test-drb April 2001

test-drb@ccmp.vtda.org

251 participants
669 discussions

by jos.mar＠bluewin.ch

-----Original Message----- From: William Donzelli <aw288(a)osfn.org> To: classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org <classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org> Date: Thursday, April 05, 2001 1:36 AM Subject: For Sale: PDP-8/i w/ Paper Tape >Due to my computing interests becoming very much centered in the IBM >world, and also due to 2 tons of Big Blue stuff coming shortly, I have >decided to sell off a PDP-8/i. I promised the original seller that I >would not Ebay the thing, so I am keeping it to only a few lists. Never mind the 8/i....What's the thing to the left of it ? Jos Dreesen

24 years, 1 month

Digitizing Archives Not So Easy

by mmcfadden＠cmh.edu

Article about the difficulty of preserving information in the digital age http://www.wired.com/news/culture/0,1284,42842,00.html They like 9 track tapes probably because they understand them. Mike mmcfadden(a)cmh.edu

24 years, 1 month

MicroVAX 3800

by broth＠heathers.stdio.com

Looking for parts for a MicroVAX 3800. A salvage yard did a number taking out the TK70 and a couple of drives. I finally have it back together and booting up. Now I am looking for the complete front door assembly and the silk screened label that fits over the front panel buttons. Willing to trade etc. Brian.

24 years, 1 month

OT somewhat. China, our aircraft, delays.

by cmcmanis＠mcmanis.com

At 04:47 PM 4/9/2001 -0400, Jeff wrote: >We are all adults here. I doubt this could turn into a flame war. We've been through this already Jeff and have established that we are all children here. (regardless of age) Which might go a long way toward explaining some of the threads :-) --Chuck

24 years, 1 month

just outta curiosity

by mmcfadden＠cmh.edu

It's nostalgia time Do you remember IBM JCL, Job Control Language? Do you remember DEC DOS/BATCH? Have you punched cards using a drum card? Have you used an O26 keypunch? Have you used an O29 keypunch? Have you played trek on at VT52? Have you entered data on a VT05? Have you used an RX01? Have you used a TU58? The oldy and goldy Fortran II, remember go to's and format statements. Don't forget all capitals. IMPLICIT INTEGER (I-N) READ(5,995) I IF( I ) 100,200,300 100 PRINT(6,999) I 999 FORMAT('0I IS NEGATIVE, ',I4) GO TO 500 200 PRINT(6,998) I 998 FORMAT('0I IS ZERO, ',I4) GO TO 500 300 PRINT(6,997) I 997 FORMAT('0I IS POSITIVE, ',I4) 500 STOP END I think a computer language and programming flame war is needed to clear the air and stoke the emotions :) Never mind! Mike mmcfadden(a)cmh.edu

24 years, 1 month

New find - NEC "mini7 GX" word processor

by ethan_dicks＠yahoo.com

I was at a recent vehicle auction at the Volunteers of America (to look at the single-engine "experimental" one-seat airplane (that sold for ~$3600) and ran across an 1977 electronic sub-hunt game from Milton Bradley and an NEC mini7 GX dedicated word processor. I picked up the electronic game because it was 75% off green-tags day (making the game about $0.67) and I picked up the word processor because it came complete with all docs, spare floppies (720K 3.5"), spare ribbon, and an unused sheet feeder. Oh... I should mention... the docs and all the onscreen messages are in Japanese. It's my second Japanese WP (the first is a portable Sharp I got at a hamfest, but I've never found ribbons for it). After an extensive search on the web, all I could find (including on Japanese web pages) were a couple of translating utilities and a web page for a company that does media conversions. I do read _some_ Japanese (thus the interest in a word processor), but not much Kanji (a few, but mostly I read Katakana and Hirigana). The slim "getting started" guide is somewhat helpful, mostly because of all the pictures and labels in kana. Nevertheless, I am finding it quite difficult to get started with this thing. Has anyone on the list ever seen an NEC mini7? There are several models, some with dual floppy, some with floppy and hard disk (and, I think, a mini5 that may have dual floppy _plus_ hard disk). At this point, I can only read about 60% of the keyboard (lots of function keys, but I think I've figured out "shifuto" and "supeesu" ;-) The copyright dates in the docs and on screen indicate that this was made around 1986-1987. I haven't disassembled it yet (I've barely had time to power it on), but I'm guessing it has a V20 or similar processor in it. There is an optional RS-232 opening in the back (blank on mine) and a what appears to be a 36-pin centronics connector for an external printer as well as a smaller connector nearby that I'm guessing goes to the sheet feeder. *Any* information on this or something similar would be helpful. If I had a way to input kanji into Babelfish, I'd start translating keytops and phrases in the manual. I've been making a list of certain kanji I see over and over again and figure I'll need to learn. Thanks, -ethan __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/

24 years, 1 month

Fwd from the Greenkeys list ...

by jfoust＠threedee.com

>From: "Craig Sawyers" <c.sawyers(a)tech-enterprise.com> >To: <greenkeys(a)qth.net> >Subject: RE: [GreenKeys] Refinishing question... >Date: Mon, 9 Apr 2001 08:52:44 +0100 > >> I >> demonstrated the M14 Strip Printer with Gumming Desk. They want to >> film the unit later this month. > >Thinking of WWII period stuff, you all might be interested in a film that >will be released in the US in August/September called Enigma. It is a >dramatisation of a novel by Harris of the same name, and has been produced >by Mick Jagger. > >Reason I know about this is that I have been restoring some cipher equipment >at Bletchley Park, and that is where much of the filming was done, and where >all the props are. These are ridiculously convincing! There is a full size >replica of the centre section of a U-boat, complete with rust streaks (you >feel obliged to knock on it to convince yourself it isn't made of metal), >and a 30 foot scale model of a whole U-boat for long shots. There are >several Turing Bombe replicas, and three Typex cipher machines (these look >so convincing I leant on one of them to reach something, and it toppled >over! They usually weigh a hundredweight!). > >Anyway - those in the UK, or visiting, can see the props as well as real >exhibits. I'm looking forward to seeing the film! > >Craig > >---- >Submissions: greenkeys(a)qth.net

24 years, 1 month

OT somewhat. China, our aircraft, delays.

by blacklord＠telstra.com

----- Original Message ----- From: Iggy Drougge <optimus(a)canit.se> Date: Monday, April 9, 2001 3:47 pm Subject: Re: OT somewhat. China, our aircraft, delays. > > Our people need our support now. Later is never in this game. > > Our? > I agree with that last comment of yours, some people don't seem to realise that this list is world-wide, it definitely isn't "our" plane, & to tell the truth, I couldn't care less - can we get back on topic peoples ? telnet://commodore.thebbs.org ftp://commodore.thebbs.org ---------------- Powered by telstra.com

24 years, 1 month

HP 9000 520

by mcguire＠neurotica.com

I've been noticing a very disturbing trend...anything that isn't an overclocked Intel box is "old" or "legacy". For those of us who care about the quality of what we put on our desktops (and in our computer rooms), this is pretty frightening. -Dave McGuire On April 6, Curt Vendel wrote: > Joe, > > Old Odd Machine??? The HP 9000 K520 isn't that terribly old, I installed > one of those with HPUX 11.3 at GT Interactive in Manhattan back in 95' A > damn good and powerful machine. > > > Curt > > > > Joe wrote: > > > FWIW there were two of these for sale at the auction at the Goddard Space > > Flight Center in Huntsville, Alabama this past week. A guy that I know went > > to the auction and I asked him to try and pick them up for me but I don't > > know if he did or not. He should be back in a day or two and then I'll > > know. The point is there's still lots of these old odd machines around if > > someone is willing to search for them. > > > > Joe

24 years, 1 month

just outta curiosity

by mmcfadden＠cmh.edu

Being a kid is a state of mind. I know a few 17 year old adults and a few 40 year old kids. I consider myself a kid because I sit on the floor when I take apart computers, I stand on my head in containers/dumpsters pulling out computers, I occasionally look like a dust bunny/dirt devil after crawling around a warehouse. My kids think I'm a kid or crazy because I talk to the computers when I'm taking them apart. Kids also get excited when they get new toys, and that's me when I've found a new computer. Actually I'm a 49 year old kid. Maybe I'll go back to school when my kids are in college and teach kids. Actually my goal is to be able to work/play on interesting projects. Mike mmcfadden(a)cmh.edu

24 years, 1 month

HP 9000 520

by rigdonj＠intellistar.net

FWIW there were two of these for sale at the auction at the Goddard Space Flight Center in Huntsville, Alabama this past week. A guy that I know went to the auction and I asked him to try and pick them up for me but I don't know if he did or not. He should be back in a day or two and then I'll know. The point is there's still lots of these old odd machines around if someone is willing to search for them. Joe

24 years, 1 month

just outta curiosity

by jfoust＠threedee.com

At 04:58 PM 4/8/01 -0400, THETechnoid(a)home.com wrote: >I often hear folks refer to thier computer as a "modem". I suppose they >do this because that is the main function of the machine for them - being >spammed by AOL. >Some call it thier 'hard drive'. Some call it thier 'Windows'. The one that drives me crazy is when people call it "the computer", as in "I'm learning the computer now." - John

24 years, 1 month

Way OT (was RE: OT somewhat. China, our aircraft, delays.)

by rigdonj＠intellistar.net

At 11:33 PM 4/8/01 -0700, you wrote: >On Sun, 8 Apr 2001, Chris Kennedy wrote: >> - The radome is missing. I'm at a loss to explain how the radome >> got ripped off the aircraft by contact on the wing -- especially >> given that the fuselage forward of the wing root doesn't appear >> damaged. > >Was the missing radome collision damage? >Or would jettisoning the radome be standard procedure? Jettision the radome? Surely you jest??? How do you propose to jettision something that's on the FRONT of the aircraft when there are four LARGE whirling propellors behind it? Obviously you never seen what happens to a propellor when it strikes a solid object. It's one thing to stike a soft object like a person when idling on the ground but the results are VERY different when it hits metal debris. Especially at flight speed and engine cruise RPM. Any damage to the blades throws the whole engine/gearbox/propellor assembly badly out of balance. Then the blades break off and fly around like huge knives. If one hits the fuselage it WILL go completely through it and it can cut it completely in two. Even if the fuselage survives, the blade will usually cut all the flight controls and the aircraft go completely out of control. And let's not even talk about what it can do to the other engines, propellors and fuel tanks! This isn't speculation. This is exactly what happened to a similar aircraft (EC-121) flying out of Otis AFB. We lost the entire crew of 23 people. All in all, the crew of the US plane is very lucky to be alive. The pilots had to have been very good just to get the plane on the ground in one piece. Flying back to their carrier or a US base would have been absolutely out of the question. Joe > > >

24 years, 1 month

OT somewhat. China, our aircraft, delays.

by rigdonj＠intellistar.net

At 05:52 PM 4/8/01 -0700, you wrote: >Do you remember when we would call that "an Army weather plane doing >meteorological research"? > >When did we start calling them spy planes? AFTER Gary Powers was shot down in his "unarmed weather recon" plane and he and the plane and it's equipment were put on public display in the USSR. Before that most people in the US were naive enough to believe that we didn't do such things. ROFL! > > >What WOULD we do if the roles were reversed? Shoot it down of course. But this isn't exactly the same thing. This flight was over water and not over land. We (the US), the Russians, the Cubans and a number of other countries have been doing this for YEARS and it's been common for the "enemy's" aircraft to escort each others aircraft. I've been in aircraft in the North Atlantic that were escorted by Russian fighters and our fighters also regularly escorted their aircraft. In the vast majority of the cases there was no trouble. I'm sorry but I don't see any secret plots in the recent US/Chinese incident. It's not uncommon for aircraft in close formation to collide and I think it was an accident. Now both governments are acting like tough guys and unwilling to admit any fault or apologize. It's all rather childish IMO. Does anyone have a count on the number of Cuban, Russian, North Korean and other communist aircraft that have landed in US controlled bases that we've kept and reverse engineered? I can name at least four that I personally know of. Joe

24 years, 1 month

HP 2000 TSB status update

by west＠tseinc.com

At long last, the 7900A drive is working reliably - and passes all diagnostics. The dual 2100 cpus are fully tested, as is the processor interconnect kit. The last major peripheral I have to get up and running is my 7970E tape drive - that's being worked on right now. Soon as that's done - I can start loading the HP2000 Access TSB operating system. After that system is up, I'll then build an HP2000E system using a 21MX cpu instead; all parts are on-hand for that. Items I'm still looking for desparately: The HP2000 IOP firmware for the 21MX cpu's (I have the firmware for 2100's, but need it for the 21MX's). Need the diags for the 7970E on paper tape, the newer version that uses the diagnostic configurator (have 7970E diags, but they're the old non-configurator style). System operators guide for 2000E (Al? Eric??, Bob Curtis wants his manual!!).

24 years, 1 month

Way OT Bullets and house cleaning

by xds_sigma7＠hotmail.com

Hmm, I don't shoot things... I blow them up.. Or make use of a nice large sledgehammer, combined with dropping/kicking/running over the object marked for destruction... blowtorches are fun too! (Note: this is directed at non-living critters, mainly dead hard drives, PC cases, and, in one memorable occasion of particular violence, an iMac keyboard.. heh..) Will J _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com

24 years, 1 month

VT340 focus adjustment?

by dburrows＠netpath.net

Loktite or drip some candle wax on it. Dan >Thanks Allison! I got the cover off and found the adjustment side of the >terminal (left side looking at it from the front) and the focus is a screw >that goes into what looks like an HV transformer. I've adjusted it to be >razor sharp, now what do I use to "lock it down" ? What is that stuff that >looks like nail polish called? > >--Chuck >

24 years, 1 month

Paul Allen Buys Old MITS Building

by jlewczyk＠speakeasy.net

Its gonna become a computer museum! Albuquerque newspaper article: http://www.abqjournal.com/news/294821news04-04-01.htm >From the article... A founder of software colossus Microsoft has purchased the Albuquerque building where the company had its first office, parties to the transaction said Tuesday. A company controlled by Paul G. Allen in October purchased the 26,000-square-foot building at the intersection of California and Linn NE, said Peggy Daskalos, whose company sold the building. Allen teamed up with Bill Gates in 1975 to start what became Microsoft. *snip* According to a brief item in the current issue of Forbes magazine, the building's sellers say Allen's company plans to turn the building into a computer museum. *snip* Slashdot discussion: http://slashdot.org/articles/01/04/05/194214.shtml - John Lewczyk - jlewczyk(a)speakeasy.net

24 years, 1 month

HP 9000 520

by Innfogra＠aol.com

In a message dated 4/7/01 7:16:39 AM Pacific Daylight Time, rigdonj(a)intellistar.net writes: > Despite the large > number of them used by the US Navy, very few managed to get into the > surplus market. I couldn't find a single surplus dealer that had one or > that even knew what they were. I got one shortly before my auction. It was like an overgrown 9845 It was larger and heavier IIRC. and sharper corners. It was one of the first 32 bit integrated workstations. Advertised as a mainframe on the desktop in 1985. Ran HP-UX.. Came with either a B&W or color monitor, 512K byte Ram and a 5 1/4 floppy. You could add a 10 meg HD, internal I think. The 9000 520 also cost $30,000 to $50,000 in 1985. Mine had two HPIB channels. I tried to get it hooked up before the sale but wasn't able to. A local listmember bought it so it is still within the CC list family. It is the only one of those I ever found. Paxton Portland, OR

24 years, 1 month

IBM 7545

by h.mansfield＠ucc.ie

I am interested in a copy of the Eproms on this machine , they are labelled IC16 and IC17 on the main controller board , prehaps a copy could be sent as an email attachment . I would appreciate any help . Regards , Hilary Mansfield

24 years, 1 month

just outta curiosity

by r_beaudry＠hotmail.com

>> > definition of "kid" = under age 18 >> >> Wrong definition, I suspect :-) Especially if you ask my wife! Probably >> even more so if you ask some of my work colleagues about my collection. >> >> >Reminds me of the old saying "Men are just boys... with more expensive >toys". Certainly Fiona reckons that I need to grow up, playing with >computers and bikes. I might just do that one day but yet, I am only 43. I read a good Wired article, an interview with Arthur C. Clarke on the 25th anniversary of 2001. He said he wanted his epitaph to be this: "He never grew up; but he never stopped growing." That sounds like a good life to me! The full interview at: http://www.wired.com/wired/archive/1.03/clarke.html makes a VERY interesting read, especially his comments on "reality"... Also, to make this slightly on-topic, thanks to all who responded on my Northstar keyboard problem. I am in the middle of selling my house and buying a new one, and the last couple of storms up here in central Massachusetts flooded my basement, so I have been cleaning up from that. I will try things out, and let you all know what's up... Rich B.

24 years, 1 month

just outta curiosity

by vcf＠siconic.com

On Sat, 7 Apr 2001, bill claussen wrote: > Very well stated and welcome to all that are interested in your given area! To be serious (for once) I think it's terrific that "kids" are interested in old computers. To show an interest in machines that in some cases predate themselves shows a reverence and appreciation for computer technology, and this is the type of person the world needs to continue progress. Seriously. Back in the 50s the US was on such a push to emphasize technology in schools, but nowadays we are teaching kids how to be users and nothing more. I'm glad to see younger folks taking it upon themselves to explore technology at a more fundamental level. These are the ones who will become the great programmers and engineers of the future. One of the things I am doing to promote appreciation of old computers and computer history amongst the younger generation is preparing a mini-lecture on computer history that I plan to give at local schools (for free of course). My idea is to show them how we got to where we are today with computing technology, for example showing them an evolution of disk drive technology by comparing a ZIP drive to a 3.5" to a 5.25" to an 8" to paper tape to punch cards, etc. And actually bringing the drives in too! It won't interest all of them, or even most of them, but the ones that were waiting to discover computers will certainly "get it", and those are the ones I want to reach. Plus once I get them hooked I can then recruit them to do menial tasks for the VCF Archives like cataloguing books and schlepping stuff around ;) Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org

24 years, 2 months

O.T. - Virus: FOOT-AND-MOUTH

by lgwalker＠look.ca

------- Forwarded message follows ------- Send reply to: <1st-powermacs(a)mail.maclaunch.com> (1st PowerMacs) To: <1st-powermacs(a)mail.maclaunch.com> (1st PowerMacs) Date sent: Sun, 08 Apr 2001 07:23:16 -0600 From: aergo <aergo(a)earthlink.net> Subject: O.T. - Virus: FOOT-AND-MOUTH Have a good week, everyone ! A. ;-) ====================================== Subject: Virus: FOOT-AND-MOUTH ====================================== FOOT-AND-MOUTH BELIEVED TO BE FIRST VIRUS UNABLE TO SPREAD THROUGH MICROSOFT OUTLOOK Researchers Shocked to Finally Find Virus That Email App Doesn't Like Atlanta, Ga. - Scientists at the Centers for Disease Control and Symantec's AntiVirus Research Center today confirmed that foot-and-mouth disease cannot be spread by Microsoft's Outlook email application, believed to be the first time the program has ever failed to propagate a major virus. "Frankly, we've never heard of a virus that couldn't spread through Microsoft Outlook, so our findings were, to say the least, unexpected," said Clive Sarnow, director of the CDC's infectious disease unit. The study was immediately hailed by British officials, who said it will save millions of pounds and thousands of man hours. "Up until now we have, quite naturally, assumed that both foot-and-mouth and mad cow were spread by Microsoft Outlook," said Nick Brown, Britain's Agriculture Minister. "By eliminating it, we can focus our resources elsewhere." However, researchers in the Netherlands, where foot-and-mouth has recently appeared, said they are not yet prepared to disqualify Outlook, which has been the progenitor of viruses such as "I Love You," "Bubbleboy," "Anna Kournikova," and "Naked Wife," to name but a few. Said Nils Overmars, director of the Molecular Virology Lab at Leiden University: "It's not that we don't trust the research, it's just that as scientists, we are trained to be skeptical of any finding that flies in the face of established truth. And this one flies in the face like a blind drunk sparrow." Executives at Microsoft, meanwhile, were equally skeptical, insisting that Outlook's patented Virus Transfer Protocol (VTP) has proven virtually pervious to any virus. The company, however, will issue a free VTP patch if it turns out the application is not vulnerable to foot-and-mouth. Such an admission would be embarrassing for the software giant, but Symantec virologist Ariel Kologne insisted that no one is more humiliated by the study than she is. "Only last week, I had a reporter ask if the foot-and-mouth virus spreads through Microsoft Outlook, and I told him, "'Doesn't everything?'" she recalled. "Who would've thought?" ------- End of forwarded message ------- Reply to: lgwalker(a)look.ca

24 years, 2 months

ESDI drives

by pete＠dunnington.u-net.com

Tony is (almost) correct: ESDI drives use a binary select scheme similar to SCSI. The three select bits are decoded to enable drives 1,2,...,6,7. There's no "drive 0" because that corresponds to the "deselect all drives" condition. However, some PC controllers only support two drives (another legacy of the IBM PC BIOS) and of course they use drives 1 and 2. Therefore, some PC manufacturers suggest using a cable with a twist, to swap pins 26 and 28 (DS1 and DS2), leaving the select jumpers the same on both drives. I've never seen a cable with a twist on a "real" ESDI system. -- Pete Peter Turnbull Network Manager Dept. of Computer Science University of York

24 years, 2 months

just outta curiosity

by Demon02554＠aol.com

In a message dated 4/8/01 5:01:42 PM Eastern Daylight Time, foo(a)siconic.com writes: << Ah yes, to be young and naive again :) The one thing you can never have enough of is time. Use it wisely to avoid regrets later on in life (moral of the story: get a <girl/boy>friend and a life now...they will become equally as important later on). Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org >> heh it was a joke dude....but oh well....i used to have one...just in between now...

24 years, 2 months

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test-drb April 2001