January 2007 - test-drb@ccmp.vtda.org

by legalize＠xmission.com

A little while back I asked about shelving. Noone suggested anything. I found what seems to be a good solution at about half the cost of the next nearest offering, so I thought I'd share. I had been looking at wire rack shelving. Some nice wire racks on casters had been purchased at work from Costco, so I started looking at those. Costco had Safco "LAN Management System" racks 72"Wx29"Dx73"H for $340, 48"Wx29"Dx73"H for $250, 30"Wx29"Dx73"H for $205. (Casters were extra.) They also had Safco wire shelving: 4-shelf 36"Wx18"Dx72"H for $120. Online I could find racks for comparable prices or a little better (like $5) and comparable shelving for $80. I found nice 5-shelf wire racks at Walmart for $40 ea. 36"Wx16"Dx72"H, black finish. Each shelf is rated for 200 lbs evenly distributed. They have levelling screwcaps on the feet. "5 Shelf Multi-Purpose Rack" by NSF is what the box says. UPC 0 34886 00012 Using this shelving, I can stack 10 terminals vertically, 2 per shelf for 5 shelves, which is a tremendous space savings. I had to go to several Walmart locations in order to get enough shelving units, so I don't know if these are end of inventory "priced to move" units or not. This shelving is not currently listed on Walmart's web site, but each store in the Salt Lake City valley had the units. There is also a 4-shelf unit standing 52" high with 14" deep shelves. Most of the stores had these, with fewer having the taller 5-shelf variety. The shelf heights are adjustable in 1" increments and no tools are required for assembly or disassembly. They seem sturdy enough when fully loaded, but I wouldn't want to trip and fall into them and put a big transverse load on the whole system. It would most likely fall over and have a danger of crushing you with what I've got loaded into them. I certainly wouldn't want to have 10 13" CRTs dumped on me. I should probably secure them in case of earthquake... -- "The Direct3D Graphics Pipeline" -- DirectX 9 draft available for download <http://www.xmission.com/~legalize/book/download/index.html> Legalize Adulthood! <http://blogs.xmission.com/legalize/>

19 years, 4 months

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(somewhat OT) "Apple Computer, Inc." no more

by compoobah＠valleyimplants.com

Pat wrote: > On Tuesday 09 January 2007 21:16, Richard wrote: >> In article <2c9905e7a0917a23c18369f94e997689 at valleyimplants.com>, >>> Especially interesting given the scorn that the DEC-VAX agreement >>> from the '70s had. >> >> Come again? That reads like a total non sequitur to me. > > He's probably referring to the agreement that DEC had with the company > that makes VAX vacuum cleaners, for both of them to be able to use > the "VAX" name for their respective products, in each other's country. As I understand it, DEC agreed not to make consumer goods, and VAX agreed not to make computers. To an adolescent mind back in the mid '90s it seemed a bit absurd and a waste of time, but maybe not so much anymore.

19 years, 4 months

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Paul Allen's DECsystem-10

by bpritts＠pritts.com

Well, we used lots of PDP-10's in the timesharing (oops, marketing calls it REMOTE COMPUTING) business in the '70's and '80's. By the late '80's this business was dying fast. But it was fun. Yes, Compuserve was a big player. I worked with ADP Network Services (originally Cypernetics Corporation); we had quite a few PDP-10's. (about 25). Also, we probably had 100 - 200 PDP8's and PDP-11's as network nodes. When DEC released its KS10 processor (minicomputer architecture), we ported TOPS-10 to run on it. We ran about 75 or 100 of these as dedicated mini's for individual clients. As I recall DEC only sold the KS10 with TOPS-20. For better or worse this machine was superceded by the VAX. What were these users doing? Mostly interactive management applications - financial models (think of Fortran meets Excel); stock analysis; engineering analysis; statistical analysis & forecasting. It really was "personal computing". Regards, Brad remembering those good old days... > Richard wrote: > > > > So what was the typical usage for a average user on a > PDP-10 back then? Word processing? Computer Science? > Acounting? Fortran programs? > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 6 > Date: Tue, 09 Jan 2007 16:47:49 -0700 > From: Richard <legalize at xmission.com> > Subject: Re: Paul Allen's DECsystem-10 > To: "General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts" > <cctalk at classiccmp.org> > Message-ID: <E1H4Qh4-0002dn-00 at xmission.xmission.com> > > > In article <45A4276F.8000505 at jetnet.ab.ca>, > woodelf <bfranchuk at jetnet.ab.ca> writes: > > >>> I was thinking of getting ADVENT running on it. >>> >> You can do that with a PDP-8. :) >> > > Well, it would be a royal PITA for me. The only PDP-8 that I have is > a DECmate I w/out the RX floppy drives. > > But this wasn't a question of *what* machines I can use to run ADVENT. > > The question was: is anyone else using a login on Paul Allen's > DECsystem-10 or TOAD? > > I think the most I ever did with the DEC-10 at UDel was play ADVENT on > it :-). >

19 years, 4 months

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(somewhat OT) "Apple Computer, Inc." no more

by compoobah＠valleyimplants.com

George Currie wrote: > I wonder if Apple (the former computer company) paved the way for the > name change in the last round of negotiations it had with Apple (the > record label) as one of Apple's major arguments (hey, we're a computer > company, no one would get confused) is now officially gone. > Especially interesting given the scorn that the DEC-VAX agreement from the '70s had. The "why" question still remains on a technical level, given that all of their "consumer" products still are data processing equipment, predominantly based around microprocessors. They may not be intended to be general purpose computing machines, but then again neither was the PlayStation 2 et al, and look what's been done with them.

19 years, 4 months

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senseless rants was Re: garbled display

by chrism3667＠yahoo.com

It's not my intention to exacerbate the situation, being that this lists already has a rather high drama index, but concerning the previous rant, I don't at all see the point of such non constructive criticism. If your "needs" aren't being met, simply move on. I for one find it to be unique and often useful exchange. The old adage sure applies here that if you can't say anything nice... And it wasn't that I found the reply funny, but rather laughable. Nearly comic. Just my 2 farthings. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

19 years, 4 months

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(Fwd) Re: laptops and 5.25 inch floppy drives?

by cclist＠sydex.com

On 9 Jan 2007 at 15:32, Chris M wrote: > *went out to the shed. Yes there is present in the > BIOS a service to format tracks. Not all clones comply > in this way though (but where would the routine to do > this be if not in the bios?). I noticed in the docs > for my NEC APC III that DOS function calls were more > or less the same as a vanilla pc, but I don't recall > seeing mention of the equivalent BIOS calls. Anyone know?* I believe that the APC follows the NEC 9801 convention, but I'm not certain. The BIOS calls are very diffierent from the PC version. A Google should turn something up; I know the calls are mentioned in Ralf Brown's interrupt list--and there was a rundown in one of the PC rags--maybe DOS/Windows Developer? I probably also have a list in my files. Cheers, Chuck

19 years, 4 months

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Sun plastics

by compoobah＠valleyimplants.com

>> I've used a product called plastic epoxy which includes a solvent to >> eat >> into the items being bonded for a better bond. I've had the best luck >> placing a small piece of metal (paperclip) across the break and >> spreading >> an 1/8" thick layer over that. > > For plastics that it will disolve (if you see what I mean), I've had > great success using a liquid called 'Plastic Weld' available from good > model shops. It's basically dicholoromethane (methylene chloride). > > What you do is put the plastic parts together and run a brush dipped in > the solvent along the crack. For a stronger join, I cut a piece of > cotton > frabric to fit over the hack of the repair, put it in place and 'paint' > it with the solvent. Then push the cotton into the softened plastic. > > -tony Sun seems to use some odd plastic compound or alloy with two different types. I usually use MEK (methyl ethyl ketone) for welding plastics, and usually it either has no effect or works well, but with the Sun-type (I've seen it elsewhere, but first on Suns) plastics it dissolves one component but not the other, and the plastic turns into this yucky granular stuff with no strength to speak of (the bond will hold, but only until you move it). The epoxy kind of worked (it was one of the trim pieces off of a SPARCstation 20 (one of the $1 Boeing specials- thanks for the heads-up) it holds together O.K., but it's a little loose now (epoxy is much slower than MEK, and stuff moved).

19 years, 4 months

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(Fwd) Re: Sun plastics

by cclist＠sydex.com

On 9 Jan 2007 at 19:24, Tony Duell wrote: > What you do is put the plastic parts together and run a brush dipped in > the solvent along the crack. For a stronger join, I cut a piece of cotton > frabric to fit over the hack of the repair, put it in place and 'paint' > it with the solvent. Then push the cotton into the softened plastic. The faceplates of Overland Data tape drives are like that--try any "regular" solvent such as xylene or MEK or (worst) acetone and the plastic just crumbles away. Methylene chloride does seem to work better--and any gaps can be filled in with auto-body resin filler (Bondo) and the whole mess painted to match. Cheers, Chuck

19 years, 4 months

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(Fwd) Re: (somewhat OT) " Apple Computer, Inc." no more

by cclist＠sydex.com

On 9 Jan 2007 at 15:04, Fred Cisin wrote: > "matured" v "devolved" v "degraded" has NOTHING to do with whether > computers are getting better or worse. It is ENTIRELY about the > transition from being a computer company into being a consumer electronics > company. Probably a very shrewd move, too. Computers are a commodity item now; just the thing you don't want if you're trying to run a high- profit margin operation. Better to produce new widgets that folks will pay a premium to own. Cheers, Chuck

19 years, 4 months

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looking for an old ad (Dimension 68000)

by chrism3667＠yahoo.com

I probably have at least 1 issue of Byte that features advertisements for this computer, but a whole big box became unexpectedly drenched, and I don't have the heart to look at it. If perchance anyone has a scan of this ad, and you'll know what I'm talking about if you've seen it, it would be awful nice to get a scan of it. I bought one of those kits to make your own T-shirts a while back (especially since it was free after the rebate) and I thought a shirt with the D68K logo would look sick. (Trouble is I have to send for different transfer material. The stuff that came in the box is only for light colored shirts, and I thought black would be a better deal). __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

19 years, 4 months

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WTB: Nokia 9000 and HP OmniGo 700

by sellam＠vintagetech.com

Does anyone have a Nokia 9000 (not 9000i) or HP OmniGo 700? Oh yeah? Want to sell them? ;) Please reply directly to me as I am not subscribed to the list. sellam at vintagetech.com Thanks! Happy New Year all! -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ]

19 years, 4 months

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Old DEC Software and Hardware Manuals

by frajkp＠netscape.net

Hi, these have all been taken. Thanks ________________________________________________________________________ Check Out the new free AIM(R) Mail -- 2 GB of storage and industry-leading spam and email virus protection.

19 years, 4 months

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wtd: Televideo TS-1603 (TS-803 lookalike)

by chrism3667＠yahoo.com

but has an 8088 instead of the z80. Preferably the color model, but monochrome is nice too. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

19 years, 4 months

1
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Manchester Baby.

by austin＠ozpass.co.uk

Hello all! I?m a long time ?list lurker? but felt it was perhaps time to contribute. I?ve just spent the morning being shown a working replica of the Manchester Small-Scale Experimantal Machine (SSEM), also commonly referred to as the ?Manchester Baby?. It?s located in the ?1830 Warehouse? at the Manchester Museum of Science and Industry. One of the curators is (by lucky chance) my Uncle Michael and he?s personally written a number of programs for this old beast. The replica is fantastic, with incredible attention to period detail. For example, the switchgear is proper 1940?s vintage (salvaged from RAF aircraft) and the frames upon which the replica is built are from former GPO telecoms exchanges. Apparently the donor of said frames was using them to prevent his garden subsiding into a nearby river! The computer itself, for anyone unaware of it is regarded as the world?s first stored program computer. It ran its first program on June 21st 1948, jointly designed by Frederic C. Williams and Tom Kilburn at the University of Manchester, UK. The stored memory is in the form of a ?Williams Tube? - a cathode ray tube capable of storing 32 X 32bit words. It?s an extremely limited bit of kit (as one might imagine!) with an instruction set of only 7, and no adder (addition achieved by negating numbers during their move to the accumulator). It?s a great exhibit if anyone?s in this part of the world on a Tuesday with nothing to do. No charge for entry into the museum. Here are some informative links, including a beautifully crafted ?Manchester Baby Emulator? (in Java). http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manchester_Baby http://www.computer50.org/ http://www.davidsharp.com/baby/index.html Regards, Austin. P.S. The guys at the museum have hooked it up to a PC, so that programs written on the emulator can be loaded into the baby to be run. Does this qualify it as the world?s most ancient add-on / peripheral / co-processor? ;-)

19 years, 4 months

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rt-11 Documentation

by williams.dan＠gmail.com

I'm sure someone on the list asked a while back, but I couldn't find it. I have the complete rt-11 docs printed out. They are too heavy to post but can be picked up from here (Soho UK). Dan

19 years, 4 months

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HP 2100A vs. 2100S

by jdbryan＠acm.org

Would anyone know the difference between a 2100A and a 2100S? Is it just packaging (such as, e.g., the "13246A Printer Subsystem," which was simply a 9866A printer and a 2640A terminal duplex card that were sold together)? Or is there something fundamentally different in the hardware? -- Dave

19 years, 4 months

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USB 5.25" floppy (was: laptops and 5.25 inch floppy drives?)

by aek＠bitsavers.org

> Essentially a USB version of the Catweasel??? That's exactly what it is. A flux-tranistion interface daughter card for a fpga4fun SAXO board (USB2 chip and Altera FPGA). http://www.fpga4fun.com/board_Xylo.html This is probably similar to what the Device Side Data board is, but the intention that I have is to make the entire design, including the tool chain and host/device side code freely available. The tape wizl is a multichannel preamp and A/D converter attached to the same board. Cost could be driven down by designing a single board, but right now I'm only worrying about the boards needed for tape/disc interfacing.

19 years, 4 months

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USB 5.25" floppy (was: laptops and 5.25 inch floppy drives?)

by aek＠bitsavers.org

Link to a possible USB 5.25" floppy drive: http://silme.pair.com/~goldman/deviceside/ -- I spoke to him at VCF, and was unimpressed by how closed he intends to keep the HW/SW. A USB floppy interface will be part of the fallout from the 'wizl' development that I'm doing, though the hardware is going to be in the $100+ range. http://bitsavers.org/tools/wizl/diskwizl/ I'm going to spend this next quarter concentrating on developing the wizl. Was looking back and it's been six years since I started looking at getting an analog 7-track tape reader running, and I need to get this project finished.

19 years, 4 months

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Yet another bounty: CompuServe software ($$$)

by sellam＠vintagetech.com

Hey All. Does anyone have this software by chance? Compuserv professional connection plus. Message management with forms. Compuserv, Inc. 1988 (PC3-Mail System) If so, it's worth some bucks to you. Please contact me directly (I'm not subscribed and won't get replies here). Thanks! -- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org [ Old computing resources for business || Buy/Sell/Trade Vintage Computers ] [ and academia at www.VintageTech.com || at http://marketplace.vintage.org ]

19 years, 4 months

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USB 5.25" floppy (was: laptops and 5.25 inch floppy drives?)

by Watzman＠neo.rr.com

Link to a possible USB 5.25" floppy drive: http://silme.pair.com/~goldman/deviceside/

19 years, 4 months

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Intergraph / Clipper / HLH Orion

by roosmcd＠dds.nl

> From: "William Donzelli" <wdonzelli at gmail.com> > Subject: Re: Intergraph / Clipper / HLH Orion > >> So noone has one of the Intergraph workstations? A pity. They were a >> dominant player, you'd have expected some of the machines to survive! > > > There are quite a few in Rhode Island at both computer groups. Even an > Intergraph VAX, with weird disk controllers made to search for polygon > data in hardware. > I still have a 2020 and a 125 from a lot I traded some time ago . These were used as GIS systems by the government. Never got the 125 to work because of some bug in the installation procedure. The steel-encased Intergraph 21" color monitor was also very nice.... I also have a lot of documentation, cd-roms, tapes and floppies. If anyone is interested, I have Intergraph memory for sale for 2000 machines, sets of 4x4MB special Intergraph 30-pin simms; my machines already is at the 64MB max. I've tried a long time to sell those, so far no luck, so I don't think many people have Intergraph workstations :) . greetings, Michiel

19 years, 4 months

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Atari 800, 810 parts (or Apple II) wanted

by wbblair3＠yahoo.com

> > but what were the differences besides the keyboard? > > They must have had similar internals. > > Expansion options I would think. A friend of mine in highschool had both > the 400 and 800 units , but we only used the 800 when we had groups over to > play Ultima III and IV. I snooped around and remember that there were card > slots for RAM and ROM carts under the hood of the 800 but never looked in > the 400. > > This site shows the expansion bays (and differences) in the 2 units: > > http://www.silicium.org/atari/800.htm > http://www.silicium.org/atari/400.htm > > It looks like the 400 was stuck with its 16K? RAM while the 800 can be > expanded more and it has an extra ROM port it seems. > > The original series was built like a tank, the XL and later models were not > as good from what I remember. The cast aluminum internal case was for EMI reasons. They were being extremely conservative to the point of overkill since, at that time, the less restrictive FCC ratings specifically for digital devices in homes weren't yet in existence. The 400 sold for US $549.95 while exactly the same hardware (with respect to custom processors and processing power) with more expansion capability and a real keyboard went for US $999.95 in the Atari 800. That $450 merely for more _easy_ expandability and a real rather than membrane keyboard wasn't enough to me to justify the additional cost, so I bought the 400 and wired up internally more memory and a real keyboard later on (for FAR less than $450). Byte magazine did a highly complimentary two-part (IIRC) series of articles on the powerful (for then) custom sound and graphics chips in the Atari machines. This was what led me to buy the Atari 400 a few years before the Commodore 64 became available. Jay Miner was the lead designer for those custom chips and he would later design the Amiga custom chips after leaving Atari. http://oldcomputers.net/atari400.html http://oldcomputers.net/atari800.html __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

19 years, 4 months

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Intel component data catalog 1982 on epay

by vax9000＠gmail.com

item 150077784822 Not my auction I post it here because the is near the end but only 8 people have viewed it! Maybe due to bad title or bad category. vax, 9000

19 years, 4 months

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laptops and 5.25 inch floppy drives

by Watzman＠neo.rr.com

Re: "What about taking an external USB 3.5" floppy drive and connecting a 5.25" drive to the interface that is being used for the 3.5" drive? It seems like it should work." Won't work. ALL of the USB 3.5" floppy drives that I've taken apart (over 100) are fully integrated USB devices. They are NOT a standard floppy drive (with a 34-pin floppy drive interface) and a USB-to-floppy controller.

19 years, 4 months

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Old D.E.C. Software and Hardware Manuals Available

by frajkp＠netscape.net

Hi, I have a few old Digital Equipment Corp. manuals. If anyone is interested in them they are yours for shipping costs (I'm in Ontario, Canada). They are as follows: - DEC System 10 - Mathematical Languages Handbook - DEC System 10 - Assembly Language Handbook - DEC System 10 - Users Handbook - KW11-L line time clock manual - ME11-L core memory system manual - Decscope User's Manual - RK611/RK06 Disk Susbsystem user's manual - DR11-C general device interface manual - AR11 User's guide - DL11-W serial iine unit/real time clock option maintenance manual - DL11 asynchronous line interface manual - RK11-D and RK11-E moving head disk drive controller manual - Rk611/RK06 disk subsystem installation manual - DZ11 user's guide Thanks ________________________________________________________________________ Check Out the new free AIM(R) Mail -- 2 GB of storage and industry-leading spam and email virus protection.

19 years, 4 months

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REPOSTING: Fw: an ADM-3A cam in tod...ay (Why this message hadn't shown up???)

by alexandre-listas＠e-secure.com.br

----- Original Message ----- From: "Alexandre Souza" <alexandre-listas at e-secure.com.br> To: "General Discussion: On-Topic Posts Only" <cctech at classiccmp.org> Sent: Thursday, December 28, 2006 2:01 PM Subject: Re: an ADM-3A cam in tod...ay >> Mac portrait displays are presumably similarly difficult to get >> replacement CRTs for, at least without realigning the yoke (I gather that >> most CRTs don't like a change in orientation, although I used to run a >> Sun colour display on its side a few years ago with no obvious >> ill-effects) >> For more conventional equipment I suspect that a swap is possible, >> providing knowledge of how to tweak the old circuits with the new tube is >> known. > > There is a very simple way of doing that. I though you all knew that, > and didn't want to be redundant, but here we go: > > - For mac portrait displays, I don't know. But I always had run tubes > on vertical on...ARCADE MACHINES! :D There is no problem on running B/W or > colour tubes on vertical, trust me. > > - Tube swap is very simple. You can assume that if the neck connector > fits, it will work. There are not many different tubes around, the problem > is the yoke. On B/W tubes you just take the yoke of the fried tube off and > put that on the new. No special alignment/convergence procedure necessary. > Just line up the text on screen moving the yoke cw/ccw and you are set. > For colour tubes, there are differences, here we go. > > - There are mainly three types of colour tubes: Mini-neck (the neck is > the diameter of a fat finger), Low focus and High focus. Of course, I'm > talking about inline masks. That Delta tubes (the RGB triad is a delta of > points, instead of three lines one besides other) I've never seen that > used in anything beyond televisions. If you have a monitor using a delta > mask tube, forget it! The adjustments you're going to do are too difficult > even to a profissional. > > - Low focus and High focus: You can see what kind is, looking at the > tube socket or the neck end of the tube. The high focus tube has a plastic > ring inserted on the pins, with a pin isolated from all the others. You > can see the same in the socket. Low focus doesn't have that, the end of > the tube has only pins, no plastic separator. > > - If you change colour tubes (talking about high focus and low focus), > usually it is just a matter of changing the tube and using the same > deflection set (yoke, convergence rings et al). E.G.: You have a monitor > like the Amiga 1084/S which uses a philips or samsung tube, Low focus > type, 15KHz yoke. Just buy any (!) television with the same > chacarteristics (low focus) and change it. Yes, you can use the same yoke. > Almost always the paramenters of the yoke are **the same**. The same > happens for VGA monitors. Usually, all vga monitors uses the same type of > yokes. YMMV, but this is the rule here. Please note: Yokes of 15 KHz > monitors and 31 KHz monitors (vga and above) are NOT intechangeable. But > the tubes ARE! > > - If you need to change the tube of, as an example, an EGA monitor, > you'll not find a complete set from a television of from an old vga > monitor, you'll have to change only the tube, keeping the deflection parts > (yoke, convergence ring) and will have to do all the convergence procedure > yourself. It is boring, it is hard, it is boring. But if you have no way > to find a suitable replacement tube, there you are. > > Ok, too much words, here we go for a simple list: > - If you have a B/W monitor, you can change the tube for ANY tube with > the same neck size and that fits phisically in place. Keep the yoke from > the old tube and put it on the new. You'll be only changing the glass > tube. > - If you have a COLOUR monitor, if the pixels are inline (sets of three > bars, RGB on screen), you can change for any tube of the SAME type, paying > attention if it is low focus or high focus. You can go some sizes above > and beyond. E.G: A 14" monitor can use a 17" or even a 20" tube, the > reverse is true. > - If you have a VGA or HIGHER frequency monitor, you need a tube with > yoke from a monitor of SIMILAR frequencies. Same as above > - If you have a 15 KHz monitor and only have a VGA tube, and > vice-versa, you can change THE TUBE, but will have to change the > deflection set (yoke/convergence rings) and do all the convergence > procedure yourself. Samsung manuals are great for teaching that, get the > Syncmaster III service manual and be free. > > Any questions, feel free to write me > > Greetings from Brazil, > Alexandre Souza > www.tabajara-labs.com.br

19 years, 4 months

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Atari 800, 810 parts (or Apple II) wanted

by chrism3667＠yahoo.com

I take it the 800 was the successor to the 400, the 1st unit my fingers ever typed on. Lol at typed on. You needed a ball peen hammer to do any serious coding. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

19 years, 4 months

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Build your own Apollo Guidance Computer

by grant＠stockly.com

http://klabs.org/history/build_agc/ Thanks to Richard Cini for the link! No, its not a kit from me, but it is really cool! It has good potential to become a kit! : ) Its an older link, but very cool. :) Grant

19 years, 4 months

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useful 286 docs for OS creation?

by chrism3667＠yahoo.com

http://cgi.ebay.com/Intel-80286-Operating-Systems-Writers-Guide_W0QQitemZ27… I'm trying to think if I have one of these in my stash. I ain't paying $20 for it regardless. Anyone have one? __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

19 years, 4 months

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govliq: mux and 26MB BAE/xerox hard drives

by aek＠bitsavers.org

> DEC RK03 (or workalike) I believe, looks to be in minty fresh > condition :) Diablo series 30 would be 2.5mb. Can't really tell from the pic of the box, but if they are in the 20mb range they would be Diablo series 40 5440 style with one fixed, one removable. 24 sector would work on TI and Interdata.

19 years, 4 months

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govliq: HP servers -- does anyone recognize these?

by legalize＠xmission.com

<http://cgi.govliquidation.com/auction/view?auctionId=1085688&convertTo=USD> LOT (2) HP SPP31 SERVERS, PRODUCT NO A5081A/ A4830-63001. SN US10076726, US10076544. I don't recognize the cabinet, but it appears to have been stripped of all skins. Beefy power inputs though! -- "The Direct3D Graphics Pipeline" -- DirectX 9 draft available for download <http://www.xmission.com/~legalize/book/download/index.html> Legalize Adulthood! <http://blogs.xmission.com/legalize/>

19 years, 4 months

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My second Mac

by aek＠bitsavers.org

>> Beyond that, you can easily spend more upgrading than a faster newer >> machine would cost you on the used market. That said... > > Nah, I'm just trying to figure out the Mac "culture". I want to get > my currently unused workstation monitor on the G3 and poke around a > bit. Forget about OS X then, and think about the evolution of a computer from a 128K 68000 through a G4 with a gigabyte of memory. There are still applications that will run on the last version of OS 9 that were written for the original Mac. Mac users would typically have many times the number of applications than a Windows user, mostly because most had no installation requirements other than dragging the app onto the system. Drivers and system extensions were easily added by putting them in the Extensions folder inside of System. The way some of them worked (patching into system calls) sometimes resulted in system conflicts. The biggest problem in the 68K Mac world was a holdover from the earliest days of trying to fit into a tiny memory footprint. The flat 68K address space was segmented to create position independent code chunks that could move around as the system compacted memory. Unfortunately, the data space was also segmented, so the APIs often had 64K restrictions on data areas. PPC Macs got rid of that, and went to a flat memory model, which made programming applications with large code/data footprints MUCH easier. The big problem with the MacOS was there really was no architecture. Features were tacked on, including things like two different shared library architecutres on PPC because they evolved through two different devlopment groups. In the end the API was a "Mactintosh Mystery House", with dead-end APIs, and APIs that were bloated and ridiculously over-engineered (Comm Toolbox, for instance). Adherence to backwards compatibility really was why it was impossible for Apple to come up with a replacement for MacOS until someone (Jobs) finally cut the cord. This was impossible from the bottom up, no one at the top was willing to have old applications break en mass.

19 years, 4 months

2
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MVME parts in Philadelphia and elsewhere

by mnusa2＠hotmail.com

Hi All, I'm going to Philadelphia, PA for two weeks. I collect Motorola MVME computers and I would like to find some spares to take back to Europe. Do You know any places near and good places even far to find classic computer parts. I have a weekend to spare and I have a car. BR, Matti. _________________________________________________________________ Uutiset ja kasvot uutisten takaa. MSN Search, t?yden palvelun hakukone. http://search.msn.fi

19 years, 4 months

1
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RK02/RK03

by aek＠bitsavers.org

> Can someone tell me if the DEC > RK03 was actually a rebadged Diablo 30? RK02 == Diablo 31 with 1100bpi heads (1.25mb) RK03 == Diablo 31 with 2200bpi heads (2.5mb) There was also an RK01, used with the RK8 contoller but it is not a Diablo drive.

19 years, 4 months

1
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Mac OS 9- browsers

by mtapley＠swri.edu

At 22:28 -0600 1/6/07, Zane wrote: > Of course if you want to be able to surf from this system, >Mac OS X is pretty much a requirement. There is no modern web >browser for Mac OS 9. Were it not for the adjective "modern", I'd say: http://www.icab.de/ (as has been mentioned) http://www.opera.com/ (find Version 6.0.3 on their website) With the "modern" it becomes a bit more debateable. They do still run, though. -- Mark Tapley, Dwarf Engineer (I haven't cleared my neighborhood) 210-379-4635 Dwarf Phone, 210-522-6025 Office Phone

19 years, 4 months

1
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FA: HP HP-2117F on ebay

by oldcpu＠rogerwilco.org

I don't know anything about HP minis, so I don't know what to look for, but for those on the list that have HPs and might be interested... The main unit: item # 320060663740 The FP unit: item # 320060663048 No bids yet. J

19 years, 4 months

6
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Motorola 6800D2

by chuck.patten＠verizon.net

Hi Allison, it was directed at the person who might have an excess 6800D2 unit. Unfortunately I never received your reply before today (I found it in a Google search...) cheers, chuck... Allison ajp166 <mailto:cctalk%40classiccmp.org?Subject=Motorola%206800D2&In-Reply-To=> at bellatlantic.net Mon Aug 15 21:30:44 CDT 2005 * Previous message: volunteers <http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/2005-August/201021.html> wanted for list help :) * Next message: Compaq <http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/2005-August/201024.html> SLT/286 * Messages sorted by: [ <http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/2005-August/date.html#201023> date ] [ <http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/2005-August/thread.html#201023> thread ] [ <http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/2005-August/subject.html#201023> subject ] [ <http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/2005-August/author.html#201023> author ] _____ This is aimed at whom? Allison > >Subject: Motorola 6800D2 > From: "Chuck Patten" <chuck.patten at verizon.net <http://www.classiccmp.org/mailman/listinfo/cctalk> > > Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 22:05:00 -0700 > To: <cctalk at classiccmp.org <http://www.classiccmp.org/mailman/listinfo/cctalk> > > >Noticed you had collected one from an old thread. Are you interested in >parting with it? > > > >cheers, > >chuck. > > _____ * Previous message: volunteers <http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/2005-August/201021.html> wanted for list help :) * Next message: Compaq <http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/2005-August/201024.html> SLT/286 * Messages sorted by: [ <http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/2005-August/date.html#201023> date ] [ <http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/2005-August/thread.html#201023> thread ] [ <http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/2005-August/subject.html#201023> subject ] [ <http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/2005-August/author.html#201023> author ] _____ More information <http://www.classiccmp.org/mailman/listinfo/cctalk> about the cctalk mailing list

19 years, 4 months

2
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ET-3400/ETA-3400 ROMs 444-24/444-51

by peter.hofmann＠chello.at

Hallo Paul, Found your link in a discussion forum on >> From: "James E Cosper" <jec at jcosper.com> To: <cctalk at classiccmp.org> Sent: Tuesday, September 07, 2004 7:00 PM Subject: Heathkit ETA-3400 Modifications I am searching very hard the images of ET-3400/ETA-3400 ROMs 444-24/444-51. I would be very happy to find someone, who has these equipment and can make a dump/punch to a file from the ROM address ranges 1400-23FF and F800-FFFF (MON>P 1400,23FFcr + MON>P F800-FFFFcr). May be you have any info for me? Many thanks in advance and best regards from Austria peter peter.hofmann at chello.at

19 years, 4 months

1
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Atari 800, 810 parts (or Apple II) wanted

by chrism3667＠yahoo.com

but what were the differences besides the keyboard? They must have had similar internals. --- cctalk-bounces at classiccmp.org <wgungfu at csd.uwm.edu> wrote: > >I take it the 800 was the successor to the 400, the > >1st unit my fingers ever typed on. > > > No, the 800 was released at the same time as the 400. 400 was the "lower > end games computer", 800 was the "more serious" higher end computer. > > > Marty __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

19 years, 4 months

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2.5GB bigfoot drives on dovebid

by cheri-post＠web.de

> On 6 Jan 2007 at 16:40, Richard wrote: > > > Wasn't there some discussion recently looking for < 10 GB drives? > > > > There's a bunch of 2.5GB drives on dovebid right now... > > Quantum Bigfoot--bleah. Miserable things. Yeah, I would'nt rely on Bigfoot drives, too. They are *very* low-cost and so is the quality and therefore reliability. We had several of these which gave up work quite quickly. One should try to avoid them. Regards, Pierre _______________________________________________________________________ Viren-Scan f?r Ihren PC! Jetzt f?r jeden. Sofort, online und kostenlos. Gleich testen! http://www.pc-sicherheit.web.de/freescan/?mc=022222

19 years, 4 months

2
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My second Mac

by trag＠io.com

>Date: Sat, 06 Jan 2007 09:51:16 -0800 >From: "Chuck Guzis" <cclist at sydex.com> >I picked up another Mac yesterday--a beige 300 Mhz G3 with 256MB, >and a 15 GB hard disk. It's also got a USB adapter plugged into one >of the PCI slots. It's running OS 9.something. Set me back $20. >Were Zip drives a standard part of these things? > >On a side-by-side with a Win2K P1 225MHz system with the same amount >of memory, I think the WIndoze box has snappier response and has >better video. > >For you Mac addicts, what do you think should be my next step in >getting the most out of this box? My experience with the Beige G3 is that the stock hard drives are slow as molasses. The built-in IDE bus is only 16.7 MB/s (whichever ATA that is) but the hard drive doesn't even perform up to that level--at least mine did not. Once I installed a more modern hard drive (faster media rate, i.e. faster data from platters to heads) the machine showed a marked improvement in performance. Beyond that, you can easily spend more upgrading than a faster newer machine would cost you on the used market. That said... A faster IDE card would improve things as well. Acard makes a very nice two channel ATA-133 card however, it will set you back about twice what you paid for the machine. Some years ago VST Tech sold an ATA-66 card based on the Promise UltraTek 66 card. If you move three or four SM resistors, possibly pull the half-size metal can oscillator (there are different versions of the UT66 and some have the Osc. and others don't) and desolder and reprogram the Winbond Flash chip, you can convert a cheap (<$5) Promise UltraTek66 into a VST UltraTek66. If you care, I'll try to hunt up the conversion instructions. The Promise cards were apparently OEM in DELL machines or some such, so there are a bunch of them on the used market. The bus speed and bus-CPU multiplier are controlled by a jumper block on the front left of the motherboard. You can change the bus speed >from 66MHz to 75 (IIRC) or 83 MHz by moving jumpers. However, many of the Beige G3s won't operate at 83 MHz and tests show that this doesn't really make a big difference in performance. The 300 MHz CPU can often be run at around 366 MHz, so you can speed your CPU a bit by changing the bus-CPU ratio. Many folks have done this reliably, but my experience was that it caused problems after a while. CPU replacements up to 1.1 GHz are also available but the manufacturer's (PowerLogix) retail outlet (OWC, macsales.com) seems to be out of them. See above about spending more money than a newer used computer would cost... There's a gap in speeds between 500 MHz and 900 MHz having to do with the version history of the PPC750. The machine used PC66 SDRAM but PC100 or PC133 will also work. DIMM capacities up to 256 MB are supported but some addressing modes are not. So you need (I think) 16 chip DIMMs on the 256 MB capacity. IIRC eight chip 256 MB DIMMs will not work or will only be seen as 128 MB. 512 MB DIMMs won't work because of limitations of the Motorola/Freescale MPC106 memory/PCI controller/bridge. For the things where my memory is hazy (indicated by a ? or "I think") check the articles on G3 computers at xlr8yourmac.com. Also, there's a link from the FAQ there to the jumper settings for the Beige G3 motherboard clock and ratio settings. >I don't care for the Mac monitor that came with it--has anyone tried >hooking up a fixed-frequency SOG workstation monitor to it? I've got >a nice HP/Sony model that might be a candidate. Mac DB15 to VGA adapters are common and cheap (=<$4, I sell a multi-rez model for $4 shipped in USA). If the monitor will work with a VGA output, it should be possible to make it work on the built-in video of the Beige G3. However, the Beige G3 and earlier Macs rely on sense codes in the monitor cable to indicate what resolutions are supported. When an adapter is used the sense codes are provided by the adapter. Some adapters are fixed-resolution coded so it's tough to get anything but the adapter's fixed resolution out of the Mac if you use a fixed resolution adapter. Other adapters are "universal" and have DIP switches to support many resolutions, and one of the resolution code choices is "21" multi-resolution". Jeff Walther

19 years, 4 months

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microprocessors in my vax 3800

by vax9000＠gmail.com

Today I pulled out the boards in my vax 3800 and I found 7 microprocessors besides the CVAX. They are, 2x 68000, 8096, 80186, 2x 8086, Z80. Just a little discovery to share with you. vax, 9000

19 years, 4 months

3
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My second Mac

by trag＠io.com

>Date: Sat, 6 Jan 2007 12:57:06 -0800 (PST) >From: Cameron Kaiser <spectre at floodgap.com> >> I picked up another Mac yesterday--a beige 300 Mhz G3 with 256MB, >> On a side-by-side with a Win2K P1 225MHz system with the same amount >> of memory, I think the WIndoze box has snappier response and has >> better video. > >The beige G3 has only a Rage II+ card by default. The later Revision 2 and >3 use Rage Pro. Thus, I think the video issue you're noticing is probably >the accelerator. The original 300 is almost certainly Revision 1. The video chip can be visually examined, although the "Wings" card (AV card) may be in the way. It will have Rage II or Rage Pro (or Rage Turbo?) printed on it. You may also be able to get this information from Apple system Profiler in the Apple menu. If the ROM DIMM has not been switched out, you can determine your revision by looking at the ROM revision in the first page of Apple System Profiler. Under "Production Information" look at "ROM Revision". If it is $77D.40F2 then you have a Revision A ROM. If this ROM shipped with this motherboard then you also have a revision 1 motherboard. However, the ROM DIMM is pretty easy to switch so there's no guarantee that the machine contains the ROM it originally shipped with and all of the ROM revisions work with all of the motherboard revisions. If the ROM revision is $77D.45F1 it is a revision B. If it is $77D.45F2 it is a revision C and absent ROM swapping the machine probably has a RAGE Pro video chip. If you have a Rev. A ROM, then the built-in IDE channels in the machine will only support 1 device per channel. You need Rev. B or C ROM for two device support per channel. You can also determine your ROM revision by looking at the Apple part number on the two ROM chips on the ROM DIMM. However, I don't remember the numbers. It's something like 341S0409 and 0408 is Rev. A, 341S0494 adn 0495 is Rev. C and I've never seen a Rev. B with the part numbers on it so I can't say, but I imagine it's 341S04xx with xx up close to 90. No matter which motherboard you have, switching to a B or C ROM will enable two device support on the IDE channels. >You might as well get a Rage Orion and I think you'll find the performance >much better. The Rage Orion is a 16MB Rage 128 PCI card, and I know from >personal experience that it is Mac-compatible and has good performance. >They're pretty cheap on the used market. Rage Orion was ATI's name for one of the Macintosh versions of the Rage 128. PC versions of the Rage 128 won't work. (I am not contradicting Cameron, just restating his information a bit.) It may be possible to do a conversion from PC version to Mac version, but I don't think anyone has ever reported a successful modification. The Radeon 7000 works well in the Beige and the Sapphire version of the PCI card with DDR memory is easily converted to Macintosh use. It is also just $30 at Newegg. Simply remove the eight pin SOIC serial flash chip and replace it with a blank ST Micro M25P10. It should then either flash with the current Mac firmware updater from ATI or it may require the R7000-ROM-208 version. It's been a while. I know the latter will work. I'm not sure about the former. Whichever way, update to the latest firmware afterwards, because there are some Sleep issues with earlier versions. 3D driver support is only official after OS 9.2 but if you install the Open GL 1.22 or 1.24 extensions by hand into OS 9.1 it works fine. Jeff Walther

19 years, 4 months

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My Second Mac

by compoobah＠valleyimplants.com

> On Sun, 7 Jan 2007, Scott Quinn wrote: > > My guess has to do with processors: i80486 binaries can run just fine > > on Pentium+ systems. > > so can 8088 binaries. (With occasional exceptions that don't typically > show up in common usage (such as PUSH SP)) > But not all Pentium+ binaries will run on 8088, or even i80486. > > > There seemed to have been a cultural difference between Motorola and > intel. > > Motorola would design each major generation from scratch, thus > producing a > much better processor, but without legacy software. > > intel, OTOH, would bend over backwards to try to maintain 4004 > compatibility. We're talking about two slightly different things here, though- 68000 (while it did not have provisions for easily running 6800 code) had a common-mode so that programs built on the 68040 could run on the 68000, but you can also have code that requires instructions (or other things) added on later 68000-series processors, similar to Intel (variable 286-style segments, the copy-on-write provision of the 80486, etc.). The transition between 68000 and PPC was more like the Intel gap between the x86 and the 960 - they are completely different processors with no common heritage (the common heritage piece was provided by Apple in firmware). I haven't worked with them, but AFAIK the new embedded versions of the 68000 (ColdFire?) maintain the tradition of working with earlier 68ks (except in a few cases).

19 years, 4 months

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My Second Mac

by compoobah＠valleyimplants.com

> Chuck wrote > On 6 Jan 2007 at 19:41, Cameron Kaiser wrote: > >> >> So I don't see what's so restrictive about the Mac requirements at >> all, >> frankly. > > You're right, it's a matter of small degree. Mac OS 8 = 1997; > Windows 95 = 1995. Intel 80486 = 1989; PPC 601 = 1992. It's pretty > much a moot point anyway--everyone's going to be x86 by-and-by. > > Cheers, > Chuck > My guess has to do with processors: i80486 binaries can run just fine on Pentium+ systems. The software probably can work just fine at 68040 speeds, but then when run on PowerPC systems you have the emulation overhead which drops speeds to around a IIci (25MHz 68030, think Sun-3) on a 8100/80 (80MHz PPC601) Some companies didn't want the bother of maintaining two versions (68k and PPC, especially after the PPC machines had been out a year or two), so they would compile PPC only- hence the higher system requirements.

19 years, 4 months

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Stunning recreation work: Danger Will Robinson!

by aliensrcooluk＠yahoo.co.uk

--- John Foust <jfoust at threedee.com> wrote: **>> snip <<** > > Back in late 1998, my buddy Sheldon Leemon (author > of "Mapping the C-64") > won the grand prize in an online sweepstakes. The > prize was a full-size > promotional version of the robot from the remake o f > "Lost in Space". > It had been touring the USA and Japan. Doesn't lo ok > quite the same: > > http://www.robotoys.com/lis99.jpg > > 600 pounds, New Line Cinema valued it at $4,500. We > debated what we > might do with it, never coming to any good > conclusions. I was tempted > to store it in my barn. He never picked it up. I t > sat in a shipping > yard for months. I think it eventually started > running up charges and > was sent back in mid-1999. I wonder where it went ! > > - John > Urghh!!!! Why would you want that piece of trash?!!! Sorry, but I think it's the worst designed robot in the history of films! Robbie the robot (Forbidden Planet, 3 or 4 eps of Lost In Space 60's tv series, background in Gremlins 1 (or 2?) and even in a Columbo film >from the 70's!), Gort (Day The Earth Stood Still), Maximillion (The Black Hole) and more modern robot's such as Robocop, ED-209 and Caine (all from the Robocop films), plus the T-1000 (Terminator), are much better designed to be menacing and/or cool looking. When I saw the one from the Lost In Space film (from 90's) I just laughed. To be honest, going from the picture, it looks like a cross between the robot's from Short Circuit and Caine from Robocop 2. Regards, Andrew D. Burton aliensrcooluk at yahoo.co.uk

19 years, 4 months

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Stunning recreation work: Danger Will Robinson!

by aliensrcooluk＠yahoo.co.uk

--- "Bryan K. Blackburn" <oldcomp at cox.net> wrote: > Recently we have seen recreations of several vinta ge > computers like the > Mark-8 Minicomputer, the Apple 1, the IMSAI 8080 a nd > most recently the > Altair 8800, but wait till you see this!!! > > eBay item # 230051400851 > > The effort that must have went into this project.. .! > Detailed > construction photos here: > > http://www.lostinspacerobot.com/newsletter.html > > I confess that I have always wanted one of these! :) > I have no > connection with the seller etc. & etc. > My dad has got 2 plastic models from Lost In Space. One had the giant holding a boulder above his head with John and Don below him and the other one was a 6" (or thereabouts) tall model of the Robinson robot. Not sure where they are now though. If he had the money I'm sure he would want the replica of the Robinson robot :) Regards, Andrew D. Burton aliensrcooluk at yahoo.co.uk

19 years, 4 months

1
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garbled display

by chrism3667＠yahoo.com

and I should also point out some of the screen is reverse video, some is blinking. Anyone know what happened to John Allain? --- cctalk-bounces at classiccmp.org <chrism3667 at yahoo.com> wrote: > it only helps if youre going to swing by and unseat > the 80186 from its bizarre cage. I aint touching one > ever again. But thanks all the same Roger :) > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

19 years, 4 months

1
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Stunning recreation work: Danger Will Robinson!

by aliensrcooluk＠yahoo.co.uk

--- Sridhar Ayengar <ploopster at gmail.com> wrote: > aliensrcooluk at yahoo.co.uk wrote: > > Why would you want that piece of trash?!!! > > Sorry, but I think it's the worst designed robot > > in the history of films! > > Robbie the robot (Forbidden Planet, 3 or 4 eps > > of Lost In Space 60's tv series, background in > > Gremlins 1 (or 2?) and even in a Columbo film > > from the 70's!), Gort (Day The Earth Stood > > Still), Maximillion (The Black Hole) and more > > modern robot's such as Robocop, ED-209 and > > Caine (all from the Robocop films), plus the > > T-1000 (Terminator), are much better designed > > to be menacing and/or cool looking. > > Are you sure you're not talking about the T-800? > The T-1000 is the > liquid-metal jobbie. > > Peace... Sridhar > Ooops. Yeah, I meant the T-800 (Arnold Schwarzenegger). Whilst double-checking the T-number, I came across this huge list of goof's (page is around 200KB's): http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0103064/goofs Regards, Andrew D. Burton aliensrcooluk at yahoo.co.uk

19 years, 4 months

1
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Intergraph / Clipper / HLH Orion

by ken＠seefried.com

I recall Opus made a AT bus plugin card with a Clipper. Think it ran Clix.

19 years, 4 months

4
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test-drb January 2007