2 actually, currently in Cambs UK and heading for the scrap pile along
with the DEREP. It's rare to see them with complete keyboards!
--
adrian/witchy
Owner of Binary Dinosaurs, the UK's biggest home computer collection?
www.binarydinosaurs.co.uk
This is an auction for a system on Ebay which might be interesting.
It is listed as a "Northstar Horizon" but has what appears to be a
single board system marked Ferguson. That would probably not be from
Northstar.
Also it is built up with 8" floppies which is even less related to
Northstar.
it appears he got a pile for a Northstar system with the Ferguson
homebuilt which is in an Incoterm box which holds the floppies. There is
a listing for a bigboard on bitsavers which is probably for this system.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/400301360595
Price may actually be something if anyone feels a burning need for a
Ferguson board, but I think its high for an ordinary Horizon. Too bad
there is a missing Horizon.
> From: jim s <jws at jwsss.com>
> To: General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts
> <cctalk at classiccmp.org>
> Subject: PDP1 Music / Record sold
> Message-ID: <507F50BC.30102 at jwsss.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
>
> The fellow who posted the record some time back which was titled to be
> PDP1 music reposted the record for $299 and sold it.
>
> the reason to note anything about it is that I had emailed him about
> taking a capture of it and passing it along before selling the record
>
> The ebay listing up right now has a track you can download as long as it
> stays up.
>
> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=170923504018
>
> Here is the link to the song as well.
>
> http://ampnoise.com/mp3/MusicOnThePDP-1X_Pinafore.mp3
>
> I thought it was nice of him to do that, as many people who list things
> on ebay would have bothered. I would say that it was just to sell the
> record, but I think the rarity of it to record collectors and a lower
> price is why it sold.
>
>
Man, what a blast from the past! A friend of mine did some work like
this on a PDP-5,
about 1970, at Washington U.
I think the PDP-1 does a little better, but it was fairly comparable.
Jon
M
From: Dave McGuire <mcguire at neurotica.com>
To: General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts
<cctalk at classiccmp.org>
Subject: Re: fine pitch soldering
Message-ID: <508063F0.2080503 at neurotica.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
On 10/18/2012 12:21 PM, Jon Elson wrote:
> > I have been doing fine-pitch soldering for a long time. I do stuff as
> > fine as
> > 0.4mm lead pitch, which is a bit of a pain. The bulk of stuff I now make
> > with a pick and place machine and a reflow oven (converted toaster oven
> > with thermocouple ramp-and-soak controller).
>
What type of pick-and-place system do you have? I'm looking to move
in that direction.
I got a VERY good deal on a Philips CSM-84. This model can hold up to about
55 8-mm feeders (capacity reduced for larger sizes) and has a vibratory
feeder
option and a large chip alignment station. For small chips and passives
it aligns
with mechanical jaws on the head. it has 3 heads, I have 2 set up with
the jaws
and one with no jaws to use the separate aligner. These machines are also
available with vision, mine does not have that feature. It is a BIG
machine,
5 x 7 feet, and needs compressed air and a fair amount of power. it is
single-phase,
however. It weighs about 1600 Lbs. Note that with all these machines, the
feeders will probably cost more than the used machine.
The CSM-84 is a VERY flexible machine, and easy to program. (The
vision system needs a LOT more programming than the placement section,
but once you have programmed all the parts you use, the vision doesn't
need much attention.) So, I do everything from 0805 up to 30mm FPGAs
with it. It is marginal with .65mm pitch parts, but does great with SO
chips and all passives.
If you look at other machines, check carefully about the range of parts
they handle, and the consumables. Some of these machines eat several
vacuum nozzles at $100 a pop every shift, and guarantee a broken nozzle
on any mis-pick or tumbled part, not to mention actual crashes.
The CSM is VERY robust in comparison, uses steel nozzles and can survive
most crashes without much damage. Having the experience with mine,
I might have been better off to get a machine with vision instead of
the jaw alignment, but it all depends on the kind of stuff you do.
The later machines are generally marked with a /// after the model
to indicate a later computer and brushless servo motors. There is
the CSM-84 VZ which has vision and a Z axis servo, and the
VANE which has vision and the auto nozzle exchanger. Not so sure
about the ANE system, it uses different nozzles, and they look more
fragile. I have made a big nozzle for FPGAs with a lathe and mill
for my machine.
I paid about $3600 for my machine including shipping and about
50 feeders. It cost me more than that to have a double door installed
on my basement to get it inside! Obviously, I had a motivated seller
who needed to get this machine off his floor to make room for new
machines already in transit. Every day I communicated with him,
the deal got sweeter. First, just the machine, then some feeders,
then lots more feeders (all he had) then a box of spare parts.
One thing is to get a machine that is highly regarded by the community
(there are some REAL lemons out there) and be sure to get the manuals
including the service manuals, because something WILL go wrong on
these older machines. They ARE complex, mine has over 50 sensors
and about 25 actuators.
Jon
cctalk-request at classiccmp.org wrote:
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> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
> than "Re: Contents of cctalk digest..."
>
>
> Today's Topics:
>
> 1. Re: fine pitch soldering (Chuck Guzis)
> 2. Re: It lives! (Liam Proven)
> 3. Re: It lives! (Ethan Dicks)
> 4. Re: It lives! (David Riley)
> 5. Re: It lives! (barythrin at gmail.com)
> 6. Re: It lives! (Shoppa, Tim)
> 7. Re: It lives! (John Many Jars)
> 8. Re: PDP1 Music / Record sold (barythrin at gmail.com)
> 9. Re: It lives! (David Brownlee)
> 10. RE: Skipware level, late 2012 (John Foust)
> 11. Re: fine pitch soldering (Dave McGuire)
> 12. Re: Dead LCD monitor? - replace $2 worth of caps - Re:
> Skipware level, late 2012 (John Foust)
> 13. Re: UCSD-P for the WD-900 ? (Eric Smith)
> 14. Re: fine pitch soldering (Dave McGuire)
> 15. Re: fine pitch soldering (Ryan Brooks)
> 16. Re: fine pitch soldering (Chuck Guzis)
> 17. Re: fine pitch soldering (Dave McGuire)
> 18. Re: Desoldering Pump (Paul Anderson)
> 19. Re: An 80386 CPU S-100 Board (Tony Duell)
> 20. Re: An 80386 CPU S-100 Board (Paul Anderson)
> 21. Re: Anyone want a DEC Letterwriter 100? Or a DEREP? (Dave McGuire)
> 22. Re: Anyone want a DEC Letterwriter 100? Or a DEREP? (Dave McGuire)
> 23. Re: An 80386 CPU S-100 Board (Ethan Dicks)
> 24. Re: Anyone want a DEC Letterwriter 100? Or a DEREP? (ben)
> 25. Re: Anyone want a DEC Letterwriter 100? Or a DEREP? (Ethan Dicks)
> 26. Re: An 80386 CPU S-100 Board (mc68010)
> 27. Re: Dead LCD monitor? - replace $2 worth of caps - Re:
> Skipware level, late 2012 (Toby Thain)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2012 10:26:32 -0700
> From: Chuck Guzis <cclist at sydex.com>
> To: General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts
> <cctalk at classiccmp.org>
> Subject: Re: fine pitch soldering
> Message-ID: <50803BC8.3080004 at sydex.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
>
> On 10/18/2012 09:21 AM, Jon Elson wrote:
>
>
>> The MOST important thing is a
>> stereo zoom microscope with a long working distance. A working
>> distance of 2-3" is necessary to get your hands and a soldering iron
>> under it. A ring light can be made from a ring of PC board material
>> that fits around the snout of the microscope. Carve a ring in the
>> copper of the PCB so it becomes two concentric rings. Use a 12 V
>> DC wall-wart power supply and 8 while LEDs, with about 1 K Ohm
>> series resistors.
>>
>
> Agree on the stereo microscope (dissection microscope). I find that the
> CCFL ring lights made for cars and motorcycles are cheap and give much
> more intense and even (shadowless) light. Typical diameter is about 100
> mm and all seem to come with mounting clips or tabs. You can also get
> them in LED, but I find the light from a white CCFL much easier on the
> eyes. Cheap inverters are available to run the CCFL lamps. I use the
> microscope for initial positioning and completed inspection and prefer
> to use a binocular loupe during the actual soldering.
>
>
>> Solder braid can be used to remove excess solder bridging the
>> leads, which WILL happen frequently. For big, high-density
>> chips, this is my procedure: First, put a tiny dab of solder
>> on 2 corner pads. Align the chip with the pads, and solder
>> the corners that have the extra solder.
>>
>
> For large TQFPs, I anchor the chip body to the PCB with a dab of clear
> nail polish, using the microscope for accurate positioning. Once the
> polish has set, I proceed with the corner soldering. I find that I can
> get extremely good registration this way. It's not fast, but it's
> nearly foolproof.
>
> FWIW,
> Chuck
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2012 18:34:58 +0100
> From: Liam Proven <lproven at gmail.com>
> To: "General Discussion: On-Topic Posts Only" <cctech at classiccmp.org>
> Subject: Re: It lives!
> Message-ID:
> <CAMTenCHLomP=yvz6sQsA0VAc4FzqKoJHd4+in98H9GKstg=OYQ at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252
>
> On 18 October 2012 15:41, Francois Dion <francois.dion at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> I thought I had sent this to cctalk, but apparently not. There are now
>> 3 clues up, because I posted about it on tuesday, one hint a day.
>>
>>
>> Guess what computer I brought back from the dead?
>>
>> http://raspberry-python.blogspot.com/2012/10/it-lives-hint-1.html
>>
>> I'm thinking somebody on this list has used one and will recognize it.
>> Just a simple screenshot to start with...
>>
>
> I was going to guess Apple II or that era from the BASIC prompt of ]
> but not given the later hints...
>
>
cctalk-request at classiccmp.org wrote:
> Agree on the stereo microscope (dissection microscope). I find that the
> CCFL ring lights made for cars and motorcycles are cheap and give much
> more intense and even (shadowless) light.
Yes, they are almost perfect. BUT, they are usually too big in
diameter. By custom
making one with LEDs, you can fit it to be completely snug to the microscope
body and sit up against the sides of the microscope, so it is as far out
of the
way as possible. We got a ringlight with a new Chinese scope at work, but
it hung below the bottom of the scope and was over an inch wider than
the scope
itself, so I replaced it with my own LED ring light.
> For large TQFPs, I anchor the chip body to the PCB with a dab of clear
> nail polish, using the microscope for accurate positioning. Once the
> polish has set, I proceed with the corner soldering. I find that I can
> get extremely good registration this way. It's not fast, but it's
> nearly foolproof.
>
I'm doing 0.4mm pitch chips, and have excellent alignment, also, with my
method.
Whatever works for you.
Jon
I find myself in need of a new desoldering pump. I found a number on the
Farnell site, anyone have any recommendations for a good one that does not
cost more than ?25ish (about $40) and for which I can get spare nozzles?
Here is the page:
http://uk.farnell.com/jsp/search/browse.jsp?N=2031+204695&Ntk=gensearch&Ntt=
desolder+pump&Ntx=mode+matchallpartial
Regards
Rob
From: Jason McBrien <jbmcb1 at gmail.com> To: "General Discussion: On-Topic
and Off-Topic Posts" <cctalk at classiccmp.org> Subject: Re: The Most
Wonderfully Ridiculous Movie Computers of All Time
http://www.starringthecomputer.com/feature.html?f=50
Weird analysis about the VAX 780 in Seven - I don't think it's outside the
realm of possibility that a police department would still be using one in
the mid-90's. The college I went to was still chugging along on an old
Amdahl 370-clone in the same time period - as the primary mail server and
host for various licensed apps (mainly SPSS)
I have NO difficulty believing municipal departments would hang on to old
gear as long as it would stay reasonably reliable. And, there is even STILL
no shortage of VAX-11/780 parts at the brokers, if you know how to run
the diags and swap boards. You could even repair the machine at the chip
level with a soldering iron, solder sucker and dikes. There are pretty much
NO custom parts in the entire machine except the fixed microcode fuseible
PROMS, the LSI-11 and the inductors in the power supply modules.
Given IT wasn't the hot cost
center it is today, I'd imagine most police departments would be loathe to
shell out for an upgrade to something that still probably worked just fine.
Now, why the director put that thing the precinct room is another question.
Artistic license?
Now, that is VERY funny! Anyone who has ever walked behind a running
780 with a handful of papers at mid-thigh level knows what those
cooling blowers will do! I can imagine the whole room being filled
with whirling sheaves of paper!
For those who don't know the 780 as well as I do (I was sysadmin
on two of them, and also did a lot of hardware hacking and interfacing
on them) they had 3 one-half Hp (I think) centrifugal blowers that
sucked air down through the card cage and blew it out the back of the
cabinet through 3 fairly small vents. The air shot out at at least
50 MPH, probably more. The 780 has a card cage that ran the entire
length of the ~5' long cabinet, CPU at the left, memory in the middle
and I/O sections at the right, IIRC. (Hmmm, have a vague recollection
maybe the memory was at the left....) Power supply boxes were below the
logic cards, blowers below that, and LSI-11 and it's floppy drive
at the bottom left.
Jon
