test-drb June 2009

test-drb@ccmp.vtda.org

233 participants
404 discussions

chiclassiccomp.org was Re: Mysterious website

by christian_liendo＠yahoo.com

I guess they didn't have permission and had to take it down. I'm sorry I know this is off topic, but why did the Atari group call themselves SCAT!?! >from the site: ============================================================== Chicago Classic Computing! A mailing list for classic/vintage computing collectors and enthusiasts in the Chicago, Northern Illinois and Northwest Indiana area. Everything from 8-bit game consoles to the Big Iron is welcome. Subscribe to chiclassiccomp * * * VINTAGE COMPUTER FESTIVAL MIDWEST 2009 - MORE INFO SOON! * * * Documents Videos Local Clubs and Lists SCAT - Suburban Chicago ATarians Chicago Area Timex/Sinclair Users Group Glenside Color Computer Club (Radio Shack TRS-80 Color Computer) SWRAP - Chicago's Commodore Group Since 1983

14 years, 10 months

Collection to go in San Antonio, TX - repost, now free/pick-up

by mtapley＠swri.edu

All, My friend John Gold has still got a respectable collection in San Antonio that needs to not be his. Surely somebody with a storage shed and a van wants to come by and collect this? He'd like it to all go at once, and not to the dumpster, but I think you can work with him on partial deals. I think at this point the price is "come get it". John can be contacted at: jhgold at stic.net Sorry to pester y'all again with this, but some of the gear in here really looks to me to be worth preserving, and John hasn't got the space to do it. ---------------- Computers IBM 5324 large old work station/main frame HP Pavilion 7370V IBM Power Server 320 Type 7012 Macintosh Power PC G3 M4405 233MHz w/ keyboard & mouse Apple 3 CompuAdd 212 Model A002 Leading Edge DC-3010 PC Clone Tall Tower Eltech desktop clone PC Clone mini tower CompuAdd 325 Desktop Dell Dimension XPS M200S Dell Optiplex GXi Sanyo MBC 550 NEC Power Mate V466 Toshiba T1000 Laptop (2) w/ parts Toshiba T1000SE Laptop (2) NEC Multi Speed Laptop Laser 128 Laptop/Portable Computer IBM PC single 360K w/ HDD 5150 w/ keyboard IBM AT clone NEC Ready 466ES NEC Power Mate 286 AT&T Complete system w/ monitor & keyboard AT&T Box (2) Model 6300 CPU1Z & CPU2 w/ 1 keyboard Compaq Presario 4550 mini tower Atari 400 w/ Cassette drive 410 IBM PS-2 Model 30 8530-001 IBM PS-2 Model 30 286 8530-U21 Packard Bell Legend 300SX 386SX-16 Compaq Prolinea MT4/66 tower GTE Government systems desktop Gateway P4D-66 Monitors IBM terminal 3151 RS-232 & printer ports (2) Atari SC1224 IBM 8513-001 SVGA Zenith Data Systems ZCM 1450DT IBM 5153 CGA Apple 3 monochrome XTRON RTB Technologies CM147E CompuAdd MCH 4095N (1989) WYSE WY50 terminal w/ keyboard Dell VM1 mono (1990) Samsung MA2565 (1989) Packard Bell PB1272A (1988) Standard MCH4095N (1988) IBM 5081-16 Composite Video (1990) Sysdyne CGA (IBM clone) AES SVGA (1996) Samtron SVGA (1989) IBM Terminal 3164-11 (1992) NEC Multisync XV14 IBM 6405301 Serial monitor in box IBM 3164 serial terminal w/ base CompuAdd SVGA 51086 (1990) Magnavox Computer Monitor 80 video only Visual 120 Serial terminal w/ keyboard NEC MultiSync JC-1401 P3A 13" (1986) NEC MultiSync 3D NEC MultiSync 3V Printers HP Desk Jet 500 Star NX-10 Dot Matrix Panasonic Quiet KX-P2180 Epson LQ570 Dot Matrix Star NX-1000 Multi font w/ box Texas Instruments Microlaser Pro E Epson LQ-1000 Wide Carriage Dot Matrix Qume Daisy Wheel w/ extra wheels and print cartridge Kodak Personal Portable Diconix 180si Miscellaneous IBM Keyboards (5) Canon Personal Copier PC-3 w/toner cartridges Seiko Digitizer Tablets (3) IBM SCSI drives 7204-001, 7207-001, 7210-001 EXABYTE SCSI tape drive CI Designs SCSI peripheral box / in box IBM PC case 5150 IBM XT case 5160 Musek scanner (no photo) Memorex scanner (no photo) IBM Keyboard??, 5015715, in box, never opened BK Precision 2040 CB Signal Generator Arnet serial expansion board, with software and cables HP 1611A Logic State Analyzer for Z80? Gould K105D Logic Analyzer for Z80? Various keyboards, internal cards, Creative Labs CD drives and Sound Blasters TRS-80 Printer Cassette interface for PC-2 (2) TI-74 Basic Calc hand held computer NEC Versa docking station, in box , never used. -- - Mark 210-379-4635 ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Large Asteroids headed toward planets inhabited by beings that don't have technology adequate to stop them: Think of it as Evolution in Fast-Forward.

14 years, 10 months

Telnet access to classic mainframe/timesharing systems

by roger.holmes＠microspot.co.uk

On 29 Jun 2009, at 18:00, cctalk-request at classiccmp.org wrote: > From: Michael Kerpan <mjkerpan at kerpan.com> > Subject: Telnet access to classic mainframe/timesharing systems > What about various lesser-known systems? Given that most > people used these systems through remote terminals to begin with, a > public access system would seem to be an ideal way to experience them, > but how many of them are available in such a way? Mine is too old, no serial connection, no operating system, not even an operator terminal. Bootstrap from drum and read 80 column punched cards. I have modified the bootstrap to read from paper tape and I have now got a bit bashing serial link which uses 100% of the CPU to make it work - no time to service any terminals though, no interrupts and no multi-programming capabilities. It would be nice to see a ICT/ICL 1900 online one day. The first machine I used was an IBM 7094. We punched our cards, they were taken to London and next week we got our listing back saying syntax error on line 1. Roger ICT 1301 mainframe (1962)

14 years, 10 months

A plan for a "universal" low-pin-count programmer

by classiccmp＠philpem.me.uk

Hi guys, I know a few folks here (besides myself) have accumulated collections of older-generation (i.e. "obsolete") fuse-PROMs, GALs, PALs, and so on. A common complaint is that modern programmers won't touch these devices -- negative voltages (sometimes very high negative voltages) are required to program some of them, and for others the programming hardware just wasn't tested with them. In my experience, when confronted with the fact that their programmers don't actually work, most programmer manufacturers seem to respond by asking why you're even thinking about using 1702 EPROMs in their programmer, and sooner-or-later admit that they actually didn't test them on anything more recent than a programmer they last sold in the late 1980s, and that they "just ported the software across and thought it would work". So what I'm proposing is this. A completely open-sourced device programmer. That is, all the hardware designs, PCB layouts, software and firmware are (or at least will be) completely open. My "rough feature set" boils down to: * Single input power supply -- probably 24V DC. Fed from a normal mains adapter. I'm tempted to use 12V DC instead, and live with the higher current consumption -- my only spare 24V PSU is a massive 600W Nemic-Lambda dual-fan unit that makes a sound not unlike that of a mid-sized jet aircraft. 12V 2A power supplies are a bit more plentiful... * Two programmable positive power supplies, all variable between around 2V and ~24V (or higher if need be). Maybe add a third if necessary (for ECL maybe?) * Two programmable negative power supplies, variable between -2V and -50V. Meaning you can program 1702s with it. * 24, 32 or 40 individually-programmable pin drivers. More or less if you like -- add or remove a few pin drivers. I think the upper maximum is likely to be around 64 pins, based on typical CPLD pin counts. * Modular design -- one interface controller (computer -> driver interface), swappable power supply boards, pin count can be increased in 8-pin blocks by adding more pin drivers (or boards can be swapped to troubleshoot driver issues). There is one obvious limitation here -- you need the programming algorithm for the chip you want to program. The algorithms for MMI PALs are (I've been told) in their databook, the Signetics algorithms (for fuse-PROMs) are just as easy to find, and TI put their TIBPAL programming algorithms on their website. Things like Lattice GALs might be difficult, unless you could live with using an "unofficial" programming algorithm (*cough* GALBlast). I suppose you could reverse-engineer an algorithm from a working programmer and a minimum of two blank chips, but I suspect something like the GAL algorithm (in complexity) might be somewhat tricky to reverse-engineer. Does anyone (besides me) think this is a worthy endeavour? At the moment I'm thinking of using FET-based pin-drivers (lower pin count and voltage drop, potentially faster switching) and MC34063-based switch-mode PSUs. The control interface will likely be USB, possibly based on a Cypress EZ-USB FX2LP chip -- the advantage being that the firmware is stored in the MCU's RAM (uploaded from the PC on startup), so no PIC, AVR or 8051 programmer is required. Unless anyone has any other comments or suggestions? Cheers, -- Phil. classiccmp at philpem.me.uk http://www.philpem.me.uk/

14 years, 10 months

Diskless Vaxstation 2000 (was Re: PDP-11/23 H786 PSU Fault Finding)

by david_comley＠yahoo.com

--- On Mon, 6/29/09, Ethan Dicks <ethan.dicks at gmail.com> wrote: > While I've seen it, I haven't used one myself (thus can't > check > details) - all of my uV/VS2000 boxes have drives. Thanks for pointing that out; I'd forgotten about the load board and the 12V situation. That's the first thing to try, loading up the +5V line. I'd be so happy if that's all it is. I have the exact opposite situation - my VS2000 is driveless and has the load board in it. I can't seem to keep an RD5x drive running long enough to install anything on it these days. I did try to get it to run OpenVMS 7.3 diskless at one point but to no avail. Perhaps they were never meant to ? I didn't spend long looking at it. -Dave

14 years, 10 months

Mysterious website

by spedraja＠ono.com

Someone knows about this website ? http://chiclassiccomp.org It appears to be one website named 'Chicago Classic Computing' and mentions VCF 2009, but is accesible actually only using Google cached webpages. In appeareance has a repository of documents, being some of them Altos related. I'm actually searching all what I can obtain related with this firm and products. Regards Sergio

14 years, 10 months

Telnet access to classic mainframe/timesharing systems

by dm561＠torfree.net

----------Original Message: Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 10:57:52 -0700 From: Rich Alderson <RichA at vulcan.com> > From: Michael Kerpan > Sent: Monday, June 29, 2009 9:51 AM > I'd be interested to know what's out there vis a vis classic systems > that are on the Internet offering public access. Currently, I know of > twenex.org (emulated KL-10B DECSYSTEM-20 with Panda TOPS-20), > pdpplanet.com (a TOAD-1 with TOPS-20, a DECSYSTEM-10 2065 and a VAX > 780) and cray-cyber.org (an emulated CDC Cyber plus a rotating > selection of historic super computers on weekends), but is there > anything else? Is anybody running classic versions of UNIX (UCB-era > BSD, AT&T-era System III/V, V6/V7, etc) Is anybody running a public > IBM system? What about various lesser-known systems? Given that most > people used these systems through remote terminals to begin with, a > public access system would seem to be an ideal way to experience them, > but how many of them are available in such a way? Among our next projects at the PDPplanet site (which will be changing names soon) are a PDP-8/e running either TSS/8 or MULTOS, and a PDP-11/45 running Unix v7. We will announce their availability here as well as other well- known fora for vintage/classic computing. Rich Alderson --------------Reply: Well, I've had a Cromemco running Cromix with two ports on the Internet a few times just as a proof of concept, and could put UNIX V or V.2 on it as well I suppose, but I thought there are already UNIX systems out there and Cromix would actually be more interesting; yeah, that's how they were used all right; I still have a few of the 1200bd modems...;-) I've only got dial-up access for it which makes it a little awkward, so I've been trying to talk some fellow Cromemco owners with hi-speed to put one up as a BBS system, but no takers so far... Unfortunately Howard Harte (who's done amazing stuff with the SIMH emulator) hasn't quite got a Cromix emulation finished. How would you tell the difference? Sort of the modern Turing Test: is it the real machine or an emulation... mike

14 years, 10 months

OT Names was Re: chiclassiccomp.org was Re: Mysterious website

by marvin＠west.net

> On Mon, Jun 29, 2009 at 10:44, Chuck Guzis<cclist at sydex.com> wrote: >> > On 29 Jun 2009 at 10:27, Patrick Finnegan wrote: >> > >>> >> I'm haven't yet figured out if it's a sick joke, or if someone just >>> >> didn't realize that it's a bad name to use. >> > >> > Happens more often than you'd think. ?Long ago, a friend decided to >> > call his company "Tripas" (a variant spelling of "Tri-pass"). ?After >> > the corporate name had been registered, the janitorial crew informed >> > him that they thought it was funny--apparently it's Spanish ?for >> > entriails ?(tripe). > > Up here in Canada, the Reform party briefly renamed itself the > "Conservative Reform Alliance" Party: CRAP > > That lasted all of two days, IIRC. Anyone remember the eBay marketing promotion, "Do It eBay"? I still love it ... Do It eBay, short for DIE!

14 years, 10 months

D'oh - Re: PDP-11/23 H786 PSU Fault Finding

by david_comley＠yahoo.com

> On 6/29/09, Tony Duell <ard at p850ug1.demon.co.uk> > > My first question is 'do you have enough load on the > 5V line?'. If you > > don't, the chopper circuit is running very 'lightky', > and probably the > > 12V side isn't getting enough power to work properly. > I've certainly had > > DEC supplies where the 12V output is low untill I > loaded the 5V output. --- On Mon, 6/29/09, Ethan Dicks <ethan.dicks at gmail.com> wrote:> > There's a load-board for the uVAX2000/VS2000 box for use if > you don't > have an internal hard drive.? AFAIK, that's why it's > needed - to > ensure enough load on the +5V line for the +12V regulator > to work. Well, as both Tony and Ethan noted, you do indeed have to load the +5V line up before the +12V line will regulate properly. I put a low wattage automotive turn signal bulb across the +5V line and the +12V line jumped right back to where it should be. Many thanks. I can now reassemble the 11/23 and get it back in the rack. Don't you love it when stuff works ! Now I just have to fix that RLV12... -Dave

14 years, 10 months

MS Basic Interpreter and Compiler for Xenix Personal Computers

by spedraja＠ono.com

Well, finally came the time to install one find from over a couple of years ago: Five floppies with the MS Basic Interpreter and Compiler for Personal Computers running Xenix 286. I plan to install it in the Altos 586. The software don't have special indications about the SCO Xenix or so. The worst that could happen is that it don't work. But I plan to do some disk images of the floppies previously with Imagedisk. The Xenix default for installation is /dev/fd048ds9 Some conseils ? By the way, no problem to make them available in one of the well known repositories of people in this list. I don't have actually web site and storage for them. I suppose that the prosecution of this copy is not the main objective of BG or SB from MS actually having in mind how is raining in the world at date. In fact, if BG is suscribed to this list (who knows, with the tribe of spammers out of the walls which try to enter in the Fort everyday) I have no problem to send him a copy... I would be VERY surprised if even MS could have a copy of this stuff. Regards Sergio

14 years, 10 months

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test-drb June 2009