22 Mar
2024
22 Mar
'24
1:19 a.m.
I just got a pdp-11 to boot and it seems to have rt-11 installed. How do I do an orderly
shutdown? Google has info on simh but this ain't that.
Thanks!
73 Eugene w2hx
22 Mar
22 Mar
1:23 a.m.
On 3/21/2024 9:19 PM, W2HX via cctalk wrote:
I just got a pdp-11 to boot and it seems to have rt-11
installed. How do I do an orderly shutdown? Google has info on simh but this ain't
that.
Thanks!
73 Eugene w2hx
Turn off the power switch. Unlike most other OSes people here
are familiar with there are no background processes running on
RT-11.
bill
KB3YV
1:35 a.m.
Ok, Bill. Still feels strange. No need to park the HD head either I guess. Please take a
look at this picture. Knowing nothing, I did a .SHOW ALL and this list of JOBs showed up.
Are these not background processes?
https://w2hx.com/x/VintageComp/micropdp/20240321_203329.jpg
Thanks
73 Eugene W2HX
My Youtube Channel: https://www.youtube.com/@w2hx/videos
-----Original Message-----
From: Bill Gunshannon via cctalk <cctalk(a)classiccmp.org>
Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2024 9:23 PM
To: W2HX via cctalk <cctalk(a)classiccmp.org>
Cc: Bill Gunshannon <bill.gunshannon(a)hotmail.com>
Subject: [cctalk] Re: How to shutdown RT11?
On 3/21/2024 9:19 PM, W2HX via cctalk wrote:
I just got a pdp-11 to boot and it seems to have rt-11
installed. How do I do an orderly shutdown? Google has info on simh but this ain't
that.
Thanks!
73 Eugene w2hx
Turn off the power switch. Unlike most other OSes people here are familiar with there are
no background processes running on RT-11.
bill
KB3YV
2:59 p.m.
I make sure that any disk squeeze is complete and other programs are
quiescence.
Then I just halt the processor or emulator.
Jerry
On 3/22/24 8:23 AM, Paul Koning via cctalk wrote:
On Mar 21, 2024, at 9:35 PM, W2HX via
cctalk<cctalk(a)classiccmp.org> wrote:
Ok, Bill. Still feels strange. No need to park the HD head either I guess.
DEC disks do that themselves, at power down.
paul
3:05 p.m.
On Mar 22, 2024, at 10:59 AM, Jerry Weiss
<jsw(a)ieee.org> wrote:
I make sure that any disk squeeze is complete and other programs are quiescence.
Good point -- while the OS doesn't have a shutdown procedure, some application and
utilities don't want to be interrupted in the middle of specific operations, and
"disk squeeze" is one example of that.
The RT11 file system has the nice property that it doesn't mind being interrupted at
any time; there is no such thing as a file system cleanup ("fsck" or the like)
and inherently no need for one.
paul
9:54 p.m.
On Mar 21, 2024, at 6:19 PM, W2HX via cctalk <cctalk(a)classiccmp.org> wrote:
I just got a pdp-11 to boot and it seems to have rt-11 installed. How do I do an orderly
shutdown? Google has info on simh but this ain't that.
Thanks!
73 Eugene w2hx
In this respect it’s similar to many personal computer OS’s of the time frame, in that you
can simply turn it off. It’s a fantastic OS in its simplicity, and a great way to learn
about the PDP-11.
Zane
10 p.m.
On Fri, Mar 22, 2024, 10:54 PM Zane Healy via cctalk <cctalk(a)classiccmp.org
wrote:
On Mar 21, 2024, at 6:19 PM, W2HX via cctalk
<cctalk(a)classiccmp.org
wrote:
Even v7 Unix didn't have halt or reboot.
Warner
I just got a pdp-11 to boot and it seems to have rt-11 installed. How
do I do an orderly shutdown? Google has info on simh but this ain't that.
Thanks!
73 Eugene w2hx
In this respect it’s similar to many personal computer OS’s of the time
frame, in that you can simply turn it off. It’s a fantastic OS in its
simplicity, and a great way to learn about the PDP-11.
10:38 p.m.
On Fri, Mar 22, 2024 at 11:00:25PM +0100, Warner Losh via cctalk wrote:
On Fri, Mar 22, 2024, 10:54 PM Zane Healy via cctalk
<cctalk(a)classiccmp.org>
...
Even v7 Unix didn't have halt or reboot.
sync;sync;sync
power off
I remember it well.
Warner
Diane
--
db(a)FreeBSD.org db(a)db.net http://www.db.net/~db https://ottawa.place/@Dianora
23 Mar
23 Mar
2:53 p.m.
On Mar 22, 2024, at 6:38 PM, Diane Bruce via cctalk
<cctalk(a)classiccmp.org> wrote:
On Fri, Mar 22, 2024 at 11:00:25PM +0100, Warner Losh via cctalk wrote:
Yes. So Unix did have a shutdown procedure, and it was particularly critical to do it and
do it right. I remember when I first heard about Unix, when at the U of Illinois -- some
PDP11s in the Center for Advanced Computation ran it, for their Arpanet connection. The
story was that CAC was a good facility to run Unix because it had very reliable power --
it was built to house Illiac 4 before that machine was moved to a military facility in
response to campus protests. So there was little worry about having to repair the file
system manually after a power failure -- I guess fsck hadn't been created yet, or
perhaps wasn't reliable yet.
paul
On Fri, Mar 22, 2024, 10:54 PM Zane Healy via
cctalk <cctalk(a)classiccmp.org>
...
Even v7 Unix didn't have halt or reboot.
sync;sync;sync
power off
I remember it well. 
3:04 p.m.
On 3/23/24 09:53, Paul Koning via cctalk wrote:
Yes. So Unix did have a shutdown procedure, and it was particularly critical to do it
and do it right. I remember when I first heard about Unix, when at the U of Illinois --
some PDP11s in the Center for Advanced Computation ran it, for their Arpanet connection.
The story was that CAC was a good facility to run Unix because it had very reliable power
-- it was built to house Illiac 4 before that machine was moved to a military facility in
response to campus protests. So there was little worry about having to repair the file
system manually after a power failure -- I guess fsck hadn't been created yet, or
perhaps wasn't reliable yet.
paul
You say that like fsck is reliable now....
Doc
5:07 p.m.
On Mar 23, 2024, at 11:04 AM, Doc Shipley via cctalk
<cctalk(a)classiccmp.org> wrote:
On 3/23/24 09:53, Paul Koning via cctalk wrote:
:-} Then again, mostly it's no longer relevant, given journaled file systems.
paul
Yes. So Unix did have a shutdown procedure, and
it was particularly critical to do it and do it right. I remember when I first heard
about Unix, when at the U of Illinois -- some PDP11s in the Center for Advanced
Computation ran it, for their Arpanet connection. The story was that CAC was a good
facility to run Unix because it had very reliable power -- it was built to house Illiac 4
before that machine was moved to a military facility in response to campus protests. So
there was little worry about having to repair the file system manually after a power
failure -- I guess fsck hadn't been created yet, or perhaps wasn't reliable yet.
paul
You say that like fsck is reliable now.... 
11:29 p.m.
You say that like fsck is reliable now...
There's a reason it's only one letter off.
--
------------------------------------ personal: http://www.cameronkaiser.com/ --
Cameron Kaiser * Floodgap Systems * www.floodgap.com * ckaiser(a)floodgap.com
-- Premature optimization is the root of all evil. -- Donald Knuth ------------
11:35 p.m.
> You say that like fsck is reliable now...
On Sat, 23 Mar 2024, Cameron Kaiser via cctalk wrote:
There's a reason it's only one letter off.
I've always wondered, . . .
"Feature" or "bug"?
Deliberate, or one of possibly many errors in development?
--
Grumpy Ol' Fred cisin(a)xenosoft.com
25 Mar
25 Mar
3:29 p.m.
On Saturday, March 23rd, 2024 at 16:35, Fred Cisin via cctalk
<cctalk(a)classiccmp.org> wrote:
I've always wondered, . . .
"Feature" or "bug"?
Deliberate, or one of possibly many errors in development?
I recall hearing somewhere else.net that it was management forcing
it to be renamed because the original name was "fuck". And technically
it's still supposed to be pronounced that way.
The Doctor [412/724/301/703/415/510]
WWW: https://drwho.virtadpt.net/
Don't be mean. You don't have to be mean.
You say that like fsck is reliable now...
There's a reason it's only one letter off. 
23 Mar
23 Mar
3:25 p.m.
I remember it as kill -9 1 then sync halt
Or sync sync halt
On March 23, 2024 2:53:56 PM GMT, Paul Koning via cctalk <cctalk(a)classiccmp.org>
wrote:
On Mar 22, 2024, at 6:38 PM, Diane Bruce via
cctalk <cctalk(a)classiccmp.org> wrote:
On Fri, Mar 22, 2024 at 11:00:25PM +0100, Warner Losh via cctalk wrote:
Yes. So Unix did have a shutdown procedure, and it was particularly critical to do it and
do it right. I remember when I first heard about Unix, when at the U of Illinois -- some
PDP11s in the Center for Advanced Computation ran it, for their Arpanet connection. The
story was that CAC was a good facility to run Unix because it had very reliable power --
it was built to house Illiac 4 before that machine was moved to a military facility in
response to campus protests. So there was little worry about having to repair the file
system manually after a power failure -- I guess fsck hadn't been created yet, or
perhaps wasn't reliable yet.
paul
On Fri, Mar 22, 2024, 10:54 PM Zane Healy via
cctalk <cctalk(a)classiccmp.org>
...
Even v7 Unix didn't have halt or reboot.
sync;sync;sync
power off
I remember it well.
27 Mar
27 Mar
7:22 p.m.
On Fri, 22 Mar 2024 at 22:46, Diane Bruce via cctalk
<cctalk(a)classiccmp.org> wrote:
sync;sync;sync
power off
I remember it well.
In my 1st journalist job, at PC Pro Magazine in 1995, I used that to
turn off a review SPARC portable. My new boss was delighted and
apparently, unbidden, I thereby proved my xNix credentials. :-)
Good thing, really... My vi skills were minimal and they still are
today. Didn't like it then, like it less now.
--
Liam Proven ~ Profile: https://about.me/liamproven
Email: lproven(a)cix.co.uk ~ gMail/gTalk/FB: lproven(a)gmail.com
Twitter/LinkedIn: lproven ~ Skype: liamproven
IoM: (+44) 7624 277612: UK: (+44) 7939-087884
Czech [+ WhatsApp/Telegram/Signal]: (+420) 702-829-053
241
days inactive
246
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16 comments
13 participants
participants (13)
-
Bill Gunshannon -
Cameron Kaiser -
Christopher Zach -
Diane Bruce -
Doc Shipley -
Fred Cisin -
Jerry Weiss -
Liam Proven -
Paul Koning -
The Doctor -
W2HX -
Warner Losh -
Zane Healy