test-drb February 2009

test-drb@ccmp.vtda.org

196 participants
309 discussions

Ideas for disposing of entire collection

by robert.stek＠gmail.com

I have been mostly a lurker on the classiccmp lists for the last 10 years or so, though I have had individual correspondence with Jim Battle, Dave Dunfield, Rich Cini, Allison, and a few others ? I think they would vouch for me. I?ve been mostly an S-100 and CP/M guy, and I have probably used more impulse than sense in collecting micro stuff. My worst sin has been in putting off any systematic cataloging of my collection, and unfortunately I am not in a position to do it now. What I describe later on is from memory ? there are all sorts of miscellaneous things as well. The time has come for me to liquidate 90% of my collection. I won?t give it away ? my kids can deal with it after I?m dead! I started to sell it piece by piece last year and sold about $3,000-$4,000 worth on ebay (I know, boo-hiss! But that?s where I got most of it from.) I would rather not go this route again, except perhaps for my Altair or one of my IMSAI?s. I am willing to take a loss if I can dispose of this stuff in bulk, but want this to be as painless (for me) as possible. All of this stuff has been packed away in moving boxes for at least 4-5 years and I no longer want to have to take it out, photograph it, test, troubleshoot, write accurate descriptions, re-package for safe shipping, take it down to UPS or the P.O., deal with eBay, etc. So, questions for the group: 1) Does anyone here have an interest in acquiring my collection and is willing to come to Tucson (7 hour drive from San Diego) and pick it all up? 2) Does anyone here know of anyone ? a computer museum, a collector not on this list, anyone else of unsound mind ? who might be interested? 3) Any other ideas on eliminating hassles from individual sales and shipping? 4) Anyone want to take a guess at a value of the collection as a whole? a) if individually priced on ebay or b) Entire lot value It?s all packed well enough for storage or shipment in a van, but most would need to be re-packed for individual shipment. Part of the problem is that while individual boxes are generically labeled (i.e., 8? disks, BYTE mags, Votrax, monitor, etc.) I have no simple or easy way to put the appropriate docs and disks together with the hardware (nor the room to even attempt it). I think I did a fairly good job of rounding up original docs and boot disks (or good copies thereof) for most of the equipment. It would be a shame to let that effort go to waste if I eventually decide to go the ebay route after all; I would have to sell it all ala carte as I come across it. To give you an idea of some of the items (almost all with complete documentation, extra S-100 boards and boot software if appropriate, and most were known working when put in storage) here is a good part of the collection that I still have: 2 or 3 Processor Tech Sols (have extra foam pads for 1 keyboard restore) ? original docs Ithaca InterSystem S-100 ? original docs 2 IMSAI?s ? original docs 1 Altair 8800 ? some docs 2 NorthStar Horizons, 1 with HD ? original docs 1 CompuPro 8/16 ? original docs 1 Morrow Decision 1 with HD ? original docs (the big iron, not the MicroDecision) Many, many S-100 cards ? 8 and 16 bit CPUs, 4k thru 256k memory boards, Matrox video, disk controllers, almost all w/ original docs 1 Lobo System with HD ? original docs 3-4-5? Circuit Cellar SB-180 systems, 1 with HD ? original docs 2 NOS Xerox Z-80 64k systems w/ 5 ?? dual drives ? original docs 2-3 KayPro?s ? original docs Televideo 925 terminal Older memory chip tester Pro-Log M882 8080 analyzer Z-80 MicroProfessor Digital Group programs on cassette Many original ProcTech programs on cassette w/ original docs Multiple SS/DD and DS/DD 5.25? disk drives, some in cabinets w/ PS, most not Several monochrome composite monitors Collection of text-to-speech units, 3-4 Votrax and a large DEC-Talk plus a few others ? original docs BYTE magazine from, v1#1 through mid to late 80?s Many issues of Creative Comp, complete Kilobaud, S-100 Microsystems, early Dr. Dobb?s, Interface Age, Computer Shopper, Lifeboat Lifelines, etc. 2 dual 8? drive systems 2-3 Apple II Plus 2-3 Apple Z-80 cards Ohio Scientific Challenger (C4P? ? can?t remember, plus I may have sold this last year, not sure but I think it?s still here) w/ docs Franklin Ace 100 (the original one with the Apple II ROMs that led to landmark court decision allowing copyrighting of software) 1-2 early Macs Mac LC w/ MS-DOS card Cables ? lots and lots, from RS-232, Centronics parallel, to power cables to ribbon cables to . . . . Lots of original software and docs: boxed sets of Digital Research CP/M, CP/M-86, CP/M-Plus, CBASIC, Concurrent CP/M ? all from DR in slip cases, WordStar, Magic Wand, Palantir, dBASE II, Microsoft BASIC-80, baZic, Lifeboat Associates CP/MUG disks, lots of NorthStar format software, NOS Dysan 10-hole hard-sector disks, complete International NorthStar User?s Association newsletters and disks, complete original SOL Users Society newsletters, etc.) IBM XT TrackStar 6502 card for IBM Baby Blue Z-80 card for IBM IBM AT Central Point Match Point card, several Option boards . . . and this is just the stuff I remember. Bob Stek Saver of Lost Sols P.S. If I can?t sell it all in one swell foop, I MAY consider offers for individual pieces from list members, but I would REALLY like to sell everything at once. Please don?t ask for any particular item right now ? I?ll let everyone know if I do decide to do that later.

16 years, 1 month

Video pinouts for Sony SMC-70G

by adamg＠pobox.com

Josh Dersch wrote: > Just acquired one of these bad boys and I've found very little info on > it -- it appears to have two video out connectors -- a 25-pin D-sub > labeled "RGB Multi Out" and an 8-pin DIN labeled "B/W Multi Out." > Anyone know the pinouts of these? If you're still looking for pinouts, here they are: http://www.eskimo.com/~adam/smc70vidpin.pdf Sorry about the huge PDF file. Since you have the G (genlock) model there should also be RGB video on BNC connectors. > Any ideas what kind of monitor I can expect to use with this machine? For authenticity, a KX-1211HG, CPD-120 or PVM-1270Q. Otherwise, a Commodore 1080 or 1084 or whatever. > Anyone have manuals/software archived? I have a little bit of stuff... I'll drop you a line if/when I archive it... probably some time in 2015? :) Amazingly enough Sony still lists a SMC-70G manual as available to order. The part number is 3-773-522-22. If you feel like taking a $20 gamble you can order it online at servicesales.sel.sony.com or servicesplus.us.sony.biz or by phone at (800)488-7669. You might end up with a hefty bound manual or you might end up with 2 xeroxed pages. I have no idea what it is other than it's an instruction manual for SMC-70G serial number 20211 and later and it's not one of the ones I have. -- Adam

16 years, 1 month

speaking of 3.5" floppies, is 720K R.I.P.?

by chrise＠pobox.com

I don't have an answer for the other gentleman's query on 720RPM floppies but I recently discovered that new 3.5" drives appear to no longer support 720K media. I purchased a number of Samsung drives for a project where I am converting a system with 5.25" drives to use 3.5" and I found that these drives have left out the media density sense switch all together! They no longer have any way to detect the lower density, 250kbps media and run at 500Kbps no matter what is installed. I needed the 300 rpm, 250Kbps capability to be compatible with the old 5.25" stuff. What's particularly nasty is that I chose these drives, Samsung SFD-321B, because I had a recent datasheet that clearly showed they supported this mode-- until of course they arrived and the switch/sensor is not even installed! Is this true of all 3.5" drives now? This might explain why 720K 3.5" drives are selling for $285 on eBay :-( I'd sure like to find a way to force the drive into 250Kbps mode-- I can't believe the chips don't still support it-- I just need a way to figure out where the sensor is supposed to connect and hard wire it to 720K mode. Any ideas on how to do that? Chris

16 years, 1 month

PDP-7's

by aek＠bitsavers.org

> I seem to recall that there was one in Australia oops, forgot that one. Max Burnett's

16 years, 1 month

Microdata Reality in Sandy, Utah

by sellam＠vintagetech.com

There is a Microdata Reality in Sandy, Utah that needs a new home. This is a large and heavy early- to mid-1970s mini in a 6 foot cabinet. Please contact me directly if you're interested and I'll pass along the contact info. -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ]

16 years, 1 month

Printronix P-600 and Qume printers available

by jws＠jwsss.com

Printronix P-600's availability "soon" in St. Louis. I'm posting for a friend who has as many as three which may be retired and scrapped. These are well maintained, but obviously elderly printers. The Qume is a wheel printer I posted about some time ago w/o any response. Reply off list unless there is a useful comment, obviously. Qume printer is in Evansville, In. Jim

16 years, 1 month

Anyone have a line on batteries for the NLS portable oscilloscope?

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

> >Subject: Anyone have a line on batteries for the NLS portable oscilloscope? > From: Ethan Dicks <ethan.dicks at gmail.com> > Date: Wed, 04 Feb 2009 13:51:59 -0500 > To: classiccmp at classiccmp.org > >Hi, All, > >The topic of replacement batteries came up in the Yahoo Group >for the RB5X, and someone posted a link for 2 volt 2.5 Amp-hour >cells (which are apparently used in an older version of the robot >than mine)... > ><http://www.batteryweb.com/hawkersla-detail.cfm?Model=0810-0004&label=single…> > >I saw the image and immediately thought of my NLS portable oscilloscope. >I'd love to refurb mine, but $45 in batteries is a little on the high >side for me. >Has anyone on the list replaced a set of this sort of battery, and does anyone >know of a place that stocks them for a bit less? I've replaced the min my NLS MS-15 and MS215 portable scopes, I usually pay around 8-9$ each (it uses 3) for them new. Google "2V 2.5AH Gell cell" you get mroe than afew hits. Note any 6V gellcell that fits in the form factor (NLS has an area) will also work. I've found 6V/2.2AH Yusa and others that fit in mind and they can be cheaper usually under 15$. If your really game 4 nicads of the 1800-2200mah size fit there but require the charger side to be modded for constant current rather constant voltage. Allison > >-ethan

16 years, 1 month

Old Software rights (was content rights)

by vern4wright＠yahoo.com

Dan, My first comment is - watch your back! --- On Thu, 1/15/09, Dan Gahlinger <dgahling at hotmail.com> wrote: > From: Dan Gahlinger <dgahling at hotmail.com> > Subject: Old Software rights (was content rights) > To: cctalk at classiccmp.org > Date: Thursday, January 15, 2009, 8:48 AM > In an unrelated topic, > > I have a bunch of old programs from my University days, > back in the late 70's, early 80's > all Vax/VMS code, in various languages, etc. > > In those days we never put "(C)" or copyright > notices on code. > I'm just wondering if it's generally "ok" > to release this code to the public? > > It's been 30 some years (longer than copyright would > apply anyhow). > I have searched for 20 years for some of the authors and > never found anyone. > > 14 years ago I posted pieces of it, and said "if > anyone objects to this, please contact me" > and never got any response from anyone. Just an experience I recall observing. A guy was posting old games on USENET (don't recall which group), from the CP/M to early IBM PC era - games for which no owner could he could find, games that seemed to be abandoned. And then one day he announced that he would no longer be doing this, having been warned by his ISP and having received a cease and desist notice from a law firm. > The system and associated parts used for the development > are long gone. Copyright is a can of worms, particularly with the obscenely long period that has been recently legislated. And there will always be someone willing to threaten action. Your examples seem safe, but I would be quick to be responsive to any request to "desist". > But another age old question, who has rights to code > developed on the universities equipment? > I know it's a common question these days, but > "back in the day" such considerations never > occurred, > it was a different era. I well recall those days when software was free, included in the rental of the mainframe. Until unbundling and the "Program Product" which would rent or sell independently from the machine. IIRC, IBM's H Assembler for OS/360, first NEW product issued under the unbundling agreement, rented for $250/mo. in 1970 - which would be something more significant these days. Those days really ended around 1970. It's particularly annoying in the area of OS's for our classic computers, which remain under copyright to companies which may have gone belly-up, been absorbed and forgotten by their buyers, etc. Getting an old CP/M machine without the OS, and not having a legal source for it, makes 'criminals' of us all. And it's damned unfair! > Everyone from that era has also vanished with the wind, I > know, I've looked. > > So is it fairly safely abandoned? > Another way to look at it - If it was your code, some small > silly thing you wrote, would you care? Now that is a very GOOD question. There are a lot of things I've written that I would NEVER want seen - by ANYONE; guess they're in the class of 'silly'. Most of my serious software belongs to entities (alive or dead), under 'work for hire'. If it were distributed with their blessings, it wouldn't bother me; I've been paid - though never enough :) OTOH, I have several proprietary systems I have written for the use of my own business AND I WOULD EXPRESS SERIOUS ANNOYANCE if they were somehow obtained and distributed. But they have never been shared, and the likelihood of it happening seems small. That said, good fortune. Vern Wright > Dan. > > _________________________________________________________________

16 years, 1 month

Straight 8 was PDP-7s

by evan＠snarc.net

How about the straight 8 ... There were 1500 made; how many of these still survive? 1. We've got one here in MARCH / NJ.

16 years, 1 month

searching a metal box for 11/04 5.25in high

by henk.gooijen＠hotmail.com

Hi all, I noticed an 11/34 on eBay (# 200302612244) which reminded me of the 11/04 that I have in similar size / housing. Just as the machine up for auction, I am missing the black metal box into which the unit is placed and mounted in a 19" rack. So ... if anybody has an empty box, I am very interested! thanks, - Henk, PA8PDP

16 years, 1 month

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test-drb February 2009