> From: Alexandre Souza
> Easily done if I had the original part on hand
We have plenty of the original bezels, from which it would be easy to cast molds
(the same part is used on the 11/45 and 11/70, unlike the rest of the front
console).
The real issue in any front panel recreation is going to be the switches (not
the plastic toggles, the actual electrical device). Both the /45 and /70 used
the now-apparently-unobtainium version with the intergral metal plate to hold
the switch in place in a metal holder plate. So a recreation front panel is
going to have to have some new mechanical design, to allow use of standard
micro-switches - and that's probably going to mean a re-design of the plastic
toggles, as those attached to side-plates on the original toggle switches.
(That's all a bit difficult to describe in words; a picture will make it
obvious, if anyone wants to know more.)
I wonder how big an order of switches would be required before some
switch-making firm could be convinced to do a run? Maybe whoever made the
'back in the day' still has the tooling to do so gathering dust in an old
room....
> From: David C. Jenner
> How about making a version for a REAL PDP-11/70 front panel, and one
> for a REAL PDP-11/45 front panel, for those of us who have such stashed
> away waiting for the right simulator to come along...
To do that is going to require exactly emulating the interface to the CPU,
which is not going to be entirely trivial. Physically, the signals all come
over flat ribbon cables to standard Berg connectors, so that won't be hard,
but I doubt the interface is documented, someone will have to puzzle it out
by reading prints - and probably looking at a working one with a logic
analyzer.
Also, powering the front console requires an unusual AMP connector shell,
although that may still be available? And of course one could always bodge
the power connection...
Noel
> Alas, it's DPDT, not SPST.
Ooops; the ones in the PDP-11 front panels (/05, /45, /70 and almost
certainly the /40 too) are SPDT, not SPST (typing too fast, in my excitement
that these have finally been found :-).
I looked at the data sheet for the ones you found, and it's actually a sheet
for the whole series, from which it looks virtually certain that the right
ones (both pemanent and momentary contact) can be ordered from C+K. It's just
a matter of working out what the part number would be!
Noel
> From: Johnny Billquist
> the switch to TCP/IP only happened in 1982-1983. So while the
> "internet" (well, ARPANET actually) existed before then, it was not
> TCP/IP based.
The conversion of the _ARPANET_ from NCP to TCP/IP happened on 1 January,
1983. However, 'the Internet' (in the sense of a grouping of networks over
which TCP/IP packets flowed) had been around for some time before that, both
as i) a testbed for developing the TCP/IP protocols and software used for
that cutover, and ii) for network service to machines which couldn't get an
ARPANET port (remember that at that point in time, there were no personal
computers, just time-sharing systems).
The history of TCP/IP and the Internet up until that point is complicated (I
lived through it, so I should remember, but alas the memory dims :-), but the
first use for actual service (as opposed to testing software, demos, etc)
would have been a year or two before that - exactly when is somewhat lost in
in the mists of time.
Although the ARPANET pre-dated the Internet, it was used to carry TCP/IP
traffic (directly, not inside NCP - the protocol used between hosts on the
ARPANET before TCP/IP) long before the cutover; it was _the_ long-haul
network in the early Internet, and connected together all the various local
TCP/IP 'hot spots' (to use modern jargon).
'All' that happened on January 1, 1983 was that the ability of the ARPANET to
carry NCP packets was disabled. Of course, in the months prior to that, all
the ARPANET hosts which didn't _already_ have TCP/IP running (many did, to
speak to other machines locally which didn't have ARPANET ports) went through
a big thrash to get TCP/IP software, and get it installed, tested and running.
Noel
Hi,
>> Oscar is already working on another very promising product.
>> [..]He will
also pay a visit to my "museum" to take a few measurements.
Sorry, can't say more
>> I'll leave that up to Oscar. Perhaps he
want to stay "below the radar" until that project is finished ...
Thanks for the kind words on my strange replica mania! We all need to do silly things at some point in our lives.
No secret... I'd love to do an "Open Source Hardware" PDP-11/70 replica (or remake - whatever choice of words is preferred). Electronically, it would a simple variation on the PiDP-8 (i.e., simh brains on a Raspberry Pi, hiding behind a front panel PCB). It's just a different emulator from the simh stable with less LEDs.
But a 11/70 replica needs two physical 'cosmetic elements': proper switches, and the white bezel/frame. The switches *seem* to be feasible to produce cheaply (I will know in a month with PDP-8/I switches...). The white bezel though brings me into unknown territory. 3D CAD (based on Museum Measurements), then injection molding or vacuum forming. Or any technique to produce a plastic object in medium quantities. All I know so far is that it's very feasible - and much cheaper to do than just a few years ago.
If anyone here *does* have know-how in this field, I'd love any advice. I got some preliminary quotes and recommendations on making a case replica using vacuum forming. Which is relatively cheap. Not perfect, but low cost is very important for such a gadget.
Kind regards,
Oscar.
Has anyone heard from Terry Gulczynski (http://stack180.com/) since
October 12? I've been waiting for him to tell me it's okay to send him a
P112 kit for assembly and testing. Now I'm worrying that something may
have happened to him. He lives in Daytona Beach, Florida.
--
David Griffith
dave at 661.org
A: Because it fouls the order in which people normally read text.
Q: Why is top-posting such a bad thing?
A: Top-posting.
Q: What is the most annoying thing in e-mail?
I'm not sure if the author of this nice bit of work is on here, but I'm
looking at a board for this, the Altera DE-1. Unfortunately there are a
plethora of Altera DE-1 boards and much puzzlement by me as to whether
this is the right one. The page with the info is deficient in details
to tell.
The actual part which the author used is the key thing here, and not
just the name of the board. I'd appreciate opinions here as to whether
these will run PDP2011 or whether it will be a nice learning board for
my mistake pile.
http://pdp2011.sytse.net/wordpress/pdp-11/fpga-boards/de1/
There is currently what I think is a good specimen available if anyone
is interested.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/131621388597
It includes the software and docs. The current one I have was a student
version sans the documents and software.
I hope to get the thing going to play with sometime soon. There are so
many small boards out there for very little money once I get this done
and understand more about targeting this board and others I'd like to
see how cheap a board this could be made to run with give the current
boards.
There is currently an Arm/fpga Zilog chip board now made available that
would be a nifty board to make into a PDP11 if it comes out as cheap as
they promise it to be.
thanks
Jim
Hello,
I have been servicing an HP 85A and an HP 85B desktop computer (printer belts, tape drive capstan). While the key caps of the "A" model are plugged into yellow plungers (according to the service manual the manufacturer is "STACKPOLE") the "B" came with white plungers ("Hi TEK" according to the svc. manual).
The yellow plungers were all in good condition, while several of the white plungers are split along one or two edges. I understand that this is a common problem with these HiTek keys. The HP 85B suffers from this problem especially on the space bar which gets stuck when depressed.
So my question is: is there a way to repair (glue? melt?) these split plungers or are there replacement/alternative plungers available to replace the white HI TEK parts? I would need at least one (ideally more like 5) as the remaining broken plungers are still working. These keys seem to be used also in some VT100, DECWriter and even some Ti-99/4 keyboards.
If I cannot find a replacement, I would probably drill a lot of small holes into the plunger, glue it to the key cap, and then rework the outer dimensions so that it slides smoothly into the casing. But then I would probably not be able to remove the key caps later, after snapping it back into the casing - sort of one way fix with some risk.
Thank you for any recommendations,
Martin
--------------------------
Deutsches Zentrum f?r Luft- und Raumfahrt e.V. (DLR)
German Aerospace Center
Institute of Aerodynamics and Flow Technology | Lilienthalplatz 7 | 38108 Braunschweig | Germany
Dr.-Ing. Martin Hepperle | Aircraft Design and Configuration Aerodynamics
Telephone +49 531 295-3337 | Telefax +49 531 295-2320 |
E-Mail: Martin.Hepperle at dlr.de<mailto:Martin.Hepperle at dlr.de>
Internet: www.DLR.de<http://www.dlr.de/>
Oscar,
I am very excited to hear about your PiDP-11 project. I also would urge you to go to 1:1 scale for the PDP-11/70 panel and also utilize the classic Purple and Pink color scheme.
I saw Henk's PDP-11/70 reanimation and dreamed of doing one some day, and then saw Jorge Hoppe's work and contacted him when I finally was able to obtain a PDP-11/70 front panel. It was one of the later DECsystem 570 styles in Blue, light Blue and White. My project is detailed on Jorg's website as well as his projects which not only include a PDP-11/70 but also a KI-10!! Anyway interested is learning about these projects or just want to see a virtual PDP-11/70 running RSX11M+ on their Windows or Linux PCs should check out:
http://retrocmp.com/projects/pdp-11-70-panel-on-blinkenbone/243-simulated-p…http://retrocmp.com/projects/pdp-11-70-panel-on-blinkenbone/189-pdp-11-70-c…
You hit upon one of the key needs for these projects, a good replica bezel. In my project I had to have a plexiglass bezel laser cut then used white plastic to frame that bezel. It works but I would love to have a replica bezel.
So I have thought about two other approaches to thermoforming. One is to make a silicone mold which then can be used to make new bezels from polyurethane. A video about that approach uses a 3D printed part to create a silicone mold which is then cut in half and the silicone is now the mold for more rigid polyurethane which is poured into the mold sealed allowed to cure then the part is removed and a new part is cast. It's not extremely fast like injection molding, but it could be used to make a mold from an original part if necessary.
see https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k7bNFT4Dcs4
The second approach is something I used many years ago to produce some solvent resistant two holed stoppers for a lab instrument. I found some PVC stoppers that worked very well but the lab supply house quit selling them. I have a M.S. in Polymer Chemistry and was familiar with PVC plastisol that when heated to about 180 C then cooled makes a tough somewhat flexible rubber like material. If you were a child in the 1960s you may have done this with a "Thingmaker"
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Creepy_Crawlers
The "Plasticgoop" is the PVC plasticsol and it can be made with a wide range of hardnesses and pigmented to any color as the PVC plasticsol is clear (It is what Tygon tubing is made from). To use this approach you would need a metal mold but it would not need to hold pressure like an injection molding machine. The heating can be done on a hot plate and monitored with an IR thermometer. In the day we could get a part from the mold about every 8 to 10 minutes by quenching with cold water.
One other comment I would make is that it would be great to modified the SImh V4.0 to work with the PDP-11 front panel. Most of the code supporting the panels are either V3.8 or V3.9. These front panel reanimations should be part of the Simh development.
Also, thanks for your wonderful PiDP-8 !! i would never have been able to afford a real PDP-8 to learn about them
Mark
Hi,
>> Oscar is already working on another very promising product.
>> [..]He will
also pay a visit to my "museum" to take a few measurements.
Sorry, can't say more
>> I'll leave that up to Oscar. Perhaps he
want to stay "below the radar" until that project is finished ...
Thanks for the kind words on my strange replica mania! We all need to do silly things at some point in our lives.
No secret... I'd love to do an "Open Source Hardware" PDP-11/70 replica (or remake - whatever choice of words is preferred). Electronically, it would a simple variation on the PiDP-8 (i.e., simh brains on a Raspberry Pi, hiding behind a front panel PCB). It's just a different emulator from the simh stable with less LEDs.
But a 11/70 replica needs two physical 'cosmetic elements': proper switches, and the white bezel/frame. The switches *seem* to be feasible to produce cheaply (I will know in a month with PDP-8/I switches...). The white bezel though brings me into unknown territory. 3D CAD (based on Museum Measurements), then injection molding or vacuum forming. Or any technique to produce a plastic object in medium quantities. All I know so far is that it's very feasible - and much cheaper to do than just a few years ago.
If anyone here *does* have know-how in this field, I'd love any advice. I got some preliminary quotes and recommendations on making a case replica using vacuum forming. Which is relatively cheap. Not perfect, but low cost is very important for such a gadget.
Kind regards,
Oscar.
2 units one tape puncher thing the other table top ksr 28 other thing a
Powersupply
Ed Sharpe
In a message dated 10/22/2015 5:57:22 P.M. US Mountain Standard Time,
unclefalter at yahoo.ca writes:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Teletype-equipment-1-model-28-writer-1-reperforater-
1-50vdc-supply-etc-/121791042544?hash=item1c5b4fd3f0:g:UR8AAOSwnDZUJHWs
On a sudden impulse, I put in a bid for an HP1663A logic analyzer for
$30 and won for $29. Just got the thing--it's essentially in like-new
condition--not even a scratch, no CRT burn and comes with the original
set of pods and grabbers. Not so much as a fingerprint anywhere--even
the line cord is clean. Must have come from a rental place.
I've got the user and programming manuals, but that keyboard jack in the
back has me befuddled. It's an RJ45 modular jack with the middle 4
positions populated. The manual only refers to it as a "standard"
keyboard and mouse connector. What does that mean, exactly? What kind
of signals does this "standard" keyboard use?
Thanks,
Chuck
