24 Jan
2023
24 Jan
'23
1:12 p.m.
I've skimmed the thread about making images of floppy disks. I want to
do the reverse.
But I had better explain. There are 2 subsets of computers here. The
larger subset -- all but one of the machines -- are classic computers.
These machines tend to hve real floppy drives and RS232 ports and not
much else.These machines I understand. I have service/technical
manuals. I have schematics. I can generally figure out how to program
them.
The other set contains one machine. A modern-ish (for me) PC laptop.
It has USB ports. It gets me on the internet (it is the only
internet-connected machine at the moment). It does not have floppy
drives [1]. I do have a USB-RS232 interface -- first thing I bought
for it. I have no proper manuals for it. I do not know how to program
it or interface it.
[1] I think I have a USB floppy drive somewhere, but it'll be a
'1.44Mbyte' [2] 3.5" thing. A type of drive conspiculously absent on
my classic machines.
[2] In quotes becuase it is, of course, nothing of the sort. Well, not
unless you believe a megabyte is 1000*1024 bytes.
Given that the floppy disk images are going to come on the latter
machine, what is the easiest way to get them onto real floppy disks
for my classics. I think it's reasonable to assume they'll be FM or
MFM encoded at the standard rates and that I will have drives capable
of handling the disk. FM of couse rules out using some PC disk
controllers.
I do of course have no objections to making stuff, but I'd rather not
start trying to interface a WD2793 to a Raspberry Pi if there's a
standard way to do things.
-tony
24 Jan
24 Jan
1:16 p.m.
On 1/24/2023 12:12 PM, Tony Duell via cctalk wrote:
I've skimmed the thread about making images of
floppy disks. I want to
do the reverse.
Greaseweazle will do this. Use the same HW setup as for imaging,
but
instruct the GW software to write an image to physical disk.
Jim
--
Jim Brain
brain(a)jbrain.com
www.jbrain.com
1:23 p.m.
On Tue, Jan 24, 2023 at 6:16 PM Jim Brain via cctalk
<cctalk(a)classiccmp.org> wrote:
On 1/24/2023 12:12 PM, Tony Duell via cctalk wrote:
From what I understand the Greaseweazle works by measuring the times
between pulses on the Read Data line, So presumably for writing it
outputs a series of pulses with the right spacing.
Does software exist to turn a disk image (as in a ,imd file) into
suitable timing data for this?
-tony
I've skimmed the thread about making images
of floppy disks. I want to
do the reverse.
Greaseweazle will do this. Use the same HW setup as for imaging,
but
instruct the GW software to write an image to physical disk.
Jim
--
Jim Brain
brain(a)jbrain.com
www.jbrain.com
1:46 p.m.
Maybe go another way and use one of those usb disk adapters to copy the hard disks that
can be placed as second disks on the classics and floppies burned from there? Or maybe try
to get a serial/parallel zip drive that works on the classics ?
If the classics support IDE, it should be easy.
Sent from my iPhone
On Jan 24, 2023, at 10:23, Tony Duell via cctalk
<cctalk(a)classiccmp.org> wrote:
On Tue, Jan 24, 2023 at 6:16 PM Jim Brain via cctalk
<cctalk(a)classiccmp.org> wrote:
On 1/24/2023 12:12 PM, Tony Duell via cctalk wrote:
From what I understand the Greaseweazle works by measuring the times
between pulses on the Read Data line, So presumably for writing it
outputs a series of pulses with the right spacing.
Does software exist to turn a disk image (as in a ,imd file) into
suitable timing data for this?
-tony
>
> Jim
>
> --
> Jim Brain
> brain(a)jbrain.com
> www.jbrain.com
I've skimmed the thread about making images
of floppy disks. I want to
do the reverse.
Greaseweazle will do this. Use the same HW setup as for imaging, but
instruct the GW software to write an image to physical disk.
2:46 p.m.
On 1/24/2023 12:23 PM, Tony Duell wrote:
On Tue, Jan 24, 2023 at 6:16 PM Jim Brain via cctalk
<cctalk(a)classiccmp.org> wrote:
Looks like a few tools will do so:
https://forum.vcfed.org/index.php?threads/a-way-to-convert-imd-to-img.12377…
You just need to get the IMD to be an IMG file, and then GW will create
the flux and timing info from that image file.
Jim
On 1/24/2023 12:12 PM, Tony Duell via cctalk
wrote:
From what I
understand the Greaseweazle works by measuring the times
between pulses on the Read Data line, So presumably for writing it
outputs a series of pulses with the right spacing.
Does software exist to turn a disk image (as in a ,imd file) into
suitable timing data for this?
-tony I've skimmed the thread about making images
of floppy disks. I want to
do the reverse.
Greaseweazle will do this. Use the same HW setup as for imaging,
but
instruct the GW software to write an image to physical disk. 
2:52 p.m.
On Tue, Jan 24, 2023 at 11:46 AM Jim Brain via cctalk <cctalk(a)classiccmp.org>
wrote:
Looks like a few tools will do so:
https://forum.vcfed.org/index.php?threads/a-way-to-convert-imd-to-img.12377…
You just need to get the IMD to be an IMG file, and then GW will create
the flux and timing info from that image file.
Jim
disk-utilities supports IMD files in read and write. I thought it was a
pretty core part of GW
(same author).
https://github.com/keirf/Disk-Utilities
4:25 p.m.
On Tue, 24 Jan 2023, Tony Duell via cctalk wrote:
[1] I think I have a USB floppy drive somewhere, but
it'll be a
'1.44Mbyte' [2] 3.5" thing. A type of drive conspiculously absent on
my classic machines.
The first NEC external 3.5" USB drive (UF0001) cabled USB into a normal
765 inside the drive case, connected to a normal 1.4M 3.5" drive!
If you can find one of THOSE, . . .
[2] In quotes becuase it is, of course, nothing of the
sort. Well, not
unless you believe a megabyte is 1000*1024 bytes.
But it is close enough to call it a "1.4M" drive (instead of 1.44)
6:28 p.m.
I know people seemed kind of turned off by the idea of GOTEK floppy disk
emulators,
but you do realize if you actually have the machine you are wanting to
make disks for
the GOTEK is a great way to do it. Put a GOTEK and a real drive on the
machine and just
use backup. Then, for the purists, take the GOTEK back off and hide it
in a drawer.
bill
6:39 p.m.
On 1/24/23 17:28, Bill Gunshannon via cctalk wrote:
I know people seemed kind of turned off by the idea of GOTEK floppy disk
emulators,
but you do realize if you actually have the machine you are wanting to
make disks for
the GOTEK is a great way to do it. Put a GOTEK and a real drive on the
machine and just
use backup. Then, for the purists, take the GOTEK back off and hide it
in a drawer.
This - a gotek and an original-format floppy drive - is my standard
setup for machines that support multiple floppy drives.
I could write a small essay on all the ways this works for me, but
they mostly boil down to one choice.
Sometimes I want the whole experience, complete with noise and
chatter and blinky amber lights, and sometimes I want to just get it
done and move on.
Example: Installing WFW 3.11. Been here, done this, way too many
times. Gotek.
Doc
25 Jan
25 Jan
3:23 a.m.
On Tue, 24 Jan 2023, Bill Gunshannon wrote:
I know people seemed kind of turned off by the idea of
GOTEK floppy disk
emulators, but you do realize if you actually have the machine you are
wanting to make disks for the GOTEK is a great way to do it. Put a
GOTEK and a real drive on the machine and just use backup. Then, for
the purists, take the GOTEK back off and hide it in a drawer.
A fully valid setup.
But for me, I doubt that it would make my life easier because I do have
the means to create standard IBM format floppies on my PC.
I don't know it, but does the GOTEK support raw images with timing, sector
and index information? If it supported e.g. hard sectored non-standard
disk images, then this would definitely catch my attention! :-)
Christian
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days inactive
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9 comments
8 participants
participants (8)
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Bill Gunshannon -
Christian Corti -
Doc Shipley -
Fred Cisin -
Jim Brain -
Tony Duell -
Tony Jones -
Wayne S