Microsoft-Paul Allen

[Guy Sotomayor Jr]

> On Oct 23, 2018, at 3:30 PM, Jim Manley via cctalk <cctalk at classiccmp.org> wrote:
> 
> On Tue, Oct 23, 2018 at 12:55 PM Guy Sotomayor Jr <ggs at shiresoft.com> wrote:
> 
>> On Mon, Oct 22, 2018 at 3:59 PM Guy Sotomayor Jr <ggs at shiresoft.com>
>> wrote:
>> 
>>> An (optional) X server (and clients) can be added to the OS (I use them
>>> all the time) but is not part of the base install ...
>>> 
>> 
>> Apple has been using self-customized, optimized-for their-hardware
>> supersets of the VNC protocol (which is X based) for Screen Sharing since
>> early versions of OS X, if not from the beginning, and It's (still) In
>> There (per Prego spaghetti sauce ads) in the latest versions of OS X.
>> 
>> That’s distinct from the X server and apps that are available as a
>> separate download (and I believe that now they point to Xorg).
>> 
> 
> No, it's not.  You don't need any third-party X components to use Screen
> Sharing, and it works across all platforms, in both directions, that have a
> VNC-compatible client and/or server (depending on which direction you're
> looking from, remotely).  I could show you in the source, but, then I'd
> have to kill you, if Apple didn't get to both of us first.  There's what's
> in the public docs and especially marketing (including technical) material,
> and then there's what's actually In There.  It's the sort of stuff marked
> with "COMPANY PROPRIETARY" watermarks that, if you try to scan or run it
> through a photocopier, produces black output due to opto-molecular chemical
> overlays.

You’re not listening.  I said that X and Screen Sharing are separate.  I use both all the time.
X on OS X is *not* in any way shape or form using anything from Screen Sharing and is
currently sourced from Xorg.

You are also forgetting, that as an ex-Apple employee (working in the kernel) I
did get to see a lot of the source base.

> 
> 
>> BTW, the X server on OS X, interfaces not to the bit-map but instead to the
>>> native OS X display rendering framework.
>>> 
>> 
>> That's not possible, at least when communicating cross-platform, where
>> bitmaps are the only representation.
>> 
>> *sigh*
>> 
> 
> 
> 
> As far as OS X is concerned, X is just another OS X application that wants
>> to render to the screen.  I use it all the time and it works well along
>> side the normal OS X applications which wouldn’t be possible if the X
>> server wrote directly to the HW.
>> 
> 
> That's the case for your add-on X components - that's not how it can be
> done under the covers, but you apparently don't have access to that level.
> Screen Sharing isn't the only function that has this sort of capability, as
> also do 3-D graphics and video - they aren't constrained to the low-speed
> 2-D world for which Display Postscript/PDF, Quartz, etc., were developed.
> Performance is everything in these technologies, and they have their own
> APIs through which the hardware is accessed (the GPU), because going
> through the gobbledy-gook stack that's fine for documents and other
> high-drag data structures is a non-starter for them.

What I’m saying is that the X components render using the native OS X
rendering capabilities and does not access the HW directly.  Go look in
the Xorg sources.

TTFN - Guy