test-drb

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101090 discussions

More mystery recycler boards - DEC, Fujitsu(??), Cipher, Emulex

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

> From: Pete Turnbull >> The other thing that makes no sense is that the KDJ11-B (M8190) has >> all that extra circuitry on it to support PMI, etc - all of which is >> unused in the 11/73 application! Why not just plug in a (presumably >> cheaper) M8192? In the /73 application, the two are basically equivalent. > Don't forget the LTC :-) ?? The KDJ11-A has an on-board LTC - see EK-KDJ1A-UG-001, pg. 1-7. > Otherwise, you'd need an additional bootstrap card such as an MRV11-D > with -B2 boot ROMs, a DLVE1 (DLV11-JE) for the SLUs, something with an > LTC, and termination. Err, the KDJ11-A has on-board termination: see MP-01890 pg. 1 of 9, on the LHS. > A BDV11 wouldn't work as it doesn't have the ROM capability ?? The BDV11 is a ROM board? (And it works fine in a Q22 bus; the address recognition circuitry uses BBS7, it doesn't look at BDAL 16 and above.) Noel

9 years, 5 months

National MM57409 "Super Number Cruncher", MM57109 "Number Oriented Processor"

by spacewar＠gmail.com

I finally got my hands on a couple of MM57409 "Super Number Cruncher" chips with 1985 date codes. I think it was probably introduced around 1982. It's a NMOS part with the same concept (though not compatible with) the earlier PMOS MM57109 "Number Oriented Processor", which was introduced in 1977. In both cases, National took their existing 4-bit masked-ROM microcontroller designs (MM5799 PMOS, COP440 NMOS), and the floating point code they'd already written for calculator chips, and turned them into math coprocessors. The MM57109 also had some support for acting as a floating point general purpose processor. The COP4xx has a test mode, so I should be able to dump the ROM of the MM57409. The MM5799 almost certainly had a test mode as well, but I haven't uncovered any documentation for it, so the ROM might have to be dumped optically. The MM57109 uses an 8-digit mantissa, and a divide takes an average of 78ms, and worst-case 223ms. The MM57409 has a 12-digit mantissa, and worst-case dvidie time is 66ms, with no average stated. Both also have a reasonably full complement of functions that would be found on a typical scientific calculator, including transcendentals. Both are quite slow compared to contemporary math coprocessors such as the AMD Am9511A (second-source by Intel as the 8231A), and insanely slow compared to the 8087. I'm tempted to wire up one of these (either kind) to an Apple II, and hack Applesoft to use it as a floating point decelerator. Back in the day, a few companies sold Am9511A cards for the Apple II. Of course, since Applesoft uses binary floating point but these National Semiconductor chips use BCD, the necessary conversion code running on the 6502 would make it even slower. Perhaps Atari BASIC would be a better choice as it used BCD.

9 years, 5 months

HP-35/45 Simulator for PDP-8

by kevenm＠reeltapetransfer.com

There is a nice HP-16C emulator for Windows - and Android. http://www.wrpn.emmet-gray.com/ Also has Java version (and sources) Keven Miller > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Marc Howard" <cramcram at gmail.com> > To: "General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts" > <cctalk at classiccmp.org> > Sent: Wed 07 Sep 2016 09:53 AM > Subject: Re: HP-35/45 Simulator for PDP-8 > > >> I'd vote for the HP-1xC line myself. You can get 5 different calculators >> (financial, 3 x scientific and programmer) for nearly the effort of the >> first one. >> >> The HP-16C (http://www.hpmuseum.org/hp16.htm) would be especially helpful >> as it can easily be converted to calculate with a 12 bit with carry width >> and octal operation with just a few keystrokes. Even does 1's >> complement/18 bits if you happen to have a PDP-1 lying around. >

9 years, 5 months

More mystery recycler boards - DEC, Fujitsu(??), Cipher, Emulex

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

> From: Pete Turnbull > all microPDP-11/73 machines had an M8190. The M8192 was mostly sold as > an OEM board. That's so bizarre (although the "Supermicrosystems Handbook", which covers the 11/73, confirms it used the KDJ11-B). So the KDJ11-A (M8192) was not used in any 'PDP-11/xx'? The other thing that makes no sense is that the KDJ11-B (M8190) has all that extra circuitry on it to support PMI, etc - all of which is unused in the 11/73 application! Why not just plug in a (presumably cheaper) M8192? In the /73 application, the two are basically equivalent. (OK, there are two built in serial lines on the M8190 - big whoop.) Both have 8KB caches (although the one in the M8190 has slightly fancier tagging, IIRC), etc, etc. Maybe it's the ROM (which the M8190 has, but not the M8192)? Noel

9 years, 5 months

ENIAC Simulator

by blstuart＠bellsouth.net

Unfortunately, I won't be able to make it to VCFMW this year. (Those of you who don't know me are probably thinking "So what?" Those who do are probably split between "Aww, that's too bad" and "Good; he's a pain in the...") In lieu of my "sparkling personality" I'm making available the ENIAC simulator I would have exhibited had I committed to coming early enough to reserve a table. If you attended VCFSE or VCFE this year, you may have seen an early version of the simulator. It's now at a beta testable level of operation. The files you'll want to download and some minimal instructions for use are at: http://cs.drexel.edu/~bls96/eniac/eniac.html It's written in Go, so you should be able to compile it on a variety of platforms. For those not wanting to compile it themselves, I've included binaries for several options including Linux/amd64, Linux/arm, FreeBSD/amd64, FreeBSD/i386, MacOS/amd64, and Win/amd64. The Windows version has not been tested at all, and only minimal testing has been done on the Mac version. You'll also need TCL/Tk installed to get the wish program available as used by the GUI. Suggestions, comments, criticisms, and questions are welcome, but it will probably be a few weeks before I'll be able to make time to do anything about them. Enjoy. BLS

9 years, 5 months

RK05 packs

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

So I have a fairly large group of 16-sector RK05 packs (i.e. PDP-8, -12) which I have no use for, which I would like to trade for 12-sector RK05 packs (i.e. PDP-11). Anyone have any of the latter, and need the former? Alternatively, if anyone has any head-crashed 12-sector RK05 packs, I would be interested in buying them (or trading something else) for them. (I am reliably informed that one can replace the platter on an RK05 pack without too much work, so I'd transplant the 12-sector hubs into the packs I already have). (Replies to me, please, not the whole list - unless there's some point you wish to make which would be of general interest.) Noel

9 years, 5 months

Odd memory error in PDP-11/04

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

> From: Ethan Dicks Let's look at this one first, this is probably the easier to solve. >>> 2) Setting D10 in location 000000 results in D10 set in all the >>> locations >> Sorry, didn't follow that? Did you mean that if you store 02000 in >> location 0, all other locations now report the 02000 bit set? > Only 04000, but, yes. Ah. That's D11. :-) > If I set that bit in location 0, or other locations, it gets set in all > locations. If I clear that bit, it clears. So that's likely in the memory (although I suppose it could be the CPU, _somehow_). It sounds like there's a latch somewhere in the output path (because it affects all locations right away, not just once you've written to them) that's getting set one way or the other, and and then, won't change. I suspect the problem is with the flop for that bit, not in the circuitry that's clearing/clocking that flop, since it only affects that one bit. Looking at the MS11-J prints, there is indeed a '174 latch in the output path; the one for D11 is in E30 (input pin 14, output pin 15). You might want to throw a scope on it, and see if it is indeed acting consistently with the symptoms (to make sure this is actually the cause). Although why it can be either set or reset with a write, but freezes in one state for reads, is puzzling. I'd suspect control circuitry, but it's only that one bit. I don't think it can be something on the input side, because the memory chips have input and output on separate pins, so if something was hanging on the intput side, it shouldn't make it through the chip. > Something appears to have died while I was powered-on and testing last > night and now, the run light goes off right away after hitting boot, > and I don't see the address lines or the data lines flickering. Yeah, sounds like the CPU is halting. It's probably going to take a logic analyzer to figure out what's going wrong. Too bad that machine doesn't have a real front console, that would probably let you figure out what the problem is. Noel

9 years, 5 months

DEC professionals Power Supply ...

by emu＠e-bbes.com

Anybody has a spare one, to sell? With all the discussions about the P350/P380, I went to my storage, and found two p350s without power supplies :( Cheers

9 years, 5 months

RK05 packs

by jnc＠mercury.lcs.mit.edu

> From: Ethan Dicks > 12-sector packs are abundant compared to 16-sector packs Really? Most of the RK05 packs I've seen for sale on eBay in the last couple of years have been 16-sector - so I naturally assumed they were more common. Well, I guess that explains why my offer to trade drew such a response! :-) Noel

9 years, 5 months

SWTPC 6800 weirdness

by vintagecomputer＠bettercomputing.net

My 6800 has been mostly working, but it seems to be occasionally flaking out. I don't know why. Sometimes you go to power it up, and there's no response on terminal side. The 'fix' is sometimes to wiggle the memory/CPU boards and then for some reason it's fine(ish). There are five cards installed right now - the MP-A, MP-S, a heavily modified MP-M board (with rams piggybacked on all the original RAM chips) and then two Digital Research 16k boards. The system was modified for Flex 2.0 Today it flaked again and would not come back up, so I pulled the MP-M board and the MP-A board and swapped slots. It came up, but memory at $0100 was missing. I tried powering up, swapping slots, etc.. same deal. Then I left the machine for an hour, powered up again.. boom.. now $0100 is back. I don't fully understand the addressing system but if that MP-M is configured as $A000 would that cover $0100 as well? I've tried changing the jumpers on each of the DR 16k board to cover $A000.. but the machine will not boot. I will only work with either the MP-M alone or those 16k cards with it configured to other spaces. In other words, the machine does not accept any other card configured for $A000. I'm wondering if anyone has any suggestions on how I might nail this down. I'm thinking some of the RAMs on that MP-M are flaky, but it would be a *nightmare* to try and diagnose it, with all the RAMs piggybacked, all the little jumper wires, and everything soldered. I'd prefer to bypass it and either use my other, less modified MP-M or just the DR boards, which are socketed. If any of you have suggestions on how I might take this MP-M out of the equation that would be awesome! Brad

9 years, 5 months

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