test-drb June 2005

test-drb@ccmp.vtda.org

221 participants
681 discussions

by bqt＠Update.UU.SE

On Wed, 22 Jun 2005 "Zane H. Healy" <healyzh at aracnet.com> wrote: > > So tell me, what are the really cool methods to transfer data between a > > PC and a real PDP11 at a reasonable speed? SCSI controller and SCSI > > disk? Something else? Ethernet? > > > > Or is a backup over serial line a normal thing...? > > It helps that I have SCSI Controllers on my operational PDP-11's. SCSI makes life easy, yes... :-) > Ethernet using either TCP/IP or DECnet is another option that I use to > transfer data, but I try to only use that for small amounts of data. One of > these days I plan to go wireless with my PDP-11. I'd also like to see if I > can't get a SCSI DVD-ROM drive running, but considering the difficulty with > getting a CD-ROM drive to work, I have some doubts on getting that to work. Huh? You had problems getting a CD to work? I just plugged one in, and in RSX I suddenly had a DU device of the type RRD40. >dev du: DU0: Public Mounted Loaded Label=RSX11MPBL87 Type=RA90 Shadow_set=(DU0:,DU1:) Cached DU1: Public Mounted Loaded Foreign Type=RA90 Shadow_set=(DU0:,DU1:) DU2: Public Mounted Loaded Label=RSXFREEV2 Nowrite Type=RRD40 Cached DU3: Loaded Type=RA90 DU4: Loaded Type=RA90 DU5: Public Mounted Loaded Label=MALIN0 Nowrite Type=RA81 Cached DU6: Offline Loaded Type=unknown DU7: Offline Loaded Type=unknown DU10: Offline Loaded Type=unknown DU11: Offline Loaded Type=unknown > I haven't tried a DVD, and I'm not sure I ever will. Can't really see the point. :-) I plan on getting a ZIP in there some day, though. Johnny Johnny Billquist || "I'm on a bus || on a psychedelic trip email: bqt at update.uu.se || Reading murder books pdp is alive! || tryin' to stay hip" - B. Idol

19 years, 1 month

How to transfer data FAST?

by bqt＠Update.UU.SE

On Mon, 27 Jun 2005 Paul Koning <pkoning at equallogic.com> wrote: > >>>>> "Johnny" == Johnny Billquist <bqt at Update.UU.SE> writes: > > Johnny> True, and definitely a point for you. I offered them access > Johnny> to systems to check it out, but no interest. > > I suppose that too makes sense -- if you don't know the OS, it's hard > to get started on debugging communication to it. No, I don't think that makes sense. If they knew enough VMS to test against that, then RSX shouldn't be a problem. The syntax for fooling around in DCL is the same. > Johnny> On a separate issue, the public domain LAT is equally > Johnny> problematic, and should not be used to connect to RSX > Johnny> hosts. You'll crash the RSX host eventually. That LAT > Johnny> implementation seem to produce some packets that RSX just > Johnny> don't deal with, which results in buffer pool getting lost on > Johnny> the RSX end. It's definitely not a good behaviour in RSX as > Johnny> well, but never the less, it appears as if the PD LAT breaks > Johnny> the protocol in some way, and LAT is even worse, since no > Johnny> documentation exists outside of DEC (or whereever), so it's > Johnny> all reverse engineering (once more of VMS). > > That's clearly a P1 RSX bug. There's a simple rule: if your system > crashes because of a packet it received, that is ALWAYS the fault of > the receiving system. Perhaps the sender should not have sent it, but > "you shouldn't have sent that" is NEVER an acceptable excuse for > crashing. I totally agree. But that don't help much right now, since the LAT code in RSX isn't available to us. So for now, the only options is not to use the public domain LAT implementation against RSX. Johnny Johnny Billquist || "I'm on a bus || on a psychedelic trip email: bqt at update.uu.se || Reading murder books pdp is alive! || tryin' to stay hip" - B. Idol

19 years, 1 month

Programming 2708's

by dwight.elvey＠amd.com

>From: "Bruce Lane" <kyrrin at bluefeathertech.com> > > Out of curiousity, I checked the support list for my UniSite system. Sure enough, it supports the 2708's. However, it won't do 2704's. > Hi I'm not sure why this is an issue, you just need to shorten the programming loop. The signal levels are the same for the 2704's as the 2708's during programming. 2704's are hard to find anyway. Dwight

19 years, 1 month

Programming 2708's

by dwight.elvey＠amd.com

Hi Richard I have both a Byte Saver and a data I/O. If you'll send me the EPROMs and the data, I can program them for you. As was mentioned, It wouldn't take much to make an adapter out of two machine pin sockets that could take 2716's to use in place of a 2708. Most of the pins are the same. Just make sure to pull the pins that provide the extra nasty voltages. Dwight >From: "Richard A. Cini" <rcini at optonline.net> > >All: > > OK, I'm ready to burn a modified copy of the Altair Turnkey Monitor >into a 2708 to use in my 8800b as a test program. Lo and behold, my >programmer won't do a 2708 -- it'll only go down to 2716. Naturally I don't >have any 2716s around and the VG ROM board accepts only the 2704 or 2708 >(without modification). > > So I browsed around eBay and elsewhere to see if any other >programmers support the 2708 and it seems that none do. They all start at >the 2716. > > What programmer can I look for that has the ability to program a >2708? > > Thanks. > >Rich > >Rich Cini >Collector of classic computers >Build Master for the Altair32 Emulation Project >Web site: http://highgate.comm.sfu.ca/~rcini/classiccmp/ >/************************************************************/ > >

19 years, 1 month

Straight-8 on eBay

by ISC277＠CLCILLINOIS.EDU

Oh-ho-ho, that thing is schweet. A very beautiful machine, and complete it seems! Though I much prefer the 1970s style -8s myself. -----Original Message----- From: cctalk-bounces at classiccmp.org [mailto:cctalk-bounces at classiccmp.org] On Behalf Of Fred N. van Kempen Sent: Monday, June 27, 2005 5:27 AM To: General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts Subject: Re: Straight-8 on eBay On Sun, 26 Jun 2005, vrs wrote: > Anyone want to ship this thing across the USA for me :-)? Looks like a > beauty! > > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=1247&item=5213265 141&rd=1 OMG, that thing is beautiful...... --f

19 years, 1 month

Goodies... offered here before E-Bay

by ISC277＠CLCILLINOIS.EDU

What PSU bits for the 11/34 do you have? -----Original Message----- From: cctalk-bounces at classiccmp.org [mailto:cctalk-bounces at classiccmp.org] On Behalf Of R. D. Davis Sent: Friday, June 24, 2005 5:55 PM To: cctalk at classiccmp.org Subject: Goodies... offered here before E-Bay Before I e-bay the following items, I'm posting a list here in case anyone's interested in making a reasonable offer or trade. Items are located in western Baltimore County, Maryland. *** Local pick-up only, unless someone makes it very worth my while *** *** to ship these items. *** - Tektronix 4014 terminal. I may have some additional Tektronix-terminal goodies, such as manuals and tapes, but for a different terminal. Shipping this isn't trivial or inexpensive... it cost me well over $100 to have this shipped here years ago. - Over 100 Sun VME-bus boards - Dual expansion chasis with power supply for a Q-bus PDP-11 or VAX - *Possibly* a spare RL02 drive - CRT from an old DuMont oscilloscope - Large drawer for a 19" rack mount chasis... may need some additional hardware, but I may have it all, will look. - Parts of a PDP-11/34A (front panel, boards, power-supply bits) - Umax flat-bed SCSI scanner... doesn't work, but should be good for parts - 17" older HP monitor... very heavy. Notes: Tektronix 4014 terminal: Appears to need an HV PSU repair. Caveat: I began disassembling this several years ago for cleaning and lost some screws that attach the power supply to the chassis. Also, I misplaced my notes about what wires connect where. Although that enormous power supply heat sink is looking very tempting for an audio amplifier project, I'll try to avoid the temptation in the interest of preservation. Sun VME-bus boards: these include several possibly rare boards such as fiber-optic network boards, cable modems, color printer board, etc. Finally, all of these boards are accessible and I've cleaned them up, so AFAIK, there are no spiders, etc. hiding on them. It's my preference to have someone collect them all at once so that I don't have to ship one here and there, etc. Of course, make it very worth my while and I'll consider doing that. :-) -- Copyright (C) 2005 R.D. Davis The difference between humans & other animals: an All Rights Reserved unnatural belief that we're above Nature & her www.rddavis.org 410-744-4900 other creatures, using dogma to justify such Help to save the wild horses! beliefs and to justify much human cruelty.

19 years, 1 month

How to transfer data FAST?

by bqt＠Update.UU.SE

On Mon, 27 Jun 2005 Paul Koning <pkoning at equallogic.com> wrote: > >>>>> "Johnny" == Johnny Billquist <bqt at Update.UU.SE> writes: > > Johnny> On Wed, 22 Jun 2005 Paul Koning <pkoning at equallogic.com> > Johnny> wrote: > > >> Ethernet is another good way; DECnet is available on Linux. > > Johnny> Unfortunately, the DECnet for Linux sucks so bad it isn't > Johnny> usable. Well, it is kindof usable if you want to talk with a > Johnny> VMS machine, but it don't work against RSX. I've tried > Johnny> it... :-( > > So try it with RSTS... Don't have RSTS. :-) > Johnny> Appearantly the DECnet/Linux guys only have had VMS machines > Johnny> to test against, and I didn't manage to stir much interest > Johnny> when I reported how badly it failed with RSX. I only got > Johnny> responses like "well, that don't surprise us, since we've > Johnny> only tested against VMS". > > Hard to blame someone for having it not work on a system they can't > test. It's open source -- you can fix it, and contribute your fixes. > That's what I did. True, and definitely a point for you. I offered them access to systems to check it out, but no interest. Myself, I'm not interested in Linux enough for this. I'm doing the TCP/IP for RSX instead. > Part of the problem is at the DEC end -- undocumented hacks in DAP > (VMS is particularly bad there) and the totally undocumented pre-CTERM > "set host" protocols. I know... :-/ RSX actually have a different program for each DEC OS that exist, to use instead of the "normal" CTERM program. Unsupported, of course, but working much better... DAP basically failed in three of the four tests I did between Linux and RSX. File transfers in both directions, and directory listings in both directions. The one that did work was directory listings of the RSX system >from Linux. I think I might have been able to transfer some trivial text files from RSX to Linux as well, but that was it. Everything else failed, or rather, just hung. On a separate issue, the public domain LAT is equally problematic, and should not be used to connect to RSX hosts. You'll crash the RSX host eventually. That LAT implementation seem to produce some packets that RSX just don't deal with, which results in buffer pool getting lost on the RSX end. It's definitely not a good behaviour in RSX as well, but never the less, it appears as if the PD LAT breaks the protocol in some way, and LAT is even worse, since no documentation exists outside of DEC (or whereever), so it's all reverse engineering (once more of VMS). Maybe one day... Or if I get my hands on the sources to RSX DECnet and LAT, I could do some cleanups in there... But that will not likely happen anytime soon I'm afraid... Ah, and there is also a bug in the DAP code in RSX. I have a patch for both RMSDAP.OLB and DAPRES. The problem is that the file protection word gets messed up when read. Johnny Johnny Billquist || "I'm on a bus || on a psychedelic trip email: bqt at update.uu.se || Reading murder books pdp is alive! || tryin' to stay hip" - B. Idol

19 years, 1 month

Straight-8 on eBay

by vrs＠msn.com

Anyone want to ship this thing across the USA for me :-)? Looks like a beauty! http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=1247&item=5213265141… Vince

19 years, 1 month

How to transfer data FAST?

by bqt＠Update.UU.SE

On Thu, 23 Jun 2005 Paul Koning <pkoning at equallogic.com> wrote: > >>>>> "Zane" == Zane H Healy <healyzh at aracnet.com> writes: > > Zane> At 9:19 AM -0400 6/23/05, Paul Koning wrote: > >> >>>>> "Zane" == Zane H Healy <healyzh at aracnet.com> writes: > >> > Zane> As I understand it, the issue was with variable byte blocks. I > Zane> had zero issues installing RSTS/E, and I think a couple layered > Zane> products off of 4mm DAT. However, DECnet/E would not install > Zane> off of DAT. > >> You mean variable length blocks? If it doesn't support that, it > >> isn't a proper tape. Proper tapes handle any block size, odd or > >> even, from 14 up to at least 8k or so. > > Zane> Yes, that's what I mean. It is my understanding from when I > Zane> got some help figuring this out (I think by this list), that > Zane> was the problem. It wouldn't install from DAT, but had zero > Zane> issues with TK50. > > Ok. RSTS does assume/require that tapes are designed by competent > designers. I'm surprised you didn't run into similar issues with > other operating systems. He should have. RSX expects tape drive to be able to deliver variable size blocks as well. The distribution tapes hold 512 byte, 80 byte and 4144 byte size records. (As well as 0 byte file mark records.) Johnny Johnny Billquist || "I'm on a bus || on a psychedelic trip email: bqt at update.uu.se || Reading murder books pdp is alive! || tryin' to stay hip" - B. Idol

19 years, 1 month

Torch Computers Ltd PSU available - anyone need a spare?

by listmailgoeshere＠gmail.com

I have here a Farnell N110P411 open-chassis SMPSU. On a relay on one end of the board there is a white sticker with the text "TORCH COMPUTERS LTD (C) 1983" and a QC stamp. If anyone would like this (free, you pay shipping) as a spare part or for a repair/restoration, please speak up by private email. I'm clearing out some old stuff and I won't be able to keep this for too much longer before it gets recycled. Ed.

19 years, 1 month

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test-drb June 2005