A few weeks ago, some people in here were talking about putting network
cards in IBM PCs or XTs or something...
As it happens, I ran across a box of 3com 3c503 network cards (AUI and
10BaseT ports, 8 bit ISA card).
If anyone wants one, lemme know, I'm asking $5+shipping, and I'll have
the box with me at Dayton if you want to harass me about them, then.
Purdue University ITAP/RCAC --- http://www.rcac.purdue.edu/
The Computer Refuge --- http://computer-refuge.org
Hopefully, this request is clear enough to be understood. Both the
software and the hardware portion of the questions are independently
important, so please answer one aspect even if you can't help with
Over the past 30 years of using PDP-11 software (RT-11 over 95%)
and hardware, I have never had occasion to use a Unibus system with
more than 256 KB of memory (such as a PDP-11/34).
I would appreciate help in understanding the Unibus Map hardware which
(if I understand its purpose correctly) is to convert 18 bit addresses given
to a Unibus controller into 22 bit addresses for real physical memory for
systems like a PDP-11/84 and perform DMA from / to the hard drive.
Also helpful would be an explanation of the related software used under
RT-11 along with exactly where the Unibus Map hardware is located
on a real DEC system (on the CPU board I presume) since the identical
CPU board is used for both the Qbus and the Unibus with both the
PDP-11/84 and the PDP-11/94.
DO NOT READ THE FOLLOWING if you don't use RT-11!!!!!!!
By way of context, I have successfully modified the HD0: device driver
originally written by John Wilson which obviously executes ONLY under
E11. Last week, John mentioned in a private e-mail that it is possible to
direct the HD0: "controller" (all references to hardware in quotes refers
to E11 software) to ignore the "Unibus Map hardware". Since I execute
under E11 using Qbus emulation in order to stay totally compatible with
the real DEC PDP-11/23, PDP-11/73 and PDP-11/83 systems (all Qbus
and all with 4 MB of physical memory) which I have available for comparison
testing, user buffers in physical memory above 256 KB are often a situation
which can't be avoided.
Consequently, it had always been a high priority to have a 22 bit device
for HD0: under E11 BECAUSE HD0: is TWICE as fast as MSCP (DUX.SYS
device driver). In addition, I have also been able to write code that
overhead of using the HD0: device driver which makes HD0: FOUR times as
fast as MSCP and also allows for direct access of 2 TB of disk space via a
32 bit block number. Since I have an immediate application for a data base
of 32 GB (I have a disk drive of 160 GB, so 32 GB is only 20% of its
although under RT-11 15 years ago in 1992, 32 GB would have been only a
dream), the code which I have written will actually be used quite soon.
However, I would very much like the HD0: device driver to be able to execute
under both "Qbus" and "Unibus" hardware. And while I can test the code for
a "Qbus" and for a "Unibus" without a "Unibus Map", I am not clear about
what is required for a "Unibus" with a "Unibus Map" such as a PDP-11/84
running under RT-11.
Megan are you still watching the list? Allison, if you can't answer,
but Megan help? Is anyone else familiar enough with the "Unibus Map" that
you can suggest what RT-11 actually needs to do with the "Unibus Map"?
A solution is to check the "hardware" configuration and refuse to allow the
HD0: device driver to LOAD or .Fetch if the modified version is not
executing under "Qbus hardware".
By the way, if anyone who is thinking of a controller for the Qbus which is
able to use SATA drives, I would be happy to modify an RT-11 device
driver to an HD0: type device that is able to handle drives up to 2 TB
in the same manner that DU(X).SYS can handle drives up to 8 GB.
If you attempted to send a reply and the original e-mail
address has been discontinued due a high volume of junk
e-mail, then the semi-permanent e-mail address can be
obtained by replacing the four characters preceding the
'at' with the four digits of the current year.
I'm trying to use simh to create an RT-11 bootable RX50 disk and am
following some instructions posted by Megan Gentry a while ago. I've
created the disk image but am having trouble making it bootable. The
copy/boot command claims it can't find the RT-11 image but it is
clearly on the floppy (du0). Any idea what's going wrong?
RT11XM.SYS 106P 20-Dec-85 DU .SYS 8P 20-Dec-85
TT .SYS 2P 20-Dec-85 PIP .SAV 30P 20-Dec-85
DUP .SAV 47P 20-Dec-85 DIR .SAV 19P 20-Dec-85
RESORC.SAV 25P 20-Dec-85 EDIT .SAV 19P 20-Dec-85
MACRO .SAV 61P 20-Dec-85 CREF .SAV 6P 20-Dec-85
LINK .SAV 49P 20-Dec-85 LIBR .SAV 24P 20-Dec-85
FILEX .SAV 22P 20-Dec-85 HELP .SAV 132P 20-Dec-85
BATCH .SAV 26P 20-Dec-85 FORMAT.SAV 24P 20-Dec-85
SETUP .SAV 41P 20-Dec-85 SPEED .SAV 4P 20-Dec-85
DATIME.SAV 4P 20-Dec-85 LET .SAV 5P 20-Dec-85
SPLIT .SAV 3P 20-Dec-85 CONFIG.SAV 7P 20-Dec-85
SWAP .SYS 27P 20-Dec-85
23 Files, 691 Blocks
95 Free blocks
.copy/boot du0:rt11xm.sys du0:
?DUP-F-File not found DU0:RT11XM.SYS
>Subject: TU-58s (was Re: Some progress with my PDP-11/73 system)
> From: "Ethan Dicks" <ethan.dicks at gmail.com>
> Date: Wed, 11 Apr 2007 21:54:24 -0500
> To: "General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts" <cctalk at classiccmp.org>
>On 4/11/07, Jerome H. Fine <jhfinedp3k at compsys.to> wrote:
>> But I once had a project that
>> used a real DEC TU-58. Not the fastest "random"
>> access device!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
>They work better as "sequential" access devices - being long and thin
>and travelling in one dimension, go figure. We used to optimize file
>order on our console TU58s to speed up the boot times on our 11/725s
>and 11/730s. Since the file order doesn't change, one just builds a
>TU58 with EXCHANGE with each file following the other. The console's
>8-bit-micro must cache the directory block, since the tape didn't whip
>back to the start between each file.
>Using unaltered console tapes from DEC resulted in, IIRC, about 15
>minutes from turning the key to booting the hard disk. Replacing that
>tape with one of our own devising shortened that pre-boot time to well
>under 3 minutes.
>I'd hate to rely on a TU-58 and no other block-addressable media on a
>PDP-11, though. I survived a PDP-8 with a TD8E and TU56, but it was
>somewhat tedious (cool to watch, though). TU-58s weren't as cool,
So happens one of my "small" pdp-11s uses a Tu58. the system is a BA-11V
with an 11/23 256k of ram, DLV11J and MRV11 rom(boot). Takes 10 minutes
to boot, setup VM: then copy key files to and reboot. After that it's
pretty decent even if I have to access a file on tape.
Everytime I runs it with a bunch of kids of the current PC generations
they go gaga and comment on how slow then I explain the amount of ram and
storage then they are amazed it can be a functional machine with so little.
They can't imagine a useful machine with 32kW of ram and 256kb of storage.
On the flip side I've used that same Tu58 to bring up iron that had no
removable storage. It's slow but very dependable.
Have a working Intel Above Board Plus 8 with 2MB RAM and would like to
populate it to the full 8MB. It will take 120ns or faster 1mbit chips
-- but where can one find that kind of thing nowadays? Are those still
commercially available or am I going to have to scavenge them from
Manual lists acceptable part numbers like:
...etc but google searches haven't been very fruitful (that is, the
pages returned when I search for IC part numbers don't return vendors
with plain pricing/availability info).
I just want a few tubes of these to populate the board, I'm not looking
for a box of 'em :-) Any pointers?
Jim Leonard (trixter at oldskool.org) http://www.oldskool.org/
Help our electronic games project: http://www.mobygames.com/
Or check out some trippy MindCandy at http://www.mindcandydvd.com/
A child borne of the home computer wars: http://trixter.wordpress.com/
I've more of these than anyone will need and they're all brand new.
3 packs of Bernoulli 5.25 44meg disks
KAO 5.25 88meg syquest disks. The label inside says they are formatted for
Macs but includes software for wintel machines also.
$1 each plus whatever for shipping and they're yours. Just say how many you
I am not willing to give up my privacy for the false promise of 'security'
A note to all 2.11bsd users:
Some time ago I looked into running 2.11bsd on systems without
floating point unit. The release notes state that this is untested
and unsupported, and indeed it didn't work.
Robin Birch some time ago fixed part of the issues, see patch 434,
but still the kernel paniced when the very first program was started.
I managed to localize and fix the problem in sys/pdp/mch_fpsim.s.
Steven Schultz right away issued 2.11BSD patch #445. All patches
up to and including 445 are provided by Steven under
A patch level 445 system will now boot on simh for example on a
set cpu 11/70 nofpp 4m
configuration and work just fine, albeit a little slower.
It should thus also work on a real 11/70 without FPP. I heard
of some 11/70 with non-working FPP's, so this maybe good news
for the owners.
With best regards,
Dr. Walter F.J. M?ller Mail: W.F.J.Mueller at gsi.de
GSI, Abteilung KP3 Phone: +49-6159-71-2766
D-64291 Darmstadt FAX: +49-6159-71-3762
"Rawn's Buy & Sell Network" in Burnaby BC (Canada),
says he has a warehouse fill of old computers to
hopefully sell as a lot.
Consists of mostly 80s and 90s systems, like Apple,
Macs, IBMs, Next, Commodore, Atari, Tandy, Hyperion,
etc. as well as tons of software.
Here are some pics he sent me:
Do not contact me, please contact:
rawnsbuysell at lightspeed.ca
Be a PS3 game guru.
Get your game face on with the latest PS3 news and previews at Yahoo! Games.
I have added a few new pictures to the xt/370 web site showing the stacked (and non-stacked) versions of the MCM66128L20, as well as two other examples of IBM engineering that employed stacked chips (AT motherboard and PC memory card) in the early 1980's.
There are 36 pairs on the AT board to get 512K and 18 pairs on the memory card to get 64K.
Obviously, these chips have different pinouts (at least select).
The url is:- www.xt370.net click on the link to the left, 'Memory Technology'
The question a data sheet might answer is:- does one of the new MCM66128L20 parts replace one of the old stacked pairs?
--- also: --
>Subject: Re: Someone in search of XT/370 software
>To: "General Discussion: On-Topic Posts Only" <cctech at classiccmp.org>
>He's on the list. I have at least some of VM/PC, but when I tried to
>email him to let him know, I got an autoresponse from a white-list
>agent, which sent me to an unresponsive URL. It was sufficiently
>irritating that I figured it wasn't worth pursuing further.
>Seriously, folks, if you're going to ask for help, don't make it
>impossible for people to give.
Bear's criticism is well-founded.
I believe I have corrected the problem; I did receive the e-mails and have responded off-list.
At any rate, I greatly appreciate the interest and am sorry for the inconvenience.
LisaEm 1.2.0 is available for download right now, from the usual place:
Many LisaEm users have complained that ROMs are too difficult to
extract. The new version of LisaEm solves this by allowing you to run
with out a ROM. If you wanted to try LisaEm, but couldn't because you
didn't have ROMs for it, now you can!
It emulates the functions of the Lisa Boot ROM as well as the Dual
Parallel Card without requiring a ROM, and allows you to boot into Lisa
Office System. If you've felt limited by only having a single
emulated Profile hard drive because you didn't have the Dual Parallel
ROM, the new version also emulates these, without requiring a ROM.
All you need is Lisa Office System and LisaEm.
As this is the first release of this feature, don't be surprised if you
encounter bugs. Please report any unexpected behavior so that I can fix
Additionally, I've added two movies that show how to install Lisa Office
System and MacWorks. (MacWorks still doesn't work properly on LisaEm
Lisa Emulator Change History
2007.09.19 - fixed romless floppy boot to always boot from floppy and not
switch to Profile.
2007.09.15 - debugging ROMless boot.
new bug: when trying to boot from floppy, if a profile exists
and is bootable, LOS starts up from the Profile instead of the
2007.09.09 - David Cecchin's XPM icon in unix
2007.09.07 - added Save/Load PRAM to Preferences
- Quit now closes any open Preference window as well
2007.08.29 - libdc42 macbinii encoded dart to dc42 conversion bugfix
2007.08.16 - added LOS error codes to ROMless error handler
- fix raw screenshot crash
2007.08.13 - got both ROMless boot and ROMless dual parallel card to work
2007.08.06 - individual profile power controls + create new profile inside
a new menu named profile.
2007.07.28 - replaced all exit() and EXIT() calls with messages before
quitting emulator so at least we know what crashed.
2007.07.27 - ROMless works with both profile and floppy now.
- Fixed a bug with configuration saving.
2007.07.26 - Tracelog checkmark correction
2007.07.25 - added Zap PRAM button in main Preferences panel
2007.07.23 - ROMLess booting - floppy works
2007.07.19 - ROMLess booting start
2007.07.12 - RESET opcode supervisor mode bug fix.
2007.07.10 - CPU core tests
If you'd like to support this project, you can do so by sending me
something from my Amazon wish list. (Used books and DVD's are
perfectly fine with me.) The trains are for my kid. :)