December 2001 - test-drb@ccmp.vtda.org

by csmith＠amdocs.com

Hi everybody. Still working on those MIPS RISComputers. I've gotten all three to power-up and self-test at least once. The one that's giving me problems came to me marked "bad power supply." Not being one to believe the markings, I tried it, and it powered up fine, did the whole self test, and (due to the lack of any disks) just set there, as you'd expect. So here's the deal. I powered it off, and then back on. The second time, it didn't seem to be getting any power at all -- not even fan-buzz. Would I be right to suspect a loose joint or the like? Is there anything else that might cause the power supply to work sporadically? What's the best way to attack this and get the power-supply fixed? Should I just dig out a multimeter and start checking connections? Regards, Chris Christopher Smith, Perl Developer Amdocs - Champaign, IL /usr/bin/perl -e ' print((~"\x95\xc4\xe3"^"Just Another Perl Hacker.")."\x08!\n"); '

23 years, 7 months

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Booting a VAX 4000-500 from KFQSA SCSI.... ARRRRRGH!!!!!

by msell＠ontimesupport.com

(Grumble)..... I'm getting conflicting information regarding the ability to boot the 4000 >from SCSI devices attached to the KFQSA SCSI adapter. Some people say you can't do it, some say they actually have done it. I have a DEC RRD-43AA CD-ROM drive, and have it connected to an external SCSI box with a cable from it to the KFQSA adapter. Onboard the 4000 are two DSSI drives. The 4000 is able to recognize and assign device identifiers to the ethernet port and the two DSSI drives, but has no clue ragarding anything attached to the SCSI (KZQSA) card. Is there anything I need to do with the "VMB" to make it recognize the CD-ROM drive, or am I missing a step? I'm attempting to boot the 4000 from the CD-ROM and start the VMS 6 installation process. Thanks! - Matt Matthew Sell Programmer On Time Support, Inc. www.ontimesupport.com (281) 296-6066 Join the Metrology Software discussion group METLIST! http://www.ontimesupport.com/cgi-bin/mojo/mojo.cgi "One World, One Web, One Program" - Microsoft Promotional Ad "Ein Volk, Ein Reich, Ein Fuhrer" - Adolf Hitler Many thanks for this tagline to a fellow RGVAC'er...

23 years, 7 months

2
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DS5000/1xx & VS4000/60 memory specs

by doc＠mdrconsult.com

I'm looking for detailed module specs for the vaxstation 4000, and probably for the decstation 5000/1xx. I have a pile of 32M modules that my supplier thought work in a vs4k, but they don't. While I can't find any references to the labeling, y'alls' best guess seems to be that they are ram for a decstation 5000/1xx. I'd like to find out if the difference is something that can be modified, to make them compatible with the VAX. Failing that, if I can verify that they really are DS modules, I can sell them. The SIMMs themselves are from several different lots, but the common label, which looks like a DEC/Compaq P/N to me, is 33522947-001. Lastly, what's a 32M SIMM worth? I've got a little over $25 each in these. If they're worth that, I'll convert or sell them, if not I'll return them as misrepresented. Doc

23 years, 7 months

4
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RSTS/E on a PDP 11/34?

by csmith＠amdocs.com

> -----Original Message----- > From: Stan Barr [mailto:stanb@dial.pipex.com] > If you could attach an 8-inch disk to a PC (or a 5 1/4 inch > one to a PDP) > it _should_ be possible to create a boot disk using Paul Koning's FLX > utility, which allows a PC to read/write and create RSTS disks. Actually, you can do either, and my PDP happens to have 5.25" disks in the first place. :) Regards, Chris Christopher Smith, Perl Developer Amdocs - Champaign, IL /usr/bin/perl -e ' print((~"\x95\xc4\xe3"^"Just Another Perl Hacker.")."\x08!\n"); '

23 years, 7 months

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Intermittent(?) power-supply trouble

by geoffr＠zipcon.net

At 12:55 PM 12/27/01 -0600, you wrote: >So here's the deal. I powered it off, and then back on. The second time, >it didn't seem to be getting any power at all -- not even fan-buzz. > >Would I be right to suspect a loose joint or the like? Is there anything >else that might cause the power supply to work sporadically? Best source for finding loose solder joints is to look at the board in question...

23 years, 7 months

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OT: Rackmount slider kit for IBM Netfinity 5100

by vcf＠vintage.org

I have a new rackmount slider kit for the IBM Netfinity 5100. This is the kit that came with the unit so that you can rackmount it. The part number on the box is 09N7484. It'll probably work with other cases in the 5x00 series. Best offer by Jan. 2 gets it. Otherwise, it probably gets recycled. Please reply privately (I know you will ;) Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com *

23 years, 7 months

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RSTS/E on a PDP 11/34?

by csmith＠amdocs.com

> -----Original Message----- > From: Sellam Ismail [mailto:foo@siconic.com] > Ok, cool. How can I get RSTS/E boot media? How do I find > out what device > my 11/34 will boot from? It has an RK05, RK05f and two 8" > floppy drives. I don't know. :) Let me know if you find any. I have an 11/75 that would love to run RSTS/E. Regards, Chris Christopher Smith, Perl Developer Amdocs - Champaign, IL /usr/bin/perl -e ' print((~"\x95\xc4\xe3"^"Just Another Perl Hacker.")."\x08!\n"); '

23 years, 7 months

2
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Apple Questions...

by rhudson＠cnonline.net

Can I somehow... A. Get Dos3.3 to run on 3.5 disk? or B. Get the renumber program from DOS 3.3 to run under Prodos? Thanks!

23 years, 7 months

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Intermittent(?) power-supply trouble

by csmith＠amdocs.com

> -----Original Message----- > From: Sipke de Wal [mailto:sipke@wxs.nl] > If it is a switching PSU you'll propably need to load it > in order to have it function properly. I always use an old > defuncty HD for this purpose ..................... > Chances are that if the load is not large enough it will shut > itself down, while it may still be a OK PSU. I thought that may be the case too, but one of the working units is missing the tape drive (which this unit has...) and still functions properly. Chris Christopher Smith, Perl Developer Amdocs - Champaign, IL /usr/bin/perl -e ' print((~"\x95\xc4\xe3"^"Just Another Perl Hacker.")."\x08!\n"); '

23 years, 7 months

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RSTS/E on a PDP 11/34?

by vcf＠vintage.org

This may be a dumb question but... Will RSTS/E (specifically) RSTS/E-V7.0/07 run on a PDP 11/34? Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com *

23 years, 7 months

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PDP8/A memory problems, what to do?

by pete＠dunnington.u-net.com

On Dec 26, 18:21, Ethan Dicks wrote: > --- Pete Turnbull <pete(a)dunnington.u-net.com> wrote: > > > It's not cool like core, but did anyone ever come up with a modern > > > battery-backed-up SRAM board? > > > > Yes, I've got one. It even has a connector to link to an interface in a > > PC, so you can squirt (or suck) data in (or out) directly. > > That's a cool feature. You got docs? Is this commercial or homebrew? > How about a digital picture? 75dpi scan? It's a commercial 4-layer board. The legend says "Tellima Technology Ltd (C) 1995", "PC03753". It has a couple of surface-mount KM68100 SRAMs, but the most prominent features are the two Actel 1020 FPGAs. It also has 6 x 8837 and 3 x 8838 interface ICs, a pair of 74HCT244's, 2 x 74HCT160 and a 74HCT161, a MAX695, a 16MHz oscillator, a 3V 1/2AA lithium cell, a littl daughterboard with some inteface chips, and the 26-way header for the PC interface. The PC interface is a small 4-layer ISA card "PC03285-C", with a couple of Actel 1010's, a few small SMDs, 2 x 74HCT160 and a 74HCT161, and a 26-pin header on the backplate. Interestingly, it also has space for a 132-pin SMD device, several smaller SMDs, eight ZIP devices, and a couple of 8-pin miniDINs. I don't have a scanner, at least not one that works. Nor a digital camera, except my Indycams, which aren't exactly high resolution. I'll see what I can do... -- Pete Peter Turnbull Network Manager University of York

23 years, 7 months

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RSTS/E on a PDP 11/34?

by csmith＠amdocs.com

> -----Original Message----- > From: Sellam Ismail [mailto:foo@siconic.com] > Ah ha. Ok, so then my next question is, if I had some > version of RSTS/E, > could I read files on disks from other versions? Are they basically > interchangeable? I think it uses FILES-11/ODS-1, which means that you can share disks among RSTS/E systems and RSX-11 systems. VMS will also read and write them if I'm not mistaken. At least it should read them. VMS uses ODS-2 natively, though. I also have the FILES-11/ODS-1 spec in electronic form. Regards, Chris Christopher Smith, Perl Developer Amdocs - Champaign, IL /usr/bin/perl -e ' print((~"\x95\xc4\xe3"^"Just Another Perl Hacker.")."\x08!\n"); '

23 years, 7 months

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add-on CPU load meters

by LFessen106＠aol.com

In a message dated 12/27/01 11:35:11 AM Eastern Standard Time, erd_6502(a)yahoo.com writes: > I found that. More than once. That's for an LED bargraph. I'm > looking for a circuit that operates an old-fashioned galvanometer- > style panel meter with a needle that swings from side-to-side. > > I can invent my own - a simple ladder D-to-A to produce a variable > voltage out of the parallel port. I was hoping to save the math > and use resistor values that someone else has calculated, but after > two days of searching, I guess I _will_ have to go do it myself. > > Somewhere in my junk boxes, I have some .5" tall by 1.5" wide signal > meters that I think I pulled from a dead CB radio, c. 1978 (pre-40- > channel). The plane of the needle swing is parallel to the floor, > and the needle has a 90-degree bend at the end, so you see a .2" > tall vertical line slide from left to right as the signal improves. > If I can find it, it'll mount perfectly in a 3.5" blank faceplace. > > Now to excavate the old parts! > > -ethan > > Well, please let us know if and how you get this working. I would love to have something like this as well! -Linc. In The Beginning there was nothing, which exploded - Yeah right... Calculating in binary code is as easy as 01,10,11.

23 years, 7 months

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PDP8/A memory problems, what to do?

by pete＠dunnington.u-net.com

On Dec 26, 18:18, Ethan Dicks wrote: > > --- Pete Turnbull <pete(a)dunnington.u-net.com> wrote: > > On Dec 26, 14:20, Gunther Schadow wrote: > > > > > My first PDP-8 program is a memory test... > > > > Good idea. I meant to mention in my followup to Ethan, that the > > diagnostics are also available, at > > > > http://pdp-8.org/papertape/ > > Nice. Fortunately for me, I have several boxes of DEC diagnostic tapes > (nothing unusual, but I'll check my list against what you have) I don't deserve any credit for the tapes and docs online -- they're the fruits of serveral other people's labours :-) pdp8.org is Aaron Nabil's site, and David Gesswien provides the docs at www.pdp8.net > At the moment, I think I have an M865 that works and an M8650 that may > or may not work. If I'm forced to use 20mA, I guess I'll have to dig > up a genuine IBM 8-bit serial card and mod it to switch it to current > loop. You probably know you can use an M8650 in RS232 mode. If you don't have a BC01V cable wired for RS232, Doug Jones' site has an excellent diagram, and a useful document explaining how to set up the baud rate etc (BTW, the note about changing the capacitor value for baud rates other than 110 only applies to current-loop operation). How different is an M865? Is it only current-loop? http://www.cs.uiowa.edu/~jones/pdp8/hard8e/ -- Pete Peter Turnbull Network Manager University of York

23 years, 7 months

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UnCursing the Darkness.

by pete＠dunnington.u-net.com

On Dec 26, 21:39, John Allain wrote: > I recently bought 2 each of all the white LED's that Jameco > sells. While *white*s are OT, they are nonetheless impressive. > The light density, efficiency, color, and longevity they have is > pretty amazing, to me anyway. Jameco rated them at 4 foot > candles at 20ma, which seemed a little 'opto'mistic. > I tried them out, and they reach near peak light at more like > 180ma, getting just noticeaby warm. At 250ma they are > 'uncomfortably' warm, hence question: > Did they really mean 20ma? at that proportion they're > putting out <10% peak, but 180ma is WAY above spec, > Jameco's spec anyway. So I guess Jameco's wrong? > Could I be loosing lifespan at this current? Maybe the > not-too-warm test is good enough? I had a look in my Farnell catalogue. Most of the white LEDs they stock are rated between 400 and 5600 mcd (millicandelas) at between 20mA. 20mA seems to be a standard current to quote the light output at, for most LEDs, not just white. However, Farnell also give lots of other data, including the maximum rated forward current, and the highest for any of the white LEDs is 30mA (made by Infineon and Multicomp). I don't think you should let them get warm :-) -- Pete Peter Turnbull Network Manager University of York

23 years, 7 months

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Will someone delete me from this email list please as the commands do not work!!

by jamie＠rbattison.freeserve.co.uk

I want to remove myself from this list as i no longer have an interest in this subject. The commands on the website do not work so can the list owner please remove or can someone give me some idea of how to do it. cheers _______________________________________________________________________ Never pay another Internet phone bill! Freeserve AnyTime, for all the Internet access you want, day and night, only ?12.99 per month. Sign-up at http://www.freeserve.com/time/anytime

23 years, 7 months

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RSTS/E on a PDP 11/34?

by mcguire＠neurotica.com

On December 26, Vintage Computer Festival wrote: > This may be a dumb question but... > > Will RSTS/E (specifically) RSTS/E-V7.0/07 run on a PDP 11/34? Dunno if this will be useful, but I ran RSTS/E v9.4 on a PDP11/34a for a long time.. -Dave -- Dave McGuire St. Petersburg, FL "Less talk. More synthohol." --Lt. Worf

23 years, 7 months

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PAL introduction (was MITS 2SIO serial chip)

by pcw＠mesanet.com

The PAL was introduced in 1978, Other types of programmable logic devices were available earlier, (FPLA's for example) Here is a quote from one of the PAL's inventors (Andy Chan -- now at QuickLogic) "MMI's PAL was designed to overcome the problems associated with FPLA that made it difficult for end users. A proprietary programmer was necessary and a cumbersome inputting process (creating the design in Boolean equations, translating them into a bitmap and typing that into a machine that generated a paper tape for the programmer to read) meant that if the design didn't work, it was impossible to know at what step something went awry. Our PAL was faster and used less power, but the main improvement was in its ease of use, Chan said, noting that the first PAL chip was introduced in 1978." PCW

23 years, 7 months

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PDP8/A memory problems, what to do?

by pete＠dunnington.u-net.com

On Dec 26, 12:08, Ethan Dicks wrote: > --- Gunther Schadow <gunther(a)aurora.regenstrief.org> wrote: > Good idea. I have a couple of quick routines I use as a basic > check-out, once I know I can read and write from/to field 0 > reliably - one is an inchworm for blinkenlights (or a counter > for the -8/a) I do that too. I also have a couple of very short toggle-in programs for the console serial line, one of which echos what you type. The last item I have that might be useful is a uploader that sends files, either plain or papertape images, to the RIM or BIN loaders -- it's on Kevin McQuiggin's page at http://highgate.comm.sfu.ca/pdp8/software/new-send.c > > The third 16k board > > plays the high fields 4 to 7, but it has a systematic > > error masking out bits 6 and 7. > Well... I doubt the core planes are bad, but I suppose it's possible. > I would suspect the bus buffers first, then, depending on the exact nature > of the problem there are failure modes of the inhibit drivers that could > whack your bits as they pass through a memory read cycle, but that's > not horribly likely. > > The trick is to sit there with the schematics and generate write cycles > and read cycles through the front panel as your trace the flow of bits > through the memory. I'd agree with that. It's more likely a logic problem than a core mat problem. > It's not cool like core, but did anyone ever come up with a modern > battery-backed-up SRAM board? I'm thinking of discussions of a few > years ago and talk about a quad-width OMNIBUS board w/2x62256 SRAMs. > Cheap to make (not counting a 1 sq. ft PCB), but compared to what we > used to pay for RAM...) and made with modern components. It may have > all been discussion without even a schematic generated, but I had to > ask. Yes, I've got one. It even has a connector to link to an interface in a PC, so you can squirt (or suck) data in (or out) directly. -- Pete Peter Turnbull Network Manager University of York

23 years, 7 months

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PDP8/A memory problems, what to do?

by pete＠dunnington.u-net.com

On Dec 26, 14:20, Gunther Schadow wrote: > My first PDP-8 program is a memory test, and I was glad I > did it because I found a problem. My test goes through all > memory fields and writes into each cell its address in the > field. Then it reads that address out of each field again > and so finds problems. Good idea. I meant to mention in my followup to Ethan, that the diagnostics are also available, at http://pdp-8.org/papertape/ and the corresponding documentation is available at http://www.pdp8.net/query_docs/query_all.html The papertape images have headers, and the way the BIN loader works, you need to strip the ASCII header but leave at least part of the top-bit-set leader part at beginning and end. The "send" program I mentioned will take care of that. -- Pete Peter Turnbull Network Manager University of York

23 years, 7 months

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OT: Older inventory programs for home computers

by SUPRDAVE＠aol.com

In a message dated 12/26/01 8:23:23 PM Eastern Standard Time, lgwalker(a)mts.net writes: << A local general purpose mechanic who mainly works on Ski-doos in the winter and pumps and everything else in the summer gave me a complete Adam (!) collecting dust on the shelf, when I told him I collect computers. He mentioned he could use an old box to keep track of his parts inventory if I had any spares. I volunteered to supply him with something that would serve simple needs thinking of everything from a C-64 to an A2 or an XT to a 386 and that there must be 100s of programs that would be available. And no I don't want to configure a Database program. I did a Google search and found only the newest Gee-Whiz Winblows 9x, 2k, XP, and OSX programs, and while I haven't searched Simtel, out of frustration I've decided to defer to the list about older programs to track inventory and if it also has billing and labour, so much the better. Any suggestions would be appreciated. It would serve as an example that older machines don't have to be delegated to land-fills. This area is in north- central Manitoba,Canada and not exactly a hotbed of technology. The temperature at present is -20 C, but the air is breathable. >> I do have an inventory prorgam with pretty modest system requirements, but pretty much seems to be designed for home inventory and such.

23 years, 7 months

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FW: VAX 3900 Free to Good Home

by DAW＠yalepress3.unipress.yale.edu

If I was closer, it'd be mine... :-( --- David A Woyciesjes --- C & IS Support Specialist --- Yale University Press --- mailto:david.woyciesjes@yale.edu --- (203) 432-0953 --- ICQ # - 905818 ! -----Original Message----- ! From: Dave McGuire [mailto:mcguire@neurotica.com] ! Sent: Wednesday, December 26, 2001 3:41 PM ! To: classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org (E-mail); NetBSD/Vax Mail List (E-mail) ! Subject: Re: FW: VAX 3900 Free to Good Home ! ! ! ! *sigh*, this has to happen a month and a half after I move out of ! Laurel... :-( ! ! -Dave ! ! On December 26, David Woyciesjes wrote: ! > I'm sure someone here would want this... ! > ! > Subject: VAX 3900 Free to Good Home ! > Date: Tue, 25 Dec 2001 22:40:56 -0500 ! > From: Chuck McCrobie <mccrobie(a)cablespeed.com> ! > Organization: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com ! > Newsgroups: comp.os.vms, comp.sys.dec ! > ! > As a testament to Digitial engineering, I have a VAX 3900 ! that's been ! > sitting in my garage for 3 1/2 years that just booted up! ! > ! > CONDITIONS: ! > ! > Machine must be picked up in its entirety - ALL OR NOTHING ! > Local pickup only - I don't want to ship this beast ! > ! > LOCATION: ! > ! > Laurel, MD 20724 ! > ! > You will need a large sedan, pickup, or similar vehicle. ! The external ! > frame has been modified to come apart, so loading it will be easy. ! > ! > PARTICULARS: ! > ! > VAX 3900 - CPU - (Big cabinet) KA655-AA (M7625-AA) ! > 32 MB RAM - MEMORY - MS650-BA (M7622-A) ! > DESQA-SA - Ethernet - (M3127-PA) ! > CXY08-M - 8 line Terminal controller - (M3119-YA) ! > USD 1108 QBUS->SCSI Controller - in passthrough mode ! > * This is a NON-DISCONNECTING controller - yes, I ! have the manual! ! > TQK70 - tape controller - (M7559-00) ! > * DRIVE IS _BROKEN_ ! > KDA50 - disk controller - (M7164-00 & M7165-00) ! > CMD 200 TM QBUS->SCSI Controller ! > * Yes, I have the manual ! > RA90 Drive (1.2GB) - Big and slow, but after 3 1/2 years idle time, ! > still works ! > TK70 - tape drive - BROKEN ! > ! > NOTES: ! > ! > The CMD 200 TM recognized a newer SCSI CD-ROM and booted ! VMS 7.1 install ! > kit. ! > ! > Machine currently boots VMS 5.5-2. ! > ! > CXY08 and DESQA have NOT been tested, but were working. ! > ! > ! > --- David A Woyciesjes ! > --- C & IS Support Specialist ! > --- Yale University Press ! > --- mailto:david.woyciesjes@yale.edu ! > --- (203) 432-0953 ! > --- ICQ # - 905818 ! > ! ! -- ! Dave McGuire ! St. Petersburg, FL "Less talk. More synthohol." --Lt. Worf !

23 years, 7 months

3
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Anti-Static Foil?

by rhblakeman＠kih.net

I do it all of the time, works fine. Stuff with onboard batteries it might hurt though if the battery is left in, so I put a sheet of thin cardboard across the bottom on the board (solder side) ---------- Original Message ---------------------------------- From: Doc Shipley <doc(a)mdrconsult.com> Reply-To: classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org Date: Wed, 26 Dec 2001 17:17:54 -0600 (CST) >Hi. > I think I've made a trade for a CPU, memory, and a graphics board for >the ex-MVII in the garage. The guy daid that he doesn't have anti-static >bags to ship the boards in, and asked if I thought wrapping them in >aluminum foil would do. > Any suggestions? > > Doc > >

23 years, 7 months

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Anti-Static Foil?

by doc＠mdrconsult.com

Hi. I think I've made a trade for a CPU, memory, and a graphics board for the ex-MVII in the garage. The guy daid that he doesn't have anti-static bags to ship the boards in, and asked if I thought wrapping them in aluminum foil would do. Any suggestions? Doc

23 years, 7 months

4
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720k floppy

by Robert_Feldman＠jdedwards.com

I've located 35 disks. Do you want them? -----Original Message----- From: Golemancd(a)aol.com [mailto:Golemancd@aol.com] Sent: Sunday, December 23, 2001 6:07 PM To: classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org Subject: 720k floppy anyone know where i can find some 720k floppies thanks Joee

23 years, 7 months

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Old issues of MacWeek

by vcf＠vintage.org

Does anyone have old issues of MacWeek they'd like to get rid of? Sellam Ismail Vintage Computer Festival ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ International Man of Intrigue and Danger http://www.vintage.org * Old computing resources for business and academia at www.VintageTech.com *

23 years, 7 months

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I'm back!!!!

by mcguire＠neurotica.com

On December 23, Ernest wrote: > Well, there were suddenly 37 active connections all trying to get it. Ouch. > No wonder it bombed on you. Keep trying if you get a server busy error. The > activity should slow down. > > Comments on the site, anyone? Cool stuff! -Dave -- Dave McGuire St. Petersburg, FL "Less talk. More synthohol." --Lt. Worf

23 years, 7 months

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Happy Holidays!

by mcguire＠neurotica.com

On December 26, Jochen Kunz wrote: > > Of course I enjoy doing that, which is why I was doing it. But it's > > also what I do most of the other days in the year, so it's hardly a > > holiday ;-) > May I call you a geek? ;-) > > BTW: I earn my mony as a programmer and what do I do for my private > enjoinment this days: I am porting (OK, trying to port) pdksh-5.2.14 to > 2.11BSD on my PDP11/73... ;-) Woohoo! And WHO is a geek here? ;) -Dave -- Dave McGuire St. Petersburg, FL "Less talk. More synthohol." --Lt. Worf

23 years, 7 months

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FW: VAX 3900 Free to Good Home

by DAW＠yalepress3.unipress.yale.edu

I'm sure someone here would want this... Subject: VAX 3900 Free to Good Home Date: Tue, 25 Dec 2001 22:40:56 -0500 From: Chuck McCrobie <mccrobie(a)cablespeed.com> Organization: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com Newsgroups: comp.os.vms, comp.sys.dec As a testament to Digitial engineering, I have a VAX 3900 that's been sitting in my garage for 3 1/2 years that just booted up! CONDITIONS: Machine must be picked up in its entirety - ALL OR NOTHING Local pickup only - I don't want to ship this beast LOCATION: Laurel, MD 20724 You will need a large sedan, pickup, or similar vehicle. The external frame has been modified to come apart, so loading it will be easy. PARTICULARS: VAX 3900 - CPU - (Big cabinet) KA655-AA (M7625-AA) 32 MB RAM - MEMORY - MS650-BA (M7622-A) DESQA-SA - Ethernet - (M3127-PA) CXY08-M - 8 line Terminal controller - (M3119-YA) USD 1108 QBUS->SCSI Controller - in passthrough mode * This is a NON-DISCONNECTING controller - yes, I have the manual! TQK70 - tape controller - (M7559-00) * DRIVE IS _BROKEN_ KDA50 - disk controller - (M7164-00 & M7165-00) CMD 200 TM QBUS->SCSI Controller * Yes, I have the manual RA90 Drive (1.2GB) - Big and slow, but after 3 1/2 years idle time, still works TK70 - tape drive - BROKEN NOTES: The CMD 200 TM recognized a newer SCSI CD-ROM and booted VMS 7.1 install kit. Machine currently boots VMS 5.5-2. CXY08 and DESQA have NOT been tested, but were working. --- David A Woyciesjes --- C & IS Support Specialist --- Yale University Press --- mailto:david.woyciesjes@yale.edu --- (203) 432-0953 --- ICQ # - 905818

23 years, 7 months

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FW: VAX 3900 Free to Good Home

by mcguire＠neurotica.com

*sigh*, this has to happen a month and a half after I move out of Laurel... :-( -Dave On December 26, David Woyciesjes wrote: > I'm sure someone here would want this... > > Subject: VAX 3900 Free to Good Home > Date: Tue, 25 Dec 2001 22:40:56 -0500 > From: Chuck McCrobie <mccrobie(a)cablespeed.com> > Organization: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com > Newsgroups: comp.os.vms, comp.sys.dec > > As a testament to Digitial engineering, I have a VAX 3900 that's been > sitting in my garage for 3 1/2 years that just booted up! > > CONDITIONS: > > Machine must be picked up in its entirety - ALL OR NOTHING > Local pickup only - I don't want to ship this beast > > LOCATION: > > Laurel, MD 20724 > > You will need a large sedan, pickup, or similar vehicle. The external > frame has been modified to come apart, so loading it will be easy. > > PARTICULARS: > > VAX 3900 - CPU - (Big cabinet) KA655-AA (M7625-AA) > 32 MB RAM - MEMORY - MS650-BA (M7622-A) > DESQA-SA - Ethernet - (M3127-PA) > CXY08-M - 8 line Terminal controller - (M3119-YA) > USD 1108 QBUS->SCSI Controller - in passthrough mode > * This is a NON-DISCONNECTING controller - yes, I have the manual! > TQK70 - tape controller - (M7559-00) > * DRIVE IS _BROKEN_ > KDA50 - disk controller - (M7164-00 & M7165-00) > CMD 200 TM QBUS->SCSI Controller > * Yes, I have the manual > RA90 Drive (1.2GB) - Big and slow, but after 3 1/2 years idle time, > still works > TK70 - tape drive - BROKEN > > NOTES: > > The CMD 200 TM recognized a newer SCSI CD-ROM and booted VMS 7.1 install > kit. > > Machine currently boots VMS 5.5-2. > > CXY08 and DESQA have NOT been tested, but were working. > > > --- David A Woyciesjes > --- C & IS Support Specialist > --- Yale University Press > --- mailto:david.woyciesjes@yale.edu > --- (203) 432-0953 > --- ICQ # - 905818 > -- Dave McGuire St. Petersburg, FL "Less talk. More synthohol." --Lt. Worf

23 years, 7 months

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Wanted DEC VT1200 mouse and cable

by pechter＠bg-tc-ppp1341.monmouth.com

I'm looking for the following. The cable that goes between the DEC VT1200 (looks like an N connector) and their monochrome video monitors like a vt262 and a DEC VSXXX-AA mouse. I've got a working VT1200 minus mouse and video cable. I was going to cobble one up with some RG6 and a BNC connector and an N connector (if that's really an N connector) but I'd really rather find the right cable and spend more time enjoying the toy rather than fixing it. Bill -- d|i|g|i|t|a|l had it THEN. Don't you wish you could still buy it now! bpechter@shell.monmouth.com|pechter@ureach.com

23 years, 7 months

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PDP8/A memory problems, what to do?

by gunther＠aurora.regenstrief.org

[For once I did not crosspost and now PDP-8 Lovers list is not working right, so it goes to classiccmp again.] Hi, after dishwashing I reassembled my "new" PDP8/A and it's working again, after David Gesswein hinted me to the programmers console quick reference, I was able to enter my first manually assembled programs and it's indeed working! I must say that I never thought I would ever manually assemble a machine program, but with the PDP8 it's remarkably easy. My first PDP-8 program is a memory test, and I was glad I did it because I found a problem. My test goes through all memory fields and writes into each cell its address in the field. Then it reads that address out of each field again and so finds problems. I have 3 16k words boards and one 8k word board. Two of the 16k boards are good but both seem to want to play the role of the lower fields 0 to 3. The third 16k board plays the high fields 4 to 7, but it has a systematic error masking out bits 6 and 7. All data X I write into it is read as X AND 7717. The 8k board has a similar bit mask error, it's mask is 6777. Is this a fatal problem or can one fix it by cleaning some contacts or redo some crummy soldering? I assume the core mats are all fine, because they would not just lose a few columns of data bits, right? I also assume that others had to deal with similar issues, because apparently such errors are not uncommon. What's the trick? (I did swap them into various backplane slots, just to make sure it's not just a gap in the data bus lines. ... BTW, does the OMNIBUS need something like grant continuity cards for intermittent empty slots?) thanks for your advice, -Gunther PS, just to show off (and to save this stuff from my hand- written notes) here's my program. It's ugly spaghetti code with quirks because I had to modify it at the console (remember: never start coding without having done your work on paper :-) I now understand much better :-) I'm not sure I have the symbolic assembly language right, I may use some things (like the Z modifier for zero-page addressing) that is not standard but helps me code right. 0020 0000 LOC , 0 TESTED MEMORY LOCATION 0021 0000 FLD , 0 TESTED FIELD NUMBER WRITE LOOP 0200 7200 CLA A = 0 0201 1254 TAD FLDINI A += FLDINI 0202 3021 DCA Z FLD FLD = A; A = 0 0203 1257 TAD LOCINI A += LOCINI 0204 3020 DCA Z LOC LOC = A; A = 0 0205 1020 WRLOOP, TAD Z LOC A += LOC 0206 3420 DCA IZ LOC *LOC = A; A = 0 0207 2020 ISZ Z LOC IF(++LOC == 0) 0210 5205 JMP WRLOOP ELSE GOTO WRLOOP 0211 4234 IFRET, JMS INCFLD THEN A = INCFLD() 0212 7450 SNA IF(A != 0) 0213 5205 JMP WRLOOP ELSE GOTO WRLOOP /*FALLTHROUGH*/ READ/CHECK LOOP 0214 7200 CLA A = 0 0215 1254 TAD FLDINI A += FLDINI 0216 3021 DCA Z FLD FLD = A; A = 0 0217 1257 TAD LOCINI A += LOCINI 0220 3020 DCA Z LOC LOC = A; A = 0 0221 1020 RDLOOP, TAD Z LOC A += LOC 0222 7041 CIA A = -A 0223 1420 TAD IZ LOC A += *LOC 0224 7440 SZA IF(A != 0) 0225 7402 ERROR, HLT ELSE HALT 0226 2020 ISZ Z LOC THEN IF(++LOC == 0) 0227 5221 JMP RDLOOP ELSE GOTO RDLOOP 0230 4234 JMS INCFLD THEN A = INCFLD() 0231 7450 SNA IF(A != 0) 0232 5221 JMP RDLOOP ELSE GOTO RDLOOP 0233 7402 OK, HLT THEN HALT INCREASE DATA FIELD SUBROUTINE returns 0 if success resets field to 0 and returns -1 if overflow 0234 0000 INCFLD, 0 0235 2021 ISZ Z FLD IF(++FLD == 0) 0236 7300 CLA CLL ELSE { A = 0; L = 0 } 0237 1021 TAD Z FLD THEN A += FLD 0240 7047 CIA A = -A 0241 1255 TAD FLDMAX A += FLDMAX 0242 7510 SPA IF(A >= 0) 0243 5261 JMP RSTFLD ELSE GOTO RSTFLD 0244 7300 CLA CLL THEN { A = 0; L = 0 } 0245 1021 TAD Z FLD A += FLD 0246 7006 RAL 2 A <<= 2 0247 7004 RAL A <<= 1 0250 1260 TAD CDFTMP A += CDFTMP 0251 3252 DCA CDFDO CDFDO = A; A = 0 0252 0000 CDFDO, 0 0253 5634 JMP I INCFLD RETURN INITIALIZATION VALUES 0254 0000 FLDINI, 0 0255 0007 FLDMAX, 7 0256 0257 0300 LOCINI, 0300 0260 6201 CDFTMP, CDF RESET THE MEMORY FIELD BACK TO 0 assert A == -1 0261 7000 RSTFLD, NOP 0262 1254 TAD FLDINI A += FLDINI 0263 3021 DCA Z FLD FLD = A; A = 0 0264 4234 JMS INCFLD A = INCFLD() 0265 7040 CMA A ~= A 0266 5212 JMP IFRET GOTO IFRET -- Gunther Schadow, M.D., Ph.D. gschadow(a)regenstrief.org Medical Information Scientist Regenstrief Institute for Health Care Adjunct Assistant Professor Indiana University School of Medicine tel:1(317)630-7960 http://aurora.regenstrief.org

23 years, 7 months

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Semi-OT: 32Mb SO-DIMMs available

by erd_6502＠yahoo.com

I thought I'd give folks a chance on these before I took them back. I bought them labelled "SO-DIMMs for older Dell Laptops" - apparently, my laptop is too old. What I have in my Latitude LM are what I think of as SO-DIMMs - 36-pins, double-sided, no keying groove. What I have appears to be for a Latitude CP machine. It _does_ have a keying groove and a lot more pins... more than double. One of these is new in the package, one has been opened (before I got them). The part numbers on the DRAMs is D42S65165G5-A60-7JF. The CDW part number is 118982, the Visiontek part number appears to be 54073.0 If anyone is interested in a pair of 32Mb SO-DIMMs, contact me off-list at ethan_dicks(a)yahoo.com. If there's no interest, I can take them back, but they'll hit me for a 10% restocking fee. -ethan __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Send your FREE holiday greetings online! http://greetings.yahoo.com

23 years, 7 months

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[geeks] IBM RS/6000 7012-3XX

by csmith＠amdocs.com

> -----Original Message----- > From: Doc [mailto:doc@mdrconsult.com] > Either have a key or "mknod /dev/big_screwdriver" and be handy with a > soldering iron. The key not only locks the cabinet, but controls the > boot sequence. You need it. I imagine one could fit a switch in place of the keylock, if you really want. > Some things you will want to consider. > The 320 & 32h need proprietary serial cables. I can supply pinouts. > They, as well as a few others, also have a proprietary external SCSI > interface. It looks like a 68-pin connector, but it's not. Reminds me of the interface on the MicroVAX 3100 machines, which also looks like a 68-pin connector, and it is(!), but it's a SCSI-1 interface. Regards, Chris Christopher Smith, Perl Developer Amdocs - Champaign, IL /usr/bin/perl -e ' print((~"\x95\xc4\xe3"^"Just Another Perl Hacker.")."\x08!\n"); '

23 years, 7 months

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I'm back!!!!

by mcguire＠neurotica.com

On December 26, Christopher Smith wrote: > > I think this is less of a pro-Linux issue and more of a > > use-the-right-tool-for-the-job issue, which sure as hell ain't Windows > > if you want to put stuff on the web. > > Then again, when is windows the right tool for the job? (Unless you want to > orchestrate a cruel practical joke...) Hmm. It's the right tool if you want to put on a tie, be a "team player", use the word "key" a lot (and not meaning a piece of metal with "XX2247" stamped on it), and pretend to be indespensible while collecting a huge salary for little or no real work. ;) -Dave -- Dave McGuire St. Petersburg, FL "Less talk. More synthohol." --Lt. Worf

23 years, 7 months

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I'm back!!!!

by csmith＠amdocs.com

> -----Original Message----- > From: Dave McGuire [mailto:mcguire@neurotica.com] > I think this is less of a pro-Linux issue and more of a > use-the-right-tool-for-the-job issue, which sure as hell ain't Windows > if you want to put stuff on the web. Then again, when is windows the right tool for the job? (Unless you want to orchestrate a cruel practical joke...) Regards, Chris Christopher Smith, Perl Developer Amdocs - Champaign, IL /usr/bin/perl -e ' print((~"\x95\xc4\xe3"^"Just Another Perl Hacker.")."\x08!\n"); '

23 years, 7 months

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More... Re: VS4000 hardware questions

by csmith＠amdocs.com

> -----Original Message----- > From: UberTechnoid(a)Home.com [mailto:UberTechnoid@Home.com] > Help does nothing really useful. What I'd like to know for > instance, is > how do I set the vax to do an unattended boot. It has been > stuck at a two > stage boot since before I even got an OS on it. It powers > on, self-tests, > boots to a second-level CLI, I type C for Continue and there we go. Actually that's probably a problem with your default boot options. Those are AFAIK unique depending on the system you're booting, and as such ought to be handled in the O/S documentation. > A prom manual would tell me how to get rid of the second-level cli. See above -- I'm not so sure. :) All else aside, though, you may consider checking the values of all the built-in variables for obvious problems. Regards, Chris Christopher Smith, Perl Developer Amdocs - Champaign, IL /usr/bin/perl -e ' print((~"\x95\xc4\xe3"^"Just Another Perl Hacker.")."\x08!\n"); '

23 years, 7 months

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More... Re: VS4000 hardware questions

by csmith＠amdocs.com

> -----Original Message----- > From: UberTechnoid(a)Home.com [mailto:UberTechnoid@Home.com] > Good luck! I can't even find a PROM command manual for the > thing. Come > to mention it, DOES anyone have a prom command listing for > the vs400/60 > and/or the Sparcstation 4/330 (sun4)? I have a Sun SBUS development kit which contains (among other things) a quick-reference card which lists most OpenBoot monitor commands, and a full (realatively large, and I'd rather not copy the whole deal if I can help it. :) forth-like-monitor-language reference manual. As for the VAX, I have no reference, but the 4000s were new enough to support the "help" command. :) Regards, Chris Christopher Smith, Perl Developer Amdocs - Champaign, IL /usr/bin/perl -e ' print((~"\x95\xc4\xe3"^"Just Another Perl Hacker.")."\x08!\n"); '

23 years, 7 months

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What did you ask "Santa" for this year.... : )

by csmith＠amdocs.com

> -----Original Message----- > From: James L. Rice [mailto:jrice@texoma.net] > You are lucky. I changed from Wife 1.0 who hated technology and > computers to Wife 2.0 who is an avid user (even if I can't > get her off > M$ products) and not only tolerates my collection but encourages it. > She is the contributer of the second cube as well as the NeXT Color > Printer. The change over from version 1.0 to 2.0 was very expensive > ...in fact so expensive that I would hesitate to do it again. On the other hand, your current wife device seems very well-behaved, so I'd not see why you should change again. ;) It's difficult to find one that will maintain stability with even a nominally normal relationship signal at any rate, and you're better off sticking with what works. It helps, of course, if you can handle the PayAttentionToME signals in real-time. Regards, Chris Christopher Smith, Perl Developer Amdocs - Champaign, IL /usr/bin/perl -e ' print((~"\x95\xc4\xe3"^"Just Another Perl Hacker.")."\x08!\n"); '

23 years, 7 months

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PDP11

by r_beaudry＠hotmail.com

Did anyone snag this?? (see below...). I haven't caught up on my digest reading .... This is about 1/2 hour from me, straight shot down Route 2. My wife would divorce me if I took it, but I'd LOVE to help rescue it for someone else... And I own a pickup w/ a cover... Rich B. ----------------------------- From: "Thomas R. Fitch" <tfitch(a)esleeck.com> To: "'mrbill(a)pdp11.org'" <mrbill(a)pdp11.org> Subject: PDP11 Date: Fri, 21 Dec 2001 15:19:23 -0500 Mr. Bill, I have a PDP11 in two towers, with 2 crt's and keyboards, and a keyboard printer. All in excellent condition. I also have all of the original documentation. This product is available for pickup from our Turners Falls, MA location. Please contact me if you have any interest. Tom Fitch, Treasurer Esleeck Manufacturing Company 36 Canal Road Turners Falls, MA 01376 (413) 863-4326 ext 206

23 years, 7 months

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Good way to archive system disks

by dmabry＠mich.com

I'd like to create some archives of system diskettes for older machines, cp/m machines that use 5 1/4" 96 tpi double sided diskettes and 8" diskettes. What is a good way to do that? I've looked into Teledisk but that assumes that you can read the actual diskettes on a PC which I can't. Any suggestions? Thanks. -- Dave Mabry dmabry(a)mich.com Dossin Museum Underwater Research Team NACD #2093

23 years, 7 months

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Source for Osborne documentation?

by gibbsjj＠u.washington.edu

Hi all, I am looking for the original Osborne 1 and Osborne Executive documentation... any suggestions? A copy would be fine. A scanned copy would be even better. Is there an online archive of scanned documentation somewhere? Thanks. Josh

23 years, 7 months

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Merry Christmas Everyone!!!!

by fernande＠internet1.net

I didn't even realize it was past 12:00 until just now...... I'm busy wrapping presents :-) I've been working on a 486 for the last few days. I'm trying to get a few stagnant projects going. Dumb things freezes on me..... will write more later. Finally snowed too! Merry Christmas!! Chad Fernandez Michigan, USA

23 years, 7 months

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Merry Christmas Everyone!!!!

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

I have a AMD5x86/133 that runs linux Xwin rather well in 16mb ram. I've run it on 486dx66 with 20mb ram and it's decent. Allison -----Original Message----- From: Tothwolf <tothwolf(a)concentric.net> To: classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org <classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org> Date: Tuesday, December 25, 2001 7:54 PM Subject: Re: Merry Christmas Everyone!!!! >On Tue, 25 Dec 2001, Ben Franchuk wrote: > >> A 486 makes a nice Linux box providing you don't run X-windows. > >A 486 with 32-64mb of ram will run X fine, but it's still a little slow >for cpu intensive processes (netscape, mozilla, gimp...). These machines >also make excellent X terminals, provided they have a fairly decent video >card. My personal favorites tend to be old Diamond Viper and Stealth VLB >cards with 2mb of video ram. > >-Toth >

23 years, 7 months

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HP 1000/E

by steven_j_robertson＠hotmail.com

>The time base generator boards are very simple, that accept a 3-bit >value >and will set their I/O flag bit after the selected time period, >which can >be 10 sec, 1 sec, 0.1 sec, 0.01 sec, etc. > >Usually the TBG board is installed in slot 10. I found the manuals for the TBG on www.spies.com/~AEK . Haven't messed with that board yet but, shouldn't have too much trouble using it. >You also have a HS Terminal board. Excellent, these are slightly >rare. >This is a serial port board that will run up to a maximm of >2400 baud, and >it is compatible with HP Basic. Normally these use a >current loop >interface, but a simple modification to the I/O cable >(inside the hood >that connects to the PCB) will give you RS-232 I/O. >I can supply all the >info you need for this. As with the TBG board, I found the manuals for this board. There are several code samples with the manuals and on Jeff's site but, so far I can't get it to work. I didn't realize the cable had to be changed for RS232. If you have the pin outs, that'd be cool. I don't have the code in front of me but, unless I'm mistaken, it just continously loops when checking the status. Not sure if this could be caused by the cabling differences or not. ... SFS 10 JMP *-1 ... NOTE: This is the only I/O card in the box so, I assumed it had to go in slot "10". If you can provide a short routine to send a single character to the console, that'd eliminate one of the variables (me). >Oh yes, your going to have to use a terminal with 2400 baud, 7 data > > >bits, space parity, and 2 stop bits. Hyperterminal works just fine >for >this. No problem. Got plenty of dumb terminals laying around. >The microcircuit interface boards are very valuable. You will want >to use >one of these as your reader-emulator interface. I'll need to >know if they >are '+ True' or 'GND true' boards, the differance being >true or inverting >cable drivers. We'll get to that a little later :-) >As for the 55613 GMR-1 board, I have no idea on this item. I'm >stumped, >and thats not too easy. Its not listed in my HP interface >manuals. >(to test a HP 1000 CPU, set the A register to 100000 octal, set the P > >register to 000000 and open the front panel. Switch the Lock/Operate > >switch to Lock, then press Was able to locate the DOCS for the ROM on the /~AEK/ site and ran the diagnostics (as indicated above). Everything checks out OK. >The Natel 2101 R/D converter also stumps me, is this a third party >I/O >board? >From the research I've done, it appears that "R/D Converter" indicates a "Resolver to Data converter. It was probably used in a some kinda robotic or motion controller application. >Now then, a tape reader emulator... > >My emulator uses a PIC 16C65A to talk to the microcircuit interface >board, >and a bank of EPROMs that hold images of the paper tapes. I >also have >modes to read from a generic paper tape reader, or from an >application >running on a PC (PC application not working yet). >If all you need is to boot HP Basic, I can build you a simple >version of >the emulator, or simply send you schematics and >pre-programmed PIC and >EPROM chips, at your preferance. Hmm... Once I get the system talking to a serial interface, I'll investigate further. From what I understand, the TAPE READER protocol is pretty simple so, I may be able to hack something together. I'll let you know when I get this far. >If these systems have the HP 7970E tape drive, thats a sturdy, >reliable >tape drive that is not too hard to get running with simple >assembly >language programs. I have one, and would reccomend it to >any HP >collector. Nothing says vintage like spinning mag tape and >blinking >lights! I have several HP 7978 (HP-IB) tape drives that I use on my "classic" 3000s and 9000 HP-UX boxes. Those are really sweet drives! Not sure if they're compatible with the 1000 or not? >Lastly, if you have any interest in assembly language programming on >your >HP machine, I can email you a DOS executable version of the >original HP >assembler. Downloaded the assembler (hpasm.c) from Jeff's site. Had no problem compiling or running it on my 9000. I've been using it while trying to get the serial interface going. Also downloaded the e21.c emulator but, wouldn't build on my box. --- /usr/ccs/bin/ld: Unsatisfied symbols: kbhit (code) --- Really haven't had time to investigate. Thanks again, SteveRob _________________________________________________________________ MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx

23 years, 7 months

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PALs (was Re: MITS 2SIO serial chip?)

by ajp166＠bellatlantic.net

I have read it, it's on my bookshelf. PALs were still just starting to be seriously used in the very late 70s with an increase into the 80s, it was the cost vs board real estate vs reliability issue. The testability/reliability issues took a few years to gain engineers confidence. Allison -----Original Message----- From: Pete Turnbull <pete(a)dunnington.u-net.com> To: classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org <classiccmp(a)classiccmp.org> Date: Tuesday, December 25, 2001 9:05 PM Subject: Re: PALs (was Re: MITS 2SIO serial chip?) >On Dec 25, 12:22, Ethan Dicks wrote: >> --- ajp166 <ajp166(a)bellatlantic.net> wrote: >> > -----Original Message----- >> > From: Ben Franchuk <bfranchuk(a)jetnet.ab.ca> >> > >> Sure its trivial to do now but we were talking 1981 when PALS were >> > >> expensive. >> > >> It depends on what your limited resource is and how costly _that_ is. >> ISTR PALs were $2-$10 each c. 1981-1982. If someone remembers >differently, >> please supply more accurage data. Yes, a single PAL cost more than >several >> TTL popcorn chips, but given how much you could fold into a single PAL in >> the way of I/O select logic (a common use on the board I first >encountered >> PALs on), it wasn't so expensive then. >> >> > Yes, they were compared to random logic, but if board space was costly >> > they were cheaper. >> >> Or if board space was a fixed resource, then it's doubly costly. The >> oldest example I can cite from personal experience is the COMBOARD-I >> to COMBOARD-II design. Both were early examples of 68000 designs (an >> intellegent Unibus serial periperal)... one with SRAM (2114s) and TTL >> logic, the other with DRAMs and PALs. One similarity - about 1.5 sq ft. >> of board space to cram in a CPU, RAM, support logic, a sync serial port >> (based on the COM5025) a parallel port and Unibus DMA logic. >> >> In 1981, our designers went with older tech, but the DMA engine was >> horribly complicated from the standpoint of the 68000, but it was in part >> because there wasn't enough room on the board for a better design with >> TTL. The second revision (c. 1983-1984) had more onboard I/O, and >> implemented the DMA engine as a bank of shared memory to the 68000 (i.e., >> read/write to a certain range of memory from your code and it >automatically >> generates a Unibus DMA cycle - most cool). I don't know for a fact, but >> from what I remember about the designs, I don't think a shared-memory DMA >> engine would have fit on a Unibus board if it had been made out of >popcorn >> logic. >> >> > >I never heard about pal's until about 1990... >> > >> > PALS are 1970s technology, really old to some of us. >> >> I didn't see PALs in use until the early 1980s. Yes, I know they came >> out in 1978, but products designed with them didn't hit right away. > >You should read Tracy Kidder's book, The Soul of a New Machine. It >describes the design of the Eagle inside Data General from early 1978 to >early 1980, and mentions PALs a lot. > >-- >Pete Peter Turnbull > Network Manager > University of York

23 years, 7 months

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PALs (was Re: MITS 2SIO serial chip?)

by pete＠dunnington.u-net.com

On Dec 25, 12:22, Ethan Dicks wrote: > --- ajp166 <ajp166(a)bellatlantic.net> wrote: > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Ben Franchuk <bfranchuk(a)jetnet.ab.ca> > > >> Sure its trivial to do now but we were talking 1981 when PALS were > > >> expensive. > > > It depends on what your limited resource is and how costly _that_ is. > ISTR PALs were $2-$10 each c. 1981-1982. If someone remembers differently, > please supply more accurage data. Yes, a single PAL cost more than several > TTL popcorn chips, but given how much you could fold into a single PAL in > the way of I/O select logic (a common use on the board I first encountered > PALs on), it wasn't so expensive then. > > > Yes, they were compared to random logic, but if board space was costly > > they were cheaper. > > Or if board space was a fixed resource, then it's doubly costly. The > oldest example I can cite from personal experience is the COMBOARD-I > to COMBOARD-II design. Both were early examples of 68000 designs (an > intellegent Unibus serial periperal)... one with SRAM (2114s) and TTL > logic, the other with DRAMs and PALs. One similarity - about 1.5 sq ft. > of board space to cram in a CPU, RAM, support logic, a sync serial port > (based on the COM5025) a parallel port and Unibus DMA logic. > > In 1981, our designers went with older tech, but the DMA engine was > horribly complicated from the standpoint of the 68000, but it was in part > because there wasn't enough room on the board for a better design with > TTL. The second revision (c. 1983-1984) had more onboard I/O, and > implemented the DMA engine as a bank of shared memory to the 68000 (i.e., > read/write to a certain range of memory from your code and it automatically > generates a Unibus DMA cycle - most cool). I don't know for a fact, but > from what I remember about the designs, I don't think a shared-memory DMA > engine would have fit on a Unibus board if it had been made out of popcorn > logic. > > > >I never heard about pal's until about 1990... > > > > PALS are 1970s technology, really old to some of us. > > I didn't see PALs in use until the early 1980s. Yes, I know they came > out in 1978, but products designed with them didn't hit right away. You should read Tracy Kidder's book, The Soul of a New Machine. It describes the design of the Eagle inside Data General from early 1978 to early 1980, and mentions PALs a lot. -- Pete Peter Turnbull Network Manager University of York

23 years, 7 months

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Found today ISD EPROM?

by mcguire＠neurotica.com

On December 21, Tony Duell wrote: > > Today I stopped at a thrift and found a Blue/White metal device made by > > ISD and can't really figure it out. It has a place burn a chip and the > > one in it is ISD 1016 AP; a four inch speaker at the top and on the > > IIRC the ISD... chips were non-volatile, speech-quality audio storage > devices. Not digitised speech, they used different charge levels in > E2PROM-like cells to store analogue qunatities. I've used these chips in a few projects recently. They work very well and are easy to interface to PIC microcontrollers. Definitely neat stuff. I'm surprised they were able to get any sort of amplitude range from those nonvolatile cells, but they seem to have perfected it. -Dave -- Dave McGuire St. Petersburg, FL "Less talk. More synthohol." --Lt. Worf

23 years, 7 months

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Flashing Light Indicators un Simple Front Panels

by mcguire＠neurotica.com

On December 17, UberTechnoid wrote: > My Sparcstation 4/330 has a bank of ten (or so) red leds in a row. These > light in varios patterns to indicate which self test is being conducted at > power on. After this, the leds 'race' back and forth faster or slower > depending on the CPU load. Unfortunately, this cool load meter doesn't work > in netbsd or openbsd, only in Solaris. > > My Vaxstation 4000/60 has an 8 (or so) red led that also posts codes at > power on but nothing else in either vms or in netbsd. > > I recompiled the netbsd 1.5.2 kernel to enable the led on the Sparc.....and > nothing still. > > Why on earth would Sun put a cool set of leds UNDERNEATH the cover? I mean, > you might as well put it out there. The "LEDs on the spine of the board" design goes back to the earlier rackmount chassis, in which one could walk behind the racks and see the LEDs. The NetBSD LED support isn't for those LEDs, if memory serves...I believe it's only for the front panel LED on the SPARCstations, which is also controlled by software. -Dave -- Dave McGuire St. Petersburg, FL "Less talk. More synthohol." --Lt. Worf

23 years, 7 months

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Tinning on old PCBs

by mcguire＠neurotica.com

On December 20, John Lawson wrote: > Just a quick (dumb) question: is this 'tinning' silver? Or Green? In > other words, has the solder itself actually flaked off the trace (meaning > it never bonded in the first place) or has the 'paint' coating called the > solder mask, which is usually green, come off, revealing the trace beneath > it? This very common, and Ethan is right, it should be carefully re-tinned > to avoid long-term corrosion. I have a bottle of this really neat stuff that I bought at Active Electronics when I lived in Maryland. It's a clear liquid that, when brushed or poured over copper, deposits a layer of silvery metal (tin I assume) on the surface of the copper...nearly instantaneously. It just seems to plate out of solution onto the copper. It's most interesting to watch. It was sold with the printed circuit board fabrication materials, obviously intended for post-etching tinning of the remaining copper. I don't quite recall what it was called; it's still packed up from my move. But it was really neat stuff. -Dave PS - Happy holidays to all my fellow classiccmp'ers!! May your days be filled with tons of good food and your nights be filled with blinkenlights and elegant non-x86 instruction sets. -- Dave McGuire St. Petersburg, FL "Less talk. More synthohol." --Lt. Worf

23 years, 7 months

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test-drb December 2001