test-drb May 1997

test-drb@ccmp.vtda.org

79 participants
197 discussions

by jeffh＠eleventh.com

On 10-May-97, classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu wrote: >Just a quickie.... >Have any of you guys ever made your own computers? >This is someting I have been thinking of doing but really don't know where >to start. It doesn't have to be fancy (something with a 8088 or Z80 or >6502 would be fine) So does anyone have any "plans" to make one? There was a book published in the early to mid 80's sometime which went into quite exact detail on designing and building an 8bit microcomputer, using the Z80 I believe. Unfortunately, I don't recall the exact name, and my copy of it was lost years ago. I believe it was something like "Building Your Own Microcomputer" and I thought it was a fascinating book. Anyone else recall this book? Jeff jeffh(a)eleventh.com -- --------------------------------------------------------------------- Sent from an Amiga 3000..the computer for the creative mind! --------------------------------------------------------------------- Collector of classic home computers: Amiga 1000, Atari 800, 800XL, Mega-ST/2 and XE System, Commodore C-128D, Plus/4 and VIC-20, IBM 5155, Kaypro 2X, Osbourne Executive Radofin Aquarius, Sinclair ZX-81, TI-99/4A, Timex-Sinclair 1000, TRS-80 Color Computer-3 and Model 4, plus Atari Superpong and 2600VCS game consoles.

27 years, 7 months

Preserve the other stuff as well Was: Re: yo

by jeffh＠eleventh.com

On 09-May-97, classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu wrote: >Well, as long as we're bragging about out systems, >on my PC I have the following hardware: Actually Tim, I wasn't bragging at all. I was just outlining the system to help illustrate the point being made. Most of my posts to this list tend to be questions since I don't have anywhere near the knowledge that you or Sam or many others seem to, since most of my 8bit experience was with the Timex-Sinclair 1000 and a cassette-based TRS-80 Model III. In fact, it was a full 5 years after getting the T/S-1000 in 1982 before I was able to afford a better system, and it ended up being a Tandy 1000HX in 1987. My interest in these systems is from the standpoint that I'm finally getting the chance to fool with ones I kept reading about, but was never able to buy or use. Jeff jeffh(a)eleventh.com -- --------------------------------------------------------------------- Sent from an Amiga 3000..the computer for the creative mind! --------------------------------------------------------------------- Collector of classic home computers: Amiga 1000, Atari 800, 800XL, Mega-ST/2 and XE System, Commodore C-128D, Plus/4 and VIC-20, IBM 5155, Kaypro 2X, Osbourne Executive Radofin Aquarius, Sinclair ZX-81, TI-99/4A, Timex-Sinclair 1000, TRS-80 Color Computer-3 and Model 4, plus Atari Superpong and 2600VCS game consoles.

27 years, 7 months

Stuff I found, BYTE, collecting, TRON info, Ohio Scientific, etc.

by foxnhare＠goldrush.com

Serves me right for not keeping on top of the list now I have to scan back a few issues and reply to stuff.. :/ But first off I'll add to the 'what I got' discussion: 2 more Atari 800s (folks must be really unloading them, these were $6.00, nut it was Sat, so 1/2 price) both seem to work, GTIA and 48k, no carts in the cart slots though, and (sigh) no power suppllies to be found either. Another place, nine Atari cartridges (no computers to be seen at the store though), all 25 cents each except for the Star Trek S.O.S. which was 45 cents (Not really enthused about it even on the Atari.) But I did get Star Raiders, (yea!) I played the game only once or twice umpteen years back, and it still holds the appeal. Others are Computer Chess, Atari Basic (Rev A), Missile Command (was really impressed by the translation to 8-bit on this), Super Breakout (now, where are all my paddle controllers...), Pac Man, Space Invaders, and Centipede. Makes time fly faster when you don't have a disk drive running (or disks). Been passing up an Exidy Sorceror (checking the net it seems information on it is pretty hard to come by.) $5.00, seems to have been modified with a different power supply (that sticks out the back and has a rather agressive looking heat sink (no to mention the 2" stilts added to the bottom of it) Just saw five Channel F Games ($2.00 each), bowling, target shoot, some breakout clone, card game, and something else that escapes memory, all in original boxes. If those of you are TRULY interested in paying cost plus shipping for any of this stuff, I'll get them next go-around if they are still here. -- Now back to previous messages: > From: Doug Spence <ds_spenc(a)alcor.concordia.ca> > Subject: Re: PET to S100 bus interface > On Tue, 29 Apr 1997, Glenn Roberts wrote: >> fyi, on p. 272 of November '79 Byte: a company called AB Computers offered >> a device called "BETSI", described as a "PET to S-100 Interface & >> Motherboard". cost was $119.... > Thanks for the info! I guess it was a fairly common type of device, then. > I wonder if there are also IBM-PC to S100 interfaces? I think advertising was cheaper then, cause there was alot of goodies that were advertised and I haven't seen all too much of it. ----- From: Captain Napalm <spc(a)armigeron.com> Subject: Re: BYTE Magazines > While I haven't read a Byte magazine in several years, (since the early 90s), > those that I have seen I tend to group into three catagories: > 1. Hobby Era (start of publication to late 83/early 84) These are the best ones, back then BYTE called themselves 'The Small Systems Journal' and everything was worth writing about. > 2. Journal Era (early 84 to late 87/early 88) Trying to be a programmer's/EE resource it seemed to me... Kinda forgot the hobbiests. started to cater to the IBM clone market. > 3. PC Rag Era (early 88 through the 90s) Saw one just the other day, they now have under BYTE: "The Global Authority of Computer Technology" They had their heyday as 'fat IBM magazine,' and are now struggling for an identity again. > My own collection of Byte starts with August of 85 (Amiga 1000 is the >cover story) and ends somewhere in late 89 or early 90. The library at the >university I attended had issues starting from Jan '77 (which I read 8-). >The dates given here are approximate, looking at a Byte from 1980, then 1985 >then 1990 will show almost three different magazines. I have a handfull from the 70s, (maybe back to 75 or 76?) a few from the early 80s and avoided it once they dropped 8-bit information. ---- On starting a newsgroup: Sounds great to me, It would be alot easier to reply to the posts I am replying to, we (Diane and I) get alot of mail as it is and I don't really want to un-digest the list. ---- On Sun, 4 May 1997, Robert Kirk Scott wrote: > I also have begun focusing on the accessories, especially if they are > mint or near it. To me a good user's manual, or a batch of original > software that is still usable is every bit as desirable as a fine old > machine. Mint? I myself collect to use the machines, I try to keep my books in decent shape but they are not even close to mint condition, nor do I consider the condition of something I buy for my collection, as long as it works, it provides information, or is interesting enough to warrant the cost and space it will take up, I'll buy it. Software and Books are a very important part of my collection, they take the computer beyond 'display peice' to actual usability and for me enjoyability. ----- From: Paul E Coad <pcoad(a)crl.com> Subject: Preserve the other stuff as well Was: Re: yo > So what's the point? Preserving the machines is good, but it is only > part of the picture. What is the good of preserving a machine if all > of "culture" that surrounds the machine is lost? So true, my collection is from late 70s through 80s and I try to get a variety of stuff associated with it, fortunately I have disovered old cataloga, price lists and ads beyond the ones in the magazines, and at times I get lucky to find more in the stuff that I get/buy. (a recent quest has been for a good copy of the Pac Man Fever LP, finally got a scratched one...) I would love to get video recordings of the Commodore VIC-20 and 64 commercials (Eveybody now, "I adore my 64, my Commodore 64!") ----- TRON & Last Starfighter... Imaging systems. Being a TRON & Last Starfighter fan, Lemme check my resources... TRON effects were done by different groups, the most notable being MAGI (Mathimatical Applications Group, Inc.) who had just recently created the ray-tracing technique (called SythaVision at the time) for visualizing objects. The other was Triple III. MAGI (ray-tracing) was responsible for the effects up to the Solar sailer, after that it was Triple I (traditional polygon 3-d) who had most of the work for the sailer, MCP, etc. Alot of the work was done on the MAGI computers (in New York) via a Chomatics 9000 terminal. (Well CineFex didn't shed light on the computers themselves...) Ahh my TRON Collector's Edition Book has computers listed! MAGI used a Perkin Elmer System 3420 Computer which features 2 MB RAM and 2 80 MB hard drives and talks to a Celco CFR 4000 computer which is used to generate the pictures onto a monitor (I am quoting here, sounds strange) Triple I uses a Foonley F-I for handling the frame-by frame calculations and the pictures are generated on a PFR recorder... Last Starfighter: Done by Digital Productions which had use of a Cray 1/S and a Cray X-MP Encoding of the gunstars, wire frame previewing and such were on a VAX 11/782. When final animation was generated the Cray X-MP did the job as the VAX could only generate one frame in 16 hours and the Cray could crank one out in 2.5 minutes. The film contained 36,000 frames of imagery. ------- (RE: Patriot Games Effects) > Hardly. I don't know of an operating system that yanks the file contents off > of your screen when someone else on the network deletes them. If I Delete files from someones shared hard drive on a Mac network they'll see the folders and icons dissapear. ------ > Well, something tells me that the cost of the LCD display, however high > it was, would have been peanuts in the prop and special effects budget. Alot of companies deal in product placement (Apple especially) where they are more than happy to loan (or even pay to loan) a movie company some equipment for the background and/or prop in a film. The more their computers are seen being somewhere, or even better, being used the better for sales! Ever see the movie Cloak and Dagger? Atari had quite a product placement hand in that one! If only I had known it was so rare, about a year ago I came across a ][c with the LCD at a thrift store... I can't remember the price though, but usually the stuff they sell is reasonable. ------ From: SUPRDAVE(a)aol.com Subject: Ohio Scientific, anyone? > I thought i'd post about a machine which certainly qualifies to be classic, > an ohio scientific challenger C1P of which i know nothing about. i did get > some extensive documentation with it including a presale brochure, some > photocopied machine language programs, the original reciept dated 20jun1980 > for $425, some info about a d&n micro card which i also got, instructions for > eprom burner software, basic ref manual, and some highly technical info and > board schematics. My brother had an interest in getting a Challenger (no money though), as I remember, there is the Challenger 1P, 2P, 4P, and 8P (8P being big boxes, the rest are within the keyboard enclosure). My brother was interested in the features of the 4P (Of which I can hardly recall, except the graphics set was kinda neat.). ------ Larry Anderson -+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+- Visit our web page at: http://www.goldrush.com/~foxnhare Call our BBS (Silicon Realms BBS 300-2400 baud) at: (209) 754-1363 -+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-

27 years, 7 months

by jeffh＠eleventh.com

On 06-May-97, classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu wrote: >Jay is certainly important, but I'd hesitate at saying he was as >influential as someone like Gary Kildall, Steve Wozniak, or Chuck Peddle. >As much as I love all of the things Jay Miner gave us, there aren't that >many people who were actually aware of his machines, let alone the man >himself. No, he didn't influence a whole 'generation' of computer hobbyist the way CP/M did and such, but he certainly did some interesting things with the hardware! Unfortunately, another computer great that has since passed away. >> >> Out of curiosity, is anyone willing to nominate Jack Tremiel? <sp?> >Uh... not me! But what about Sir Clive Sinclair, and that Tandy guy. :) Hmmmmmm...I can't quite think of the name of the head of Tandy that killed off so many of thier good ideas. They had some interesting machines...and sometimes even rather innovative. Too bad they tended to ship with a lot of the interesting stuff crippled. Sir Clive Sinclair on the other hand gave us the Sinclair series, so he couldn't be all bad. Jeff jeffh(a)eleventh.com -- --------------------------------------------------------------------- Sent from an Amiga 3000..the computer for the creative mind! --------------------------------------------------------------------- Collector of classic home computers: Amiga 1000, Atari 800, 800XL, Mega-ST/2 and XE System, Commodore C-128D, Plus/4 and VIC-20, IBM 5155, Kaypro 2X, Osbourne Executive Radofin Aquarius, Sinclair ZX-81, TI-99/4A, Timex-Sinclair 1000, TRS-80 Color Computer-3 and Model 4, plus Atari Superpong and 2600VCS game consoles.

27 years, 7 months

Replies to stuff...

by zmerch＠northernway.net

Due to massive amounts of caffeine & sleep deprivation, Doug Spence said: >> > Um... hold it... how are the 4116's arranged? You probably said, but of >> > course I can't go back into my mailbox to read that while I'm replying to >> > this one (I knew there was a reason I should my system to do this >> > locally!). If they're 16K by 4, then that certainly WOULD be more than >> > 8K. :) >> >> I think those are only 8kx1. I did look at my expandamem board and the >> chips with the plates on them had (c)Mostek written. > >Actually, I believe the quote you had in your other post said the 4116 was >16k bits... which would make my board 64K, which is too big without some >kind of bank switching scheme, isn't it? Ummmm... methinks your math might be a bit off. 16Kbits would be 2K bytes, so you'd have to have 32 chips on the board to get it to 64Kbytes... how many chips are there on the board? Hope this helps, Roger "Merch" Merchberger -- Roger Merchberger | If at first you don't succeed, Programmer, NorthernWay | nuclear warhead disarmament should zmerch(a)northernway.net | *not* be your first career choice.

27 years, 7 months

PET to S100 bus interface

by groberts＠mitre.org

fyi, on p. 272 of November '79 Byte: a company called AB Computers offered a device called "BETSI", described as a "PET to S-100 Interface & Motherboard". cost was $119. While i'm on that page, the PET was $795 for the entry level system (8K, small keybd, cassette) and on the high end: $1,295 for 32K system with "business" keyboard. A 2040 dual diskette drive (343,000 bytes total) would set you back another $1,295. At 05:23 AM 4/29/97 -0400, you wrote: > >I'd just like to make an update for all who may be interested in that >potential PET to S100 bus device that I had sitting in storage. > >I pulled it out tonight instead of studying for exams, and it is indeed >what was suspected. > >The "motherboard" (if that is the correct term) is a Vector Graphic Inc. >S100 bus board. The RAM board that was being used for the PET, is a >Vector Graphic Inc. 16K Static RAM board with a date of 1977 on it. The >power supply says "KIMSI-PLUS Power Supply" on the back, 1977 from >Forethought Products. > >This is all very wild, because I had no idea there was S100 stuff in this >house. > >Anyway, the really interesting piece of circuitry is the PET to S100 >interface board. It's the same size as the RAM board, and of course plugs >into the S100 bus. At the top of the board is a 50-pin connector that >plugs into a cable, that in turn plugs into the side memory expansion >connector on the PET 2001. > >In white lettering, it says >.----------. >|_| | | |_|| >| | |_| | || (<-- my cheezy attempt at duplicating the company >.----------' logo with ASCII, it's HUH surrounded by a question >.ELECTRONICS mark.) > > S100 MPA > >and etched into the board it says "COPYRIGHT 1978 BY HUH" and "S100 MPA >REV A". > >The board isn't very heavily populated, compared to the RAM board, and >most of the chips are 74LSxx chips. > >Anyone out there know more than I do about this thing? > > >Doug Spence >ds_spenc(a)alcor.concordia.ca > > >

27 years, 7 months

movie computers (The List! )

by ekman＠lysator.liu.se

Captain Napalm wrote thus: > Now, to turn this back to an on-topic thread, the microcomputer used in > "War Games" was one of the last IMSAI's if I recall correctly. And does > anyone know what computers where used for the graphics in "Tron" and "The > Last Starfighter"? Tron was animated by hand. No computers were used, except where you actually see them on the screen. Since I am writing, I thought I might contribute this little piece to the thread: I watched a German soap opera about ten years ago. It was about some hospital and they had a computer, for storing the patient records, I assume. It was a C64, which would not have been impossible at the time, only someone obviously thought it didn't look cool enough just sitting there by itself, so they built it into a wooden panel and added some flashing lights and buttons. /Fredrik

27 years, 7 months

Help Identify Machine

by BigLouS＠aol.com

While prowling around a new thrift store today I came across what may be a computer or it may be a word processor. It had a keyboard, monitor and two 5 1/4" floppies housed in one unit with the floppies mounted vertically and to the right of the monitor, which I estimate was about 12"". The front of the unit was marked GBV( hope I remembered that correctly ) System 9. Does anyone know what it is? I checked the copy of THE LIST that I have and didn't find it. Thanks, Lou

27 years, 7 months

What a weekend...

by jeffh＠eleventh.com

On 12-May-97, classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu wrote: >Was it Memotech? they made all sorts of addons for the ZX81, hi-res >graphics cards, serial and parallel ports and RAM expansion up to, as >far as I can remember, 1Meg!!! BTW, is anyone interested in swapping any >UK Sinclair stuff for a TS1000 or TS2068. I'd love to get either of >these! I have a number of catalogs from Gladstone Electronics which show Memotech products, though none that offer memory expansion that large. They did offer some impressive add-ons for the Timex-Sinclair though! One of the more interesting things they list for Memotech is a real keyboard that plugs into the expansion port, but doesn't inhibit it's use for other addons. Real typewriter keys with atuo-repeat and it was buffered. It lists for $99.95. Your offer for trade for UK stuff makes me wish I had picked up an extra TS1000 a few months ago when I had the chance. I'd love to get my hands on some of the things that are common in the UK but rarely seen over here. Jeff jeffh(a)eleventh.com -- --------------------------------------------------------------------- Sent from an Amiga 3000..the computer for the creative mind! --------------------------------------------------------------------- Collector of classic home computers: Amiga 1000, Atari 800, 800XL, Mega-ST/2 and XE System, Commodore C-128D, Plus/4 and VIC-20, IBM 5155, Kaypro 2X, Osbourne Executive Radofin Aquarius, Sinclair ZX-81, TI-99/4A, Timex-Sinclair 1000, TRS-80 Color Computer-3 and Model 4, plus Atari Superpong and 2600VCS game consoles.

27 years, 7 months

re-found magazines

by jeffh＠eleventh.com

On 12-May-97, classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu wrote: >The other side of the coin, though, is the difficulty of converting >programs >to make them work on your computer. I remember spending a lot of time >in high school, trying to convert TRS-80 and Apple II programs to run on >my TI-99/4A. Fun? Yes. Would I want to do this under deadline pressure? >Probably not. I had a book about 1986 or so that crossreferenced the Basic commands of the popular home computers of the period, such as the Apple II, Commodore's, and the various TRS-80's. It was pretty interesting. I saw mention of a similar book being worked on now that was even greater in scope than this one. It is called something like 'Basref' or some such. I found a web page for it on the Web. That book certainly made the conversion of programs much easier though, even if you did at times need 4-5 statements on one machine to mimic something done on another. Jeff jeffh(a)eleventh.com -- --------------------------------------------------------------------- Sent from an Amiga 3000..the computer for the creative mind! --------------------------------------------------------------------- Collector of classic home computers: Amiga 1000, Atari 800, 800XL, Mega-ST/2 and XE System, Commodore C-128D, Plus/4 and VIC-20, IBM 5155, Kaypro 2X, Osbourne Executive Radofin Aquarius, Sinclair ZX-81, TI-99/4A, Timex-Sinclair 1000, TRS-80 Color Computer-3 and Model 4, plus Atari Superpong and 2600VCS game consoles.

27 years, 7 months

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test-drb May 1997