test-drb February 2006

test-drb@ccmp.vtda.org

224 participants
452 discussions

We Moved, please update your records with our new address, phones numbers stay the same!

by jeff＠selectcomputer.net

cctech at classiccmp.org, I'm updating my address book. Please take a moment to update me with your latest contact info. Click the following link to correct or confirm your information: https://www.plaxo.com/edit_contact_info?r=4295311943-82525385--637936337 Name: cctech at classiccmp.org Job Title: Company: Work E-mail: cctech at classiccmp.org Work Phone: Work Fax: Work Address Line 1: Work Address Line 2: Work City, State, Zip: Mobile Phone: Home E-mail: Home Phone: Home Fax: Home Address Line 1: Home Address Line 2: Home City, State, Zip: Birthday: P.S. I've included my Plaxo card below so that you have my current information. I've also attached a copy as a vCard. +----------------- | Jeff Silverman | jeff at selectcomputer.net | CEO | | Select Computer Technology Inc. | 1605D Mabury Rd. | San Jose, Ca 95133 | work: 408-944-9475 | fax: 408-944-9476 | mobile: 408-390-3760 | im: jsilve1260 | web: www.selectcomputer.net +------------------------------------- ____________________________________________________________ This message was sent to you by jeff at selectcomputer.net via Plaxo. To opt out: https://www.plaxo.com/opt_out?r=4295311943-82525385--637936337 Plaxo's Privacy Policy: http://www.plaxo.com/support/privacy

18 years, 5 months

seeking connection information of CRT assy of Olivetti M21

by dwight.elvey＠amd.com

Hi Henk 'Got the pointer wrong, should be: http://www.elhvb.com/mboards/olivetti/systems1.html Take care Dwight >From: "Gooijen, Henk" <henk.gooijen at oce.com> > >Thanks Dwight. >I will do some more Googling tomorrow, and wade through the results :-( >I tried the link a few times, but I get a 404. Will try it again tomorrow too. > >- Henk. > >________________________________ > >Van: cctalk-bounces at classiccmp.org namens Dwight Elvey >Verzonden: di 14-02-2006 21:19 >Aan: cctalk at classiccmp.org >Onderwerp: Re: seeking connection information of CRT assy of Olivetti M21 > > > >Hi Henk > I just did some google and found a web page that >looks like it may have technical docs for the M21. >Look at: > >http://www.elhvb.com/mboards/olivetti/system1.html <http://www.elhvb.com/mboards/olivetti/system1.html> > >Selecting cap1.pdf brings up a email request. I'm not >sure if it will lead to anything but you might get a >schematic showing the connector pins. >Dwight > > >>From: "Gooijen, Henk" <henk.gooijen at oce.com> >> >>Hi all, >>I got an amber 10" monitor that was originally in an Olivetti M21. >>I like the screen size and the color, so I would like to build some >>sort of terminal with it. From the PCB comes a flat cable which >>ends in a DB25 connector. As this is all connections I see, >>I assume that it gets a low voltage power supplied via this cable. >> >>Does anybody have more info on this connector? >> >> thanks, >>- Henk, PA8PDP. >> >> >> >> > > > >This message and attachment(s) are intended solely for the use of the addressee and may contain information that is privileged, confidential or otherwise exempt >from disclosure under applicable law. >If you are not the intended recipient or agent thereof responsible for delivering this message to the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution, or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited. >If you have received this communication in error, please notify the sender immediately by telephone and with a "reply" message. >Thank you for your cooperation. > >

18 years, 5 months

anyone heard of Berkely systems?

by chrism3667＠yahoo.com

produced a 68000 based high end graphical unit. The only mention Ive ever heard was this dude in Australia (who has one). Referred to it as a big loverly toaster. Imagine being able to make fractals and cook your English muffins with the same unit. Maybe hes on the list and can discuss it further. I remember him saying he managed to track down a tech who worked for the company (wonder of wonders), but was only able to provide the most basic info, __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

18 years, 5 months

seeking connection information of CRT assy of Olivetti M21

by henk.gooijen＠oce.com

Thanks Dwight. I will do some more Googling tomorrow, and wade through the results :-( I tried the link a few times, but I get a 404. Will try it again tomorrow too. - Henk. ________________________________ Van: cctalk-bounces at classiccmp.org namens Dwight Elvey Verzonden: di 14-02-2006 21:19 Aan: cctalk at classiccmp.org Onderwerp: Re: seeking connection information of CRT assy of Olivetti M21 Hi Henk I just did some google and found a web page that looks like it may have technical docs for the M21. Look at: http://www.elhvb.com/mboards/olivetti/system1.html <http://www.elhvb.com/mboards/olivetti/system1.html> Selecting cap1.pdf brings up a email request. I'm not sure if it will lead to anything but you might get a schematic showing the connector pins. Dwight >From: "Gooijen, Henk" <henk.gooijen at oce.com> > >Hi all, >I got an amber 10" monitor that was originally in an Olivetti M21. >I like the screen size and the color, so I would like to build some >sort of terminal with it. From the PCB comes a flat cable which >ends in a DB25 connector. As this is all connections I see, >I assume that it gets a low voltage power supplied via this cable. > >Does anybody have more info on this connector? > > thanks, >- Henk, PA8PDP. > > > > This message and attachment(s) are intended solely for the use of the addressee and may contain information that is privileged, confidential or otherwise exempt from disclosure under applicable law. If you are not the intended recipient or agent thereof responsible for delivering this message to the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution, or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please notify the sender immediately by telephone and with a "reply" message. Thank you for your cooperation.

18 years, 5 months

Osborne Executive CRT circuitry

by fritz_chwolka＠t-online.de

I don't know if my first mail was send correctly. Someone needs an sheet for osborne executive video this should be the right one if the sold exceutive in germany ist identical.-) For the foghorn I must have to search. http://oldcomputers.dyndns.org/public/pub/rechner/osborne/executiv/manua l/sheets/osbe_video.png Mit freundlichen Gruessen Fritz Chwolka

18 years, 5 months

seeking connection information of CRT assy of Olivetti M21

by dwight.elvey＠amd.com

Hi Henk I just did some google and found a web page that looks like it may have technical docs for the M21. Look at: http://www.elhvb.com/mboards/olivetti/system1.html Selecting cap1.pdf brings up a email request. I'm not sure if it will lead to anything but you might get a schematic showing the connector pins. Dwight >From: "Gooijen, Henk" <henk.gooijen at oce.com> > >Hi all, >I got an amber 10" monitor that was originally in an Olivetti M21. >I like the screen size and the color, so I would like to build some >sort of terminal with it. From the PCB comes a flat cable which >ends in a DB25 connector. As this is all connections I see, >I assume that it gets a low voltage power supplied via this cable. > >Does anybody have more info on this connector? > > thanks, >- Henk, PA8PDP. > > > > >This message and attachment(s) are intended solely for the use of the addressee and may contain information that is privileged, confidential or otherwise exempt >from disclosure under applicable law. >If you are not the intended recipient or agent thereof responsible for delivering this message to the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution, or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited. >If you have received this communication in error, please notify the sender immediately by telephone and with a "reply" message. >Thank you for your cooperation. > >

18 years, 5 months

PDP-11 Integer Divide Instruction "Div"

by bqt＠update.uu.se

"Jerome H. Fine" <jhfinedp3k at compsys.to> wrote: >>Johnny Billquist wrote: > > >>>> >"Jerome H. Fine" wrote: >>>> > I have noticed what may be an interesting result when I use the >>>> > PDP-11 Integer Divide Instruction "Div". Since I have noticed >>>> > at least one individual who worked on the microcode for the >>>> > PDP-11, perhaps there is an explicit "Yes / No" answer to my >>>> > question: >> >>> Since this actually have nothing to do with the microcode, and >>> actually is nothing specific with the PDP-11 DIV instruction, just >>> about anyone should be able to answer definitely. > > >Jerome Fine replies: > >I suggest that you might not be aware of the exact implementation >of the PDP-11 integer "Div" instruction when an overflow occurs. But the algorithm can't produce an overflow. However, it requires that the math be unsigned. Herein lies a problem; the DIV instruction is signed, so the result cannot be allowed to be > 32767. Afraid that problem really kicks butt. Oh well, you cannot use the DIV instruction then. Interestingly enough, it seems as if atleast E11 don't work the same way as a real PDP-11 in this case. I really need to check this more. It might be neccesary to report this to John Wilson. In E11, the V flag is still set, but it also actually performs the division. The J11 does not. What have you tried your code on? I believe it shouldn't have produced correct results for you on a real PDP-11, but I believe it would on E11. Don't know about SIMH, or other PDP-11 emulators (and I've only tested a real J11 so far, I'll try to check on a real 11/70 tomorrow). >Please see below! Happy to. >>>> > If I divide 196612 by 3 - i.e. "Div (R2),R0" where R0 = 3, R1 = 4, >> >>> (R2) = 3 >> >>>> > the result (in addition to the condition bits) is R0 = 1, R1 = 1 >> >>> which is >> >>>> > exactly correct if the quotient is regarded as a 32 bit result with >> >>> R0 being >> >>>> > the low order 16 bits of that result and the high order 32 bits are >> >>> somewhere >> >>>> > else - probably inaccessible as far as programming is concerned, but >> >>> easily >> >>>> > obtained by: [...] Well, now that I'v actually tested this, I can tell you that this works in E11, but does not work on a J11. If you load R0=3, R1=4, R2=3 and do a DIV R2,R0, the only thing that happens is that the V-bit of the PSW is set, and the registers remain unchanged. >I agree that the above code is the "correct" method to ensure >a valid result. BUT, that is NOT what I am attempting to determine. Well, what we now know is that the piece of code you have will not actually produce correct results on a real PDP-11, since we have a overflow into the sign bit, which aborts the DIV instruction. >Specifically, I have found that the following code also works: > Mov R0,R3 > Div (R2),R0 ; First Divide Instruction > Tst R1 > Bne Somewhere - since the quotient is not of interest when a non-zero remainder > Mov R0,-(SP) > Mov R3,R1 > Clr R0 > Div (R2),R0 ; Second Divide Instruction > Mov (SP)+,R1 >At this point, R0 / R1 now contains 32 bit quotient IF the first >"Div" instruction places the low order 16 bits of the 32 bit >quotient into R0. I have found this result in practice and since >there is a VERY HIGH probability that the remainder is NOT >zero, the above code is MUCH faster. And this will totally fail on atleast a J11, and probably all other "real" PDP-11s. At overflow, nothing gets computed. The register remain unchanged. >Again, the specific question is IF the quotient of the "Div" instruction >is the low order 16 bits of a 32 bit quotient all of the time or just >when the high order 16 bits are all zero???????? Basically never. It the quotient can't be expressed in *15* bits, the registers will remain unchanged. >>>> > Can anyone confirm what I have found in practice? >> >>> Certainly. It's basic math, the way it's taught in elementary school. >>> That was atleast the first way I was taught how do do divides on big >>> numbers on paper. > > >I learned that also, but the observation is not relevant >to my question. True. The algorithm is correct, but the PDP-11 DIV instruction have more limitations. You could use it if you played with smaller quantities. Easiest would be to work at 8 bits at a time instead of 16. However, that also requires the divisor to only be 8 bits, which might be a bit limiting. If you do 15 bits at a time, you're at the limit of the DIV instuction, but still working. You have to do the bit packing and unpacking though. And all that will probably take much more time than just implementing a DIV yourself. >I realize that the DEC manual description of the "Div" instruction >does not address the situation when the quotient exceeds 65535 >(decimal) or 16 bits, but again, perhaps someone who knows >the microcode might have an answer. Uh. My processor handbooks actually do address the situation, but it's actually when it exceeds 32767. And I have three different processor handbooks here. (1977-1978 pdp11/70 processor handbook, 1979-1980 pdp11 processor handbook for pdp11/04/34a/44/60/70, and 1983-1984 PDP-11 Architecture Handbook). Look in any processor handbook you have at the DIV instruction, and the V condition. >>>> > Even better would be a method of retrieving the high >>>> > order 16 bits of the quotient in a manner which takes >>>> > fewer instructions and without a second divide instruction! >> >>> >>> I doubt you'll find it. > > >I AGREE!! It would have been "nice" though if >DEC knew where the value was and made that high >order 16 bits available via the next instruction >if the user needed it. That information would >also have exactly defined whether or not the low >order 16 bits of the quotient and the remainder >were correct all of the time. Any comments on these >TWO observations? Unfortunately, the DIV instruction is explicitly a 16-bit signed divide. They actually don't do a 32-bit divide, so there aren't any upper 16 bits to tell about somehow. >I realize that the instruction set is long past being >subject to change in DEC hardware, but that does not >mean that an emulator could not manage to make a few >small but vital improvements. And certainly, at least >in SIMH, it is possible to examine the code to determine >the answer to my original question. Does anyone have >the code for the "Div" emulation in SIMH and what does >happen when the high order 16 bits of the quotient are >non-zero? Afraid I haven't looked at simh in a while, and I also apologize for my previous answer. I was just observing the algorithm, and not how the PDP-11 DIV instruction actually worked. I should have looked in the processor handbook, which I did this time. But then again, since you observed that your code worked, then I had no reason to doubt it. But in fact, it will not work on a real PDP-11. Johnny -- Johnny Billquist || "I'm on a bus || on a psychedelic trip email: bqt at update.uu.se || Reading murder books pdp is alive! || tryin' to stay hip" - B. Idol

18 years, 5 months

seeking connection information of CRT assy of Olivetti M21

by henk.gooijen＠oce.com

Hi all, I got an amber 10" monitor that was originally in an Olivetti M21. I like the screen size and the color, so I would like to build some sort of terminal with it. From the PCB comes a flat cable which ends in a DB25 connector. As this is all connections I see, I assume that it gets a low voltage power supplied via this cable. Does anybody have more info on this connector? thanks, - Henk, PA8PDP. This message and attachment(s) are intended solely for the use of the addressee and may contain information that is privileged, confidential or otherwise exempt from disclosure under applicable law. If you are not the intended recipient or agent thereof responsible for delivering this message to the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution, or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please notify the sender immediately by telephone and with a "reply" message. Thank you for your cooperation.

18 years, 5 months

=== IBM 5151 terminal keyboard ===

by f5inl＠wanadoo.fr

Hi guys ! Should anyone help me and give me some informations regarding the keyboard signals and keyboard's connector pin assignment from the IBM 5151 terminal ? I supposed the pin assignment was the same as for the IBM 5121but it's not true... (The keyboard connector of the 5151 is a DB25 female, and using a single gender changer is not enough). Many thanks for your help ! Fred. --... ...-- -.. . ..-. ..... .. -. .-.. 73 de F5INL

18 years, 5 months

Slightly OT: Bastard plagiarists

by lee＠geekdot.com

Look what someone posted .. http://www.britishinformation.com/forums/about1931.html Lee.

18 years, 5 months

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test-drb February 2006