd notify me, or at least someone on the list. It ain't junk to everyone. Best contact for me is at the above email address. - Mark

24 years, 4 months

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"Toy" computers (was Re: Micro$oft Biz'droid Lusers)

by mythtech＠mac.com

>> > An easy way to spot a product intended for the toy market as opposed to >> > one intended to be seen as a computer, is that the disk drive interface >> > is external. >I would propose that the label "toy" might be suitable for machines that >have external disk controllers _and_ an external network interface Woah... my PS/2 is a 'real' computer? It has internal storage (built in DVD drive, and 2 user upgradable RAM slots), AND has built in network interfaces (2 USB ports on the front which can be used for connecting 2 PS/2's together, and a proprietary expansion slot on the back for the recently released network/modem connector for connecting your PS/2 to the internet.. which I would classify as built in, since it connects to the single body unit, and was intended pretty much for this network box, and really is more of an optional part). Glad to know I didn't spend $300 on a toy. Oh... and the GameBoy is a real computer to. It has built in storage (game card slot), and built in networking (head to head port). I could probably go on with more examples... I could even narrow it down to ones that have built in floppy drives (to fade off the non "disk" drive concept, although I think claiming to need a floppy drive excludes an awful lot of other legit storage mediums, like all those systems that only use tape). There is a V-Tech kids learning "computer" that comes to mind that used 3.5" floppies (although, it might have lacked the required network port, but I think it had a serial port, but probably didn't support a "network" protocol). -chris <http://www.mythtech.net>

24 years, 4 months

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Apple-1 Auction conclusion

by vcf＠siconic.com

In case anyone is interested, the Apple-1 sold for $14,000, right at the reserve price. A low number by my estimation, but respectable considering the overall circumstances. :) -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com *

24 years, 4 months

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Micro$oft Biz'droid Lusers (was: OT email response format)

by mythtech＠mac.com

>The same software is now the >second-best-selling (? am I right in claiming this?) OS on the planet. Actually, recent reports say that more copies of OS X are selling off the retail shelves than Win XP... so looking at best *SELLING* OS, one might argue it is the #1 best seller. (of course, XP beats it out by a long shot when looking at most copies moved when included in bundles with the computer... but again, one could argue it is the computer you are buying then, and not the OS) -chris <http://www.mythtech.net>

24 years, 4 months

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Micro$oft Biz'droid Lusers (was: OT email response format)

by mythtech＠mac.com

>In the early days, 1980 and earlier, people got their low-end computers, e.g. >Commodore Pet, TRS-80, minimally equipped APPLE, etc, into the house under >the >guise of being able to do useful works with respect to the household ... >generically referred to as "balancing the checkbook" but not limited to that. >They were seldom used for that. They were tools for self-amusement/abuse, >often leading to increased drinking, smoking, cursing, and profuse >consumption >of potato chips, coffee, cola, or whatever. Um... do you per chance believe Apple is a satanic company because of 'Darwin'? I know I never increased my drinking, smoking, cursing and profuse consumption of potato chips, coffee, or cola because of playing games on an Apple II. I did however increase my use of "Whatever", but I blame that on the 70's. And I didn't start the self abuse for another few years.... hey, I was only 7... how young should I have started?!? -chris <http://www.mythtech.net>

24 years, 4 months

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anyone with an old national memory databook ?

by uban＠ubanproductions.com

I am looking for info on a National Semi 4916944-2 memory IC in a 16-pin 0.3" DIP package. I am assuming that it is some variant of the 4164, but am not sure. --tnx --tom

24 years, 4 months

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Specifications Sought for 7-Track Tape Heads

by aek＠spies.com

> I'm seeking a source for the specifications for 7-track tape > heads. I'm thinking what I really need is just the mechanical/ > physical specifications... that leads me to the second part.. OK, a quick session with my calipers confirmed the spacing is the same as 7 track instrumentation recorder heads (which are weird two stack things with every other track on a separate head) http://jcs.mil/RCC/files/xappxd.pdf for details. >from that spec: track width .050" +/- .005 track spacing .070" track tolerance +/- .002 track number 1 (reference) .000 2 .070 3 .140 4 .210 5 .280 6 .350 7 .420

24 years, 4 months

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new server status and RFC on problem tracking database for all classic OS's

by mhstein＠canada.com

EXCELLENT IDEA!!!! Maybe with time there could be systems for classic hardware, languages & applications as well. I've just about had it with the increasingly inane signal/noise ratio here and would very much welcome a place to just find or be a resource when I don't have the time or inclination to be amused or irritated. My C$0.02 worth. mike ---------------Original Message------------ Date: Wed, 24 Apr 2002 10:53:13 -0500 From: "Jay West" <jwest(a)classiccmp.org> Subject: new server status and RFC on problem tracking database for all classic OS's I would like to put up a problem tracking system for all classic OS's. This would be off the classiccmp.org website, where anyone could put in a problem they have run into

24 years, 4 months

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Quadram drivers?

by rigdonj＠cfl.rr.com

I'm working on restoring an old 64k IBM PC and I'm putting a Quadram card in it but my driver files are corrupted. Can someone send me a copy of the files? Thanks, Joe

24 years, 4 months

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Unix versions

by pete＠dunnington.u-net.com

On Apr 24, 13:13, Bill Pechter wrote: > A yes... That explains my current state of mental health: > > Alliant Concentrix (4.2 BSD) > Coherent (v3, v4) > Concurrent/Perkin-Elmer OS/32 > Concurrent Xelos > Concurrent RTU > DEC RT11 > DEC Vax/VMS (v2.x, 3.x, 4.x) OpenVMS 7.1 > FreeBSD (v1.x, 2.x, 3,x, 4.x) > HP-UX (v9.x) > IBM AIX RS6000 (v3.2,4.1.x) > Linux (Red Hat, Mandrake, Caldera, Slackware, SLS, Suse) > SCO/Caldera Open Desktop/Server, SCO/Caldera Unixware 2.x, Xenix86) > SunOS4.x > Solaris2.x,7,8 > Pyramid OS/X > Pyramid DC/OSx > Unix System III (UnipLUS > Unix System V (Release 0,2,3,4) Mine is approximately BSD 2.11 BSD 4.3 Vax/VMS 5.something RT-11 RSX-11M RISC OS (Acorn, not MIPS RISCOS) Acorn MOS CP/M 2.2 NeXTStep 3.3, OpenStep 4.2(?) Solaris 2.3, Solaris 7 Linux (Slackware, RedHat) IRIX (5.3, 6.5) Windows NT (OK, I know, but it's only used to decode or print Word docs) Those are the ones I've used recently. If you want to count the others here, there's AIX, other Windows, OS/8, 7th Edition Unix, XXDP, and too many more to remember. -- Pete Peter Turnbull Network Manager University of York

24 years, 4 months

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ISO a mid-70's Cipher tension-arm tape drive

by aek＠spies.com

Thanks to a pointer from Doug Q. I now have a brand new Cipher 7 track head assembly. I had thought this was just going to be the head, but it is the whole tape path, with a date code of Jan, 1976. Does anyone have a mid-70's Cipher 9 track that I could get to attach this to? My original thought was to put what I thought was just the head onto a 9 track transport, but since this is already aligned, it would be MUCH better to put it onto the drive it was designed for. I will be on the road for the next few weeks, so if you have one and are near SLC, Denver, St Louis, Dayton, Chicago, or Buffalo, I could pick it up.

24 years, 4 months

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"R.I.P. for D.I.Y."

by marvin＠rain.org

I got this URL for an article in Scientific American that seems appropriate for this group :). The last paragraph reads: "Evidently, the something-for-everyone model epitomized by Heathkit and the Amateur Scientist column can't compete anymore. Specialized sources and Internet newsgroups cater to each skill level. But much of the mentoring and serendipity that the diverse community of amateurs offered has been lost. It is hard not to regret its passing." http://www.sciam.com/2002/0502issue/0502scicit4.html

24 years, 4 months

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suggestions on BBC Micro, voltage converter, PAL monitor (in US)?

by acme_ent＠bellsouth.net

> From: Derek Peschel <dpeschel(a)eskimo.com> > It has been my mission for some time to bring a BBC Micro back from > England. I would need some way to adapt British plugs to US sockets > and convert the voltage Why not just make a PS to fit? > and I would also need a PAL monitor. PAL to NTSC converters are available for < US$100. Please reply off-list if you need pointers. I fixed a friend up with one and the results were excellent. > Yes, I could bring a montior back from > England along with the computer. I'm not sure if I want to do that. Absolutely not recommended due to the chance of damage en route. Glen 0/0

24 years, 4 months

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DEC3000 Model 500

by truthanl＠oclc.org

What is a Dec 3000 model 500? Has a cd rom. and a SCSI port out the back. Looks Like an Alpha Processor system. What OS? Peanut 2.2? on handwritten CD. I am a digest subscriber. Sincerely Larry Truthan

24 years, 4 months

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Unix versions

by csmith＠amdocs.com

> -----Original Message----- > From: Dan Wright [mailto:dtwright@uiuc.edu] > Heheh. I run a bunch of IRIX machines used for scientific > computing :) It's > really not so bad, if you ignore the more horrifying examples of > brain-deadness (what? 16 CDs for an OS install?!...) One of the great mysteries of the universe is the ability of windows <insert some version number here> to take up more space than IRIX once installed, but only fit on one disk. ;) Chris Christopher Smith, Perl Developer Amdocs - Champaign, IL /usr/bin/perl -e ' print((~"\x95\xc4\xe3"^"Just Another Perl Hacker.")."\x08!\n"); '

24 years, 4 months

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Cheap tools (was: Micro$oft Biz'droid Lusers)

by dwightk.elvey＠amd.com

>From: "Hans Franke" <Hans.Franke(a)mch20.sbs.de> > > >Now, a real neat example did come to my mind: Isn't MS like >one of these 500 parts for 49.95 tool boxes at K/Wall-Mart ? >You realy get the oddest bits you ever seen and a good selection >of tools - tools where each single one costs you 20 bucks if >you buy them at a tool store. Now, would a serious craftsman >ever buy and use this 49.95 tool box ? No. He'll rather spend >ten times the money on a tenth of the tools to buy exactly the >quality he needs for his job. > Hi Having made the mistake of buying the $49.99 tools in the past, I can tell you that you should have bought the $250.00 set from a good source. The sockets split open, the Philips screwdriver points rounded and damaged the screws and the ratchet busted without even using a cheater. It had a life time guarantee. I found the replacements just as useless. Worse still, the plating from one of the replacement sockets peeled up and slashed my hand. It is better to have tools that don't break or damage your hardware than to have guaranteed junk. Dwight

24 years, 4 months

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Looking for MicroVAX 3100 model 20E comm parts

by msspcva＠yahoo.com

Hello all: I've got a problem finding some parts and I'm hoping someone on this list can help me out. I'm looking for a DSH32-YA second synchronous serial card option P/N 54-17230-01, and especially it's cable P/N 17-02298-01. These go with a DSH32-BA combo controller module for the MicroVAX 3100 Model 20E systems from DEC. Please email or call me at the number below if you've got the -YA module and the cable, or just the cable. Thanks, Frank Helvey ===== = M O N T V A L E S O F T W A R E S E R V I C E S P. C.= Clayton Frank Helvey, President Montvale Software Services, P. C. P.O. Box 840 Blue Ridge, VA 24064-0840 Phone: 540.947.5364 Email: msspcva(a)yahoo.com ============================================================ __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Games - play chess, backgammon, pool and more http://games.yahoo.com/

24 years, 4 months

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Micro$oft Biz'droid Lusers (was: OT email response format

by dquebbeman＠acm.org

> It was thus said that the Great Douglas H. Quebbeman once stated: > > > > The interesting thing is that so much of Letwin's book contradicts > > a magazine article by IBM's Ed Iaccabucci, where Ed described > > a dynamic linking mechanism that worked exactly like the one in > > Multics. So at one point, *early* on, there were divergent path > > of development for OS/2, that ended up coalescing into one, the > > wrong one... > > Would you happen to remember the magazine and when? It was around 1987, and it was one of those controlled- circulation magazines, many of which are excellent and not mere advertising rags... "Mini-Micro Systems" may have been it... whatever it was, it underwent a name change while I was subscribed, and I have been searching for the article since about 1990. I've thought about asking Ed personally, but he's a corporate big-wig now, possibly succumbed to PHB disease, and so on... The article galvanized me into buying OS/2 1.0 (Zenith version). I was *very* disappointed when I got the docs on programming the system, and discovered I'd once again suffered from bait-and-switch... -dq

24 years, 4 months

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Micro$oft Biz'droid Lusers (was: OT email response format)

by SUPRDAVE＠aol.com

In a message dated 4/24/2002 2:52:50 PM Central Daylight Time, erd_6502(a)yahoo.com writes: > Right... remember "OS/2 for the PS/2 - half an OS for half a computer"? > > -ethan > > > ah, but those of us who use both know that that couldnt be further from the truth.

24 years, 4 months

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linux in 6gb

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

From: Christopher Smith <csmith(a)amdocs.com> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Douglas H. Quebbeman [mailto:dquebbeman@acm.org] > > >"Enhanced" MINIX FS -- I actually got a copy of FIPS, and broke the >disk into two partitions. The linux part was slightly larger than >10M, with five for swap. My first pass was Minix2.0 {very fast on a 386/16 with 5mb) and used that to download Linux. The first linix install frm CD was on a 8mb 486slc/25 with an 80mb IDE disk. The current Linux toy is 486/133 with 16mb and a 2.1mb disk from the Caldara Openlinux 2.3 CD. Most of the bells and toys are installed and it's big but useful. A bare bones install still fits on a small disk with useful room if you forget all the packages and Xserver. Allison

24 years, 4 months

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anyone with an old national memory databook ?

by dwightk.elvey＠amd.com

>From: "Tom Uban" <uban(a)ubanproductions.com> > >I am looking for info on a National Semi 4916944-2 memory IC in >a 16-pin 0.3" DIP package. I am assuming that it is some variant >of the 4164, but am not sure. > >--tnx >--tom > > Hi Tom This is most likely a OEM number. What machine did it come out of? It looks like it might be a HP number or something. A lot of places have their own part numbering system that several manufactures will make labled parts for them. You may need to check what parts were listed for that application. Of course, if the power lines are correct, you can always try the part you think it is. Dwight

24 years, 4 months

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Micro$oft Biz'droid Lusers (was: OT email response format)

by dquebbeman＠acm.org

> On Tue, 23 Apr 2002, Fred Cisin (XenoSoft) wrote: > > On Tue, 23 Apr 2002, Richard Erlacher wrote: > > > > > > > such as when Bill Gates said, "The 80286 is brain-dead." ? > > > > > > Did he really say that? I can't imagine what he'd have meant. Perhaps he was > > > mad at the Intel folks. > > > > Yes, he did. > > Also, Gordon Letwin (author of OS/2 at Microsoft) compared mode > > switching of the 286 to having to shut off your engine to change gears > > on the freeway. > > Interesting you bring up Gordon Letwin...I picked up a copy of his book > _Inside OS/2_ last Friday at the annual library book sale. I haven't > started to read it yet, so I hope it was worth the $1 it cost me. OS/2 is/was a nice OS, but it embraced some architectural flaws that persist in Windows and are part of of makes Windows a sucky operating system. Gordon is obviously very proud of his many pronoucements in the book, such as his belief that GPF indicates a program bug and your program must therefore be terminated. GPF is just a fault condition, and can be programmically used to implement OS features. What OS/2 and Windows call dynamic linking isn't dynamic linking at all, for example. The interesting thing is that so much of Letwin's book contradicts a magazine article by IBM's Ed Iaccabucci, where Ed described a dynamic linking mechanism that worked exactly like the one in Multics. So at one point, *early* on, there were divergent path of development for OS/2, that ended up coalescing into one, the wrong one... -Douglas Hurst Quebbeman (DougQ at ixnayamspayIgLou.com) [Call me "Doug"] Surgically excise the pig-latin from my e-mail address in order to reply "The large print giveth, and the small print taketh away." -Tom Waits

24 years, 4 months

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linux in 6gb

by csmith＠amdocs.com

> -----Original Message----- > From: Douglas H. Quebbeman [mailto:dquebbeman@acm.org] > My first Linux box was a 40MHz 386-DX (AMD) with 4MB of RAM and a Mine was a 16Mhz 386SX, with 3MB of RAM. (One SIMM, and a strange XMS ISA card from a slightly older system. :) > pair of 40MB Seagate ST-251s... downloaded a piece at a time from Single 40MB IDE disk. > the UNC sunsite onto floppies and installed from them I used the Softlanding from a local BBS... ;) > UMDOS filesystem, since the machine normally booted into DOS 5; "Enhanced" MINIX FS -- I actually got a copy of FIPS, and broke the disk into two partitions. The linux part was slightly larger than 10M, with five for swap. > I used LOADLIN to load Linux (still do on my workstation at home). Used LILO. > My first kernel build took 27 hours. After a series of builds, > I think I got the total build time down to about 16 hours. I don't remember, actually, I used to start them running, and just leave them. Never build a kernel on that machine, though. Chris Christopher Smith, Perl Developer Amdocs - Champaign, IL /usr/bin/perl -e ' print((~"\x95\xc4\xe3"^"Just Another Perl Hacker.")."\x08!\n"); '

24 years, 4 months

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linux in 6gb

by dquebbeman＠acm.org

> > From: Pat Finnegan [mailto:pat@purdueriots.com] > > > For a more suitable install, I can easily install everything I really use > > (between X windows and a few apps, gaim for IM, kernel source so I can > > recompile my kernel, gcc and related stuff) in 1G or less of space. > > I'll go with the "or less." I have personally put Linux, X11, GCC, a few > apps, etc, along with a swap file (that worked very slowly) on 60MB of a > 95MB zip disk. My first Linux box was a 40MHz 386-DX (AMD) with 4MB of RAM and a pair of 40MB Seagate ST-251s... downloaded a piece at a time from the UNC sunsite onto floppies and installed from them I used the UMDOS filesystem, since the machine normally booted into DOS 5; I used LOADLIN to load Linux (still do on my workstation at home). My first kernel build took 27 hours. After a series of builds, I think I got the total build time down to about 16 hours. Eventually, I copied that system to a single 120MB Seagate IDE drive and ran that on a 486 for a while. One day, on a whim, I brought that drive into work and installed it in a 233MHz Pentium (one). Kernel build time: 15 minutes. ;) -Douglas Hurst Quebbeman (DougQ at ixnayamspayIgLou.com) [Call me "Doug"] Surgically excise the pig-latin from my e-mail address in order to reply "The large print giveth, and the small print taketh away." -Tom Waits

24 years, 4 months

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Micro$oft Biz'droid Lusers (was: OT email response format)

by dquebbeman＠acm.org

> For some time now, the gaming console market has been where the real > technological advances in consumer/PC computers have been made. Most PC > users in the business world could get along just fine with a '386 if the OS > and software weren't so bloated now. > > Bob (who is still trying in vain to get MS WinWord to behave and who uses a > WordStar clone on the HP palmtop he carries) The secret to making this work is pretty simple... you just need to drop back to Word for Windows 2.0... it's fast, stable, and even has VBA (albeit they called it WordBASIC back then). -dq

24 years, 4 months

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Emulex "UC07/08 distribution panel

by DAW＠yalepress3.unipress.yale.edu

This has been taken... -- --- David A Woyciesjes --- C & IS Support Specialist --- Yale University Press --- mailto:david.woyciesjes@yale.edu --- (203) 432-0953 --- ICQ # - 905818 Mac OS X 10.1.2 - Darwin Kernel Version 5.2: Fri Dec 7 21:39:35 PST 2001 Running since 01/22/2002 without a crash > ---------- > From: David Woyciesjes > > > > > Which reminds me. I have an Emulex "UC07/08 distribution panel" sitting on > my shelf here. Anybody want it? > > -- > --- David A Woyciesjes >

24 years, 4 months

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Cenbtral Florida JunkFest

by rigdonj＠cfl.rr.com

Hi All, Eric is plannng on arriving here at about 5 PM on Thursday the 16th and leaving the next day to go to Jacksonville (he has a dinner date there that night). Therefore I'm planning on having the JunkFest on Friday morning. Glen has already aggreed that we can hold it at his store in west Orlando. I know it would be better if we could hold it on a weekend but it didn't work out. I was also thinking of trying to get everyone together and going out to dinner on Thursday evening. That would give us some time to chew the fat before the junkfest. I'm not planning on anything fancy, just someplace where we can all pile in and sit around and talk. Let me know what you think. Joe >Date: 20 Apr 2002 08:43:56 -0000 >From: Eric Smith <eric(a)brouhaha.com> >To: Joe Rigdon <rigdonj(a)cfl.rr.com> >Subject: travel plans > >The plan has firmed up a bit. I expect to arrive in Orlando on Thursday >May 16 at 4:51 PM, on American Airlines flight 244 from Los Angeles. > >I'll depart for Jacksonville on Friday the 17th. It looks like I'll >either take a bus which departs Orlando at 3:30 PM, or a train that >departs Orlando at 3:53 PM. > >I'd like to figure out the travel and accomodation details. I hope you >won't think me too rude if I ask whether I might be able to sleep on the >floor at your place. I'll have an Aerobed with me. However, if that's >not convenient for you, don't feel pressured; just let me know of an >inexpensive motel nearby. > >Mapquest says that you're about 22 miles from the airport. Do you know >if there is any shuttle service that will get me to your place (or to the >motel)? > >If it's not too much trouble, could you please measure the outside >dimensions of the IBM 5100? I may be able to borrow a suitable transit >case, but I need to make sure it will fit. > >Best regards, >Eric >

24 years, 4 months

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linux in 6gb

by csmith＠amdocs.com

> -----Original Message----- > From: Pat Finnegan [mailto:pat@purdueriots.com] > For a more suitable install, I can easily install everything > I really use > (between X windows and a few apps, gaim for IM, kernel source so I can > recompile my kernel, gcc and related stuff) in 1G or less of space. I'll go with the "or less." I have personally put Linux, X11, GCC, a few apps, etc, along with a swap file (that worked very slowly) on 60MB of a 95MB zip disk. I'm sure I can do better, too... Chris Christopher Smith, Perl Developer Amdocs - Champaign, IL /usr/bin/perl -e ' print((~"\x95\xc4\xe3"^"Just Another Perl Hacker.")."\x08!\n"); '

24 years, 4 months

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Windows 2 (Was: Re: "Windows V1.0)

by dquebbeman＠acm.org

> Windows 2 was what they shipped so you could run Excel, which had grown > popular on the MacIntosh, on the PC/AT. That's where much of the prejudice > against "smartdrv" came from, since that first release didn't work very well. > I don't think there were many other app's for it. Windows 2.0 came to me bundled with my Microsoft Mouse (the Dove Bar version with the steel rollers). As far as apps, Micrografix Draw was somewhat popular; but you're right, there weren't many... -Douglas Hurst Quebbeman (DougQ at ixnayamspayIgLou.com) [Call me "Doug"] Surgically excise the pig-latin from my e-mail address in order to reply "The large print giveth, and the small print taketh away." -Tom Waits

24 years, 4 months

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Looking for documents of IMS - boards

by Fritz_Chwolka＠t-online.de

I got an help for some IMS board , hope that someone here have an answer >Subject: Thanks for files >Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; x-mac-type="54455854"; x-mac-creator="4D4F5353" >Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > Just want to thank you for making the old manuals and image files available on http://oldcomputers.dyndns.org/public/ I found things here (like the IMS information) I have been hunting for years. I am still looking for documents etc for some other IMS S-100 boards dating from around 1980-84: - A862 Z80 CPU - A930 Floppy Controller - A821 Winchester Controller - A1100 Winchester Controller - A1021 64K RAM You don't by any chance have files for these, do you? :) Best wishes, Arlen Michaels arlen.michaels(a)sympatico.ca ===================END FORWARDED MESSAGE=================== Thank you @ classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org . I like this group. PLease answer only to arlen.michaels(a)sympatico.ca Thanks Greetings from Fritz Chwolka - Duisburg / collecting old computers just for fun at www.alterechner.de \

24 years, 4 months

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