test-drb April 2001

test-drb@ccmp.vtda.org

251 participants
669 discussions

by chris＠mainecoon.com

Yesterday's post brought four CDs filled with TIFFs of PDP-11 (and related) prints. They're available at: http://www.mainecoon.com/classiccmp It's nothing more than a pile of directories and a boatload of files, each of which is on the order of several megabytes. If you're planning on pulling a bunch of these down it might be a good idea to contact me and see if it isn't possible to deliver the stuff to you on CDs... Cheers, Chris. -- Chris Kennedy chris(a)mainecoon.com http://www.mainecoon.com PGP fingerprint: 4E99 10B6 7253 B048 6685 6CBC 55E1 20A3 108D AB97

24 years, 1 month

Just checking

by rhblake＠bigfoot.com

had to resub under my other address as my other seems to be down - ignore this.

24 years, 1 month

[Fwd: Re: HDOS 3.0]

by knightstalkerbob＠netscape.net

-------- Original Message -------- Subject: Re: HDOS 3.0 Date: Tue, 10 Apr 2001 13:07:33 EDT From: DocBogner(a)cs.com To: knightstalkerbob(a)netscape.net In a message dated 4/10/2001 8:15:53 AM Central Daylight Time, knightstalkerbob(a)netscape.net writes: << How do I go about transferring from the H-89 to a PC? I know there used to translator services, used one myself once in 85-86. Is there a software package for the H89 or PC that will read the others format, or nul-modem the two together? >> Bob, it's just been too long for me to remember this offhand. I will have to dig into some of my old HDOS notebooks. Meanwhile, please repost the above as a message to me (or All) in the existing HDOS 3 message thread on our forum. That will get some more replies from HDOS users whose memories are better than mine. Doc -- Bob Mason 2x Amiga 500's, GVP A530 (40mhz 68030/68882, 8meg Fast, SCSI), 1.3/3.1, 2meg Chip, full ECS chipset, EZ135, 1084S, big harddrives, 2.2xCD Gateway Performance 500 Piece 'o Crap, '98, 128meg, 20Gig, flatbed. __________________________________________________________________ Get your own FREE, personal Netscape Webmail account today at http://webmail.netscape.com/

24 years, 1 month

Wonder (was Re: just outta curiosity)

by mcguire＠neurotica.com

Hmm. I've never found computers tedious. I also don't run Windows. I think there's probably a connection there. :) And no...nobody *NEEDS* to use Windows. I love getting into that argument. "But I NEEEEEEED it!" My favorite response is usually something like "you mean you'd be unemployed and destitute if this one bad product from this one bad company didn't exist?" That really pisses some people off. Others have gone and installed decent OSs on their PeeCees that very day. :) -Dave McGuire On April 8, Chuck McManis wrote: > I don't recall exactly when it was, but I not too long ago I found myself > dealing with the "tediousness" of using a computer. To consider a computer > tedious was, for me, such a shock that I had to ponder the implications of > that. The result of that pondering was that for my tools, I needed them to > work correctly and they rarely were, and getting them fixed was tedious. > However I also realized that for the "PC" at least a lot of the wonder had > gone out of computers. I remember clearly the FORTRAN printout that > computed the impact point of a free falling object dropped from 5,000 feet > in a uniform gravity gradient and a perfect vacuum :-) I printed x & y > co-ordinates of the object for every tenth second and got 20 pages or so of > numbers. That was WONDERful. Writing a PL/I program to use overstrikes to > print multi-shaded histograms on a line printer attached to a 370 was > pretty fun to. > > Figuring out what my graphics program on Win98 wasn't seeing mouse events > was TEDIOUS. > > So much of my motivation is driven by the wonder of what the system can do > with what it has that I find VAXen and PDP-11s much more impressive than > 1.5Ghz Pentium IVs. Capturing the wonder is my secret ingredient to learning. > > --Chuck > >

24 years, 1 month

large load of old (non-PC) microcomputers available

by mmcfadden＠cmh.edu

Is this some place in Australia? Isn't that where Brisbane is located? I'm not sure I know the abbreviations for all of the Australian states and territories. >Most importantly, are any interested list members in AZ (brisbane I = >think was the city) and could thus do a look-see, and maybe organize = >shipping, etc? Mike mmcfadden(a)cmh.edu

24 years, 1 month

vt100 & graphics

by mcguire＠neurotica.com

On April 10, emanuel stiebler wrote: > > Now, though, I have two VT100s with the VT125 graphics option > > installed. They're neat! > > Was there really an option, or is it just aother mainboard ? It's really an option. It's a secondary board, almost as large as the main board, that sandwiches onto it. Then both slide into the card cage. The option kit also comes with a replacement back cover that has extra holes for stuff like the RGB BNC connectors (it can drive an external color monitor)... > P.S. You need both of them ? > ;-) ;) I hadn't thought about parting with one of them, but I might consider it... -Dave McGuire

24 years, 1 month

Way OT (was RE: OT somewhat. China, our aircraft, delays.)

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

From: Fred Cisin (XenoSoft) <cisin(a)xenosoft.com> > >Was the missing radome collision damage? >Or would jettisoning the radome be standard procedure? No. That would be an aerodynamic disaster as it could hit something important further back. FYI: that is an older survialence plane and likely hold fewer secrets that is believed. Allison

24 years, 1 month

Way OT (was RE: OT somewhat. China, our aircraft, delays.)

by rigdonj＠intellistar.net

At 04:19 PM 4/9/01 -0400, you wrote: >There is some disagreement about jettisoning the radome. Not sure what >made it fall off, but it is only a fiberglass bubble over a radar >transceiver. Not terribly sturdy because it has to be transparent to >radar waves. It is only there to protect the antennae and for aerodynamic >purposes. > >I bet that is one of the only senders on the plane. Of course it is. Did you happen to notice that big dish on the bottom of the fuselage? Guess what's in it? Also take a look at the long dome on top of the fuselage. I'd be willing to bet that it contains a fixed antenna for a side looking RADAR. FWIW the RADAR antenna that was in the forward radome probably contained an antenna for a STANDARD weather and naviagation RADAR. The system certainly contains nothing that would have to be jettisisioned. The rest of it are >antennae for receiving electronic intelligence such as radar frequencies, >radio traffic, microwave traffic, and the like. > >In <Pine.GSO.4.21.0104082328560.11155-100000(a)lanshark.lanminds.com>, on >04/09/01 > at 04:19 PM, "Fred Cisin (XenoSoft)" <cisin(a)xenosoft.com> said: > >>On Sun, 8 Apr 2001, Chris Kennedy wrote: >>> - The radome is missing. I'm at a loss to explain how the radome >>> got ripped off the aircraft by contact on the wing -- especially >>> given that the fuselage forward of the wing root doesn't appear >>> damaged. Most likely it collided with the vertical stablizer (ie "rudder") when the fighter tried to "bump" the EP-3 by passing underneath it at high speed. The debris probably did the damage to the propellors and other external antenna. Joe

24 years, 1 month

HP 9815 (was Re: HP 9000 520)

by fmc＠reanimators.org

Joe <rigdonj(a)intellistar.net> wrote: > The two expansion slots were optional on the early 9815 "A" models but > were standard on the later "S" model. There are several interfaces that can > go in those slots. Here's the list of the ones that I know of: One I didn't see on your list, don't know the part number of, and don't have, but have seen in the hands of another subscriber: a cable with a 9815 cartridge on each end, used to connect two 9815s together for tape duplication. -Frank McConnell

24 years, 1 month

vt100 & graphics

by mcguire＠neurotica.com

On April 8, emanuel stiebler wrote: > In the beginning of the '80 I was sitting on a VT100 with an > additional/optional > "selenar graphics board" > > Anybody out here, ever heard of such beast or has one ? > > As far as I remember, it had an z80 on it, and was emulating an > Tektronix 4010 or something similar. Yes, I used to have one of those. I had a huge amount of fun with it. I ran it hooked up to my pdp11/34a. I have no idea what happened to it...sure wish I'd hung onto it. Now, though, I have two VT100s with the VT125 graphics option installed. They're neat! -Dave McGuire

24 years, 1 month

OS-65U and/or OS-65D boot disks?

by jfoust＠threedee.com

Someone is looking for these boot disks for emulator use. Can someone here help him? See below. - John : Date: Thu, 05 Apr 2001 20:37:03 -0400 From: Chris Ott <cott(a)bellatlantic.net> Organization: Acclamation Systems Since I noticed you'll be downloading the Ohio Scientific manuals next, I'm reminded of a question I wanted to ask. You wouldn't happen to know if anyone out there has a disk image of OS-65U and/or OS-65D, would you? I'd like to try to run them on my C4P emulator. I actually have my own copies, but since I don't have a computer that'll read them, I don't think I have any other options. Chris

24 years, 1 month

Heath/Zenith stuff

by KB9VU＠aol.com

I have 3 H-89s, 2 H8s, an H19, H29, original Zenith 10 Meg HD with the on board 8" drive, several 8" dual drives, spare SS and DS 5" drives, several spare 5" HH and FH hard drives, controller boards, CPU and TLB boards, spare I/O and RAM boards, drives, chips, hardware. A ton of original documentation and software. All of the systems are in operating condition. Spare parts are used and NOS. Free to the first person that picks it up within the next 7 days in St. Louis, MO E-Mail direct if you want the collection. kb9vu(a)aol.com After 7 days it goes to the dump. We are moving and it just can't be moved with us this time. Thanks. Mike

24 years, 1 month

just outta curiosity

by Demon02554＠aol.com

In a message dated 4/8/01 3:20:46 PM Eastern Daylight Time, KenzieM(a)sympatico.ca writes: << My APPLE ][ plus came with CP/M manuals. Reading them I found a reference to the new mini diskettes, they were referring to 5.25" floppies. Browsing in used book stores this weekend I found TI, heathkit, Intel and Motorola chip reference books and a manual for my Amstrad 1640. I'm afraid that many of the older machines won't even be recognised as an old computer by people who started out with a Pentium. When I ask if they have any old hardware they say that they had a Pentium 100 but it was too old and they threw it out. >> WHAT THE HELL IS WRONG WITH THOSE PEOPLE?!? i have a little shelf that has all of my old processors sitting on it....since the machines wouldnt work....i have a processor from every generation of the X86...some Atari processors...and i think actually a few gaming console processors....

24 years, 1 month

Now taking exhibit entries for VCF East!!!

by vcf＠siconic.com

I think I am about to announce that the first VCF East will be held at the Centrum Centre in Worcester, Massachusetts. The tentative dates are June 23-24. With that in mind, I would like to start taking exhibit entries. If you would like to exhibit at the VCF East then please go to the following page and fill in the form: http://www.vintage.org/2001/east/exhibit.php3 First, Second and Third place awards will be given based on attendee votes. $50 will be given to the First Place exhibit. As an enticement, exhibitors get free admission to the event and a free t-shirt. Please remember that this is COMPLETELY PRELIMINARY. The dates and the venue are by no means cast in stone at this point. I just want to start getting exhibitors signed up because the timeframe is so tight. I would also like to take this opportunity to welcome suggestions for speakers at VCF East. If you have suggestions, please send them to <sellam(a)vintage.org>. I will know in the next day or so if Centrum Centre will indeed be the place. Within a few days after that the VCF East area of the VCF website will begin to carry information about speakers, exhibiting, vendors, admission rates, etc. The VCF East message board will open up shortly as well. There will be a link to the message board on the VCF East main page once things get rolling. Stay tuned!!! Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org

24 years, 1 month

Slabs, kids, shipping, cdtv.

by agraham＠ccat.co.uk

> Date: Mon, 9 Apr 2001 06:39:56 -0400 > From: Jeff Hellige <jhellige(a)earthlink.net> > Subject: Re: NeXT slabs, recent finds and a request > > I've got a CDTV myself, but it's CD-ROM doesn't work. > Otherwise it > works fine booted from a floppy, acting like an A500. I've got > keyboard, wireless mouse, remote and a black Roctek floppy > drive. What > does your keyboard look like? Mine is black and looks > identical to the > A3000/A4000 keyboard except for the connector but it doesn't > have 'CDTV' > below the Amiga logo in the upper right corner and it almost > looks like > it was spray painted black. The cord and connector don't look like a > homebrew job though. My keyboard DOES say 'CDTV' but doesn't have the amiga logo (I don't think) and it looks identical to the keyboard for the Amiga 1500 its sitting on top of, apart from being black and having a mini-din connector. There's a thought - the wired mouse connector looks identical to the Apple ADB port......anyone know if I could use a 2-button Kensington Mac mouse? Got one floating around somewhere....heh..... > ------------------------------ > > Date: Mon, 09 Apr 2001 09:37:24 -0400 > From: Curt Vendel <curt(a)atari-history.com> > Subject: Re: NeXT slabs, recent finds and a request > > Hi Adrian, > > Sure, I'd be happy to ship one, I'd highly recommend > shipping by boat, > no air as it'll cost into the hundreds. Do you want a monitor? (its > actually a necessity since the keyboard/mouse plug into the > monitor and the > monitor cable plugs into the slab and also takes its power > from the slab.) > > Let me know and I have no problems lugged down two boxes (1 cpu, 1 > monitor) to the post office for you. Yes please; slab/monitor/kbd/rodent and I agree about the boat shipping - I haven't got any spare arms and legs to pay for airmail :) Actually, you could probably ship it to my gf's sister in Providence, RI 'cos she's coming over here next month and might be able to bring it with her since her bf's a pilot! > ------------------------------ > > Date: Mon, 9 Apr 2001 15:50:43 +0100 (BST) > From: "M.Buckett" <M.Buckett(a)dcs.hull.ac.uk> > Subject: Re: NeXT slabs, recent finds and a request > > Hi, > If your prepared to ship to the UK I would be very interested > in getting a > slab, monitor, keyboard and bits if there are still some going. > How much do expect shipping by boat to the UK will be? and > how long will it take? 4-6 weeks and probably round the $30-$50 mark I'd guess...... > ------------------------------ > > Date: Mon, 9 Apr 2001 10:34:10 -0500 > From: "McFadden, Mike" <mmcfadden(a)cmh.edu> > Subject: Re: just outta curiosity > > Being a kid is a state of mind. I know a few 17 year old > adults and a few 40 year old kids. I'm a (nearly) 34 year old kid :) > I consider myself a kid because I sit on the floor when I take apart > computers, I stand on my head in containers/dumpsters pulling > out computers, > I occasionally look like a dust bunny/dirt devil after > crawling around a warehouse. Check! > My kids think I'm a kid or crazy because I talk > to the computers when I'm taking them apart. Check! > Kids also get excited when they get new toys, and that's me > when I've found a new computer. I don't get excited per se since I haven't been excited about anything for 10 years or so, hence the Prozac I'm on now and the past tendency to want to jump off tall buildings (over that now, fortunately :) but I DO get a sense of satisfaction that it's another machine that's been saved that I'll eventually get time to play with. > Maybe I'll go back to school when my kids are in college and > teach kids. > Actually my goal is to be able to work/play on interesting projects. Check! My daughter's school has expressed an interest in bringing the kids round to see the museum when its in some sort of order since they're all PeeCee based apart from a couple of Beebs and the odd Mac. She thinks its great that I've got a couple of Colour Classics now since that's what she uses at school! Right. Back on me head :) -- Adrian Graham MCSE/ASE/MCP C CAT Limited Gubbins: http://www.ccat.co.uk (work) <http://www.snakebiteandblack.co.uk> (home) <http://www.binarydinosaurs.co.uk> (The Online Computer Museum) 0/0

24 years, 1 month

27C020's :)

by geoffr＠zipcon.net

YAY!!!!! I found a local wholesaler that offered to sample me out 2 of the chips I need :) I will definately be buying repair componants for systems from them from now on :) I LOVE a company that goes out of their way to provide customer service :) I also found a source for 11 of them in a tube for $12.00 plus shipping, he ahs 7 tubes :) i think I'll be getting a few of these since sparc 2's, ipc's ipx's and Sparc 10's all use those for their ROMs...

24 years, 1 month

Looking for Les Solomon

by vcf＠siconic.com

Does anyone have any contact information for Les Solomon of Popular Electronics fame? Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org

24 years, 1 month

Atari 520ST up for grabs in Maryland

by vcf＠siconic.com

Here's a boxed Atari 520ST with all the trimmings. Looking for a new home. Please reply to the original sender. Reply-to: <fmstef(a)earthlink.net> ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Mon, 9 Apr 2001 20:31:54 -0400 From: Frederick Steffens <fmstef(a)earthlink.net> Subject: Atari 520ST Hi: I have an Atari 520ST with software, a color monitor and original packing. Also included is manuals and other software, mostly games. I would like to give this computer to a good home, rather than trashing it. Let me know if you have an interest. Thanks, Fred Steffens --- Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org

24 years, 1 month

Where to find 44pin edge cards/ 6502 d/l freeware

by zmerch＠30below.com

Rumor has it that THETechnoid(a)home.com may have mentioned these words: >MIght try www.atari.org. They have links to the common suppliers of >obsolecent Atari gear. Including development boards and the like. > >Wish I could remember all of them, but: > >BravoSierra is one, B&C Computervisions is another, and there are a couple >of others that escape my perforated memory. Acid is not a good thing for >your long-term memory.... > >Regards, > >Jeff Those are good suggestions, but IMHO the atari dealers get kinda expensive... the 44-pin slots were actually quite standard, and are available from www.jameco.com & *prolly* (but don't quote me) from www.bgmicro.com. Jameco also has the 44-pin edge proto boards, which might be handy if you like to do homebrew electronics. These guys carry a lot of older things, but they don't (usually) want an arm & leg from you... Another good place to try is www.mouser.com - I'm not affiliated with them other than a very satisfied customer... Jameco wants a $5.00 "processing fee" for orders under $50.00, so you might want to browse the catalog for other stuff they carry... HTH, Roger "Merch" Merberger (Oh, Jeff - I did get your email, but things have been crazy over the winter - I have quaffed a few ales with your brother (and he likes my homebrew... ;-), he only lives a few miles from me.) -- Roger "Merch" Merchberger --- sysadmin, Iceberg Computers Recycling is good, right??? Ok, so I'll recycle an old .sig. If at first you don't succeed, nuclear warhead disarmament should *not* be your first career choice.

24 years, 1 month

Way OT (was RE: OT somewhat. China, our aircraft, delays.)

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

From: Chris Kennedy <chris(a)mainecoon.com> > >You screwed up the attribution. This wasn't me -- I did the wing loading >calcs to refute it :-) > Sorry, too many layers of indirection. Allison

24 years, 1 month

Looking for Hayes LANStep

by chronic＠nf.sympatico.ca

Does anyone out there have a copy of this? I remember using it all the time when my school had a nice, respectable computer network and not the Windows NT garbage they have now. I loved the interface, not the best looking thing around but real user friendly and all. If anyone has a copy, let me know. -Lanny

24 years, 1 month

Way OT (was RE: OT somewhat. China, our aircraft, delays.)

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

From: Chris Kennedy <chris(a)mainecoon.com> > >> Since the US plane is larger and slower than the Chinese fighters it >> would be effected more by the turbulence. The effect of turbulence is based on wing loading and wingspan. the E-3 having greater wingspan is less impacted as the figher wake is more localized. Further international flight rules stipulate that the faster and more maneuverable plane (fighter) MUST give way to the slower (E-3). >There's a bunch of problems with the Chinese claim that the EP-3 >made a sudden roll and thus caused the contact: Even if that were the case the fighers position was such that he would be invisible to the larger E-3. >- The photo evidence of the damage isn't consistent with running > into another airplane. The prop tips are munched, but the props > are still attached to the gearboxes and the gearboxes and engines > didn't depart the airframe. The damage is more consistent with > colliding with birds -- or debris. It was a close miss, likely the props did some nasty chewing on the fighter. Those mounts and gearboxes are very robust on that bird. >- The radome is missing. I'm at a loss to explain how the radome > got ripped off the aircraft by contact on the wing -- especially > given that the fuselage forward of the wing root doesn't appear > damaged. Flying peices from the contact could be a factor. >It looks more like the Fishbed was trying to bump the Aries (which >essentially consists of passing under the Aires with a delta of >about +200 knots and pulling vertical) and wasn't up to the task. >The empennage collided with the radome, peeled the radome and part of >the empennage off and the Aires in turn plowed through the debris field. Likely. One common maneuver to rattle the slower bird is pass from the low and behind and pull up and infront crossing the path of the slower aircraft. Mistiming can be very bad. >Like saying that _he_ gave the downed pilot permission to bail out? >Since when does wing give lead permission to do anything (the usual >job of wing is to tuck in tight, shut up and listen to guard) -- or >was the surviving pilot lead, in which case what was the wingman doing >in a position where the only way he could collide with the Aires >would have been if the Aires went into Beta thrust? Exactly. Inconsistant stories. Add to that the chinese pilots do not get the air time the US pilots do and have less proficientcy. Allison

24 years, 1 month

OT somewhat. China, our aircraft, delays.

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

From: THETechnoid(a)home.com <THETechnoid(a)home.com> >The operable variables are: Method of Propulsion - wind power stays on >course, motors maneuver. Size: The smaller vessel is generally the more >maneuverable and is obliged to do so. Very so for aircraft. it has more depth as there are blimps, choppers, sailplanes but the rule is basically the same everywhere. >There are other rules as well, but these two suit this situation very >nicely. Fast, jet powered fighter aircraft can and should avoid colliding >with butt slow prop-driven piglike aircraft. Really, that is the first >duty of any fighter pilot after taking off and before landing. The rest >is trying to SHOOT down the bad guys. Ramming them is not nearly so >effective, as our Chinese friends have learned. It's a result of serious pilot error on the part of the figher pilot. Allison

24 years, 1 month

Way OT (was RE: OT somewhat. China, our aircraft, delays.)

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

>From: "Eric J. Korpela" <korpela(a)ellie.ssl.berkeley.edu> >To: <classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org> >Sent: Monday, April 09, 2001 11:48 AM >Subject: Re: Way OT (was RE: OT somewhat. China, our aircraft, delays.) > > >> > - The radome is missing. I'm at a loss to explain how the radome >> > got ripped off the aircraft by contact on the wing -- especially >> > given that the fuselage forward of the wing root doesn't appear >> > damaged. >> >> I've assumed that the missing radome was part of the "landing >>preparations" if you know what I mean. Far from likely, the dome it self is just a RF transparent window and all the goodies, radar antenna and bits, are mounted to the aircraft. The seperation like for a contact would be clean as the dome is removeable with ease for maintenace on the equipment behind it. Besides the dome leaving would likely contact other parts of the plane on the way past doing significant damage. What I can't figure is why the figher pilot didn't punch out unless his path was such that his canopy was scraped off taking him with it. Allison

24 years, 1 month

goodbye / giveaway

by nemo＠net.house.cx

I've not been active on this list, but circumstances force my hand and I must depart. I also want to clear my rooms of stuff that's filling my place. I have a Tektronix 4012 terminal (vaguelly working - the screen lights up) to anyone who wants it and can pick it up. I'm in Canberra, Australia. I've got a few other items around that might be of interest to people. Some Xterminals (not actually 10 years old, but still older than most people want to know about) and WYSE terminals. (one that works, one that is probably fixable, and one that probably isn't) You'll have to email me directly if you're interested. <nemo(a)net.house.cx> cheers... .../Nemo

24 years, 1 month

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test-drb April 2001