- test-drb@ccmp.vtda.org - classiccmp.org

by dwoyciesjes＠comcast.net

In looking for a place to dispose of my unwanted computers, I ran across this company... Computer Recycling & Refining 27 Ciro Road North Branford, Connecticut 06471 Phone: (203) 488-0535 Contact: A.J. LaCroix When I was talking to him, he mentioned he does get some old computers. I told him about the Rhode Island computer museum, the collectors on this list, and the website to join the list. He talked about keeping some old computers in the back. Hopefully he will join, and maybe offer some goodies for sale? Or maybe donate to the museum? Usual cautions apply, I don't really know them, found thier number and talked to him just today... -- --- Dave Woyciesjes --- ICQ# 905818

22 years, 10 months

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Fluke pods - request for quote, revised request

by artgames＠nycap.rr.com

Please quote for the below items in any quantity you may have up to 2 each. I am also looking for "closeout" deals on larger quantities of Fluke pods in bulk, assorted numbers. quantity 2 - 9000A-8085 pods quantity 2 - 9000A-6809 pods Please note - I need the pods themselves not just the manuals Please include air insured shipping to US zip 12118. Payment will be made in certified funds in advance of shipping. Thank you Art Mallet

22 years, 10 months

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Popular Science article

by jrasite＠eoni.com

GEEK DIY BY PAUL WALLICH The Pride of FrankenMac Lurking in the shadows of Moore's Law is a subculture of retrocomputerists who believe PCs only get better with age. DOWN IN THE SPARE ROOM IS the computer I affectionately call Frank. As in FrankenMac. It has the case and motherboard of a Macintosh clone from 1997, stuffed with new RAM and a CPU upgrade six times the speed of the original. It's on its second video board and Ethernet card, and has a USB adaptor (a technology barely invented when Frank was born) and a replacement 60GB disk. I installed Linux on it a while back because the last few generations of MacOS never did run quite right. And what with the realities of my eat-at-your-desk household, I've lost count of how many keyboards Frank has gone through. In the world of active-yet-obsolete, the polite term is "vintage computers." Frank is an infant. As the era of mass-market personal computing heads for its 30th year, no one knows how many superannuated desktops are still out there chugging away, though reports from around the Net mention still-active Apple IIs, Commodore 64s, first-generation IBM PCs and clones, and even the odd IBM PCjr (a scaleddown, overpriced PC offshoot that garnered widespread ridicule when it was introduced back in 1983). There are three types of people responsible for this computing-with-the-undead phenomenon. I like to think of them as the nostalgists, the pragmatists and the adaptists. The nostalgist impulse sequesters ancient machines in ad hoc museum collections-veteran programmer Bruce Darner's Digibarn (digibarn.com), for instance, houses hundreds of PCs dating back to the mid-'70s. Damer says he keeps old hardware and software running because static museum displays do nothing to convey the actual experience of using a Radio Shack TRS-80 with its subminiature tape drives, or one of Steve jobs's original Next cubes. Damer invites computer builders and users to his museum to put their reminiscences on video for the day when old components finally give up the ghost. Meanwhile, says Vintage Computer Festival organizer Sellam Ismail, the pragmatists are plugging away at dayto-day office work on uncounted thousands of archaic PCs. When Dell ran a contest back in 1999 for the oldest small-business PC still in use, the company turned up more than 200 worthy entries in addition to the winner, an Altair 8800b that had been used for word processing since October 1976. And aging control computers that run industrial or lab equipment generally don't get replaced until the machinery they're attached to wears out --one classic-computer aficionado says his mass spectrometer has been hooked up to the same Apple II for 20 years. Finally, adaptists around the world continue to bang out letters, novels, e-mail and code on revamped elderly machines. Consider British electronics designer and ex-particle physicist Tony Duell, whose primary machine is a pervasively upgraded PC-AT from 1986. (Among the many other computers running in his house is a 31-year-old PDP-11 minicomputer.) "Why?!" asks the megahertz junkie in me. "Why not?" replies my retrocomputing alter ego. Fact is, if you don't absolutely need your computer to play broadcast-quality video clips in 3-D windows while you navigate via throbbing full-color control buttons that unleash CD-grade stereo sound with each click, you probably don't need a machine built in the past 10 years--certainly not for your backup basement machine. Sticking with the same computer ("same" being a relative term) also yields real benefits, says Duell. You seldom have to throw away your old software, and you're less likely to misplace crucial files, as can happen when upgrading from one machine to another. "I never trust people who say they'll copy all the files over to the new machine," Duell laments. "They never do, and five years later some poor person like me is called in to recover a file from some unknown floppy disk." If you're willing to install Linux or FreeBSD instead of the bloated monsters that pass for in dust industry-standard operating systems, a 386 or 486 machine with 16 or 32 megabytes of RAM will do just fine for everyday work. Even if you're addicted to windows and mice, there are some minimal windowing systems whose entire program code takes up less RAM than half a dozen icons on a fancier box. (A simple Google search for "minimal window system" yields a range of options,) And all the hype about Internet-optimized Pentia notwithstanding, 386 and 486 computers around the globe serve as firewalls and routers, e-mail and Web servers directing Internet packets to their destinations in homes and small offices. It only stands to reason, after all, that a machine capable of performing tens of millions Of 32-bit operations per second should be able to keep up with a pipe that delivers no more than a million bits of new data in that time. Finally, in an age when bleeding-edge hardware can set you back a few thousand dollars every year or two, the price of obsolete technology looks right. Used-computer dealers sell perfectly capable machines for $50 to $100-or you can try to snag one of the millions of working PCs that end their lives in dumpsters every year. Even vintagecomputer users who bought new and pay top dollar for parts upgrades are saving a bundle: Duell, for one, hasn't bought a new kit since 1995. 1 have mixed feelings about the whole enterprise. On the one hand, I'm always going to lust after the newest, fastest hardware out there. On the other, I can't bear to get rid of my old toys. Maybe Frank will become a Web server or an image-processing engine or an outlet for some of my stupider software ideas. And if I make some terrible, terrible hacking error on Frank, I'll still have the working--if far less romantic-machine on the desk in my office. SO YOU WANT TO RESUSCITATE AN OLD PC? IF YOU DON'T ALREADY HAVE AN old computer cluttering up your closet, you'll have to cadge one from a friend, find the nearest office trashing old machines this week, or visit your local computer junk store -the place on the other side of town from me offers 30OMHz Pentium Ils with 128MB of RAM and a 4GB drive for $95, or 20OMHz PenHum Is with 48MB of RAM and a 2G8 drive for $50. When I asked about 486 boxes, one of the techs pointed me toward the clumpsters in back and asked, "How many pallets do you want?" (YOU can also find old computers on eBay, but the cost and risk of shipping 30 or 40 pounds of iron across the country tends to kill any price advantage.) Once you've got the machine, junk its obsolete Windows system, flip a coin to decide between FreeBSD and Linux (the first will probably be more work; the second probably requires a slightly heftier computer) and start downloading. (You can find either system at linuxiso.org.) if you have a computer with a CD-ROM burner, you'll typically be making three installation CDs-if you don't, you can scrounge one, order one online for $50 or so, or read the instructions for installing from floppies. (A barebones installation sufficient for sucking the rest of the software down over an Ethernet connection is only a few disks, and a no-name Ethernet card, if you don't have one, is about $ 10. While you're at it, consider another $60 for a 30GB hard drive. Don't worry: These days all the plugs for such things fit in only one way.) Depending on what you want your new old machine to do -browse and read e-mail, serve files, act as a router or firewall -installing the operating system and the appropriate free software (on FrankenMac, that's Mozilla, Open Office and probably Portable AllegroServe) should take about half a day. TOTAL COST: Anywhere from zilch to about $200.

22 years, 10 months

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Assorted cards available

by cb＠mythtech.net

Anyone want an UltraStore SCSI/Floppy controller card for EISA bus? Its got an internal 50 pin SCSI and floppy connectors, and an external 50 pin high density SCSI connector. I also have some Intel AboveBoard ram expansion cards. Some are AT some are 286, all have at least their main banks filled, some have a daughter card attached that is also filled. And I have some PS/2 ram expansion cards (two that use 72 pin simms, one that uses 30 pin simms). And I have some ram expansion cards similar to the AboveBoard, but that have serial ports on the card as well. And I've got some FDD controller cards. Has an old card edge connector on it, so I'm guessing it predates 3.5" drives. Don't know what drives they work with, but I'm assuming 360k 5.25 and maybe HD 5.25 as well... I have 3 of them (and one cable). And some Winchester Drive controller cards And some EGA video cards Any or all of the above are available, just cover shipping. -chris <http://www.mythtech.net> w + p = -?

22 years, 10 months

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ID this card: MPPi Ltd

by dwight.elvey＠amd.com

Hi It looks like a ROM card. I'd check the pinouts before plugging it into a PC. Many cards like these were for various proprietary busses and have the power leads in different locations. If it is for a PC, trace down the address leads from the edge connector. These will usually go to some kind of comparitor ( ls688 or similar ). You should be able to figure where to look for it in the address of the PC. You can then use some simple code to transfer the EPROM to a disk file. Still, doesn't look like a PC card so be careful about plugging it in until you've traced a few leads. Dwight >From: chris <cb(a)mythtech.net> > >I found a rather old looking card. It appears to be an 8 bit ISA card (or >at least has that size/style looking connector). > >The only writing on it is MPPi Ltd. There are no connectors on it, not >even a case dust plate for filling a blank slot (so they must have >planned on you leaving the slot cover in place when this was inserted, or >it isn't an ISA card). > >There are 4 chip sockets on it, with the 2nd of the 4 containing an EPROM >chip (M5L2764K). Remaining chips appear to be maybe support chips (SN74L >series chips). > >There is a small bank of 4 dip switches, and two clusters of jumper poles >(no jumpers installed, poles are labeled A thru G). > > >Anyone have any clue what this card is? I'm wondering if maybe it is an >early security dongle. Maybe this was done as an internal card rather >than an external parallel or serial block. > >A pic of the card is at <http://www.mythtech.net/card.jpg> > >-chris ><http://www.mythtech.net> > >w + p = -? > > >

22 years, 10 months

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ID this card: MPPi Ltd

by cb＠mythtech.net

I found a rather old looking card. It appears to be an 8 bit ISA card (or at least has that size/style looking connector). The only writing on it is MPPi Ltd. There are no connectors on it, not even a case dust plate for filling a blank slot (so they must have planned on you leaving the slot cover in place when this was inserted, or it isn't an ISA card). There are 4 chip sockets on it, with the 2nd of the 4 containing an EPROM chip (M5L2764K). Remaining chips appear to be maybe support chips (SN74L series chips). There is a small bank of 4 dip switches, and two clusters of jumper poles (no jumpers installed, poles are labeled A thru G). Anyone have any clue what this card is? I'm wondering if maybe it is an early security dongle. Maybe this was done as an internal card rather than an external parallel or serial block. A pic of the card is at <http://www.mythtech.net/card.jpg> -chris <http://www.mythtech.net> w + p = -?

22 years, 10 months

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TI 99/4a Looking For A Good Home

by ohh＠drizzle.com

Hey, all: I've met another generous person. :) Anyone after a TI 99/4a? I just received the following e-mail, with permission to forward: > I have recently retired and relocated to the Puget Sound area. I do > have a COMPLETE Texas Instruments TI 99/4a system. Yes, SYSTEM. As we > have settled in smaller quarters, I presently have no place for this > system and no immediate plans for its future. I am willing to donate > this system to a good home. If there is interest on your part, please > e-mail and I will gladly send specifications and software list. It is > presently in seven or eight boxes and is located in the south King > County area (Des Moines, WA (Redondo Beach)). Anyone in or handy to Seattle, Washington can presumably pick this system up directly from the owner. If someone further away would like it, you'll have to sound him out about how willing he is to ship elsewhere. I'm hoping he may be willing to as long as you pay the expenses, but I _don't know_ this; so, if you ask, be polite. :) Anyway, if you're interested you can e-mail Thomas Roughton at <T_Roughton round-thing-with-an-a-in-it msn black-spot com>, with the appropriate anti-spam alterations. -O.-

22 years, 10 months

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HP3000 users have a "wake" on Oct 31 2003

by dzubint＠vcn.bc.ca

Story web page: http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/61/33536.html "Many tears were shed when HP announced that the e3000 would meet its maker at the end of this month. But loyal fans of the product will meet on Oct. 31 at bars and restaurants around the globe to put down several cold ones and discuss their good times with the server. Take a trip over the HP wake Web site to see your nearest venue." "Introduced in 1972, the HP 3000 was loved and adored as being one of the most solid systems around. Running the MPE operating system, HP 3000s chugged along for three decades, but in 2001 HP said it would stop sales and end support for the product in 2006." The "HP 3000 Wake web site" is listed as http://207.21.244.161/hpwake/ (I hate URLs with IP numbers) "For those who want to reminisce about the good old before getting blotto, there is a nice history of the HP 3000 " http://www.robelle.com/library/smugbook/classic.html

22 years, 10 months

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Digital software, books and misc hardware clearout :(

by witchy＠binarydinosaurs.co.uk

Hi folks, Continued redundancy is forcing me to start sorting and selling most of my rather considerable DEC CD collection that goes back to almost the beginning of the CDDS service in the early 1990s and features VAX/VMS, Alpha VMS, Ultrix VAX, Ultrix MIPS and OSF/1 stroke DEC Unix software product CDs. They're all complete sets, and rather than bung 'em on epay I'll give you all the chance to have first go. This is just a toe-in-the-water bijou list-ette to gauge interest. I've also listed my spare hardware. There are 2 ways to do this I think, either I give you all a week to mail me off-list with your offers and best one gets it or I stick it all on the Vintage Computer Marketplace. Let me know if you need pictures of any of it. I'll ship anywhere as long as you pay for it :o) A brief list of CDs: OpenVMS Alpha V6.2 in blue distro box with manuals, never been used OpenVMS VAX V7.0 in blue distro box etc OpenVMS Alpha V7.0 in blue distro box etc (complete with firmware CD) DEC OSF/1 Layered Product set December '94 (nearly on topic :o) OpenVMS CDDS March 1995, 2 boxes containing 12 product CDs and 4 documentation CDs (many many many more CDDS box sets are there somewhere, like 20 or 30+) Books (all Digital Press): Terminals and Printers handbook 1983-84 Microcomputer Processors 1978-79 Microcomputer Interfaces handbook 1980 Processor Handbook PDP 11/04/24/34a/44/70 1981 (2 off) PDP-11 Micro PDP-11 handbook 1983-84 PDP-11 Microcomputer Interfaces handbook 1983-1984 Microcomputer Products Handbook 1985 Terminals and Communications handbook 1981-82 Microcomputers and Memories 1982 Introduction to Local Area Networks 1982 Misc hardware/software: Unopened DECnet/SNA ST Gateway software pack QA-S01AA-H5 (2 off) Unused DNSES Synchronous comms board for AXP 3000 series, EISA. Alphastation 600 motherboard and CPU MicroVAX 3100-40 motherboard Alpha 3000-400 motherboard and CPU MicroVAX 3100 model 40 and 80 memory SIMMs Alpha 3000-400 complete with (I think) 64mb memory, PMAGB graphics. VAXstation 3100 M48, unknown condition for now. MicroVAX 2000, slight case damage A stack of QBUS cards for VAX/PDP, all untested. Obviously the latter 3 are rather heavy :) Let me know! cheers -- adrian/witchy www.binarydinosaurs.co.uk - the online computer museum www.snakebiteandblack.co.uk - ex-monthly gothic shenanigans :o(

22 years, 10 months

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Dust covers

by teoz＠neo.rr.com

What is the best material for making dusk covers for computers? I want to make covers for my 8/16 bit computers like the Amiga 500/1200 Atari 1040ST, C64c, C128, Tandy 1000HX, etc.

22 years, 10 months

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AT&T General Purpose Sychronous AT/Enhanced card

by cb＠mythtech.net

I have an AT&T GPSC-AT/E serial card here if anyone wants it. Its a 12 inch, 16 bit ISA card with a single DB-25 Male port on the back. It was pulled a while back from an AT&T computer. No idea if it works or not. The computer did before it was stripped down, so my guess is the card is fine. I don't really know anything about it, but it looks like it could be a decent serial card, and since so many of you use serial terminals, I thought maybe someone would like it. Just cover postage and its yours. -chris <http://www.mythtech.net> w + p = -?

22 years, 10 months

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Digidata Mag Tape Unit

by Vines.Julian＠northropgrumman.ca

Sir, I am following up on a query on the following link and am hoping that you may be able to help...: http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/2003-September/026900.html Within our organization , we use a number of 9-track Digidata Mag Tape Units, Model P/N 1149-8-2-120-FN-UL. We have some vendor service manuals for these, however what we have, do not have any information regarding how to perform or check head alignment. We are looking either for a manual addressing this head alignment or a "service agent" that has the capability to repair / align these units.. We have tried Digidata themselves and they have no information. I am assuming someone somewhere has the capability / and or knowledge to repair them and am looking for a contact Any suggestions ?? Thanks for your help. Julian Vines Engineering Dept. Navigation Systems Division Northrop Grumman Canada Corporation 25, Cityview Drive, Toronto, Ontario M9W 5A7 Ph: 416 249 1231 Ext 2603 Fax: 416 246 2018 Visit us at www.ngnavsys-canada.ca

22 years, 10 months

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DEC OSF/1 history?

by waltje＠pdp11.nl

Hiyas, Anyone here familiar with early history of DEC's moving from Ultrix to the "new" system called OSF/1 (which itself was based on Mach) ? I found some interesting docs from that era, and some of the dev't cycles arent clear to me.. some help would be useful in understanding what went on then.. Cheers, Fred -- Fred N. van Kempen, DEC (Digital Equipment Corporation) Collector/Archivist Visit the VAXlab Project at http://www.pdp11.nl/VAXlab/ Visit the Archives at http://www.pdp11.nl/ Email: waltje(a)pdp11.nl BUSSUM, THE NETHERLANDS / Sunnyvale, CA, USA

22 years, 10 months

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POST problem

by ajay_chadha＠ttps.ntpc.co.in

we have IBM RS/6000 7043-140 , it is not booting during POST LED shows F50 and then nthing happens maching is not booting i was trying to install linux from boot floppy after that it happens pl help AJAY CHADHA ENGINEER (IT) IT DEPARTMENT ,NTPC TTPS ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ "Speed & Quality is essence of IT"

22 years, 10 months

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about the Teac FD-55GFR 5 1/4" Drive

by eclipsah＠rdslink.ro

I had the same problem on my Teac FD-55GFR 5 1/4" Drive, as I was trying to recover some old applications of mine. Here are some advices: 1. Check if the BIOS setting is correct (1.2MB/5 1/4") 2. Check if the jumper configuration is correct - you can find that at: http://www.teac.com/DSPD/pdf/5fd0050a.pdf 3. My problem: the spring that holds the head #1 on the disk surface probably "got old". If this is the problem, try to press it gently onto the disk, and push it twards the tracks at the end of the disk (the center). If this was useful, I would appreciate a thank you mail... just kidding ;).

22 years, 10 months

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MOS operating System?

by rigdonj＠cfl.rr.com

Went to a surplus store today and found a package that said that it was "MOS Operating System" and that it was a multi-user system and that it was MS-DOS compatible. Does anyone know anything about it? I've never heard of it before. The package was sealed so I couldn't open it to read any details. Joe

22 years, 10 months

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SYSTEM 80 Schematics

by David.Kane＠aph.gov.au

The technical manual is hosted on Terry Stewart's great System 80 site at: http://www.webweavers.co.nz/system-80/manuals_technical.htm The site has the manual with the copyright owners permission which includes the schematics. David -----Original Message----- From: Geoff Gunn [mailto:vax@onthenet.com.au] Sent: Sunday, 19 October 2003 10:05 PM To: cctech(a)classiccmp.org Subject: SYSTEM 80 Schematics Mike, I just found you message about having the ciruit diagrams for a Disk Smith System 80. I found one of these the other day in a recyling center and always had a soft spot for them as it was first computer. The one I found works, but has a problem in the video circuit. It is repairable, but would be a lot easier if I had schematics to work from (I collect video games from the same era as well so my skills in repairing these would help me a great deal :) If you have a scan or even a photocopy of this manual, I would glady purchase it off you. Cheers, Geoff

22 years, 10 months

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ARM Evaluation System discs

by pete＠dunnington.u-net.com

Some of you will remember a thread earlier this year, in which various of us discussed the ARM Evaluation System -- an ARM Second Processor for a BBC Microcomputer -- and bemoaned either our lack of discs, or that we had a Disc 1 that was corrupt. Well, thanks to a kind benefactor who provided me with an *un*corrupt Disc 1, I've been able to copy them and make them available on my website. If you have an ARM Evaluation System and need the software, go to http://www.dunnington.u-net.com/public/BBC/ARMeval.html What's there are ZIP files; I thought about making disc images, but I can't get Xfer to behave :-( However, the discs are just normal ADFS discs, and my webpage has links to the things required to unpack them on a Beeb or an Arc (or later RISC OS machine) so there shouldn't be any problem. However, if anyone on the list deperately needs actual discs, and can provide me with suitable blanks (5.25" DSDD or 3.5" DSDD, not HD), I'll be happy to make copies. Apologies to those who're on both the BBC Micro list and the ClassicCmp list, and get two copies of this. To those who're on both *and* in my private "ARMeval" list, well, good things always come in threes :-) -- Pete Peter Turnbull Network Manager University of York

22 years, 10 months

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DEC Roamabout?

by waltje＠pdp11.nl

Hiyas, Nyone here (relly) familiar with these beasties? I now have two sets of them, and gawdamit, they dont talk together. I have one set being the DEIRB-AG (my first set), and the set of new cards are DEIRB-DA's. Cant yet tell whether its the cards, their firmware or the drivers. Although... I tried one of the DA's in my access point, and that one doesnt seem to be too happy with the card, either, so it could well be the card or its firmware... Any clues? (yes, all cards are labelled 2400/FH, by the way ;-) Cheers, Fred -- Fred N. van Kempen, DEC (Digital Equipment Corporation) Collector/Archivist Visit the VAXlab Project at http://www.pdp11.nl/VAXlab/ Visit the Archives at http://www.pdp11.nl/ Email: waltje(a)pdp11.nl BUSSUM, THE NETHERLANDS / Sunnyvale, CA, USA

22 years, 10 months

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How do _you_ move equipment? What "tools" do you use?

by SUPRDAVE＠aol.com

In a message dated 10/21/2003 4:51:54 PM Eastern Daylight Time, allain(a)panix.com writes: << > Now what I REALLY want - is one of those lift genies that is like a > hand truck but with a large flat platform that you pump up and down. > Not to move racks, but to lift disc drives and tape drives up from 5 > inches to 5 feet, so that they can be easily rackmounted. Haven't > found one cheap yet though. I would pay up to $350 for such a thing (it sounds too perfect). I've been looking for it in the form of a "scissor jack" >> take a look at globalindustrial.com

22 years, 10 months

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Sony disk drives

by ard＠p850ug1.demon.co.uk

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22 years, 10 months

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OT : tape heads and cleaning tapes.

by ard＠p850ug1.demon.co.uk

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22 years, 10 months

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Prom/EPROM history

by rigdonj＠cfl.rr.com

I found this on the net and thought some of you might find it interesting. <http://www.jmargolin.com/patents/eprom.htm> Joe

22 years, 10 months

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How do _you_ move equipment? What "tools" do you use?

by wrljet＠yahoo.com

This is how I do it... http://www.wrljet.com/bridgeport/ Bill __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? The New Yahoo! Shopping - with improved product search http://shopping.yahoo.com

22 years, 10 months

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How do _you_ move equipment? What "tools" do you use?

by rigdonj＠cfl.rr.com

At 05:19 PM 10/20/03 -0500, you wrote: > >Greetings; >I am faced with picking up a sizeable IBM some hours from where I live in >the next few weeks. >What I had originally planned to do has fallen through, and now I am left >trying to work out how best to lift what has been estimated as 800+lbs of >1978 IBM. > >I have a decent half-ton pickup truck, its more than plenty for carrying >this machine home. The magic trick is - how do I get the heavy sucker into >the deck? >I was planning on "borrowing" another truck with a lift-gate on it, to >lift the IBM up to the pickup deck height, and then waffling it into the >pickup. That has fallen through, and actually renting one is, as far as >I'm concerned, cost prohibitive ($78 + 29c/mile + $150 deposit). You should be aware that a lot of the lift gates are junk! They're actually worse than that, they're downright dangerous! Many of them have a steep ramp about 2 to 3" high before they reach the top. That makes it very difficult to get heavy objects onto the lift gate. In addition, the tops are sloped away from the truck and when you raise the lift gate the slope increases. That makes things tend to slide completely off the ramp right at the worst time! Just as you're lifting it up and have nowhere to go. Finally, they have a hinge in them that makes it difficult to get heavy loads off and on the ramp. Take a close look at any lift gate that you're considering using, BEFORE you rent the truck. And if you don't have a fork lift or other machinery to load the cargo, think THREE TIMES about using one of them for heavy objects. Last year, I narrowly missing being crushed under a 1800+ lb UPS that I was trying to load on one using those POS! Something you might consider is the use of one of the off-road type fork lifts. A LOT of companies in this area (central Florida) use them to unloading and moving pallets of sod (squares of grass used for landscaping) and they can be rented quite reasonably and the rental companies have trailors for them. I have moved a couple of big heavy computers by renting a low trailer and then using 2 x 10" boards as ramps to load the puter. If it's real heavy and you're short of man power then you can use a come-a-long to pull it into the trailer. Loading is generally pretty easy but unloading is tricky! A lot of times the load will run away from you and it will try to stop and tip over when it gets to the ground. Also it will sometimes try to push the boards out off the trailer. If that happens one side will drop to the ground and the thing will tip over. Take your time and be careful unloading. Use plenty of man power if you can get it. Joe > >If you were to move this IBM, how would you have done it? >Keep in mind while I can cover $100 worth of gas for my pickup - more than >that is a pinch. > >JP > >

22 years, 10 months

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Popular Science

by jrasite＠eoni.com

Tony, Sellem, Nice write up. (Nov 2003 Popular Science.) Unfortunately not on their website. I'll scan and OCR if anyone's interested. Jim

22 years, 10 months

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Recommendations for archiving audio tapes

by dundas＠caltech.edu

I have a number of old DECUS U.S. Symposium audio tapes that I would like to archive before they completely disintegrate. I have a way to digitize these and store them in a variety of formats. I'm not sure what format is best for archive and distribution, though I assume something like WAV or AIFF for archive and MP3 for distribution. I have no prior experience at this and would appreciate any suggestions on the best approach. Also suggestions on who to contact to make these archives legally available on the web would be welcome. Is anyone else archiving these? As a teaser, here's what I have: 1987 Fall: N008 Understanding Ethernet N037 Cryptographic Security for Ethernet DA054 Optimizing VMS device Drivers for Realtime I/O V104 Tape 1 VAX Magic, War Stories, and Horror Tales V104 Tape 2 1988 Fall: PC031 Internal Enhancements to AppleTalk for VMS NE050 An Introduction to the Digital's Distributed Name Service (DNS) GR054 Renderman: A 3D Scene Description Interface for Computer Graphics System GR033F Computer Graphic and Visualization Thanks, John

22 years, 10 months

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Looking for 4Kx1 drams

by dwight.elvey＠amd.com

Hi Anyone have a good source for 4Kx1 drams? I need three for my poly8813. I also need 2111's but I've found a place that has these. Dwight

22 years, 10 months

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question about the TI-52

by s0507649＠fhtw-berlin.de

Hi, my name is Tobias and i own a TI-52 calculator. As it was given to me, i'd really like to program it(thoug it's as old as me). But this model is too old, and i can't get a manual for it. So i'd like to enquire whether you know how to get a manual for the TI-52. Thanks in advance! best regards Tobias Petschke

22 years, 10 months

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Recommendations for archiving audio tapes

by pete＠dunnington.u-net.com

On Oct 20, 8:10, John A. Dundas III wrote: > I have a number of old DECUS U.S. Symposium audio tapes that I would > like to archive before they completely disintegrate. I have a way to > digitize these and store them in a variety of formats. I'm not sure > what format is best for archive and distribution, though I assume > something like WAV or AIFF for archive and MP3 for distribution. That sounds reasonable, but beware of WAV -- although originally it was effectively a byte-swapped AIFF format, it's been added to in so many ways that a WAV file could contain just about anything. If you use AIFF at 44100Hz you can write the tracks to a CD-R using just about any writer software. MP3 is pretty good for distribution. It's reasonably compact, better supported than just about any other compressed format, and not likely to go away any time soon. Of course, it's lossy so don't use it for archives (I'm sure you weren't planning to). -- Pete Peter Turnbull Network Manager University of York

22 years, 10 months

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How do _you_ move equipment? What "tools" do you use?

by SUPRDAVE＠aol.com

In a message dated 10/20/2003 7:42:21 PM Eastern Daylight Time, jplist(a)kiwigeek.com writes: > Perhaps you can rent a car towing trailer? Those are very low to the > ground generally and you may be able to push it onto the tracks. Renting > one may well be much cheaper than a truck with a lift gate. Tempted. For reasons I won't go into, I've been told that I cannot use a trailor by the person who actually owns the vehicle - I only drive it. Transmissions and various reasons like that. Asides from whether or not I agree or believe this - I'm just trying to make do with what I have. I believe I'll probably put together a pair of sturdy oak ramps, maybe 12" wide, that hook to the bumper of the truck. Then I'll use a winch to pull the IBM up the incline - although I'm not sure yet what to use under the lower end to stop it grating on the ground once its picked up off its casters... Perhaps a skateboard? :) I've moved some heavy things before including an extremely heavy player piano and might be able to off some suggestions. Being able to use a tilt bed trailer is a big help. You can find some low cost tiltbed trailer kits pretty cheaply if you know the capacity of what you're carrying is less or equal to the trailer's. Carpeted furniture dollies are cheap and can take a lot of weight and abuse. get a few of those. As someone said, a come-along is handy for loading or moving up a ramp. There's a thing called a Johnson bar that works great for moving heavy things. it's basically a 6 foot long wooden pry bar with a metal angled end and wheels on one end, so you can lever up something extremely heavy and then move it around because of the wheels. Any rental place should have those. Pallet jacks are nice too. too bad they don't go up higher though. I've seen some companies sell a small motorized lift to raise something like a motorcycle for service. can something like that be rented? If you plan to unload from a pickup's bed, see if there's a ditch or a low spot you can back into to make it lower. barring that, it might be helpful to use whatever you can to make a platform at a height halfway between the truck and the ground so you can manouver onto that first. trying to lower something heavy 2 feet at once is not easy to do.

22 years, 10 months

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How do _you_ move equipment? What "tools" do you use?

by Innfogra＠aol.com

> > I believe I'll probably put together a pair of sturdy oak ramps, maybe > > 12" wide, that hook to the bumper of the truck. Then I'll use a winch to > > pull the IBM up the incline - although I'm not sure yet what to use under > > the lower end to stop it grating on the ground once its picked up off its > > casters... Perhaps a skateboard? :) > Your oak ramp is a good idea Use a large sheet of aluminum or steel about 3 foot by 3 foot. Larger is better and stainless steel is better than aluminum. The cabinet will actually skid on the metal until the casters take over going up the ramp. The plate might try to kick out so be careful, particularly if it is too small. If you are going to make a ramp bevel the ends of the boards or put some wedges at the end so the metal doesn't deform. You want a smooth skid surface. Be especially careful of your center of gravity on the incline. Good luck, Paxton Astoria, OR

22 years, 10 months

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Tektronix 4209 graphic terminal commands summary

by mmcfadden＠cmh.edu

I have just received a Tektronix 4209 terminal which works. Manufacture date is 1987. I vaguely remember plot commands for a tektronix system when I worked for AT&T Western Electric in 1980's. These were not the 4014 storage tube stroke vector displays but the first raster displays. Does anybody have a Plot-10 command summary? Is this the correct set? mike m m c f a d d e n a t c m h . e d u

22 years, 10 months

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website update

by pete＠dunnington.u-net.com

I know some of you have bookmarked or made links to one or two files I have on my "website". Earlier today I moved some of the PDP11-related files, such as the Q-Bus diagrams and XXDP docs, into a subdirectory, so you might want to update bookmarks/links. http://www.dunnington.u-net.com/public/PDP-11/ -- Pete Peter Turnbull Network Manager University of York

22 years, 10 months

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Emulation moment of insanity... (fwd)

by geneb＠deltasoft.com

This is just.....insane. :) g. ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Mon, 20 Oct 2003 14:58:18 -0700 From: Jeff Vavasour <vavasour(a)shaw.ca> To: trs80(a)cs.ubc.ca Subject: Emulation moment of insanity... Well, for those on this list that are interested, I recently had a moment of insanity in the emulation realm. Here's the result: http://www.vavasour.ca/jeff/mice.html - Jeff

22 years, 10 months

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Nice Apple ///

by toresbe＠ifi.uio.no

And I quote horrified: "I now feel the desire to make the room more useful so the computer does not fit the decor any longer." Don't you know that Apples, like black, go with everything?!? :) Sheesh. <g> -Tore

22 years, 10 months

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sticky Sony 3.5" drive

by vp＠mcs.drexel.edu

The following article although not written by Tony is still detailed and informative: http://www.hpmuseum.org/cgi-sys/cgiwrap/hpmuseum/articles.cgi?read=78 **vp

22 years, 10 months

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Teledisk software to duplicate license floppy disk

by kyrrin＠bluefeathertech.com

I don't, Zhu, I'm sorry. However, please don't rule out the possibility of the OS or floppy drive being at fault. Teledisk should, ideally, be run under a strict DOS 6.22 environment, as that is what it was written to support. I've found, through direct experience, that it will run in a command window under Windows NT 4.0, but you may have different results. The other possibility is that the disk you're trying to archive has a format scheme that is so alien to PC-type floppy controllers that it simply cannot be read. Perhaps someone more experienced with floppy archiving than I am can comment on this. *********** REPLY SEPARATOR *********** On 20-Oct-03 at 14:47 Zhu Jin Yong wrote: >hi, > Just searched yahoo and found your email about teledisk tools.I also >encounted the same problems with errors such as "Drive A: is not ready. >Please correct and press any key to continue" especially when floppy >disk is running at final way. I just took out of this disk but this disk >can be nomally used even it got errors in process of td0 file creation. > > But recently,I got a problem using teledisk.Teledisk can't >colon(duplicate) Some authorization disk such as Siemens Simatic Step 7 >V5.1 SP4 authorization disk into *.td0 file with "Drive A: is not >ready" erors at starting up.Do you know any other software could copy >this authorization disk so that I don't warry about my authorization >disk crash? > Thanks, >Zhu -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Bruce Lane, Owner & Head Hardware Heavy, Blue Feather Technologies -- http://www.bluefeathertech.com ARS KC7GR (Formerly WD6EOS) since 12-77 -- kyrrin(a)bluefeathertech.com "Quando Omni Flunkus Moritati" (Red Green, aka Steve Smith)

22 years, 10 months

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upcoming classiccmp wierdness

by chrisc＠addpower.com

My boxes have borrowed their names from Bloom County...there's opus and bill connected to the network, and milo (my vax) which is currently not connected to anything besides my terminal emulation program. Philip Pemberton <philpem(a)dsl.pipex. To: cctalk(a)classiccmp.org com> cc: Sent by: Subject: RE: upcoming classiccmp wierdness cctech-bounces@clas siccmp.org 10/17/2003 01:11 PM Please respond to "General Discussion: On-Topic Posts Only" In message <69DBC74E5784D6119BEA0090271EB8E5FA3EB2@MAIL10> "Cini, Richard" <RCini(a)congressfinancial.com> wrote: > And of course there should be an "Uncle Donald" around there somewhere : -) Well, seeing as we're on the subject of machine names, I've been using star names, constellations and Zodiac signs - Polaris, Arcturus, Vega, Rigel, Coriolis and Aquarius have all been used so far. The laptops are named after Star Trek movies and series - Nemesis and Voyager. As for the machines that sit there doing nothing 99% of the time? IJSH and IJST. Guess what IJST and IJSH mean :) I'd be interested to find out what network names/nicknames some other classiccmpers have given their machines. Later. -- Phil. | Acorn Risc PC600 Mk3, SA202, 64MB, 6GB, philpem(a)dsl.pipex.com | ViewFinder, Ethernet (Acorn AEH62), http://www.philpem.dsl.pipex.com/ | 8xCD, framegrabber, Teletext * <- Tribble # <- Tribble after Borg assimilation

22 years, 10 months

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sticky Sony 3.5" drive

by fmc＠reanimators.org

Found in an HP 9114A. Doesn't want to accept a diskette; it doesn't move the diskette down when fully inserted, but pushing the eject button ejects the diskette. Removed the drive from the 9114A, and pulled its cover; its heads appear to be intact and in place. I'm wondering what I need to clean and re-lubricate (and how, and what sort of lubricant to use); I'm thinking Tony Duell has told us all before but doggone if I can turn it up in my searches. -Frank McConnell

22 years, 10 months

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ASR33 Teletype interfacing

by tomj＠wps.com

> Date: Sat, 11 Oct 2003 09:04:11 -0400 > From: Ian Primus <ian_primus(a)yahoo.com> > Subject: Re: ASR33 Teletype interfacing > >> I have been attempting to get my ASR33 teletype connected to something > >> and communicating, but so far I have not been successful. I have built > > Teletypes are inductive loads. Though they only want 20 mils, the > > voltage needs to be high to get the initial magnet pull-in (basic RL > > theory). ASR33 loops were generally run at 100V or so, but I run my > > Model 28 at 14V, with non-perfect error rate, and I don't use the > > keyboard. > > I take it that the voltage isn't that crucial, just the current? Yes, but higher voltage means the in-rush current will reach 20mA faster (the RL time constant doesn't change, just absolute values).(I kinda lied when I said it wasn't subtle; there are subtleties. But they're not of the pee-cee interface kind. The Old Guys who worked all this stuff up were as smart or smarter than us; it's best to read old source material for this kind of trivia.) > > The keyboard and printer are IN SERIES. If you hit keys while it's > > printing you foul it up. Normal. > > What about on a full duplex machine? Is it the same, or are they > separate? Yes, but most teletype equip was half-duplex (two wires). > > I've done one of these fairly recently, and if poked with a > > not-too-sharp stick, I'll scan the schematic and pu on my website. > > *poke* > > <grin> > > If it's not too much trouble, I'd like to see it. From what I have > heard, there are lots of ways to do this, and i would be very > interested to see how you did it. OK, I'll get to it this week and post URL here. Everyone's interface is better than everyone else's, mine included :-) Be skeptical. Simplest isn't always most reliable, it depends on what you're trying to do: punch 1000 feet of error-free tape a mile away? Or just make the tty dance for an afternoon of fun? I cobbled up a PIC-based board that does ITA2 (aks "baudot") to ASCII, motor control, etc for a Model 28 teletype. It fits a particular project of my own. The source for it is at http://wps.com/projects scroll down for "PIC BASED PROJECTS" or something. tomj

22 years, 10 months

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Naming schemes (was upcoming classiccmp wierdness)

by blstuart＠bellsouth.net

> I'd be interested to find out what network names/nicknames some other > classiccmpers have given their machines. I've been using intellgent computers from sci fi for a while. The laptop I'm using now is called nomad (from Star Trek) and my gateway is called orac (from Blake's 7). I've got some Suns that I hope to have back on-line soon with names like colossus, guardian, hal, m5 and zen. Of course, my daughter wanted me to name her machine fluffy (from Harry Potter) and my wife's is taliesin (from Arthurian legend). BLS

22 years, 10 months

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acrhival/displays

by joel.bradley＠comcast.net

Hey guys, I am 'new' to the list under this address. I have posted several times about CDC items I have available, and thank you to those who have expressed interest. I do not wish this to come off as a blatant advertisement, but it probabaly will. If any of you out there are looking to 'decorate' your offices or hobby spaces, keep on reading. One of my other hobbies is sports memorabilia and I have something that I developed for my own use in displaying my collection. Being that there has been talk about manuals, old computer magazines, and the like, I thought some of you might be interested in what I am 'selling' to display your ietms. I actually have them listed on eBay, but I can give a better price to those on the list that contact me directly. http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2760307223 I have been a collector of magzines for almost 10 years and have been looking since I started for an attractive way to display my collection. In conjunction with a local custom acrylic fabricator, I came up with the following... The holders are made from a combination of 1/8" and 3/16" crystal clear anti-static (anti-dust!) acrylic and can be made to either 'hang' on the wall or 'stand' on a shelf/desktop. They are made from 2 pieces. Imagine one of the pieces is like a shoebox lid. The second piece is the 'back' of the holders slides in and out along a routed edge that is on 3 of the sides of the 'front', You access the box which holds the magazine by sliding the back out. The genius of this design is that it completely seals it inside for protection. They come in various sizes, as well as two 'flavors', hanging or standing. If you go to the listing on eBay, you will see a picture of the 'standing' kinds. I have pictures of my magazine collection using the 'hanging' type available as well. http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2760307223 Feel free to contact me directly with questions. Thanks! Joel Bradley joel.bradley(a)comcast.net

22 years, 10 months

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Available PDP-11 Cabinet, St. Louis

by ohh＠drizzle.com

Like I said a couple of days ago, I'm meeting the nicest people lately. :) Though I still haven't found the PDP-12 I can afford to buy just yet, I have found an empty PDP-11 rack looking for a good home: > This is not exactly what you were looking for but I have a PDP-11 > cabinet i would like to give away, it is the rack only with a pdp-11 > bottom panel, ~6' tall, 2 fans in top, some slides installed, on > casters with leveler feet. Free to a good home. I am in the ST. Louis > area. Anyone interested, particularly in or near St. Louis, can e-mail the owner at "rhugh a-in-a-circle att black-spot net" (with the two appropriate, and I hope obvious, substitutions). -O.-

22 years, 10 months

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air filters

by jwest＠classiccmp.org

I was looking for air filters for DEC RK05, HP7900A, and HP7906. I found one website that I sent an email to the company asking for prices and here's what I got: DEC RK05 - 67.00 HP 7900A- 74.00 HP 7906 - 73.50 This just seems ludicrous to me. Anyone know of better priced sources? Jay West --- [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus]

22 years, 10 months

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Data I/O Series 22 EPROM Programmer help

by ian_primus＠yahoo.com

A friend and I are working on building a simple Z80 computer from scratch. We've got a pretty good start on it so far, but have run into a little snag - an EPROM programmer. I have an ancient Data I/O Series 22 programmer that I have been attempting to get working. I have the manual, and I managed to get it to power up. The power supply caps were limping, but they seem to have reformed while I was playing with it. I am now able to turn it on and have it come on properly every time. I can read devices into RAM fine, and I have (I think) successfully erased an EPROM with the built in UV eraser. (When I read the erased chip, the checksum is 0000). This programmer has an RS232 port on it, and I have attempted to connect it to a couple of different things. First, I tried connecting it to the Linux box in the workshop, and tried copying the data from ram to the serial port while I had a "cat /dev/ttyS1 > file" running. This produced no effect, other than a zero byte file. I connected a VT220 terminal, and have been able to control the programmer (to an extent) from the terminal. I can type the commands for copy, etc. But, the manual states that I should get some feedback on the terminal screen, as well as on the programmer's readout. So far, I have yet to see a single character come out of that programmer through the serial port. I know I have the baud rate, parity and stop bits set correctly. I even tried connecting my even more ancient Tektronix "doghouse" (German Shepherd sized) 'scope to the RS232 TX pin, and I haven't gotten a clear reading. Of course, my lack of a good reading is probably related to my lack of good probes, the ones I have are quick kludges with some old shielded coax cable, and are probably the electronic equivalent of pounding nails with a bowling ball (i.e. it works, kinda). Has anyone had any experience dealing with an EPROM programmer like this? What format is the data transferred in, and how can I communicate with the programmer from the computer. The manual is pretty cryptic about it, and mentions that the programmer is capable of sending and receiving data in no less than 20 formats, none of which seem like anything I have heard of before. What is the 'standard' method of transferring data two and from a serial EPROM programmer? Should I be able to see data on a terminal if I dump the data to the serial port, or is it in some non-ASCII format that the terminal (and Linux) can't render? I am lost here. Any suggestions would be appreciated. Thanks! Ian Primus ian_primus(a)yahoo.com

22 years, 10 months

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Naming schemes

by classiccmp＠crash.com

Oh what the heck, why not do my bit to congest the network... Can't tell who wrote: > > I'd be interested to find out what network names/nicknames some other > classiccmpers have given their machines. I picked crash.com in the Great Internet Domain Name Land Grab back in early 1994. Hard to believe what wasn't taken back then. As to why, well, what do computers do at the least convenient times? What logically followed (to me) was a series of names based on Unix signals. abort.crash.com Desktop buserr.crash.com Desktop fpe.crash.com Web server hup.crash.com Current firewall int.crash.com temporary, new machines io.crash.com File server segv.crash.com Old firewall term.crash.com Livingston Portmaster They've all been different machines at different times, as these are role-based names as much as anything else. And of course they have CNAMEs/aliases of the proper format: SIGHUP, SIGINT, etc. Other naming schemes in use are predictable. The Sun's are Egyptian gods (Ra Sparc 10/52, Thoth Sparc 20/92 (yes, 90MHz), Horus and Osiris are Ultra 30's, the Sun-4/260, 3/50 & 3/60 haven't been revived yet). The DEC MIPS and Alphas are Indian gods (Kali 5000/260, Hanuman a 3000/300lx, Siva a 600MHz PC164LX rack, new AS1200 and AS4000 haven't been named yet). The VAXen don't conform to this, I can't recall the name given to the uVAX 3400, the VS3100m38 only went far enough to confirm that it worked, and the 4000/500 is OMEGA. If I get the 11/730 running, I'll worry about a name then. The big problem there is what to do for mass storage, as I don't have a Unibus SCSI card and don't want to use a second backplane. OTOH, it might be faster to boot diskless and run over the net than hook up an R80... . The DG Aviions aren't really part of the network, and their names are stopgaps. An AV410 is "lilav", and the AV530's are Edson and Webo. I can't recall what name was given to the AV5500 just now. The cluster project was named arg.crash.com. The individual nodes (Soyo dual Slot 1 mobo's with Celerons on slockets - gives you an idea of timeframe!) were arg0, arg1, arg2, etc. I was tempted to rename the whole cluster argv, but... Laptops have been Slim (DEC HiNote Ultra), Slate (ThinkPad 600X), and now Folly (a ThinkPad T23 1400x1050 that I shouldn't have put the money into). Network attached HP LaserJet 4+ is Hardcopy.

22 years, 10 months

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Netbooting VAX-11/730 (was Re: Naming schemes)

by classiccmp＠crash.com

I wrote: > If I get the 11/730 running, I'll worry about a name then. > [mentioned net-booting] Antonio Carlini wrote: > It will boot from the TU58 but I don't know of anything that > will then boot it over the net over MOP. Jochen Kunz suggested: > The NetBSD/VAX boot loader? > It uses DHCP and NFS to load an ELF image. This might work. This 11/730 was packaged in a low-boy (~42" tall) rack with RL02 on top, an R80 on the bottom. I received the host because it was crashing on bad sectors in the R80, and the person using it was given a free 11/750 & rack of RA81s from another lab. The TU58 might be a bit cramped for a full-on bootloader with all kinds of network support at 256k minus whatever else needs to be on there for the machine to boot to the console. However, if it can then read a more complete loader from the RL02, or even a miniroot... Hmmm... Very Interesting... --Steve.

22 years, 10 months

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still a green keys list ?

by PLancashire＠columbia.com

Gil, is the list still active ? if so would like to become a member. thanks -pete pete5520(a)pdxeng.com

22 years, 10 months

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Sad Day need help on replacing ASR35 and IBM 129 Verifier

by PLancashire＠columbia.com

I lost (in addition to lots of old computer items) two things I'm trying to get information for my insurance company on. The first is a ASR35 that was 'loaded', over the years I had converted a TWX ASR35 in to on that had every option you could think of. I just did a search of Google, and could find almost no references to it, sad in its own right. I also lost a ASR 38, but that's for another time. The other item destroyed, was a IBM 129 Punch card verifier. A 129 is a 29, with the ability to verify previously punched cards. It also could be used as a card reader. Mine had that option. Both were very clean, low usage. They both were 'backup' machines that in the case of the 129, had less then 100 hours on its run time meter. Both had full sets of manuals, spare parts etc. The 35 included a never used type unit in the box. So if anyone could help with where I can start to look for replacements, value etc. I would be most thankful. Thanks in advance for any leads -pete

22 years, 10 months

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help: Brikon Floppy drive tester

by rigdonj＠cfl.rr.com

Hi, I have a couple of Brikon model 723 floppy drive testers made by Brian Instruments of Fullerton, California. One of the testers that I have has the "R" option. The "R" option is a feature that includes a bunch of flying leads tahat you can attach to various test points on the drive under test and measure various analog parameters. It's shown in the factory brochure and it appears to be a ribbon cable with a small blue box on it and about 8 or 10 individual leads coming out of the box. The leads appear to have banana plugs on them where they plug into the box and the other ends have grabber clips on them. Does anyone have one of these cable/pods? If so can you send me the pin out so that I can make one or can I borrow it long enough to make schematics of it? Joe

22 years, 10 months

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SYSTEM 80 Schematics

by vax＠onthenet.com.au

Mike, I just found you message about having the ciruit diagrams for a Disk Smith System 80. I found one of these the other day in a recyling center and always had a soft spot for them as it was first computer. The one I found works, but has a problem in the video circuit. It is repairable, but would be a lot easier if I had schematics to work from (I collect video games from the same era as well so my skills in repairing these would help me a great deal :) If you have a scan or even a photocopy of this manual, I would glady purchase it off you. Cheers, Geoff

22 years, 10 months

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Mac SE/30 revival

by liste＠artware.qc.ca

I was driving into town when I spoted the aforementioned computer in some phule's garbage. I stopped and pulled it out. However, when I turn it on, the screen comes up 4 grey scan lines, then alternating 8 black scan lines and 8 grey scan lines. A friend mentioned that this is normal boot config, that it should then proceed to the happy mac icon and so on. He asked if the ROM was still in it. I can't get the box open though : I don't have the extra special long torx driver to get at the 2 top screws. And the hex extention bits I have don't fit into the hole. Anyone have a clue about how to revive this? I'd love to get netbsd running on it. Or is it hopeless? -Philip

22 years, 10 months

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IBM System/23 ROM help needed

by ian_primus＠yahoo.com

This is yet another incomplete project that I am trying to finish... I have an IBM System/23 Datamaster, and I am attempting to get it to work. When turned on, it displays a series of numbers on the screen, and stops at "FD". Of the numbers printed, "0B" is inverted and flashing. I found a listing of the error codes in google's cache of classiccmp.org (part of the archive seems to be down). http://216.239.51.104/search?q=cache:83dbK69EHG8J:www.classiccmp.org/ mail-archive/classiccmp/1997-07/0566.html+IBM+System/ 23+error+site:www.classiccmp.org&hl=en&ie=UTF-8 According to this, the error code "0B" indicates that one of the ROM chips on the logic board has failed. The chip is soldered to the board, but replacing it with a socket and an EPROM shouldn't be a problem, but I don't know anything about these chips, or if they have an EPROM equivalent. I have repaired my EPROM programmer, so I now have the ability to burn my own EPROM chips. The problem I face now is that I need the data for the new chip. Does anyone have a ROM image of this chip that they could send me? Also, does anyone know the pinouts of these ROM chips on the System/23 board? (or as IBM calls them, ROS modules, for Read Only Storage). Thanks! Ian Primus ian_primus(a)yahoo.com

22 years, 10 months

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The UNIBUS FAQ is wrong about grant cards, isn't it?

by gunther＠aurora.regenstrief.org

Hi, the UNIBUS FAQ sais that the grant cards G727A is a dual-height card with NPG grant. But from the cards I have I see the G727A is a single height card with only bus grant, not NPG, and it is a knucklebuster. The one that's dual-height and has handles is the G7273. I also have a 3rd party vendor dual height bus+NPG grant card. I suppose it shouldn't be too hard to make grant cards yourself. I think I have my VAX11/780 UNIBUS under control now. I threw out all cards except for the UDA50 pair, put in a new terminator and filled all with appropriate grant cards. Now the UDA50 initializes fine and I get the 8/9 blink fine the port-A light goes on on the RA90. Still the VAX doesn't seem to get anywhere and after a while the lights go off. May be I'm too impatient and should just wait long enough? -Gunther

22 years, 10 months

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Naming schemes (was upcoming classiccmp wierdness)

by pete＠dunnington.u-net.com

> > I'd be interested to find out what network names/nicknames some other > > classiccmpers have given their machines. Mine are an assortment of groups. The SGIs, which are the largest group that are networked, are mindy (my original Indy), mork (another Indy), mearth (another!), orson (Origin 2000), volgar and exidor (O2s), but the Indigos mostly still have the names they were given by previous owners (dopey, ziggi, mrtoad, ...). My laptop is called dancer because it moves about; the windows PC is called floorbox because it's just a box that sits on the floor. The NeXT slab is predicably called monolith (blame the previous owner). I have a few Acorn machines named after districts around Newcastle (which is where a couple of them came from), and a few other machines (PDP-11s, microVAXen, a couple of Suns, a Mac, etc) named by their previous owners. The network printers are star (a Star Laserprinter8), twinkle (big HP colour deskjet), and coruscor (made up word, an HP LJ5M PostScript printer). Most of the rest are functional names (the GatorBox is gator, the LANmodem is lanmodem, and the ATM switches and bridges are named after their colours: orange (ATM-Ethernet), red (ATM-FDDI), purple (route server), magenta (ATM switch)). -- Pete Peter Turnbull Network Manager University of York

22 years, 10 months

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Naming schemes (was upcoming classiccmp wierdness)

by pete＠dunnington.u-net.com

On Oct 18, 18:47, Jochen Kunz wrote: > On 2003.10.18 06:40 Pete Turnbull wrote: > > > Mine are an assortment of groups. > My "primary" names are James, MissSophie, SirTobie, MrWinterbottom and > AdmVonSchneider. If you don't know these names, well, I can't explain > the origin. You have to see the film. ;-) "Dinner For One". I've not see it for years, though. It should be "Toby" though, not "Tobie" :-) -- Pete Peter Turnbull Network Manager University of York

22 years, 10 months

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OT, but REALLY funny -- Killer Helium Blimps!

by kyrrin＠bluefeathertech.com

I know this is off-topic, but we all could use a good laugh. NOTE: Remove all furry, feathered, or scaly critters from your lap, shoulders, or wherever, and put down all spillable and snortable substances, BEFORE you read this! http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?threadid=160851 Other than that, enjoy! ;-) -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Bruce Lane, Owner & Head Hardware Heavy, Blue Feather Technologies -- http://www.bluefeathertech.com ARS KC7GR (Formerly WD6EOS) since 12-77 -- kyrrin(a)bluefeathertech.com "Quando Omni Flunkus Moritati" (Red Green, aka Steve Smith)

22 years, 10 months

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PDP-11/34A's, 11/05, PDP-8/I backplane for sale in Northern VA

by wrljet＠yahoo.com

Thanks for all the replies to my post. All the PDP-11 stuff has been paid for, picked up, and has gone to a good home. The PDP-8/I backplane is most likely spoken for. Bill

22 years, 10 months

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list status

by jwest＠classiccmp.org

Well, I had a very bad time with mailman and sendmail today. I was assuming the problem was with sendmail. After screwing around with it all day, I'm not so sure the problem is sendmail. I found the following items: 1) A LOT of people on the list have very slow mailservers. This is bad in conjuction with the way mailman queues messages. 2) All the junk email coming into the list gets a "your post awaits moderator approval" return email, and most of those domains don't exist, or have servers that are extremely bogged down, also causing a problem with the way mailman queues messages. 3) Mailman queues messages in very large groups. A single post to the list generates 4 emails, each one with around 150 recipients. When sendmail processes one of these single messages, as it sends to one of the recipients and encounters a VERY slow mail server, everyone else on the recipient list just sits and waits. The delays are... to me... well... horrid. 4) When I set mailman to send one email per recipient, sendmail still only had one runner processing the queue. Of course, the same problem exists them as #3. Everything I tried seemed to make it the same or worse. I tried starting a separate localhost only daemon of sendmail which doesn't do DNS lookups, setting the outbound sendmail daemon for persistant queueing, put in a caching only nameserver on the mailserver, set mailman to send one recipient per message, etc. before running out of time to work on this. I suspect that this all started with the upgraded mailman, this version apparently has it's own message queueing and is very different from previous versions. I've kinda hit the point of not being able to see the forest for the trees, so if someone is up on mailman and sendmail I'd appreciate some insight. If you have some thoughts (besides "dude, switch to using XXXXX for your MTA"), please email me directly so I get the email quickly. In response to the people who have suggested replacing sendmail... I would like to call attention to what the website for mailman says. Bear in mind, the mailman camp is somewhat anti-sendmail, instead favoring qmail, exim, and postfix. However, note what THEY say about sendmail... "Moreover, with appropriate work, sendmail can be configured to be the fastest and highest-volume general-purpose MTA on the planet." This is in the section where they compare sendmail to exim, qmail, and postfix. So I'm not the only one who believes in sendmail. I put things back the way they originally were. I'll ponder it over the weekend. Regards, Jay West jwest(a)classiccmp.org --- [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus]

22 years, 10 months

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TinyC, port to HP

by dwight.elvey＠amd.com

Hi Bob The boot loader for my Nicolet is similar in that it over writes itself. It fits into about 15 words so it is quite easy to toggle in. They even took advantage of the 'don't care' fields in some instructions to take advantage of minimizing switch changes. Even the memory location is chosen because it is has bits that fit well in adjacent instructions. It is quite remarkable that they can squeeze so much into so few instructions. I have written a boot loader that I use to transfer data to and from an H89 ( Heathkit ) computer that takes about 52 bytes. Most is com port initializing. It was nice when the hardware was jumper configured. The loader would be much smaller. The loader is such that I can send it by email and someone can bring a H89 up from scratch. They just need a couple of blank 10 sectored disks and my code. Later Dwight >From: "Bob Shannon" <bshannon(a)tiac.net> > >Oh no, many HP boot loaders use self modifying code. > >Take a look at the source for the H 264X terminal boot rom, it alters an >instruction by >using it as the target for an increment-and-skip-on-zero instuction. HP >took great pains >to squeeze some boot loaders into only 64 words. As a result you have >to reload these >loaders from ROM each time they run. > >ben franchuk wrote: > >> Tony Duell wrote: >> >>>>> C requires a stack pointer and a index register.Offhand I don't >>>>> think your hardware supports that. >>>> >>>> >>>> Certain HP2xxx do have index registers (the ones with the EIG >>>> instructions >>>> IIRC), but guess how FORTRAN compilers handle indexed array accesses >>> >>> >>> >>> Err, self-modifying code? That was the traditional way to do this >>> sort of thing. >> >> >> I think the PC is noted more more self-modifying code than the old >> machines. The only real self modifying code (on your typical early >> machine) is the fact the return address is placed in the first word >> of subroutine code. >> >>> -tony >>> >> >> >> >> >> > > >

22 years, 10 months

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TinyC, port to HP

by jwest＠classiccmp.org

I am looking for full source code for a *VERY* tiny C compiler written in any common assembly language. I'm much more concerned with size of the compiler than functionality/features. Can anyone suggest one or know where the source might by laying around? I thought I had heard ages ago about some microcomputer C compilers being well under 32K. As to how this relates to classiccmp... well.. *blush* I'm actually thinking of porting C to the HP2100. The whole thing has to fit in 32K of ram, including drivers, etc. Not sure what OS it will be placed on, perhaps HP-IPL/OS. Might make a simple native OS for it or might even make it standalone, not sure yet. Did I recently post about being overcomitted? heh Jay --- [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus]

22 years, 10 months

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Funny vintage gaming article

by evan947＠yahoo.com

http://www.egmmag.com/article2/0,4364,1338730,00.asp

22 years, 10 months

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DEC AlphaServer 2100

by vcf＠siconic.com

I picked up a DEC AlphaServer 2100 today. Is anyone interested in it? It has what I believe to be a RAID array. I haven't looked inside yet. Anyone interested in making an offer? I don't think I want to keep it. -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ]

22 years, 10 months

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still testing

by jwest＠classiccmp.org

please ignore Not sure sure the problem is sendmail. There is much wailing and gnashing of teeth going on here *sigh* --- [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus]

22 years, 10 months

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test please ignore

by jwest＠classiccmp.org

testing --- [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus]

22 years, 10 months

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Recommendations for archiving audio tapes

by dundas＠caltech.edu

I have a number of old DECUS U.S. Symposium audio tapes that I would like to archive before they completely disintegrate. I have a way to digitize these and store them in a variety of formats. I'm not sure what format is best for archive and distribution, though I assume something like WAV or AIFF for archive and MP3 for distribution. I have no prior experience at this and would appreciate any suggestions on the best approach. Also suggestions on who to contact to make these archives legally available on the web would be welcome. Is anyone else archiving these? As a teaser, here's what I have: 1987 Fall: N008 Understanding Ethernet N037 Cryptographic Security for Ethernet DA054 Optimizing VMS device Drivers for Realtime I/O V104 Tape 1 VAX Magic, War Stories, and Horror Tales V104 Tape 2 1988 Fall: PC031 Internal Enhancements to AppleTalk for VMS NE050 An Introduction to the Digital's Distributed Name Service (DNS) GR054 Renderman: A 3D Scene Description Interface for Computer Graphics System GR033F Computer Graphic and Visualization Thanks, John

22 years, 10 months

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testing testing

by jwest＠classiccmp.org

another test - please ignore --- [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus]

22 years, 10 months

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upcoming classiccmp wierdness

by RCini＠congressfinancial.com

And of course there should be an "Uncle Donald" around there somewhere :-) -----Original Message----- From: cctalk-bounces(a)classiccmp.org [mailto:cctalk-bounces@classiccmp.org]On Behalf Of Jay West Sent: Friday, October 17, 2003 8:38 AM To: cctalk(a)classiccmp.org Subject: upcoming classiccmp wierdness I finally have carved out a little time to work on the sendmail config for huey (the classiccmp list server). I know exactly what needs to be done and there are several ways to do it, I'm not sure which way is best. Hence, I will be experimenting a bit today and possibly over the week. During that time, expect some oddity from the list. I'll keep you posted on the progress. Trivia note - Why did I name the classiccmp list server machine huey? The first computer I ever used was an HP 2000 TSB system in highschool. It's name was Huey. I couldn't resist the nostalgia. We also had a PDP-11/03 with RT-11 & TSX-plus. It was named Dewey. So if classiccmp ever gets split to another machine, it will be called (you guessed it) Dewey. Three? Well, Louie of course :) Jay West --- [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus]

22 years, 10 months

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upcoming classiccmp wierdness

by jwest＠classiccmp.org

I finally have carved out a little time to work on the sendmail config for huey (the classiccmp list server). I know exactly what needs to be done and there are several ways to do it, I'm not sure which way is best. Hence, I will be experimenting a bit today and possibly over the week. During that time, expect some oddity from the list. I'll keep you posted on the progress. Trivia note - Why did I name the classiccmp list server machine huey? The first computer I ever used was an HP 2000 TSB system in highschool. It's name was Huey. I couldn't resist the nostalgia. We also had a PDP-11/03 with RT-11 & TSX-plus. It was named Dewey. So if classiccmp ever gets split to another machine, it will be called (you guessed it) Dewey. Three? Well, Louie of course :) Jay West --- [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus]

22 years, 10 months

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TI-52 manual

by mmcfadden＠cmh.edu

Actually the first calculator I bought in graduate school was a TI-52, I still have it and the manual. Please email me an address and I will email you a scan of the manual. My battery packs are shot but I have saved them. I also have the case. The 52 could do factorials and logs. It was really handy for computing probabilities using factorials for my statistics classes. When I first went to college they had a remedial class for students who didn't know how to use a slide rule. I already knew how since my grandfather gave me one in 6th grade. I used a slide rule all through college until 1975 when I bought a calculator. Mike m m c f a d d e n a t c m h . e d u > Hi, my name is Tobias and i own a TI-52 calculator. As it was given to me, i'd really like > to program it(thoug it's as old as me). > But this model is too old, and i can't get a manual for it. > > So i'd like to enquire whether you know how to get a manual for the TI-52. > > Thanks in advance! > > best regards > Tobias Petschke >

22 years, 10 months

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TinyC, port to HP

by dwight.elvey＠amd.com

>From: "Jim Battle" <frustum(a)pacbell.net> > >Dwight K. Elvey wrote: >... >> In any case, I never understood the stigma of using self >> modifying code. It does require careful documentation if >> it is expected to be maintained. There is no reason why >> it can't be as robust as any other code if done properly. >> I suspect it was used as a sales talk when someone was >> trying to pitch their version of code to be better than >> someone else's. Such things as overlays would qualify as >> more risky uses of self modifying code but that is done >> without mention. > >Obvious drawbacks -- > >doesn't work if you ROM the code > >indeterminate behavior on certain chips that have instruction caches. >the data cache snoops and invalidates the write address, but the >instruction cache doesn't snoop and so requires an explicit flush (eg, >the i860). > >even if the icache snoops the write, it can have a performance impact >depending how often the code is modified since it can result in a full >instruction pipe flush. > >even without caches, there can be a race between the data being written >and the instruction fetch path. some self modifying code that works >reliably on a 386 may not work on a 486. > >in an interrupt driven environment, such code is unlikely to be >reentrant/thread safe/interrupt safe. > >it is harder to maintain. > >but, I agree, sometimes a coder has to do what a coder has to do. > > Hi I should have mentioned the issues with instruction caches and pipelines. After all, our K8 is heavy into this. I was thinking more in terms of small micros or even in the case where there is a well defined cache that can be used to advantage. Anytime one does something out of the ordinary, one needs to make it clear all of the restrictions and such of how it is to be used. One of the examples of how a known cache can be to advantage is like the adsp2100 works. It has a 6 instruction cache so that it can do things like over write the current instructions in memory for an overlay while running the loader code from the cache. It does need the interrupts disabled but this can be handy for something like a flash update. Dwight

22 years, 10 months

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testing number 2

by jwest＠classiccmp.org

testing again - please ignore --- [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus]

22 years, 10 months

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testing

by jwest＠classiccmp.org

Just testing... please ignore. Jay West --- [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus]

22 years, 10 months

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DEC Pro 350 For Sale

by ohh＠drizzle.com

Hey, all: I'm meeting the nicest people lately. :) I've run into someone who has a DEC Pro 350 which he'd like to sell to a respectful owner. Here's his description of the system: > DEC Pro-350 (circa fall 1983) > 10GB drive > 2 400K floppies (400K each? 800K each? now I don't remember) > VT-220 style keyboard and display > hang-on copyholder for the monitor > vertical stand for the system unit > all P/OS diskettes and manuals > RSX-11M disks and manuals (some are copies) > Original boxes (unsure of the condition) > > LA-100PC printer > extra ribbons (if I can find them) - reinkable > some rom cartridges including Epson MX-80 emulation (again - if I can > find them) > no box - sorry > > The BIOS battery is probably dead by now, but it's 3 AAA nicads if I > remember. Other than that, it's ready to go. I found it an encouraging sign that he regretted not having the original printer box. :) Anyway, anyone who has an interest and/or questions and/or offers can contact the owner directly. His name's Ron Hansen, his e-mail is <ogre(a)brainlink.com>, and from the e-mails we've exchanged he sounds like a nice guy. :) Thanks! -O.-

22 years, 10 months

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ASR33 Late comments

by kandres＠epssecurity.com

Message: 16 Date: Sat, 11 Oct 2003 09:04:11 -0400 From: Ian Primus <ian_primus(a)yahoo.com> Subject: Re: ASR33 Teletype interfacing To: "General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts" <cctalk(a)classiccmp.org> Message-ID: <67FFB9E5-FBEB-11D7-86CD-000393D7845A(a)yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed I am late in an response to this ASR33 discussion but the comments here definitely hit some memory banks buried deep. In the early 70's, I recall that 120VDC was the source for 60ma current loop to teletype, and it seems to me that "full-duplex" had the send side sourced from the teletype and the receive side sourced from the connected transmission equipment. There was something special that was done to "echo" at the local printout any typed keys, It seems that it was jumpers at the transmission equipment between the incoming "xmit" current and the outgoing "Rcvd" current, again it must have put them in series. It also rings in my head that the interfaces changed when 20ma came out and they could not be intermixed. A machine would be either 60ma or 20ma and required an overhaul to change it. 20ma was a result of reduced physical part requirements for robustness and EMF splatter reduction. Test equipment of the time put out "RY's", and that was almost a perfect square wave at 120Vdc, 60ma as I remember. I have conveniently forgotten most of what we did to repair these units, but I do remember a tank where the units were given a bath in something??? If air couldn't get things cleared and freed up, it got a bath then a complete relube???!!!! The comments to "running open were correct. That is the sign that no current was available to the unit. The current kept it "held". On Thursday, October 9, 2003, at 04:52 PM, Tom Jennings wrote: >> I have been attempting to get my ASR33 teletype connected to something >> and communicating, but so far I have not been successful. I have built >> the interface here : >> http://www.daedalus.co.nz/~don/computing/20mahack.html > > > It wont work, sorry... > Somehow I'm not surprised. Something told me that it was too simple to work properly. > Teletypes are inductive loads. Though they only want 20 mils, the > voltage needs to be high to get the initial magnet pull-in (basic RL > theory). ASR33 loops were generally run at 100V or so, but I run my > Model 28 at 14V, with non-perfect error rate, and I don't use the > keyboard. I take it that the voltage isn't that crucial, just the current? > The keyboard and printer are IN SERIES. If you hit keys while it's > printing you foul it up. Normal. What about on a full duplex machine? Is it the same, or are they separate? > Because it's inductive, it makes a spike when yuo turn the voltage off. > You need to suppress this with a diode, a resistor and capacitor, for > example. > > They're not subtle interfaces, and weren't meant to be. > > If you just want to print, you can rig up a power transistor, two > resistors, a diode, and a high-voltage DC power supply to do the trick, > and drive it from the serial port. > > If you want to receieve also, you can use another transistor and > resistor to pick off the change in loop current that happens when you > press keys which open the loop, and drive the serial port. > > I've done one of these fairly recently, and if poked with a > not-too-sharp stick, I'll scan the schematic and pu on my website. *poke* <grin> If it's not too much trouble, I'd like to see it. From what I have heard, there are lots of ways to do this, and i would be very interested to see how you did it. Thanks! Ian Primus ian_primus(a)yahoo.com --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.528 / Virus Database: 324 - Release Date: 10/16/2003

22 years, 10 months

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Vintage collection for sale

by collectionsale＠quicknet.nl

Please see http://www.fossilicon.com/collectionsale for details and pictures thanks, Sergej

22 years, 10 months

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Seiko RC-1000 wrist terminal software req?

by dave＠mitton.com

Does anyone have a copy of the host system software for the circa 1984 Seiko RC-1000 watch terminal? I thought I had a copy that ran on DOS as a character mode app, but I cannot find the original diskette. The original PC I used is long gone. Dave.

22 years, 10 months

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TinyC, port to HP

by dwight.elvey＠amd.com

>From: "ben franchuk" <bfranchuk(a)jetnet.ab.ca> > >Tony Duell wrote: >>>>C requires a stack pointer and a index register.Offhand I don't think >>>>your hardware supports that. >>> >>>Certain HP2xxx do have index registers (the ones with the EIG instructions >>>IIRC), but guess how FORTRAN compilers handle indexed array accesses >> >> >> Err, self-modifying code? That was the traditional way to do this sort of >> thing. > >I think the PC is noted more more self-modifying code than the old >machines. The only real self modifying code (on your typical early >machine) is the fact the return address is placed in the first word >of subroutine code. > >> -tony >> Hi I don't call this self modifying. Where you have a port command like the 8080 and you overwrite the port address before executing, now that is self modifying. Something like over writing an add instruction with a subtract would qualify as self modifying. Placing the address at the beginning is no different than pushing the address onto a stack, other than that it isn't reentrant ( with out extra code and then not for interrupts ). The first address isn't code, it is a variable space. The executed code never changes. My Nicolet uses the entry address saving method. In any case, I never understood the stigma of using self modifying code. It does require careful documentation if it is expected to be maintained. There is no reason why it can't be as robust as any other code if done properly. I suspect it was used as a sales talk when someone was trying to pitch their version of code to be better than someone else's. Such things as overlays would qualify as more risky uses of self modifying code but that is done without mention. Dwight

22 years, 10 months

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