- test-drb@ccmp.vtda.org - classiccmp.org

by chrish＠knet.kootenay.net

Sam: could you please tell me what isbn number and the publisher was on the "Computer power for small business" book though I could try and track it down in some used book syores around here. thanx Chris At 10:25 AM 06/02/98 -0800, you wrote: > >I added another 37 volumes to my vintage computer library yesterday. > >By far the most valuable from a historical standpoint is the book >_Computer Power for the Small Business_ from 1979. It is a buyer's guide >for microcomputers of the mid- to late -0's era. Talk about a treasure. >This book has pictures and decriptions of many computers I've never even >heard of. > >It contains information on systems we know much of, such as the Atari's, >Apple, PETs, Radio Shack, etc. But it also has blurbs on systems that >I've not seen mentioned anywhere else (at least not in a way that is >looking back on these systems with a historical perspective) like the RCA >Cosmac VIP, the Sol-20, Exidy Sorcerer, Heathkit H-8 and H-11, Intecolor >8031. > >The best part is the descriptions of systems I've never knew about before. >Has anyone ever heard of an Outpost computer? Its a fully integrated >package with keyboard, display and 5.25" drive, but its almost three feet >wide, with the two 5.25" drive bays to the side of the display! How about >the PeCos One from APF Electronics. I have a pong machine made by APF but >who would've thought they once made computers? How about The Renaissance >Machine (aka Compucolor II)? There's also mention of the Teal SHC-8000, >which is sort of like a pet with display, keyboard and cassette player in >one unit. > >It then has a listing with about 40 different system descriptions, >including CPU, memory, external storage, input (ie. keyboard, lightpen), >output (ie. display, printer) and basic cost. There's also the company >address which is extremely valuable for research. > >Here's an interesting tidbit. Apparently Data General made a line of >computers dubbed "The Digital Group". According to this entry in the >table, they were systems based on the Z-80, 8080A, 9080A, 6800 and 6502 >processors; they had 2K of main memory; they used cassettes for storage. >Can anyone verify this? > >I also got another similar book entitled _The Peter McWilliams Personal >Computer Buying Guide_ circa 1985. I haven't had a chance to go through >it in much detail but it is basically more nice descriptions of early- to >mid-80's computers, again some of which I've never heard of. I'll do a >review later. > >In my travels I also picked up a Victor 800 electric adding machine. I >don't collect adding machines and only rare grab them for specific >reasons. In this case, this is the same Victor as the Victor 9000 >computer. I knew right away because the 'o' in the "Victor" emblem was >that striped-circle that is telling of a Victor product (plus it had a >Scott's Valley, CA address on the back). > >Sam Alternate e-mail: dastar(a)siconic.com >------------------------------------------------------------------------------- >Computer Historian, Programmer, Musician, Philosopher, Athlete, Writer, Jackass > > Coming Soon...Vintage Computer Festival 2.0 > See http://www.siconic.com/vcf for details! > > >

27 years, 10 months

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PDP-8

by allisonp＠world.std.com

> That sounds right. In fact, the readers are even labeled < > "DECtape55"s. How much do these hold? Around 185-230k 12bit words depending on how formatted. 1464 blocks of 128 words, randomly block addressable with an index. Another scheme used 129 word blocks with over 1400 available. It was low cost disk like and moderatly fast storage. One tape could hold a complete OS and utilities along with a language. Allison

27 years, 10 months

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PDP-8

by allisonp＠world.std.com

< >Standard paper tape stores 10 characters/inch. Each row of holes across < >the tape is an 8-bit character, with a small 'sprocket' hole which is < >either used to drag the tape through the reader, or to provide a strobe < >pulse. < < Is that enough to actually do some decent stuff with the PDP-8. Humph, PC mentality... Back beofre Gates could stand there were computers and programmers programmed such that tens of kilobyte requirements for OSs were inconceiveable as being bloated. Considering the basic PDP-8 has 4k 12 bit words. Yes. < I also have some reels of film-like tape. What's the proper name for it? < How does it compare to the paper tape? There are two things, mylar tape (does not decay around oils) and if the tapes have a 4" hub and say dectape then it's a old low cost magtape. Allison

27 years, 10 months

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PDP-8

by tomowad＠earthlink.net

>> >A full reel of tape was 1000' I think. That's about 100K of data (to give >> >an order of magnitude). A full box of fanfold tape would be about the same. >> >> I also have some reels of film-like tape. What's the proper name for it? >> How does it compare to the paper tape? > >Are these little reels about 4" in diameter of 3/4" magnetic tape? If so, >they're the original DECtapes. That sounds right. In fact, the readers are even labeled "DECtape55"s. How much do these hold? What is used to 'punch' the paper tape? My reader certainly doesn't look like it's capable. Thanks. Tom Owad -- Sysop of Caesarville Online Client software at: <http://home.earthlink.net/~tomowad/>

27 years, 10 months

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Recompilong old DOS

by rcini＠email.msn.com

On Fri, 17 Jul 1998 05:54:31 -0800 (PDT), Tim Shoppa <shoppa(a)alph02.triumf.ca> wrote: >It's probably not too far off target. The original QDOS was certainly >developed on a S-100 CP/M-80 system - Tim Paterson's articles in _BYTE_ >make this much obvious - but most Microsoft products >of the era were cross-compiled from one of several DEC minicomputers >that Microsoft owned or "leased" time on. I know that most of their early >Macintosh products were developed on a TOPS-10 system, in particular. >I would guess that after they bought QDOS, Microsoft moved development >to a TOPS-10 platform. >Tim. Do you have copies of those articles handy? I'd really like to get copies of them. Thanks. Rich Cini/WUGNET <nospam_rcini(a)msn.com> - ClubWin! Charter Member - MCP Windows 95/Windows Networking - Preserver of "classic" computers <<<< ========== reply separator ========== >>>>>

27 years, 10 months

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RT-11 Help

by mbg＠world.std.com

> Right now only one of the drives is hooked up, set to drive '0'. >It will boot and run the UCSD stuff and it will boot RT-11(V2.0).... >except that, in 7 out of the 7 packs with RT-11.... it is as if KMON >was missing or damaged; it boots up to the dot prompt and then >returns the ?ILL? message no matter which command I give it. I have >RT-11(V5.0) on my 11/73 and it is fully functional, so I have had >some cursory (N.P.I.) experience with the OS. Ah... you're playing with an RT-11 which didn't have DCL... there are no quick shortcuts to accomplish things. To get a directory of your disk: R PIP *RK0:/L *^C There is no 'HELP' command... each utility has to be run explicitly. There is no BUP, DUP, DIR... the functions that were split out into DUP and DIR are still in PIP... Back when I first used V2... I wrote what I called a supplementary command scanner which was invoked if KMON couldn't otherwise identify the command. So I had a sort of CCL way back in 1976 or so (when I was at WPI). Megan Gentry Former RT-11 Developer (1978-1992) User of RT-11 since 1975 +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+ | Megan Gentry, EMT/B, PP-ASEL | Internet (work): gentry zk3.dec.com | | Unix Support Engineering Group | (home): mbg world.std.com | | Compaq Computer Corporation | addresses need '@' in place of ' ' | | 110 Spitbrook Rd. ZK03-2/T43 | URL: http://world.std.com/~mbg/ | | Nashua, NH 03062 | "pdp-11 programmer - some assembler | | (603) 884 1055 | required." - mbg | +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+

27 years, 10 months

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Looking for 2 magazine articles

by rcini＠email.msn.com

Hello, all: While going through the old Popular Electronics magazines that I recently got, I found two article series that I would like to have complete, but I'm missing two issues...bummer. Does anyone have the following and would be willing to mail me a copy: 1. Popular Electronics, March 1977, Part 3 of the "Build the Cosmac Elf" construction article. 2. Popular Electronics, November, 1981, Part 3 of the "Designing with the 8080 uP" article. I'd be more than happy to reimburse for copying/postage. Thanks. Rich Cini/WUGNET <nospam_rcini(a)msn.com> - ClubWin! Charter Member - MCP Windows 95/Windows Networking - Preserver of "classic" computers <<<< ========== reply separator ========== >>>>>

27 years, 10 months

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MSDOS 6.x

by bwit＠pobox.com

I ran across a consignment store that has a large supply of shrink-wrapped MSDOS 6.x they are selling for $1 each. Probably be about $5 including postage. Please let me know if anyone is interested. Regards, Bob

27 years, 10 months

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Sirius sound chips

by ard＠p850ug1.demon.co.uk

A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text Size: 507 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.classiccmp.org/pipermail/cctalk/attachments/19980719/c462a89b/at…

27 years, 10 months

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Updated Commodore PET and P500 Pages

by foxnhare＠goldrush.com

Those of you interested I have been doing some updating to my Commodore pages. Let me see if I can give you a list: * Added a better 'original PET' graphic to the PET page (Yeah Doug, that picture does look awfully familiar, hope you don't mind..) * Added a picture of my Pet Rock (as a link in the PET page) * Added to the PET FAQ two sub-pages on PET BASIC (one small, one REALLY BIG) both are adapted from the Commodore 64 Programmer's Reference text from Project 64 with changes/additions to be PET specific. also a nother question or two * Started a Commdore 8-bit Troubleshooting Guide (stuff like don't put things to close or to the left of monitors, etc) I have a couple 64 and 1541 fixer charts I plan to add someday too. * P500 Page has all new pics! (with close-up of the back panel) much re-wording (also found a pic of an Ultimax to add) Unfortunately my QuickCam can't do a screen-shot, the monitor refresh through the camera is too messy. * Did a bit of work on the BBS history, still have to add a link over to the CBBS North West page (4th BBS in the U.S!)... If any of that sounds interesting, click on the link below and check it out. (BTW I know the long PET BASIC page 4.0 command portion is incomplete, I got lazy, what can I say.) -- -+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+- Larry Anderson - Sysop of Silicon Realms BBS (300-2400bd) (209) 754-1363 Visit my Commodore 8-Bit web page at: http://www.goldrush.com/~foxnhare/commodore.html -+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-

27 years, 10 months

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new additions: mac128

by SUPRDAVE＠aol.com

In a message dated 98-07-18 21:53:03 EDT, you write: << A friend of mine called me today and told me that he stopped at a garage sale and that they had some kind of large Apple laptop computer for sale. The owner claimed it was some sort of prototype and was asking $100 for it. Do this sound like anything that you're interested in? >> i dunno. ive heard that "its a prototype" line before so unless they have incontrovertible evidence, they are probably lying. it's probably just a mac portable. i'll pass.

27 years, 10 months

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Off-topic informational anti-spam anecdotal

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

> I was just pointing at that in the US, the telcos have far >less ability to control how many phones you have the house than in other >parts of the world. > >Anyway, point taken. > Is there any reason for a telco to worry about the number of phones in a house besides for purely financial concerns? Of course, if you have 100 phones all plugged in, it's possible there won't be enough power for all of them, and certainly not enough to make them all ring. I believe the FCC controls stuff about the amount of power a phone can use for ringing. ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

27 years, 10 months

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How many computers?

by allisonp＠world.std.com

< > TRS80 model II with 3 physically huge 8 meg HDDs < < 8 meg ? not five ? Whats the type and manufacturer ? < Do you have an online picture ? Back then SA4000, Memorex M101s were as common as the new ST506/412 drives. I have a M101 here operational on a CCS s100 crate big and like most of the 8"s clear plastc cover to watch the goings on. Allison

27 years, 10 months

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Atari 1040 ST

by higginbo＠netpath.net

Looking for a good source of info, parts, specs, etc. for the Atari 1040 ST. Haven't found much yet out in netspace. - - john higginbotham ____________________________ - webmaster www.pntprinting.com - - limbo limbo.netpath.net -

27 years, 10 months

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new additions: mac128

by SUPRDAVE＠aol.com

i've got just about every compact mac model made except for a 128. while selling some things at a radio rally today, i came across a guy who said he had a complete working one for sale. turns out this guy even works in the same facility i do! here's what i got for $10 imagewriter // in original box. mac128 in its original box with manuals and system disks. also has keyboard and mouse in their boxes also along with the purchase list and other literature. machine is dirty and will have to be disassembled and cleaned. one thing he told me is that it has some sort of scsi upgrade. the battery door has been replaced with a db25 connector so im not sure if it has a genuine 128 board in there. nonetheless, i will keep it in its current modified status because the upgrade it's had is almost as "rare" as the machine itself. i also have a lead on another guy that has about 30 compact macs in several designs: 512, plus,se and probably some more 128 models which i might also get. for some reason, i couldnt sell all the plus and 512k models i had...

27 years, 10 months

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PDP-8

by tomowad＠earthlink.net

>Standard paper tape stores 10 characters/inch. Each row of holes across >the tape is an 8-bit character, with a small 'sprocket' hole which is >either used to drag the tape through the reader, or to provide a strobe >pulse. Is that enough to actually do some decent stuff with the PDP-8. >A full reel of tape was 1000' I think. That's about 100K of data (to give >an order of magnitude). A full box of fanfold tape would be about the same. I also have some reels of film-like tape. What's the proper name for it? How does it compare to the paper tape? Thanks. Tom Owad -- Sysop of Caesarville Online Client software at: <http://home.earthlink.net/~tomowad/>

27 years, 10 months

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C'mon guys - somebody has to know these things!

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

Do those panels have any circuitry in the back? Switches that are stamped with the date? Could you make pictures of the back as well? >A bit ago, I posted a request to help identify some old front-panels >that have been in my collection for about 20 years. I didn't get a >single response! With all of the wise guys (sorry - smart folks ;-) >in this group, I'm disappointed! Somebody has to recognize them! >Allison? Anyone? Anyone? (The pictures are on my web page at >http://incolor.inetnebr.com/bill_r. Just click on the "Classic >Computers" link, then "Unidentified Technological Artifacts".) Your >help would be appreciated? > > > -Bill Richman > bill_r(a)inetnebr.com > http://incolor.inetnebr.com/bill_r > (Home of the COSMAC Elf Simulator!) > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

27 years, 10 months

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Re-compiling old DOS

by rcini＠email.msn.com

On Fri, 17 Jul 1998 14:45:11 +1 "Hans Franke" <franke(a)sbs.de> wrote: > Anyway, this plus a message from one of our own, results in an > interesting question. How, in 1982 (or in 1980-81, when Project Acorn was in > beta), would Microsoft have written and compiled DOS 1? >>86-DOS (the base of MS-DOS 1.0) at least was developed on >>a DEC 2020 station and transfered via serial line to an >>INTEL ISIS system for writing Disks, or to the SCP 8086 >>S100 system for runntime tests. What is a DEC 2020? Rich Cini/WUGNET <nospam_rcini(a)msn.com> - ClubWin! Charter Member - MCP Windows 95/Windows Networking - Preserver of "classic" computers <<<< ========== reply separator ========== >>>>>

27 years, 10 months

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PDP-8

by tomowad＠earthlink.net

I picked up a PDP-8, 8L, 11/20, and a bunch of accessories this week. That PDP-8 is one cool looking computer. Of interest in the lot was a "high speed paper tape reader" and quite a bit of tape. The tape, one inch thick, looks to be of incredibly low density. Just how much does this stuff hold? More questions to come as I learn more about the PDP's. Thanks in advance. Tom Owad P.S. I'm looking for an inexpensive Mac Classic or SE, 4/40 configuration, w/kb & mouse. Anybody? -- Sysop of Caesarville Online Client software at: <http://home.earthlink.net/~tomowad/>

27 years, 10 months

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How many computers?

by pete＠dunnington.u-net.com

On Jul 16, 19:28, Tony Duell wrote: > > I suspect it used the same ROM as the Z80. A colleague used to have a > > Graduate, so I'll ask him today. > > Please do. I've got the Z-80 host ROM (and know of a few more if this one is > dead), but I don't have any other Torch ROMs. My friend reports that the Graduate doesn't have a BBC ROM, and indeed doesn't use the Tube. It uses the 1MHz bus to access BBC I/O, apparently. -- Pete Peter Turnbull Dept. of Computer Science University of York

27 years, 10 months

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DIGI-COMP 1 Assembly Instructions now available

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

Thankfully, I was using a T1 at the time I first looked at this page and didn't notice the size of the images. The first thing you should do is reduce them from RGB to Grayscale. I tried it and it doesn't reduce image quality at all. Also, does anyone currently own the rights to this? I would like to make an HTML and DVI version of it, which would be much easier to read, since it wouldn't involve as much horizontal scrolling. Now, some questions about the computer itself. A) How much did it cost in 1998 dollars? B) Was there ever a DIGI-COMP II? C) What type of plastic was used in it? D) Has anyone tried to make one? E) How popular was it? F) What year was it terminated? Basically, a brief history. >Due to popular demand, I have finally gotten around to >adding the DIGI-COMP 1 Assembly Instructions to the >collection of other scanned DIGI-COMP 1 manual pages at >http://galena.tjs.org/digicomp/ . They are all 300 DPI >grayscale images - in other words, huge! The parts list >alone (Page 1) should be immensely helpful for those >wishing to create their own DIGI-COMP. > >Thanks to everyone who e-mailed me over the past few >days! > >Tom >-- > >This account is used so mailing lists don't >clutter up Tom's real account. If you really >want to talk to Tom, use tom(at)galena.tjs.org > > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

27 years, 10 months

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C'mon guys - somebody has to know these things!

by bill_r＠inetnebr.com

A bit ago, I posted a request to help identify some old front-panels that have been in my collection for about 20 years. I didn't get a single response! With all of the wise guys (sorry - smart folks ;-) in this group, I'm disappointed! Somebody has to recognize them! Allison? Anyone? Anyone? (The pictures are on my web page at http://incolor.inetnebr.com/bill_r. Just click on the "Classic Computers" link, then "Unidentified Technological Artifacts".) Your help would be appreciated? -Bill Richman bill_r(a)inetnebr.com http://incolor.inetnebr.com/bill_r (Home of the COSMAC Elf Simulator!)

27 years, 10 months

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Off-topic informational anti-spam anecdotal

by allisonp＠world.std.com

< >they couldn't charge you on anything if they found out you were < physically messing with the line. HERE IN THE USA: If you violate the NI (bell parlance for network interface) which is the demarcation line to your home or business and damage their equipment you will likely be at the end of both criminal and civil charges. The key issues would be if the cause is deliberate, neglegence or accidental. They do actively persue this as deliberate tampering with their business as both a public safety issue and interfering with their conducting business in an unlawful manner (mischeif, vandalism). I would bet in Europe there are certain actions available as well. The oddity of it all is if you fry the phone line who really looses? Your out the use of the phone and their interface equipment is likely protected as they have to worry about power distibution lines and lightining getting into their stuff. The damage would be more to the user than TPC (the phone company). Allison

27 years, 10 months

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Off-topic informational anti-spam anecdotal

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

Is there anything I can do at home that will damage phone company equipment? I suspect that 240v in a telco switch is nothing pretty. >That was when you could get away with free phone calls by messing with the >line voltage. ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

27 years, 10 months

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Off-topic informational anti-spam anecdotal

by JRichardson＠softwright.co.uk

>> A _very_ good book for the older stuff (manual switchboards, relays, >> step-by-step 2-motion selectors) is called 'Telephony' by (IIRC) Herbert > and Proctor. It's a UK book,... Hmm, I'll have to check that out. > >> 'Tip' and 'Ring' refer, of course to the 2 contacts on a 3-wire jack >> (phone?) plug - like a stereo headphone plug, used on the old manual >> switchboards. The other contact - sleeve (aka the 'P wire') was used in >> the exchange to check if a line was in use (P=Private, I think). I always did wonder. I've got a couple of old (can't remember the exact date, but I'd say early 70's at a guess) answering machines somewhere which make use of such plugs. I'd love to wire one of these things up to a phone circuit if possible, I doubt that it could be done though - the systems were badged "Ansafone" IIRC, making use of enormous reel-to-reel tape decks and foot pedals... :) (I suppose this could be judged almost-on-topic, if the phone system is deemed to be some giant computer, and the technology, after all, is more than 10 years old) cheers Jules >

27 years, 10 months

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Off-topic informational anti-spam anecdotal

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

I don't know how much truth there is in those descriptions of various boxes, but there a very frequent warnings on messing with line voltage because of what "hackers" call "gestapo". >That's what's funny about the phone companies in the UK versus those in >the US. I could plug my phone line into a 240v outlet and the phone >company couldn't do a damn thing about it. > >Sam Alternate e-mail: dastar(a)siconic.com >------------------------------------------------------------------------------- >Ever onward. > > September 26 & 27...Vintage Computer Festival 2 > See http://www.siconic.com/vcf for details! > [Last web page update: 07/05/98] > > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

27 years, 10 months

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Off-topic informational anti-spam anecdotal

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

>they couldn't charge you on anything if they found out you were physically >messing with the line. Couldn't they cancel your service if they felt that their station equipment was at risk of damage? ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

27 years, 10 months

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Rebuilding Mac Portable batteries

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

You can order them with equivalent ease from Radio Shack, for about $7.75. It might end up being cheaper, since RS won't charge you shipping and handling. Of course, they might be getting it from the same source as you. > Now all I need is the batteries... > >Rich Cini/WUGNET <nospam_rcini(a)msn.com> > - ClubWin! Charter Member > - MCP Windows 95/Windows Networking > - Preserver of "classic" computers ><<<< ========== reply separator ========== >>>>> > > > > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

27 years, 10 months

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More finds

by jrkeys＠concentric.net

Picked a few things this week for the museum , so pleas do not ask me about selling them. If I ever get month off to check what all I have in storage I will be unloading all extras. The finds: 1) Franklin ACE2100 cpu and monitor (mono) not tested yet both were free; 2) Franklin ACE2200 cpu, monitor (mono), keyboard, Franklin joystick, and all cables, it also was free; 3) EXELTELII was a trade; 4) new IOMEGA cleaning kit for 8" media $1 at Goodwill; 5) OPENDOC video from Apple; 6) TG Products chip tester; 7)Super Expander cartridge for the C64 60 cents at Thrift; 8)Super Graphix jr by XETEC for the Commodore cost $1.60; 9)IQSuperPC Trivia Blitz cartridge A cost $1.80; 10)AppleColor RGB monitor 80 cents at thrift not tested yet; 11)some QX-10 items for free; 12) about 15 various books. That's been it so far I will be going out later today to the thrift's about 45 miles from my home and working my way stopping at any place looking interesting. Keep computing John

27 years, 10 months

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FW: Student asking for old DEC equipment

by kyrrin＠jps.net

If anyone can help this fellow out, please contact him directly. -=-=- <snip> -=-=- On Fri, 17 Jul 1998 16:07:29 -0400, in comp.sys.dec you wrote: >>Hello everyone in DEC land. >> >> I'm a student at Eastern Connecticut State University and was wondering >>if someone out there had an old DEC workstation that they were going to >>throw out and would be willing to donate. I'd be willing to travel >>through most of New England to fetch it (CT,MA,RI,Southern VT, Part of >>NY/NJ). It would have a loving and useful home next to my SparcStation >>LX and I could finally dispose of my PC. >> >>Donald Lewis La Barre III >>iggy(a)megahits.com -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Bruce Lane, Sysop, The Dragon's Cave (Fido 1:343/272) http://table.jps.net/~kyrrin -- also kyrrin [A-t] Jps {D=o=t} Net Spam is bad. Spam is theft of service. Spam wastes resources. Don't spam, period. I am a WASHINGTON STATE resident. Spam charged $500.00 per incident per Chapter 19 RCW.

27 years, 10 months

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Thanks to the list...

by ddameron＠earthlink.net

Hi Doug and all, At 05:19 PM 7/17/98 -0500, you wrote: >> 5) Check the +8, +/-16, and GND pins on the bus connectors before >> powering up, make sure nothing's shorted. > >I found the power supply wasn't very well regulated, so you might see >higher voltages without a load. Which pins on the S-100 bus correspond to >those volatages? I just checked the mobo terminals, one of which was >unlabeled. Pins 1-50 on front, 51-100 on rear. Pin 1, 51 +8 Volts. Leftmost from the front, front and back. Unregulated (just filtered rectified DC from the power transformer) for the +5 volt regulators. (Usually very easy to trace or test) Pin 2, +16 Volts, unregulated. Pin 52, -16 Volts, unregulated. In my system I put fuses in these lines. Make sure the filter capacitors have bleeder resistors attached, so they will discharge without a load. Otherwise you might have problems when plugging in a card later :-(. Pin 50, 100 Ground. There were other ground lines on later cards, which you may have to check for when you start to mix cards, such as pins 20, 70, which were Unprotect, Protect in the early S-100 systems. -Dave

27 years, 10 months

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Q-bus boards I need ID of...

by cfandt＠servtech.com

There are actually three boards I need to ID, the third is possibly a tape controller. Here's the rundown: #1 A Q-bus dual width board made by DTC. Has a 50-pin header next to a single ejector handle. All TTL chips, no LSI or CMOS devices. Two 8-section DIP switches on board. Only markings are a FAB, ASSY, REV and S/N numbers. The ASSY number is 007-00002. Could this be a Q-bus SCSI board (I hope, I hope, I hope)? But there's no CPU or ASIC, etc. onboard to handle DMA, SCSI device protocoll, etc. :( An appropriate driver in conjunction with the OS would have to do this. #2 A Q-bus quad width board of unknown manufacture. Two 50-pin headers at handle-edge of board. A marking on the component side says it's a "Q BUS/LEXID INT." with a number 77D609871P1 under it. A number stamped on the backside is "GE77D609871G1" with "SER NO- 44" under it. Those part numbers look like old GE part numbers. Did General Electric make any equipment for the DEC world? #3 This is what I feel is an Archive tape controller. It has "ARCHIVE CORP. Copyright 1983" silk screened onto the component side. No other numbers on the silk screen, dang it. It is 5.5" x 7.75" with a 50-pin edge connector (marked "J1") on one 5.5" end and a 50-pin header (marked "J3") at the other end. "J2" is a 4-pin recepticle which is the same as the power connector on a 5.25" floppy or hard drive and is on the edge connector-end of the board. The EPROM label has 80182-010 on it. Has an 8031 microcontroller chip, an 8155 and an Archive LCC ASIC plus a bunch of TTL and one small CMOS RAM chip (Mitsubishi M5M2167P-70). Other numbers found on the board seem to be component part numbers however there is a hand-written number on the solder side which is 80158-013/A. Could this be an important identifying number? I want to try to identify these boards to see if theyt are useable in the systems I'm keeping, especially item #1. Thanks for the help. --Chris -- -- Christian Fandt, Electronic/Electrical Historian Jamestown, NY USA Member of Antique Wireless Association URL: http://www.ggw.org/freenet/a/awa/

27 years, 10 months

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DIGI-COMP 1 Assembly Instructions now available

by tomsaddressformaillists＠altavista.net

Due to popular demand, I have finally gotten around to adding the DIGI-COMP 1 Assembly Instructions to the collection of other scanned DIGI-COMP 1 manual pages at http://galena.tjs.org/digicomp/ . They are all 300 DPI grayscale images - in other words, huge! The parts list alone (Page 1) should be immensely helpful for those wishing to create their own DIGI-COMP. Thanks to everyone who e-mailed me over the past few days! Tom -- This account is used so mailing lists don't clutter up Tom's real account. If you really want to talk to Tom, use tom(at)galena.tjs.org

27 years, 10 months

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sources

by icyblackhand＠hotmail.com

I live in Union County NJ. Are there any good old computer sources around here??? Mike ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

27 years, 10 months

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Rebuilding Mac Portable batteries

by rcini＠email.msn.com

After a little research, I figured out how to rebuild a MacPortable battery pack for about 1/3 the cost of buying one on the resale market (I've seen prices between $60 and $75 per battery). Anyway, the pack is rated at 6v/5ah, and contains three, 2v/5ah Gates Cyclon "X" cells. The X cells are two sizes above the conventional D battery. Gates no longer makes these batteries, having gotten out of the battery business. Hawker Energy Products (http://www.hepi.com) now makes these cells. These are available from Battery Specialties (1-800-854-5759) for $7.24 each ($21.72 total). Opening the battery case is also easy. The pack top is ultrasonically welded to the bottom case, but if you score the top plastic in the groove where it meets the bottom case, and then bang it with a small slot-headed screwdriver and a hammer, you can open it easily. Replace the internal cells with the new ones, observing all polarity markings and ensuring that all insulating plastic and foam pieces are replaced. You can then seal it with plastic welding cement such as X7. The only problem that I can see is creating the bars that join the cells. I'll probably use 12g copper wire in stead of bus bars. Now all I need is the batteries... Rich Cini/WUGNET <nospam_rcini(a)msn.com> - ClubWin! Charter Member - MCP Windows 95/Windows Networking - Preserver of "classic" computers <<<< ========== reply separator ========== >>>>>

27 years, 10 months

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VC404 The Standard

by lwalker＠mail.interlog.com

One of my recent curbside finds is a machine put out by a Canadian company based in Waterloo Ont called Volker-Craig model vg-400. On the front it has a title VC404 The Standard. It has a k-b attached with ribbon cable which is about the size of a C64 with Function Pf1-12 buttons as well as a separate pod with APL,PAGE,FULL,LOCAL on the left vertically. There is a full qwerty alphabet and numerical pad as well as some specialized keys the most unusual of which is a key labelled "rub-out" and no down arrow. In the back it has a 25 pin RS232 connector, a BNC labelled "composite video" ,2 switches : one 3-pos.to configure parity the other "Transparent on off" It also has cutouts for parallell and serial (maybe a 9pin dshell for different modems) I haven't opened it up yet, and I must admit to doing what the impeccable Tony Duell would deem unforgiveable (sorry Tony, Couldn't he'p m'se'f) I plugged it in and tuned it on. It worked except for a stuck k-b which stopped printing to screen when I punched another key than local on the right-most pad. Obviosly a terminal of some sort, but the keypads are not what I would expect. My guess is it's a terminal for the deaf which hooked up to a service. But why all the other k-b functions. Any ideas ? ciao larry lwalker(a)interlog.com

27 years, 10 months

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Thanks to the list...

by Anthony.Dellett＠Staples.com

Well... I finally found one, I ordered a used Imsai 8080 from an undisclosed place in CA (they had one on consignment) and they're shipping it to me here in Boston. Thanks to those on the list who gave me pointers on how to find one. Now I gotta order replacement switches for the front panel (Tony heads to his web browser) Tony

27 years, 10 months

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Thanks to the list...

by allisonp＠world.std.com

< 2) DISCONNECT THE FRONT PANEL AC SWITCH!!! Put an on/off power switch < in the back, use a hole next to the fan (most back plates had one. < Don't run the AC power through the front panel. This one applies to Altair8800s BIGTIME and any others that has mains ac near logic. The designers that did that should be made to stand in a puddle and work on it! Allison

27 years, 10 months

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Thanks to the list...

by peacock＠simconv.com

Not so easy, you would have to grind down the back spacers so the front panel stayed in alignment with the bus slot. Just adding the ring would push the panel card forward. Jack >Don't know how they are but I can guess - has anyone tried puuting the screws in, then the spacers, then putting a C or E ring on the screw as a keeper to make it a captive screw and spacer?

27 years, 10 months

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Thanks to the list...

by peacock＠simconv.com

> Well... I finally found one, I ordered a used Imsai 8080 from an > undisclosed place in CA (they had one on consignment) and they're > shipping it to me here in Boston. Advice to a new IMSAI owner: 1) if you take the front panel off, tape the plastic sandwich with the film for the front panel logo so it doesn't come apart. Also, tape the allen head screws on so they don't come out. This is real handy when the time comes to reassemble. You will discover you need 4 hands to do it: one to hold panel, one to position screws, one to hold spacers in back, one to tighten screws. 2) DISCONNECT THE FRONT PANEL AC SWITCH!!! Put an on/off power switch in the back, use a hole next to the fan (most back plates had one. Don't run the AC power through the front panel. 3) If its been heavily used, chances are the bus connectors may be worn. Wiggle cards a bit when STOPed and see if status lights change. You might have to hunt for the least worn slots. 4) Look for purple plague. If it's old, the socketed IC pins or card edge connectors may have oxidation (usually purple or black discoloration). You may need to check the front panel for this if it's socketed. 5) Check the +8, +/-16, and GND pins on the bus connectors before powering up, make sure nothing's shorted. Jack Peacock Using IMSAIs since 1975

27 years, 10 months

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Transputer documentation required

by JRichardson＠softwright.co.uk

Hi, So can any of you recommend a good book on how transputers work in a broad sense? I occasionally have the urge to take all the old PC system boards lying around and construct some form of transputer system - ok, so it's impractical, would be a lot of work, and wouldn't be of any benefit at all, but it would be an interesting exercise :) (so I'm crazy... just seems a shame that I've got various system boards lying around unused that can't be made into complete machines and are of no use to anyone else...) Jules >

27 years, 10 months

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Thanks to the list...

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

The reason is that if the cord runs through the whole IMSAI, a problem can cause a whole lot more damage. Also, if there is a problem with insulation, you are a lot more likely to electrocute yourself by touching a switch in the front than in the back. >Why not? I powered-up through the front panel, but with the >front-panel removed from the backplane. >-- Doug >Using IMSAIs since 1998 :-) > > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

27 years, 10 months

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Transputer documentation required

by JRichardson＠softwright.co.uk

>> So can any of you recommend a good book on how transputers work in a >> broad sense? I occasionally have the urge to take all the old PC system >> boards lying around and construct some form of transputer system - ok, >> so it's impractical, would be a lot of work, and wouldn't be of any >> benefit at all, but it would be an interesting exercise :) > >> A transputer is a specific type of processor from inmos (IIRC), so you you learn something new every day (or in my case, several hundred things ;) I always thought that transputer was a general term for any processing component in a parallel system. >> However, you could certainly build a parallel processing supercomputer >> from a bunch of old PCs. In fact, that was the original idea behind Cal >> Tech's Cosmic Cube which eventually led to Intel's hypercubes (such as the >> iPSC/1). hmm, wait for Java chips to really take off and write the whole lot in Java... now there's a plan... :*) > >> I wouldn't be surpised if somebody still has the Cosmic Cube code around, >> which would allow you to network some 8088-based machines to create a >> hypercube. I have an old Unix-based hypercube simulator from Intel which >> was based on the Cosmic Cube code, but I haven't looked into the copyright >> issues. parallel systems was a whole area that I never got too heavily in to at university and regretted it afterwards (and being a fairly specialist area it probably means you can get away from bad products produced by monopolising companies :^) I was tempted to ask how fast these 8088-based 'cubes were, but I suppose it's really hard to describe real-world performance of such systems without actually using them... Jules >

27 years, 10 months

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Transputer documentation required

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

What exactly is a transputer and how is it different from a normal CPU? >A transputer is a specific type of processor from inmos (IIRC), so you >wouldn't be able to easily make one from bits of other computers How many processors were in the Cosmic Cube? What kind of speeds did it reach? There was once a Circuit Cellar article on building a parallel processing computer out of a 286 and IIRC from 16 to 256 microcontrollers. All that could do was calculate the mandelbrot set, though, at speed reachable by an i486 (yes, I know that's not the point). >In fact, that was the original idea behind Cal >Tech's Cosmic Cube which eventually led to Intel's hypercubes (such as the >iPSC/1). > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

27 years, 10 months

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Valve robots, was How many computers?

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

>>Doing it in transistors wouldn't be the same :-) I assume that with enough picking and matching it is possible, _in theory_, to build a similar circuit by replacing vacuum tubes with transistors, i.e. it's just a matter of taste in your case. >> >>-tony >> ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

27 years, 10 months

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Off-topic informational anti-spam anecdotal

by Philip.Belben＠powertech.co.uk

Tony Duell quoted me as having written: >> battery - 12V was all that was left after voltage drop when the 30mA or > > Don't forget the few volts (probably 10V or so) dropped across the line relay > coils at the exchange to sense the off-hook condition. The system is > (obviously) designed so that a short on the line (no matter how short the > line is) won't cause damage. Applying 'battery' straight to a line wouldn't > allow for this. Good point. >> had to go the several miles to your house and back. May still be like >> that, come to think of it. > > AFAIK it is. The specs of 'phone lines rarely change, and there are plenty > of 706's and 746's still in use. Maybe even the odd 300-series. I still use a tone-dial 746 as one of my phones and a rotary dial 300-series wall mount version (don't know the number) as my other. The only two reasons I don't use my type 332 are 1) the induction coil is dead and 2) I have now borrowed microphone and speaker diaphragm to keep the wall mount one going. > Note for US types. UK 'phone wiring then was even stranger than it is Another note for US types. Type 330 and its derivatives = pre-war design of phone. My 332 actually has cloth insulation on internal wires, although the (much rarer) wall mounted one has plastic insulation. Late 1950s (?), much lighter design, PCB based, introduced, called 706. As components got smaller, the number and size of PCBs reduced, and the 746 has all the components, including the line drop compensator (resistors, diodes, light bulbs) on a single PCB. This design remained in use for around 20 years - PCB from phone circa 1970 interchangeable with PCB from phone circa 1990, the main difference being the size of the capacitors and (if you're lucky) the provision of a few extra screw terminals. (dial, bell, handset etc. all terminated with ring or fork (spade) terminals to screw onto these). I keep several type 746 phones in stock - people still occasionally want rotary dial phones... >> the 1960s (? What date is the 706 anyway ?), many UK phones had the >> "line drop compensator" on a plug-in module, presumably so you could >> swap it for one with different resistors... > > AFAIK the 'line drop compensator' had a constant-current barretter lamp > on it, and there was only one version. Certainly I've only ever seen one > version, and that's the one shown in all schematics. Alas my copy of I've only ever seen one version, but then again, I've never seen a schematic that actually gives the resistor values. > You could plug the 'line drop compensator in upside-down, whereupon it > was out of circuit and it bridged the appropriate terminals to use the > 'phone without it. I beleive you did this at the end of very long lines. Could be what I was thinking of. Philip.

27 years, 10 months

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Valve robots, was How many computers?

by ddameron＠earthlink.net

Hi All, At 12:57 AM 7/17/98 +0100, you wrote: >> >> >> Has anyone built any of these? Does anyone have any extra copies? >> >Indeed it is. 1966 IIRC > >One day I might have a go at said robotic dog - assuming I can find >enough DF92s, etc. Doing it in transistors wouldn't be the same :-) > >-tony > Any kind of description would be appreciated! What did it do? How many tubes/valves, etc.? I looked up the U.S. equivalent tube for the DF92 valve and found the 1L4. A similar one, much more common is a 1U4, used in many portable radios before transistors. All battery filament (1.4 volts, 50mA) miniature pentodes.

27 years, 10 months

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Cross-Assembly (was RE: Re-compiling old DOS)

by peacock＠simconv.com

>86-DOS (the base of MS-DOS 1.0) at least was developed on a DEC 2020 station and transfered via serial line to an INTEL ISIS system for writing Disks, or to the SCP 8086 S100 system for runntime tests. This seems to be another one of those cases where what was once a common software development technique is being lost to changing times. In the 70's, when micros first came out, it was common practice to buy a cross-assembler and simulator that ran on a mini or mainframe. Code was developed and maintained in a familiar environment, run through the simulator, testing as much as possible, then burned into EPROM and installed in the target system. IIRC the original IBM PC BIOS was built this way. When Intel came out with the 8086, they did offer an assembly language translator for 8080 to 8086 code. For the most part there is a 1:1 correspondence for 8080 instructions, except when it came to status flags, so the translator was relatively easy if you had a clean design. In practical terms it was less useful because all you got was the same program without taking advantage of the features unique to the 8086, like segments or 16-bit operations. Cross-assemblers were not unique to micros either. The lab where I worked in the 70's had several stripped down DG Nova 1200s used as embedded controllers. These machines had no console or disk, no operating system, just a paper tape reader bootstrap and a front panel plus some custom electronics. The development cycle was to write a program on the mainframe (CDC 6600), punch a paper tape (yes the CDC did have paper tape output!), load it into the Nova, sacrifice a candy bar to the computer gods, then hit the Run switch. Debugging was front panel lights/switches, several cases of Coke, vending machine candy, and the good ole Single-Step toggle. Jack Peacock

27 years, 10 months

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How many computers?

by pete＠dunnington.u-net.com

On Jul 16, 19:28, Tony Duell wrote: > > devices play merry hell with Acorn's Tube code, which tends to see that > > something is there but can't deal with it. > > :-(. What do you do on a machine with a DNFS ROM, then if you add a Torch > Copro? It depends on the version of the Torch ROM. In some cases, changing the order of the MCP (for Torch Z80) and DNFS ROMs makes it usable. Usually I softload the MCP ROM, though, else it complains if the Torch Z80 isn't there. > > I suspect it used the same ROM as the Z80. A colleague used to have a > > Graduate, so I'll ask him today. > > Please do. I've got the Z-80 host ROM (and know of a few more if this one is > dead), but I don't have any other Torch ROMs. I forgot :-( I'll remember today, honest. I've got several versions of the MCP ROM, if you need one. -- Pete Peter Turnbull Dept. of Computer Science University of York

27 years, 10 months

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Off-topic informational anti-spam anecdotal

by JRichardson＠softwright.co.uk

Ok, so given that there are people out there who know about phone systems, how would I build a device that sat on the phone line and could detect whether the line was in use or not - it's extremely annoying when you have a modem and voice phone on the same line and your voice call gets interrupted by a burst of modem noise! :) btw, this is for a UK system - I've seen curcuits to do exactly this job, but they never say whose phone systems their designed for, and I'd imagine that US and UK systems work with different setups.... cheers Jules (ok, so it's not on-topic - thought I'd ask though before this thread disappears :)

27 years, 10 months

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How many computers?

by franke＠sbs.de

> TRS80 model II with 3 physically huge 8 meg HDDs 8 meg ? not five ? Whats the type and manufacturer ? Do you have an online picture ? > Phillips Micom 2000 dedicated WP with an 8" Shugart > and a Qume daisy wheel printer that has a power supply big enough > to power a small villiage. Same here: Any picture for the Micom 2000 available ? Gruss H. -- Ich denke, also bin ich, also gut HRK

27 years, 10 months

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Places to visit in Silicon Valley?

by franke＠sbs.de

> Kai Kaltenbach wrote: >>[...] > Is this the same Kai that the "power goo" software was/is created by? Haven't > seen the name in here before and guessing he's a recent signon? (I may just be > on a drug flashback and imagining all of this) I think you are talking about Kai Krause - he is already living somehere in California :) Gruss H. -- Ich denke, also bin ich, also gut HRK

27 years, 10 months

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Re-compiling old DOS

by franke＠sbs.de

> Anyway, this plus a message from one of our own, results in an > interesting question. How, in 1982 (or in 1980-81, when Project Acorn was in > beta), would Microsoft have written and compiled DOS 1? 86-DOS (the base of MS-DOS 1.0) at least was developed on a DEC 2020 station and transfered via serial line to an INTEL ISIS system for writing Disks, or to the SCP 8086 S100 system for runntime tests. Gruss h. -- Ich denke, also bin ich, also gut HRK

27 years, 10 months

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Re-compiling old DOS

by rcini＠email.msn.com

One of my recent time sink-hole projects is de-compiling DOS 1.1. I figure that I needed a computing challenge :) Anyway, this plus a message from one of our own, results in an interesting question. How, in 1982 (or in 1980-81, when Project Acorn was in beta), would Microsoft have written and compiled DOS 1? I know that DOS as we know it was purchased from Tim Patterson of Seattle Computing Products (Is this the right name? I don't have a copy of one of my many Gates books handy.), so the source code in printed, magnetic, or paper tape form would have existed. Would they have used a PC simulator running on another computer (the same way they wrote BASIC for the Altair)? Would they have waited to receive a beta unit to test/develop it live after months of writing blind code based on IBM's specifications documents? Anyway, I digress. I've pretty much finished the boot sector code, and IBMBIO is done. So, now I'm working on IBMDOS. Does anyone know anything about how early DOS versions loaded? Looking at the DOS1 code and comparing it to DOS6 code, it seems like the DOS1 boot sector loads both BIO and DOS back-to-back in memory (producing a single image, if you will), and then jumps to BIO. DOS6, in comparison, the boot sector loads IO, which then loads DOS. Any thoughts? I felt this qualifies as "classic" since the file dates are May 7, 1982 <g> Rich Cini/WUGNET <nospam_rcini(a)msn.com> - ClubWin! Charter Member - MCP Windows 95/Windows Networking - Preserver of "classic" computers <<<< ========== reply separator ========== >>>>>

27 years, 10 months

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Re-compiling old DOS

by jfoust＠threedee.com

At this point in CP/M and DOS development, it was common to use an automated translation tool to convert 8080 and Z-80 assembler to 8088 code. I believe this was used on early DOS, too. I remember seeing the "signature" of this in disassemblies by the way something was done less than efficiently. - John

27 years, 10 months

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Off-topic informational anti-spam anecdotal

by allisonp＠world.std.com

< Ok, so given that there are people out there who know about phone < systems, how would I build a device that sat on the phone line and could < detect whether the line was in use or not - it's extremely annoying when < you have a modem and voice phone on the same line and your voice call < gets interrupted by a burst of modem noise! :) for this the US and euro systems are sufficiently the same. < < btw, this is for a UK system - I've seen curcuits to do exactly this < job, but they never say whose phone systems their designed for, and I'd < imagine that US and UK systems work with different setups.... the only thing you need to do is detect if the line voltage is above or below some level. that point is best set mid way between battery off hook and battery on hook (easily measured). The only other need is to do it such that you do not load the line(or you look like your off hook) and can withstand the ring without failing the circuit. Likely the circuits you've sen will do that. Allison

27 years, 10 months

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Re-compiling old DOS

by allisonp＠world.std.com

< I would _guess_ that MS-DOS was written and assembled on a CP/M system of < some sort, until it was self-hosting. Although, it's also quite possible < that MS-DOS was assembled on a QDOS system, since that's basically what < it was :) it could have been done under intel ISIS using the MDS-311 package or IRMX-80 or IRMX-86 along with ICE pods. the 8088/86 was a already a mature product by time IBM started the PC and there wre at least three second sources. Also 8086 development tools from Intel, AMD and HP to name a few were available. So developing 808x code was not a problem. I know that as we built a system using 8088 at 8mhz to play with the 7220 GDC which was the hottest thing for graphics on one chip for before the PC would escape into the world. Allison

27 years, 10 months

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VC404 The Standard

by CharlesII＠nwonline.net

CL>> -tony CL>> CL> Well, it looks like I'm going to have to read up on terminals. I really kno CL>little about them. It has baud rate settings on the back 300 - 19.2 . I'm CL>surprised at the speed. I would have thought 2400 or at most 9600. CL> Thanks for the help. CL>ciao larry CL>lwalker(a)interlog.com The baud speed really isn't that surprising since 19.2 is the speed of the Atari SIO.

27 years, 10 months

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Off-topic informational anti-spam anecdotal

by franke＠sbs.de

> The voltages must remain the same in order to be compatible with old > equipment per government regulations. Believe it or not there are still > many people out there with old (ancient) rotary dial telephones. a) Don't forget about these pseudo modern phones - keys, but still emiting pulse scemes. b) I had, until I switched to ISDN, still a 1927 Telephone in every day use. Worked fine, even with the latest (analogue) exchange :) - Noy I connect it via an a/b adaptor. Gruss H. -- Ich denke, also bin ich, also gut HRK

27 years, 10 months

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Robot books, was How many computers?

by ddameron＠earthlink.net

At 09:40 PM 7/16/98 +0100, Tony wrote: >> Has anyone built any of David Heiserman's robots? He's written several robot >> construction books. Some with hardwired logic, some with microcomputers. > >I don't think I've come across these - can you provided titles, etc, please > He wrote many, I think about all for TAB books, now part of McGraw Hill. 'Build your own working Robot', 1976. TTL, sorry my copy has been borrowed and lost. Must still be much easier to find, at least in the U.S. than "We Built our own Computers" 'How to build your own self-programming Robot', 1979. Used a 8085. Has a convoluted final algorithm (to me) to determine responses. 'How to build your own working Robot, the second Generation', 1987. Still TTL, about 30 ic's, 4 bits input (bumpers), 4 bits output (2 drive motors). Other's I haven't seen are '101 Programming Surprises and Tricks for the IBM PC'. Of course today there are all sorts of robots with PIC microcontrollers, etc. -Dave

27 years, 10 months

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Re-compiling old DOS

by allisonp＠world.std.com

< running on another computer (the same way they wrote BASIC for the Altair) < Would they have waited to receive a beta unit to test/develop it live afte < months of writing blind code based on IBM's specifications documents? Likely they used a intel MDS800 running asm86 or PLM86. They could run on intel ISB86 systems (multibus 8086 based). the 8086 was introdued in '78 and available in '79 so hardware was not a problem. Heck they could ahve used a Seattle Computers S100 8086 crate. < it to DOS6 code, it seems like the DOS1 boot sector loads both BIO and DO < back-to-back in memory (producing a single image, if you will), and then < jumps to BIO. DOS6, in comparison, the boot sector loads IO, which then < loads DOS. < < Any thoughts? I felt this qualifies as "classic" since the file dates < are May 7, 1982 <g> The monolithic load is an artifact of the CP/m heritage in general and specifically CP/M1.4. It's effect was to make loading drivers difficult. That resulted in later version loading the IO which is more extensable and then using the io to load the DOS. I may add that CP/M2.x put more of the burden in the bios and also seperated the load preocess more. Parallel development. Allison

27 years, 10 months

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Off-topic informational anti-spam anecdotal

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

Well, then why don't the other phones sound out the data string with the ringers? >Wrong. > >Caller id senses the ring and does not go off hook as that would disturb >the CO and it is uneeded. Instead the ring is an alert to the caller ID >that data will follow and it's already camped on the line using a non-DC >(capacitor coupled) connection to avoid loading the line. this allows >it to hear the ring and the data. > >Allison > > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

27 years, 10 months

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book "We Built our own Computers"

by ddameron＠earthlink.net

Hi all, At 11:09 PM 7/16/98 +1000, Phil wrote: >-----Original Message----- >From: dave dameron <ddameron(a)earthlink.net> >>Speaking of books, >>has anyone seen the book "We Built our own Computers" by A.B. Bolt, >>Cambridge Univ. Press, published about 1966. ^^ > >Yes, I've got it here (bought as part of a $3 per bag haul from a charity >book sale a month ago). ... >I see a few other replies, so that it is not all that rare :( >- but what exactly did you want to know for? > OK, Thanks, One of my collection interests is for computer construction books and articles. This book was mentioned in another article without any details. If copies are floating around, I might find one yet. -Dave

27 years, 10 months

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How many computers?

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

Has anyone built any of these? Does anyone have any extra copies? >Indeed it is. 1966 IIRC Are any still in publication or recently gone out of? >I don't think I've come across these - can you provided titles, etc, please ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

27 years, 10 months

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1
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Developing my Web site

by rcini＠email.msn.com

Hello, all: I thought that I'd share with you that I'm beginning my own classic computing web site. I was fortunate enough to find a gentleman in Vancouver who will sponsoring this effort. His particular interest is in PDP equipment. Right now, he hosts a PDP8 document archive. The first thing to be posted will be scans of the printsets that I recently got. I'd also like to reproduce the hardware user manuals that I own (which are on the order of 2 or 3 copy paper boxes worth). I also intend to post the Altair scans that I've been holding, server space allowing, of course. I'll take some time, but when it's up, I'll solicit document donations. More to come... Rich Cini/WUGNET <nospam_rcini(a)msn.com> - ClubWin! Charter Member - MCP Windows 95/Windows Networking - Preserver of "classic" computers <<<< ========== reply separator ========== >>>>>

27 years, 10 months

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Off-topic informational anti-spam anecdotal

by Philip.Belben＠powertech.co.uk

> When a phone is on-hook (hung-up) there is a 48V potential on the line. > When the phone is ringing, there is 90v (nominal) AC on the line during > the ring cycle to activate the ringer. When a phone is off-hook (you're > talking) there is 12v on the line. I think the 48V on hook and 12V off hook is historical - in the days of long copper wires back to the exchange, it was all done from the 48V battery - 12V was all that was left after voltage drop when the 30mA or so (apparently the carbon microphone needs at least 23mA to work well) had to go the several miles to your house and back. May still be like that, come to think of it. Those on shorter lines had higher resistance phones to compensate. In the 1960s (? What date is the 706 anyway ?), many UK phones had the "line drop compensator" on a plug-in module, presumably so you could swap it for one with different resistors... Philip.

27 years, 10 months

3
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Off-topic informational anti-spam anecdotal

by allisonp＠world.std.com

< > When a phone is on-hook (hung-up) there is a 48V potential on the line. < > When the phone is ringing, there is 90v (nominal) AC on the line during < > the ring cycle to activate the ringer. When a phone is off-hook (you're < > talking) there is 12v on the line. the voltages are wildly approximate. It's current that does the work! On hook is sensed by some current flowing and the threshhold is about 5-10ma may be more. Ring is ac coupled but the voltage is set so the energy level of the ringer is met despite the loop (line) resistance. the only one that was nominal was onhook of ~48v. Allison

27 years, 10 months

1
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Denver sources?

by dougdu＠MICROSOFT.com

In Denver try Fistell's Electronics and Crump Electronics and in Boulder try J.B. Saunders. - Doug > -----Original Message----- > From: Uncle Roger [mailto:sinasohn@ricochet.net] > Sent: Wednesday, July 15, 1998 7:53 PM > To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers > Subject: Denver sources? > > > My girlfriend and I are hoping to go on holiday at the > beginning of August, > and right now, it looks like Denver/Boulder will be our > destination. So, > does anyone know of any good thrift shops/swapmeets/etc. in the area? > (And, off-topically, antique or teacher stores? Gotta keep > the gf happy > too! 8^) Thanks! > > > -------------------------------------------------------------- > ------- O- > > Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad > roger(a)sinasohn.com that none but > madmen know." > Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates > San Francisco, California http://www.sinasohn.com/

27 years, 10 months

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How many computers?

by ddameron＠earthlink.net

Hi Tony and all, At 09:28 PM 7/15/98 +0100, you wrote: >> >> [We built out own...] >> >> Oooh! Scan! Scan! > >Well, it's all relay logic, and switches, but it's still fun. > >May I also recomend 'Practical Robot Circuits' from the Philips Technical >Library series. It describes a robot dog built from DF92 etc valves, and >includes schematics. The radio control book in the same series is >interesting as well. > This must be 30 or so years old. Can one still get these from Philips? I didn't find anything on Philip's site. Has anyone built any of David Heiserman's robots? He's written several robot construction books. Some with hardwired logic, some with microcomputers. -Dave

27 years, 10 months

2
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Mac 512 video mods

by PB14＠leicester.ac.uk

Yesterday I acquired two boxes, each about the size of a UK telephone directory, that were described as "AppleTalk to serial convertors". Opening them up reveals a Mac 512 motherboard, a nice Farnell psu, and a homebrew card in place of Apple's analog board. There are a couple of other mods such as the programmer and reset switches mounted on the front panel, small speaker mounted inside the case, no internal floppy, keyboard extender. The Mac board in box #1 appears to be completely standard. The homebrew board contains 2 * SN74LS221N and 1 * 74LS256N with a lead joining it to a composite connector. Does anybody have any idea what the video output might be for? I understand that there were a number of homebrew video mods of this type published in Mac magazines in the mid 80's. The Mac board in box #2 appears to be slightly non standard. At the location F3 the original SN74F253N has been piggy backed with a 7F153PC (I think). There are also a few connections to the chip at location F2 and to a factory solder pad on the motherboard. The homebrew board looks similar to that in box #1 but is better made and clearly hand labelled "composite video". Which size floppy drive should these boards support? The ROM HI is Apple # 342-022 and ROM LO is # 342-0221. Any thoughts, Phil ************************************************************** Phil Beesley -- Computer Officer -- Distributed Systems Suppport University of Leicester Tel (0)116 252-2231 E-Mail pb14(a)le.ac.uk

27 years, 10 months

2
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DEC Stuff FS in Switzerland

by lwalker＠mail.interlog.com

Spotted this in the DEC newsgroup. For our euro friends. DO NOT REPLY TO ME - REPLY TO ORIGINAL POSTER From: Peter Mueri <MPe(a)pop.agri.ch> Newsgroups: comp.sys.dec.micro Subject: FS DEC material Date: Mon, 13 Jul 1998 20:14:18 +0000 Organization: 64 Bit Linux/AXP forever! For Sale 1 Vaxmate Computer with HD Box sFr. 100 1 DEC uVAX 2000 sFr. 200 1 DEC uVAX 2000 4MB Memory Board sFr. 20 1 DEC VaxStation2000 RD54 RGB-19" sFr. 400 1 DEC Monitor 19" B/W VR100 55kHz sFr. 30 1 PDP-11/70 Plessey Core Memory sFr. 10 1 Rainbow Computer with DOS and CP/M and table sFr. 100 1 DEC VT100 sFr. 20 1 DEC VT240 Console sFr. 20 various DEC MFM HDs Prices are pick/up prices in Switzerland. Willing to trade-in McIntosh CPUs. Peter lwalker(a)interlog.com

27 years, 10 months

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taking care of bad sectors... easy stuff. Was: Re: hard

by allisonp＠world.std.com

< OK, easy on that anti-MS stuff. Kai might be reading :) Anyway, Scandisk < is useful for erasing lost files which is all I use it for. Does anyone First of all MS didn't write scandisk... anyone that uses norton tools should recognize it. it a stripped vendor version the norton tool. I have had excellent success with norton tools and still used copies I've had for over 8years. Allison

27 years, 10 months

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IBM 3380 HDA

by Philip.Belben＠powertech.co.uk

> In a message dated 98-07-15 10:58:12 EDT, you write: > > << I just acquired an IBM 3380 HDA which weighs 70 lbs, and is in a clear > plastic case. Does anybody know the lineage of this? The HDA has IBM > 390X-001 as well as 13-E8719-CJ printed on a label. > >> > > hmmm, i remember seeing 3380/3880 dasd units back in 1992 when i was a > computer operator running an IBM 4381 and later an ES9000. kinda useless for a > pc although fascinating to look at. belt drive and everything! 3380s and 3880s were certainly around when I was at IBM in 1985-86, mostly on 308X mainframes. I'll have a look-see if I have any info (probably just marketing bumf as usual). It is the clear plastic case that intrigues me. Do you mean you can see the platters and heads and things? I have a vague memory of the HDs in our system/34 being like that. Nice. I also once saw a later disk model (9330 or something like that?), demo version, which not only had a clear plastic case, but had the platters replaced by discs of clear plastic, too. It didn't power up or anything - strictly for showing tourists when on the factory tour... Philip.

27 years, 10 months

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Places to visit in Silicon Valley?

by kaikal＠MICROSOFT.com

Nope, I'm not that Kai, and I'm far from a recent addition to the group, either :) Kai -----Original Message----- From: Russ Blakeman [mailto:rhblake@bbtel.com] Sent: Thursday, July 16, 1998 5:39 AM To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers Subject: Re: Places to visit in Silicon Valley? Kai Kaltenbach wrote: > I'm going to be visiting the silicon valley area and I'd appreciate any tips > on where to look for interesting old computer gear. > > This is a one-time visit so if you're afraid of spreading the word around on > your favorite spots, send me email instead of posting to the list, I won't > tell anyone your secrets, I swear! Is this the same Kai that the "power goo" software was/is created by? Haven't seen the name in here before and guessing he's a recent signon? (I may just be on a drug flashback and imagining all of this) -------------------------------------------------------------------- Russ Blakeman RB Custom Services / Rt. 1 Box 62E / Harned, KY USA 40144 Phone: (502) 756-1749 Data/Fax:(502) 756-6991 Email: rhblake(a)bbtel.com or rhblake(a)bigfoot.com Website: http://members.tripod.com/~RHBLAKE/ ICQ UIN #1714857 AOL Instant Messenger "RHBLAKEMAN" * Parts/Service/Upgrades and more for MOST Computers* --------------------------------------------------------------------

27 years, 10 months

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How many computers?

by pete＠dunnington.u-net.com

On Jul 16, 1:50, Tony Duell wrote: > Subject: Re: How many computers? > > >That sounds like a Torch Graduate machine. An MS-DOS copro for the BBC=20 > > >micro. I have one, but alas I'm missing the host ROM and systems disk = > > for=20 > > >it :-(. > > I dont thing it needs a rom in the BBC , I have the system disks If > > I am suprised. I guess it works with the standard Tube host routines. > Odd, as it doesn't (IIRC) contain a Tube ULA. Or does it use the same > host ROM as the Z80 copro (those I have). > > Does anyone know for certain? I'd not want to waste your time if there > are other bits I need. I'm sure it doesn't use the standard Tube routines; in face most Torch devices play merry hell with Acorn's Tube code, which tends to see that something is there but can't deal with it. I suspect it used the same ROM as the Z80. A colleague used to have a Graduate, so I'll ask him today. -- Pete Peter Turnbull Dept. of Computer Science University of York

27 years, 10 months

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Off-topic informational anti-spam anecdotal

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

Hey! A great way to bring this thread back on topic! How do those electronic switches work, and what is the approximate network topology of the system? Is there a reference guide to it somewhere? I'd love to take a look. >>From about the 1970s and on (somewhere around there...about the time the >first electronic switching systems start appearing) ***snip*** As far as I know, a telephone rings because when it's on hook, any current on the phone line is connected to the ringer. When someone is trying to connect, the company sends a periodic AC signal to the phone. If the caller ID data signal was sent first, it would cause jittering in mechanical ringers, and a maddening noise in electronic ones. When the ring is detected, the caller ID can 'pick up' the phone line briefly to check the data signal, which should be extremely brief. The station knows to keep ringing the phone if the user has caller ID. This is my theory. >I don't know the specific reasons that are behind sending the data burst >after the first ring. It may have a lot to do with the caller ID boxes >needing some sort of indicator to let them know a call was coming and they >should start monitoring for the carrier. I think the caller ID boxes >could have easily been designed to continually monitor the line for a >carrier and then capture the data that came before the first ring. > >Sam Alternate e-mail: dastar(a)siconic.com >------------------------------------------------------------------------------- >Ever onward. > > September 26 & 27...Vintage Computer Festival 2 > See http://www.siconic.com/vcf for details! > [Last web page update: 07/05/98] > > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

27 years, 10 months

3
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A couple more questions, 8/M's and Es

by mcquiggi＠sfu.ca

Hi Chuck: > My question is how can I figure out if the 8/M chassis has the > requisite 8v lamp supply so that if I found an 8/e front panel I > could plug it in? Alternatively, if I pulled the 8/e panel I have > off, and plugged it into the other one to see if it would work, > would this damage it? (the FAQ says that you can run the LED > panel on an E but the going the other way is ambiguous.) You can run a LED front panel in an 8/E, Tim Shoppa and I tried this about January. There are two connector lugs on the left hand side of both types of front panels. The 8/e uses both lugs, an 8/f or other LED-style panel only the blue. The blue lead is -15V, the yellow is 8V. The lugs on the front panel are labelled "YELLOW" and "BLUE", just connect the proper wires. Leave the yellow wire unconnected to use the LED front panel in your 8/e. This works, we tried it. To find out if your supply has an 8V output, best dig out the voltmeter and check the leads coming from it! > I need an omnibus extender card, did such a thing > exist? I'm sure that they did, but I've never seen one. I'm currently waiting on connectors so that I can make one. Heck, I could make two if you need one. If anyone wants to make their own, the connectors are hard to find. Here's a suitable part number: Manufacturer: EDAC, they're at 416-754-3322 Part #s: 346-036-540-201 346-036-541-201 346-036-540-202 346-036-541-202 346-036-540-802 346-036-541-802 Any of these connectors will work, they are 0.125" spacing 36 contact edge connectors, 18 per side. You'll need 4 for an omnibus extender. The first two types are best, as they don't have mounting ears. The last 4 parts have mounting ears that can easily be cut or ground off to allow the connectors to be properly spaced. Hope this helps, Kevin -- Kevin McQuiggin VE7ZD mcquiggi(a)sfu.ca

27 years, 10 months

3
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How many computers?

by Philip.Belben＠powertech.co.uk

Phil Beesley wrote: >> -----Original Message----- >> From: dave dameron <ddameron(a)earthlink.net> >> >Speaking of books, >> >has anyone seen the book "We Built our own Computers" by A.B. Holt, >> >Cambridge Univ. Press, published about 1966. > > If anybody in the UK is interested in getting this book, I saw a copy > of this recently (two or three pounds) and I'm happy to go back for > it. Yes please. I'll try and pop into Leic. again soon and pick it up (I live at Coalville). If I thought I'd get to Leic. this weekend I'd say, tell me where and I'll buy it myself. But I am fully booked for the next three weekends, I think :-( Philip. PS Don't forget to read it before you give it to me!

27 years, 10 months

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Question on DEC file formats

by allisonp＠world.std.com

< > < Will an RL01 pack be readable in an RL02 drive? < > < > Yes. < < I think you have to rejumper the RL02 to RL01 for it to work. Bill, you just got the good memory award. ;) Allison

27 years, 10 months

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Off-topic informational anti-spam anecdotal

by allisonp＠world.std.com

<If the caller ID data signal was sent first, it would cause jittering in < mechanical ringers, and a maddening noise in electronic ones. When the < ring is detected, the caller ID can 'pick up' the phone line briefly to < check the data signal, which should be extremely brief. The station < knows to keep ringing the phone if the user has caller ID. This is my Wrong. Caller id senses the ring and does not go off hook as that would disturb the CO and it is uneeded. Instead the ring is an alert to the caller ID that data will follow and it's already camped on the line using a non-DC (capacitor coupled) connection to avoid loading the line. this allows it to hear the ring and the data. Allison

27 years, 10 months

3
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Off-topic informational anti-spam anecdotal

by allisonp＠world.std.com

< Well, then why don't the other phones sound out the data string with the < ringers? The amplitude is low compared to the ring signal and it's very short blip of data. Ring is 90-120v, voice and id are in the under two volts region. Max, please edit the copy string! bandwidth is limited and I can remember what I wrote even at my advenced age. Allison

27 years, 10 months

1
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How many computers?

by PB14＠leicester.ac.uk

> -----Original Message----- > From: dave dameron <ddameron(a)earthlink.net> > >Speaking of books, > >has anyone seen the book "We Built our own Computers" by A.B. Holt, > >Cambridge Univ. Press, published about 1966. If anybody in the UK is interested in getting this book, I saw a copy of this recently (two or three pounds) and I'm happy to go back for it. Phil ************************************************************** Phil Beesley -- Computer Officer -- Distributed Systems Suppport University of Leicester Tel (0)116 252-2231 E-Mail pb14(a)le.ac.uk

27 years, 10 months

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Places to visit in Silicon Valley?

by kaikal＠MICROSOFT.com

I'm going to be visiting the silicon valley area and I'd appreciate any tips on where to look for interesting old computer gear. This is a one-time visit so if you're afraid of spreading the word around on your favorite spots, send me email instead of posting to the list, I won't tell anyone your secrets, I swear! thanks, Kai

27 years, 10 months

4
3
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hard drive data recovery

by Philip.Belben＠powertech.co.uk

Allison (>>) and Tony (>) wrote: >> media you may pit it some or at least remagnetize a small area, disaster >> for servo tracks. >> >> FYI/note: Why do ALL drives spin up then load the heads? It's to allow > > A lot of winchesters land the heads on the platter - and not always in a > special 'landing zone'. This implies the heads start flying as the disk > gets up to speed. > > It also implies that the heads can land on the platter without damage. On > the other hand, there's a difference between the landing when the drive > spins down, and crashing due to hitting a dust particle. > >> the airflow from the spinning media to establish the clean airflow inside >> the drive. Also any dust on the active portion of the media spins off the >> media and is then captured in a filter. > > Agreed... A lot has been said about dust in hard drives, most of it assuming that the dust is dry. But only one person (sorry, can't remember who) has talked about other things. Remember, not all pollutants are dry. Some (water, spittle) are wet, and some are quite sticky (ever parked your car under lime trees?). These will mess a hard drive up something cruel! Yes, if you take reasonable precautions, you may well be OK. But one day, if you haven't got a clean room, you will come to grief... BTW, I have two questions. What does HEPA stand for? And (Christian will parobably be able to answer this) how do you grade clean rooms? I take it it has something to do with the size of the largest particles you'll find in the air and/or how many of them you have... Oh yes. I take it "Tobacco for chewing only" goes without saying ;-) Philip.

27 years, 10 months

5
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fake NeXT

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

THe site is www.pandaproject.com. The reason why your suggestion won't work is that the drives are right in one of the corners. >Hmmm... Seems to me that two PC's stacked on top of each other is just >about a cube. So, why not a case that has two motherboards, with an >integral Monitor/kb/mouse switch... > > > _______________ > ||--- || > ||--- || > ||--- || > || [ ] ---|| > || [ ] ---|| > || [ ] ---|| > --------------- > ^ ^ ^ > | | \ > | \ ---- Mobo 2 with Exp Cards > \ ---- Drives (Shared Floppy?) > ---- Mobo 1, with Exp Cards > > >Okay, so maybe there isn't any point or anything, but I still think it's a >cool idea... Hmmm... Mac on one side, PC on the other? > > >--------------------------------------------------------------------- O- > >Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad >roger(a)sinasohn.com that none but madmen know." >Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates >San Francisco, California http://www.sinasohn.com/ > > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

27 years, 10 months

1
0
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Dell 4066/XE info needed

by Marty＠itgonline.com

The 4066/XE's belong to the US Government. From what I understand, when an agency excesses a machine it is up for grabs by any other federal agency, then state agency, local government, schools etc. until it is sold at GSA auction which is where you should look. Marty ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: Re: Dell 4066/XE info needed Author: Russ Blakeman <rhblake(a)bbtel.com> at internet Date: 7/16/98 9:19 AM Marty wrote: > Not that I'm aware of. We are supporting a couple hundred Dell 4066/XE > Interactive Unix servers which are at the end of their life cycle and > being replaced by Compaq Proliant 2500 and 5000 servers. We have one > in-house 4066/XE for building root drives for field servers. All other > times the 4066/XE sleeps. What (tell me please) are you/they doing with the XE's as they are replaced? I would love to get sme parts such as a Pentium upgrade board to make it a 45xx/XE as well as drive rails, hard drives, hard drive mounts, etc and I wouldn't even mind considering some for purchase if reasonable enough. Sure they are heavy but in the process of messing with this one I thought what agreat machine for a local church group that runs 15-20 machines and has limited funds, to be able to run their homeschool machines with the same software available. I guess I ought to take this to private email as well.... > Marty > > > ______________________________ Reply Separator > _________________________________ > Subject: Re: Dell 4066/XE info needed > Author: classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu at internet > Date: 7/16/98 8:44 AM > > Marty wrote: > > > Found an easy path to the info you need: > > > > 1. Access www.dell.com > > Marty is your Phoenix bios in your 4066/XE at A17? This is supposed to fix a > lot of > things including some sort of Y2K bug. Just installed it and it works nearly > invisible. It's on Dell's web site or FTP as 4xxXEA17.EXE > > -------------------------------------------------------------------- > Russ Blakeman > RB Custom Services / Rt. 1 Box 62E / Harned, KY USA 40144 > Phone: (502) 756-1749 Data/Fax:(502) 756-6991 > Email: rhblake(a)bbtel.com or rhblake(a)bigfoot.com > Website: http://members.tripod.com/~RHBLAKE/ > ICQ UIN #1714857 > AOL Instant Messenger "RHBLAKEMAN" > * Parts/Service/Upgrades and more for MOST Computers* > -------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > ------ Message Header Follows ------ > Received: from lists5.u.washington.edu by smtp.itgonline.com > (PostalUnion/SMTP(tm) v2.1.9i(b5) for Windows NT(tm)) > id AA-1998Jul16.084405.1767.51627; Thu, 16 Jul 1998 08:44:05 -0400 > Received: from host (lists.u.washington.edu [140.142.56.13]) > by lists5.u.washington.edu (8.8.4+UW97.07/8.8.4+UW97.05) with SMTP > id FAA22644; Thu, 16 Jul 1998 05:41:55 -0700 > Received: from mxu4.u.washington.edu (mxu4.u.washington.edu [140.142.33.8]) > by lists.u.washington.edu (8.8.4+UW97.07/8.8.4+UW97.05) with ESMTP > id FAA63566 for <classiccmp(a)lists.u.washington.edu>; Thu, 16 Jul 1998 > 05:41:52 -0700 > Received: from bnllc2.blue.net (www.scrtc.blue.net [206.65.217.168]) > by mxu4.u.washington.edu (8.8.4+UW97.07/8.8.4+UW98.06) with ESMTP > id FAA31415 for <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu>; Thu, 16 Jul 1998 05:41:50 > > -0700 > Received: from bbtel.com (brand102.blue.net [206.65.221.102]) > by bnllc2.blue.net (8.8.8/8.8.5) with ESMTP id HAA13618 > for <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu>; Thu, 16 Jul 1998 07:42:43 -0500 (CDT) > Message-Id: <35ADF507.6847A34A(a)bbtel.com> > Date: Thu, 16 Jul 1998 07:41:44 -0500 > Reply-To: classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu > Sender: CLASSICCMP-owner(a)u.washington.edu > Precedence: bulk > From: Russ Blakeman <rhblake(a)bbtel.com> > To: "Discussion re-collecting of classic computers" > <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> > Subject: Re: Dell 4066/XE info needed > References: <1998Jul13.141642.1767.118341(a)smtp.itgonline.com> > MIME-Version: 1.0 > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii > Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > X-Listprocessor-Version: 8.1 beta -- ListProcessor(tm) by CREN -- -------------------------------------------------------------------- Russ Blakeman RB Custom Services / Rt. 1 Box 62E / Harned, KY USA 40144 Phone: (502) 756-1749 Data/Fax:(502) 756-6991 Email: rhblake(a)bbtel.com or rhblake(a)bigfoot.com Website: http://members.tripod.com/~RHBLAKE/ ICQ UIN #1714857 AOL Instant Messenger "RHBLAKEMAN" * Parts/Service/Upgrades and more for MOST Computers* -------------------------------------------------------------------- ------ Message Header Follows ------ Received: from bnllc2.blue.net by smtp.itgonline.com (PostalUnion/SMTP(tm) v2.1.9i(b5) for Windows NT(tm)) id AA-1998Jul16.091914.1767.51631; Thu, 16 Jul 1998 09:19:15 -0400 Received: from bbtel.com (brand102.blue.net [206.65.221.102]) by bnllc2.blue.net (8.8.8/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA17588; Thu, 16 Jul 1998 08:17:57 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <35ADFD49.673151C4(a)bbtel.com> Date: Thu, 16 Jul 1998 08:16:58 -0500 From: Russ Blakeman <rhblake(a)bbtel.com> Organization: RB Custom Services X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu, marty(a)itgonline.com Subject: Re: Dell 4066/XE info needed References: <1998Jul16.085228.1767.119269(a)smtp.itgonline.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

27 years, 10 months

1
0
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Amiga Mice (and Atari)

by Anthony.Dellett＠Staples.com

Oh man! Talk about a day late... I "donated" a whole ton of Amiga mice/keyboards to a friend when I moved from Chicago to Boston. Tony > -----Original Message----- > From: Uncle Roger [mailto:sinasohn@ricochet.net] > Sent: Wednesday, July 15, 1998 10:53 PM > To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers > Subject: Amiga Mice (and Atari) > > > At 06:55 PM 7/7/98 +0100, you wrote: > >> >Also, are the keyboard and mouse PC-compatible? > >> > >> Alas, no. The keyboard will run you about $60, and the > mouse about $15. > > There seems to be a guy who posts Amiga/Atari mice for sale pretty > regularly on the Antique Computers section of Haggle (or it > may be either > Workstations or Other Computers); I think they sell for about > $15. There's > also a woman (Brenda Watson?) who sells Atari mice; I bought > one and it > seems fine. No connection, yada yada yada. > > > -------------------------------------------------------------- > ------- O- > > Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad > roger(a)sinasohn.com that none but > madmen know." > Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates > San Francisco, California http://www.sinasohn.com/

27 years, 10 months

1
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Places to visit in Silicon Valley?

by Anthony.Dellett＠Staples.com

Weird Stuff Warehouse! The ultimate store for computer junk! http://www.weirdstuff.com/ Tony > -----Original Message----- > From: Kai Kaltenbach [mailto:kaikal@MICROSOFT.com] > Sent: Wednesday, July 15, 1998 8:24 PM > To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers > Subject: Places to visit in Silicon Valley? > > > I'm going to be visiting the silicon valley area and I'd > appreciate any tips > on where to look for interesting old computer gear. > > This is a one-time visit so if you're afraid of spreading the > word around on > your favorite spots, send me email instead of posting to the > list, I won't > tell anyone your secrets, I swear! > > thanks, > > Kai >

27 years, 10 months

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Dell 4066/XE info needed

by Marty＠itgonline.com

Not that I'm aware of. We are supporting a couple hundred Dell 4066/XE Interactive Unix servers which are at the end of their life cycle and being replaced by Compaq Proliant 2500 and 5000 servers. We have one in-house 4066/XE for building root drives for field servers. All other times the 4066/XE sleeps. Marty ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: Re: Dell 4066/XE info needed Author: classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu at internet Date: 7/16/98 8:44 AM Marty wrote: > Found an easy path to the info you need: > > 1. Access www.dell.com Marty is your Phoenix bios in your 4066/XE at A17? This is supposed to fix a lot of things including some sort of Y2K bug. Just installed it and it works nearly invisible. It's on Dell's web site or FTP as 4xxXEA17.EXE -------------------------------------------------------------------- Russ Blakeman RB Custom Services / Rt. 1 Box 62E / Harned, KY USA 40144 Phone: (502) 756-1749 Data/Fax:(502) 756-6991 Email: rhblake(a)bbtel.com or rhblake(a)bigfoot.com Website: http://members.tripod.com/~RHBLAKE/ ICQ UIN #1714857 AOL Instant Messenger "RHBLAKEMAN" * Parts/Service/Upgrades and more for MOST Computers* -------------------------------------------------------------------- ------ Message Header Follows ------ Received: from lists5.u.washington.edu by smtp.itgonline.com (PostalUnion/SMTP(tm) v2.1.9i(b5) for Windows NT(tm)) id AA-1998Jul16.084405.1767.51627; Thu, 16 Jul 1998 08:44:05 -0400 Received: from host (lists.u.washington.edu [140.142.56.13]) by lists5.u.washington.edu (8.8.4+UW97.07/8.8.4+UW97.05) with SMTP id FAA22644; Thu, 16 Jul 1998 05:41:55 -0700 Received: from mxu4.u.washington.edu (mxu4.u.washington.edu [140.142.33.8]) by lists.u.washington.edu (8.8.4+UW97.07/8.8.4+UW97.05) with ESMTP id FAA63566 for <classiccmp(a)lists.u.washington.edu>; Thu, 16 Jul 1998 05:41:52 -0700 Received: from bnllc2.blue.net (www.scrtc.blue.net [206.65.217.168]) by mxu4.u.washington.edu (8.8.4+UW97.07/8.8.4+UW98.06) with ESMTP id FAA31415 for <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu>; Thu, 16 Jul 1998 05:41:50 -0700 Received: from bbtel.com (brand102.blue.net [206.65.221.102]) by bnllc2.blue.net (8.8.8/8.8.5) with ESMTP id HAA13618 for <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu>; Thu, 16 Jul 1998 07:42:43 -0500 (CDT) Message-Id: <35ADF507.6847A34A(a)bbtel.com> Date: Thu, 16 Jul 1998 07:41:44 -0500 Reply-To: classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu Sender: CLASSICCMP-owner(a)u.washington.edu Precedence: bulk From: Russ Blakeman <rhblake(a)bbtel.com> To: "Discussion re-collecting of classic computers" <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> Subject: Re: Dell 4066/XE info needed References: <1998Jul13.141642.1767.118341(a)smtp.itgonline.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Listprocessor-Version: 8.1 beta -- ListProcessor(tm) by CREN

27 years, 10 months

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How many computers?

by guerney＠uq.net.au

-----Original Message----- From: dave dameron <ddameron(a)earthlink.net> >Speaking of books, >has anyone seen the book "We Built our own Computers" by A.B. Holt, >Cambridge Univ. Press, published about 1966. Yes, I've got it here (bought as part of a $3 per bag haul from a charity book sale a month ago). You are right about year and publisher, but the "author" was Bolt, not Holt - it is part of a series called School Mathematics Project Handbooks and A.B Bolt actually lists himself as "supervisor" of 6 Exeter School 6th form boys who actually wrote the book. It describes a binary adder, a NIM machine, a noughts and crosses machine .... I see a few other replies, so that it is not all that rare :( - but what exactly did you want to know for? Phil Guerney Brisbane, Australia

27 years, 10 months

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Dell 4066/XE info needed

by Marty＠itgonline.com

Found an easy path to the info you need: 1. Access www.dell.com 2. Click on the SUPPORT wrench at the top of the home page. 3. Click on TROUBLESHOOT YOUR DELL SYSTEM 4. Now you will be prompted to HELP US IDENTIFY YOUR SYSTEM <or> OR SELECT YOUR SYSTEM MODEL. Under SELECT YOUR SYSTEM MODEL click on the last choice, All Other Product Lines. 5. Under All Other Product Lines, click on 80486. 6. Now you will see 80486 highlighted in black on the left of the screen. On the right side click on the second choice from the top which is 40XX/XE and you will finally be there. The address is http://www.dell.com/support/tech/dta/4000XE/index.htm By the way, the Dell 4066/XE is a great server, very reliable and well built from my experience. Marty ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: Re: Dell 4066/XE info needed Author: classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu at internet Date: 7/13/98 1:09 PM Been there, done that. I got driver files but nothing more. Will have to dig a little further I guess....Nice machine though, but big enough to put a cushion on use for a couch :-) Marty wrote: > At http:/www.dell.com you will find everything you need although you > will need to do some digging as Dell seems to change this site and the > method to find info every six months. Anyway, you will find > troubleshooting info, tech specs, jumper settings, illustrations, etc. > > Marty > > ______________________________ Reply Separator > _________________________________ > Subject: Dell 4066/XE info needed > Author: classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu at internet > Date: 7/11/98 11:10 PM > > Just picked up a Dell 4066/XE 486DX2 server unit, complete. It has EISA > slots, tons of drive slots, etc...It is in a BIG case!!.... > > Anyone possibly have a manual for one of these? I'd like to buy one, pay > for a copy, get a scan over the net, something. With all of you that > work in corporate business someone might have one, or know of an online > text or PDF copy. > > -------------------------------------------------------------------- > Russ Blakeman > RB Custom Services / Rt. 1 Box 62E / Harned, KY USA 40144 > Phone: (502) 756-1749 Data/Fax:(502) 756-6991 > Email: rhblake(a)bbtel.com or rhblake(a)bigfoot.com > Website: http://members.tripod.com/~RHBLAKE/ > ICQ UIN #1714857 > AOL Instant Messenger "RHBLAKEMAN" > * Parts/Service/Upgrades and more for MOST Computers* > -------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > ------ Message Header Follows ------ > Received: from lists5.u.washington.edu by smtp.itgonline.com > (PostalUnion/SMTP(tm) v2.1.9i(b5) for Windows NT(tm)) > id AA-1998Jul11.231024.1767.50787; Sat, 11 Jul 1998 23:10:24 -0400 > Received: from host (lists.u.washington.edu [140.142.56.13]) > by lists5.u.washington.edu (8.8.4+UW97.07/8.8.4+UW97.05) with SMTP > id UAA09277; Sat, 11 Jul 1998 20:07:49 -0700 > Received: from mxu2.u.washington.edu (mxu2.u.washington.edu [140.142.32.9]) > by lists.u.washington.edu (8.8.4+UW97.07/8.8.4+UW97.05) with ESMTP > id UAA68704 for <classiccmp(a)lists.u.washington.edu>; Sat, 11 Jul 1998 > 20:07:43 -0700 > Received: from bnllc2.blue.net (www.cruciblemagnetics.com [206.65.217.154]) > by mxu2.u.washington.edu (8.8.4+UW97.07/8.8.4+UW98.06) with ESMTP > id UAA16711 for <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu>; Sat, 11 Jul 1998 20:07:36 > > -0700 > Received: from bbtel.com (brand241.blue.net [206.65.221.241]) > by bnllc2.blue.net (8.8.8/8.8.5) with ESMTP id WAA14717 > for <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu.>; Sat, 11 Jul 1998 22:08:27 -0500 (CDT) > Message-Id: <35A8287B.AC5593F9(a)bbtel.com> > Date: Sat, 11 Jul 1998 22:07:39 -0500 > Reply-To: classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu > Sender: CLASSICCMP-owner(a)u.washington.edu > Precedence: bulk > From: Russ Blakeman <rhblake(a)bbtel.com> > To: "Discussion re-collecting of classic computers" > <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> > Subject: Dell 4066/XE info needed > MIME-Version: 1.0 > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii > Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > X-To: Classic computers message group <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> > X-Listprocessor-Version: 8.1 beta -- ListProcessor(tm) by CREN -- -------------------------------------------------------------------- Russ Blakeman RB Custom Services / Rt. 1 Box 62E / Harned, KY USA 40144 Phone: (502) 756-1749 Data/Fax:(502) 756-6991 Email: rhblake(a)bbtel.com or rhblake(a)bigfoot.com Website: http://members.tripod.com/~RHBLAKE/ ICQ UIN #1714857 AOL Instant Messenger "RHBLAKEMAN" * Parts/Service/Upgrades and more for MOST Computers* -------------------------------------------------------------------- ------ Message Header Follows ------ Received: from lists2.u.washington.edu by smtp.itgonline.com (PostalUnion/SMTP(tm) v2.1.9i(b5) for Windows NT(tm)) id AA-1998Jul13.130904.1767.50978; Mon, 13 Jul 1998 13:09:04 -0400 Received: from host (lists.u.washington.edu [140.142.56.13]) by lists2.u.washington.edu (8.8.4+UW97.07/8.8.4+UW97.05) with SMTP id KAA24765; Mon, 13 Jul 1998 10:06:46 -0700 Received: from mxu3.u.washington.edu (mxu3.u.washington.edu [140.142.33.7]) by lists.u.washington.edu (8.8.4+UW97.07/8.8.4+UW97.05) with ESMTP id JAA39788 for <classiccmp(a)lists.u.washington.edu>; Mon, 13 Jul 1998 09:32:00 -0700 Received: from bnllc2.blue.net (www.crumaxmagnetics.com [206.65.217.166]) by mxu3.u.washington.edu (8.8.4+UW97.07/8.8.4+UW98.06) with ESMTP id JAA19027 for <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu>; Mon, 13 Jul 1998 09:32:00 -0700 Received: from bbtel.com (brand124.blue.net [206.65.221.124]) by bnllc2.blue.net (8.8.8/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA02327 for <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu>; Mon, 13 Jul 1998 11:32:51 -0500 (CDT) Message-Id: <35AA368A.5A6CECC3(a)bbtel.com> Date: Mon, 13 Jul 1998 11:32:11 -0500 Reply-To: classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu Sender: CLASSICCMP-owner(a)u.washington.edu Precedence: bulk From: Russ Blakeman <rhblake(a)bbtel.com> To: "Discussion re-collecting of classic computers" <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> Subject: Re: Dell 4066/XE info needed References: <1998Jul13.112136.1767.118264(a)smtp.itgonline.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Listprocessor-Version: 8.1 beta -- ListProcessor(tm) by CREN

27 years, 10 months

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Denver sources?

by sinasohn＠ricochet.net

My girlfriend and I are hoping to go on holiday at the beginning of August, and right now, it looks like Denver/Boulder will be our destination. So, does anyone know of any good thrift shops/swapmeets/etc. in the area? (And, off-topically, antique or teacher stores? Gotta keep the gf happy too! 8^) Thanks! --------------------------------------------------------------------- O- Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad roger(a)sinasohn.com that none but madmen know." Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates San Francisco, California http://www.sinasohn.com/

27 years, 10 months

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Fwd: Free Telatype brand telatypes

by cfandt＠servtech.com

Folks, here's something I found on the Boatanchors Swap List. Wonder if they're ASR-33's? If so, they are of interest to us that collect early DEC and Data General, etc. computers. Of course, contact WA6GYD directly to rescue these -I'm just passing this lead on.... >X-Authentication-Warning: ns1.foothill.net: majordom set sender to owner-baswaplist(a)foothill.net using -f >From: WA6GYD(a)aol.com >Date: Wed, 15 Jul 1998 21:02:04 EDT >To: baswaplist(a)foothill.net >Subject: Free Telatype brand telatypes >X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 49 >Sender: owner-baswaplist(a)foothill.net > >2 late model machines with re-perfs on floor stands with power supplys. >These need to be picked up this week 16th or 17th July or they will be thrown >in dump. > >they are located in So San Francisco. need reply of interest tonite or >tommorow. > >Don > Christian Fandt, Electronic/Electrical Historian Jamestown, NY USA Member of Antique Wireless Association URL: http://www.ggw.org/freenet/a/awa/

27 years, 10 months

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FW: FREE DECWriter (LA120) up for grabs, Bay Area

by kyrrin＠jps.net

Found on Usenet. If you're interested, get hold of the fellow directly. Attachment follows. -=-=- <snip> -=-=- On Wed, 15 Jul 1998 16:35:25 -0700, in comp.os.vms you wrote: >>From: Mike Graff <mgraff(a)aimnet.com> >>Newsgroups: comp.os.vms >>Subject: LA120 available - interested? >>Date: Wed, 15 Jul 1998 16:35:25 -0700 >>Organization: Wombat Internet Guild >>Lines: 12 >>Message-ID: <35AD3CA4.AFB9FECD(a)aimnet.com> >>Reply-To: mgraff(a)aimnet.com >>NNTP-Posting-Host: host52.macsource.com >>Mime-Version: 1.0 >>Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii >>Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit >>X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 (Macintosh; U; PPC) >>Path: blushng.jps.net!news.eli.net!news.burgoyne.com!news.eecs.umich.edu!nntprelay.mathworks.com!newshub.northeast.verio.net!news1.best.com!204.188.144.17.MISMATCH!batnet!not-for-mail >> >>Hi all, >> >>I've got an old LA120 hardcopy terminal (aka DECWRITER III) to give away. >> >>The unit is fully functional (as far as I can tell). I've got some spare >>ribbons for it too. >> >>You come haul it away, it's yours. I am located in the San Francisco Bay >>Area. First come first served. Email me at mgraff(a)computerware.com. >> >>Thanks, >>Mike -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Bruce Lane, Sysop, The Dragon's Cave (Fido 1:343/272) http://table.jps.net/~kyrrin -- also kyrrin [A-t] Jps {D=o=t} Net Spam is bad. Spam is theft of service. Spam wastes resources. Don't spam, period. I am a WASHINGTON STATE resident. Spam charged $500.00 per incident per Chapter 19 RCW.

27 years, 10 months

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RT11 SIG tapes

by mbg＠world.std.com

> The tapes are spoken for. John Lawson claimed the stack, with Dave >Jenner a close second. Glad to see they're going to a good home. Thanks, >folks! Any chance someone could determine if there are any sig tapes among the stack which aren't currently available from any of the pdp-11 archives and make sure the archives get a copy? (Tim Shoppa?) Megan Gentry Former RT-11 Developer +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+ | Megan Gentry, EMT/B, PP-ASEL | Internet (work): gentry(a)zk3.dec.com | | Unix Support Engineering Group | (home): mbg(a)world.std.com | | Digital Equipment Corporation | | | 110 Spitbrook Rd. ZK03-2/T43 | URL: http://world.std.com/~mbg/ | | Nashua, NH 03062 | "pdp-11 programmer - some assembler | | (603) 884 1055 | required." - mbg | +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+

27 years, 10 months

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FW: Q-bus and other boards available

by kyrrin＠jps.net

Fellow sent me a message to the effect that he's got a stack of various DEC and T1000 boards available. If interested, please contact him directly at: jboldway(a)cottagesoft.com List follows. -=-=- <break> -=-=- Here's a list of boards: 2 X G114 2 X G235 1 X H207 2 X H217 1 X M225 1 X M3104 4 X M7168 2 X M7169 1 X M7231 1 X M7233 1 X M7234 1 X M7235 1 X M7236 1 X M7238 2 X M7555 2 X M7606 2 X M7607 2 X M7608 1 X M8012 1 X M8027 1 X M8186 2 X M8637 1 X M8639 4 X M9047 2 X clearpoint Q-RAM 11B with 76 256K chips per board packed in as tight as you could put them. Bet these burned out from heat problems really fast! "Codar Technology" model 120 calender clock. A battery backup, I presume - 2 x 3V duracell batteries on this board. The other T1000 boards: 3 X T1019 1 X T1003 1 X T1002 1 X T1012 1 X T1014 2 X T1001 -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Bruce Lane, Sysop, The Dragon's Cave BBS (Fidonet 1:343/272) (Hamateur: WD6EOS) (E-mail: kyrrin(a)jps.net) "Our science can only describe an object, event, or living thing in our own human terms. It cannot, in any way, define any of them..."

27 years, 10 months

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fake NeXT

by sinasohn＠ricochet.net

At 01:10 PM 7/12/98 PDT, you wrote: >black cube, the size of a NeXT cube, but balanced on one corner with >little feet supporting it. It's made of aluminum and is just a regular Actually, that sounds like a pretty neat idea. I'll have to check it out... >uglier than the NeXT, and I don't quite know the reason for making it a Simple... To differentiate it from the hordes of other technically identical PC's available. If I had to choose between a standard PC-type case and something like that (on a consumer level) I'd definitely go for the oddball. Consider Bang and Olufsen stereos -- same thing. >cube - it doesn't support four motherboards or anything! Just thought >you people might be interested. Hmmm... Seems to me that two PC's stacked on top of each other is just about a cube. So, why not a case that has two motherboards, with an integral Monitor/kb/mouse switch... _______________ ||--- || ||--- || ||--- || || [ ] ---|| || [ ] ---|| || [ ] ---|| --------------- ^ ^ ^ | | \ | \ ---- Mobo 2 with Exp Cards \ ---- Drives (Shared Floppy?) ---- Mobo 1, with Exp Cards Okay, so maybe there isn't any point or anything, but I still think it's a cool idea... Hmmm... Mac on one side, PC on the other? --------------------------------------------------------------------- O- Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad roger(a)sinasohn.com that none but madmen know." Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates San Francisco, California http://www.sinasohn.com/

27 years, 10 months

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Amiga Mice (and Atari)

by sinasohn＠ricochet.net

At 06:55 PM 7/7/98 +0100, you wrote: >> >Also, are the keyboard and mouse PC-compatible? >> >> Alas, no. The keyboard will run you about $60, and the mouse about $15. There seems to be a guy who posts Amiga/Atari mice for sale pretty regularly on the Antique Computers section of Haggle (or it may be either Workstations or Other Computers); I think they sell for about $15. There's also a woman (Brenda Watson?) who sells Atari mice; I bought one and it seems fine. No connection, yada yada yada. --------------------------------------------------------------------- O- Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad roger(a)sinasohn.com that none but madmen know." Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates San Francisco, California http://www.sinasohn.com/

27 years, 10 months

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Help ID Emulex quad module

by mbg＠world.std.com

>But Andromeda has long supported 3.5" floppies under MSCP >emulation, both as 1.2 Mbyte >and 1.44 Mbyte devices. It's very possible that the UDC11 has >been configured to report back the drive type as RX33. My Andromeda >SCDC can be configured to work either way. Don't you have a ESDC, >Megan? Ever try a 3.5" floppy on it? Nope, because I don't have the adapter that is required for connecting to such a drive... Megan Gentry Former RT-11 Developer +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+ | Megan Gentry, EMT/B, PP-ASEL | Internet (work): gentry(a)zk3.dec.com | | Unix Support Engineering Group | (home): mbg(a)world.std.com | | Digital Equipment Corporation | | | 110 Spitbrook Rd. ZK03-2/T43 | URL: http://world.std.com/~mbg/ | | Nashua, NH 03062 | "pdp-11 programmer - some assembler | | (603) 884 1055 | required." - mbg | +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+

27 years, 10 months

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Question on DEC file formats

by mbg＠world.std.com

>Do there exist DEC drives A and B such that A and B have their own >(different) 'native' packs, and packs from A can also be read (at least) >in B, but not vice versa I don't know of any such disk packs (in fact, there is one combination, I forget which, which will result in a volume spindle swedged into the drive spindle -- making the drive so much worthless hardware) However, TK50 and TK70 fit the bill... you can read TK50s on a TK70, but not write them. Tapes written on a TK70 cannot be read on a TK50. Megan Gentry Former RT-11 Developer +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+ | Megan Gentry, EMT/B, PP-ASEL | Internet (work): gentry(a)zk3.dec.com | | Unix Support Engineering Group | (home): mbg(a)world.std.com | | Digital Equipment Corporation | | | 110 Spitbrook Rd. ZK03-2/T43 | URL: http://world.std.com/~mbg/ | | Nashua, NH 03062 | "pdp-11 programmer - some assembler | | (603) 884 1055 | required." - mbg | +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+

27 years, 10 months

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Help ID Emulex quad module

by cfandt＠servtech.com

In the MicroPDP-11/73 that I got in the great haul there's an Emulex quad board which I want to identify. An identifying number on it is C3987-C. Two 50-pin headers are on the edge pointing to the back. No cables attached. Stuff obviously has been swiped >from this system.

27 years, 10 months

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How many computers?

by franke＠sbs.de

> BBC Microcomputer Model B-plus B-plus ? Never heard of it or is this jus another motherboard revision ? > Torch Z80 Card x 2 ?? same here. Gruss H. -- Ich denke, also bin ich, also gut HRK

27 years, 10 months

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How many computers?

by pete＠dunnington.u-net.com

On Jul 15, 0:47, Christopher Denham wrote: > I have a Torch its a big box 2 5 1/4 drives plugs into the Tube of > the BBC and runs msdos about half the speed of a XT ......... That sounds like a Graduate. There were several Torch units; the original was a Eurocard-sized Z80 processor that fitted inside the BBC and came with dual double-sided 80-track drives in a case styled to fit under the Beeb. Notorious for noisy head solenoids and a rather iffy SMPSU. Then came the Graduate, based on an 8086 (?), followed by the Unicorn, which was a repackaged Beeb with a Z000 (? or 68000?) running a Xenix derivative. -- Pete Peter Turnbull Dept. of Computer Science University of York

27 years, 10 months

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taking care of bad sectors... easy stuff. Was: Re: hard

by jeff.kaneko＠ifrsys.com

At 09:37 AM 7/15/98 -0500, you wrote: E-Mail Me privately, at: jeff.pat(a)mindspring.com Jeff >OK, easy on that anti-MS stuff. Kai might be reading :) Anyway, Scandisk >is useful for erasing lost files which is all I use it for. Does anyone >have an old copy of Spinrite or know of a place where I could get it? >How much does the latest one go for? > >>I truely hate the brain-damaged program >>ScanDisk as nothing more than a Trojan Horse! Microsoft should have >>known better than to put out something like that. I have *never* had a >>problem with Spinrite although that probably includes only a few >hundred >>drives I have worked on. >> > > >______________________________________________________ >Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com >

27 years, 10 months

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MAD Computer

by jeff.kaneko＠ifrsys.com

At 10:01 AM 7/15/98 -0500, you wrote: I'll bet I know-- My MAD-1 (nee TELEX 1186) had a card with such a BNC connector. It was used for connectivity with IBM mainframes (3720 Emulation?), and pretty much useless for anything else. Jeff >Speaking of TELEX, they once had the tan-colored 286 boxes, pretty >small, with only a 3.5" fdd and a hardcard. They had a BNC connector >emanating from the motherboard. Does anyone know what that was for? If >it's a network card, does anyone know about drivers? > >>I once had one of these nasty little beasties. In fact, it was >>a rare version that was badged for TELEX/Memorex. It used an >>80186 CPU-- It was fast, at least to me, anyway (although >>I don't recall the clock speed). > > >______________________________________________________ >Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com >

27 years, 10 months

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Atari 800 (was free atari in Sacremento)

by SUPRDAVE＠aol.com

In a message dated 98-07-15 05:19:21 EDT, thomas pfaff put forth: << What always amazed me was this huge aluminum casting at the center of the machine where you inserted the BASIC and game cartridges. That casting must have added significant cost to manufacturing the >> well, my atari 400 is the same way. ive never seen a computer with so much metal in it like that. perhaps it was for emissions issues? the 400 had that dreadful keypad too so i can imagine even the best typist could only type about 1-2cps. david

27 years, 10 months

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C64 parts

by manney＠lrbcg.com

I've several junk C64's I have been saving, if you want parts from them. manney(a)lrbcg.com "Enough is abundance to the wise." -- Euripides >Anyone know a good source of C64/C128 parts in the US (the chips >mostly). I have a C128 and two C64s that are going to require >replacement chips and I have no idea where to get them. > >Thanks >Tony > > >

27 years, 10 months

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Rare vs. Desirable

by fmc＠reanimators.org

> What is it with Apple and clear plastic cases anyways? I think I remember > clear plastic Apple ]['s at dealers. Did Apple do this for all of their > models? I remember clear plastic Apple ][ lids. In fact I think I remember seeing them for sale in Computerland in Rockville, MD way long ago, but can't recall whether they were made by Apple or just made to fit. Just the thing to show off your new computer inside its boring beige case. Apple is not alone in the clear-plastic business. I've seen clear cases for some older HP calculators from the mid-to-late 1970s. -Frank McConnell

27 years, 10 months

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Off-topic informational anti-spam anecdotal

by dastar＠ncal.verio.com

This is totally off-topic but this is the kind of thing you all can appreciate, and it may even help some of you. For the last several months I have constantly been spammed by what can be described as Son-of-Spamford. There's some spam e-mail software marketing company in Los Angeles that sends out millions of these messages I guess. They use web crawlers that steal e-mail addresses from web pages. They then send out this spam letter with forged headers and false return addresses. Very annoying. However, they do include a phone number and address at the end of the spam. Interesting. I've included the message at the end of this message so you can see if you've been spammed by these assholes as well. I was so incensed at one point that I was almost going to buy a plane ticket, fly down to L.A. with a box full of this spam e-mail printed out, kick the door open to the office that these guys are in, find the president of this "company", beat the shit out of him (or pimp-slap her), then start shoving the printouts down this person's throat (yes, this is rather violent :) But I soon figured out that the address was merely a private mailbox, and the phone number rings into a voicemail box. Hmmm. Well, I have the resources to find out where this number rings in to, possibly track down the service provider, but then what? Then I realized, "Hey, I have a PBX, a T-1 and a voicemail system with 16 ports...its time to have some fun." Thus sprang forth the Spaminator! The Spaminator is something I threw together in about 10 minutes. What the Spaminator does is call the offendor's number, wait for the voicemail to answer, dial a digit to cut thru the outgoing message, then it starts singing simple tunes by playing "spam" in different notes. I recorded a "spam" scale with my own voice. Basically I sang "spam" starting from A and going to G. I created 10 different song files, with simple tunes such as "Mary Had a Little Spam", "Twinkle Twinkle Little Spam", "Happy Spamday", "We Shall Overcome (the spam)", "Jingle Spam", "Popeye the Sailor Spam", and a few others. The Spaminator randomly selects three spam tunes to play for each call. It plays the tunes, then hangs up and calls right back up again. The Spaminator is currently running, filling up the spammers voicemail box with spam tunes. Hopefully, it will fill up the voicemail box and they won't be able to receive any other messages. Also, it will bring them much anguish as they constantly try to delete these messages that don't stop coming. The last I checked the Spaminator had played over 100 spam tunes into their voicemail box. I am ecstatic. The Spaminator will continue to run over night. Tomorrow morning I will check its progress (it keeps a log of all tunes it plays so I know how many it did). If anyone is interested in utilizing the Spaminator for spaminating other egregious spammers, let me know. I can easily program it to simultaneously call out to other phone numbers and sing a symphony of spam for them as well. I hope that my simple solution brings some manner of grief to these idiots, whoever they are. Ideally it will give them more anguish than their constant barrage of spam has brought me. I will not relent. My next step is to try and track down the actual owners of this "business", try to find out their other phone numbers (preferrably home numbers) and unleash the Spaminator on those numbers as well. Thanks for letting me vent. Sam Alternate e-mail: dastar(a)siconic.com ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Ever onward. September 26 & 27...Vintage Computer Festival 2 See http://www.siconic.com/vcf for details! [Last web page update: 07/05/98] ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Mon, 13 Jul 1998 16:16:46 -0700 From: "***Bull*sEye)*" <33rq2w(a)att.net> To: vcoffey(a)bu.edu Authenticated sender is <33rq2w(a)att.net> Subject: ++BullsEye-*Targeting*Software*)+ Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit EMAIL MARKETING WORKS!! Bull's Eye Gold is the PREMIER email address collection tool. This program allows you to develop TARGETED lists of email addresses. Doctors, florists, MLM, biz opp,...you can collect anything...you are only limited by your imagination! You can even collect email addresses for specific states, cities, and even countries! All you need is your web browser and this program. Our software utilizes the latest in search technology called "spidering". By simply feeding the spider program a starting website it will collect for hours. The spider will go from website to targeted website providing you with thousands upon thousands of fresh TARGETED email addresses. When you are done collecting, the spider removes duplicates and saves the email list in a ready to send format. No longer is it necessary to send millions of ads to get a handful of responses...SEND LESS...EARN MORE!!! A terrific aspect of the Bull's Eye software is that there is no difficult set up involved and no special technical mumbo-jumbo to learn. All you need to know is how to search for your targeted market in one of the many search engines and let the spider do the rest! Not familiar with the search engines? No problem, we provide you with a list of all the top search engines. Just surf to the location of a search engine on your browser then search for the market you wish to reach...it's that easy! For instance if you were looking for email addresses of Doctors in New York all you would do is: 1) Do a search using your favorite search engine by typing in the words doctor(s) and New York 2) Copy the URL (one or more)...that's the stuff after the http://... for instance it might look like http://www.yahoo.com/?doctor(s)/?New+York 3) Press the START button THAT's IT!!! The Bull's Eye spider will go to all the websites that are linked, automatically extracting the email addresses you want. The spider is passive too! That means you can let it run all day or all night while you are working on important things or just having fun on your computer. There is no need to keep a constant watch on it, just feed it your target market and give it praise when it delivers thousands of email addresses at the end of the day! Features of the Bull's Eye Software: * Does TARGETED searches of websites collecting the email addresses you want! * Collects Email addresses by City, State, even specific Countries * Runs Automatically...simply enter the Starting information, press The Start Button, and it does the rest * Filters out duplicates * Keeps track of URLs already visited * Can run 24 hours per day, 7 days per week * Fast and Easy List Management * Also has built in filtering options...you can put in words that it "Must" have while searching,...you can even put in criteria that it "Must NOT Have"...giving you added flexibility * Also imports email addresses from any kind of files (text files, binary files, database files) * List editor handles Multiple files to work on many lists simultaneously * Has a Black-Book feature... avoid sending emails to people who do not want to receive it * Built-in Mail program...send email directly on the internet with just a click of your mouse * Personalized Emails...if the email address has the user's name when it is collected,..you can send Personalized emails!!! * Sort by Location, Server, User Name, Contact Name * Advanced Operations: · Email address lists export in many different formats (HTML, Comma delimited, text file) · Advanced editing...Transfer, Copy, Addition, Delete, Crop, Move to Top/Bottom · Operations between lists...Union, Subtraction, Comparison * Program is Passive,...meaning you can run other programs at the same time CALL FOR MORE INFORMATION 213-427-5820 CALL FOR MORE INFORMATION 213-427-5820 ORDERING INFORMATION Customer Name Company Name Address City State Zip Phone Fax Email Address ______ BULL'S EYE SOFTWARE $259.00 Includes Software, Instructions, Technical Support ______ Shipping & Handling (2-3 Day Fedex) $10.00 (Fedex Overnite) $20.00 ______ TOTAL (CA Residents add applicable sales tax) *All orders are for Win 95 and Win NT *****CREDIT CARDS ACCEPTED***** MASTERCARD VISA AMEX PLEASE CALL 213-427-5820 to process your order 9am-5pm Pacific Time Checks or Money Orders send to: WorldTouch Network Inc. 5670 Wilshire Blvd. Suite 2170 Los Angeles, CA 90036 Please note: Allow 5 business days for all checks to clear before order is shipped. *If you would like your email address removed, please write us at the above address.

27 years, 10 months

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Help ID Emulex quad module(here's more info...)

by pete＠dunnington.u-net.com

On Jul 15, 15:01, Christian Fandt wrote: > This is "tomorrow". More details from that silvery sticker: > > "TOP ASSY TC0210201-FSH" > "S/N 93395" > "Sub ASSY C3987 C" > > Hmmm, that Top Assy number has TC02 in it Tim. Also, when looking at the > board from the component side up, edge fingers downward, there is a male > 26-pin header at top left and a male 20-pin header at top right. In top > center is a 4-position DIP switch (SW1) and a single LED (CR1). Just to > left of center and downward there are SW2 and SW3 which are both > 10-position DIP switches. "C3987" is on a small bar coded sticker under the > left-hand 50-pin header. > > With that TC02 in the Top Assy number would that mean this is indeed a TC02 > tape I/F as you figured? It's exactly the TC02 that I have (and have the manual for). The two male headers you mentioned are for diagnostics connections the factory used. It can handle up to 4 tape drives (that's what 4 of 10-way DIP switch are for). I can dig out the manual for you next week -- sorry, this week is too hectic to do it right now. You might want to send me some private email to remind me, of course :-) > If so what tape drive model(s) should I be looking for? Any Pertec-interface drive. Kennedy drives were popular. -- Pete Peter Turnbull Dept. of Computer Science University of York

27 years, 10 months

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Off-topic informational anti-spam anecdotal

by poesie＠geocities.com

Speaking of, does *67 cost? I've been up to the same pranks as Sam, w/ a local "mass marketer." I vaguely recalled it being a feature that cost nothing, but I never was sure. Sorry to keep this thread going, as humourous as it is :) -Eric >Don't forget to dial *67 or whatever the sequence is in your area to >disable the caller ID from being passed on to the recipient. If not, >they may have proof of your harrassing phone calls (and I'm sure such >slime would resort to it...) > > Megan Gentry

27 years, 10 months

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Off-topic informational anti-spam anecdotal

by peacock＠simconv.com

Here in Nevada a new anti-spam law just went into efect on July 1. Unsolicited commercial email, if sent after you request it to stop, is now a $5 (five dollars, that was not a typo) fine. I'm sure that will keep those spammers out of my mailbox. Jack Peacock -----Original Message----- From: Max Eskin [mailto:maxeskin@hotmail.com] Lawsuits are more effective because if he continues to do it, he'll lose all the money he made, maybe even go to jail.

27 years, 10 months

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C64 parts

by Anthony.Dellett＠Staples.com

Okay, I'm gonna come right out and ask it... Anyone know a good source of C64/C128 parts in the US (the chips mostly). I have a C128 and two C64s that are going to require replacement chips and I have no idea where to get them. Thanks Tony

27 years, 10 months

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How many computers?

by mbg＠world.std.com

>Speaking of books, >has anyone seen the book "We Built our own Computers" by A.B. Holt, >Cambridge Univ. Press, published about 1966. I remember one from years ago which was how to build (and program) a simple computer using paperclips and lights... (and a program 'drum' made out of a coffee can). I think I still have it... is this what you're thinking of? Megan Gentry Former RT-11 Developer +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+ | Megan Gentry, EMT/B, PP-ASEL | Internet (work): gentry(a)zk3.dec.com | | Unix Support Engineering Group | (home): mbg(a)world.std.com | | Digital Equipment Corporation | | | 110 Spitbrook Rd. ZK03-2/T43 | URL: http://world.std.com/~mbg/ | | Nashua, NH 03062 | "pdp-11 programmer - some assembler | | (603) 884 1055 | required." - mbg | +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+

27 years, 10 months

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hard drive data recovery

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

I'm not sure what that means, but I assume that the servo surface contains a sort of coordinate system that the servo head reads and thus guides the other heads. If that assumption is correct, why isn't it possible to realign the thing with another servo platter? >Of course if it's a drive with a separate servo surface and the servo >head is the one that's crashed then you lose everything. > >-tony > > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

27 years, 10 months

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just wondering

by rcini＠email.msn.com

Well, I have DOS 1.1 (May, 1982) and Windows 1.03. In fact, I'm in the process of de-compiling DOS 1.1, now. BootSector: done. IBMBIO: 75% done. IBMDOS: not started yet. I'm still looking for DOS 1.0. In fact, I have copies of many true-IBM dos-es (not OEM versions). Rich Cini/WUGNET <nospam_rcini(a)msn.com> - ClubWin! Charter Member - MCP Windows 95/Windows Networking - Preserver of "classic" computers <<<< ========== reply separator ========== >>>>>

27 years, 10 months

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taking care of bad sectors... easy stuff. Was: Re: hard

by allisonp＠world.std.com

< A more "classic"-related question related to some faded brain < cell connections in my head: Wasn't there once a CP/M version of < the Norton utilities, long before the IBM PC was even a glimmer < in its parent's eyes? There were several for CP/M, apple][ and trs80. Most were bad sector scanners and disk editors. Very useful though as TRS80 and most cp/m crates with external drive would write garbage to any externally powered disks if the system was powered off with media in the drive. Alison

27 years, 10 months

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How many computers?

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

Let me tell you why one of my keyboards now has an 'enter' key with the corner smashed off by a hammer: the damn Packard Bell with all integrated serial ports, hard disk controller, etc. wouldn't let me set my modem up on COM2 or COM4. Plus, this took very long to verify because the hard disk controller makes the IDE act like a C= 1541. >> I will say this, though: At this point in the evolution of computers, if >> you find users of your systems are wanting regularly to add on more than >> three (or so) cards or sidecar modules, you have drastically misevaluated >> your target market and deserve to start haemorrhaging market share. IMO. > >No way!. Maybe for the average consumer PC (build the disk controllers, >serial/parallel ports, etc into the motherboard), but in my case I'll >want all sorts of strange special-purpose cards (user I/O, ADC, I2C, >special disk controllers, etc, etc, etc). > >I've managed to fill the 14 slots in a PC/XT+expansion chassis and still >wanted more!. BTW, is it possible to build one of those? How does it work? >> Those don't count. (: Even the monitor and power supply hookups are BERG >> strips. Sick. What is a BERG strip? ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

27 years, 10 months

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Off-topic informational anti-spam anecdotal

by franke＠sbs.de

> Here in Nevada a new anti-spam law just went into efect on July 1. > Unsolicited commercial email, if sent after you request it to stop, is > now a $5 (five dollars, that was not a typo) fine. I'm sure that will > keep those spammers out of my mailbox. USD five ? HoHoHo. Stoping after request isnt exactly whats needed - The SPAM is already done. And getting a replay will make the address more valuable: now it is validates - the spammer now could sell the address to s.o. else for a single usage without any fear of beeing prosecuted. And you could still spamm the other people. And even if - Send out 5000 SPAMs and get 10 complains and pay USD 50 - thats USD 0.01 per 'customer contact' still _very_ cheap. I don't know if you ever looked into marketing, but companies are paying up to USD 20.00 for a singe use of ONE address. I don't think ths law will have any impact - very spaming friendly. Just done to get votes but avoide any change. Gruss H. -- Ich denke, also bin ich, also gut HRK

27 years, 10 months

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Off-topic informational anti-spam anecdotal

by mbg＠world.std.com

>Thus sprang forth the Spaminator! The Spaminator is something I threw >together in about 10 minutes. What the Spaminator does is call the >offendor's number, wait for the voicemail to answer, dial a digit to cut >thru the outgoing message, then it starts singing simple tunes by playing >"spam" in different notes. I recorded a "spam" scale with my own voice. >Basically I sang "spam" starting from A and going to G. Don't forget to dial *67 or whatever the sequence is in your area to disable the caller ID from being passed on to the recipient. If not, they may have proof of your harrassing phone calls (and I'm sure such slime would resort to it...) Megan Gentry Former RT-11 Developer +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+ | Megan Gentry, EMT/B, PP-ASEL | Internet (work): gentry(a)zk3.dec.com | | Unix Support Engineering Group | (home): mbg(a)world.std.com | | Digital Equipment Corporation | | | 110 Spitbrook Rd. ZK03-2/T43 | URL: http://world.std.com/~mbg/ | | Nashua, NH 03062 | "pdp-11 programmer - some assembler | | (603) 884 1055 | required." - mbg | +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+

27 years, 10 months

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Europe tour

by wanderer＠bos.nl

If they still have it, the is an old PDP in the Utrecht office of Digital. As far as I can remember (have seen it at least 10 years ago) it's blue, has 3 panels and the centerpanel has a round tube (a scope tube?). There were also a lot of switches on the panels. I believe that the University in Utrecht has a museum of some sort with various computers which they used over the years. You might like to go to the Waterloo square in Amsterdam, every Monday till Friday there is a flea market, and certainly there will be some vintage stuff for sale. Ed

27 years, 10 months

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taking care of bad sectors... easy stuff. Was: Re: hard

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

First of all, I think that the latest Norton Utilities are soooo bloated, they possibly won't even run on a damaged computer. High-res pictures of your computer components are the latest thing you need when you can't find a vital data file. For example, what good is it to have a data recovery program you can't run if you just formatted your hard drive? That said, I think NU is a good tool, but Spinrite is still better than NDD. >First of all MS didn't write scandisk... anyone that uses norton tools >should recognize it. it a stripped vendor version the norton tool. > >I have had excellent success with norton tools and still used copies >I've had for over 8years. > >Allison > > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

27 years, 10 months

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MAD Computer

by franke＠sbs.de

>>Does anyone have a MAD Computer? It was just another boring peecee > MAD = Magnetic Anomoly Detector > Or in other words it's used in Anti-Submarine Warfare. NoNo. MAD = Militaerischer Abschirmdienst (military counter inteligence) > (Sorry couldn't resist, yes I realize in this case this isn't what you meant.) dto :) H. -- Ich denke, also bin ich, also gut HRK

27 years, 10 months

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Anyone out there have...

by Anthony.Dellett＠Staples.com

A deceased C128 that would be willing to give up it's keyboard? I need a replacement for the C128 I'm refurbing. Thanks Tony

27 years, 10 months

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Off-topic informational anti-spam anecdotal

by peacock＠simconv.com

This is a case of the law being intended (originally) for quite different purposes. The story behind it is that the Nevada Legislature has an email system where the public can send comments to the lawmakers when the Legislature is in session (every other year for a few months). It seems last year someone flamed one of the senior politicians, he got pissed off, claimed it was racially motivated hate mail and tried to outlaw flaming. Someone (the state attorney general) pointed out to him his proposed law violated both free speech and right to petition for redress in the Constitution, but he wouldn't back down and withdraw his bill, so to keep it legal it was changed to an anti-spam law, and in theory flame mail can be legally defined as spam too. No one expects this law to ever be enforced. Jack Peacock -----Original Message----- From: Hans Franke [mailto:franke@sbs.de] USD five ? I don't think ths law will have any impact - very spaming friendly. Just done to get votes but avoide any change.

27 years, 10 months

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I'm back!

by kyrrin＠jps.net

Yes, I have returned. Lord Almighty, what a haul!! I can say with confidence that I definitely tested the maximum load specs for the (rented) Ford Windstar minivan. Every time I went over a good bump, the rear springs -almost- bottomed out. I'll be updating my web page soon with the gory details. Suffice to say I've got more than enough to keep me going, project-wise, well into next year. Among the more 'classic' items in the haul were a Kennedy 9100 tape drive installed in a nice 5-foot DEC rack, and a box full of 9-track tapes containing mostly DECUS RT-11 SIG libraries. Tony, I know you'll get a kick out of this. I also got hold of another 11/44 CPU box, loaded with cards (including a Unibus UDA50 disk controller). Between that one and my current unit, I should be able to get the power supply going AND fix the broken one for a spare! Since I'm not heavily into RT-11 (yet), I'd like to offer the RT-11 SIG tapes to whoever's interested and willing to pay shipping. There's about six or so, maybe a couple more. And would you believe I'm already planning next year's run? I know I'll see at least some of you at VCF in another couple of months. Until then... Banzai! ;-) -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Bruce Lane, Sysop, The Dragon's Cave BBS (Fidonet 1:343/272) (Hamateur: WD6EOS) (E-mail: kyrrin(a)jps.net) "Our science can only describe an object, event, or living thing in our own human terms. It cannot, in any way, define any of them..."

27 years, 10 months

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hard drive data recovery

by allisonp＠world.std.com

< Alright for some :-). Alas most of us don't have access to a clean room. < Even if I was working at a place which had one, I can't believe they'd be < too happy if I wandered in with an HDA and started stripping it. Majorly true. I worked in pharmaceuticals and though they didn't use super clean rooms (class 10,000 worst case) the equipment was under a laminar airflow curtain with a flow of 100 linear feet per minute and the air under there was class 100. The air flow was obvious ly of the the machine then into the room where super clean was less important. < I would have thought looking for backscattered light would be more < sensitive and easier to set up. Still not sensitive enough for a clean < box, of course (in this form). The air flow and the sensing area cross section are important. Using a light source like a laser is helpful in getting the backscatter brighter. This is the problem of how many Angeles can dance on the end of a pin. You build a clean box and use a good HEPA filter. With 100-200cfm of incomming clean air once the dust in the box has been blown out it will be clean especially if gloved hands are the only thing inside. I'e heard a lot of "good luck", "it will not last" and "too dirty" from those that haven't. I've done it, when RD53s and 54s were in desperately short supply here and it does work without the clean box with some care. Obvious tricks like wearing nylon gloves to avoid finger prints, a canister of dry air to blow things off and keeping the unit covered when possible all reduce risk. Allison

27 years, 10 months

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hard drive data recovery

by allisonp＠world.std.com

< I'm not sure what that means, but I assume that the servo surface < contains a sort of coordinate system that the servo head reads and thus < guides the other heads. If that assumption is correct, why isn't it < possible to realign the thing with another servo platter? First it depends if the servo is embedded or dedicated platter or stepper (or other absolute positioner). For dedicated platter one head is assigned as the servo head and since they are all mechanically one assembly the rest just follow along. Now if a platter is changed it's data may be offset relative to the others. Same thing is true for replacing a head as the RELATIVE alignment between heads is disturbed. This case I believer the disk can be low level formatted and reused but existant data may be lost. If servo information does not exist (DeMIL'd drive) it's likely good for parts as servo tracks are hard to regenerate. If it's embedded servo per head each head as selected will follow the selected track servo signals and making relative head alignment less critical. If the servo is blown there is no way to regenerate easily. For cases of absolute positioners like older ST506/412/225/251 (and a swarm of others) drives getting alignment to cylinder 000 and beteeen heads would be critical for complete data recovery. If the drive is to be reformatted however a bulk erase and reformat will establish new tracks in some cases and make a mess in others. In the case of removable pack drives that is a totally different can of worms though simpler as they so have alignment procedures for field or depot use. Allison

27 years, 10 months

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European Tour

by cfandt＠servtech.com

At 22:25 14-07-98 -0500, you wrote: >I'm planning to be in Europe for a week or so in October (a few days each >in Holland, Belgium, and Germany). I'd like to sneak in a few nerd-stops >along the way, and I'll make room in my suitcase for a couple of vintage >portables just in case. Any suggestions for the American nerd tourist in >Europe? > Doug, if you indeed do go to Munich to see the Deutches Museum I suggest you set aside at least a _full_ day to see only a couple of sections or several days to see most of the museum. Roller skates or rollerblades would be of great help to see more in less time<g> I'm the type of person who studies a museum and have spent two to four hours in each of the few sections I've visited during the three different visits to the Deutches Museum. As Hans just said in a previous msg in this thread, the computer section is indeed about 12,000 square feet. Loved it! Seriously, I do recommend seeing the collections at Deutches Museum to anybody who may visit Munich. Something for everybody. Check out URL: http://www.deutsches-museum.de/dme01.htm if you're interested. Have fun in Europe, --Chris -- -- Christian Fandt, Electronic/Electrical Historian Jamestown, NY USA Member of Antique Wireless Association URL: http://www.ggw.org/freenet/a/awa/

27 years, 10 months

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IBM 3380 HDA

by Marty＠itgonline.com

Yes, dual head positioners on both sides plus four twenty pin connectors on both sides as well. David is correct as well, I have confirmed this HDA is from an IBM 4381 mainframe and uses a 3880 controller. Does this HDA have a lineage that goes back to the IBM Ramac? Any idea when this HDA was introduced? It certainly will make a great paper weight. Marty ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: Re: IBM 3380 HDA Author: classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu at internet Date: 7/15/98 11:07 AM At 10:59 15-07-98 -0400, you wrote: > I just acquired an IBM 3380 HDA which weighs 70 lbs, and is in a clear > plastic case. Does anybody know the lineage of this? The HDA has IBM > 390X-001 as well as 13-E8719-CJ printed on a label. Good Lord... unless I miss my guess, that's from a System/390 mainframe! Let me guess... dual head positioners on either side, yes? And big connectors with about a zillion pins? -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Bruce Lane, Sysop, The Dragon's Cave BBS (Fidonet 1:343/272) (Hamateur: WD6EOS) (E-mail: kyrrin(a)jps.net) "Our science can only describe an object, event, or living thing in our own human terms. It cannot, in any way, define any of them..." ------ Message Header Follows ------ Received: from lists3.u.washington.edu by smtp.itgonline.com (PostalUnion/SMTP(tm) v2.1.9i(b5) for Windows NT(tm)) id AA-1998Jul15.110730.1767.51412; Wed, 15 Jul 1998 11:07:31 -0400 Received: from host (lists.u.washington.edu [140.142.56.13]) by lists3.u.washington.edu (8.8.4+UW97.07/8.8.4+UW97.05) with SMTP id IAA07163; Wed, 15 Jul 1998 08:05:18 -0700 Received: from mxu2.u.washington.edu (mxu2.u.washington.edu [140.142.32.9]) by lists.u.washington.edu (8.8.4+UW97.07/8.8.4+UW97.05) with ESMTP id IAA43306 for <classiccmp(a)lists.u.washington.edu>; Wed, 15 Jul 1998 08:05:13 -0700 Received: from repop1.jps.net (repop1.jps.net [208.25.63.34]) by mxu2.u.washington.edu (8.8.4+UW97.07/8.8.4+UW98.06) with ESMTP id IAA07964 for <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu>; Wed, 15 Jul 1998 08:05:12 -0700 Received: from seleth (sea-port157.jps.net [209.63.189.116]) by repop1.jps.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id IAA07712 for <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu>; Wed, 15 Jul 1998 08:06:06 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <3.0.3.32.19980715080612.00e5b9e0(a)mail.wa.jps.net> Date: Wed, 15 Jul 1998 08:06:12 -0700 Reply-To: classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu Sender: CLASSICCMP-owner(a)u.washington.edu Precedence: bulk From: Bruce Lane <kyrrin(a)jps.net> To: "Discussion re-collecting of classic computers" <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> Subject: Re: IBM 3380 HDA In-Reply-To: <1998Jul15.105724.1767.118953(a)smtp.itgonline.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-Sender: kyrrin(a)mail.wa.jps.net X-Listprocessor-Version: 8.1 beta -- ListProcessor(tm) by CREN

27 years, 10 months

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MAD Computer

by franke＠sbs.de

> On Tue, 14 Jul 1998, Thomas Pfaff wrote: >> Does anyone have a MAD Computer? It was just another boring peecee >> but I liked the name of the computer. I believe it was the fastest >> computer you could buy for some small amount of time- an early 80386 >> PC running at a whopping 16 mhz. > I e-bumped into a guy who knows *all* about MAD. I've captured some of > his knowledge for posterity: > http://www.yowza.com/classiccmp/mad/ Thanks Doug. Now I know - I have to have a MAD1 - I _must_ have any 80186/88 system ever build - just a obsession - maybe because I like the PC-D a lot .) Gruss H. -- Ich denke, also bin ich, also gut HRK

27 years, 10 months

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Off-topic informational anti-spam anecdotal

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

A short refresher on human psychology. Most of the time, a clearly thinking person does not do anything they consider wrong. Your spammer thinks he is doing someone a favor, and your songs are disrespectful teasing of his honest attempt to make money. Lawsuits are more effective because if he continues to do it, he'll lose all the money he made, maybe even go to jail. That said, keep up the good work :) >> Lawsuits appear to be the only effective weapon so far. > >I hope that 937 spam songs (at last count this morning) will bring some >manner of cheap and effective restitution. > > >Sam Alternate e-mail: dastar(a)siconic.com >------------------------------------------------------------------------------- >Ever onward. > > September 26 & 27...Vintage Computer Festival 2 > See http://www.siconic.com/vcf for details! > [Last web page update: 07/05/98] > > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

27 years, 10 months

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Off-topic informational anti-spam anecdotal

by franke＠sbs.de

> I've been hit many times by the same bozos. They almost always use > unsuspecting sites as spam relays, so I've been notifying these sites and > trying to shutdown the relays. > I love the spaminator idea, but isn't your phone bill going to be pretty > high this month? Also, the way spammers retaliate against retaliators is > to include your email address as the return address in their forged > headers, so you get mail-bombed by naive spam haters. > Lawsuits appear to be the only effective weapon so far. Thats one thing I realy like about the German laws - spamming via any kind of personal device is forbidden - no fax-spam, no telex spam and no e-mail spam. Spaming is considered stealing your property, since the spammer uses your fax paper and your power line to print his message, and/or your time to check and delete spam. And theft is just unlawful :) After just 4 or 5 court ruleings spamming _IN_ Germany is almost zero - we just have SPAM from outside the country like senseless US-Spamm :) Gruss H. -- Ich denke, also bin ich, also gut HRK

27 years, 10 months

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Off-topic informational anti-spam anecdotal

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

Here in the US, we're spammed by the government, too. Though I'm under 18 and not a US citizen besides, I've gotten at least 30 requests for jury duty. BTW, what is the earliest incidence of e-mail spam? >After just 4 or 5 court ruleings spamming _IN_ Germany is >almost zero - we just have SPAM from outside the country >like senseless US-Spamm :) > >Gruss >H. > >-- >Ich denke, also bin ich, also gut >HRK > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

27 years, 10 months

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IBM 3380 HDA

by SUPRDAVE＠aol.com

In a message dated 98-07-15 10:58:12 EDT, you write: << I just acquired an IBM 3380 HDA which weighs 70 lbs, and is in a clear plastic case. Does anybody know the lineage of this? The HDA has IBM 390X-001 as well as 13-E8719-CJ printed on a label. >> hmmm, i remember seeing 3380/3880 dasd units back in 1992 when i was a computer operator running an IBM 4381 and later an ES9000. kinda useless for a pc although fascinating to look at. belt drive and everything! david

27 years, 10 months

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MAD Computer

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

Speaking of TELEX, they once had the tan-colored 286 boxes, pretty small, with only a 3.5" fdd and a hardcard. They had a BNC connector emanating from the motherboard. Does anyone know what that was for? If it's a network card, does anyone know about drivers? >I once had one of these nasty little beasties. In fact, it was >a rare version that was badged for TELEX/Memorex. It used an >80186 CPU-- It was fast, at least to me, anyway (although >I don't recall the clock speed). ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

27 years, 10 months

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MAD Computer

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

Clearly a very innovative company. It would be nice if all PC clone manufacturers added a little of their own abilities (well, perhaps not :) to their computers. > http://www.yowza.com/classiccmp/mad/ > >-- Doug > > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

27 years, 10 months

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taking care of bad sectors... easy stuff. Was: Re: hard drive data recovery

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

OK, easy on that anti-MS stuff. Kai might be reading :) Anyway, Scandisk is useful for erasing lost files which is all I use it for. Does anyone have an old copy of Spinrite or know of a place where I could get it? How much does the latest one go for? >I truely hate the brain-damaged program >ScanDisk as nothing more than a Trojan Horse! Microsoft should have >known better than to put out something like that. I have *never* had a >problem with Spinrite although that probably includes only a few hundred >drives I have worked on. > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

27 years, 10 months

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RP06 alignment

by mbg＠world.std.com

>A friend has an RP06, an alignment pack, and the alignment tool, but >lacks the instructions to do the deed. >Anyone got the manual that describes the procedure, or know how? Have your friend contact me off-line at work... I may have some RP06 manuals in my collection. Maybe one of them is a maintenance guide which explains it... Megan Gentry Former RT-11 Developer +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+ | Megan Gentry, EMT/B, PP-ASEL | Internet (work): gentry(a)zk3.dec.com | | Unix Support Engineering Group | (home): mbg(a)world.std.com | | Digital Equipment Corporation | | | 110 Spitbrook Rd. ZK03-2/T43 | URL: http://world.std.com/~mbg/ | | Nashua, NH 03062 | "pdp-11 programmer - some assembler | | (603) 884 1055 | required." - mbg | +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+

27 years, 10 months

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taking care of bad sectors... easy stuff. Was: Re: hard drive data recovery

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

Spinrite is most famous for low-level formatting, which is only allowed on old MFM drives, most IDE drives have a sticker that says "Do not low-level format this drive". When I used a Model D with a hardcard, I loved this program. I ran it twice a day because I had nothing else to do :) As for bad sectors, what's up with that? Why is it that sometimes a bad sector will be marked bad, then I can format a drive and have it use those 'bad sectors' just fine? > > well, I personally have never opened up a hard drive, if nothing else >because I've never had an extra to pop open (i'm too frugal. hehe.) > > Regardless, I have found the program "Spinrite" to work great on IDE >drives; it goes through and can fix bad sectors, or mark them totally >unusable. this really differs from standard formats/etc, because I've been >able to take drives w/ 30mb of bad sectors and get it to 0 bad sectors, and >still running fine w/ no problems after a year. i believe they are on >version 5, i got version 4 for about 20 bucks. This is kind of off-topic and >doesn't cover a whole lot of you out there, but when you buy a box of 100 >drives that are all "bad", you can sometimes salvage quite a few of them. > > >-Eric > > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

27 years, 10 months

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MAD Computer

by jeff.kaneko＠ifrsys.com

I once had one of these nasty little beasties. In fact, it was a rare version that was badged for TELEX/Memorex. It used an 80186 CPU-- It was fast, at least to me, anyway (although I don't recall the clock speed). The Powersupply and floppy drives were in one unit, and the CPU was in another. It had a CGA compatible display adaptor. It also had what appeared to be an ISA bus, but most stock PeeCee cards would cause problems. I hacked this one by adding an 8-bit Hard disk controller, and disabling the HDC bios ROM. There was support for the HDC in the MAD-186 ROM, but the harddisk was not a standard option (AFAIK). I think this is the only computer I ever destroyed on purpose, and out of spite, no less. When we bought our 1st '286, my wife urged me to give the MAD to her brother. I really should have resisted, because the thing became a support nightmare. "Can I put a joystick on this?" "Uhh, whats an 'ERROR TRAP'?" "Uhh, RatRacer keeps locking up, can you fix this?" The computer got passed around the family, and I finally ended up with it about three years ago, when it was summarily smashed into little pieces-- retribution for countless sleepless nights when I had to play 'Tech Support'. I had been driven to the edge of MADness. Needless to say I wasn't into CLASSICS yet. I DID save the part with the PS and flopy disk drives, though . . . Jeff At 11:29 PM 7/14/98 -0500, you wrote: >Does anyone have a MAD Computer? It was just another boring peecee >but I liked the name of the computer. I believe it was the fastest >computer you could buy for some small amount of time- an early 80386 >PC running at a whopping 16 mhz. > >Just curious... I just like the concept... >Perhaps they should have used the slogan... > >"Everyone should have a MAD computer in their home!" > >Or perhaps not... > >Thomas >

27 years, 10 months

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How many computers?

by Anthony.Dellett＠Staples.com

> From: ard(a)p850ug1.demon.co.uk [mailto:ard@p850ug1.demon.co.uk] > Sent: Tuesday, July 14, 1998 2:14 PM > To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers > Subject: Re: How many computers? > > > > > > Actually, there is a little known difference on the power > supply board > > between a beige Mac plus and a Platinum Mac Plus. Just a > diode but boy > > Were they both Capetronics designs? The one in my Mac+ (is > there an easy > way to tell them apart when it's been dicoloured by sunlight...) is. > > Where is the diode connected between, and which version has it? > I really dont remember where it is. This was back in 1988 or so :) Tony

27 years, 10 months

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IBM 3380 HDA

by Marty＠itgonline.com

I just acquired an IBM 3380 HDA which weighs 70 lbs, and is in a clear plastic case. Does anybody know the lineage of this? The HDA has IBM 390X-001 as well as 13-E8719-CJ printed on a label. Thanks, Marty

27 years, 10 months

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MAD Computer

by thomas100＠home.com

Does anyone have a MAD Computer? It was just another boring peecee but I liked the name of the computer. I believe it was the fastest computer you could buy for some small amount of time- an early 80386 PC running at a whopping 16 mhz. Just curious... I just like the concept... Perhaps they should have used the slogan... "Everyone should have a MAD computer in their home!" Or perhaps not... Thomas

27 years, 10 months

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European Tour

by franke＠sbs.de

> I'm planning to be in Europe for a week or so in October (a few days each > in Holland, Belgium, and Germany). I'd like to sneak in a few nerd-stops > along the way, and I'll make room in my suitcase for a couple of vintage > portables just in case. Any suggestions for the American nerd tourist in > Europe? Hmm, couldn't you be a bit more specific ? A few days in Germany is like saying 'visiting Alaska and BC and maybe some days on the West Coast' ... Oh Boy, Germany is more than 700 miles 'high' and up to 500 'wide' (nowadays:). Ok, for historic nerds there are at least 3 main places: - Museum fur Verkehr und Technik in Berlin - here you can find (beside a small display) a _complete_ replica of the Zuse Z1 computer - the first computer - and all mechanical :) - The Heinz Nixdorf Museum in Paderborn (a small city middle of nowhere) - They have a real comprehensive display. The single largest in Germany. A lot of small systems from the 70's - Of course since this museum started out as a company nuseum of Nixdorf. - The Deutsches Museum in Munich - THE science museum - I think #1 worldwide - the only thing coming close anyhwere might be the Smithonian Collections. A museum about almost anything. Also including a small Computer display - some 12,000 sqft. They have things like Zuse Z3 replika, Z22, Siemens 2002, PERM, IBM 360/20, TR4, Mark 1...realy impressiv. Althrough I think the modern part is a bit .. hmm .. lets say more like a junk yard - only a PC and a PET hidden in a sidecase and other random parts ... :( - They (the Deutsches Museum) opened a subsidary in Bonn some time ago (Kohl wanted to have such things in hs 'capitol' city :) - But this museum is nice, and well done, but more political/modern historical orientated - only 3 pices are special computer orientated: parts of a Z23 computer (afair the drum), some boxes of the SUPRENUM Project, and a 1 meg chip from VEB Forschungszentrum Mikroelektronik Dresden - the last East German high tech product - they almost ruined their industry - any research money available and a lot more was spend for this development. Beside these, maybe the RWTH in Aaachen (Aachen university) could be an interesting place - they have a small display of big old stuff ... Aachen, Bonn and Paderborn might be close enough to the westen border (Begique/Holland). Oh yes, and maybe send Stefan Walgenbach <walgen(a)do.isst.fhg.de> a mail - he is building the HCM (Home Computer Museum) in Oberhausen, thats just 60km east of the Dutch border. Maybe he invites you to see his collection of classic 80's small and home- computers - he has a big heap of european (English, French and German) home computers. Some hints about your planned tour would help. And if you come to Munich (Deutsches Museum) I would be glad to show you the museum, the city and bragg with my collection :) Servus H. -- Ich denke, also bin ich, also gut HRK

27 years, 10 months

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Painting Macs (was: fake next)

by peacock＠simconv.com

DEC actually tried something like that in the late 70's, they had an option for some kind of designer pattern painted on small racks going into office environments. I think it only lasted a few months, but I do remember getting the brochures from DEC (company was an OEM from DEC at the time). Response was underwhelming. Personally, if it isn't beige or blue I don't consider it a "real" computer. When DEC went to the black racks and purple lettering (hmm, early 70s?) that was too radical for me, I was glad to see a return to the traditional beige rack. DEC did have a nice desk with a builtin short rack, it was sold with PDP-8s used for small business office applications. It looked like a regular desk, but the left side was actually a 19" wide rack. It held a BA-11 and a dual 8" floppy box. For our customers that was more popular than the "designer" panels. Jack Peacock -----Original Message----- From: Tom Owad [mailto:tomowad@earthlink.net] Sent: Tuesday, July 14, 1998 9:19 AM To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers Subject: Re: Painting Macs (was: fake NeXT) >I have this weird idea that one day custom paint jobs on computers might >make me some extra money. Am I crazy? Do you think there would ever be a >market for it?

27 years, 10 months

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Off-topic informational anti-spam anecdotal

by allisonp＠world.std.com

< I love the spaminator idea, but isn't your phone bill going to be pretty < < Lawsuits appear to be the only effective weapon so far. < Sam, If traced back to you, the action you've taken is covered by law so you could be at risk. I agree that bunch is a problem as are the earthlink sex girls that are apparently not anywhere from earthlink. Allison

27 years, 10 months

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hard drive data recovery

by allisonp＠world.std.com

< Now, my question. Let's say a single head crashes. This would raise up < some dust off the platter, right? Would it be possible to recover the < material that wasn't destroyed by the dragging head? What if this < deformed the platter? Head crashes are always bad. What generally happens for 5" and 3.5" winis is the head is ripped off the mount, slammed against the wall and shattered. the free arm gouges the platter badly. the metal dust from the grinding gets into the rest of the heads and it cascades. If shut down when the head first goes the platter will be shot. Repair would be trying to get head and arm assembly, another drive to get a good platter from. Then there is the problem of disassembleing the platter drive assy as many are "glued and screwed" and maintaining tolerances on assembly. Allison

27 years, 10 months

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Help ID Emulex quad module

by allisonp＠world.std.com

< >a third-party dual width card with light blue ejector handles with < >"UDC11" stamped in white letters on one. Don't know where the ribbon < >cable goes that's connected to it. I'll take the BA11 chassis out and < >peek inside tonight and report what I find on these questions. My guess the tape is not tu58 but a DC100/300/600 series tape. There wasn't a tu58 that mounted to a 5.25hole unless it was a hack. Also TU58 is easy to recognize as the drives are bare (no electornics) and the use a board that is roughly 5x10" with serial interface to the host. Also TU58 was a dual drive system though it could be configured with only one. Allison

27 years, 10 months

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How many computers?

by allisonp＠world.std.com

< Interesting peripherals from late 1970's when I was going a lot. < 1. SWTP CT-1024 modified for 64 columns and graphics. Hope to get this < working again with some computer. I have one of those operation with the same mod! All of my collection I listed are tested operational systems. The unique boards I've built for my own use are not listed nor are some of the inop stuff salvaged for parts. I also didn't list the parts supply as that would need a T1 link to get though reasonably. I have a lot of OLD parts that were new purchase at one time! ;) Allison

27 years, 10 months

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Painting Macs (was: fake next)

by mbg＠world.std.com

>DEC did have a nice desk with a builtin short rack, it was sold with >PDP-8s used for small business office applications. It looked like a >regular desk, but the left side was actually a 19" wide rack. It held a >BA-11 and a dual 8" floppy box. For our customers that was more popular >than the "designer" panels. I actually have one of those desks (I bought it from DEC Salvage about 12 or so years ago). Yes, the left side had a 19" wide set of standard rails... but there was also a 19" wide set of rails on the right, only accessable from the back. This was a perfect spot for a power controller. Megan Gentry Former RT-11 Developer +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+ | Megan Gentry, EMT/B, PP-ASEL | Internet (work): gentry(a)zk3.dec.com | | Unix Support Engineering Group | (home): mbg(a)world.std.com | | Digital Equipment Corporation | | | 110 Spitbrook Rd. ZK03-2/T43 | URL: http://world.std.com/~mbg/ | | Nashua, NH 03062 | "pdp-11 programmer - some assembler | | (603) 884 1055 | required." - mbg | +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+

27 years, 10 months

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How many computers?

by franke＠sbs.de

>>> BBC Microcomputer Model B-plus >> B-plus ? Never heard of it or is this jus another >> motherboard revision ? > No it was a different machine. 64K RAM as standard, I think. Do you know a picture in the web ? (Haven't found any). >>> Torch Z80 Card x 2 >> ?? same here. > That's a Z80 coprocessor card that fits inside the BBC micro and plugs > into the 'Tube' connector. A pretty simple machine with 64K RAM and a > small ROM containing a CP/M-a-like. There's a host ROM that goes into the > BBC micro. The BBC acts as an intellegent terminal to the CP/M machine. Ahh ja - hanks, I own 2 BBC Mod B but almost no documentation (and no extensions other than floppys). Gruss H. -- Ich denke, also bin ich, also gut HRK

27 years, 10 months

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How many computers?

by mbg＠world.std.com

>That sounds like another one I don't have, but read through an >interlibrary loan: "How to build a working Digital Computer", by E. >Alcosser, Hayden, 1964. It used a bunch of ganged switches to make a 4 >bit adder. Can you look, anyway? I will look for it... I also have an old book called 'Star Ship Simulation' published by Dilithium Press... >Sounds like you had fun! Sure did... >The picture in the Edmund catalog looked like it was made from various >colored shapes of flat plastic. I know it wouldn't be quite the same, but >if you have the documentation and once had your hands on one, could you >recreate it from mat board and an exacto knife? Or some plastic as >required. Yes, it was made out of colored plastic shapes... with a few shaped metal rods and a number of what amounted to 1/2" (If I remember) sections of plastic straws which were used to do the actual programming. The documentation shows the parts, but not to scale... if I had a real one, I'd try to duplicate the parts... I remember the follow-on unit, the DigicompII, was not so much a computer as it was a game of Nim... I got that one as well, but I preferred the DigicompI Megan Gentry Former RT-11 Developer +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+ | Megan Gentry, EMT/B, PP-ASEL | Internet (work): gentry(a)zk3.dec.com | | Unix Support Engineering Group | (home): mbg(a)world.std.com | | Digital Equipment Corporation | | | 110 Spitbrook Rd. ZK03-2/T43 | URL: http://world.std.com/~mbg/ | | Nashua, NH 03062 | "pdp-11 programmer - some assembler | | (603) 884 1055 | required." - mbg | +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+

27 years, 10 months

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How many computers?

by ddameron＠earthlink.net

Hi Megan and all, At 09:06 PM 7/14/98 -0400, you wrote: > >>Speaking of books, >>has anyone seen the book "We Built our own Computers" by A.B. Holt, >>Cambridge Univ. Press, published about 1966. > >I remember one from years ago which was how to build (and program) >a simple computer using paperclips and lights... (and a program >'drum' made out of a coffee can). I think I still have it... is this >what you're thinking of? That sounds like another one I don't have, but read through an interlibrary loan: "How to build a working Digital Computer", by E. Alcosser, Hayden, 1964. It used a bunch of ganged switches to make a 4 bit adder. Can you look, anyway? Thanks, You also wrote: >>Way cool. I had access to one in high school, to play with, but I never >>owned one. I've written to Edmund Scientific. They get the occasional >>letter inquiring about the DigiComp 1, but so far, not enough interest >>to resurrect the product. >I concur... way cool. I remember when I was in fifth grade or so, my >father ordered one for me. When he received it, he thought it was too >complex and simply put it away. One day I came across it, and before >he came home that night I had assembled it and was working on some of >the programming examples. > >I have a set of documentation for it (sent to me by someone a few years >ago) and I would LOVE to get one for my collection... Sounds like you had fun! The picture in the Edmund catalog looked like it was made from various colored shapes of flat plastic. I know it wouldn't be quite the same, but if you have the documentation and once had your hands on one, could you recreate it from mat board and an exacto knife? Or some plastic as required. That's the kind of thing I might do... -Dave

27 years, 10 months

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Laser 128

by blindpete＠stratos.net

On 1998-07-13 classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu said: cl{Can anybody tell me anything about a machine called cl{Laser 128, I have the opportunity to get and understand cl{that it is very small with built in drive and may be somewhat cl{like an Apple II. cl{Thanx cl{------------------------------------------------------ cl{http://www.voicenet.com/~generic cl{gene(a)ehrich.com cl{Gene Ehrich P.O. Box 209 Marlton NJ 08053-0209 cl{------------------------------------------------------ Hi I used to have one a long time ago, the laser 128 is an Apple 2 C clone. It runs at about one and a third or some thing like that, MHZ. Has a 5.25 inch built in flopy 180 K I think and /ram drive in slot 3 drive 1 I think. It isn't a tam card or any thing like that that is just where the system has the ram drive. I had a later model laser 128 ex this one was cruzzing at 3.6 MHZ, also it had a conecter for an external 3.5 inch flopy. Net-Tamer V 1.11 - Registered

27 years, 10 months

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RT11 SIG tapes

by kyrrin＠jps.net

The tapes are spoken for. John Lawson claimed the stack, with Dave Jenner a close second. Glad to see they're going to a good home. Thanks, folks! -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Bruce Lane, Sysop, The Dragon's Cave BBS (Fidonet 1:343/272) (Hamateur: WD6EOS) (E-mail: kyrrin(a)jps.net) "Our science can only describe an object, event, or living thing in our own human terms. It cannot, in any way, define any of them..."

27 years, 10 months

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Atari 800 (was free atari in Sacremento)

by thomas100＠home.com

I had a friend who turned an Atari 800 into a planter. After that, I inherited it for awhile- it still worked. He had spray painted tho' it so I elected not to hold onto it. What always amazed me was this huge aluminum casting at the center of the machine where you inserted the BASIC and game cartridges. That casting must have added significant cost to manufacturing the machine! Hope someone grabs it... they're kinda neat. Thomas

27 years, 10 months

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How many computers?

by thomas100＠home.com

I looked around at what's in sight... NeXT Color Turbo Station Sparcstation 5 Some boring peecees (incl a Linux box) A Mac IIx An Apple IIc Trs-80 Model 4P Trs-80 Model 16B w/ 8 megabyte HD and 12" floppies Trs-80 Model I w/ Expansion Interface/printer Trs-80 Model 100 NEC PC8201a Trs-80 PC-2 Kaypro 2000 Oh yeah... an HP 9825 from the mid-70's [w/ one-line display] Oddly most of these I never owned new. Of all of them the NeXT machine is still by far the most useful / least painful. The Trs-80 Model 16B is the most unique in my eye. I was annoyed by it at first but it was free and gradually began to like it. It's currently running CP/M but I'd like to get the HD back up and run Xenix. The software that came with it made it more interesting... as this stuff was untouchable [expensive] when it was new. Thomas

27 years, 10 months

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fwd: atari 800 (Sacramento, CA)

by sinasohn＠mail.crl.com

Please contact Mr. Woo directly if interested... >From: K W <wookm(a)yahoo.com> >Subject: atari 800 >To: sinasohn(a)crl.com > >Mr. Sinasohn, > >I've got an Atari 800 computer that I want to get rid of, and I'd >rather give it away than throw it in the trash. It's still in great >condition, with a drive, tape recorder, joysticks, etc. Would anyone >in ABACUS be interested? > >There is a catch though: it's in Sacramento. I've emailed the Sacto >groups, with no response yet. If there's someone in ABACUS who makes >regular trips to Sacto, and would like to have it, I'd be willing to >hold it. > > >Kevin Woo >wookm(a)yahoo.com --------------------------------------------------------------------- O- Uncle Roger "There is pleasure pure in being mad roger(a)sinasohn.com that none but madmen know." Roger Louis Sinasohn & Associates San Francisco, California http://www.sinasohn.com/

27 years, 10 months

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How many computers?

by cad＠gamewood.net

My wife says, 'Too many!!' A Sphere, Astral 2000, M&R sbc, Dragon, several CoCo's, Eagle 1600, enough spares for a Leading Edge model 2, XEROX 860IPS,Unisys Personal Workstation Series 850 (marginal timewise). Chuck -- Chuck Davis / Sutherlin Industries FAX # (804) 799-0940 1973 Reeves Mill Road E-Mail -- cad(a)gamewood.net Sutherlin, Virginia 24594 Voice # (804) 799-5803

27 years, 10 months

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European Tour

by fmc＠reanimators.org

Doug Yowza <yowza(a)yowza.com> wrote: > Any suggestions for the American nerd tourist in Europe? Hmm. How about the Heinz Nixdorf Museumforum somewhere near Paderborn in Germany? I have brochures (somewhat dated), or you can check out their web site (which, last I looked, was mostly in German) at http://www.hnf.de/ . Never been there myself, but it's on my list if I ever get around to a European Tour. -Frank McConnell

27 years, 10 months

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taking care of bad sectors... easy stuff. Was: Re: hard drive data recovery

by higginbo＠netpath.net

I'll bring it back on topic: Spinrite is some powerful hoodoo. I used it alot on Seagate ST-225 drives. I'm never one to use any questionable sectors though: Some of those drives had less than 10mb when I was through with them. I don't trust iffy sectors. At 08:06 PM 7/14/98 -0500, Poesie wrote: >version 5, i got version 4 for about 20 bucks. This is kind of off-topic and >doesn't cover a whole lot of you out there, but when you buy a box of 100 >drives that are all "bad", you can sometimes salvage quite a few of them. - - john higginbotham ____________________________ - webmaster www.pntprinting.com - - limbo limbo.netpath.net -

27 years, 10 months

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How many computers?

by higginbo＠netpath.net

At 01:42 AM 7/15/98 +0100, Tony Duell wrote: >My rule is that if it's possible to get a user program in there, it's a >computer. Yes there are marginal cases, but who cares. This is not a 'who's >got the most computers' competition, now is it? It's not??? Dang! I thought I was a shoe in for mister congeneality!!! :) - - john higginbotham ____________________________ - webmaster www.pntprinting.com - - limbo limbo.netpath.net -

27 years, 10 months

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hard drive data recovery

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

If you are removing a head arm and working on it, you can wrap everything but the actual connection in clean plastic. I wouldn't expect smoke particles to magically fall off the arm onto the platter, even if the arm is upside down. Plus, smoke travels upwards, and I would expect little of it to settle if you use a fan or something. As soon as you finish soldering, take it back to the clean box, and put it inside to let it cool off or to reassemble (unless it's still smoking). As for doing activities which involve platters, that's a trickier thing. I have no idea what you would do if you had a problem with the motor or the axle on which the platters are mounted. Now, my question. Let's say a single head crashes. This would raise up some dust off the platter, right? Would it be possible to recover the material that wasn't destroyed by the dragging head? What if this deformed the platter? >Serious question. What do you do if you need to resolder a head >connection or something? Do you remove the head assembly from the clean >box, solder it, clean if off with IPA, put it back in the clean box and >reassemble or what? I can't believe you want flux smoke in the HDA. > >> Philip. > >-tony > > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

27 years, 11 months

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taking care of bad sectors... easy stuff. Was: Re: hard drive data recovery

by poesie＠geocities.com

well, I personally have never opened up a hard drive, if nothing else because I've never had an extra to pop open (i'm too frugal. hehe.) Regardless, I have found the program "Spinrite" to work great on IDE drives; it goes through and can fix bad sectors, or mark them totally unusable. this really differs from standard formats/etc, because I've been able to take drives w/ 30mb of bad sectors and get it to 0 bad sectors, and still running fine w/ no problems after a year. i believe they are on version 5, i got version 4 for about 20 bucks. This is kind of off-topic and doesn't cover a whole lot of you out there, but when you buy a box of 100 drives that are all "bad", you can sometimes salvage quite a few of them. -Eric

27 years, 11 months

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How many computers?

by SUPRDAVE＠aol.com

In a message dated 98-07-14 11:45:07 EDT, tony duell put forth: << > BTW, how common are PC-jr machines without floppies? Were most of them > upgraded? >> all pcjr machines came with 128k and one floppy drive. i have seen "second story" units that add another floppy drive. it seems to be there used to be an aftermarket for the jr, but a hot-rodded one still wouldnt be as good as a standard xt though. a popular modification was to bring the machine up to 640k by soldering in some dip chips in the 128k add on sidecar thing. i believe IBM has a file on the www searchfiles page that still tells how to do this. david

27 years, 11 months

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hard drive data recovery

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

The actual sensor is a sealed unit, just like a transistor or a vacuum tube. You don't even have to tell anybody :) >don't believe the small amount of Am241 in the average smoke detector is >that dangerous if handled carefully, but I can see some people getting >very upset if they found I was stripping down smoke detectors and >modifying them. And I don't need that sort of hassle. > >-tony > > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

27 years, 11 months

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How many computers?

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

Well, I think that the default lack of floppy drive was a mistake, as was the lack of RAM. I'm not sure what year it is, but I believe 640K was standard by then. Also, I have the Getting Started manual for the PCjr. It's supposed to be a technical reference with specs, and details on how to prepare it for shipping (like in the IBM PC manual of the same name), but instead it has childish junk on how to use cursor keys (it has a little cartridge game called the keyboard adventure, with a little guy that can move around). Techinicians reeely don't like that. >Apart from the IR keyboard, which was a mistake ;-), it's basically a PC >without the DMA chip, but with better-than-CGA graphics. What's wrong >with it? > >In some ways the lack of a DMA chip is a good thing. There are the right >signals on the expansion bus to add one, with the result that an >expansion module can take over the bus. The PC bus doesn't allow that. > >-tony > > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

27 years, 11 months

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Painting Macs (was: fake next)

by mbg＠world.std.com

>or blue I don't consider it a "real" computer. When DEC went to the >black racks and purple lettering (hmm, early 70s?) that was too radical >for me, I was glad to see a return to the traditional beige rack. The 19" racks were generally black... there were attachments to the top of them which were different colors. The purple series was indicative of the pdp-11s (which match the time-frame). I've seen them both with beige side-panels and black side-panels... Megan Gentry Former RT-11 Developer +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+ | Megan Gentry, EMT/B, PP-ASEL | Internet (work): gentry(a)zk3.dec.com | | Unix Support Engineering Group | (home): mbg(a)world.std.com | | Digital Equipment Corporation | | | 110 Spitbrook Rd. ZK03-2/T43 | URL: http://world.std.com/~mbg/ | | Nashua, NH 03062 | "pdp-11 programmer - some assembler | | (603) 884 1055 | required." - mbg | +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+

27 years, 11 months

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how many computers?

by mbg＠world.std.com

Maybe I'll provide my full list in a later message, but for now, you can check my 'home_systems' page off my home page... >> DIGI-COMP 1 (an educational toy from 1963) > >Way cool. I had access to one in high school, to play with, but I never >owned one. I've written to Edmund Scientific. They get the occasional >letter inquiring about the DigiComp 1, but so far, not enough interest >to resurrect the product. I concur... way cool. I remember when I was in fifth grade or so, my father ordered one for me. When he received it, he thought it was too complex and simply put it away. One day I came across it, and before he came home that night I had assembled it and was working on some of the programming examples. I have a set of documentation for it (sent to me by someone a few years ago) and I would LOVE to get one for my collection... Megan Gentry Former RT-11 Developer +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+ | Megan Gentry, EMT/B, PP-ASEL | Internet (work): gentry(a)zk3.dec.com | | Unix Support Engineering Group | (home): mbg(a)world.std.com | | Digital Equipment Corporation | | | 110 Spitbrook Rd. ZK03-2/T43 | URL: http://world.std.com/~mbg/ | | Nashua, NH 03062 | "pdp-11 programmer - some assembler | | (603) 884 1055 | required." - mbg | +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+

27 years, 11 months

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How many computers?

by ddameron＠earthlink.net

At 06:41 PM 7/14/98 GMT, you wrote: >> I was just wondering, how many computers do all you have out there??? > Not many, 10 to 20, and some I don't know if to count, such as pc boards with a 6802, 2716, and 2 6821 ic's. I think they came from a cash register system. Others like XT motherboards... 1. Mixed brand S-100 System. Either Flashwriter display or serial to Heatkit H19 terminal. Extra crate and misc cards. 2. Various PC clones. I am using a 386 now. No Pentiums or higher. 3. A few Z-80 test computers. 8 or so ic's on a single board. 4. 80188 board computer for "Radio Electronics" Robot. 5. Homebrew game of "life" computer. (1973) 6. Calculator built from neon bulb "shift register counters". Input is a rotary telephone dial. I think subtraction was "1's complements". (about 1968) Interesting peripherals from late 1970's when I was going a lot. 1. SWTP CT-1024 modified for 64 columns and graphics. Hope to get this working again with some computer. 2. Sylvanhills flat bed plotter. Used DC motors and opto-interruptor wheels which I replaced with stepper motors. 3. Stepper motor 3 axis wax carver. Used cylindrical coordinates. The wax block rotated on a turntable. Literature, including First 7 years of Byte. First few years of Dr. Dobbs, the bound volumes, I didn't keep the individual issues. 2 of the Creative Computer games books. 10 issues of "Computer Hobbyist", I have just found the remaining issues. Documentation for Scelbi 8H and other 8008 stuff. Other construction type books. Various parts, including a box of RTL ic's, 1101 memory's. There apparently was an ad in 1967 "CQ" for an RTL computer. >> DIGI-COMP 1 (an educational toy from 1963) > >Way cool. I had access to one in high school, to play with, but I never >owned one. I've written to Edmund Scientific. They get the occasional >letter inquiring about the DigiComp 1, but so far, not enough interest >to resurrect the product. Yes, it would be fun to find things like this. I still have the 3 potentiometer "analog" computer I built for some science fair. The Digicomp I cost $5.95 in 1969 from Edmund Sci. Others were various mechanical (Dr. Nim) and electronic NIM players, Computers like "Brainac", and later in 1971, a National Radio Institute computer using 53 TTL ic's. Have seen only ad's. A RCA projects book I have has a "slot machine" built from individual transistors for flip flops, gates, multivibrators, etc. It "computed" the score, so was a calculator of sorts. Speaking of books, has anyone seen the book "We Built our own Computers" by A.B. Holt, Cambridge Univ. Press, published about 1966. -Dave

27 years, 11 months

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empty rack

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

I found an empty rack today, not sure of the dimensions. It had nothing but rails and a power cord. At the top, it had something like "Camex" in blue letters, I forgot exactly what by the time I got home. Next to the name, it had some kind of snowflake-like emblem. Does anyone in the Boston area want this thing? I will inquire if there is anything more where that came from... ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

27 years, 11 months

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Forward Air - Ship them hunks o' Iron!

by higginbo＠netpath.net

This is an unofficial page for Forward Air, a company that claims to have very reasonable air freight rates for packages. This page was put together >from the perspective of an arcade machine afficianado(sp?), but plenty of info here for all. Just thought I'd pass it on in case someone needs it or hasn't heard of it, or whatever. http://www.geocities.com/Yosemite/6996/forwardair.html - - john higginbotham ____________________________ - webmaster www.pntprinting.com - - limbo limbo.netpath.net -

27 years, 11 months

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Painting Macs (was: fake NeXT)

by higginbo＠netpath.net

Please do. I'd like to see it, but I would rather keep the original case, or an exact or near to it replica in another material. Doug had a good idea with the chrome look, but I think I would have to actually tool a metal case and get it chromed for it to look good, too much money for me, but it would look neat, maybe with some red glowing lights behind the vents ala Terminator. :) Hmmmm. I do have the empty SE/30 case to practice on, but I just got another idea while looking at my mini-tower 233mmx: Cut out one whole side of it, replace with plexiglass or glass panel so I can see all the goodies inside, maybe throw some little 5v LEDs into it to make it purty... I'm getting too many cool ideas here. I need to stop thinking and start putting this in action. At 04:45 PM 7/14/98 -0500, Poesie wrote: >My girlfriend works for a sign company that does small and large scale >signage; including printing out vinyl signs. they can print onto lexan, >transparent vinyl, aluminum, etc etc; our project last week was making a >tower case out of clear acrylic, and putting some various translucent >designs on it (including a very dashing "Linux Powered" logo.) the company >is www.fastsigns.com, there are local all over the US and i believe also >england. for a full colour case design (they can scan and print any graphic) >it's usually about $50 US and then the cost of the materials. most likely >under $100. i'll upload some shots of this awesome case once i get my >digital camera back from a friend. > >-Eric > > > > >>Absolutely! :-) >> >>I'd certainly be interested in a Mac with a neat paint job. It would >>have to be something interesting, though, after all, even I cold do solid >>colors. :-) >> >>A while back MacAddict gave away some custom painted Power Mac 5100's. >>They weren't very intersting, though, just crazy designs. >> >>Tom Owad >> > > - - john higginbotham ____________________________ - webmaster www.pntprinting.com - - limbo limbo.netpath.net -

27 years, 11 months

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How many computers?

by Philip.Belben＠powertech.co.uk

> I was just wondering, how many computers do all you have out there??? Right. My turn now. Unlike most of you, it seems, a lot of my computers don't work. I seem to acquire faster than I can repair - perhaps because computers are just one hobby among many, perhaps because acquiring computers is relatively easy... I have about 60. Last time I counted I got to about 51 but I don't think I got them all. A selection: Assorted PETs, at least one C64 and a couple of VIC 20s (one with missing keytop); Assorted PDPs in various states of disrepair, plus a large number of spare M-series boards (both Unibus and Qbus, including several CPU boards) and a couple of Rainbows; Several BBC model Bs (don't know what sorts) and an electron; Tatung Einstein, TI 99/4A; Sinclair ZX81, Spectrum, Spectrum +2; IBM PC-AT, 6150 (= RT PC tower model), System/23 (5332 Datamaster); A couple of Compaq 386 lapdogs; HP 71C, 75C, 85, 86, 87 (but the HP I use most is my 28C - I suppose that's a classic now); Sirius-1, FTS Series-88 (nearly two of those), Superbrain; I recently got a couple of Apple ][ and a couple of Exidy Sorcerors; But my favourite is the Tektronix 4052 graphics box. With luck, I'll bring it to the VCF this autumn ^H^H^H^H^H^H^H fall. Philip.

27 years, 11 months

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How many computers?

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

A question about the Sorcerer: I heard once that it used 8-track tapes. Is this true, or did they mistake a cartridge for a cassette? >I recently got a couple of Apple ][ and a couple of Exidy Sorcerors; ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

27 years, 11 months

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Painting Macs (was: fake NeXT)

by poesie＠geocities.com

My girlfriend works for a sign company that does small and large scale signage; including printing out vinyl signs. they can print onto lexan, transparent vinyl, aluminum, etc etc; our project last week was making a tower case out of clear acrylic, and putting some various translucent designs on it (including a very dashing "Linux Powered" logo.) the company is www.fastsigns.com, there are local all over the US and i believe also england. for a full colour case design (they can scan and print any graphic) it's usually about $50 US and then the cost of the materials. most likely under $100. i'll upload some shots of this awesome case once i get my digital camera back from a friend. -Eric >Absolutely! :-) > >I'd certainly be interested in a Mac with a neat paint job. It would >have to be something interesting, though, after all, even I cold do solid >colors. :-) > >A while back MacAddict gave away some custom painted Power Mac 5100's. >They weren't very intersting, though, just crazy designs. > >Tom Owad >

27 years, 11 months

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yes I would like a list of what is left of the computers

by gargor1＠concentric.net

My phone number is (408)338-9282.

27 years, 11 months

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How many computers?

by pete＠dunnington.u-net.com

On Jul 14, 10:55, Max Eskin wrote: > Subject: Re: How many computers? > A question about the Sorcerer: I heard once that it used 8-track tapes. > Is this true, or did they mistake a cartridge for a cassette? No, they used "ROM Pac"s, which consist of a small circuit board with a decoder chip and 4 x 2KB ROMs mounted inside a gutted 8-track tape cartridge. -- Pete Peter Turnbull Dept. of Computer Science University of York

27 years, 11 months

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Painting Macs (was: fake NeXT)

by pete＠dunnington.u-net.com

On Jul 14, 6:50, Russ Blakeman wrote: > Use paints that have glue type solvents, ones with toluene, acetone and xylene > that will melt into the finsih below and/or plastic and bond after sanding > with 400 sandpaper, works great. [snip] > After it dries overnight (esp black) clean it down with a sponge and then dry > it off and the excess dust of overspray will be gone, just like a factory > finish. Philips used to supply small runs of OEM monitors which were spray-painted in custom colours, instead of using different coloured plastic. -- Pete Peter Turnbull Dept. of Computer Science University of York

27 years, 11 months

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How many computers?

by pete＠dunnington.u-net.com

On Jul 14, 12:45, Hans Franke wrote: > Subject: Re: How many computers? > > BBC Microcomputer Model B-plus > > B-plus ? Never heard of it or is this jus another > motherboard revision ? The B-plus was a model introduced after the B but before the Master Series. It had a lot of features of the Master 128, but was in a case just like a Model B. The circuit board is completely different, though. Different processor (65C12, IIRC), 64K RAM expandable to 128K, shadow memory and extra modes, etc, and a very different layout. -- Pete Peter Turnbull Dept. of Computer Science University of York

27 years, 11 months

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How many computers?

by pete＠dunnington.u-net.com

On Jul 13, 18:07, Zane H. Healy wrote: > Here is a question, how do you include terminals? For example I've got a > Tandy WP-2, it's a combo Word Processor, terminal sort of thing, basically > a keyboard with a LCD strip. Would it be a computer, or a terminal. In the list I posted, I included anything that was vaguely a computer, like the Psion and the AgendA, and the Torch, which is really a second processor for a BBC B. I didn't include terminals, such as my VT131, a couple of Cifer terminals, and some Wyse terminals. If the WP-2 runs software, even just a dedicated word processor, I'd probably count it. -- Pete Peter Turnbull Dept. of Computer Science University of York

27 years, 11 months

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Aaaaanthony!!!

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

I don't believe I've seen Anthony Clifton around recently? Has anyone seen him? If you're reading this, Anthony, please post so that I know your address and can email you. ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

27 years, 11 months

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Aaaaanthony!!!

by SUPRDAVE＠aol.com

In a message dated 98-07-14 15:03:11 EDT, you write: << > I don't believe I've seen Anthony Clifton around recently? Has anyone > seen him? If you're reading this, Anthony, please post so that I know > your address and can email you. > >> he did have a website called retrocomputing.com but i am unable to establish a connection to it. I hope that he still is present as I need to close a deal we had made. david

27 years, 11 months

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RP06 alignment

by DSEAGRAV＠toad.xkl.com

A friend has an RP06, an alignment pack, and the alignment tool, but lacks the instructions to do the deed. Anyone got the manual that describes the procedure, or know how? -------

27 years, 11 months

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Painting Macs (was: fake NeXT)

by tomowad＠earthlink.net

>Any idea how we might find the original paint color to restore a faded Mac >or other Apple product to new condition? The old Beige cases are made with Borg-Warner's ABS Cyclolac using the color PMS 453. Tom Owad -- Sysop of Caesarville Online Client software at: <http://home.earthlink.net/~tomowad/>

27 years, 11 months

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Painting Macs (was: fake NeXT)

by Anthony.Dellett＠Staples.com

In the old days, I used to work for a company that made hard disk subsystems for the mac. When Apple changed to the "Platinum" color scheme, they sent out a paint sample with a pantone color #. Someone MUST know what it is... Tony > -----Original Message----- > From: George Rachor [mailto:george@racsys.rt.rain.com] > Sent: Tuesday, July 14, 1998 1:53 PM > To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers > Subject: Re: Painting Macs (was: fake NeXT) > > > Any idea how we might find the original paint color to > restore a faded Mac > or other Apple product to new condition? > > George > > ========================================================= > George L. Rachor george(a)racsys.rt.rain.com > Beaverton, Oregon http://racsys.rt.rain.com > > On Tue, 14 Jul 1998, Rax wrote: > > > >>If I ever get the time, I want to do a custom paint job > on my SE/30. > > >>Remember the fighter planes of WW2 that had the > mouth/teeth/eyes painted on > > >>the nose? You get the picture... :) > > > > > >I've been tempted to do that too. :-) What kind of paint > would be best > > >for this? And how would you go about cleaning the unit > before hand? > > > > > >Tom Owad > > > > > >-- > > >Sysop of Caesarville Online > > >Client software at: <http://home.earthlink.net/~tomowad/> > > > > > > My ex-girlfriend painted her Mac metalflake purple. She got > the paint from > > a model shop - it's the stuff they use for painting plastic > models. I > > thought it would fuck everything up when she spray-painted > the keyboard, > > but it didn't seem to do it any harm. Worked fine, but it certainly > > challenged one's touch-typing skills... > > > > R. > > > > -- > > > > > > > > Warbaby > > The WebSite. The Domain. The Empire. > > http://www.warbaby.com > > > > The MonkeyPool > > WebSite Content Development > > http://www.monkeypool.com > > > > > > Dreadlocks on white boys give me the willies. > > > > > > > > > > > > >

27 years, 11 months

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Painting Macs (was: fake NeXT)

by higginbo＠netpath.net

At 07:38 PM 7/13/98 -0700, Tom Owad wrote: >I've been tempted to do that too. :-) What kind of paint would be best >for this? And how would you go about cleaning the unit before hand? Hmmm. I would probably go with a really fine sandpaper to give the paint something to stick to, then if I wanted, clear coat the finished product for a good seal against possible flaking. I painted a 14" SVGA monitor once. Flat black, straight out of a cheap spraypaint can. It never flaked, but some did rub off when I moved the monitor. I touched it up with black magic marker. I have this weird idea that one day custom paint jobs on computers might make me some extra money. Am I crazy? Do you think there would ever be a market for it? I've seen one guy on the net that has built custom mahogany and marble cases for his Mac cx and others. Was cool to see a more recent Apple in wood. :) Is this off-topic? - - john higginbotham ____________________________ - webmaster www.pntprinting.com - - limbo limbo.netpath.net -

27 years, 11 months

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How many computers?

by Anthony.Dellett＠Staples.com

Actually, there is a little known difference on the power supply board between a beige Mac plus and a Platinum Mac Plus. Just a diode but boy oh boy did it cause havoc when installing a certain CPU accelerator board made by now defunct MacMemory. Mommy! I let the magic smoke out! Tony > -----Original Message----- > From: Zane H. Healy [mailto:healyzh@ix.netcom.com] > Sent: Monday, July 13, 1998 9:08 PM > To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers > Subject: Re: How many computers? > > > >Every so often, someone asks how many computers I have, and > I always find > >it hard to give a straight answer. It depends whether you > count half a > >dozen 68000 boards as 1 + spares, or 6 -- I only have two > keyboards and one > >PSU rigged up for them -- or none, since I haven't got the > orignal case or > >PSU. Or the PDP-11s; I have several spare CPUs and other > boards, but only > >a few cabinets. > > Well, just tell 'em what I do. I've got about 70 computers > (See the web > page if you want the list, I'm not typing them all in :^) ), > not counting > duplicates/spares. However, I do count such things as a > "Beige Mac Plus" > and a "Platinum Mac Plus" separatly, despite the fact the only real > difference is the colour of the case (well, in this case the keyboards > also). Still I think the only systems that fall into that > catagory are the > Mac Plus, TI-99/4a, and A1200(HD). > > Here is a question, how do you include terminals? For > example I've got a > Tandy WP-2, it's a combo Word Processor, terminal sort of > thing, basically > a keyboard with a LCD strip. Would it be a computer, or a terminal. > > Zane > | Zane H. Healy | UNIX Systems Adminstrator | > | healyzh(a)ix.netcom.com (primary) | Linux Enthusiast | > | healyzh(a)holonet.net (alternate) | Classic Computer Collector | > +----------------------------------+----------------------------+ > | Empire of the Petal Throne and Traveller Role Playing, | > | and Zane's Computer Museum. | > | http://www.dragonfire.net/~healyzh/ | >

27 years, 11 months

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Painting Macs (was: fake NeXT)

by tomowad＠earthlink.net

>If I ever get the time, I want to do a custom paint job on my SE/30. >Remember the fighter planes of WW2 that had the mouth/teeth/eyes painted on >the nose? You get the picture... :) I've been tempted to do that too. :-) What kind of paint would be best for this? And how would you go about cleaning the unit before hand? Tom Owad -- Sysop of Caesarville Online Client software at: <http://home.earthlink.net/~tomowad/>

27 years, 11 months

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hard drive data recovery

by cfandt＠servtech.com

At 17:51 13-07-98 -0700, you wrote: >On Mon, 13 Jul 1998, Tony Duell wrote: > >> What we now need is for some brave person (me, Allison???) to take a >> number of old (and dead) drives, make a clean box, pull them apart, >> document everything, and write a repair manual.... > >I would love to help with this effort as I'm very good with my hands and >the whole point of starting this thread was to guage the practicality of >home hard drive repair, but currently I wouldn't have the time to embark >on such an endeavor, although at some point I will. I hope that whatever >tricks I'm able to pioneer with respect to hard drive repair will be >passed on in FAQs. Good! We'll be watching, Sam! :-) > >I've already noted the discussions on building a clean box and at some >point will be creating one. QUESTION: Is there a way to determine just >how clean such a clean box is after its built? Is there some meter that >can be hooked-up to the exhaust opening that will give you a particulate Yes there is a device used to count particles in the air. But you may not like the cost of them. My job involves work in our Class 10,000 cleanroom at my place of employment. A few of you others out there either once had or now work in such a company that has cleanroom(s), or possibly had spent time in a cleanroom as a service person. I can give a brief primer on how a cleanroom is built and short definition of the federal standard of cleanroom classes if some of you are interested. That would give a picture of the environment within which the drives had been manufactured and what one would do to make a simple one for his/her use. We make linear encoders of which the finest line size of the ronchi ruling on the encoder substrate is 4 microns (157.48 millionths of an inch.) Figure one micron = 39.37 millionths of an inch (0.00003937"). Most dust particles in 'free air' (the air we normally live in and breathe everyday) are in the 0.5 to 10 micron range. Therefore, keeping the air _clean_ during the manufacturing process has benefited us extremely well. Of course, semiconductor manufacturers fabricate microprocessors, transistors, all other IC's in cleanroom environments. Those hokey Intel TV advertisements with cleanroom workers in full body suits are actually not far off the mark with regard to the actual need to keep a class 10 or 100 cleanroom clean when making chips with sub-micron features. I had purchased a particle counter at work to check the "cleanness" of the air in various zones in the cleanroom. These machines are somewhat complicated though the basic concept used for counting particles is not. Most particle counters are sensitive. The one I bought is able to "see", therefore count, a *single* particle as small as 0.5 micron. Our unit has similar specifications as other typical brands of particle counters but it still cost us a little over US$10,000. Used equipment dealers have them for less but it's still not reasonable for the hobbyist or even a very small business. Maintenace parts and calibration is also a bit high. BTW, the air quality in most areas of our cleanroom stays at less than 100 particles per cubic foot. Very clean when considering that outside air which is relatively clean (say, the proverbial fresh mountain air) has 100,000 to 500,000 particles per cu. foot -more with forest fires, etc. nearby. If I do decide to tinker with some of my dead hard drives, I plan to bring them to the plant some weekend and have at it :-) I'll just slip on a boufont (sp.?) cap as a hair cover, special gloves, my lab coat and maybe a face mask of some sort, setup at an empty table and away I go! >count? My Panasonic vacuum cleaner has such a detector that triggers a >dual-color LED on the front panel: it lights red if it detects dirt >particles passing through the hose and green if the particle count is >below some threshold. This is an extremely simplified version of a particle counter. I can envision it as having a simple LED emitter, probably IR, on one side of the hose and a photodetector on the opposite side. The detector and the analog front end may be rather sensitive to differentiate minute changes in light intensity. When significant amounts of dust and crap are sucked thru the hose the light is slightly occluded whichs lowers the output of the photodetector which then trips the circuit driving the red LED on your Panasonic vac. This is much too coarse of a device to measure air quality in any home-built glovebox/cleanroom any of us may build. It serves to show the homeowner that the Panasonic company's wonderful Model Such-and-Such is doing a great job at cleaning their house. Pure marketing gimmick but kinda neat on a home vac anyway IMO. > >> Yep, this is an interesting thread for me... > >Me too! Thanks for starting the discussion Sam, as a few of us who have the resources will need to get into it in the future -if not now. I can offer additional ideas and advice from my own cleanroom experience to the group on setting up a work area using either homemade or used commercial "clean benches", etc. Regards, Chris -- -- Christian Fandt, Electronic/Electrical Historian Jamestown, NY USA Member of Antique Wireless Association URL: http://www.ggw.org/freenet/a/awa/

27 years, 11 months

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Painting Macs (was: fake NeXT)

by Anthony.Dellett＠Staples.com

I seem to remember a company way back (when the Mac Plus was considered a power machine) that used to do custom faux finishes on Macs. The cool one was the granite macintosh. I think the company was also the first to make a fishtank out of a Mac 128K Tony > -----Original Message----- > From: Tom Owad [mailto:tomowad@earthlink.net] > Sent: Tuesday, July 14, 1998 12:19 PM > To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers > Subject: Re: Painting Macs (was: fake NeXT) > > > >I have this weird idea that one day custom paint jobs on > computers might > >make me some extra money. Am I crazy? Do you think there > would ever be a > >market for it? > > Absolutely! :-) > > I'd certainly be interested in a Mac with a neat paint job. It would > have to be something interesting, though, after all, even I > cold do solid > colors. :-) > > A while back MacAddict gave away some custom painted Power > Mac 5100's. > They weren't very intersting, though, just crazy designs. > > Tom Owad > > -- > Sysop of Caesarville Online > Client software at: <http://home.earthlink.net/~tomowad/> >

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hard drive data recovery

by dastar＠ncal.verio.com

This is off-topic, so I'd like to know if anyone would like to start a short discussion off the list regarding data recovery on crashed hard drives? I recently had two hard drives go south on me. One was my 2.5" IDE in my laptop...scary considering it had all my notes, memos and source code. The other was a 3.5" IDE on the voicemail system in the office. The laptop was a physical crash; the voicemail was a soft crash (directory got over-written somehow). I took the hard drives to a data recovery shop (Data Recovery Group in San Leandro for the locals). They have complete clean room and repair facilities. The data recovery technician, Yongin, opened up the 2.5" HD in the clean room and found the head had gone bad. He assembled a new head onto the drive but it wasn't repairable: it was a temporary fix to get the data off. He then proceeded to extract all the directories I told him were the most critical. Over all he said he was able to read about 60% of the 1.2GB drive. The other drive he found had a bad root directory, apparently having been over-written with random data (I suspect a virus). They basically used Norton Utilities on that to locate the lost directories and re-link them. They were able to recover the entire drive contents. What I wanted to discuss is the possibility of doing home drive repair without the luxury of a clean room. Is it possible to use some sort of cheaply available or easily made vacuum chamber with positive airflow and filtering, or is it absolutely required? Can a drive be opened in room air and be worked on without introducing dangerous dust particles onto the platter? Figuring out the data on the drive is the easy part, compared with actually trying to read the data off the platter, whether the problem be a failed head or a crashed head. Why can't they make a hard drive that's crash proof? Even if the mechanics fail, can't some hardend substance like glass be layed over the platter so if the head did crash it would only scratch the glass? Then you would simply open the drive, pull out the platter, replace the glass shield if necessary, then insert it into a working assembly. The head calibration would be adjusted to compensate for the extra distance to the platter. If anyone would like to continue this discussion, please reply to me privately. Thanks! BTW, the above drive repair cost $1,490 total. Not only is the job challenging and fun, but highly lucrative. Back that data up! Sam Alternate e-mail: dastar(a)siconic.com ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Ever onward. September 26 & 27...Vintage Computer Festival 2 See http://www.siconic.com/vcf for details! [Last web page update: 07/05/98]

27 years, 11 months

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hard drive data recovery

by maxeskin＠hotmail.com

Why not use a radioisotope and a metal plate, like in a smoke detector? I think the element could be removed from the smoke detector and wired into a different circuit that triggers on dust. > >I don't know how it works. For high particle counts (like your vacuum >cleaner), I would guess you could use light scattering. I can't believe >that would work at class 100 levels, though. > >-tony > > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

27 years, 11 months

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hard drive data recovery

by allisonp＠world.std.com

< What we now need is for some brave person (me, Allison???) to take a < number of old (and dead) drives, make a clean box, pull them apart, < document everything, and write a repair manual.... Either that or I have to trouble shoot the two maxtor2190s(rd54) I have with seek spindown death. I know it's not a HDA problem as I opened them and watch the gyrations. Allison

27 years, 11 months

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Painting Macs (was: fake NeXT)

by tomowad＠earthlink.net

>I have this weird idea that one day custom paint jobs on computers might >make me some extra money. Am I crazy? Do you think there would ever be a >market for it? Absolutely! :-) I'd certainly be interested in a Mac with a neat paint job. It would have to be something interesting, though, after all, even I cold do solid colors. :-) A while back MacAddict gave away some custom painted Power Mac 5100's. They weren't very intersting, though, just crazy designs. Tom Owad -- Sysop of Caesarville Online Client software at: <http://home.earthlink.net/~tomowad/>

27 years, 11 months

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How many computers?

by Marty＠itgonline.com

Yes the RJ-11 jack is to hard wire the keyboard. My PC Jr works wireless okay up to four or five feet then gets flakey. Batteries don't last long in mine either although it's been a long time since I've played with it. Marty ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: Re: How many computers? Author: classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu at internet Date: 7/14/98 11:45 AM On Tue, 14 Jul 1998, Tony Duell wrote: > Remmeber it was supposed to be a _home_ computer. At the time very few > home computers came with floppy drives. > > BTW, how common are PC-jr machines without floppies? Were most of them > upgraded? Dunno, mine's got an IBM 360k drive in it. My biggest complaints about are the 'sidecar' expansion (the second all-time-lamest computer innovation) and the fact that all backpanel ports are.. BERG headers (the first all-time-lamest computer innovation). What's up with the tiny card-edge connectors inside on the motherboard? I also noticed my keyboard (which is a joke) has an RJ-11 jack off to the side, and that there's a 2x3 BERG header at the back labelled 'K'. Could this be for a keyboard cable, heaven forbid? Also, keyboard battery life is uniformly poor. It seems like I get about 20 minutes. Is this normal? ok r. ------ Message Header Follows ------ Received: from lists4.u.washington.edu by smtp.itgonline.com (PostalUnion/SMTP(tm) v2.1.9i(b5) for Windows NT(tm)) id AA-1998Jul14.114543.1767.51176; Tue, 14 Jul 1998 11:45:43 -0400 Received: from host (lists.u.washington.edu [140.142.56.13]) by lists4.u.washington.edu (8.8.4+UW97.07/8.8.4+UW97.05) with SMTP id IAA02047; Tue, 14 Jul 1998 08:43:32 -0700 Received: from mxu1.u.washington.edu (mxu1.u.washington.edu [140.142.32.8]) by lists.u.washington.edu (8.8.4+UW97.07/8.8.4+UW97.05) with ESMTP id IAA24738 for <classiccmp(a)lists.u.washington.edu>; Tue, 14 Jul 1998 08:43:21 -0700 Received: from instinct.bears.org (red(a)instinct.bears.org [208.9.111.102]) by mxu1.u.washington.edu (8.8.4+UW97.07/8.8.4+UW98.06) with ESMTP id IAA00421 for <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu>; Tue, 14 Jul 1998 08:43:20 -0700 Received: from localhost (red@localhost) by instinct.bears.org (8.9.0/8.9.0) with SMTP id LAA19769 for <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu>; Tue, 14 Jul 1998 11:44:07 -0400 Message-Id: <Pine.LNX.3.96.980714113825.18506B-100000(a)instinct.bears.org> Date: Tue, 14 Jul 1998 11:44:07 -0400 (EDT) Reply-To: classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu Sender: CLASSICCMP-owner(a)u.washington.edu Precedence: bulk From: "R. Stricklin (kjaeros)" <red(a)bears.org> To: "Discussion re-collecting of classic computers" <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> Subject: Re: How many computers? In-Reply-To: <m0yvu0C-000IyKC@p850ug1> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers <classiccmp(a)u.washington.edu> X-Listprocessor-Version: 8.1 beta -- ListProcessor(tm) by CREN

27 years, 11 months

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40 ? Re: How many computers?

by wanderer＠bos.nl

> What's a G40? Never heard of one. It's an HP 9000/800 model G40. A box measuring 40cm by 40cm by 50cm deep, and it has a 40Mhz processor. Ed

27 years, 11 months

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C128 Service Manual

by Anthony.Dellett＠Staples.com

A bit of followup... I ordered the Sam's Photofact kit for the C128. Guess I'll be breaking out the scope. Tony

27 years, 11 months

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how many computers?

by tomsaddressformaillists＠altavista.net

I suppose I'll chime in with my small collection: Apple ][+ clone (label says "Tel-Com", the keys have CP/M, MBASIC, and other commands silkscreened onto them) Apple Lisa 1 Apple Lisa 2/10 DIGI-COMP 1 (an educational toy from 1963) Osborne 1 Epson QX-16 (seeking more, as always...) Other stuff: Televideo 950 terminal Power Macintosh 6100/66 (maybe as one of the first powermacs it will have some historical significance someday. Contains a 486 DOS card.) Generic 586 PeeCee (yawn) This account is used so mailing lists don't clutter up Tom's real account. If you really want to talk to Tom, use tom(at)galena.tjs.org

27 years, 11 months

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